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Men Cheat Because They Love Us? WTF?

Another day, another study telling us how unnatural monogamy is.

You chumps are FREAKS, I tell you. FREAKS! The latest academic to say so is Eric Anderson, author of The Monogamy Gap: Men, Love and the Reality of Cheating. His thesis? Men cheat because really, they love you women.

(Sorry guy chumps and gay chumps, I don’t have any academic books to review about your situation today. Apparently, infidelity is only an evolutionary imperative for straight men. And who interests the Academy? Straight men, preferably white colored ones. If you are a faithful straight man, or gay, lesbian, or transgender person, file yourself under Outlier, Freak, or Monogamous Anachronism. Thank you.)

The otherwise irreproachable Good Men Project reviewed this absurd book with the assumption that their readership “good men” would like an excuse for cheating? Hey, dude! Stop being “good” — check out this professor who says cheating is LOVE! Yeah, were you going to get her a diamond? Fuck that shit! Get yourself an Ashley Madison account instead! Nothing says “I love you” like exposing her to STDs or having another woman’s baby. The ladies love a player. You gotta be free to spread that seed, but she’s just the lucky lady you come home to. She’s gets uppity about that? Tell her evolution says so!

According to the review:

Anderson suggests that monogamy is an irrational ideal because it fails to provide a lifetime of sexual fulfillment. Cheating becomes the rational response to an irrational situation.

And it is at this stage that Anderson provides his most provocative argument: Men cheat because they love their partners. It is the ‘because’ that makes the statement so challenging. Yet Anderson’s argument is convincing: Intentionally focusing on younger men unburdened by marriage and parenthood, he argues that if these men did not love their partners, they could break up with them. Existing in the open sexual marketplace of university culture, and fuelled by high consumption of both alcohol and porn, these men do not need to be with their partners for access to sex (unlike undergraduates of past generations). In other words, if the 78% of university-attending men he interviewed who had cheated on their current partners did not love them, they would have left them. The logic, then, is clear—these men are with their girlfriends because of the emotional bond they share. Having undergone a rapid process of sexual habituation in a culture that is highly sexualized, it is men’s sexual dissatisfaction rather than any emotional one which propels them to have sex with others.

Hey, Dr. Anderson — I don’t have a Ph.D. or anything (just a useless masters degree in African history) and I’m not a scientist… I’m just a girl and our brains don’t do logic and stuff as well as your big male science brains do — but couldn’t we also conclude that cheating men don’t stay with women because of “the emotional bond they share” but because those women are of USE to them. Like, they earn paychecks and shit, and raise babies, and are better at scrubbing toilets than guy roommates tend to be?

Cheating men don’t “break up” like they did when they’re single because there are adult consequences like child support and a reduced standard of living when you divorce. Don’t you social scientists study motivations behind societal behavior and stuff? I had no idea you were all so tender hearted as to ascribe “love” to infidelity. Love is rather intangible and hard to measure. How much you have in your 401K, divided in half, not so much.

Again, I’m a girl, so do discount my fuzzy thinking — but me and my besties, we discuss EVERYTHING. Those I share “emotional bonds” with, I’m honest with. There’s nothing they don’t know about me. So, why don’t those cheating men who have those deep emotional bonds with the women they’re cheating on tell them they’d prefer an open relationship?

Or do the deep emotional bonds not extend to imagining another man fucking your girlfriend? Is that why it’s a big secret that you like to cheat? Or is that you would prefer an unequal playing field where women stay faithful to YOU and you have carte blanche to fuck around? I know it sounds really douchey when I put it that way.

Call me a femi-nazi but that sounds pretty retro and patriarchal to me. I mean, isn’t that the system we’ve HAD for ages? But what you’re proposing is all new and edgy and paradigm shattering!

Destroy monogamy! Monogamy is the problem! It’s a “failed social institution.”

Fuck you Eric Anderson. Or rather polygamously fuck you, so more than one can fuck you.

Monogamy isn’t a failed social institution — commitment is a failed social institution. Good character is a failed social institution. You’re just dressing up the same old shit and trying to sell it in new ways.

No one forces you to be monogamous. You commit to it. Don’t blame the “institution” for your personal failures and sense of entitlement. Waah! It’s so unfair of you to hold me to promises I made of my own free will! It’s hard!

You’re not alone Eric Anderson. The world is full of fuck responsibility apologists like you. You’re not the only one who thinks commitment and keeping promises sucks. People like you? You don’t commit to your employees, your veterans, your debts, your aging mothers, or your attention spans. Commitment of any sort seems to be a dying thing. Stick-to-it-tiveness of any kind is suspect. How passé, how old school. How… limiting.

Personally, Eric Anderson I think the world needs MORE commitment. Maybe we’ll evolve to get some. Because surely we need commitment  and sacrifice to solve any major societal bugaboo facing us — national debt, global warming, Tori Spelling reality TV series.

We need people with GRIT. Instead we seem to be a nation of douchebags who need media/gaming rooms, granite countertops and more closet space (or have I been watching too much HGTV? ) The old shit is looking tired? Get new shit! You have 3G, you need 4G! Faster consumer cat, kill, kill!

Is your wife so very 2004? Time to upgrade. Oh, but you “love her,” so keep her. (Less costly that way. For her? What’s a few decades of her life and a scary pap smear or two? She has YOU!) Swap out sexual partners the minute one gets droopy or inconvenient. Rank them on Amazon! Yelp! Google map them! (Wow, there is willing pussy just .4 miles from my house!)

Eric Anderson if you are part of this Brave New Monogamy-Free World, thanks but no thanks. I’ll keep it old school over here with my faithful Luddite husband. Like our old monogamous ancestors, we choose quality and hang on to it until it dies.

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at info@chumplady.com. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • Preach it!

    A lot of the comments call bullshit, citing the accompanying deceit. Cheating is very one-sided. If you want an open relationship, say so. As long as everyone’s on board, it’s not cheating.

    I did note the response from the man whose wife was seriously depressed. His emotional needs weren’t being met, so he had an affair, got caught, and now he and his wife are talking to each other and working on their relationship. He calls bullshit on the article–it wasn’t about sex, but about emotions–yet still manages to shift blame for the affair from his own decisions onto his wife. What an asshole! Oh yeah, and she’s now better at taking her meds. What is this? If she stops taking her meds, it’s okay for him to stick his dick in the first sympathetic vagina?

    Sheesh!

  • Thank you! I saw this this morning on GMP and thought someone had hacked into their blog and posted some bullshit. I’ve seen a couple other articles that were a little sketchy, Reasons Men Don’t Cheat was one where there was some questionable ideas, but yeah, this one was complete bullshit. If they keep posting this stuff, I’m not going to follow anymore. Way to out this for what it is, utter horse crap.

  • CL, that’s so beautifully said, you make me proud to be a member of Chump Nation.

    On one hand I wish Eric and people like him would read your article and change their ways.

    Sadly, they probably would not see the light.

    There’s really only one solution. We need to stop procreating with these types!

    I know you see it written on these pages a hundred times a day, but when are these folks going to realize they simply need to grow the fuck up?

        • Then it’s even worse!

          I just checked Dr. Anderson’s publications online.

          Turns out, M. McCormack, the guy who did the book review, is a former PhD student supervised by Dr. Anderson! When the article was published in 2011, he was barely done with his thesis with the Prof. Anderson. They have several published articles together. He should not be writing book reviews for his former PhD supervisor even in the mass media. He should not have been published…

  • “Stick-to-it-tiveness of any kind is suspect. How passé, how old school. How… limiting.”

    UGH. How true of their mindset. This reminds me of some tripe XW spewed at me when she was rationalizing her actions. Something like, “Every decision we make either limits us, or liberates us.” Puke. She must’ve read that inside her bellybutton during one of her navel-gazing sessions. Or maybe in traffic on a bumper sticker. Yeah, sorry for limiting you with my quaint expectation that you wouldn’t bang other dudes. My bad. I guess I’ll get back to churning butter now.

    • “Every decision we make either limits us, or liberates us.”

      Yack. I’m sure she is using the royal “we”, there. Because there’s no way she’d be ok with you liberating yourself from the limits of her bullshit worldview.

    • They just don’t get it. After I said, “but I was 100% loyal to you for 16 years,” my cheating Ex said, “Ah yes… loyalty. You got me there. You are better at loyalty but I am better than you are at attending to my lover’s needs.” Better? This was a competition and loyalty was just one of the choices? And fucking another woman behind my back was attending to my needs? Help, I’m confused!! 😉

    • The great mystics and spiritual teachers saw that discipline both limits and liberates. There is freedom in commitment and fidelity to a person or an ideal.

    • My ex wife naval gazes too. She spewed a lot of yoga mantra while standing on her head, which I doubt she understands but only recites. Funny thing is, she learned to contort her body to match her brain. It was like watching a breast implanted monkey at a circus. She said a a lot of “We” when describing her reason to cheat, as if I was part of the equation. hmmm….ok, what does bending yourself into the shape of a pretzel have anything to monogamy. Oh…she posted a FB picture of herself in daisy duke shorts and cowboy boots with the caption of Namaste.

  • Guy chump here in solidarity with all other chumps…

    Is this the guy who actually works for Ashley Madison who was on that Huffington Post video with one of our own a couple weeks ago?

    If so, he can rot. Well, he can rot anyway, video or not.

    • I honestly don’t know how anyone working for Ashley Madison or other sites that encourage infidelity can sleep at night. Then again, I honestly don’t know how my husband could have cheated on me.

      Signed,
      Pollyanna

  • Tracy, you pretty much covered the bases on this stupid hypothesis (AKA, justification) for cheating. I would like to ask Anderson and his like-minded stooges why the Jackass cheater in my life didn’t simply break up with me, instead of disengaging, gaslighting, lying, and getting into a FB and likely physical affair with his dead friend’s sister who is MARRIED with three kids. Would it perhaps have something to do with the money I gave him for our supposed life/business partnership that he kinda sorta needed just then? Would it perhaps have something to do with the fact that he didn’t want me to know he is a douchebag cheater who picked up a semi-literate, needy cheater MOW and found that easier than following through on commitment? Would it perhaps have something to do with keeping me as a well-financed back-up plan once his affair ran its course–because the whole purpose of the affair from his end was “changing his life” and once OW got a head of steam up to leave her Chump for what she thought were greener ($$$) pastures and a nicer body, he might want to jump back to me…The best thing about Chump Nation is that once you see it’s all about entitlement, all about getting what the Cheater needs at the expense of anyone and everyone else, you can see it have absolutely nothing to do with love. Or I wouldn’t have spent four months not knowing the difference between broccoli and roast beef because everything in the world tasted like sawdust after D-Day. The Jackass’s Schmoopie likes to spell the first person, objective case pronoun this way: Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. How representative of her cheating peers.

  • “Personally, Eric Anderson I think the world needs MORE commitment. Maybe we’ll evolve to get some. Because surely we need commitment and sacrifice to solve any major societal bugaboo facing us — national debt, global warming, Tori Spelling reality TV series.”

    Hahaha. Loved that paragraph!

    What about sports teams? A lot of men have absolutely no problem committing to them for their entire lives. Regardless of what the team gives back to them (ummmm that would be nothing!). They can commit to the things they want to commit to. The End.

    They stick around after they’ve cheated because of all the reasons CL mentioned. The real consequences; like losing half of their 401K in a divorce settlement hurts. If they can avoid that, they will. It ain’t cuz they love us because nothing says more clearly that they are indifferent to our feelings and our health, than having unprotected sex with someone other than their spouse or SO!

    • I don’t think my ex stuck around because of the finances; he just wanted to EAT CAKE. He wanted the loyal, loving spouse who took care of everything at home, helped him manage his fucked-up emotions and make better life decisions, and had lots of sex w/him. AND he wanted the OW, to gaze at him with admiration and tell him how wonderful he was, and have a bit of strange to boot. And he wanted all that to happen with no thought to consequences.

  • Right on Chump Lady! Eric Anderson is just another alleged educated prick trying to make a sale! Sorry pal, NO SALE!. Marriage is in fact a commitment! monogamy is one of those commitments! This is not some mathematical theory folks. It’s simple, you are married, you made a commitment to be faithful. Yes I am a man, and yes I completely fucking disagree with this wackjob Eric Anderson! We are not trying to reinvent the wheel. Commitment has become a failed institution Chump Lady. You nailed it!
    Get Married, Don’t Cheat! Got it!

  • Also, too…I haven’t even read the book, the blurb nor nuthin’…but it’s clear from your excerpts that his (probably entire) sample is –ta-da!! COLLEGE STUDENTS….. Because they so totally represent the lives of adult monogamous couples, dontcha know.

    Also, free stuff if you take the Prof’s stupid survey. . (Donuts? I like donuts. Maybe he’ll bump that C to a B-)

    So, you can toss that fucker in the round filing cabinet, pronto.

    (PS. dirty little secret: many psych. studies are based on the responses of…college students. (a more unbiased sample you simply could not find har har.) I kind of thought the discipline was fixing that shit, but maybe not.)

      • But I’ve watched thousands of students fill out end-of-term course evaluations and they spend 10 seconds total on the questions. So I would have concerns about whether they were serious about their replies or whether they had sufficient adult experience to actually comment. That’s a lazy study if students were the population.

  • Yeah. Right. What a bunch of horse shit.

    My husband loved me SO much he decided to stick his dick in another woman and then leave me for her. At 53 years old. After I stuck by him during his terrifying health crisis.
    Boy did I feel loved when I found out about all the lying and cheating.

    Eric Anderson is a punk spouting pure bullshit. I hope marriage material women avoid him like the plague.

    • My husband loved me so much he couldn’t support me after an unwanted abortion we had (my health was at serious risk)–but went on a dating site complaining that “things were a little quiet in the bedroom” but don’t expect a relationship, because he had no plans to leave me…

      • I’m sorry CITS. You deserved better. What a selfish selfish man. Pregnancy is already such an incredibly vulnerable state. And I can’t imagine having to go through such a horrible thing. For this alone your husband (ex?) deserves a bench in hell.

      • CITS, the same thing happened to me. Unwanted abortion for medical reasons… My ex is a horrible man. He blamed the affair on it. My heart goes out to you!

      • My supposedly committed partner loved me so much that on my birthday, which fell on Friday night, he took be to the movies and then dropped me off so he could go sit in his mother’s recliner and text his married “new love.” On a phone he paid for with my money.

        • My ex loved me so much he had at least six affairs over the course of our marriage, including fucking one of my friends. He loved me so much that when I kicked him out he did everything in his power to leave me financially fuck.

          Man, nothing like being loved like that.

      • While trying to not get thrown out, mine told me “they” (the many, yes many whores he slept with after buying them drugs with my money) knew that he wouldn’t leave me, he always made that clear in the beginning! WTF!!?? And he thought telling me that would help persuade me. If I wasn’t in such shock I would have laughed in his face….

    • My husband must have REALLY loved me because he frequented swingers clubs, massage parlors, escorts, dating sites and had at least 20 affairs he will admit to during our 26 year marriage, and yet chose to stay and just live his double life. Somehow I wasn’t feeling the love. My bad.

  • ROFLMAO. Thanks Tracy, your response to this article cracked me up.

    “I’m just a girl and our brains don’t do logic and stuff as well as your big male science brains do”

    Lol.

    • “our brains don’t do logic and stuff as well as your big male science brains do”

      Funny, it was my XW that thought I was too emotionally unavailable that was part of her justification. Well, my “big science brain” is now quite good at filtering out BS, thank you very much.

      It’s simply amazing how absurd some people think when it comes to rationalizing (read: justifying) behaviors that are patently wrong and will cause great pain to others who don’t deserve to experience such pain. For example, today Yahoo ran on their Shine site yet another article about “Why I Cheated on My Husband”, and I was dumb enough to click on the link. The article ran the same set of reasons I’m sure most of us have seen on those types of articles (I won’t list any of them since they infuriate me). The only redeeming part of the article was that it seemed that most of the comments parallel the opinions that I see here and that I believe is the right opinion.

  • So….if the entire Chump Nation fucks him up the ass with a shoe horn, does that make us no longer chumps???

    Just askin’

    I still stand by, we need to tattoo cheaters, so we know where not to invest time, which could be otherwise used…being monogamous? Gardening? Picking out belly button lint?

    • Chump in the sand,

      Even though I like the idea of us all in chump nation fucking this lame brain, I can’t whore myself out to a whore hound.

      He is just too disgusting. Sure he is smug with his stupidass ideas, that bastard.

      He should go back in time, OMG how women dealt with this crap, I swear to god.

      Those westerns now I am triggered, the whores hanging out of the windows and the cowboys going to the saloons….Do you notice how wives were NEVER mentioned!

      So disgusted now.

      I used to love John Wayne and Clint Eastwood, no more, both whorehounds. That ring of fire song, whorehey Cash wrote to Johnny, god his poor first wife, all those kids she had. Thank god she married a sherriff in Ventura, so now I have to hate Johnny Cash also. I just do. Oh, and Robin Williams, the list goes on.

        • Men cheat because they love women? Don’t us chumps all find it amazing that bums like Eric Anderson have the nerve to spout such incredible BULLSHIT! Does this idiot actually think that he is convincing? HA! Men cheat because they fucking want to cheat! I don’t know why my wife cheated because I am not a her. But if I had to take a guess it would be, well lets see here now uh, umm, uh umm, SHE CHEATED BECAUSE SHE WANTED TO! HEY WAIT A MINUTE, I thought that’s why men cheat.
          Oh well, I am a chump, what do I know.

    • I agree Chump in the Sand. It would be nice to know I am about to be fucked like a housecat in a relationship. Tattoo Cheaters, Splendid Idea!

    • Very long, difficult day. I was feeling very blue and then I read, “fucks him up the ass with a shoe horn” and an involuntary smile came to my face. Thank you.

  • I can take being called a freak, I like it that I can lay my head on the pillow every night of the week and sleep tight and not worry if my dick has blisters or crabs or worry if I lied or not ,,,,,,,it makes life really easy when your an open and honest book,, no fb or strange numbers or missing money or surprise babies.

    Yea I kind of like being a normal freak with a big ass NORMAL LOVING heart 😉

  • Chumplady!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You rock! I love everything you said and was thinking of sending the article so someone who loves me but is banging free pussy.

    Oh that is .. ok I usually don’t swear like this, I just have turned to it to get my anger out, I may stay this way too.

    Yeah, decades of my life but oh that was then this is now I live in the PAST

    screaming anger here

  • Yeah I am just a true freak, I am so proud of that!

    I always will be too.

    I do not appreciate getting the sexual history of who knows how many people after being true to this man who “loves me” Oh Tracy, I am so loved, I am, I am loved so much he tells people I am dying, his ex, we are separated, divorced.

    I am a woman of many hats of what has happened so that it is ok for him to show his love even on a corner to free PUSSY

    I am sure he is too cheap to pay for pussy, he clips coupons.

    • A Huge LOL Beach!!!

      ‘He’s too cheap to pay for pussy, he clips coupons.’

      That’s some funny shit, I don’t care who you are.

      Isn’t it a howl to make fun of these idjits? The thing that blows my mind is …..they are ALL the same! In their own entitled, narcissistic ways. CL nails it when she says they all play by the same cheater hand book. I had no idea they were all EXACTLY alike until I found Chump Nation. They’re all beyond ridiculous.

      My mother always said, ‘There’s no fool like an old fool.”

  • Why is it always monogamy that is contrary to evolution, yet you never hear this argument for any other societal problem? I haven’t heard one of these bogus social scientists say that it’s counter evolutionary to allow blacks to use the same drinking fountains as whites, why not? Isn’t integration a “failed modern institution,” since throughout most of human existence, humans have lived in small, tribal groups of people who were closely related? Humans tend to be herd animals and reject those who are “different,” so obviously bigotry and prejudice are the normal human state, and any laws or social modification contrary to that are anti-evolutionary.

    You’ll never hear that, because it is bullshit. Humans are perfectly capable of modifying their behavior whenever it is required or beneficial for them to do so. Monogamy is easily accomplished by anyone who wants to remain faithful. There is no other social norm that gets bashing like monogamy and that is because there are so many cheaters around.

  • This scientific study is brought you by none other than Ashley Madison, for whom he works. He is their “Chief Science Officer.”

    I had no idea such lucrative opportunities built on entire bullshit await me. I cannot get this dissertation finished quickly enough. . .

    “Dr. Eric Anderson is a professor of masculinity, sexuality and sport at the University of Winchester. He serves as the Chief Science Officer for AshleyMadison.com and is President of Anderson Inclusive Consultancy.”
    http://www.ericandersonphd.com/

    (PS: Don’t eff with a researcher. She will find dirt on everything. My husband ought to know.)

  • “..a lifetime of sexual fulfillment..” Is that the main male aspiration these days? Nothing more noble, enlightened, or, ahem, RESPONSIBLE? Wow, I’m ready to call human beings a failed experiment, even solely based on my ex, who put his peter above his own flesh and blood. Yeah, he “loved” me too, like a slave owner loves a slave.

    I was in charge of raising rats in my science lab days. They got fresh bedding, a full larder, a sippy bottle of water (I guess that made me their ‘wife’) and they fucked their brains out all day long. The only difference between them and Mr. Anderson, PhD, is opposable thumbs and the ability to form words with his mouth.

  • Fire is hot, water is wet. This snake oil salesman Eric Anderson really has my blood boiling. All of us chumps know the score though. We have been well trained on chumpology 101. Cheaters are selfish, in its purest form. Cheaters simply have no moral compass whatsoever. Cheaters simply do whatever they want to do. No grey area here folks. Its not complicated, emotional, physical, none of those bullshit reasons a cheater will give you for cheating. They want to cheat, so they do. Just as Chump Lady says. To you Eric Anderson, I say, I have things in my stool that I am more impressed with!

  • Oh I so want to buy in on some of this so here goes.

    What about sports teams? A lot of men have absolutely no problem committing to them for their entire lives. Regardless of what the team gives back to them (ummmm that would be nothing!). They can commit to the things they want to commit to. The End.

    This commitment is right up a cheaters ally as it is an open relationship they do not care who their team fucks and they are up for fucking an entire team of others as long as they can wear their team colors while doing it.

    Scotty I am not sure where your x gets her fuzzy logic from but your quote,
    Something like, “Every decision we make either limits us, or liberates us.” Puke. She must’ve read that inside her bellybutton during one of her navel-gazing sessions.

    Your wife and my husband would be perfect for each other as long as she is willing to keep tabs on his as he like to see out strange men ( Sorry I know todays post does not include the gay or genderally fucked up) But as for every decision we make either limits or liberates…. in a real relationship a both parties are liberated as they know they have a common bond with someone and that what ever goes on in their day to day in normal life they have that security to return to and be encouraged by, your wife’s decision to cheat ‘limited’ her because it gave her very little scope to justify that she is actually a decent human being.

    Beach, you crack me up ‘Oh that is .. ok I usually don’t swear like this, I just have turned to it to get my anger out, I may stay this way too.”

    OMG the F word is used quite a bit her at chump nation and as I read your post I saw no offense and then the above quote so I then looked back at other posts to see if you had let rip? NO and then I began to laugh. I do not usually swear unless I feel as though I am to a point that the only way I am going to be heard is if I drop one and so yesterday while being berated by my now X minister and his wife as I outlined the course of events that lead me to seek fellowship in another church, I raised my voice and used the F word. They still were unwilling to accept what I was trying to explain to them and in stead then set to berate me further and in a very hostile manner might I ad for my despicable language and even went as far as to state that if I had had a real father figure growing up I would not act in this manner. No I didn’t swear at you because in your opinion I have Foo issues I was just angry that you cannot listen to anything other than your own opinion even when you are wrong is glaringly obvious and not checking you pastoral care meeting minutes is not going to change the facts as I lived them. And the issue remains although you are not my cheating XH your in his corner and while you remain their no-one is ever going to hear the truth of our situation and that our marriage is over. Because he will never have to actually face his crap in the real world.

    So to all here at chump nation I apologize in advance for the following;

    To all those self opinionated FUCKTARD out there who feel that it is ok to extol their utter BULLSHIT because in their FUCKED UP universe going and FUCKING some random stranger is just as acceptable as going for a coffee (or for a walk? who the FUCK does that?) I say take your MINDFUCKERY and your CUNTRA_DICTIONS (did I get that right notyou?) and shove them up our ASS. No one wants to hear it.

    • I’ll never forget the first time I said “F.U.” to the ex. In an email. ALL CAPS. Yes, that was positively therapeutic. Broke the F.U. barrier that day.

      My lawyer said, “I don’t think that was helpful”, and I didn’t care. I fucking didn’t care.

      Very special kind of mental release. I only wish I’d been there to see him clutch his pearls and try to tsk-tsk his way out from under it.

      • Chumpalicious
        you crack me up,
        I only wish I’d been there to see him clutch his pearls and try to tsk-tsk his way out from under it. Priceless. Princess

        It has only been in the past few years that I have used the F word with my X I am very sure he is PA and the frustration levels have been extreme, but he would always look down his nose at me as though my using the F word was only justify my unworthiness of his commitment to our marriage.
        I use to think I know it isn’t lady like but at the time I volunteered as an Emergency Rescue Worker surrounded my real men who would let it rip at times.
        I think you do remember the first time you use the word in anger and it is therapeutic.

        • Here’s the thing about our holier-than-thou exs Sammie D — they know perfectly well how to use the F bomb and all their shock is feigned.

          One night the STBX was having a nightmare and saying FUCK (inhilation) YOU (exhalation) over and over. It sounded like he was panting and saying it.

          LOL. I woke him up but he wouldn’t tell me what it was about. Probably cursing me, no doubt.

  • sorry this should say
    and no checking your pastoral care meeting minutes is not going to change the facts as I lived them.

    • Sammie D, I went to my church for guidance myself. And to my shock, my church leaders (people of supposed wisdom) actually had the nerve to say that it was OK for my wife to cheat on me! WHAT? They told me that I had to consider her happiness too! And if having an affair was making her happy, then I should accept that. What? Her happiness! How about my happiness you selfish pricks? Suffice to say, I told them that I was leaving their immoral church, and good riddance. I thought about it long and hard, and the answer was easy. I AM NOT WRONG SHE IS! Ah the life of a chump!

      • Miles you have to be kidding? WTF?
        How can they say that to you?
        That is not a church it is a regular gathering of Morons with a church logo.
        How long were you going there?

        I had been in my church for 10 years which is why I am so disappointed with there behavior. I got told yesterday that they are accepting of him not his sin and that they in their actions are kicking his ass in love. they have only ever gotten to know us on face value over that time so all they have seen is a wife dealing with a PA husband and an overtly feminine nice gay (oops) guy. So while they are loving him in to recovery I am attending another church. and they are dismayed at my actions. Gee I wonder how shocked they will be when he is served with divorce paper in December.
        Because although they understand I have grounds for divorce they feel I should not dismiss my marriage so quickly as there is hope for him. OH GO GROW UP !

        • Sammie D, sounds like they’re forgetting that this is YOUR decision. They can advise, suggest and recommend all they want, but it’s YOUR life and YOUR so-called marriage, and YOUR decision.

          Also sounds like it’s time to stop talking to them – they are clearly never going to ‘get it’, and trying to explain to stupid is just exhausting and aggravating. By explaining and justifying to them, you’re actually giving their opinions more value, where they clearly have none.

          • KarenE, you are so right a friend said the same to me and I have conceded to her that I have acted rashly in trying to get them to see this from my side as all I have done is put myself in a position of someone they can blame shift onto.

            so on that front NO MORE. and your saying the same just helps it to sink in.
            thanks

        • Loving him in to recovery. Yeah Sammie D, that will fly like a concrete pig! I was 23 years with my church! Then to be told by them that it is ok for my wife to cheat! I left that church with great speed. It was one hell of a disappointment to be treated with such disregard by my church. I can only describe it as “organized immorality”.

          • that will fly like a concrete pig!

            I have tears.. fly like a concrete pig!
            when my X minister said yesterday that these emotional big hits usually come in three’s and thank god I only got two, my cheating x and my sick kid, I so wanted to jump in and say and lets not forget having to change churches but I bit my tongue ” I am sure the verse about “pearls before swine might be relevant here”

            that will fly like a concrete pig! love it!

            • Miles
              I’m sorry I have to ask but the person in your church that you went to were they the other person by any chance. Because I just can’t get my head past the 23yrs membership and the “its ok she has a right to be happy. That you should just accept it.?”

              No, no, no I know I am new to this whole issue but that to me that is cheater speak.

              I do like the reference of it being “organized immorality” yep you have that right.

              • No they were not the other person. Another reason why I was so disappointed. But did I mention that I talked to two different supposed persons of leadership in my church. Got the same line of crap from both of them. We chumps have to absorb the bruises.

            • Sammie D, I am from the south as you likely have surmised. We southern gentleman have lots of those lines. I recall saying to the soon to be XW. Only the wicked flee when no one pursueth, after she decided to move out and shackup with her AP. I may as well been talking to the wall. I truly enjoy the CL experience. Here, the bullshit lamp is out. We have been illuminated and us chumps have the light to see the cheaters for what they are.

              • I am not from the US but am starting to understand that unlike most people, Southerners call it like it is. I like that.
                I once had a boss refer to me as someone who does not suffer fools lightly. He was right.
                Im sorry your wife just didn’t get it.

      • OK. This shocked me. That is not any kind of church at all. It’s one thing for the church to be overly judgmental (“casting the first stone at others”). But it’s quite another to justify adultery, which, last time I looked, is one of ten big NO-NOs in the Judeo-Christian tradition and is (so far as I know) also forbidden in most other mainstream traditions. Unbelievable.

  • Dear Tracy – you had me at the scary papsmear. It’s the reminder, the notice, the whoa Nelly that scientifically or not – cheating is nothing more than entitlement – a monster truck of one spouse rolling right over the other with financial, emotional, physical and sexual abuse.

    And Chump Nation must be made up of the MOST gritty folks I’ve had the pleasure of never meeting. I follow the work of UofPenn’s Angela Duckworth and what she speaks of in her TED talk is exactly what you’ve instilled in us who just don’t buy that commitment is a bad thing.

    http://www.ted.com/talks/angela_lee_duckworth_the_key_to_success_grit.

    Tracy, you have faith in our power to recover, And you have the fury for the truth. You are the antidote for the snake bite. Let’s talk social science. Let’s look at quality research. Duckworth has a site that includes a survey on grit. Questions to help determine how much we have. The Nation needs to get their grit score and get movin’ on.

    https://sites.sas.upenn.edu/duckworth

  • It is a wonder these guys don’t crack up while writing this incredible CRAP!! One thing I wanted to add is another reason men/women like to cheat is what really makes it an immature, character disordered move, is that they actually get off on fucking you over! The secret that you don’t know, the sneaking around, the planning, the conniving, the .getting away with it all is a BIG part of the fun! If they didn’t have you to screw over, then they are just trying to get laid as a single person, and what fun is that? You play the part of the Mommy or daddy and they play the naughty teenager. Better luck growing up next lifetime.

    • YEs, I sometimes wonder what the ex and his Owife do for fun these days, and then I realize I don’t care. Meh.

    • You play the part of the Mummy or Daddy and they play the naughty teenager.

      ^^^THIS!!

      My screwed up STBXH rejected his family to fuck around with a meth head, not because he loved me (spew) but because I reckon he didn’t want to be a grown up anymore!
      Being a grown up is boring 🙁 People expect things from you, they need you to follow through on your words, keep promises, actually give a shit about stuff other than yourself. Maybe help at being a parent, and not spend every cent of your paycheck on yourself.
      That shit is just too hard. He wanted to go out with mates and drink, and get high, and screw ‘exciting’ skanks AND HAVE FUN being a teenager! You’ve hit the nail on the head in my case. And then when he felt like it, he got to come home and ‘play family’. win win.

      Until I realised what the score was. Then he ran away from home…..like a teenager.

      • Being grown up is SOOO boring and annoying, so a good cheater solution is to cheat! But then there are consequences, how unfair! How awful! Why don’t we feel sorry for them and rebuild their lives for them????? ‘Cause they might want to come home and play family again!

      • Haha! I wish someone would have told me there was a choice!! I thought I had to grow up, and at an early age Picture him slipping out the window in the middle of the night, going “garaging” to get some liquor for his “lay,” stealing a couple of cigarettes from his Mom & waiting at the neighborhood playground on one of the swings to see if the twat was able to slip out for the night…….now that is livin”!!!!.

        • Sheesh they’re so crummy. SMH
          Sitting at the park in the dark waiting for the skank is part of my story too. Discovered that a few days after I found out about her. Just can’t stop shaking my head and sighing that so many people are going through the same shit I am.

          Are there any grown ups out there?
          People who recognise that there are amazing pay-offs to being an adult! I’m so glad there are some guys on this site to help restore my hope that they’re not all the same!

    • Regina, that’s what I discovered from this sight that they get off on fucking you over. Who does that? An immature,character disordered arsehole. I asked my STBXH,”what are you in middle school doing this crap?” Then he just blame shifts and says the house is a pigstye. Pray for me to get out of here.
      .

  • Regina, you have just perfectly described my ex husband. A boy in a mans (and I used the term loosely!) body. A more cunning person you will never meet.

  • Regina, Well said! My 40 something year old wife acted as if it was nothing. Hey, yeah I am cheating, so what!
    Then, I say well, we will have to get a divorce. She said, yeah, I am a woman, and millions of women always get everything in the divorce, so Go Ahead and divorce me!
    Well she has discovered this is 2014, not 1974! It has been like dealing with a teenager. No encyclopedia needed, cheaters know everything!

    • Well she has discovered this is 2014, not 1974! It has been like dealing with a teenager. No encyclopedia needed, cheaters know everything!

      You said it.

      STBX seems to think than now he has come clean the best thing for all would be to just sell the family home and split the proceeds 50/50. OH hang on you live with your mum. I have our three kids one of which has been diagnosed with cancer since our Dday and is in the process of a 2 year treatment plan leaving me without a job so I can care for her and you want to sell the family home and split if 50/50. yeah that sounds like a great idea. NOT!

      • Yeah, Its not enough that he gutted your heart like a fish, now he wants to filet your wallet and lifestyle too! Unless he is blind it should be obvious what you have to contend with, the child’s condition and all. The level a cheater will go to have no bounds. This earth would stop turning without them on it!

        • I know right!

          I could reply to you comment above, at least they gave you the same line _ same play book, Stupid Disrespectful Pastoral Care 101. I have had to deal with two people also how have been cunning enough to have their wives present when speaking to me and when I have challenged them on what they have said at a later date they have denied it and their wife have then jumped to their defense insinuating that I am making it up. Because just like cheaters I am learning that Ministers with agendas ( not all ministers) don’t like to be held accountable when caught out. But I hold hope in knowing that in time this chumps bruses will heal.

          Oh seriously though that concrete pig comment is going to make me smile for days. I have a thing about flying pigs.

  • Dear Chump Lady,

    So happy to come across your website… I have been feeling like the biggest chump myself lately. I’m single and was dating a married man for over 2 years; then suddenly daily contact stopped. “I’m tired… Work … Kids…” Excuse after excuse and bam! He ends it because he “can’t make me happy all the time”. How could I believe this BS???

    But of course it’s not over; text messages professing love and devotion are back. Once a week.. Twice a week… Blaming me… God grant me strength to get through a period of no contact. Your stories are inspiring. Your stories and a bottle of wine. And a Valium.

    • Be glad you’re not married to him.his “love and devotion” is just bs. “When someone shows you who they are,the first time ,believe them.”Maya Angelou. 1)he’s married and cheating on his wife. 2) he’s blaming you for things like “he can’t make you happy all the time”. How could he? He’s married!then he comes back professing “love and devotion”. Look up articles on “cake”. Read everything you can on this sight. Chump lady is better than any therapist. Go no contact and stay that way.this guy is trouble,big time. Stay away. He will only hurt you more.you have worth.don’t settle for this scum bag.

    • Vanessa,

      You didn’t learn the first sentence of the first lesson on the first page of the great cosmic book of rules for dating: “Never knowingly date a married person; and if you find out the person IS married, run like hell or you will soon find yourself there.”

      You believed him because you suspended REALITY in deference to your “feelings,” expecting the universe to make an exception for you. It doesn’t work that way; and your pain, while real, is completely self-inflicted.

      • Yikes. Just puked a bit in my mouth due to Vanessa’s glorious entitlement to her married boyfiriend. V, grow the fuck up.

        • ANC,you are right on, I couldn’t have said it better.”grow the fuck up”. I’m still laughing. You made my day!

      • Agreed. Your pain is, indeed, self-inflicted. You knew he was married, imagine the horror of discovering that your entire life, and everything you believed in, was one big, fat lie.

        At least you saw it coming.

        • I love the “You Chumps are FREAKS! FREAKS I tell you!!” (about believing in monogamy) Guess what! Our Cheaters believe in it too…..but just for YOU, not them. Otherwise, as has been pointed out, it would be an OPEN relationship that person is ONBOARD with. They don’t want you cheating, that would be hurtful, humiliating, degrading, devastating, well—you know what all it would be don’t you?.

    • Vanessa. sympathy for the devil is not just a rolling stones song. Vanessa, you want unconditional love, get a dog! Oh you already did that.

  • First, unmitigated bullshit.

    Second, if you don’t want to be monogamous:
    1) don’t get involved in relationships, don’t get engaged and don’t get married. It really is that simple.
    2) Get into a relationship with someone who wants an open, swinging or poly relationship. Those people exist.

    If you want to be a playah, fine. Just be HONEST about it.

    That is the main issue with the guy I just kicked out. If he had been honest we could have figured this out. NOT KIDDING! But he chose to lie and deny and cheat.

    Asshat.

    • samiam, if he had, would you have stayed with him? I know that my X never asked for an “open relationship” and that if he HAD, I would have kicked him out then and there just like I did ten months ago on D-Day (and I since found out about his prior affairs). He knew I would never say yes to that because I had told him my ex husband had asked for an open marriage after he cheated on me and I divorced him.

      My X loved all the financial support he got from me for our 16 years and co-owned house together, I pd for all our food and then some. So yes, if he wanted to be poly amorous or whatever the fuck being a slut and whore is called these days, I would have broken up with him on the spot and he knew it. Thus the deception.

      I truly regret trusting him and having missed the chance to meet another man, because I was 100% loyal to the cheater.

      • I’m only mostly straight, so frankly, with honesty and openness I would have been open to try out some alternative relationship models. Not saying it would have worked, but I would have been open to trying.

        To try that type of thing you must have absolute transparency and rigorous honesty with each other. It isn’t for everyone that’s for sure.

        My main problem with what happened to me is that he was a lying piece of crap.

          • That is so true. I have a hard time believing how some people can be so deceptive, manipulative and duplicitous and actually be able to live with themselves. It is shocking the level to which some people can sink.

  • For partners (a majority) who commit to a “standard marriage contract” the provisions and length of term of the contract are completely clear:

    [Groom’s name], do you take [Bride’s name] to be your wedded wife, to live together in marriage? Do you promise to love her, comfort her, honor and keep her for better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and health, and forsaking all others, be faithful only to her, for as long as you both shall live?

    {I do.}

    [Bride’s name], do you take [Groom’s name] to be your wedded husband to live together in marriage? Do you promise to love him, comfort him, honor and keep him for better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and health and forsaking all others, be faithful only to him so long as you both shall live?

    As it exists today, marriage is the only legal contract I can think of in which one participant can UNILATERALLY break the contract/commitment due to unclear and/or vague feelings of “discontent” (without due process of law for the betrayed partner) and not experience any meaningful punitive damages for doing so.

    Getting rid of “no fault” divorce and requiring “grounds” again; and reinstituting the option of a betrayed spouse to file alienation of affection or criminal conversation lawsuits might cause a whole lot of marginally discontented people (who just don’t “feel” like honoring their commitments) to think long and hard about how to make their existing marriage better and to not see cheating as a ready option……or better yet, hopefully people would learn to enter marriage after having a clear understanding of the serious, permanent, and sacrosanct nature of it.

    IMO Marriage should be neither a trap for the abused nor a revolving door for the irresponsible. It should be both entered and exited with the utmost of respect and gravity within a legal system that reinforces these concepts.

    If “business” suddenly had the easy contract breaking options open to “it” that spouses who want to renege ( including no fault divorce) on the marital contract have, there would be total economic chaos within 24 hours. And we wonder why we have relationship and family chaos.

    It always reverts back to character, commitment, honor, integrity, and courage.

    • notyou, I am keeping a copy of this, it articulates beautifully what most Chumps believe and practice. Thank you.

    • Are there still ten or eleven states which allow “alienation of affection” suits? Even if the affairs took place in one of those states, I’ve read that “alienation of affection” rules can be applied.

      The x’s ow (I don’t like to capitalize those since they really aren’t proper) wasn’t worth suing but I would have loved to have told her x since he could have gained from suing my x.

  • Reading garden variety shit like this just makes me want to go back to bed this morning and not get up – ever.
    My lovely teenaged daughter has watched me go through her Father’s return to University MLC/new career/ MOW and other justafriends phase for the last 8 years. Her response last week was…
    ” Mom , I am going to be a ____ when I grow up and focus on my career first. Then when I have accomplished that, I am going to be a Cougar!”
    I am soooo proud! No talk of family, marriage or children. She saw what happened to me . So far at 16 she has only focused on her friends and studies. No boys. So I believe her!
    If this article is any indication of where our society is heading – I don’t want my children to participate.
    Yup…. Going to go stick my head under a pillow!

  • Seems pretty simple to me…

    I make a promise…..

    I keep it.

    If I don’t want to keep it……

    I don’t make it.

    Of course that seems to apply only for those who value good character…….

  • Vanessa, the woman who is going through the heartbreak of her MARRIED boyfriend breaking it off with her. Now she doesn’t know who or what to trust.
    The biggest WTF? I believe I had was that my ex was mad at the OW for a long time, for you got it…NOT TELLING THE TRUTH about her intentions, that for her it wasn’t just about the sex, she wanted him, money, everything. She Lied!!! How could she?? I wondered & said “WTF!! Weren’t you quite the liar yourself? You told me we had hit a “rough patch” which was what I am sure he told her-Yeah, the rough patch was her pussy being offered! You told her you were in a relationship, but weren’t honest about that either, I am sure we had an open relationship or whatever sounded good at the time, and I am sure I had many flaws which just happened to be what she was offering. These people actually trust the schmoopie so much because they have so much to lose (respect, marriage, job, family, kids, you name it) and this precious secret is a big bond with the OM/OW. They have SO much TRUST…I mean this is truly SPECIAL. WTF?? ARE YOU KIDDING ME?? This is another example of just how juvenile this is! I love the ID channel where as soon as one schmoopie gets in trouble with the law, all bets are off, all promises broken. And schmoopie #2 is so shocked & mortified…..he/she meant everything to me. NOT!!

  • ” And who interests the Academy? Straight men, preferably white colored ones. ”

    Generally true, but as it turns out, Eric Anderson is a gay man. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Anderson_(sociologist)

    Maybe the Tea Party is paying him so they have evidence that gay men are plotting to destroy heterosexual marriage. Or maybe he believes in the nonsense he spouts.

    Either way: Eric — shut the hell up. You’re not helping the team out here. By way of contrast, here’s a link to an article about Jim Egan, a pioneering gay rights activist in Canada. He and his partner and Jack Nesbitt were a monogamous couple from 1948 until Egan’s death in 2000. Unfortunately, they never got to get married.

    http://canadianhistorycomesout.wordpress.com/2010/01/26/1921-the-birth-of-a-pioneering-activist/

    • Given the context, I wish I’d typed “he and his partner Jack Nesbitt” rather than “he and his partner and Jack Nesbitt.”

      • this comment makes no sense without the one it’s replying to, which is apparently “awaiting moderation”. never seen that here before.

  • I know what I am about to say will be very unpopular on this site, but here it goes.
    Society has progressed a lot faster then our brain. Behind every action is a thought, and behind that thought is a desire of some kind. EVOLUTION 101: Our desires are tied to survival and reproduction–the first two basic instincts.
    Unfortunately, we are living in a world in which our desires–while being tied to millions of years of evolution in their origin–are misled by modern trappings that our minds simply are not “naturally” equipped to deal with in the healthiest, most progressive way.
    Add to this, television, processed meats, flavor enhancers, video games, adult topless bars, internet porn, contraception, narcotics, viagra, shopping, fashion magazines, and even commercials!, you are still left with your basic instincts to deal with all these mouthwatering temptations. So how does one deal with millions of years of evolution? We will fall short every time until your brains catch up to our now called “Evolved Modern Society.”

  • “I know it sounds really douchey when I put it that way.” — I actually sprayed my coffee on that one.

    As if the content isn’t fabulous enough, there’s the delivery. My undying thanks for being able to take things that are painful and serious, and present them in such an audacious manner. All forms of humor make the unpalatable so much more palatable.

  • Also, who cares? Liars and cheaters are people with feelings, fully capable of love. If he loves me, that is of absolutely no consequence if he’s also an abuser. A man’s love puts a woman under no obligation. I guess his pore lil l heart is going to get broke.

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