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The OW Were Not Amused

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amusedI don’t write for Other Women (the knowing ones, anyway. Those of you who were chumped, carry on). And yet, for some reason I often find they link to me on their forums.

Why? Well, I think some of them find the cheater manipulation tactics described here useful. Perhaps little lightbulbs go off in their heads. No, you mean he was lying to me TOO?! And others I guess read here for the frissons of superiority they must feel when comparing themselves to chumps.

No surprise that yesterday’s column was not a hit. Someone posted it on LoveShack.

Most took offense that I called OW sluts.

I am a lot of things, but a slut is not one of them. I do not dress provocatively, do not parade myself around promiscuously, and the amount of people I have been intimate with is far below average for a woman of my age. Was I a one-time other woman? Yes. Does it make me selfish, slightly narcissistic, emotionally messed up, and dishonest? Yes. Am I currently working on these issues? You bet.

But does that make me a slut? Absolutely not.

The article was actually about “slut shame,” but hey, if the thong fits…

I don’t actually like the term myself. My point was not to shame OW for their sexuality, but for their utter lack of remorse about hurting chumps — which, yeah, is shameful. You don’t get to willingly fuck innocents over, feel zero guilt about it, and then play the victim.

I really have no idea if most OW are promiscuous or not. For all I know you’re like the main OW in my story, pining her way through THREE marriages waiting for the idiot. (At once point buying wedding rings for him to propose with, but I digress.) I don’t know how many other men she fucked. Maybe not a single one. Maybe she was the Lady of Charlotte awaiting his return. I have no clue.

But she did leave her thong in bed for me to find. I did see the creepy little emails they shared. “I’ve got hot flashes for you!” The English language only has so many words — “slutty” is one of them.

Another OW complained that Hers Was a Great Love That Conquers All Obstacles.

Hilarious? Fine, if stringing a bunch of cliches together gives you the giggles. Personally I found it unoriginal, hackneyed and also inaccurate.

I’ve been an OW. Was I ever ashamed, or shamed? Nope. No one who has ever heard “our story” — and because we’re an international couple, people do usually ask — has responded with anything other than approbation, support, and admiration of a “love that conquers all obstacles”. Sure, I’m betting that’s not how his xBW sees it — and I’m sure she would coo and cluck around a bunch of “slut shamers” if she was given the chance – but normal, ordinary people? Nope.

Oh, I’m sorry! You’re an international couple? My God that makes all the difference. So dazzled by such an exotic pageant of multiculturalism, people must approach you all the time to ask about your Special Relationship!

Are you Bulgarian? Sudanese? No, no. Let me guess — Finnish!

(Brushing her sleeve with false modesty) No, I’m actually from Pittsburgh. The better part of Pittsburgh, of course. But my partner is Puerto Rican.

OMG. I’ve never met a Puerto Rican! Say something Puerto Rican!

Yes, the Love That Conquers All Obstacles. Obstacles like wives and children. Obstacles like alimony and child support. Obstacles like integrity.

Kudos, OW.

Eh. The article sounded like someone who was burned and who was lashing out.

Truth is people aren’t so easily categorized. There are many reasons a woman will become involved in an affair. Including a man lying about being married or getting divorced until the woman has feelings for him.

The word slut is ridiculous anyway. Most “sluts” aren’t sluts at all. A true slut – a woman who has sex indiscriminately with as many people as possible – is pretty rare. And even those women are either proud of their sexually free attitude, or are very damaged and are looking for something to make them happy. Either way, they don’t need to be “shamed”.

So why do we need to label people as “sluts” anyway. It’s just another word used by insecure people to make them feel superior to others.

OW, you have a point. When you knowingly fuck a married man, you aren’t having sex “indiscriminately.” You know exactly what you’re doing. You’re discriminating for the married ones. You are actually CHOOSING the “pick me dance.”

Yep, you choose a competition in which your opponent has no idea she’s competing with you. That certainly makes things skew in your favor, don’t you think? (Really, the married man is playing you for cake, but you won’t hear that.) You discriminate for unfair situations and swan about with your True Love. Doesn’t that make you feel superior to the unknowing chump? Winning that pick me dance? He’ll get that divorce! Really! And then we can be together FOREVER! 

They don’t need to be “shamed”.

Tell me about it. Bounces off you people like rubber.

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Ask Chump Lady

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  • You the funny thing is, I have noticed, how other women ( and other men ) are so full of defending cheater behaviour when they do it, except when they in turn become cheated on ( inevitably this will happen if you are in a relationship with a cheater) then it’s the worse thing in the world.

    • Yes, EXUK. It’s as if they’re missing the “Golden Rule Gene” or…something!

      It’s a shame that I’m seeing more and more of a trend of people in general who just don’t give a flying you-know-what about others…

      …but they sure want others to give a flying you-know-what about THEM!

      Their arrogance is too much for me. The people who think like this are the reason WHY the world is as messed up as it is.

      • This is all so depressing. OW knew about me but would not stop calling him, planning work out dates with him, playing online games, etc. She knew I was upset over their “friendship” (sent me a consolation prize of candy) but she wouldn’t enforce boundaries. She was obviously getting ego kibbles. Even if their A hadn’t blown up our marriage what she did was so selfish and evil.

        That being said, he disrespected me by continuing a “friendship” he knew bothered me and by telling her private things to do with our marriage and taking it to another level. He always was easily lead and she really played him. The tragedy is that I don’t think she even really wanted “him”. She wanted kibbles. I guess it’s pretty much the same with all these stories. Such a damn tragic sorry waste. And in the end for what? As my attorney said, “In two years he’ll be getting another divorce.”

        • Lina I’m so sorry you were forced to endure those fucktards. You deserve SO much love and respect; these asswipes aren’t worthy of anything other than the bottom-feeding, lying, scheming cheaters they got in one another, just like in my case. Like I said in yesterday’s comments on slut-shaming, we’re talking about immature girls and boys who are fucking WHORES, and who are really no more mentally or morally disciplined than a less-than-average zoo monkey. (And again, no offense to the intelligent zoo monkeys, likely more sexually disciplined than these cheating human whore spouses and ex-spouses.) Hugs to you, Lina.

        • I also meant to say that if I had a male friend who’s wife was upset over our spending time alone together I wouldn’t send her candy, I’d stay the fuck AWAY from him and that situation. Someone who isn’t up to no good would extricate themselves from a situation like that immediately.

            • Lina, your attorney is probably right. My attorneys sat and took bets on when he would be back at my door! I thought they were crazy, but they said they have seen this time and time again! Oh and their advice to me was to send him away again if he returns! Does that tell you something?

              • Yes, my attorney is in his eighties and I’m sure has seen it all.

                I can definitely see another divorce but never him trying to come back. That would mean admitting he was wrong and he’s NEVER wrong.

              • Seems to be a stream of lawyers involved in affairs, married or not it is unethical and of course wrong.
                Hurt divorced,vulnerable,low self esteem
                Ripe plucking time.

                Seebare.49

            • When I was young and very silly, I reconnected with an old friend from university days, a chap who was a mutual friend of a girl he later went on to impregnate and marry in a serious hurry. Obviously things were difficult for them, being young and broke and with a small child, trying to finish their respective degrees, and they were new to my area. Anyway, one evening they’d had a huge fight and he came round and I invited him to tag along to a large casual gathering at another friend’s house *with zero romantic intentions at the time or at any other time under any circumstances*, he came along and it was a pleasant evening, he met new people, it was fun. His wife found out and went absolutely ballistic. So I cut off all contact with them both, because in that short experience I realised something very important; a married person does not get to go and do stuff that makes their spouse unhappy and uncomfortable, certainly not without clearly explaining where they are going / with whom first. In this case, the chap concerned genuinely had no plans to cheat and as far as I know, never has (they are still married 20 years later!), but the point of my ramble is that when you REALISE you are stepping on toes, EVEN IF your intentions are only friendly and in no way poaching, you back off, and leave it alone. You DO NOT send sweets, or patronise or anything like that. You respect that you have no place. Being young and stupid is a fair excuse right up until someone tells you to back off. Then it’s not anymore. I look back and cringe at how she must have felt and at my thoughtless behaviour. Am happy to say that is the closest I have ever come to a clandestine encounter with a married man!

        • Hi Lina- I had much the same dynamic going on with XH and OW. I think it was the continuing disrespect post DDay, by both of them, that I found so staggering. She just wouldn’t keep away from him and he just loved the whole drama. Although now divorced ( thanks CL) I’m eighteen months on from DDay and the whole nastiness of it all still turns my stomach.

            • Mikky, in all do respect, I kind of had a chuckle over you saying 18 months. I had to count on my fingers and I’m at 17 months. (Dday to divorce) It’s like we’re thinking of a child growing up. I guess we need to start saying 1.5 yrs. But, yes, the nastiness I read daily on CL reminds me of what I lived with through those 17 bloody months.

        • Lina, I filed and waitng on final order to be filed. Yesterday, a close friend said, “you better not take him back”. My therapist also predicted he would come knocking on my door. My daughter thinks the whore controls him and his decisions. I warned her not to become his caretaker and fixer because HE has never had consequences for his behavior. Cheaters are about self preservation at others expense in my opinion. I am sticking to my role as the chump that moved on!! This requires the strength to have no contact to rid yourself from the toxic asshole. As time passes that compassion we chumps have in abundance has to be replaced with boundaries. He can’t pick up his adult children or granddaughter in my driveway. He drops off my granddaughter at my daughters work. I have come to realize he can no longer fuck with my emotions. The two times I did HAVE to see him (at court and a funeral) he had his mask on and it no longer mattered. The person I loved never existed. THAT was the most torturous pain. As difficult this was to accept I know it’s the truth. Sometimes I think about what I would say if he did want to come back. Nope. I just cleansed. We deserve more.

    • ExUK,
      Exactly!
      I FINALLY found out my ex, who I call Dexter, had cheated because he left a FaceBook Message for the OW’s best friend after they apparently had a fight one night.

      The message?:

      “I don’t know how much you know about me and Jan, but she’s a player and hurt me real bad”

      Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!!!
      Turns out that about halfway into their 8 month affair Jan had decided to see someone else.
      (She ended up marrying that poor sucker)

      Jan was bad enough with her FB post that read “I do whatever I want, whenever I want” (narcissistic much?), but Dexter had some real balls!

      I know for sure that he didnt even see the irony in his statement, which actually made it that much worse.

      As an aside…
      Is it even cheating if you’re cheating on a cheater? 😉

      • It is ironic how people who so coldly disregarded your feelings can be badly hurt when their affair ends. My cheater wasn’t moved a bit by the pain he was causing, he could leave in the middle of the night to sext on his phone, but when OW dumped him for a richer man who had no attachment, he was soooo distraught. Weird.

  • Part of the problem we have in our rapidly collapsing society is the response “people aren’t so easily categorized.” We’re so scared of calling people what they are because in todays world the judgment is worse than the crime, as if excusing and allowing bad behavior is somehow admirable. What a crock. People get defensive when you call them on their bullshit. Too bad for them. Time we gave integrity a try instead of excuses.

    • YES. In today’s world, nothing can be considered abnormal, wrong, immoral, crazy, selfish or bad in any way. Everything has to be accepted, because all that matters is “following your bliss,” and “creating your own reality.” Our society has become a cesspool of narcissism because complete self-absorption is encouraged, and refusal to accept responsibility for one’s own actions, along with a severe sense of entitlement, is now the norm.

      As for the OW who don’t like being called sluts….. who cares? They are defined by their actions, doesn’t really matter what you call these selfish, entitled, narcissistic hags.

    • I agree too Scott. What started out as being politically correct, has now taken a tragic turn into let anyone do anything they want. Dr. George Simon says if we continue down the path we are on with allowing the character disordered to take over, the future will be frightening. I believe anyone who is ok with cheating is just as bad as the actual cheaters.

      • Thank you for this reflection. Last nite, My brother and sister in law told me I’m too morally obsessed with my ex’s lyin’ theivin’ deceivin’ after 36 years. I’m not “fun” and nobody really cares on the grand scheme what happened. And the adult kids probably like him better cause they can kick back with him – ya know – have a few beers. Adultery is just not the problem for everybody else that I think it is. Get this, he was cheated on, as was my mom. But he never had children. Tiny, sweet creatures that wind and entwine hearts with you – but then invite the slut to holidays and vacation spots. Cause it’s in everyone’s best interest to just move on. Empathy? Compassion? Character? Not so much…

        • Oh it stinks, but I too have learned that most people might be sympathetic for a little while, then they just want to not talk about it. After a while, I got tired of discussing it too. But then again, it’s been 2 1/2 years ago from dday and the marriage was 16 years, the last year was divorcing. So during that 2 1/2 years I’ve come to a lot of realizations, one of them is, I judge, I find what I can and can’t live with, and the things I can’t live with from someone else, I move off to the side and walk away from them. One of my boundaries is, if you accept cheating, find it okay, or in any way side with someone who cheats, I walk away. There’s no middle ground. The world may go to hell, but I don’t have to go with it.

          • That’s exactly right Scott. Toxic is as toxic does. And if it disappoints us or we can’t tolerate the windshield wiper ambievelence, then we show who we are by standing up for ourselves. Adultery and its trappings. Are. Wrong.

          • The sad truth is that most people just don’t give a crap because ultimately it doesn’t hurt or affect “them”. My X’s oldest son (26) told me “I don’t know what he is doing and i don’t want to know…. and I don’t want to know the details of what he did because it will alter my opinion of my father.”

            This is the biggest problem in the situation…. I am the ONLY one that will call X out on his bullshit so I am always the bad guy….. everyone else is always “unaffected”. Wtf?

            • Calling people out on their bullshit is not an exercise for the faint of heart -the person on the receiving end, if a narcissist, looks at you like you have three heads, claims you are mentally defective and too emotional and then promptly mounts a smear campaign against you. If you can withstand the theatrics, you’re gold. It’s hard to be the bad guy all the time – wears you out. But there is something very psychologically satisying about passing the shit sandwich back to where it belongs.

              • Tflan386….
                you are spot on. My ex and his ho started a smear campaign against me once I called them out. The slut even had the nerve to blog about me stating that “she’s not a slut no matter how I wished it to be ” and they both claim that ” I’m batshit crazy” bc i call them as I see it. I should post it on here so everyone can see how delusional she is. she revised her story 4x to make herself look like she did nothing wrong and the lies she wrote is astounding.

          • Scott, I’ve occasionally toyed with the idea of joining a dating site. I keep wondering how “no cheaters need reply” would go over? I seriously don’t want anything else to do with someone who thinks it’s okay to cheat.

            NCStevie, I have one son who had a real hard time with what his dad did. Saw it as absolutely wrong. He was actually chomped by a long-term girlfriend in college.

            The other son was “understanding” of his dad. I believe his dad gave him the “we just grew apart” speech and my youngest son believes that was a justification for cheating. This son actually cheated on a long-term girlfriend in college, so I guess he thinks he sees things from the other point of view. He ended up marrying the girl he cheated with, and so far their relationship seems good. There were problems with the previous relationship, but I hated the way he ended it with her. It did seem to turn out best for both of them. The old girlfriend went on to marry someone who treats her well.

            Anyway, I just try to focus on making MY relationship with my sons as pleasant as possible. There are some things people just don’t understand until it happens to them.

            • I understand his defective “receptors” when it comes to spouting truth to X, he has an “aversion” to what he calls “negativity” and I call “reality”, but you can only put up with SO much before you just get SICK of the irresponsibility and selfishness!! He just doesn’t get (or refuses to acknowledge) that his decisions don’t just affect him…. it affects all of us. The sad thing is that, besides the affair & what he has destroyed between us and how badly he has hurt his youngest son…. he is truly financially destroying himself. ZERO accountability, it’s that damn entitlement they all have…. even spills over into his legal affairs and inevitably it is going to reach out and bit him in his ass…..

              • “I understand his defective ‘receptors’ when it comes to spouting truth to X, he has an “aversion” to what he calls ‘negativity’ and I call ‘reality’, but you can only put up with SO much before you just get SICK of the irresponsibility and selfishness!! He just doesn’t get (or refuses to acknowledge) that his decisions don’t just affect him…. it affects all of us.”

                My X was/is *EXACTLY* like this.

                The aversion to “negativity”? A couple of times during our marriage, when I dared to say that I wasn’t being “negative”, just “real” – boy did I have that shoved up you know where.

                My X was (and probably still is) so financially irresponsible. One good example was one time I overdrew the checking account because he had ATM’d some money out without looking to see if checks were outstanding. We had a fight over it. He told me (quite loudly), that he would “take over” all the bill paying. Well guess what. For the next four months, I literally watched him grow a neat little pile of unopened bills up on his desk. Maybe it was stupid of me, but, I just wanted to see how far he’d take it, thinking, “He HAS to do this at SOME point, doesn’t he???”. One day, I mentioned the growing pile and I got reamed for “Nagging”. Into the fourth month, I finally went in and grabbed them all and started paying them. He never made a peep about 1) not paying them … 2) the pile missing …. 3) the fact that *I* then took over the bill paying.

                This was just one example of how fucked up he was.

            • Lyn; unfortunately, many would love to have someone who does not cheat, but lie to you about their end of the bargain. In fact, who wants someone who cheats? Nobody!! I think you put yourself out there as a Chump if you say that or at best find another Chump who would like to reduce their chances of getting another Cheater.

              Cheaters love having the advantage of someone who won’t cheat! I remember mine was trying to get me to go cheat so I could see how meaningless it is! I said no I don’t need to, I already know it is meaningless!! I am sure it would be so he could call me a whore or somehow put us in the same category. Nice try! I (duh?) already know I don’t need some stranger banging away on me YUCK! LOL!

    • Hey, I have no problem categorizing some people: Cheater. Liar. Thief. Narcissist. Verbal Abuser. Asshole.

      • Thank you! My brother and sister in law tried to explain that no child wants to hear about their parents’ sex life.

        Ewwwww, not that I’d discuss that aspect anyway! Cheating isn’t about sex any more than rape is. IMHO cheating is abuse. It’s an abuse of power through lying and deceit. It’s about control and secrecy. It’s about hurting and blaming a spouse without the spouse’s knowledge. Anybody that would do those things has dreadfully poor character and a mean spirit. Of course then, I wonder why ANYONE would choose to associate with a liar let alone the family to which the cheater lied.

      • Nain, I agree cheating is about abuse. For my x it was always about sex. He dates multiple women and admittedly stated it was always about the chase and finding someone willing.

  • I’ve been hit on yesterday by a married man. I know his wife, we were discussing the textiles industry, regarding a business venture he is pursuing and advertising on a site I manage, and all of a sudden he’s telling me about his nagging wife. When I realized that I know her, and she is fucking awesome, I realized what a pathetic piece of shit he was. Poor woman. He actually told me he is only staying in his marriage for the children and he hasn’t felt love in years (their kids are 4 and 1). They’re also an international couple (so was I by the way). If you’re stupid enough to believe the bullshit that these kinds of guys are spouting, then yes, you’re stupid enough for me to call you slut. Would you prefer stupid or fuckwit instead? Works for me.

    • JJ,

      I was part of an “international couple” too…how laughable. Maybe we can provide the sluts with lists of words for “family-wrecking, child destroying, evil, soul-less, warped, pathetic whores” in about five different languages…since we’re all international and everything…that would make it special. just. like. them.

    • JJ, or how about stupid fuckwit? It has a nice ring to it.

      If being an American and living in poverty with my Iranian/British husband in London makes me part of an “international couple” then put me down as well!

      • Yeh, I tend to go for fucktard, shitwit and dickwit most of the time. I should note, I told him in no uncertain terms that I felt he was being an entitled moron and that he should worship his wife as she is awesome. I also said that maybe if you gave her love, you might get some right back at you. What a turd he was. Modern day entitlement is such a fucking disease. Nobody seems grateful for what they have anymore. Idiots.

    • JJ did the exact opposite of what a slut would do, so anybody who’s been offended by being labeled a slut should read her story over and over until it’s burned into their forehead. To begin with, a man disclosing this much personal info is looking for something. If a man tells you he “is married… hasn’t felt love in years… has 2 young kids… a nagging wife,” he’s clearly looking for somebody to screw. A decent person would look at the total picture (just like JJ), but a slut would spread her legs for him. Don’t be a slut.

      • Over sharing. It’s weird that people don’t even realize they are doing it. They honestly think everyone would side with them, or even care.

    • I cringed at that too, funny how people want to blast the writing, but I don’t see any facts behind unoriginal and hackneyed, just the accusation that it is unoriginal and hackneyed. And I’m not seeing where the inaccuracies are either. People just can’t accept criticism for their bad behaviors. Good response Doc…

      • Hard to believe anyone would criticize Cl
        s writng. It is quite good, even if they do not agree with the substance.

  • Awe… Did we strike a nerve. Dont call me those horrible names… Youuuuuu dont understand meeeee!!!!!!
    I am a simple woman who uses simple language. SLUT… Pretty simple four letters. Rhymes with stuff. Works for me. Perhaps we are not speaking their language… We need to flower that puppy up… Like…. Mistress…yes that sounds much more acceptable. Or Lover? Oh… Betcha they like that one. Kittens , puppies and little floaty hearts… How sweet.
    Yes hide behind the language…its just so much more acceptable when we call it something different.

      • Mutts are great! Much more loyal than people! Also rhymes with nut.
        SLUT stands for Subhuman Liar/Loser from the Underbelly of Trash!

      • LOL when I found out about CFMily, my X was telling me what a good old fashion girl she was. I said is a good old fashion word for a girl old fashion girl like her… IT.IS.SLUT! He was truly taken aback that I could think that such love would have that name. Lord help me.

      • How about “consort?” So cosmopolitan and European sounding! Back when I used to practice law in family court the popular word was “paramour” though now that I’m a chump I doubt there was any “amour” involved in cheating it’s all kibbles and fucks, kibbles and fucks.

        • it’s all kibbles and fucks, kibbles and fucks…….OMG THIS!!! (It should be the Ashley Madison jingle/slogan)

          I laughed so hard I snorted here at work!!!

          Thanks Muse-I needed that today

              • I like it, harlot. My favorite is still Whore, though. Simple, straightforward, and Biblical.

              • I think whore is apt because I have read several times about the theory of the Madonna/Whore in a narcissist’s cheating behavior. We are the Madonna who comes to be untouched by our man while he goes out to seek the whore. I am sorry I am not explaining this well but it’s easily googleable. It made a ton of sense to me when I read about it because my ex BF was a text book, card carrying somatic narcissist to the Nth degree.

              • I just did a google and the only site that I looked at (a narc blog) had posters saying THEY become the whore to him and others saying they became the Madonna.. However we look at it and interpret our own situations, it all just so f’d up.

    • One of my husband’s sluts referred to herself as “love buddy.” She was a business professional, and I guess “fuck buddy” was too vulgar.

      • That’s my issue with the word “polyamory” too, it implies it’s all about “loving” lots of people, but let’s face it they are usually talking about fucking lots of people. Same with “paramour” which means “for love,” but it’s NOT about love. Love requires respect, which cheaters lack, even for themselves.

  • It seems these “people?” Don’t want to be called what they consider derogatory names. Well then, will somebody please offer up a one word definition for a woman or man who climbs in a bed with a married man and the notoriously carries on in spite of destroying others? I get the feeling that they just don’t get that if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and acts like a duck well then, I guess it’s a frigging duck! Don’t like being called what you act, walk and talk like? Well guess what? Then DON’T Fuck married men and get all delusional that your sex act with him makes you “special” ! You are a slut stupid!!

  • ivillage.com and ivillage.co.uk each had a message (support) board for women involved with married men. Neither of those boards exist anymore. what happened to them?

  • “It’s just another word used by insecure people to make them feel superior to others.”

    Dear OW,
    Where to start?
    You took advantage, made secret combination, disrespected the bed I bought on my honeymoon, commandeered my children, flaunted your freedom and pretended to be my friend.
    You may not be insecure right now. But you will be.
    I suppose you prefer the term, “Beloved Equal”.
    Nope.
    Slut.
    Sincerely,
    Queen Mama

  • “I am a lot of things, but a slut is not one of them. I do not dress provocatively…”

    Brene Brown talks about shame and how we have unwanted identities that reveal our shame points. It is clear from this person’s response that “slut” is an unwanted identity for her. And it sounds like she IS struggling from shame issues to me.

    Personally, I consider such discussions as distractions. It is more wasted energy on the OW. Instead, they ought to be focusing on the bad thing done, how it hurt others (e.g. the spouse and kids), and correcting that behavior. Since they lack the character to do this, they fall back into navel-gazing wondering if they are rightly being labeled “slut” or not.

    Sad.

    • Well, I did write an article about them. But yes, other OW write a bazillion articles of the Do Not Judge Me variety, which invariably leads to them being judged. Which I’m beginning to think is a form of kibbles.

      • Fair enough. I suppose my point is about how the OW are better served developing empathy and learning from their behavior than spending their time wondering if they are or aren’t a slut. That’s a side issue to what we do know: They did something majorly wrong by sleeping with a married man! That needs correction and attention. Kibbles, yes.

      • Like Oscar Wilde said, “The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.” Yes, I suspect the “don’t judge me” columns are a version of kibbles.

        • They are idiots, CL’s whole point was that it is not slut shaming, it’s ” you have no ethics you asshole” shaming. Damn.

    • DM, if you spend a day on blogs written by OW you would understand why these Chumps hate them. The narcissism that oozes across the pages is sickening. Their cheaters are still stringing them along year after year and their selective vision(delusional thinking) keeps them hanging on by their fingernails. If the piece of shit was going to leave his wife he would have done so. If he did leave his wife and marry the OW then you have two pieces of shit in the same space. The aroma must be overwhelming.

  • A couple of years ago I took a look at loveshack.org, it really should be called Nutshack. The site has an other woman section and the majority of these other women are nutcases.

    I also noticed that the Moderator by the name of WIlliam used the avatar image of a young Ted Bundy, someone from loveshack.org had sent me a private message that the moderator was also a poster by the name of Carhill who claimed to be an other man. This guy moderates like a wing nut and bans anyone who disagrees with him.

    Loveshack.org is a weird place and I left it long ago.

      • Hilarious, X cheaterpants loved “married with children”. I loathed it. I think he got some sadistic pleasure from laughing out loud at the stupid shit, in front of me, the chump,
        But, yeah, slut is not pc in slut circles, but this is not a slut circle. so, yeah, I think calling a spade a spade, or…,ahem…a slut a slut, is perfectly acceptable Just sayin’.

  • The remarks made by the OW attempting to defend their horrible behavior is proof enough to me that they absolutely know that they are inferior! Let’s face it, they know that they are playing second fiddle to the legal wife and it pisses them off! No problem HO, you can have first chair and his useless ass, but I get all the rest! Have fun Little Miss second choice!

    • Or Third, or Fourth…. Well, you get it! It used to piss my ex husband off when I would tell him, ” I had pizza last night, does the HO want my leftovers from that too!” That would make him so angry!

      • Ohmigosh, Roberta – you just helped me reframe a bit of what I think about the two whores (x & his ho-worker) who blew up my family. They are both whores for seconds/leftovers, seeing as how they were BOTH “married.” Sloppy seconds. Leftovers! Haha!! I love this!! Thank you for this today. I needed it.

        • Kibble Free, yep! They take sloppy seconds from some old fart who feeds them some line! I married mine when he was young, virile and his ego hadn’t taken over every available space in our life! He was healthy and played with our children! She is getting a selfish, bloviating, sick old guy who thinks just his presence is awesome! He is so over-educated that he thinks he is above physical activity (except fucking, then you do all the work anyways). He is a bore, plain and simple! Glad I don’t have to sit with him and simply show my adoration anymore! But Schmoopie gets that job!

          • Roberta, yes she is getting the aging asshole! I take comfort knowing she got the whole aching package. A 57 year old balding, hearing impared, bed wetter that sleeps with a heating pad sexy.

            • Yup, ex’s new wife-to-be (not the OW -hmm, wonder what happened to her?) will be getting a cheater, a 52 yro who was taking Viagra in his early 40s and a relapsed alcoholic. Bet she knows nothing of these fine attributes.

  • “It’s just another word used by insecure people to make them feel superior to others.”

    Actually, I’m quite secure. And yes, OW, I do feel morally superior to you.

        • I think most other women have some sort of Daddy issues. Ignored, abandoned, not Daddy’s girl, or abused into thinking sex is their only special quality. Basically they think they have something to prove. Someone to knock down. Think every woman that ever competed on “the bachelor.”

          My sister had no problem sleeping with her boss who had a girlfriend he had no intention of leaving. She ended up aborting a child from that escapade. Years later she became almost suicidal when her husband of two years started seeing a waitress and discarded her. She was so distraught. I never said “I told you so.”

          But as the years go by, I realize she is jealous of me and would love to see me fall on my face. I was Daddy’s favorite. Not my fault. I even felt bad about it. She was Mommy’s favorite and the golden child. She got the better end of that because my dad was mostly blind and disabled by the time I finished elementary school. He had no power after that.

          I have no idea why my family decided to make the dynamic that of a “survivor” alliance. I know we didn’t choose that, our parents did. I just don’t know why she can’t see that. But the fact that she doesn’t makes her OW material.

    • I am by no means a perfect human being, but I know one thing 100%… I AM morally superior to any OW who knowingly fucked a married man.

        • Haha – “nailed it.” Ok, I’ll grow up now. And yes! I 100% agree with you GIO, and I’m not ashamed, nor do I feel self-righteous when I claim moral superiority over WHORES like the X and his whore-worker who was also “married.” We all make our choices, huh? They just like that they’ve removed all doubt of their less-than status. F-tards.

          • Oops – they DON’T like that they’ve removed all doubt of who and what they really are.

      • Sluts who sleep with married men are just for sex. They are not superior, just disordered women who take pride in destroying lives. They are so insecure to believe they fulfill any real need other than sex. The put out for a payday that usually never comes. They are competitive and think it is a game. Men who cheat especially serial cheating narcs like my x also think it’s a game. Sluts believe the cheater is safe because he lies and says he never has sex and sluts that they are have unprotected sex. While they think they are SPECIAL they are just another whore he found while simultaneously picking up women on craigs list and prostitutes. Sluts think all the good guys are taken and hook up with married men who are looking for a reciprocal relationship based on sex. The real difference between the sluts and the chump is that chumps have class and high standards; sluts are trashy with no moral compass. While cheaters seek out sleazy low life piggys as my x did, believe that he knows the difference. Knowing that he lost everything that was good in his life will come back to haunt the slut. Cheaters live to blame and there’s no one left in his life but the sleaze. After the infatuation wears off and they get tired of the fuck me whore the cycle repeats. Whore is at the bar looking and the cheater is talking shit about the home wrecker. That shit is normal for cheaters and whores. Chumps live better.

        • But I knew a woman who gets labeled “slut” at work because she sleeps with all the male employees who will have her. Some of them are married. She doesn’t claim to care about any of them, and they do not treat her any better for doing it.

          She is nice to the women, and I don’t think she would sleep with any of the male employees who are attached to someone at work. I think she has a real problem. We (the girls) tried to sit her down and tell her to stop it. We said things like, we are afraid you are going to get hurt (and we didn’t mean emotionally) and make a (single) man take you to dinner a few times before you sleep with him.

          That’s the problem with the word “slut”. Men use it to connotate someone they can fuck without consequences or feelings. Other women are much worse than sluts. Sluts have a problem respecting themselves. Other women think they deserve “the rose” and they will knock you down to get it. Other women are people without a conscience.

  • It’s funny ( and cliched) how they lose the substance of what was being said… The bottom line which was ofcourse DONT FUCK MARRIED PEOPLE and this is the most important piece of the message KNOWINGLY.

    Instead they focus on that word SLUT and just spew a whole bunch of bullshit around that word … As if the point being discussed is women being called SLUTS without a reason.

    No wonder the cheaters n these SLUTS gravitate toward each other…in their special international galaxies….

    Whatever!!!

    • Cheater told me, “it was JUST an attraction”, I replied,”I know it was just an attraction, like flies to shit. All I need to know is who’s the fly and who’s the shit”…..Now I know it doesn’t really matter. They were both, both.

  • Tempest, you’re right about that! I had a female dog that has more discernment in mating than some of these assholes! Am I superior? Maybe, maybe not, but I DO have morals! That’s the difference!

  • Guilty as charged. I’m the one who posted in on LS because I really wanted to hear what excuses and justifications the OW would come up with. I was not surprised that they were offended. One of the things I say a lot on that site is if you don’t want to be judged, then don’t do the action.

  • Their responses (the OW) only proves what has already been said about them.

    Defensiveness: “I’m not a slut. I have issues that I’m working on.” Too bad a marriage and family was torn apart (in part) because of your issues. We all have issues. But we don’t use that as an excuse to wreak havoc on someone else’s life. Sorry… You’re still a slut.

    The next one says, normal ordinary people don’t judge her. I hate to tell her but she’s in fantasy land. If people (normal, ordinary people) know you’re a lying, cheating half wit, they judge you. Maybe not to your face, but they have no respect for you. Men wouldn’t want you hanging out with their wives because you’re immoral. Women don’t want you around their husbands because… Well, pretty obvious. Parents don’t want you around their children because you’re a bad example of what a human being should be.

    And then we have an OW saying that only those who have been burned, would lash out at OW calling them sluts. When it happens to her, maybe she will see things differently. She says chumps are insecure for calling OW sluts. Really? I can’t think of anyone more insecure than an OW. You don’t have the self respect to have boundaries, to say no to something that is not only hurtful to everyone involved but also to you. Guess you lack the insight to see that.

    Not one acknowledges and owns her bad behavior. Not one is sorry for the hurt and damage she participated in causing. This just proves these are bad people, with no moral compass or sense of right and wrong. Pretty pitiful.

    • i know the oompa loompa is not sorry for her part in destroying my marriage or hurting my children. she honestly believes “our marriage was over” before she hooked her claws into boyman. and even if i can see how she would think that (after all that is what he told her and he was staying out all weekend probably with her) i still dont understand why she acted the way she did AFTER the divorce. disrespectful to me. telling my sons lies about me to make her and boyman look better. interferring with his time with his kids, to the point of throwing herself bodily on him and in between his kids. talking shit about me.

      so how am i suppaose to hink she is a good person? how can i NOT blame her when she is guilty of all this other shit. my ASS she is innocent. she knew what she was doing. she was so desperate for a man, she blow up my kids and i to get one.

      they dont care and they dont feel bad. and most of all neither her or him think of all the pain they caused. they dont think of you at all. they are living happily along without any consquences while you struggle to pick up the pieces. they have no conscious to feel guilty and if they break up with your X, they just shurge off the shoulders and find someone else to open their legs for. if you wonder if they care, they dont even remeber you. you were just someone they ran over to get what they wanted.

      pick yourself up and move on cuz most like your Ex and his/her fuck are not thinking of you.

    • Reminds me of an e-mail I once received from OW, which began,”I am not a whore…” I got a real chuckle from that one!

      • i got a text from her saying “i aint no hood rat”

        lol really? are u sure? u aint no huh. i just laughed. i dont think she would have got even if i explained it to her. (in small slow elementary words)

    • This sounds like it was written by my ex’s whore-wife (he actually married her and thinks that I don’t know that they’re married. He didn’t even invite our son to his wedding. ..which was fine with me). She actually had the nerve to tell me that she didn’t think that I was a slut when I was dating while I was separated…but still legally married. She also blamed me for the demise of our marriage. I told her I didn’t know about her existence unit I caught them. She accused me of slut shaming. .but the fact of the matter is that she is a bona-fide slut. She admitted that she loved being the other woman. Any woman who thrives on being the other woman not only has mental issues but is truly a slut. None of her friends or most of her family know that she broke up a marriage. Her mother. .who in my opinion is a slut as well knew about her affair with my husband and actually helped them cover it up. She has major daddy issues since her daddy died when she was in her 20’s. If some women don’t want to be labeled as a slut, whore, homewrecker, etc…then stop acting like a slut, whore, homewrecker. It’s only a matter of time since they start cheating on each other since they are both major narcissists. Karma always comes around and I’ll be on the sidelines with my popcorn…enjoying the show.

      • Annabella you are so right! Let’s get a Popcorn machine because, I can tell you now it will be such a good show! How do I know? I have seen the exact same thing happen.
        My ex left with OW (friend & employee) blah blah after 19 yrs etc….I have watched that ship go down like the Titanic 😉 She has major mental issues & he is a raging alcoholic & Karma is a Chameleon!

        I have never wished ill will on them as, I knew what they were both going to get as, two selfish narc’s will always destroy each other!

        Kudos to you Annabella & big hugs 🙂

        • You know, even if the OW and cheaterpants go their seperate ways, and even if the cheaterpants stays with his wife and family, I like to believe the karma bus is on it’s way. Someday the shmoopie will marry somebody, and even if she’s lucky enough to get a really good guy, she’ll never trust him, and she’ll ruin a good thing because of what she lived and believes to be true. It’s called projection, and like karma, it’s a bitch..

  • I didn’t bother speaking up yesterday, but I do have to agree that the word ‘slut’ is the wrong one to use. How does that saying go? “A slut is a woman who approaches sexuality like a man.” There’s nothing shameful about being a slut by the usual definition – have fun with as many available partners as you can find, if that’s what you enjoy! The key is ‘available’ partners. A married person isn’t available – no matter what they try to convince you.

    An affair partner, male or female, is someone who is morally corrupt, lacks integrity, prioritizes their sexual gratification over the well-being of innocent people including children, practices dishonesty and encourages others to do the same and above all, deceives themselves about the damage they are doing and their responsibility for it.

    Someone who actively encourages an alcoholic to drink is just as responsible for their relapse as the alcoholic.

    Someone who helps another person to commit murder is also considered just as guilty of murder. The criminal justice system doesn’t let them off any easier because they were not the one who did the deed.

    Just because the affair partner was not the one who made the marriage vow that is being broken does not absolve them of participating in the harm done. It’s all the unspoken contracts that hold society together, and one of the biggest is ‘don’t wreck marriages.’

    What used to astound me the most about cheating, was how an affair partner will believe the lies from the married person. Here is someone you are actively encouraging to lie to their spouse, but you believe everything they say to you is true? Over time, and with much research, I came to understand that cheaters and affair partners lie to themselves first, about what they are doing being okay. Once that lie is well-established, little else matters to them.

    But to get back on topic, ‘slut’ is just the wrong word to use. The affair partner may or may not also be a slut. We really need a new, gender-neutral insult. If we use ‘slut’ to try to shame an affair partner, they’ll be able to deflect that because it doesn’t fit the circumstances properly.

    The best I can suggest is enabler right now. It just doesn’t have the right ring to it though. Accessory? Parasite?

    • I think the archaic term of co-respondent would be good. From Wikipedia, “a person charged with misconduct with the petitioner’s spouse.”

      • My x called her a “crack whore.” But when I did too he got offended. He also said she had a 75 year old boyfriend and called her Anna Nicole Smith.

        I guess the reason these terms are offensive is there isn’t an equivalent word for men.

      • A person who knowingly sleeps with married men- needy slut

        A person who knowingly sleeps with married men with children-needy narc whore with a twist

        A person who knowingly sleeps with a married person with children and verbally abuses the chump- character disordered needy narcissistic loser slutty whore scumbag.

        Ow

        • And a person who will commit sexual acts for drugs is a crack whore. They all have a common thread. Willing to do something vile to get something they want.

    • “An affair partner, male or female, is someone who is morally corrupt, lacks integrity, prioritizes their sexual gratification over the well-being of innocent people including children, practices dishonesty and encourages others to do the same and above all, deceives themselves about the damage they are doing and their responsibility for it.

      Someone who actively encourages an alcoholic to drink is just as responsible for their relapse as the alcoholic.

      Someone who helps another person to commit murder is also considered just as guilty of murder. The criminal justice system doesn’t let them off any easier because they were not the one who did the deed.

      Just because the affair partner was not the one who made the marriage vow that is being broken does not absolve them of participating in the harm done. It’s all the unspoken contracts that hold society together, and one of the biggest is ‘don’t wreck marriages.’”

      THIS!

      AWESOME!

    • I’ll go with “whore” for the female and “pig” for the male. Though I’m sure it’s an insult to actual pigs everywhere.

      • I’ve called them both pig whores, and her brats are her piglets. Yeah, yeah, leave the kids out of it. Not sorry – they carry her pig whore DNA, and I care about MY kids and destryoed family much, much more.

        Yes. Pig whores. All cheaters.

    • Cynic – There have been so many gems on this sight that I will cut and past into my Divorce folder, but yours today has absolutely been one of the best comments that I have read on this sight to date. Thank you a million times.

    • I call them officially the adulterer and his adulteress, or partner in adultery. Although they don’t like it they cannot accuse me of being rude. Not to their faces anyway.

    • I am waiting tables at the moment. We have “closers” that check side work at the end of the night. I told a busy closer what I did so he could sign me off. He said, “you’re not lying to me are you?” as he was too busy to physically check. I told him no, I’m not capable of it. He said, “everybody’s capable of it, not everyone is comfortable with it, Whether you lie to yourself, or lie to someone else.” So I had to agree, I’m not comfortable with lying to others, but I have lied to myself on occasion.

      Cheaters and affair partners are comfortable with both. They lie to us and they lie to themselves. Narcissistic rage hits when the data conflicts with the lies.

    • i agree with everything you said except the slut part. i was raised to believe a slut is someone who has sex with anyone who wants to. no screening, no questions, any and every man who could get it up and keep it up was welcome. and yes it is VERY shameful to be a slut.

      it is ok to have sex as long as you do it with class. and not act like a slut. i have had fuck buddies where it was mutual between he and i that we were not geetting together but liked to satisfy our cravings. i knew he was clean as was i. and it was brodcasted eithr since he and i both were looking for parnters. if a parnter was found fucking was out. (at least for me) i lost track of him after i got married to the boyman.

      but there is a vast difference between a slut and someone who likes sex. at least that is my opinion. OW are nothing but dirty sluts. which is why they open their legs to a married man.

  • In all of this breast beating and angst between what seems to be a continuous contest between OW and BW, guess who gets off the hook because of all the hoopla. the fucking asswipe cheaters. why are we still talking about OW (as if there are no OM that exist) as if they are the only ones dserving of shameing?

    I think it’s only fair that if an OW/OM gets to be publicly shamed, the cheater is to be held to the same standard. I think publicizing cheaters’ names and what they did on blogs and those “shaming” sites is only appropriate. they were part of the tango (probably the initiator, right) that lead to the affair.

    How about that idea BSs? Because i know when I think of going around telling everyone the details, making sure everyone knows, putting it out there for the world to consume I cringe. Because I am embarrassed that I married (and believed) a fucking asshole like my husband. I don’t want to go around publicizing it.

    There’s a downside to that whole idea of going around publicly shaming OW/OM—it reflects on us as well. i say go and put the spouse’s name and picture and all that on every cheating website, identifying him (or her) to the world at large. i’m interested in seeing if there’s any pushback on that because again, this is getting directed at OW/OM and not at the people mostly responsible for letting that OM/OW into the marriage.

    i think we’re giving them just what they want, a continuation of the “pick me dance” only it’s not for the fucktard, it’s for public opinion. i want my whole trashy episode to go away and be completely behind me, move on and let whatever happens to OW happen to her. let karma do their work. i don’t need to lower myself to their level, i won’t compete with her about who was right and who was wrong and whatever. my husband cheated. if it wasn’t with that idiot, it would be with some other idiot. the problem is him, not her. the names and public shaming should be directed at him, as it’s appropriate.

    • I’m all for meh. If you read yesterday’s column, you’ll see I was responding to a public article written by an OW asking that we not “slut shame” or judge her. There’s a lot of that sort of thing.

    • GCJ – I agree completely. If you google my exwipes name it comes up on “Bad Boy Report” (he’s too paranoid to have a social media presence to counteract the key word effect). The hilarious thing is I didn’t put him there – I put him on “Cheaterville” and someone else he messed with must have realized what he was and “updated” my info by adding theirs! I confess that I google his name regularly to make sure he stays prominent (smile). As far as the new wife is concerned – either she didn’t look, or she believed his victim story. I tried to warn womanhood – that’s all I can do.

      • To hell with verbal nonsense!
        Tar & Feather the OW!
        Public Ass Whopping for OM!

      • GCJ, I am all for publicizing “it” meaning my X picking up a whore while he was with me. I am not embarrassed. He owns that shit. The OW. Exposed.! Sent copies of her history of arrests to ALL family members. This is the truth, phone records, hotel receipts, poems , and vacations for ho. Everyone we did business with for years know the truth. He can add THAT to his list of complaints! No one respects him!! I made him look good. Consequently,(lol) I am thriving! Leave a cheater gain a life!

    • IMHO –

      All the ass-wipe sees is two women fighting over him, calling each other names. Talk about kibbles for the narc.

      I have seen sick fucked up men do this to women more times than I care to count while they just sit there grinning. And, I have seen sick fucked up women do it to men.

      We have to be mindful of who the true rat is and never forget it’s the one with the tale. Yes, I used the right word.

  • If anyone is slut shaming, it’s the OW in the first quote you provided.

    There is nothing inherently wrong with having casual sex and dressing provactively… provided you are single and only having sex with other people who are single.

    It doesn’t matter if that OW dresses like a pilgrim and was a virgin before she fucked a married man… she committed an act worthy of shaming. She doesn’t get to pass judgment on people whose behavior victimizes no one.

    • Now see I don’t think casual sex and all that is ok. I think it is a catalyst into anything goes. I believe people with strong character don’t have casual sex- meaning multiple partners without much of a relationship. I’m sure that seems old fashioned but maybe we if we had more old fashioned morals there wouldn’t be so many disordered people out there.

  • Hey!! I was in an *International* couple [we need italics here…]. Crapweasel was born in Singapore, raised in Indonesia…even lived in the same neighborhood as Barack Obama for a while. Woo woo.

    Dr.Hoe first met him there (her father was an oil field worker or some such. Bless her soul.)

    So when Crapweasel and Dr. Hoe hooked up at their, ahem, *International School* high school reunion, was that ever the height of sophistication or what???

    Skyrockets is flight, indeed.

    Except, despite their thirst for glamor, they were both at heart a couple of middle aged losers–she, a chronic breaker-up of marriages, with hideous taste in clothing, 3 kids at home, and no morals at all. He, a perennial wanna-be, with buckets of potential, all of it unused and beginning to moulder.

    Tant pis.

  • Having sex with other people’s spouses is shameful. It’s lying, cheating, and deceitful behavior. By being the OW/OM, you not only accede to the Cheater’s need to cheat his/her spouse, but you also participate in that deception.

    This is why, when I saw the OW’s texts to STBX accusing him of being deceptive, I nearly laughed out loud. Of course he’s deceptive! He was having an affair! For two years she was okay with him lying to me, taking money from our marital assets to pay her bills–hello! Sweetie, the moment you knowingly fucked a married man, you knew that he was deceitful. He showed you who he is at that moment, and you were okay with it because you thought that his deceit didn’t affect you. You participated in that deception. You don’t get to play victim now that the tables are turning.

    The women who are so concerned with people judging their sexual behavior need to clue in that it’s not the sex that’s the problem; it’s who they’re having sex with and the layers of dishonesty that this kind of sex thrives on.

    And that’s what I judge them on.

    • But I also want to reiterate that I don’t target the OW in my story. Sure, she’s a woman of negotiable virtue, what with her two prior failed marriages, her string of affairs with married men, and her tendency to sleep through the management team at whatever workplace she’s at–BUT she did not make STBX cheat. He chose that. Yes, she may have made it easy for him to choose, but it was his choice.

      And now it’s a choice he finds easier to make.

      • “Negotiable virtue?” LOL. You’re being generous. The virtue of most cheaters is “negotiable” the way prices at a yard sale at sunset are “negotiable.” As in, “pay what you want or I have to haul it to the dumpster.”

        In many cases, these cheaters PAY OTHERS to take their virtue away.

      • i like that. she made it easy for him to cheat.

        but she made it easy because she has no morals. no values. no intregity. and she made sure he didnt feel bad for his decisions so no accountibity and no responsiblity…..what do u call those types of people besides easy?

    • My ex husbands AP called me once and left me a message saying that my ex husband had become a very good liar. He had left me for 9 months and then came home “to make our marriage work” and continued on with her and she thought he was still on his own. She was SOOOOO mad and seemed shocked that he was lying to her. I called her back and left her a message and I basically told her that she was right about him but that she also needs to take a good long hard look at herself as well.

      So hilarious that they think they are somehow better or above being lied to. AMAZING!

      • AP told someone “I was DEVASTATED when he went back to Brave!” Praise Jesus he only came back for 2 weeks (bogus reconciliation) and then went right back to the doormat. He was lying to her the whole affair but she really believes she is so special and that he wasn’t. I know he told her we weren’t having sex too….well, then how was it that I got PREGNANT during their affair? I’m very pleased that that pregnancy ended in a miscarriage…sorry if that triggers anyone, but it’s the truth.

      • Aren’t cheaters such a treasure trove of inconsistencies (and sexually transmitted diseases too)?! The ex’s OW, when confronted by her then husband about why she suddenly didn’t love him anymore asked her if “there was someone else” and she lied <——-insert shocked face here.

        Imagine my surprise at the ex's surprise and anger that she would do such a thing? You see, he told me that if I asked him outright, he would've told me the truth. What a stand up guy huh?

        Is it wrong that I giggle every day when I think of both of those losers spending eternity lying to each other and not being on the market for any more unsuspecting chumps?

        • Cheaterssuck, I was on the phone with the AP,literally in front of my ex husband, and he was still denying the affair while she was telling me that she was in love with him and they were having an affair.

          Your ex was lying when he told you he wouldn’t have lied to you, lol! As though in the moment you could bust him, he would magically find some character. LOSER for sure.

  • “Oh, I’m sorry! You’re an international couple? My God that makes all the difference. So dazzled by such an exotic pageant of multiculturalism, people must approach you all the time to ask about your Special Relationship!”

    This^^^ LMAO!!!!
    That’s exactly where my mind went! Well, shit….I had no idea you were an elitist cheater, that surely makes your affair more valid than the other peasant cheaters out there….proceed.

    Get the hell outta here…

    What OW Side-piece-now-main-dish fails to realize is that most people DON’T GIVE A FUCK. Does she, as (assuming) an adult, not know that many people just humor you or agree with you to your face because they don’t give enough shits about you to tell you how they truly feel? Is she so delusional that she’s convinced herself that “normal people” with morality would immediately abandon all their beliefs and jump on her Narc fairytale because it’s a SPECIAL kind of infidelity?

    Sorry, but please bent & lose your AP/Husband the same way you obtained him.

  • Well…. I don’t really use the term “slut” anyway, I prefer rutting pig or nasty piece of ass 🙂 wonder if they’d like that any better?? As if we are supposed to give a fat shit about anything they condone or approve of?? Seriously…. get over yourself.

  • Chump lady, you are tough. I could barely stand to read the things they were saying about you on that site, so messed up.
    For me it is still something that gets on my nerves once in a while, the self righteousness of the OW. The brazenness just flabbergasted me from the beginning. At least with my x we had a few tiny moments of reality interspersed with the craziness of what he was doing and decided to do, leave when I found out. It was like he turned into another person but I caught him unawares a time or two and saw a bit of angst and realization of his douchery before he went behind a cold mask again. I guess I just have to also just trust that she sucks too and not waste any thought on wishing I could see her downfall. I do blame both. It’s not black or white to me in that he is the only one that did something by letting her in. He did and that was wrong. She interfered knowingly in a marriage and that is also wrong. She does not get off scot free just because I didn’t know her and she didn’t know me. And I think she thought she knew enough about me from whatever he would tell her that she felt she could enter into this “competition” to get him. Pathetic.

  • Oh we’re not supposed to judge the OWs but they’re allowed to make pithy attempts to publicly humiliate us? Pass judgment based on all the schmucky things out exes said about us, such as we “weren’t ever in the mood for sex” (lie), “never wanted to do anything exciting” (lie), “don’t have any career ambition” (lie). I’m sorry OW, you judged the most intimate aspects of my life without my consent or input so now I will judge you, quite accurately, on the actions you committed.

    In fact, I’ll judge the OW from my past as much as I like: she’s a desperate, insecure woman with poor writing skills and little education who believes in cultural appropriation and indulges in age-inappropriate behavior such as planning an elf themed, new age wedding. She can take her love of dystopian costume fashion, elven fantasies, and my ex and shove it up her behind.

    • Lucky35, your description of the OW in your life fits the OW in mine exactly: “She’s a desperate, insecure woman with poor writing skills and little education who believes in cultural appropriation and indulges in age-inappropriate behavior.” MOW is the queen of highly adorned fingernails, eye makeup more suited to nightclubs that cater to 20-somethings, tiny cut-off shorts with the pockets hanging out, and sparkly bras meant to be seen under clothes. She of course can wear none of this stuff but still loves it all anyway. Like Jackass, still an adolescent in her own mind.

    • I especially loved the “I’m sure she would coo and cluck around a bunch of “slut shamers” if she was given the chance.”

      Hey, we chumps are chickens!! Persnickety little hens! Borrow a cup of sugar and don’t return it? cluck cluck. Didn’t treat your lawn with weed killer? cluck cluck. Fucked my husband repeatedly? cluck cluck.

  • I am so sorry that they don’t like “slut” or “home wrecker”. The OW always have excuses for their behavior. I think many people can comment on this stuff and make assumptions BUT until you actually LIVE it…fuck off!!

    I fell into a pit that was on fire and couldn’t get out. I was literally burning alive. It was the worst imaginable pain. I have NEVER been in pain like I was until D-Day. I hope that I never have to feel that way again. Imagine the excuse that I got from one of the OW was that she was going through her own divorce and needed to feel loved. WTF?!??

    You my friend are deceptive slutty home wrecker and I don’t give a damn who knows and how YOU feel. I hope you fall into the pit of fire and see how it feels!!

  • The things that gets me with these OW, especially single ones, is that they have no sense of remorse or wrongdoing. I really got an education when my cheater’s whoring was revealed.

    I was at work, and I suddenly realized that the Mutual Acquaintance (ow friend, also my friend) i had asked about my husbsnd and the whore had actively lied to me, and that she had probably covered for the whores as well.

    Everyone was gone to lunch but me and another co worker. I told her how mad I was and why. She was a very religious, go to church all the time person. Also a single never married mother of a young child. She said ” you don’t need to be mad at the OW. SHE DIDNt DO ANYTHING WRONG. “. I said, Excuse me, what ??? She said, she’s single, she can date anyone she wants. I said, Married men? And she said, she is single, she can date ANYONe she wants, and it’s not wrong.

    I just walked away at that point. But I have noticed it is the new prevailing attitude of single women. That is the one my husband’s unmarried whore had. Incredible.

  • To the Ow…Slut Slut Slut. Wanna make something of it? See you in the parking lot on my lunch hour. Would love to smash your ugly face in.
    I have a ‘friend’ from high school still waiting for her married lover from high school (been waiting ten years) to leave his wife …bwahahaha…as she gets fatter from the wine and more wrinkly from the Marlboro’s by the day. Oh, and older by the minute. Talk about an absolute waste of her life. One day she was yakking to me about him and their soon to be life together and I said super exasperated ‘HE’S FUCKING MARRIED!!!’ I can’t even stand to talk to her. It’s so beyond stupid.

    Oh, and BTW. Guess what I saw on Craigslist yesterday? Slut Woman’s perverted ex-husband’s ad who she was married to for TWENTY FIVE years…advertising that he was BI Sexual and looking for a BI sexual woman. He’s on EVERY dating site in the world plus Craigslist being an absolute predator pig. Yesterday was the first time I saw he was looking for a guy to suck him off. Eeewwww. Nice, huh? That means that whilst my husband was fucking Slut Woman who was fucking Bi Sexual Perv Man and then coming home to the Marital Bed WITH ME….of course unbeknownst to me. Could have been giving me AIDS.
    THIS.IS.WHY.AFFAIRS.ARE.SO.WRONG.ON.EVERY.LEVEL.

    • Carrie Fisher in When Harry Met Sally: “He’s never going to leave her.”
      Meg Ryan as Sally: “Of course he isn’t, no one thinks he’s going to.”

    • Syringa, that was the deal breaker for me when I opened a healthcare receipt in the mail showing HIV testing and 4 follow up visits for treatment within three weeks of his announcement. This is the reason I will never forgive him and continue to inform people. My results were negative thankfully. It literally made me sick for a month. To play with their own lives is one thing, another to expose innocent trusting spouse. Such sick sick assholes. Sorry you had to deal with that. We can rightfully call them anything we choose.

  • One more thing…..I have NOTHING against gay people. Some of my best friends are gay. If you’re gay be gay. This cruising Craigslist to find ANYONE to suck you off or screw is disgusting. This predator pig XH of hers is on Match posing as a ‘normal’ guy then has super icky ads on CL with all of his kinks listed. Be careful out there people.

  • No, you assholes. You are whores. That’s it. Fini.

    There are only two kinds of whores who I may be able to rationalize their behavior: paid sex workers and really stupid people who were duped into fucking a married person.

    Your prancing and hiding behind whatever it is you pontificate about does not disguise what you ARE, whores. Including my serial cheating spouse.

    • I also want to give a pass to sex workers. Not that I know any, but it seems less predatory than an other woman.

  • Syringa,
    Exactly ! They DO NOT give a shit !
    Had the pleasure of talking to my then husbands whore that he knew from high school. He traveled to Tucson, Az on business and stopped by to see her after she had communicated on FB for a couple of months and had invited him over to fuck her. The arrogance that just pored out of her was astonishing! She was married herself with a daughter about my daughters age and I could tell she just could have cared less that she passed along her STDs to me. I guess what I deserved for being such a “bitch of a wife ” So , I said ” Carrie, you don’t seem to be the least bit sorry . She said she only should ask GOD and Jones ( her husband )for forgiveness. She owed me nothing. A SLUT is a SLUT is a SLUT all day long.

    • I will let you know when I conquer the concerned tone in Slut’s voice when she said with a glisten, “It is so sad to see marriages fall apart.” (in reference to mine);
      … sluts really really care…

      And yes, she bragged about getting Ex drunk. And about his most intimate quirks.

      • Oh yeah slut’s care soOOooo much. I had a mammogram come back wanky and Slut Face in an email to MY husband at the time told him she sure hoped I was ‘okay.’ WTF? I mean how freaking phoney can you possibly be? Slut face all concerned about my health? Can you imagine?? I’m pretty much at Meh these days because I think XH realizes that the grass wasn’t really greener. Especially when he looks at me and then looks at her. Seriously, Karma is good kids. OW gets uglier and uglier. That’s what happens to these black ass hearted SLUTS!!

        • I can’t imagine her getting any uglier. She is SO ugly already inside and out. That is why it has to be about sex. She talks like a crack whore. I am embarrassed FOR him.

  • Another person interfering with a marriage has been going on forever…As evidence that there is nothing new under the sun the mindset of Other Woman has been with us for the ages, a quote: “This is the way of an adulterous woman: She eats and wipes her mouth, And says, “I have done no wrong.” Proverbs 30:20

    • Love that hanecita, I haven’t studied scripture much but I have been reading Proverbs…. this might be my new favorite!! X and OW are Jesus cheaters…. once he split they started doing “bible study” every night together over the phone (she lives 4 hours away), she was skipping out on Sunday services with her hubby & 3 boys to stay home and hang on the phone with X. I literally laughed my ass off!! These two idiots think they get a free pass now because they have brought the Lord into it? W.T.F.E. They are SO delusional.

    • After Dday, my ex would leave his bible sitting on the kitchen table open to the bible sections that talk about adultery. Not sure why he did that, but after I flipped the pages to the verse that talks about a good wife being worth more than rubies, he stopped doing it.

  • Oh goodness…the website’s name says it all: LoveShack.org…WTH?!?

    I’m having quite a laugh with these people justifying themselves…stupid,stupid, stupid people. Like with anything else, if you have to explain or justify anything to anyone, you look exactly what you’re being called out to be!!! Enough said!

  • One of the reasons I chose my ex was because his first wife made him a chump. This was important to me because my mother was chumped by my father and I lived with her pain.
    Funny how for so many years he criticized this behavior, hated his brother in law for cheating on HIS sister. Then he turns around and does it to me, his wife of 25 years! Has it all justified because he had been unhappy for a long time. God forbid we tell his wife of this unhappiness.
    Yall are going to love this.. He never wanted his children to know of first marriage because ours was the only one that mattered. Well when he started justifying his behavior to our adult children I told them of his history. On a call with our daughter when he was telling her how this happens to good people. Our daughter asked him if he felt that his first wife was a good person too? He had no idea that she knew. He blew up at her saying how her mother had no business telling her about such a private matter! Lmfao always blaming me never addressing his bad behavior!

    • Jen–I exposed my X’s previous marriage to his children after D-day, too. Screw his multiple deceptions; I don’t cover for him anymore (nor the fact that he cheated on her, too).

    • “had been unhappy for a long time..”

      I hope Chump Lady tackles this universal lie in a future column.

      It deserves its own single blog post and is in need of MAJOR deconstruction!!

      • Absolutely. I heard the exact same shit. He hadn’t been happy “for years”. If ever. So why the fuck did he pursue me, and date me, and ask me to move in, get married, etc. He was fine, till responsibility set in…

        • Me me too! She said she’d been unhappy for at least the last 10 of our 30 years together. When the f**k was she going to tell me? It came out of the blue. I can only assume she’d been cheating for at least that long. But I know it was from the very beginning. Need this as a blog one day. 🙂

      • God yes. For 20 years, my ex always told me I was his best friend, he was happy, he would never want a divorce, he loved me. That lasted right up until Dday, when it suddenly changed to he was miserable practically since our wedding day, he never should have married me, we had nothing in common, he didn’t love me, etc.

        I spent a lot of time wondering which was the truth: had he ever loved me or not? Now I know that it really doesn’t matter — he cheated throughout our entire marriage, he lied all the time and he turned out to be a terrible person who mainly married me because I was useful. What difference does it make if he once loved me or not? The only thing that matters is that it’s over now and I am better off without him.

        • Exactly. Mine did a 180 like that too and also turned out to be a serial cheater from day one. We are def better off w/o sociopathic double life leading cheaters!!

      • Chumpette, they all use that “I’ve been unhappy for a long time” line! Funny, you never told me anything. As a matter of fact, you told me how great our life was, how much you loved me and all the other lies that apparently were part of the script! Or did you just realize how “unhappy” you were after screwing the HO cause she told you that you were unhappy! These guys can’t even think for themselves. I really don’t need any man who is so weak minded that he can be led around by his….. Nose!!!

        • And just a side note: he doesn’t look all that happy now! I guess when you lose everything you worked for all your life to your faithful wife then reality slips in! Sucks to be him!

    • Several months after I asked for a divorce, after reality and finances finally hit my now ex husband in the head, he told mutual friends of our that he had been unhappy for YEARS!!!! Yeah……I would be unhappy too if I was living a lie every day for over five years. Coming home from work every night living a lie to my spouse and children. It doesn’t make you feel good I imagine. He apparently wanted something else but he couldn’t have it because he was stuck with me! And our kids! You know, it wouldn’t look right if he just walked out on us for no reason at all.

      Outside of that, I think he should have been dancing in the streets with delight. He had two women wanting him!! He was having sex with two women. He had this secret exciting life! If he could just get past the guilt!!! lol

      • So Kimmy, how is he doing nowadays? Is his life all he thought it would be? Hope he got just what he thought he so richly deserved!

        • He is living with his AP now and they just bought a house. She is all he has left. And he is all she has left. I imagine they will stay together. Will they be happy? Will they last forever? Will they get married? Not sure. I suspect they probably will get married one day and maybe it will last forever. I’m not sure they even know what they are doing. But I am 100% certain they will both question their relationship, their love and the real reasons they are together. They won’t trust one another forever. They will fight and they will wonder if the other is mad enough to cheat. I suspect it will always be in the back of their minds somewhere. THAT is their cross to bare. That is the price they will pay for their affair.

          I am blissfully happy that I am no longer living a life wondering if I am second best. Let them live that way!!!!

  • OW/OM and especially MOW/MOM of the world.. a Big at FUCK YOU! Signed.. Honorable women and men of the world.

  • i am in the mood to contribute further to OWs not being amused…

    Guess what, MOW of my XH….while he was lying to me, he was lying to you!! (we WERE sleeping together, planning our retirement, future trips…and he was telling me he loved me!!)

    AND after he said all those awful things about me to you ( i.e., kibble deprivation while i worked full time and coordinated every detail of kids, house, family life while you were a SAHM and drove $$$$ sports cars to your gym workouts…), after DDay, he said awful things about you!!!

    AND he said he regretted everything and wished he had never done “it” a year after the divorce …while he was still with you!!!

    Hope you have an endless supply of kibbles….the entitled-shameless-slut-variety. so far, it looks like you do! keep up the good work!

    • Same here Chumpette. Kept talking about our future, trips, etc. WTF? Now he’s stuck with the HO! I don’t want him back ever! Let him have what he thought was so wonderful!

  • And how about those awful things about YOU, OW, that he said to me. He said he couldn’t trust you. He said “this reflected poorly on” YOUR character! He said “Don’t tell anyone I said this but she is not the type of person I could ever be in a relationship with,” and guess what else? He also said, “Muse, I don’t know where you get this idea that the sex with her is wonderful – it’s NOT – it’s JUST sex, OK?” He said you were going to be a better girlfriend because you don’t have children and you represent a great “opportunity” for him, can we say $$$$ in his eyes? he said “all he did was take advantage of an offer someone made.” See what a great Prize you won from me? I simply can’t thank you enough for taking this subhuman opportunist off my hands! Enjoy your lovely new life with him!

    • Same here Muse. When I gave x the chance to profess his undying love for OW, by me stating that he shouldn’t be doing this, his only response was ” I don’t want to be homeless”, Wow. So that’s what you’ve got darlin’, See…. you’re just of use to him…..for now…..

    • Well, I had to support ex in every way during our marriage, especially financially, while he worked at his “consulting” business that never seems to really take off. He was jealous of my success, but hid it behind a passive-aggressive facade. He claimed to adore me, but at home, he constantly griped that the house was not clean enough, the children too chaotic, and the pets so annoying. Also, ex sucked at sex, literally from the minute we were married 25 years before D-Day, and was…ahem….less than well-endowed besides. In the years before D-Day, from sun-up to sun-down, ex was in his home-office putting together brochures for his “consulting” business, and (I now know) talking to his various AP’s, looking at porn and doing that thing that men do when they look at porn.

      And now, three years later, ex and OW#1 are planning their wedding. OW#1 makes all the money, has to support ex, and he moved into the expensive home that she rents. Our three children, all beautiful, successful and hurt beyond belief, will have nothing to do with their father or OW#1, and he has no other family.

      In the meantime, I have gotten re-married to my new husband, a kind and thoughtful man of integrity. He rocks it in every way (even in our 50’s), and I have come to realize all that I have gained in “losing” my ex, including a loving marriage, an authentic partner, and a fantastic sex life (as well as 3 step-sons!).

      So buh-bye cheater, have fun slut….I mean OW, I mean AP. And thank you. I didn’t know what I was missing, but now that I do, I just wish I’d have lost him sooner.

      • Kelly – oh how I hope my story of losing the serial cheating f-tard becomes the beautiful chapter that yours has! Mine was emotionally inept and never “grew” or matured past about 25. Covered it all up by acting “calm,” and like he was more “thoughtful” about things. The reality was that he was shallow as hell, a professional liar, and sought kibbles from any whore who’d tell him he was funny, awesome, thoughtful, kind, blah, blah. Well, kind and thoughtful men don’t fuck around with married whores, or any with anyone behind their wife’s back. Just so unfortunate for me to have lost 23 years on that fuckwit.

        Dday just after I turned 39. Divorced Dec. 30, just after I turned 40. I was alone so long in that sham of a “marriage,” I just can’t WAIT for some amazing man of integrity to show me what a REAL man – and what real love & respect – is like! (((hugs!)))

    • Ditto Marci! And Muse, my husband would leave the HO and try reconciliation all the while telling me how awful it was when he was with her. That she’s needy, pushy and he could hardly ever finish the sex act! Oh and her cooking was gross! Really? Liars, all of them! She can have his dumb ass!

  • Laughing out loud in my office….snorting actually…

    Some of my favs–“if the thong fits”

    And of course– “Oh, I’m sorry! You’re an international couple?…….No, no. Let me guess — Finnish!…No, I’m actually from Pittsburgh. The better part of Pittsburgh, of course. But my partner is Puerto Rican….OMG. I’ve never met a Puerto Rican! Say something Puerto Rican!”

    hahahahahahahahaha

  • I think this sums it up nicely: “Does it make me selfish, slightly narcissistic, emotionally messed up, and dishonest? Yes.”

    Selfish–check. Narcissistic–check. Emotionally messed up–check. Dishonest–check. But don’t call her a slut because she only cheated one time, only broke up one marriage. So: Asshole–check. Homewrecker–check.

  • Hi,
    I normally don’t respond, because I was the other woman and while I benefit from reading here, it isn’t my space to heal and I want to respect that. I’m commenting now just to say why I am (and probably at least some former OW) read here. I can’t speak to all OW, and I am sure CL is right that some read to feel superior, but personally, I read CL because I fucked up. I did something horrible — I had an affair with a married man. At the time, I used all the justifications (He says their marriage is basically over! He loves me! I am not married to her!). All of that is non-sense and in reality, I knowingly participated in hurting another person. The fact that I didn’t make vows is irrelevant. When D-day happened and I realized — really realized — I had dehumanized someone else in one of the worst ways possible and caused unspeakable pain, it was important for me to understand the damage I caused. It was important to wrestle with that, and to see it clearly and in unambiguous terms. All the “slut” stuff aside (which I am avoiding because I think the term is inherently misogynistic, regardless of who it is applied to), I agree with a lot of what Chumplady has to say. I don’t think OW are “chumps” for all the reasons she states in her posts — we, myself included, knew what we were getting into. Many of us were lied to, but it is not the same as someone who was innocent, who had no say in the matter. Not being a chump, however, doesn’t mean that what chumplady has to say isn’t true and useful, even if we aren’t the intended beneficiaries.

    I can never undo the pain I caused or the choices I made. I can move forward never doing the same thing again. Shame, at it’s best, alerts us that we did something we know is wrong and helps us to make different choices. I am sorry.

    • Hey Sarah, brave post. You are owning your shit and that’s to be commended.

      I hope you’re doing the work to figure out why you accepted such a crap person and willingly bought into the nonsense. Affairs are degrading, except to the cake eater who plays everyone for kibbles. We should all make “different choices” to get away from such people.

      I’m glad the site helps you. Welcome.

      • I understand Sarah because I too was an OW and I can attest that there are some of us who are mortified by what we did and want nothing more than to try to go through life without ever hurting anyone again. I am in my 50s now and I was an OW at 25, so it has been a very long time and I can look back with some wisdom now and try to figure out what the hell I was thinking back then and how I managed to justify doing something so awful to another person. I was living in a fantasy at the time and was eager for “adult” experiences, eager for something interesting and intense to happen to me. It was like trying to live out a scene from a movie or a book (most likely books and movies that made infidelity seem glamorous), and at the time I was actually able to convince myself that this wasn’t really hurting anyone. I certainly wasn’t important or powerful enough to have an impact on anything, right? I was having an experience in a bubble, apart from real life and real people and since I wasn’t trying for a real relationship with this guy, I was actually able to convince myself that it was apart from his marriage and therefore had no power to hurt it. All craziness and immaturity and very weird magical thinking. Looking back, what’s frightening is how easy it was to rationalize what I was doing. It’s very, very easy. I understand now the great wisdom and importance of Bible verses that warn us to guard our minds and guard our thinking. The way one thinks can go down the rabbit hole very quickly, and soon the most awful actions can seem normal and reasonable. (Just read The Lottery by Shirley Jackson.)

        I was able to wake up and leave behind this destructive behavior when his actions started to get creepier and creepier. He wanted to take nude pictures of me and wanted me to write him dirty letters and other disgusting crap. I remember one day I started shaking and felt this horrible, sick feeling come over me. I felt like I was in the presence of something evil and that this evil was in me and it WAS me, and the horrible sick feeling was a gift from God to get me to wake up and SEE what I was doing. I thought of my wonderful, decent parents and realized what a dishonorable thing I was doing to them and to the way they had raised me. After that I vowed I would NEVER do such a thing again, and I never have. I can’t imagine being smug about this – I don’t want anyone to know about it, ever. It’s a secret I will take to my grave and it is something that can never be undone. I feel great remorse and regret and have always wondered about what happened to his wife. They got divorced about 10 years after our affair and I know she remarried. She’s now in her 70s. I think of her from time to time, I pray for her and hope she’s happy. I share this because there are some of us who are truly horrified by our actions, and wish nothing more than that we could undo what’s been done. I am on other blogs and I spend a lot of time dishing out stern warnings to feckless young women who think it’s cool to get involved with married men. If I can stop just one of them from going down this evil path, then something good will have come out of the blot I have on my own soul.

        • Annie,

          The blot is gone. It left when you got out of that relationship and felt great sorrow for being in it and the harm that it caused others.

          Keep on warning ignorant young women.

    • It’s nice that you are sorry and trying to change. But you’ll never know what it feels like to go days without sleeping or eating because the one person you trusted has utterly betrayed you–whether with a stranger or someone you know. You won’t know the pain of the children involved that will go on for a lifetime. Or the financial losses a wife or husband of 10, 25, 35 years endures that makes retirement a struggle or impossible. You can move on and perhaps have all that wonderful aspects of a faithful marriage. Even if the chump in your case decides to stay, she will never look at her husband the same way and will always wonder why he devalued her in conversation and sex with you.

      So read on. The pain here for chumps not theoretical, nor does it end once DDay has faded for those who had long-standing marriages and children. Even “meh” doesn’t erase the memories and the loss.

      And I wouldn’t say you “dehumanized” the woman whose life you blew up. She is still very, very human. You devalued her in your own mind and in your relationship with someone who was supposed to be her friend, her lifetime partner, her champion. She was and is a person of value, but you treated her as if she wasn’t. That is always, always on the AP and the Cheater–that you treat actual people as if they were cardboard cutouts or items on the sale table that are no longer in style.

      • Sarah, it is nice to see an OW be sorry. The OW in my case was downright giddy at the prospect of blowing up my life and world. The pain that those two people caused me cannot be measured. Six weeks after I caught them in a motel room I ended up in the ER with Takotsubo cardiomyopathy. It’s what known in laymen’s term’s as a Broken Heart. I had a heart attack but my heart was perfectly normal.

        This shit can literally kill people. I mean it when I say that I will never forgive these people in a million years for what they did to me. They tried to kill me and they damn near succeeded. My XH has given me thousands of dollars over the years trying to make up for it. I’d rather have my intact family. NOTHING has been the same since they blew my life up. Happiness is fleeting at best.
        I put a curse on those fuckers. I know he drinks. A LOT. I also know he’s an asshole when he drinks too. She deserves all of his assholism. I can’t believe people get away this stuff. There just has to be hell to pay somewhere.

      • LovedAJackass, THIS!! So well stated! She can NEVER U ring that bell and I don’t care how much she apologizes. Nice try though!

    • Sara L,

      Thank you for your comments. I have one question, out of curiosity, what was the grace (awakening) you received that made you realize the pain you caused others by your affair with a married man.

      • This is not in any way noble, but it was D-Day. I think to be an OW (or, presumably, OM), you have to mentally make the BS less real in your mind. The MM in my case had told me all sorts of things about the BS, which I realize now are complete lies (though even if they hadn’t been (they were) it wouldn’t have made what we were doing okay). I chose to believe them and him, and chose to believe that somehow, while all of what I/we were doing was wrong/would be painful/etc, it wasn’t *that* bad because she didn’t really love him/they weren’t happy/etc etc (all bullshit). On D-day, I heard from the BS and it was impossible to pretend I wasn’t really hurting anyone. It is why I used the word “dehumanized” in my first post. In order to have an affair, I made her less human in mind and treated her as less than a full person. On d-day, I couldn’t do that anymore. When she called me on D-day, I saw how very real and not small she was. She was a whole person and I had denied her humanity. I had justified all of it for all of the shitty reasons CL talks about. It wasn’t some magical fog. It was a choice. I chose to stick my head in the sand before D-day and not see her as a whole person because it would have meant I couldn’t keep doing what I was doing. I wanted to keep doing what I was doing.

        It was profoundly selfish and arrogant. I was profoundly selfish and arrogant. And LovedAJackass is right — I can’t and don’t know her pain. I’m not trying to pretend I do. There is no going back or making up for it.

        • Sarah….at least you were human enough to see her pain. God love you for that. Most OW don’t care. The one that was with my husband most certainly didn’t. I was a devastated nobody in her book and so were four little grandkids.

        • Thank you for your reply, Sara L.

          I appreciate it.

          LAJ is right about the immeasurable pain inflicted on the wounded party.

          If I was a priest, which I am not and that is another story, I would say, go forth and sin no more, but it sounds like you are already doing that.

        • It Is perhaps to your credit that you don’t know the pain, had you ended up with that married man, you may have experienced it. Apparently you stopped after DDay, not what most APs do.

  • In my world, your actions define you and your character. If you decide to have an affair with someone who is married, then that defines your character – you are the sort of person I don’t want to know. Whatever names there are for this sort of person doesn’t matter too much, they’re pretty low.

    Ms Deluded who is part of the “international couple” is obviously uncomfortable about what she’s done or I’m sure she wouldn’t spend so much time and effort defending it and shouting to the rooftops that it was all so “special” that it was meant to be.

    • “Meant to be”.. WTF does that even mean? Narcissistic, selfish people with no regard for others. That’s the bottom line.

      • Meant to be….. OW/NPD code for “I’ll do whatever the hell I want and then make everyone believe I’m fabulous”.
        It’s a pity she’s so incredibly thick-skinned, she’ll never believe that everything thinks she’s a slag.

  • Just got a letter from the OW. Husband and I are still together, and he is still denying anything except for their “friendship”.

    Dear XXX (me),

    When you asked me to keep away from your husband for the next year to see if God would or could do anything to bring healing to your marriage, well, I could not. Why? Because you told me that I was not the first “interest” he had, and “probably would not be the last”. You said that if his interest were not in me, then it would have been in someone else. Well, I suppose I still want to be that “someone else”. Your husband reminds me of my father who passed away just a year ago. I know that I am vulnerable, and I know that your husband simply sees me as someone exciting and likely in a sexual way. So I have no delusions of grandeur for a lasting future with him. I am twenty five years his junior and cannot imagine caring for him in his old age. I have no husband (divorced) and want a secure life someday with someone my own age.

    You said that he seems to be “never satisfied”, and that he had been unfaithful in his previous marriage too. So I suppose that this means that I should expect to experience the same kind of waxing and waning from him also in due time. But I am willing to enjoy the relationship in spite of the risks and for however long it lasts. I have resisted seeing him for these last three months at your request, but met up with him recently for a brief visit at a pizza take out. I surprised him after he closed his store, and he was more than willing to meet with me. This indicates that he has not put me out of his mind and that it was really YOU that wanted me to go away. If you had not figured us out, we would still be in our friendship.

    Your husband speaks VERY highly of you, which indicates that he does not intend to divorce you, but simply wants a larger variety of relationships. If this is something that you can live with, then I would advise it because he is otherwise a very kind and generous man from what I can tell. I would hate to see him get tossed and lose so much of what he has at his age. He seems to love the Lord and believes that he will be disciplined appropriately if and when that time arrives. He is a gambler I take it?

    He told me that all your children are grown and gone, you have a nice home, you each have your own businesses and apparently get along great as long as you do not mention the subject of other women. He is just bored with the same o’ same o’. I would advise not rocking the boat because like you said, if it were not me he is pursuing, it could be someone far more ruthless and possessive. I also advise that you do not make his life miserable. This will only result in making me appear suddenly more desirable to him other than as “just a friendship”. He really does not fit my idea of someone permanent . Keep what you have, look the other way, and let God be the Judge.

    You might be tempted to think of me as a bit sleazy, and the way I am handling the loss of my father by taking comfort in your husband, I suppose this gives the appearance of that. I do not care. You can have him back after I feel whole again. If you no longer want him, just remember that it was HE that pursued me and offered himself for no other reason than his desire for excitement and variety. He knows that I am bereaved and attracted to his resemblance of my father and is willing to take full advantage of that. So your issue will not be resolved anyway long after I am gone.

    This speaks of nothing about your qualities as a person, but I imagine that your husband could not have picked anyone better to have married. I was shocked when I finally met you, you are truly beautiful and kind. I instantly could tell that you “knew” that he and I had already developed a relationship. Yet, you were gracious to me nevertheless. Hold on to your virtues and do not let this destroy the person that he truly admires and what you have.

    Aimee

    So, that is it…any takes? I do not want to answer this.

    • Wow. What remarkable bullshit. What boundless entitlement. What a worthless human being you are.

      Aimee. With two ee’s. And no soul.

      Though it might cause crucial mechanisms to overheat and explode and possibly cover an entire continent with a toxic stew of narcissism and self-delusion, I vote for Chumplady to run this heap of verbal cow-flop through the Universal Bullshit Translator for tomorrow’s column.

      Just, wow.

      • OMG…”cow-flop”. She dresses in cowgirl apparel. She is around 40, my husband is 62. I have been getting my ducks in order for the last three months and am looking forward to the end of this year which will mark ten years (social security benefits secured as well as spousal support). I have already saved about $12K so far in just three months (cash). So I just plod along and do not say a thing. I do not intend to give this an answer, but will save it to give it to my husband when I exit.

        This is what we are dealing with people. Those who believe that God will not send His Karma Bus and continue to do as they please.

      • Who among us doesn’t mourn the death of a loved one by finding their doppelganger and fucking them senseless?

        Hey, at least it was the death of her father. Instead of, say, the death of Howlexander the Great, her beloved Labradoodle.

      • Disturbed? Well, stranger things have happened. My husband’s father sexually molested his sister for years. So FOO issues seem to have a far reach as well as leaving lasting impressions. I wonder what Aimee and her father’s relationship was like. There is a lot of molestations in families.

        Here is the sick twist in this whole thing. Aimee is also screwing my husband’s SON. He is just 24 years old and very handsome and shy and lost his virginity to her. Seems that when my husband nurtured a relationship with her, that his son was included into the “mix” since he works in the store with his dad during the week. But my husband was having her “for lunch” in the back room when his son was off work on Saturdays. And my husband did not have a clue that Aimee was already “involved” with his son until he drove past his house and saw Aimee’s car in the driveway. What a surprise! I feel so sorry for his son. He got sucked into this by the actions of his own father, but does not seem to be able to extricate himself from her and refuses to talk about it.

        When I told my stepson that Aimee was not allowed into the store anymore (and why) his eyes got as big as saucers. Little did we know that he was involved already. What kind of a woman does this?

        Buy one get one free.

        • Wow, I guess a really sick person. This is incest. A whole different blog. I am so sorry for both of them, but I don’t think its the same as narcissism or infidelity. Maybe he might want to take a look at the “girl with the dragon tattoo”.

    • Sweetz: I’m not sure where you are at psychologically in your marriage, but my response to her would be “Keep him.” My overall response would be filing for divorce.

      • I might be tempted to add a P.S. to slut’s letter: “Good luck with that “getting whole” thing (wink)”

      • I already told her that she could have him after this year is over if things did not change dramatically. The way I figure it is that if a woman can get my husband, then she can have him. I’d do it NOW but am not stupid. Getting my ducks in a row means taking into consideration the benefits that I need and the time it takes to get them secured. I have already given up on the marriage, but did not want to have to deal with her while I was bidding time. So I confronted her and asked her to back off for a year. Nine months to go. I am not going to say a thing to my husband. If she tells him about the letter, he will have to come to me regarding it. I will deny it (as he does everything) and have fun with that.

        • Fact is, she didn’t back off.
          Take a look at the amount of “I” in that tripe that skank has written. It shows you EXACTLY what you’re dealing with.
          Doesn’t dignify a response.

    • OMG. I am 48 and I’m not sure if I should be happy or terrified that people can still shock the shit out of me. This is an honest to God letter?

      Please put this through the bull shit translator Chump Lady! It may break it but it would be so worth it!!

      My thoughts are that this is one of the most selfish people on the planet and she is so full of herself I can’t even imagine how her head doesn’t have it’s own zip code since it’s so huge!! I think you should give it to your husband right after you show it to your lawyer and file for divorce!

      • Yep, I am surprised she did not come to my store and deliver it personally. Or offer to take me out to lunch and give me the HOdown personally. But I am the ONLY jewelery store in town and she knew exactly where to mail it. Ours is a no fault state, so lawyer wont care either way. I am thinking of keeping it myself in the event that I might be tempted to cry sometime in the future.

        I think she thinks that I believe it is simply a nice friendship that I denied them. But my husband has a history and I know better. My husband often spoke about her to create a smoke screen of innocence. But when I found out that he had been having her in the back room of his store “for lunch”, that was all I needed to know because we had already drew the boundaries years ago about doing that. I had already preached to him regarding the dangers of “getting personal” with female customers, flirting, and such. But apparently, he is still doing it for thrills. AND yes, he is a gambler haha! Lost $40K with the click of a mouse and hid that from me too.

        • If he’s gambling away your assets, you need to talk to a lawyer now. Don’t wait to line up your ducks. Your ducks might be hocked. Get out while there are still ducks.

          • No worry, that was four years ago. Since then, we have no bills (verified by running credit checks) no credit cards (result of bankruptcy several years ago), my own business account which he cannot access, cash savings hidden that no one knows about ect. AND I know the divorce laws in my State. All important documents and certificates are in my safe at my store. Right now, I am gathering all copies of his business transactions, tax filings and bank statements since I go to work at his store once a week and am “cleaning/organizing” it for him. 🙂

            He did learn a rather painful lesson regarding that $40K blunder and has not done that since. Now he plays online poker but only using virtual chips and no real money.

      • Can’t help but wonder what her motives are. Why send me such a thing, why not just continue behind my back just as they did before I was on to them? I simply do not get that! She is a “tomboy”. Maybe seeing me made her feel rather competitive? I just do not know. Maybe she thinks she is terrifying me? I already knew that he met up with her at the pizza place. He told me himself, saying she waited till after he locked his store and asked him where he was headed. He had ordered a pizza and told her where, so she met him in the parking lot saying she had to “discuss some business”. Well, he could have just told her that he did not have anything to say to her and got into his truck and left. That would have been the right thing for him to do if he really valued our marriage. Yes?

        At any rate, I will be happy to offload him to her at the end of the year. I do not need validation from a man who lives his life for thrills and at the expense of those closest to him.

    • that is one seriously twisted person. she is fucking your husband because he reminds her of her dad? my dad is awesome. he is a wonderful man and has been a blessing to me. it would devesate me to lose him but i damn sure would not find someone who looks and act like my dad then fuck his brains out. very sick.

      so what is her excuse for fucking the son?

      you are better off not saying anything. in fact, you better be careful about this kind of crazy. she already said she didnt want him, to grow old with. she most definately is just trying to ruffle your feathers. but why? i would give your husband a copy since she says such nice things about him. but say nothing to her.

      so glad u are getting out.
      be strong
      be careful

      • She is truly twisted. I say nothing and ask no questions either to my stepson or to my husband. When we realized that my husband’s relationship with her spilled over to my stepson, I only thing I did say was that it is easy to get into a relationship, but once the physical has happened, often a woman thinks she “owns” you and there will be hell to pay to try and get out of it. Don’t know how that went over with him though since I have not brought the subject up again. Aimee does not know that we know about what she is doing with my stepson…she thinks that we think they are just “friends”. Why she would want them both is beyond me. Maybe she wants to just push me out of their lives entirely and step into it where I was/am. What better way than to make sure she is indispensable/wanted by both?

        I am worried about my stepson. If she goes violent on him if he tries to end it with her. He is a sweetheart, gentle, mild and gullible. He has NO IDEA about the wickedness of these types of women and how manipulative they are.

        I will not say anything about the letter to my husband. Let him unravel HER skein himself…or if things escalate badly regarding his son and Aimee, then he can intervene if he wants to on some level. Maybe have his son move into our cottage since Aimee does not know where we live. I am just worried that this threesome will destroy my stepson’s relationship with his father. He adores his father and has been sheltered regarding his father’s bad behavior.

  • “Though it might cause crucial mechanisms to overheat and explode and possibly cover an entire continent with a toxic stew of narcissism and self-delusion, I vote for Chumplady to run this heap of verbal cow-flop through the Universal Bullshit Translator for tomorrow’s column.”

    Seriously Nomar…you are so dang funny and so right on. This shit just might cover an entire continent.

  • Perhaps someone has already said it.

    I don’t know why they would be upset about being called a slut. After all, it’s a step up from their actual status. But if they don’t want the promotion, don’t force it on them 😉

    And no, I don’t condone calling anyone a slut.

  • I’m with you Chumplady Bravo!
    If you knowingly betray the ‘sisterhood’ or ‘brotherhood’ etc…you are just as bad as the cheater!

    Rise above your lust & greed & have some integrity. If it’s married, it’s off limits!
    Do the decent thing & wait until the divorce is finalized & the settlement has settled.

    If you indeed love the cheat, then prove it & wait your turn! Don’t queue jump & stab another in the heart!
    You many not have any emotional attachment to the chump ( shame on you if you do!) but, remember it could be you & probably already is. Cheats never stop & cheat in many ways so, just remember that!

    Goodluck Cheats & the Knowing OW’s, you deserve each other & we are free of control, manipulation, lies, shared appendages etc….Eewww & hopefully STI’s!!!!

  • I can’t wait for the day when I no longer think of my ex and hear the words in my head.
    He was a huge N. In fact I’m sure still is.
    He left me after 25 years of marriage. He wanted to fall in love with someone else.
    He had been seeing his soulmate. His ex g.f. From 20 years ago. He hooked up with her. When he took 50.
    And fell in love. Blah blah blah.
    They were leaving their families to be together.
    Well he left his but she didn’t leave hers.
    Then he wanted me back. Why don’t these idiots think???
    They think the grass is greener ??

    • Hi Rachel,

      The grass is not greener, just a different variety like ‘buffalo’ 😉

      Your N sounds like he got a ‘pie in the face’ & that was his just deserts!

      I hope you realize you are so much better off without him & that you deserve so much more.
      Can’t have a soulmate without a soul so, he got his comeuppance!

      Love & Light to you Rachel x

    • Because hormones. At 45-50, some men fall back into a state similar to teenage years, all emotional, they want to fall in love again. Old age is lurking. They want to feel the sparkle that comes with a blooming spring sunny day. Sometimes hooking up with a much younger person is the key, others reconnect with people of college years and fond memories of their youth. But it doesn’t work very well. What they have in common is soon exhausted, they get tired of milking the same old stories, and finally realize they are old schmucks.

      • Same for women. Mine turned 50 and finalized her plans by trolling for old high school boyfriends. She found one who was getting divorced. She started an affair and left to move within a mile of him. I hope what you all say is true. I know I shouldn’t, but I want her to suffer like I did.

  • People who are in a non married relationship should be also be off limits. My XBF carried on with two women, both of whom knew he lived in my home, drove my vehicle when he was with them, etc. Upon discovery, I diplomatically contacted them and they said they were disgusted with him, apologized profusely, swore their allegiance to me and ‘they’d have nothing further to do with him’. Guess what? They LIED. They not only continued to accept his attention, they encouraged it by repeatedly asking him spread his sparkle on/in them.

    • When I contacted OW of my X (my fiance’ of 8 years and father of my 7 year old) and her husband, I told the husband what a train wreck he is, of course he told OW and she told X (boo hoo). Her reaction “as I told you before… she’s NOT going to run me off.”

      Maybe not…. but she will wish I had 🙂 just sayin!!

  • Cheating spouses and OW/OM will never gain forgiveness from the people whose lives they’ve knowingly ripped apart. It kind of goes with the territory.

    We don’t care how you feel about yourselves, us or anyone else.

    • Oh but, that’s where your wrong Ken_doll, we do forgive you!
      I forgave my ex for his lack of integrity, lack of respect & basically lack luster person he truly is.
      If you have to lie, cheat, control & manipulate to get something & deceive others then, you are not real!
      I guess without a conscience or empathy etc…,you can hurt others irrespective which makes you just like a robot. Your just an object that objectifies & usually objects the loudest when ‘outed!’

  • Mine gave the number of 22 years of unhappiness during a rage. I thought later, thats a strange number to pull from a hat. Well, he had put thought into his misery and that was the length of time we had been together. I said he needed to leave if he was unhappy because no one in the house was happy. He asked, “even the kids?” NO they are not happy you have had zero to do with them! Honestly wouldnt you know if your child was happy? He acted as if that conversation never happened and then mentioned it much later when he was angry again.
    I had the same feelings. What is real? What was real? I cared and could not believe that all those years were a big lie. That is hard to take and I guess a waste of time to try to figure out. I know i was cheated on sexually but feel it more because even a slight good memory seems tainted and fake. Looking back i realize there are basically no fond memories so i have to reconcile that not much was lost. As some have stated-not a lot of difference after I left except peace.

    • He probably was unhappy. Because happiness comes from within and instead of working on himself, paying some therapist to understand his permanent insatisfaction, and learning to be thankful for all the wonderful things he had, he chose to blame his spouse, and leave to seek whatever he thinks will bring him the state of bliss he craves. It won’t take long for him to fall into the same unhapiness after any new situation becomes a routine.
      Blaming the spouse is a classic. He leaves the faithful spouse… and then, surprise ! The spouse-related unhappiness follows him wherever he goes !

      • What about the ex who at some point moved on to another woman after OW & now plans on marrying her? Is he still unhappy or have the 5 years since BD made him happy so to speak? Has a great job, great car, new home & new woman. My friends say she is probably a piece of work herself.

    • Mine said, in response to me saying he never even gave us a chance to save our relationship (because he cheated), “I gave you 16 years of chances, Muse!” The entire time of our being together.

      So apparently, unbeknownst to me, the entire relationship was just a trial run and I was on probation or something, and I failed so he “had to” cheat secretly deviously, lying and fucking other women behind my back, as it turns out, during the entire 16 years we were together as I later uncovered. All the while as I was supporting his lazy underemployed ass. TWISTED pretzel cheater logic, word salad, justification B.S. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

      • When I was begging my ex to stay or to give me another chance, her response was: “I gave you five years to get it right and you couldn’t. Why should I give you more time?”

        There’s so much to say about that and I’m trying to resist. Someone here said “not my circus, not my monkeys” and I’m trying to divert my thinking, but it’s damn near impossible. I’m like a frigging dog; almost 8 months later I’m hoping she’ll come back, pat me on the head, and tell me I’m a good boy. I feel lost and empty, I think because for the first time in my life I don’t have my mother or a significant other vocally judging me on my life performance. My therapist swears there’s a light at the end of the tunnel, but most days I’m hoping it’s a train coming to run me over. I’m trying to find hope in the stories of other people who have made it.

        • Whichwaydidshego –

          I am 4 years post DDay and I did the pick me dance for approx. 4 months. That was the most humiliating and tortorious time for me. It was so hard, I feel very, very sad when people do the dance of hope.

          4 years later, I am in such a good place. I was married to my cheating ex, for 30 years and it all just simply takes time. I know it’s hard and your whole world has changed, but it will get better – I promise you. They average 1 year for every 5 together that you’ll have to heal. I’ve still got 2 more to go based on my math, but I’m really doing fantastic. You are EARLY in this process and you don’t say how long you were together, but regardless, it’s still early. Just keep on doing what you’re doing and make yourself a promise to go no contact, and if she tries to get back with you – slap yourself in the head and walk away – because inevitably it will end the same way, just with more wasted years in between. You don’t want to be with someone who doesn’t want to be with you. Don’t let your relationship define who you are – you were an individual important before her an you are an important individual now. Don’t let that cheat get the best of you.

        • WWDSG,
          yeah, I give that train a lot of thought too. I’m almost 2 months divorced and 9 months abandoned. I know now that I’ll never give up, but it does hurt ago much. I’m starting over because I can’t stand the people who think nothing of her running off to her affair partner. It’s like 30 yrs never happened and no one cares. Some day I will step out of the way of that on coming train. Good luck. Don’t give up (I almost did once).

        • Hi WhichWayDidSheGo,

          You can never please the displeased person so, don’t try.
          Your therapist is right but, the light is not at the end of the tunnel, it is in the tunnel with you & guiding you through each day.
          I know it’s hard but, believe me it does get better 🙂
          It’s an individual process & time is the best healer.

          I was left for an OW after 19 yrs & she was a friend & employee in our business. I told her she was welcome to him & karma has visited them often.
          Next I ran headlong into a massive malignant narc straight after & 10 yrs later here I am so, 29 yrs total!

          Guess what though, I am 2 yrs clear of it all & living & loving life.
          I had lessons to learn about people, my own strengths & weaknesses & finally arrived at myself 🙂

          Learn to appreciate yourself, your worth & know you deserve better. You don’t need anyone’s judgement, only your own. Define your healthy boundaries, exercise, surround yourself with good friends, do the things you enjoy & mainly just be yourself. You are doing just fine & everyday you get up, you succeed where many have failed. You get up & keep getting up & keep going. 🙂 x

  • Do the OW’s ever stop to think that if they weren’t supplying sex then the cheat wouldn’t be with them?
    OW’s are just supply for ego to the cheat.
    Take away the supply & the OW’s are just more of the same food in the food chain!

    Having spoken to numerous OW’s, they all betrayed knowingly & did not care one iota.
    It was all about sex, money, power & control.
    They played the pick me dance, all of them & all lost in the end.

    The cheat is a massive N & every-woman (regardless of age or race) is just somewhere for him to masturbate. He use’s OW’s instead of his hand, that’s all. (sorry for the demeaning language but, it is what it is.) Take sex, money etc…out of the equation & it’s bye bye cheat.

    OW’s need to own their selfish behavior & perhaps tie their legs together!

    Chumps need to know their worth & rise above the cheat & the OW’s of the world.

    Chumps are not losers, they are winners & they are free from cheatsville & la la land where OW’s dwell!

    • In my opinion, if OW are often mere sex providers for these guys, chumps are also often family providers, in a sense that the chump is used, to provide a home, have children, have the nice façade that society tells us is what we should have. With this point of view, I am not sure what position is better. At least, sex provider is less work ! No cooking, no house maintenance, no bills, no parenting.
      A long time ago, I married a guy who definitely considered me as part of a plan. He behaved like he had a list of things to acquire along his life, and he had just ticked “pretty wife” on the list, and was hoping to tick “kids” during the next couple of years. He even had a user’s manual for sex. The kind of book you buy to children to explain human reproduction, but this one was for grown ups. What a turn off. Eww.

      • ChumpFromF, that’s exactly what they do!
        They acquire & put up facades for a front.
        Have a look for the book Narcissists Exposed-75 Things Narcissists Don’t Want You To Know.
        It will answer a lot of questions for you I think?

  • I feel like just walking up to the OW and just staring in her eyes. Then walk away.
    Need some closure!!

    • I did walk up to her and she was vile. X always left evidence. It is torturing yourself. It just left me knowing not one if them had one morals. It keeps you stuck in their fantasy. Closure is believing the x is disordered. Believe everything he does was his fault. That is what helped me the most.

    • All you would see is vacant eyes. There is nothing in their head to look back at you. You are better off staring at goats.

  • Tracy, you’re an outstanding human, ILU! Thank you a thousand times for getting me to the level of understanding and strength that I’m at today. I truly feel that I’d still be locked within the cycles of “best friend/worst enemy” trap that my x had me entangled in for the past decade, if it weren’t for your wisdom, generosity and sharing here – as well as the amazing people in the forums here. I don’t say this lightly at all – this site has very literally saved my life. TYTYTYTYTYTYTYTYTYTY all !!!

  • Actually, I think the term “slut” refers to someone who is “dirty/grubby”. That’s what makes the OW a “slut”, her behaviour is grubby. Fancy going after someones husband and buying into the bullshit they spin. Well I guess that would make her a dumb slut! As for being promiscuous…..That would be your choice, as long as you are descriminating (no married men for instance) and you wash and keep yourself nice, then power to you, who cares. Two different things I think!

    Right, going back to the top to read the comments now….

  • I have had short flings with married men – probably 5 or 6 times in my life (I’m an old bird of 50) and I have also cheated on partners when I was younger. I knew it was wrong but thought that was just a technicality. Until I was older and settled and got cheated on myself (ie flattened by a speeding karma bus) I had no concept of the devastation it caused. I would never cheat again and I would never go near another married man. The reality of smashing someone’s soul to pieces didn’t gain focus until it had happened to me. I believed every word of the: ‘My wife is a tyrant’ spiel’ they spun me. I was an idiot and I was wrong. I regret what I did and the lack of respect or value I showed those women. I didn’t conceive that my presence would affect the way he treated her – not that she mattered so much anyway as she was such a tyrant. I thought I knew best… I didn’t. Big regret.

  • What about the fact that the OW agrees to be kept a secret. How little self respect she must have. To agree that she is not valuable enough to be out in the open. PATHETIC!

  • My cheater has a problem. Now the divorce is in the financial disclosure stage and I have lawyered up instead of relying on mediation only. He let OW woman move into his small rental last summer after she sold her house and put her stuff in storage as “she got gazumped each time she found a place she liked”.
    He has been made to fill in a legal form that demands details of living arrangements and he has had to admit to co-habiting. He claims that she pays no rent or bills as he wants “independance”. The form asks for details of her income and assets.
    She refused point blank “on principle” to allow him to declare this information…she worked for her money and will not “give it to him”.
    After all those years of waiting and pick-me dancing she now seems to be doubting the value of her prize.
    I know she is in receipt of a good pension, got a generous lump sum, and is still in work. I also know when she sold her house and how much for.
    Apparently she would rather let him go to court…or maybe even leave him…poor sausage.
    If I could just accept that her principle is to important to budge on and let him be assessed as living alone while she lives with him rent free….no need to make a big deal of it.
    I asked if he would overlook me moving a man in, a man with money and in work, support him for months, and agree that his money is a private matter which should not affect my settlement or alimoney.
    He very generously told me he “thought he would”.
    That, of course, is a hypothetical situation and I am a mean hearted old chump.
    I remain legally married to him after 35 years and bore him 3 children and will not forfeit what is rightfully mine.
    She can keep him with half of his wealth and an alimoney bill.

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