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Your Life Version 2.0

newlifeToday’s guest post is by Nord.

When we’re in the throes of D-day and writhing about in pain we are often told that Things Will Get Better and Time Will Heal. And both of these statements are true. But as I come up on four years since discovering my ex was a serial cheater I also know that while time will heal and the searing pain of being horribly betrayed will fade there will always be a part of me that aches, even if it’s just a bit and not very often.

This past weekend one of my kids was with his father and when he returned I once again was treated to My Life v.2, meaning that my ex seems to live the exact same life he lived with me – going to the places I introduced into our lives and engaging in the activities I always dragged him on – but with a new person at his side and my kid tagging along, confused by this strange turn of events.

It’s a bit of a head scratcher for me because when we were together he never wanted to do a lot of these things and since I left him I have made a concerted effort to do different things with my children, ones that are unique to the family we now have. Sure, we do some of the old stuff but in general none of us are all that interested unless those things are specific to me.

So all this wondering as to why The Ex does all the same things with his new family that he did with his old, such as going to certain restaurants in a city brimming with places to eat, or swimming at particular places that he always groaned about before, I realized that he does this because he never has any ideas of his own. When I look back on our 20 years together it occurs to me that everything we did was dreamed up by me and unless (or until) a light bulb goes off in his new sweet young thang’s head and she starts coming up with new things to do.

The twinges of pain and irritation I sometimes feel when I hear the stories are dampened by this thought: Why would I want to live another woman’s life? Why would I want to live in her old neighbourhood or drive the same car or literally sleep on the same beds she slept on over the years while doing all the same things she did for years and years? Sometimes I think it’s because she really did want my life, lock, stock, and barrel, and sometime I think it’s because she’s not the brightest bulb on the Christmas Tree and because she thinks she’s hit the jackpot with The Ex she’ll go along with whatever he wants. And then I realize, after a bit of a chuckle, that it really doesn’t matter.

In any future relationship I know that I want to develop something new with whomever that person will be, create new memories and visit new places. I’m sure I’ll introduce this mysterious and lucky, lucky man to things from my world, both past and present, but only as part of the fabric of the new life we’re creating together.

In immediate aftermath of getting together with Sweet Young Thang The Ex was all about her world and her interests and her activities and it was fun fun fun all the time. This made me feel boring and dull and old, particularly after he told me exactly how much fun she was. I realize now that it was classic Love Bombing, with him mirroring all her interests to lure her in. Now that she’s secured he can settle back into what’s comfortable, which appears to be the life he lived with me.

So while it does bring up twinges of pain when I hear about the fun times they’re having doing the exact same things we used to do as a family I know that he’s dull as dishwater and she’s either dumb or unimaginative. Or both.

And I look at my new life, set aside my worries about money and the future, and am very, very grateful that I’m not sitting around anymore trying to dream up things to entertain him while setting aside the things that interested me. These days I do what I want and I explore and try out all sorts of new activities, entertainment, even food.

So, Chumps, anyone else seeing the Happy New Couple live your life v.2?

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  • During my DDay, I had the intense feeling that the OW wanted to steal my life. The house I put so many hours into. The neighborhood I picked out so carefully. The husband I thought loved me. The precious children who the ex dressed up when he took them on a date with the OW. It made me sick to think about it. It was like the worst kind of thief – a robber who steals your life.

    Now that I’m divorced and out of the house anyhow, the only thing that bothers me is another woman (not the OW any longer) trying to be a mom to my kids. That still gets me. I know that I have no control of this, since my ex can have a gf around when he has the kids. But it still bugs me. My children are precious to me…I birthed them. I take care of them. I’m their mom, and I don’t like it when his gf acts like she can step into the role, for a weekend. Grrrrr..

    • Ugh. That would seriously be the WORST.

      I often say, it’s like having been booted out of your own life–of your CHILDREN’S lives–when you didn’t do anything wrong. It’s so unjust to have to give up your children 50% of the time. SO unfair. Bad enough she “took” your husband (she didn’t, I know, I know–he walked) and now she gets your KIDS, too?


      Only advice I have is to fill that time with something you love for yourself, or something that will make your life with your children better when they ARE with you.

      God, these people are such jerks.

      • Try it from the non stay at home parent side. 50/50 would be dramatically more time than that person usually gets. It goes like this: you work outside the home; stay at home parent cheats= you see your kids on weekends if you are lucky.

        • I know, Arnold. AND you get to pay her. I don’t know how you deal with the injustice of that. I really think I would lose my mind.

          I remember being SO angry that I had to help pay for xH’s love nest apartment before the divorce, so that I could live in our house with the kids. My head nearly popped off with anger over that, and it doesn’t come close to what you had to deal with.

          No fault divorce is a JOKE. A very unfunny joke.

          • Amen to that! If a business partner did to any of us financially what our spouses did, there would be huge legal repercussions. No fault divorce royally screws the chump. If there were more serious consequences I think some of these cheaters would be less inclined to cheat, or at least be a little less brazen about it.

            • How bout having them stoned to death! No offense anyone but I now find that fascinating. I really think cheating should be illegal.. Hehehehe!
              And the penalty – hanging. They have no brains anyway what would the world be losing.

            • HeHid- No shit! I was SO pissed when my attorney told me that “He had every right to get another phone line!” I just about dropped her right there – I was LIVID. I said “NO HE DOESN’T! Lets look at this as a business partnership (as you said). If you found out your ‘partner’ was taking $50.00 a month out of the till to walk down the street to the local whore post to get lap dances…. you are saying he has every right to do that? You are OK with him doing that? NO IT.IS.NOT.OK! Saaaaame fucking thing!

          • The problem isn’t No-Fault divorce. I obtained my divorce on the grounds of adultery (which is still an option even in a no-fault state) but still ended up paying the cheater alimony because he was the so-called stay-at-home parent (although very little parenting went on). The problem is that even with fault clearly determined, it doesn’t affect the division of assets and determination of alimony.

        • But eventually, with setting a good example, your child(ren) will see the difference.

          My ex was a SAHM, and now my daughter spends the majority of her time with me.

          I’d like to think she has awakened in the past two plus years to the superior value of my approach to life.

          Am I perfect? I say no, even though my ex-wife would say yes you think you are perfect. But I don’t cheat, I don’t make promises I can’t keep, and would like to think I’m generally tough but fair.

          At some point, kids decide they want that, even if they don’t.

          She still goes to “Disneyland” every weekend at moms. But often she is just at work, out with friends, etc, and isn’t spending all that much time with her either.

          She knows dad is the one she can count on. Dad didn’t spend all his paycheck shopping at the mall. Dad is the one who taught her to save a little from each paycheck. Dad spent the time teaching her to drive, paying her tuition. Dad is the one who did the 5k’s and triathlon with her, and so on.

          Eventually, they know.

          I knew I couldn’t fight the system. But what I could do was be the best dad I could be.

          The very same contrast effect that makes the affair seem appealing for a short while can be used to your advantage by being the parent the child needs.

          The shiney, artificial best friend the unfaithful parent often uses, is of little use to your child when they find they are in a real difficult situation.

          Be the parent your child needs and you’ll be the parent your child wants to be with.

          • My children are adults and this applies to them also. Providing stability, nurturing, and authentic love and kindness does pay off uniballer. I have had my granddaughter on weekends since she was born and she is like a daughter to me. They know the difference between a trip to Disney and the one they confide in during their growing years. They can be themselves with the ones they trust. Great Post and great dad.

          • So right Uniballer! Thanks for helping me to calm down a bit after reading and commenting on Arnold’s post.

          • I agree. My kids have gravitated to me more and more. BUT, financially, it is difficult to pay full child support and shoulder much beyond that when they stay with me or need something.

          • Fortunately for me, the child support was a cut in what she was spending. It put an upper limit on how much of what I earned she could spend.

            And it ends in less than two years. Once the college years begin, the support equation is solely between my daughter and me.

            The OM or parade of men is further instability at mom’s. In the ~12 years since my ex started her nonsense, there has been a hand full of different men living with her.

            Yet another reason my daughter likes being here. More stability. No creepy men that mom brought home to deal with.

            What sort of man doesn’t have his own home or car? That was one of them who was there for a few years.

            Seriously, ex-wife affaired down from a multi-degreed engineer that could support her being a SAHM to men who can’t rub together enough money to have their own home and car. SMH.

            • Same here, Uniballer. I was working three jobs trying to keep up with her spending. Financial abuse is part and parcel of the cluster B behavior pattern.

              • Yeah, it ought to be re-named the “Cluster F” behavior pattern!
                One thing I gained from this site that I found so shocking was how far down the food chain my spouse went for his cheating. And he thought she was so great, I was the one who couldn’t compare! Upchuck!
                To find out this is basically normal is/was such a relief. I found it to be not only a shock and a supreme insult, but very confusing to deal with. Now that I realize that this is just what Cheaters do, it made me put it to rest in my head. I am so sorry for all Chumps who get this grisly insult.
                Ashley Madison shows you how picky some of them are. Just about anything with a hole or a unit will do for their ego problem.

              • Uniballer, Arnold, TwinsDad, you are good men. Nice to know you still exist and I just want to send all of you my admiration and respect for being, as CL says, the stable and sane parent. You are all amazing and wonderful fathers. You do get a particularly brutal consequence from your cheaters: increased financial burden, less time with kids. My heart aches for dad’s who go through this.

          • thanks for sharing uniballer. I definitely needed this. I am doubting myself that I can be a good parent to my 7 year old child. thinking that his father can provide all the material things he needs, but me, I can only give my love, time, and attention. but now I realize that its actually what a real parent is- the one they with whom they can feel secured and loved.

        • So sorry Arnold. I’m so lucky that I could switch to a telework schedule that allows me to have my kids half the time. She tried to use my career against me (you know, the one paying all of her bills) in the divorce to get majority custody (and more child support money), but I worked it out and she had to accept 50/50. Her AP just moved in recently. I only know this because I see his truck parked out front at all hours when my kids are there and he filed a change of address with the court. She recently went back to her part-time job as a teaching assistant and tried to leave our kids home with her AP on a day I was also home. In our agreement we are each supposed to give the other parent notice if we have to be away from the kids for more than 4 hours. I called her on it and she sent them over to me. I’m sure she wanted to have bonding time for her AP and our (MY) children. Gotta stop writing now before I type so hard I break my keyboard! Sorry for the rant.

          • It is mind boggling how they start bringing the Ap into the kids lives, TwinsDad. My xw had no qualms about exposing her three young, good looking daughters to a guy who had no morals at all.
            I hate the fact that the decision as to who is the “primary caregiver’ seems to rest , alomost entirely, on which parent spent more time at hime with the kids, as if financially supporting them by working is of less importance.
            We still have some archaic notions of what constitutes the best interests of the child in that regard.
            Yet, we have abandoned the older consepts that lying and cheating need to be considered when determing whch parent is more fit.
            I would advise any young person contemplating getting married these days to forget about the stay at home parent paradigm, as you are likley to get screwed financially if the non stay at home cheats. And , if you are the non stay at home, you get screwed in custody when the stay at home one cheats.
            This is gender neutral. Just do not consent to this arrangement in this day and age.

            • I was a stay at home mom until my youngest went to kindergarten and then I took a part time job that worked with my kids’ school schedule. I wouldn’t trade that time I spent at home with my kids for anything. I might get screwed over financially in the divorce but I don’t care. Some things are worth more than money. However, I did get two degrees before I had kids and worked at home a little while I was a stay at home mom. In hindsight- best decision ever. As for the non stay at home parent who is a chump, that injustice is more than I can fathom. I am so so sorry. My heart goes out to you.

    • You’re always going to be your children’s Mom no matter what.

      Fortunately the OW is gone so you don’t have to worry about the woman party to your betrayal being in your kid’s lives.

      I think it is a good thing, though, for your kids to be treated well by the people your ex is dating and people you will date in the future. Having a hateful stepparent is hell for a kid.

      • Lulu I totally agree. What I wouldn’t give for the OW to be gone. I know for a fact that I would be much more open to effectively co-parenting with the ex-husband if the OW was gone. I despise the ex, but he IS my child’s father so I have to respect that relationship no matter what. I owe the OW absolutely nothing and when I do see her, I nothing her. If he was dating anyone else but her, things would be much easier.

        The OW often gets called my child’s mom while out in public with her (totally understandable) and she and the ex husband have told my child to not correct people when that happens. WHO TEACHES A KID TO LIE ABOUT WHO HER MOTHER IS?!?!

        • I am so with you here on this! I would be so much more open to effective co-parenting with the ex if the OW was out of the picture! Anyone else but her. They both knew what they were doing but I have no choice but to deal with him. But as a mom I believe she also sought out my husband with no regard for the hurt or pain it would cause my son and ANYONE who hurts my son so callously and purposely will never be anything but nothing to me. I will never show her one more ounce of respect than she showed me! He is a good dad and my son adores him but he is inherently selfish and manipulative, so unfortunately I feel that will affect my son in years to come. She is 10 years younger than us and while marriage policing I read a conversation between them and the ex sent a picture of my son to her. She didn’t even acknowledge it- like at all- just went right back to their conversation. When I confronted my ex about it (then husband) he said she just loves kids so much and she knows it will be a while before she is around him and that makes her sad! Boo fucking whoooo! Talk about narcissim. I have it in my decree that she can’t be around him until the end of this year and I feel like I am walking towards a ticking time bomb that is ready to explode! The thought makes me want to scream of that little girl trying to play house with my son!

    • I don’t think it is right that they can steal from their children, steal their intact family, steal time with the chump parent, steal from their financial security, steal from them the foundation of trust and love that every child deserves, and then the cheater gets to go on playing the awesome parent. Even worse, mine tells my kids he did it FOR them, because we were fighting. I let them know that we were fighting BECAUSE daddy had a girlfriend, that until daddy had a girlfriend we never fought and were a happy family.

      I know for a fact that the OW wanted my life, she told me so before I knew she was the OW. She was my daycare provider and friend. She told me once that whenever she left my house she would cry because my life seemed so perfect. I made sure that they weren’t able to continue their affair by getting ahead of the “they were just friends” story. I told enough people in enough places that no one believed they were just friends, they all knew the truth. Once they realized they couldn’t walk away looking like the good guys who fell in love after we split, they had to part ways. I hate sharing my kids with the new GF, especially because she somehow thinks that she is more entitled to my two years olds love then I am, but at least she isn’t the backstabbing home wrecker.

      • HeHid–not easy, but at least you didn’t have to swallow the bitter pill of narc-nanny being stepmom. It just compounds the betrayal when the OM/OW was one you enveloped into your home.

        • Exactly. The new GF, what little I know of her, sounds like a crazy lady, but at least she isn’t the OW.

        • I think that would have been the thing that sent me over the edge. Fortunately, my prayers were answered and the affair with OW is over. She’s moved on to some other sap. Whatever happens now happens. It will be hard if he gets a girlfriend and completely suck if he gets married some day, but I can handle it as long as it’s not her. I think that’s why I pick me danced so hard. It wasn’t to win him as much as it was to defeat her. I could not have dealt with her playing house with my kid.

        • Exactly. I was just out of town for work and I got a text from the STBX that he had signed a lease on a new place and the girls were camping out with him there for the next 2 nights along with the OW/Nanny. She had lied and told the kids attorney that she was going back to college and staying in a condo on campus and here 2 weeks later the 22yr old whore is moving into his place and according to the kids 1 bdr is for him, 1 bdr is for her and the two teen girls will be sharing a bedroom over there (even after he has told them they’re a couple which is so frickin weird that I just don’t get why she has her own bedroom). Apparently the 16yr old has become closer to her (hell, she’s only 5 yrs older than her) and my STBX loves how close they’ve become that she wants to stay there 5days/week and apparently only wants to be with me to spend time with her sister (that’s what she told her sister). My 13yr old, wants to spend the majority of the time with me but she’s going to feel like a guest in his place cuz she doesn’t even have her own space there and she’s afraid they’re all going to have inside jokes since they’re together all the time. All week long both her father and AP have been text love bombing her and pressuring her to come over there so she’ll probably go tonight so they’ll stop pressuring her. The requests will stop for 2 days and then it will start up again with pressure to join the “fun” home with her dad, sister and AP nanny. Meanwhile I haven’t put any pressure at all on my older one because I don’t want to add any more stress in her life and all we do is argue but I feel like I’m being a bad mom by not urging her to come over like they’re doing so my younger one. Damn…I feel like just running away sometimes. How can I compete with fun house and a wildly wicked 22yr old who texts them and emoji’s them all day long.
          Sorry for the rant – it’s been a horrible week

          • Kfl, sending you hugs, what a disgusting situation for your kids and you!

            Have you read “We’re still family” by Constance Ahrons? It is a great book about life after divorce from adults recounting how it felt to grow up a kid of divorce.

            From what I remember, the kids reported that their relationship with their mom (quality wise) did not change drastically post-divorce. Furthermore, they reported that as long as the sane parent (mom or dad) picked up their calls and was there for them when they needed her/him, these adults who were kids/teenagers during the divorce formed strong bonds with their sane parent.

            There are also several passages about the impact of infidelity, especially on girls when the dad is a cheater that can help you help your teenagers come to terms with who their dad is.

            I hope your week will end better than it started (((KfL)))

            • Thank you for your insight. I will check out that book. I just found out from my attorney that his attorneys filed “discovery” against me.
              He does all the books and all our money is in joint accounts and he spends like crazy on the girlfriend on hotels, travel, food, gifts and he sends discovery papers on me???? WTF

              • Kfl, so sorry. Such a shitty situation. I have had similar, if not exact, stressors. This stuff drives you crazy. I do really truly believe now that I am a year out, that the kids begin to “get it,” meaning the fun starts to dwindle, regular life kicks in, dad’s attention on his new gf ramps up, and as things normalize, the charm of the household decreases. If I had not been told countless times by Chumps on this site to just stay the sane parent, focus on what you can control (YOU), and be stable that the kids will see the truth. When others emphasized this to me, it was hard to fathom and the emotions I felt were overwhelming and I felt threatened a significant amount of the time. This was increasing my cortisol like crazy and I just slowly needed to remember that “they suck,” and that’s the truth. And the truth will win out for you hopefully. Maybe not immediately, but definitely in time.

                CL has said this many times: focus on what you can control. All that stuff in the household, the AP, her sending of emojis, is completely out of your control. Rather control what you can: your sane loving full-of-integrity parenting. Hugs and sending you lots of hope and karma.

          • Oh Kfl, I am so sorry that it is this way things are now, I can only hope that things change for the better soon. I would be very surprised if a 22 year old is there for the long haul. Mothering will probably get old, and Cheaters will usually move on & dive into the next sparkle pool. What looks good at a distance doesn’t always look good up close.
            It is such a bummer that the younger set seems to place not a lot of value on sex, and a lot of value on money and materialism. My daughter, who is 30 and married says that her friends who are RN’s are having difficulty finding a man their age that even wants a full time relationship or a commitment, much less a marriage and children. They are very nice looking and will most likely be financially secure. They have grown up in a whole different world as we know, one with more instant gratification, and focus on having things. In the last 10 years, I feel instantly old with my value set and views on life.
            Hang in there Kfl! May you have better weeks ahead. This woman is VERY young and probably will tire of all this work.

            • She’s always wanted to be a mom and has wanted my kids for herself. The whole time she lived with us (9/13-2/15) she told the girls they were like her little sisters and how happy she was to have a “mom and dad” like me and my husband. Of course all her flirting with the STBX got to him and he fell for her and just had to take care of her and then fell in love with her (he would text her love notes morning and night he said so she knew that someone loved her) ughhh. She won’t tire of having her former “sisters” as kids. They’re almost 14&17 and she’s 22. She hangs out with them and texts them like she’s their best friend… That’s one thing the STBX loves about her so much is how well she gets along with the kids. She doesn’t argue with them like their mom does!!!

              • “…always wanted to be a mom” ? All her long 22 years here on the planet? The novelty of playing mom will wear off soon. Wait until a real challenge comes along. Wait until the 14 year old turns into a full blown moody teen. Or the 17 year old uses Dad’s cool girlfriend to cross some boundary and gets in trouble, in turn causing problems for XH and AP. The sparkles will fall off of everyone and melt into an ugly river of sludge, and the happy happy good times fun zone will go out of business.

      • OW coveted my life too. Stbx and I had a great marriage (I thought, apparently he is a big faker) and her husband was (according to her) a cheater and a drunk. I didn’t realize how cruel she could be and stbx…I have no words. Who spends so much of their life deceiving someone? But, if they decide to make the leap and be together they will lose out socially and they get the wonderful prizes that are each other. Liars and cheaters.

        I wish there were some way to make it all go away for my kids sake. They don’t need this.

        • I am glad somebody addressed this. I get so sick of people saying, “Well, she is good to your kids.” No she’s not, if she cared about my kids, she would have left their married dad alone. I get so sick of the manipulation of the kids from him and her. They don’t do jack crap for the kids but expect all the benefits of being a parent.

          In my state, joint custody is the norm except in blatant abuse of the kids and the burden is placed on the protective parent. If it sounds like I am bitter, I can be. My kids do not deserve to pay for YOUR sins over and over.

  • Dear CL an Nord,

    Nord, I really appreciate what you have written here. But I also want to be very honest with you. As someone who only married 2 years ago and was left 9 months ago, this post doesn’t bring me any solace–And I’m not at all making the assumption that this is your intention. Right now I am in so much pain. We are not yet divorced and since month 1, the other woman has posted photos of my husband, doing all the things i taught him as well. My therapist says her posting photos like this speaks volumes about their relationships. That she does it and that he allows it. That may be true. But none of this lessens the blow. I wake up daily and feel I am in a complete nightmare. I do not believe he will have to be accountable nor will there ever be a comeuppance of sorts. I think I was used by a selfish man and he will live a life with this other woman for practical reasons that don’t need to be listed here. While I work and pay for immigration lawyers and the beginnings of divorce lawyers he has rented a villa in Ibiza saying he deserves a break. These are times that we look to the universe to give us strength or show us some sort of sign, but we feel helpless because we have no faith. I don’t mean faith in any god, I mean belief that anything good is going to come. I am 34 and i don’t have kids. I know it could be way worse. If I’m honest I want so badly for their to be revenge or some sort of reckoning. I try so hard to focus on my own life but feel this is a defining moment. I feel like I’ve lost everything. My best friend, my lover and my husband. And slagging their life and her, that is a temporary high but ultimately meaningless. Can anyone say if things come out in the wash eventually?

          • One of the very first things I did after D-Day was find her Facebook and block her. The ex had already deleted his months prior to me finding out because he didn’t want the whore to see the stuff I was posting on his wall. Ya know, family things that showed we were very much still a family. It’s human for you to want to police them, we’ve all been there, but you need to take some baby steps. Block them Samaritan. Take the baby step.

        • Yes, block!

          OW likes to flaunt that she has your husband. Fuck ’em both! Block her, and while you’ll still want to sneak a peak, you’ll discover your days go by better without looking.

          The happy adulterous couple love to make a show of how much fun they’re having, now they don’t have to put up with boring monogamy. They love the fact that they’re making you envious of all the fun they’re having. It’s their way of shoving a middle finger up your nose and telling you that You’re Not Worthy. Certainly You’re Not Special. Not like they are.

          If they find you’ve blocked them, it will totally piss them off! How could you dare cut off their power fantasy?!!! Here they were, making you feel like dirt, and all the time you couldn’t see it! That is soooo unfair of you!

          Once they get tired of play-acting for you (since you refuse to be an audience), they’re stuck with each other.

          He’s stuck with a woman who likes to fuck other people’s husbands, and she’s stuck with a man who thinks it’s okay to screw around with other women.

          Yep, they suck!

          • Yup, refuse to participate. Then they are left in a pool WAY too shallow to swim in, much less tread water….but, being simpletons, they will drown. Go get an ice cream or something and contemplate that. : ). Eschew victimhood-it’s a brain suck and you will need that sexy, functioning brain to enjoy the life you deserve. GO.

            • The VERY best thing I did to crawl closer to MEH – Was give up FB stalking the idiots for Lent. Block em, and spending your online time doing something more productive. I guarantee the sting will lessen. And HUGS – I know you don’t want to hear this, but time does make it hurt less. It will always pull, there will always be regrets (WHY did I spend my life with a Knothead!) – but keep moving. And re-read CL often. It helps.

    • *Hugs* to you, samaritan. You deserve so much better than this.

      Your therapist is right – the fact that the OW is parading your ex around social media is a sign of dysfunction. And anyhow, you don’t necessarily know that it’s all peachy with their relationship. Facebook posts show only the good moments, they don’t show the ugliness lurking underneath.

      Have you considered taking a cold-turkey break from social media for awhile? I did this after dday, and it helped tremendously.

      • Thanks Lining up ducks.
        I did take a few months off and then started back afresh. I of course don’t follow her, but a mutual friend of mine and my husband (who knows OW) called me to say she was writing to my husband about his lack of respect and she wanted my permission to do so. This of course made me curious and…wowza were they ever disrespectful. You’re totally right to point out that we never know what’s really happening. I just imagine if I had cheated…I would NEVER allow my new man to post anything.
        I really appreciate the hugs. In perhaps a positive, seeing what I saw has motivated me to divorce.
        My husband, through a lawyer, requested silence between us over the summer. My lawyer went back yesterday and said silence is also behaviour and this hasn’t been respected. Therefore, we move forward with adultery. I have a pang in my heart but there is no coming back from this. xxx

        • “In perhaps a positive, seeing what I saw has motivated me to divorce.”

          I hear you….when I saw my ex and OW;s tripe on social media, I also got the fuel I needed to divorce.

          Trust that they suck.

          • My STBXh isn’t original either. On a side note though, while he has been a serial cheater for 31 years, he also took his AP to places WE had been and had good times. One place in particular has been a trigger for 25 years to me bc I drive past it. This OW was a skank he carried on with for a year. They would meet at this place (not a hotel) but an outdoor beautiful park area. He also had an affair with a bar fly skank he met in Alaska at a bar, he flew there several times to see her. ALASKA was my favorite place in the country and I lived and worked there for a season while working for alaska airlines. HE ruined that pristine place too. Im from Las Vegas so of course he was a kid in a candy store there over the last 31 years. Always “needing” to run an errand. Actually visited all the strip joints there. So he ruined my hometown too.

            Bottom line is the are bottom feeders and are NOT original. They only have getting OFF on their mind so they can’t be original, they go to what they know!! After my divorce is final, Im sure he will go to all the places we vacationed or lived or things I created for our life. He swears he never brought anyone into our home. But he defiled it with pornography for sure. They sure have a way of making you feel dirty.!! Glad he’s gone.

        • You are absolutely right Samaritan! There is “no coming back from this”. Be brave. Let whoever else wants the disordered have the disordered and LIVE YOUR BEST LIFE! They do suck and you really want no part of that. This all gets better with time. Find distractions that you’re interested in and don’t let others drag you back into the quagmire of disorder. (((hugs))) for your journey to meh.

          • ^^^This^^^ – Fantastic reply Renee62!
            Samaritan, I know about the profound curiosity that can provide the motivation to check out social media pertaining to your husband. But this is akin to putting your already broken heart in a blender. As you have said, and Renee62 affirms (as do I), there’s no coming back from this, there’s only moving forward. And, as excruciating as that is now, there is light and healing awaiting you – truly. We at Chump Nation are walking, or have walked, this path. We’re along side you now because We Get It. If you can stay out of the social media for as long as it takes, and ask your friends to stop informing you of his whereabouts and whatabouts, the healing has a better chance to be complete. If you haven’t already done so, please consider getting help from a Therapist who is well-qualified in relational abuse, because his behavior definitely classifies as abusive on so many levels. Gracious Renee62 sends you hugs, as do I.

        • I’m so sorry!

          If it’s any solace, I, too, love to “look.” I can say that I, too, am about 4 years out, like Nord (found out March 2011.) When I was as far out as you are, it was excruciating for me to see OW’s posts of the two of them enjoying life together, while I was alone. I did feel as though I was stolen from, too. And every vacation pic, every pic of their wedding, every time I saw that they were enjoying the same things he and I had enjoyed–it felt like a kick to the throat. And yet, I looked because I wanted to know–I wanted to be able to process what they had done in the privacy of my own home and time. I didn’t want to be blind-sided with the awesomeness of their life in public, where my reaction might have been humiliating. I recovered from each kick in due time, and moved forward. And, truly, I have this morbid curiosity–how is she better than I am? How was she worth leaving our family for? When will karma come by? I’ve learned a few things about their life that makes me feel satisfied that he’s definitely with a downgrade.

          You know, this woman is taunting you on purpose. Do you realize it’s because she’s flying high on novelty mixed with the rush of insecurity? Pictures are just superficial. Seriously. I bet she doesn’t post pictures of him checking out other women, or of the two of them arguing. Any pics of him “forgetting” to take out the garbage, or of coming home late (again?) If you think life for two thoroughly indecent people is all butterflies and rainbows–think again. How was he an asshole to you, leading up to the d-day? He’s an asshole in the same way to her–believe it. Except she knows that he’s a cheater, and he knows that she’s an aggressive whore, and they both know that he’s a coward. Way to go, those two!!

          Over the last 4 years, the distance between the ex and me is filled in with new memories, new good times. I literally think back and realize that HE missed out on SO much awesomeness. I remember that he was such a PRICK during most of our vacations together. And even for the good times–there’s no way she can top what he and I had–honestly, I don’t care if she’s the ideal companion for him, because I now realize I could never be, ever again (he could be a real drag sometimes). I learn and have ah-hah moments! Like that he lives in a shit-hole with a junk yard in the front of the house, an hour away from here. He still has a bad back. He still does what he wants to do, and she goes along with it. (He never ever cared about doing what I wanted to do–it was always about what HE wanted to do, and I went along. And I put aside the things that I wanted to do. His new thing is sailing allllll the time, wheeeee–no thanks.) Beth posted a link to a pod cast that was so enlightening for me–he’s still the same asshole I was married to, just with a different woman. This pushed me forward in the healing process by quite a bit–listen if you haven’t:

          Frankly, knowing that xH had (has?) an Adult Friend Finder and AM account also made me feel better–he’s a gross and skeevy freak.
          These realizations take time. A lot of my healing has come from other people’s stories right here.

          I’m to the point that I still like to look, and all I can think is, “Better her than me.” The Coward was not a good partner. I don’t need someone to drag me down with lies and disregard. She can have my leftovers–apparently she likes them. And he is comfortable with being used financially. And a life with chihuahuas. (Tee-hee! He hates dogs!)

          What were some of the things about your ex that used to make you uncomfortable or that you really disliked? (Oh, in my case, I could go on and on.)

          Why did you allow yourself to be treated poorly? (For me, it was because I was young, didn’t have experience with men before him, was desperate to get married, thought he looked good on paper–ticked off most of my requirements–I didn’t recognize the signs that he just wasn’t into me at all, didn’t realize my worth, didn’t realize there was a life beyond getting married and having kids right away.) What about you? What have you learned about yourself? Sometimes these realizations help you not feel as though you were broad-sided. Understanding what happened–what led up to this crisis–can lesson the trauma.

          What have you done for yourself in these past two years? Have you made time for new relationships (doesn’t have to be romantic–I think maybe you’re not ready for that, anyway.) Have you had any fun? If not, how will you fix that? Where will you go, what will you do?

          You’re SO YOUNG! How are you becoming the woman you want to be?

          Hang in there. Nord is right–it gets easier with time. I don’t ever see myself completely “getting over it,” but I do know that I have a very good life now. And that’s good, because we only get one.

          • THIS! THIS! THIS! Sounds like you feel the same way I do! My Ex ALWAYS had to have a rocking chair in every room cause he wants to sit on his ass and read or watch TV! Imagine how I laughed my ASS off when I saw a picture of him and SCHMOOPIE sitting in his & hers rocking chairs! She’s living my life now….Boring! Hope she likes it!

            • While my ex was still trying to get cake, he told me that he was tired of having our two dogs and a big house outside of town. Needed something different with less responsibility. What does he do three days after our divorce with schmoopie number four? Gets a dog and even bigger house a little further out of town. And she has a 13 year old son. Our kids are grown. Way to simplify life. What an ass.

          • Hello Little Miss Sunshine,

            It only happened 9 months or so ago, but in the 9 months the first 6 I was flailing, losing my mind, begging for him back. The last 3 months there is no contact and I’ve accepted and am trying to heal. You ask me the things I didn’t like about him. It is very difficult to answer this because I was deeply in love. He always kept me waiting and didn’t respect my time. That’s for sure. For 3-4 months he carried on a complete double life…lunches with her everyday, business trips away, staying at hers while i was away…and i had no idea. And so I guess the other thing I don’t like about him is he is a spectacular liar.
            That said he was patient, he always treated me to flowers on weekend and dinners out. I guess the superficial shit he was great at.
            I do hope we both compeletely get over it. x

            • Hi samaritan,

              Recovering from this is so painful. It is truly awful and the pain is so brutal.

              I was married a little longer than you, but, like you, it was shorter than many on here, and I can relate to having trouble finding things you didn’t like about your ex. Yes, my ex was not perfect, but, from my perpective, we diid not have problems and there weren’t warning signs, and I adored him.

              However, with time (I am over 2 yrs post dday), I have realized some things about my relationship and about my ex’s character that I didn’t for a while because I was so in love. Once the love died, eventually, I was able to see things more clearly. And I have recently learned something my ex did before OW and dday (with a different person), so it confirmed that my ex sucked even before he “met his soulmate.” I just didn’t know it. 🙁 I had thought that maybe it was her (and his immaturity and lack of character.)

              But no, he was making crap choices even before OW. After finding that out, I have realized that there are probably other things that had happened over the years while we were dating and married that I will never know about. Maybe they aren’t clear-cut cheating, but would be what I would consider faithful or appropiate behaviors (judging from the pre-OW event I do know about). And I realize that even had that not been OW, some of my ex’s less positive character traits would have probably worsened over time as he got tired of trying and got even more bored with me/marriage/a settled life/adult life responsibilities. I just hadn’t realized how deep entitlement is when it’s present in someone’s core character and how it impacts absolutely everything.

              And your ex being disrespectful of you, being a spectacular liar, and leading a double life with another woman seem like excellent reasons to “trust that he sucks.” You deserve so much better. Hang in there. The pain eventually lessens, and with time it starts to fade away. WIshing you well!


              • Oops, should have typed “would *not* be what I would consider faithful or appropiate behaviors…”

          • I loved your comment so much, I copied it and pasted it into a draft email so I can read it when I need to. Thank you! I needed to hear this today.

          • This! Same arsehole,different women. Bit sorryfor those who weren’t ow.CL has picked open a festering scab. I thought it was all my fault (because he said so). It affected me in so many ways.But CL has made me feel so much better 🙂

          • This: “Seriously. I bet she doesn’t post pictures of him checking out other women, or of the two of them arguing.”

            Oh, how I forget…there’s no way that’s stopped happening. It got to where I never wanted to go anywhere, it was so humiliating the way he checked out other women. And they way they checked him out back. I was “fat and ugly.” I am a model and on TV now. But I refuse to date. Can’t go through it again.

            • ‘Dating’ is a piece of shit anyway. Best way is widen your social network, male OR female, with common interests, and if one of those people becomes more, than more power to you.
              I have personally never ‘dated’ anyone in my life, and I never will. Can’t stand that superficial shit.

          • THIS! THIS! THIS! ” Except she knows that he’s a cheater, and he knows that she’s an aggressive whore, and they both know that he’s a coward. Way to go, those two!!”

        • Hugs to you samaritan. Just a year ago I was where you are. I had lost a ton of weight (and I’m already fairly small), I couldn’t eat, sleep and it took all my energy to put one foot in front of the other. I could not believe my husband of almost 20 years could be SO cruel to me and our kids and really not care. I thought I’d never recover. It’s been a year and I say I have recovered about 80% of the way. I feel so much better and am enjoying life now. He still seems like the same unhappy awful person I saw last year. The OW is out of the picture. He has lost all of his long time friends and his two sons merely tolerate him. Here’s the thing, I know cheaters look human on the outside, but they are not human on the inside. They don’t attach or bond to others properly, the only feelings they have are shallow feelings like pleasure, and they think money and things replace real relationships. I know it doesn’t feel like it now but you are blessed to get him out of your life. You will feel that way some day but it does take a while. Keep going to your counselor as much as possible and reach out to friends and family a lot. You can do this.

        • Samaritan—this and your original post could have been written by me right now. I’m deactivated from fb at the moment, but heard about OW’s pics with stbx from multiple people. You’re right—aside from being tasteless and really effing tacky, completely dysfunctional. It would be on its own but on top of it, OW is married too! So not just sticking it to me but to her poor chump husband, too. A friend of mine had a great perspective—that it’s territorial. It’s like she’s marking territory.

          If that weren’t dysfunctional enough, here’s more: shortly after that, OW’s *mother* shared a bunch of happy pics from meeting my stbx. HER MOTHER. I wish I had wisdom to offer to you but I don’t. Just saying I know exactly how you feel!

          • “….[I]t’s territorial. It’s like she’s marking territory.”

            Yes!! Exactly!

            They’re saying, “Look what IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII wonnnnn!! And see how HAPPY he is?? He will never leave me because I make him soooooooooooo happyyyyyyyyy!”

            So, but, you know what happens when they’re not happy. And you know that nobody makes anyone else happy–that comes from within.

          • These disordered freaks “mark” things because they’re bitches. That whore’s “mother” encourages her to “mark” because she’s a bitch, too. What’s the other thing we know about bitches, of the canine type? They don’t have impuse or urge control where mating is concerned. So, essentially, these bitches are no higher on the intelligence level than the average dog. Bitches. That includes all the cheating male and female bitches out there. Lame-ass whores.

            • BTW – no offence to all of the highly loyal, trustworthy dogs on the planet. Had a sweet, loyal golden retriever for 12 years. She was more trustworthy than the married bitch ho-worker who preyed upon the x-douchebag, who happened to also be “married.” They all suck, and I would trust a lab or golden ANY day more than one of these cheater bitches.

    • samaritan, I can’t say what will happen in the end. I’m only about 3 months from DDay myself. What I can tell you is if you keep reading this blog and open yourself up to the ideas here you will start to see things in a different way. It’s not about something good coming to you. It’s more about not being confined by or defined by the narcissist in our rear view mirror and finding the things that make us happy. What makes you happy? Was it another person? A lot of us have been there and now know we have to happy with ourselves and as ourselves. Embrace yourself and what you want to do, be, and live. Then take the steps to do that.

      • Thanks Alloutofkibble,

        I don’t believe i was codependent on my husband for happiness. I’m an author and tv person and do get a lot of joy from what i do and my incredible friends. I think it’s just like…we had JUST gotten married and the DAY he told me he was in love with another woman after a 3 month affair was the day our application for a mortgage was accepted. Our first house. I was just ALL IN and so excited about the life we had created. I also moved to a city for him and that wasn’t easy and the first sign of compromise, this house that was in our hometown, he bolted. My self worth has taken a massive hit and I’m trying to work on that. It was all so new and i really believed in it. Just have lost my path…

        • He’s completely commitment phobic! And he won’t be committing to HER, believe me. He’s enjoying the superficialities of a non-committed life now. That’s all they have. He’s Peter Pan. And one day he is going to be old and with just anyone. And still very restless. And all alone on the inside, because he hasn’t built a real bond with anyone.

        • Samaritan,
          I wanna give you the statements my counselor gave me that really helped in the beginning

          1. They are a piece of garbage, they didnt transform into something awesome with that other person, they’re gonna treat that other person the same, it just may take a little time

          2. It isnt you, or anything about you, it is ALL about them, your worth has nothing to do with it

          3. Logic over emotions, he “loves” an affair partner after three months of a relationship completely made up of a fantasy scenario? Your soon to be ex and his OW are morons. Real life scenarios will rear their ugly heads (if this even lasts long enough) and he will drop her or she will drop him like a hot potato. Things lose their luster after they are no longer forbidden.

          My Ex husband cheated on me after dating for four years, and being married for six, thats a damn decade. I filed six months after finding out. He did horrible things, moved to an apartment took our bed, and slept with this OW in it. BARF

          “Tried” to cut it off with her which was just a show… but she said things to him like, ” I am going to ruin your fucking life!” What does this show me? Shes a nut job just like him. He got a second cell phone to convince me he hadnt been speaking with her, he’s a disordered freak.

          Trust me when I tell you that your situation is better, he is parting ways with you easier than most. There isnt that much skein, your ex is an asshole and now you have all the information you need. Right now your brain is in the exposure mode…. this is when you re-experience all of the most painful elements because the more exposure the more tolerance we build.

          Try to turn your thinking, I know it’s difficult. Even in this horrible situation there are elements that are good, you had no children, the marriage was short ( less wasted time), and you sound very independent. You can do this, infidelity has a way of stretching you and showing you that you are stronger than you ever thought.

          • Great comments, brittneyk and what our therapist stated is 100% true.

            Samaritan I am going to give you a link and I think well I know it will be very helpful for you to really listen to it. This link helped me understand so much with the ex and his disordered mind. I know you are in the beginning process of this hell but know you did not do anything wrong at all. I know it is easier said than down. Right now you are processing a lot of shit and what he has done is abuse and also the OW. They are nothing special at all. Also you need to grieve the lost of what you thought the ex WAS. He was never ever what you thought he was. This alone takes a lot time and thought to really understand what many of us know now. We fully understand all of the pain and confusion you are dealing with now. You are at the right place for the support and the love and to gain the right knowledge about these PD.

            Let me give you the link now (please don’t be mislead about the title of this radio podcast):


            I also highly recommend you to get Chump Lady’s book and also Sandra Brown book (she is one of the speakers on the above podcast).

            Just remember it takes time to heal from this mess. We are here for you dear. I am sending you much love and hugs. We know what you are dealing with and we are here for you no matter what.

            I would also highly recommend you to go full no contact with the ex and the ow. If that means going no contact with “friends” you both share then so be it. That is what I did and I am still doing. Also I would stay off any social media that you can be linked to them. I know it is hard to do but really this is for your best interest and going no contact is for your healing and well being meaning your mental health which can effect your physical health. I don’t do social media myself because it just looks like too much of a waste of time in my viewpoint. I rather be living my life than posting about it. Also I been around many many years before social media and I have no need for it.

            Also I would highly recommend you to educate yourself about Cluster B Personality Disorders.

          • The problem for me is DDay never ends. It wasn’t until I left that I discovered his ex never did. That came from searching for financial info for my big name dimwit lawyer who couldn’t do a google search.

            His family knew, they encouraged it. She stayed with their kids, kept them over weekends, took them to their favorite places. All behind my back. I have no kids either, too late now (really). He was going to “make me his family”, even shed a tear over that one. Oh wait, that was vodka.

            At first when I thought he was human, I suggested he introduce us (if they were going to remain in contact). He was mortified, never going to talk to the crazy bitch again. I thought maybe he was embarrassed for me to meet her. Joke’s on me. Had I passed the unspoken sparkle test the title would have gone to me.

            He’d pick full scale fights on holidays knowing, eventually, I’d stay home. I found pictures…surprise! Guess who was there in my stead. For years. The photos all with tags about “her family”. They were all biding time until I left. (Isn’t there some adage about the devil and patience?) Our marriage wasn’t an issue for her, she got the family out of the deal. Tremendously sparkly people.

            Their marriage was short and stupid. He couldn’t have trivialized it or her more. But the moment he married me her stock value mysteriously soared, and stayed. Last week I found the latest pic, her and the kids, how thankful she is in the caption. I’m glad I know but it hurts like a motherfucker.

            It embarrasses me that that vacuous twit wins, won, whatever. He is really married to his foo, so the game was completely rigged. She was in training for the gold and I didn’t even know there was a competition. He hated her, “crazy bitch”. If he’d hated me that way we’d still be married. We never really were.

        • Samaritan, normal people look at situations and try to learn from them. A little introspection can help us correct some things we need to work on. I had to learn the hard way that I could not control the actions of others. I did everything a normal person could do to change the outcome. Didn’t help one bit. My STBX screamed at me, “It’s your fault that I cheated on you.” It’s not. We got involved with someone who had a character problem. Some of these people are masters at hiding who they really are. They use our good qualities against us in a way. The “good” part is that we came out of a terrible situation, scars and all. It proved our strength of character, and we can move ahead slowly getting stronger.

          • This weekend I got a text that said “why should I help you figure out where our money is, you haven’t given two shits about the predicament you out me in this summer, you have made allegations against me, you’ve made it very tough with the girls and you’ve spent a fiend on your lawyers”. WHAT??? he starts having an emotional then sexual affair with our babysitter and then brings her into our home to sleep with her across the hall from me and down the hall from our kids and won’t stop even after I find out so I have to get a restraining order keeping him from bringing her into the house. I send our youngest to overnight camp this summer so she can stay away from this toxic environment, my allegations about you sleeping in hotels with your lover and daughter are all true and I’ve had to spend on lawyers to try to unravel your lies and get the restraining order because you feel it’s okay to bring your lover to sleep in our marital home because you pay for the majority of the mortgage?????? Who the hell does and says this and then puts the blame on the chump???

            • Kfl – So sorry you have to go through this. Your ex is a massive piece of work, and sounds like a text book abuser.

              Please read “why does he do that” from Bancroft, especially the chapter about the making of an abusive man. I had my lawyer read it too, and it really helped for our negotiations.

              He will try to pay as little as possible, protect your kids and yourself!

              • Yup! Just got a call from my attorney that his lawyers are doing “discovery” on me!! What??? All the accounts are joint except for the one I just opened last week with $500 and he holds the stock fund that he’s draining for his new place (and won’t let me have access to to get s deposit for my own place) and he’s the one spending money on an AP. the nerve!!!!

              • Kfl–ALL, and I repeat ALL accounts are community property. It doesn’t matter whether it is in his name, your name. All Debts are community property (except for those you can prove are related to the affair). He needs to pony up, release his information. It gets thrown into a spreadsheet (if your attorney doesn’t do this, let me know as I have a template). Then, it gets divided in half, taking into account who keeps the properties, etc.

                Do not let that bully keep his accounts. Furthermore, if he wants to claim a certain amount of, say, his retirement account, was already his before marriage, he needs to PROVE it. Documentation is necessary or it is community property.

              • Kfl – Protect yourself, he is showing his true colors, and I would hate to be right but he might try to distract you while moving money to different places.

                Definitely follow Tempest’s advice, and get DOCUMENTATION for everything you can.

                Your marriage contract is a form of partnership, think about it as a business you built with a partner. You just found out that your business partner has been dishonest, protect yourself, and get everything you can, because he is showing you that he is going to try and get away with as much money as possible.

                Download savings account statements, mutual funds, retirement accounts, and any marital assets that you are both listed on. Call the brokers/banks to obtain them via mail before your cheater closes anything.

                Then ask for discovery on him (ask for a report on all the CC opened under his name and yours), and start downloading or requesting all the statements starting as far back as your gut tells you.

                Get everything you can based on what you know from your previous tax returns or all other financial statements. You might not need them but better be ready than sorry.

                Every time you think “he wouldn’t do this” repeat to yourself “don’t be chumptitude, who thought so too and got screwed.”

                There is no downside of fighting for your rights, the only downside is not to fight for what you earned.


    • Samaritan, I hear you. I know what you mean. Even if they go on posting stuff constantly, eventually it will start to bother you less as you get more wrapped up in your new life. Doesn’t mean it’s okay that they’re doing that, though. Just remember, it’s likely that he will dump OW1 in the same fashion, and be posting self-congratulatory schmoopie garbage with OW2, so eventually OW1 will have an “oh shit” moment when she realizes that she inflicted the same kind of pain on you.

      One thing I did that helped was that I asked my best friend to be in charge of monitoring their social media. She took screenshots and stored them for me, and only mentioned stuff to me when she thought it was important or that I needed to ask my lawyer about it. I didn’t have to look at their stuff on a daily basis and let it derail my day, but it was still being documented for court. Eventually, once the pain I felt had softened to the eye-rolly variety and not the bleeding-internally variety it had been, she transferred these responsibilities back over to me. Now I just screenshot and file, screenshot and file, with sometimes a laugh and an eye roll. I highly recommend letting someone else take this burden off of you, at least for a while. A sibling or a very close, trusted friend should do the trick.

      You’re not alone!

    • Samaritan, I can feel your pain. You should know that your still in the shock and awe stage of such betrayal and grief. Keep going to your counselor, and keep coming here. Block the bastard and his bimbo, and do everything you can to go no contact. Lean on real friends.

      It gets better, I promise. Hugs to you.

    • samaritan, I can so relate to your pain. Some days, like today, I wake up and I just know that it is going to be a battle with my emotions, my mind, a battle to stay focused on my own growth. Your words touched me so much because I could have written your comment almost word for word.

      The realization that I invested so much in someone that ended up abusing my trust is one of the most crushing experiences of my life. I can’t put into words that pain, that sorrow, the weight of all the shit sandwiches that I have eaten and will have to eat because I share a kid with my STBX. My DDay was a year ago, I am in the middle of divorce proceedings that seem to take so freaking long I want to scream every time my lawyer notifies me of more delays due to the myriad of non-actions from my STBX.

      This is why CL is so important to me, why I am so grateful to be part of this community.

      This morning I re-read Luziana’s post (, and reminded myself that extreme self-care is exactly what I need today. So I booked an hour massage, will be sure to walk my 10K steps, and tonight, I will write 3 things I am grateful for in my journal before I go to sleep. It is very unlike me, but this week, I will do what I absolutely need to do at work, not pushing myself, not taking on more. Because I need my energy to heal.

      I am sending you super big hugs samaritan, just know you are not alone, and that I hope you will post one thing you will be doing today to put into action the extreme self-care you so deserve!

      • Chumptitude,

        Wow, thanks. I’m going to re-read that post you sent me too. Why is it that people who cheat are the ones who have such a knack for self preservation? Or maybe that self preservation is a motivation to cheat? Either way I went down the road of self destruct FAST. Beyond trying to understand why that was, I’m also working harder to heal and be easy on myself.
        i REALLY appreciate your words and thoughts.
        The anger and rage I feel is totally alien to me and I’m shit at dealing with it.

        • samaritan – I believe that for chumps, anger and rage are the healthiest possible reaction to a really really sick situation. It is a sign that your boundaries have been severely violated. Journal your anger and use it to propel you towards your cheater-free future.

          The best description of cluster b minds I found was chapter 13 of Lundy Bancroft’s “Why does he do that?” The chapter is titled “the making of an abusive man.”

          Trying to understand things from a cheater’s perspective is very very hard to impossible for anyone who has even a minimal level of self-sacrificing empathy (which by definition most chumps possess loads of). The above chapter completely changed my life and expectations about the consequences of the unfortunate choice I made to marry and have a family with a disordered lying cheating coward.

          There is no point in asking WHY they get away with what they did/do to us. Because they don’t get away with it. They put up a great show, but it is just that, a show.

          They go through life eternally dragging the burden of their own inner emptiness.

          In contrast, we have the choice to turn the burden of our experience with the disordered into wisdom to build a better life for ourselves and our kids.

          Hang in there samaritan, educate yourself as much as you can about cluster b personalities, and keep posting on CN as you build your next chapter!

      • Chumpitude: You are mighty. It is indeed difficult to remember all the personal attacks on our dignity that we suffered through in order to stay married. As the horrific pain starts to abate months after D-day, those memories come back clear as a bell. They have two functions–to remind us that the old situation with X or STBX is untenable, and to clarify the type of relationships (friends or lovers) that we want in the future by contrasting it to the relationships we *don’t* want. The problem is we’re left with disapproval of our old selves: “Why did I put up with that? and for so long?”

        Last week, with help from Donna and so many others here, I realized that I stayed for the right reasons. My reasoning may have been flawed (e.g., I do NOT think staying in a bad marriage for the sake of the kids is a good idea. at all.), but my *intentions* were pure & honest. So were yours, and so were everyone else on this site. Piaget considered the higher form of moral reasoning to be based on a person’s intentions (not the outcomes). In that regard, we all get an A++.

        • Completely off topic, Tempest, but Asshat’s most ‘successful’ girlfriend (and someone who he still chats with occasionally and i like very much – been to each other’s weddings and spent time with her) is one he consulted with years ago about Little Elf. Asshat’s mom is a physician, no expertise in children/development or mental health other than her being cuckoo herself, who kept telling him Little Elf was mute autistic. That same day, his younger sister snapped at her and said she’d heard Little Elf answer a couple of questions in more than one language. Truth was he really disliked grandma and gave her a wide berth. Plus she is hard of hearing so when he did speak, she couldn’t hear him. Anyway, his ex-gf’s mother studied under and worked for Piaget (she is German and then went to Switzerland and France). She spent a good deal of time working on language processing at one time and taught ESL for years. She said Little Elf was fine, as in, was not in need of serious treatment in order to function (some drugged up Montessori preschool teacher said Little Elf had physical issues, which he does not). We all stayed at her house one weekend to pick fruit at their orchard and Little Elf played with strange loud kids and followed the large, kind German lady around and obeyed her English and French commands, though without saying much bc he was shy. Good heavens, what on earth am I telling you this for?

          • ChumpyElf–I see the line of thinking; I triggered the memory by bringing up Piaget, which made you think ESL-teacher & orchard, and also development (including people who said LittleElf had developmental issues, wrongly). Makes perfect sense!

            • I found for awhile there that the only way to get busybody armchair specialists off my back was to blurt out one of Piaget’s team said Little Elf was fine. Haven’t even thought about that it years.

        • Thank you Tempest, today is not a mighty day, but better ones are ahead.

          And your comment on the Piagetian model really hit home of me. Let me know what you think of the following to describe cheater/chump dynamics:

          As you wrote in a previous post, chumps and cheaters share a high excitement seeking trait (

          What is fundamentally different is what happens to cheaters’ and chumps schema when put in an exciting situation that does not fit their current prevalent schema (thus creating cognitive dissonance).

          * Cheaters have an assimilation-driven approach to life (ie new experiences creating the dissonance are reinterpreted to fit into, or assimilate with, their prevalent schemas or world view). Example: I fucked someone else, it is wrong to fuck someone while married. I had to in order to stay with my spouse, s/he has become such a dull/boring/fat/controlling/stressed/x/y/z person. I will keep doing it because I deserve to be happy.

          * Chumps have an accommodation-driven approach to life (ie new experiences creating the dissonance are used to modify their change their prevalent schema or world view into new and more adaptive schema). Example: my spouse fucked someone else, it is wrong to fuck someone while married. S/he had to because I was unavailable/tired/older/dull/boring/fat/controlling/stressed/x/y/z person. I must dance harder.

          “Hyena, meet Prey” you so aptly pointed out.

          The better choice is for chumps to learn how to assimilate more and accommodate less. Another way to say, trust your gut, trust their actions not their word.

          Thank you Tempest for being a light in this tunnel, your posts and comments are always right on. I also hope you will have a great seat and awesome popcorn when the karma bus hits the “cliffhanger.”

          • Chumptitude–Fabulous application of Piaget’s assimilation/accommodation to cheaters & chumps! Three cheers for all of us to reach the schema shift of meh (they suck, we don’t, movin’ on).

            And thanks for the well-wishes! Picked up my favorite popcorn this week (Parmesan & Rosemary) and am waiting for the X’s new romance/house drama to unfold….

            • You guys are MIGHTY clever… I haven’t thought about Piaget in years… My schema has shifted. Meh! Meh! Meh!

            • Don’t you love a good mind stretch?? My favorite part is that a human mind stretched by new thoughts never goes back to its original state, here is to schema shifting to Meh!!

              Right there with you Tempest, today is a better day, I never tried Parmesan & Rosemary popcorn, but I’m buying some today as I watch the circus monkeys from afar.

    • Samaritan, please give yourself a break, it’s only been 9 months since he left. It’s still fairly early on, I know it doesn’t seem like it, but it is.

      Try to look at the positives,
      – You are still so young,
      – You do not have kids with this Fucktard
      – You deserve so much better than him
      – Don’t loose faith, that things will work out for you, they will, just need to hang in there.

      Then you MUST block him and OW on ALL social Media. That is called Pain Shopping. Stop it now!
      No Contact, NO Contact, NO contact.

      Focus on you. I know, I hated when people told me that, when ALL of my thoughts, were about him and OW. But really Focus on you, what do you like to do? Keep busy, get together with girlfriends, invite them to your place, go out. Did I say, Keep Busy?

      Soon enough, it will hurt a little less each week, and then you could care less what happens to him and is OW. The Universe will take care them.

      Hang in there – you will survive this!

      • Betrayed Friend,
        Thank you so much for your comments. You’re right. It hasn’t been that long. Trying to stay busy and have fun and self care. I really really REALLY appreciate your words. xo

    • I can absolutely promise you things come out in the wash! Maybe not right away, but your X did not get a character transplant and he is going to continue to be an jackass. I put it this way-disordered people live disordered lives. Eventually, his conduct will catch up to him. “For every action there is an opposite and equal reaction.” But you know what? There will come a time when you will not care if he gets his due. You will be so busy living your own life that what he is doing won’t even matter to you. The hardest part is the untangling, that stage when you are no longer a couple, but it still feels like you are…the missing limb syndrome. How to get past it? Time, time, time.

    • Samaritan: I can commiserate. I was inches away from ‘meh,’ have zero feelings for my X except for contempt and disgust, and don’t miss him in the slightest. However…..this weekend I found out that the jerk, who was always very fiscally conservative (mm, tightwad?) with me just allowed his new girlfriend to talk him into buying a gorgeous mansion that is straight out of an Architecture magazine. WTF?

      And my suffering is not only because his Karma bus turned out to be an ice cream truck, but because it reminded me that for the past decade my serial-cheater X has been giving his best to other people–his charm, his compliments, his attention, money, to his affair partners at my expense. His ‘happiness’ has always come by putting one foot on my back.

      I’ve given myself until tomorrow to feel sad and resentful of the deficient Karma bus, and then I’m pulling out of it. He does not get to control my moods, my ability to concentrate, or my thoughts any more. Post-it notes are going up around the house today about things he said and did to remind me that he can NEVER be happy, nor will he ever make any other woman happy. Of that I am sure. Despite his superficial charm, the man is too narcissistic, controlling, and cruel. His new house & GF may be sparkly right now, but the degrade is coming. When new GF moves her kids into the house after her divorce, she’ll see Hannibal Lecher’s contempt, impatience, and snide remarks in all their glory. I wouldn’t trade places with her for ANYthing–not that house, not fancy dinners, not even if Hannibal could afford the penthouse suite in the Plaza hotel.

      A truthful life, lived on my terms, surrounded by my dogs & friends with integrity (including all of you in the CN community) is preferable to emotional abuse and betrayal.

      • Thanks again Tempest,

        Your ex sounds like a total nightmare! I think one mega difficulty for me is that my husband was, until his affair obviously, a good guy to me. We called each other our pet names until the moment he told me and then he called me only by my first name and all contact was brutal, mean, degrading. And so much lying. The core of the issue is that I was often tough on him…and in the aftermath even he admits that my distrust and critisicim of him was warranted. He was like a person I could not grasp and this made me irrational and agitated. So i look back at a dozen times where I was critical and feel awful and think maybe he found someone who is all sunshine all the time? For us there was no back and fourth and “cake” and all that. He stayed for 5 days and then left and told me to get use to it and I should lose all hope. The more I told him I loved him, the more i chased, the more venom he spit at me. He said 4 months after he got married, he must have fallen out of love because he made space in his heart for someone new. His says it has nothing to do with me. That i’m an amazing woman but he doesn’t ever want to be with me. We JUST got married…x

        • Samaritan: Yeah, the Xs who morph from helpful, seemingly good people & partners into pit vipers overnight must be really hard to take. The level of surprise makes you think that there is some switch that flipped, and if you can just switch it back…

          But if you were harsh on your X, there were probably subtle reasons for it throughout the marriage. Try to remember specific incidents so that you can realize there was no one switch, he sucked all along (you just didn’t know it consciously).

          Hugs to you!

          • Hugs to you bigtime.
            My therapist keeps reminding me I was in love with an illusion. Someone who was faking it until they could no longer…

            • Sounds like someone incapable of deep love, as bad as you feel right now I am glad this happened quickly so that you can get on with your precious like while you ar in your prime. It will get better. Jedi Hugs

        • Ah, yes, the light switch change. I had this. The pet names too. I do think they are incapable of truly loving and connecting at any sort of deep level. I resisted this though for a long time, because it felt so real to me and I was so “all in.” But finally I had to admit that anyone who could just walk out suddenly and go straight to the OW probably did not have a deep connection to me, since there was no struggle whatsoever. And that is an awful realization and I can’t really fathom how someone could be like that, but I guess they must be to be able to do stuff like this….

      • Are you kidding me, Tempest? That mansion? Like a ball and chain to him. He is WAY over his head, drowning in fear right now. And you know it. I dare say that the house (not a home–he’s not a man who has a family home) will prompt him to act out. He might need to get himself a bit of strange, just to show life that it doesn’t yoke HIM! It’s expensive! What if he runs out of money!

        This is so easy for me to see. The first plumbing bill? When the spring on the garage door opener breaks? He is going to freak out–“I KNEW I never wanted this house!!” He will blame her.

        Or? He bought it for himself, and he’s allowing her to occupy the premises for now. If she so much as rearranges anything in it that belongs to him? He might be forced to get himself some hot new action. How DARE she impose on him!

        Ehhhh, I don’t know him, but I feel like nothing he would do would surprise me. At all. He’s a cheating coward, after all. All his “best” is a ploy for something else.

        • You’re absolutely right, Miss Sunshine!! Leopards be leopards. (And he should be drowning in fear, since the jackass used his work email for his now-leaked Ashley Madison account. oops)

        • This. Miss Sunshine nails it.

          And using his work email for Ashley Madison? He is probably trying to explain how that account is really used for his scholarly research! 😛 At least some of the researchers at my institution would have an obvious scholarly interest in infidelity as an aspect of sexual behavior. 😉

      • Tempest, how do you know if this little tart isn’t feathering her nest for the next sucker and divorce! Maybe that huge house is what she hopes to “win” in a split from your Ex? These cheaters ALWAYS have a hidden agenda. It can take a few years for their evil plan to come together, but these lil’ whores are patient if nothing else. Especially while “gold digging!”my Ex was a cheap bastard too. I can imagine him doing something exotic or expensive for his HO, but I can see him exacting his pound of flesh for it also! Take heart, remember, he hasn’t changed that much!

        • That thought did cross my mind, Roberta. I’m waiting on feedback from two friends who have met the new GF to see if they detected any hint of gold-digging (since she is 20 years younger than him).

      • Tempest, I’m so sorry about your vile X’s latest real estate purchase. Mine did something a bit similiar, but on a smaller scale.
        After the divorce, he sold our vehicle, purchased our dream car, supplied himself with new sporting goods like a beautiful kayak that he knew I could not enjoy while we were married due to my mobility challenges and proudly flaunted in all over social media with the thinly veiled implication: “See, now that I’m rid of the crippled loser that was my wife, I can live out my fantasies with whomever I want!”
        Big hugs and love to you Tempest. You’re so mighty, but I empathize with you on this.

        • Boudica: Your X and mine would probably be best buddies (until they started fighting for supremacy). Neither seems content to just go for the kill; they want the kill long, drawn-out and bloody (but both are good at masquerading their true intentions behind a facade of charm). I waiver between viewing them both as the face of evil (more dangerous because of their superficial appeal) vs. pathetic, since their actions are bound to catch up to both of them.

          And love back to you; you are insightful & mighty and live up to your moniker!!

          • Tempest: Regarding your remark that your X and mine would be best buddies until they started fighting for supremacy – what a great idea! I wonder how it would manifest…. Pistols at dawn? Claymoors at high noon? Flame throwers at dusk? I wouldn’t care, as long as they both had good aim. (Cue in evil laugh.)

            • Lol, Boudica and Dat–your posts bring to mind very vivid images! I don’t mind which weapons they use (flame throwers seems appropriate), as long as they both suffer.

              The two of them could attempt a battle of wits, though that wouldn’t last long.

    • Samaritan, it is understandable to feel this way. The betrayal just guts you. But believe it when we tell you it does get better. What helped me cope beside chump lady is this blog:” Lessons from the end of a marriage “. It is through this blog that I found chump lady. I know it will help you. So you hang in there, this to will pass eventually.

    • samaritan,

      In a sense, I have walked the road that you are on, but I am much further along the path. It is not an easy road, but the futher out you get, these things will still bother you but more like an itchy, dull ache than the open oozing sore like it feels like right now.

      The OW in my case is actually a flaming overt narc – my sons call her psycho. She uses false charm and “niceness” as camoflauge. Most people (she is a minister) believe her carefully crafted “good person” image. I had barely been out of the house two months before she had come to visit (she lives out of state – he has since joined her) and was sleeping in my bed and occupying my home as if she had always lived there. My Ex allowed this. My son, who was due to leave for school in a couple of months, was still living in the house. Even though my son expressed his discomfort when Ex proposed allowing her to stay there while my son was still in the house, they did it anyway. For her, she wanted immediately to assume my position, not only as his woman, but as the “mother” to my (adult) children, as if I never existed and they wouldn’t have any feelings about that. For the Ex, once he had discarded me, he felt it was perfectly acceptable just to swap us out. They both could have waited for my son to be out of the house and done these things privately, but she is like a dog who wants to piss and mark her territory and Ex is like an owner who is more than happy to allow his pet to shit in the neighbor’s yard. This was just the beginning. He attempted several times when OW was in town to “double date” with our oldest, my daugther who is not his biologically, although he raised her. She repeatedly refused and eventually told him if he ever asked her again, she would stop speaking to him. OW has tried (and he has allowed her) to introduce herself as the mother of my youngest. There was push back from that child as well. The list of these behaviors goes on and on. She didn’t just want him – she wants to assume my role completely in his life – to marginalize me as if my existence was of no consequence and totally irrelevant. Over 2 years later, and while there is less of it because my children have expressed their displeasure, this behavior still continues.

      Understand that only severely disordered, insecure, sick people behave this way. In the beginning, the pain from hearing about these encounters was excrutiating. They, too, flaunted their European and domestic travels while I was barely making ends meet. Now? I still get annoyed and sometimes get an ache, but it bothers me far less and for a much shorter time. I have had to accept that I cannot control the behavior of unscrupulous, duplicitous crazy people – unless I want to drive myself crazy. Therapy helps. Gradually understanding that you will never be able to control or fix crazy helps. Beginning to create a life for yourself free of that kind of illness helps and actually becomes a relief. When I recently heard how, when he is not with her, she is constantly texting and calling and checking up on him, I smiled a little on the inside.

      This is a process, but listen to Nord. It was hard for me to accept and believe that the pain would lessen and dull after awhile, but it really does. Will they ever get what they truly deserve? Who knows? People usually do not escape the consequences of their actions. However, by the time it happens you may not know or even care. I wish for you your own new life without the stress of having to be involved with someone who could be so unloving and careless with you. You deserve so much more and better.

      • Gosh , my x is a Ministet and so is Miss Piggy. She would come from 4 hours away and do the same thing ( he just swapped me out too )!

        The creepiest thing is that when she is not around he has tried to put out oldest daughter into my old role ( not sexually of course ). He was so used to his wife appliance being available as free labour ( Minister’s wife is the worst unpaid job ever ) that he tried to manipulate our daughter into that position after I left.

        After my very young son examined that Miss Sparkly had to sleep in our old bed with Daddy because she has a bad back I was livid.

        But I got even in my own way.
        I was in the house to use the bathroom and he leopard print pillow was on his bed.

        So I used it to wipe myself with. Hope twatwaffle enjoys a comfortable nights sleep on our Theraputic Pillow Top !!!!

    • OW is posting their “oh so wonderful lives together” on social media due to relationship insecurity. If she was secure in the relationship or had an ounce of decency she would not be posting items that she thinks you are viewing. Make no mistake, she is sure you are viewing her postings. I know you have heard it all before that you are much better off, but you really are and 34 is young. The day will come (and I’m pretty sure it will be within a year) that you sigh a relief that you dodged a bullet.

    • Samaratin.. I know how you feel.. but really 34 is SO SO YOUNG. Be glad it happened now and not 10 years later. I feel certain you will meet someone a lot better for you. Not to minimize the pain, it hurts like a MF.. we all understand and live it every single day. Hang in there, it will get better.

      • Or 25 years later. How so many of us wish our X’s would have shown their true colors early on! The choices we could have made…thinking about it just makes me sick.

    • Samaritan,
      In the first few weeks after D-Day #1, I felt outrage and pain of STBX’s betrayal (lies and affairs with men, women, prostitutes). Now, I think that all these ‘others’ won the Turd Olympics, and I am happy to lose that game. The only thing that upsets me now (one year past D-Day #1) is the fact that the kids and I might be impeded from reaching our goals (earning certain degrees, getting certain jobs) that we had hoped to reach before STBX blew up our lives. Fortunately, some days now, I notice how much more energetic I feel now that STBX doesn’t share my home. I got saddled with a big burden (e.g., much less money, less time with my kids), but I also got to put down a big burden (deadweight of a very abusive STBX). By the way, against great odds (I am a wrinkled, unemployed, nearly 50-year-old mother of young kids), several months after STBX filed, I got a younger (younger than me and STBX), accomplished boyfriend who treats me like royalty.

    • Ooo Samaritan, I had to chime in here . . .

      My X and the new Mrs, (Yep, he married her) did ghastly shit on Facebook. Literally one week after I kicked him out, a friend told me he went from “Married to Rumblekitty” to “In a relationship with Butter-face.” Our divorce took 4 months, and the VERY DAY we were legally divorced, they relentlessly posted pictures of their great love which could not be denied. Another month later, he asked her to marry him and they posted the ring on Facebook.

      These two were UN-fucking-believable. I have never seen two adults act like the entire planet was so engrossed in their love affair. But that’s a narcissist for you, so it makes sense. I couldn’t believe I was married to the same guy in these pictures.

      Now, a good 15 months later, he’s unblocked me so I can see him. I don’t bother to look because I just don’t care. You’ll get there eventually. The love I had for him is just dead, because once it sinks in that someone is that screwed up in the head and had that little of a regard for you, my rational brain said, OK – I’m done.

      Go ahead and block them both. It helps get your mind right.

  • Nord —

    Your comments are so timely! My STBX is moving Schmoopie into his apartment next month (on the same day we are due in court). Schmoopie is from Iowa and she’ll be caught in the NYC suburbs living in a 2 bedroom apartment built in the 1920’s and in a town where everyone knows everyone and everyone is aware of what he’s done. But she’ll be sleeping in my bed and using my dresser (a 15th wedding anniversary gift) and she’ll be sitting on my couch and eating off my china and using my pots and pans. STBX spent the summer working out of Iowa but he’s now itching to get back “home”. He thinks a marching band is waiting to greet him and Schmoopie will be loved by all because he loves her.

    My sisters can’t understand why I don’t grab my furniture and other possessions and run. I tell them it’s because they were bought by both of us and every purchase was always a compromise on my part. I never got to choose what I really wanted. Now I’m on my own and in an apartment I purchased and surrounded by things I have chosen and love. I don’t want the old stuff and even my kids don’t want it as it’s too “old” and “fussy”.

    I know it’s going to be difficult watching the Happy New Couple living life v.2 but I then have to remind myself that I am living an authentic life and she’s the one who is a dimwit living with a cheater!

    • mom9193, I know right?
      I told my STBX to take the china, the flatware, any furniture he bought (it’s barely 10 things in the whole house) the towels, nearly anything not given to me/us by my family. Take it! Take it! Take it! because if you don’t take it I will put it by the curb 10 minutes after you leave. I don’t want any memories of him in my house when he leaves, except of course, my kids.

      • A dead rat in a drawer of the anniversary dresser might be just the homecoming gift these two dopes deserve! 😉

        • A few weeks ago, someone told the story of a woman who put shrimp in the hollow curtain rods before she left, and then took delight at seeing carpet/drapery cleaning trucks routinely going to the house.

          • Dang, you already know it!

            The OHo pretty much tried to step into my shoes, and DD has no time for her. But she reports, having visited is that their life is NO different to when we were together, and Downgrade was just the Auntie/Friend. Mr Fab gets home from work, locks self in study to ‘chill out’ (porn) only emerging when dinner is ready, then they sit and drink until midnight. Their Life 1.0. She cheated to get with him, the karma bus will roll when it rolls…..

            Actually, I think of My Life 2.0 as what I am living now. Yes, the MoFo owes me money-quite a lot, as I have only recently found out. So we are back in touch/selling property, and I get flutters at every new email. Yes, I am raising a teenager by myself and at the start of a new career with much less stability.

            But it’s MY life now. So.Much.Better.


            • Did you post the shrimp story? I remembered it! Brilliant!

              I know it’s hard raising a teenager by yourself, but I’m actually finding it easier than raising a teenager with fucktard. My 14 yo actually admitted in therapy that her father used to take her side and not enforce rules or boundaries (making me the bad guy, and my job harder). I don’t miss that at all.

              Sounds like X’s Karma bus might be cirrhosis of the liver.

              xx, Mehphista!

              • OMG…me too, you guise. Crapweasel did that all through my Mädchen’s adolescence, and it was really, really confusing, both to her and to me. Yet he never tried to have a “real” relationship with her, just in the moments when he could side with her to tear me down….

                (He even voiced getting mad at me, and why wouldn’t I “make his relationship with her better” ?? As if. I tried to explain that you have to have relationships with other people your own self. A possible red flag. ::cough::.

                Now that she’s 23 and counting, she doesn’t even bother to read his emails…. while we just spent a delightful month together (Mädchen, her kind and wonderful Freund, and I). Golly gee, I wonder why?

                They know who the real parent is.

              • True enough. He pulled the Disney Dad crap often enough… nice to be in OUR space, where we can hang up our choices of art-it was guitars guitars guitars at the old place. Tonight we just hung up the Wonder Woman poster she got me.

                Waaay grateful to be away from that pair as they drink themselves drad!


              • Lol, Mehphista! You ARE Wonder Woman!

                One of my biggest supporters throughout this debacle informed me that Target had Wonder Woman underwear. I bought a pair at the beginning of the summer and wear them every day I need that extra psychological boost.

            • I think of it as My Life 2.0 too, and before I read it. I thougt this post was going to be about the 2.0 life we all have to create when we start over after a cheater. But it works for the exes and their affair partners too. My ex took OW to one of the restaurants we went very early in our dating in the first two weeks after dday when he left for OW (he paid with our joint account, so I saw it). At that point, I realized that he wasn’t too original…and then I realized he must have taken the others before me to that restaurant too!

    • What about taking all of the possessions, selling the lot, and then buying whatever you need with the cash?
      Its a win-win situation for him, and fuckwit OW doesn’t profit off your stuff. 😀

  • Bingo!!! Over here ! Over here!
    I am told by my child that he has purchased the same paint colors, same sheet sets, and has has plans to duplicate our yard at his new house… All things that I created in our home. Prior to him leaving the home I changed the color of the bedroom to suit my taste. I painted mauve. One of his last parting comments was ‘ thats an ugly color’ Come to find out he recently painted his bedroom the same color!!! He asked my daughter to write down recipes of the meals I ussed to make!
    Tweeny has a car but he insists that she learn how to drive my old standard…they just got a dog…. The same cross breed that he left behind.
    The best part of all this…. Is he has now started taking our child to meet his ‘ new’ girlfriend. Yes , he is cheating on Tweeny and is taking our child as cover…. Just like he did with me. Is there seriously a handbook that they use? Cause , holy fuck, its twilight zone shit. You cant make this shit up!!! And the further along The road to Meh I get I am realizing…. It wasnt me.

    • Yeah, my ex has painted his place the same way I painted our place, bought similar towels and linen, etc. I just shake my head.

    • Me, too!

      After I wouldn’t agree to release funds so he and Bim could set up their loveshack across the street in our neighborhood (“so the kids could go from house to house” = so he doesn’t have to pay child support), he bought a house and proceeded to paint it the EXACT colors in our house. He put a bar in his living room (meany me made him build a bar in the basement) but upgraded so he could have a running tap at all times. But he still put all of his cheap hootch in the expensive, top-shelf bottles he dug out of a dumpster behind a bar one night.

      Trips? He and Bim take their annual trip during the week of our wedding anniversary, and last year they went to Jamaica. He’s been unemployed since we got divorced, but has a sugar mama and an inheritance. Oh, and they took our kids to DisneyWorld last April; the place I wanted to go for years and the place his mother gave us $10,000 for before she died. But, he “didn’t like Disney” and that money? Disappeared!

      Still, while he has no original thought and it’s a bonus to do all these things THINKING it’s another “fuck you” to me, I’m at the point where I know that in addition to Life Version 2.0 (which wasn’t all that and a bag of chips to begin with), Bim also gets the moody, hateful, nasty, LAZY, selfish, cold, booze hound as a partner.

      He’s turning 60 soon, and just getting more moody, hateful, nasty, LAZY, selfish, cold, and drunk.

      I consider that a win for me.

      • What on earth is so damn charming, that it attracts the AP’s in the first place? Baffling. Sorry, but I am laughing over here at your description! Too funny, and familiar to me,and aging does not make the Narcs any lovelier. It just reinforces for me the truth that WE made them look good. All the decor, choosing and buying their wardrobe, and (in my case anyway) deciding when to have kids. The OW tried that shit, of taking over my adult sons. She thought they were sooo cool, and young like she pretended to be, and she wanted to hang with them. Too bad they hate her! My middle son told me he’d punch her in the face if she showed up at his house one more time (he’s a firey Italian). Just have to shake your head at all this needless drama and destruction.
        And of course, when I divorced him, she dumped him.

        • Free woman

          I made him look good also. And narcs age terribly. What she thought she was getting was a good guy. Right after DDay I sent him a text stating all the things good guys don’t do. They don’t cheat, lie, or degrade their wife to a bar whore.

          We give them stability and that’s why they stay while leading a double ife. Take that away and the good guy evaporates into the dark smoke of evil. It bothered me to be replaced by a grotesque druggie piggy. Now it’s like watching a circus act. She takes his pain medication my insurance pays for. So indirectly I’m now paying to kill the bitch. He’s living the life in the pig pen.

          • Donna, that’s too rich! She takes his pain meds????!!!!! Good heavens, he’s not her lover, he’s her drug dealer! Ha! Ha! Ha!

            • Roberta he just had surgery and pain meds make him sick. She was arrested in 2013 for breaking into her last AP’S apartment, punching him in the neck and throwing coffee at him. When she was arrested they charged her with felony for having illegal pain meds. I kid you not she looks,acts, and sounds like an addict. She is grotesque.

              It was reported to me that she was totally off the wall following his surgery.

      • “But he still put all of his cheap hootch in the expensive, top-shelf bottles he dug out of a dumpster behind a bar one night.”

        This made me laugh out loud. hahahaha! You are so well-rid of this douche.

    • That would really creepy just knowing there are people that strange out there? Duplicate the yard and get the same kind of dog?! It doesn’t sound like that is for your child’s benefit either.

    • Good Lord! What the heck is wrong with these people! Some of these cheaters should just keep the family home and install a turnstyle where the doors should be! But I do relish the idea that each and every OW is auditioning for the part I played so well for so many years! “I’d like to Thank The Academy and my fans for this award!” Bwahahahaha! Unfortunately, no one will EVER be ME! I am the one and only! I set the bar bitches!!!!

  • My experience is radically different. My ex was cheating with a married co-worker and they did not end up together, although both ended up divorced. He remarried last year, nine years after we separated. I don’t even date. I feel sorry for his wife. She had no idea what kind of pain he is capable of causing other people.

  • I watched MOW ( Miss Piggy ) covet my life for 3 years. She wanted the house, my husband, my clothes and they even had fantasies of combining the two families like sick version of the Brady Bunch.

    They groomed my kids and her kids during this time too. What good friends – let’s go camping together or have them spend weekends at the house!!!

    I watched her try to tell my teenaged daughter what to do and try to become her BFF through social media.

    All the while I played the pick me dance, and spackled like crazy. I thought I would lose my mind!

    In the end, she got to booby prize.
    Neither her teenager or mine want to spend time in their fantasy land …oops I mean life .

    The boys are younger and just go where the good times and food are.

    The big house was rented when he was in school ( not sure how she missed that ) and my family has the money – he was just constantly free loading off them and ran up a giant amount of debt anyway !

    He drinks and eats too much, has a chronic illness and lies and cheats.

    Sure looks like she got my life in spades and she’s welcome to it!!!

    • Lucky,
      I am sorry that your husband never had the intestinal fortitude to create meaning for his life. It sounds like he just chased jealousy in a skirt. I am so glad that you have financial security and a meaningful life!

  • Mine mirrored me. I can only think of one vacation spot we went to that was his idea and once he had the bright idea of going to The Lizzie Borden House which completely creeped me out. (There’s a seriously bad vibe in that place) and things to do with sports which were only occasionally shared with me. The rest of our outings were my ideas and then he began resenting it during the discard. Like I’d done it on purpose without regard to his interests when all the previous times he had offered to go to these places with me.

      • He was into serial killers and dark humour. Again, I thought it was a guy thing and even I used to like Forensic Files. Now I wonder.

        My sister read that book about Manson. Just the little bit of it she told me about creeped me out. I don’t want to read or hear about those sickos.

        • I used to watch some of those silly shows about haunted buildings. Then they would freak me out and I would have to watch a cooking show or something. aking someone else go to the home of a murderer seems weird and creepy!

          • Funny, though, I found my interest in the techniques of serial killers increased dramatically after D-day…….

            • Tempest I know what you mean.

              My first therapist actually used to bring up Scott Peterson a lot as an example of someone everyone thought was a great guy until his murdered his wife and unborn child.

              Chumpy Elf, 🙂

            • Same Tempest! I thought to myself hmmmmm….could be a useful skill set!! Then I had to turn off the boob tube before i was featured on an HBO series ‘ Cheater, Eaters and Beaters… Women Torturers’

  • Mrs. DM is a natural blonde. My ex is a natural brunette. Early in my dating period with the xW, I made a boneheaded comment about liking blondes that–rightfully–earned me a fight with her. Recently, I noticed my xW in a profile picture had dyed her hair/highlighted it blonde. It made both Mrs. DM and I chuckle.

    • Whoa! DM–you and Nord just caused an epiphany. I have always had a fascination with China. Two rooms of my house look like they could have come from the Forbidden City; three of my dish sets are distinctively Chinese (including a red lacquer with calligraphy set), my daughters and I have taken Chinese language lessons for the past decade. My X has always claimed he preferred the All-American girl look (think Christie Brinkley, Jennifer Garner). But guess what nationality his new girlfriend is? His live v.2 appears to have been influenced by my preferences v.1. Lol.

      • Gawd, Tempest, I have lots of Chinese, er, stuff. Maybe one day I will unload some on you. Some is beautiful but my parents don’t seem to understand while I am the only sentimental, respectful child (okay, exaggerating here), I have downsized and don’t have room for all of this.

        • Thanks for the thought, ChumpyElf–I could make my whole house look like the Forbidden City! (too bad X never learned the meaning of “forbidden”).

          • Back in the 80s there was a huge traveling Chinese exhibition of art and science that went around the globe. Did you catch it? It was in Toronto for a long time and we had friends in it (the double sided silk embroiderer, an inside the bottle painter and a miniature dough figurine girl most notably). I even went to see it in Chicago with my cousins. One of the promo posters was of a bronze basin with handles and water droplets flying up in the air.

            • I’m not sure I saw that exhibit, though I did catch the Xi’an terra cotta soldiers exhibit in Atlanta when it was making the rounds years ago (and had seen the original terra cotta burial sight when it first opened up, when I was on a study tour in Xi’an in 1984). Whenever I was in DC, I always took a trip to the Freer Gallery in the Smithsonian.

              • I remember seeing soldiers in North America but I don’t remember when or where. I finally saw them in Xi’an in 1994. It was neat though the most memorable part of that day of our group tour was buying flat dougnut peaches from a person at the entrance and watching a donkey pulling a cart on a crowded highway while his owner was sprawled out on top of bags of food in the back. If only I had an animal smart enough to do that!

  • Holy shit… first time poster here and this is hitting the nail on the head of what I am about to experience. SICK! This entire article and all the comments…. YIKES but I can DO THIS…. right! Fucking unoriginal bastards. My story is so unoriginal with the two of them it is disturbing. I did ALL the work for my two best friends and now they are a “thing”. After 20 years and 2 young kids. DISGUSTING single white female slore and my STBX unoriginal TOOL. Should be in a movie on lifetime.

    • Chumpydoo, yes YOU can do this!!!!!!! I know it’s hard and it hurts but you are mighty and you CAN do this!

    • Chumpydoo–Welcome (and sorry you have to be here). Cheaters who get it on with the spouse’s best friend suck beyond belief. The only advantage is that it doesn’t take much more evidence to realize that they are awful and unredeemable.

    • You can do it Chumpydoo.. they are both disordered freaks and deserve each other. It will implode. By the time it does though you won’t care. You’ll be marching along in your happy new cheater free life.

        • WOW when did they write a song about my (and obviously others as well) life! WTF…. freaky but maybe it’s my new jam. I feel like posting it on my FB page! ha Or not… People SUCK and are so sick! Single White Female shit is some scary stuff. LOSERS!

    • They are all the same, ChumpyDoo, my ex got it on for over 15 years with two co-workers who became “family friends.” The level of betrayal is bewildering. And like Nord said above, there is a part of it that continues to hurt. But it gets much much better with time and eventually you truly realize you are in a better place. As my daughter says, he is just sick (so is she).


    • Chummy… You will connect the dots more quickly now. Keep reading. Tell yr story. It has healing power. Welcome aboard the Chump Boat! Sarcasm served on the Promenade Deck….

      • Thank you. So happy and lucky I found you and CN 4 months into this shit storm. I am buckling my seatbelt and holding on for the fucking ride. UGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

  • The Trashican that the Sad Sausage was f****** wrote it all in one of the “charming love letters” I found. Yes, she wanted my life down to the washing dishes together, doing chores, etc barf barf. Wonder how she will like it having to be his mother— stop picking your ears, eyes, nose; go to the doctor; clean up your dribbles; turn here; and on and on. Yes, I did all the planning and executing in our 35 yrs. She’ll be doing the taking care of as his 65 yr old ass ages quickly. And that Karma bus is bring Alzheimer’s on it scheduled for a stop in his neighborhood!

    • Happily never after, don’t forget this one….”turn your turn signal off, we’ve been on the highway for an hour now!” Then they get pissed because you are telling them how to drive! Yep! My Ex is 60, but acts like he’s going on 80 when he drives!

  • I’m sure that my ex is still communicating with a buffet of potential Russian pussies, but he has no one to go on vacation with at the moment and he borrowed my dog to keep him company.
    His first EA with online stranger started 5 years ago, when I spiralled into a burnout. Tends to illustrate what other posters have written: when it’s their turn to answer needs, they go out the door.
    When cured, I took correspondence courses to be a comics author. I spent many hours drawing and we did not go out that much. But I did ask him every evening or wekeend if it was OK with him, and invariably he said he wanted to stay home and rest.
    After his affair reached a climax (wedding plans) and failed, he changed completely, acted like he resented the fact that we stayed home so much, and demanded that we visit every single city of the Riviera. I did not know the extent of the cheating and was willing to pick-me-dance, so I drove him around. Every.damn.weekend. Saint Tropez in February is gorgeous, but I resented this forced activity, it was wearing off my car, costing money, and I wasn’t sure why he was doing this.
    Apparently, he was storing pictures to lure strangers.
    It turns out that he continues to this day. He visits region after region. With a Russian woman. With my dog.
    I am not interested. Drive, drive, walk walk walk, drive, walk, drive, …. Even the dog was exhausted; she ran under a bush when he dropped her at my home.

    • Okay, it’s not 2.0 yet. It’s only been 2 months since final separation. But the behavior is already strange.

  • Not sure about v.2. We will have to wait and see what happens. Not sure I care all that much at this point, just please take him off my hands and get him away from me! I’m sure there will be lots of things they do that I always wanted to do. I just mentioned I had new dreams the other day to go new places and see new things that were not on my list before. Guess what he’s been researching? All I can do is laugh! How can I not.

    Mediation is this afternoon – not expecting much but hoping to get him out of my house. I’ll be taking all of you with me into that room, as my emotional back up. Then we’ll see what v.2 looks like. I suspect it will be a mad cap comedy.

    • Stay strong! I wish you the best in mediation. You are open-hearted and authentic… don’t let him take that.

      • Good luck today, AllOutOfKibble! I actually have a meeting with an attorney this afternoon to answer some jurisdiction questions about custody and review the custody agreement I drafted (with the help of an online legal form) that Fuckwit actually agrees to. Can’t wait to get everything court ordered! The thought of him picking them (8 yr old boy, 4 yr old girl) up one weekend and never returning them haunts me.
        I took a PTO day today to take our son to orientation at his new school (we moved back to my home town an hour away from Fuckwit) and go to see the attorney. I even put a roast & veggies in the crock pot which is making the house smell amazing as I type this! All signs point to it being a great day? Keeping my fingers crossed for you.
        Our daughters first day of preschool was yesterday. Of course the little diva had to get all dolled up in her most bedazzled new school outfit for her first day. I took a pic of her and emailed it to Fuckwit in an effort to really try to be a good co-parent. Guess what? *crickets* No, “tell her good luck”, “aww…she looks cute”….nada. Well, there you have it. Yet another example that he truly cares for no one, not even his kids unless it immediately makes him look good in some way; however, I’m sure he showed it off to his new coworkers (new kibble supply…he actually got a job recently) so they can see what a fantastic dad he is to such a gorgeous blue-eyed girl. It’s sick and sad but I refuse to let it get me down today.

  • My x flew his girlfriend and 2 year old in and had my kids ask me if they could use my family pass so they could all go to the zoo together. He then proceeded to do with them all the things we used to do as a family – drive over to MI for the day, go to all the same restaurants, do all the same things. It was so weird, especially since she looks a lot like me (only 15 years younger).

    He also flew new girlfriend in for his sister’s wedding (which he was late for, as always) and then sent me a ‘nice’ note at the end of the weekend detailing out all the things they did together with one of my sons, which was the exact same as every other trip we ever took to his home town.

    I have come to the same conclusion – he has no ideas of his own so he just keeps doing the same things over again. What’s ironic is during our fake reconciliation, he passive aggresively insinuated that i was dull and boring. Since we split, our financial lives strangely became more comfortable as some long term investments finally paid off. We never were able to do much while we were married because money was a little tight. My being dull and boring was, from my perspective, living within our means. Since the divorce, i have followed my passion for travel and gone to many new places with friends, my new boyfriend and my kids. Meanwhile, he takes them to the same place (where his new GF lives) for every vacation. But i am the dull and boring one.

    • Unencumbered,
      You have got to be kidding me. That man is a freaky display of lame. I send my liberating doves of freedom your way. I had a bad week last week, but these posts keep my mind working. What a great eternity those of us with a streak of imagination will have!

  • Come to think of it – I did all the planning of any ‘trip’ too. That is as long as it revolved around his pool tournaments and alcohol. ALL the jackass did was play pool and by god he was at EVERY tournament in the area – so basically every weekend he was at a pool tournament. Once and awhile he would have a weekend free to take a jaunt down to a comedy club or check out a restaurant in a neighboring town. Since we’ve been separated, I have taken a road trip down to Arkansas (and am going back over Labor Day), been to Fargo, I’ve road tripped with friends to some other Southern Minnesota towns. None of that I would have done if I were still with dumbass…unless there was a pool tournament in one of those towns. He can take his pool stick and shove it up his ass.

  • Great post Nord! You are awesome.

    These people are greatly disordered, so it is useless to try to find an answer. But it sounds like your EX is employing impression management 101 to the people that were part of those places (‘look at my new prize’ and ‘see I am a good guy, it was my Ex that was nutty’). Also, he is likely telling OW a greatly massaged story to make him look better or play the sympathy card (‘isn’t it beautiful here? my EX was always miserable and didn’t want to come here).

    In my singledom, I had a date who purposely took me to the same restaurant during a weekend getaway as his previous girlfriend. When I learned this, it went over like a lead balloon. So weird.

    I just keep repeating the mantra ‘it’s not me — it’s you’!

  • This is an ideal post Nord! I’m fortunate that my ex doesn’t post photos of him and OW – probably because he’s used to juggling more than one at the same time. In the words of CL: his “relationships just overlap”, so he’s keep things, uh, discreet.

    However, when I was digging around on his computer backup files after the first D-day, I found a photo of his “main squeeze” in the lobby of somewhere, lifting up her dress to show him her hmmm….underpinnings. Yep, she was going commando that special evening. This was the same woman who stripped off her shirt without my permission to sunbath topless in our back yard. Yeah, that one – the Church Elder’s wife. Anyway, upon closer inspection, I notice something familiar about the surroundings in the photo. It was the same nightclub Mr. Depraved took me dancing for our first New Years Eve Celebration together.

    My theory is that, since cheaters are having their downstairs brain doing all the thinking for them, that leaves nothing for the upstairs brain to work with in terms of imagination. His life is one big deja vu – all over again, and again, and……

    • Urgh I remember the story of the exhibitionist in your backyard… You must be right regarding the downstairs brain.

    • Boudica,
      You have the right name for you. You are so classy. Ex instituted the morning and evening prayer (that I thought would help our marriage) with the OW. I can honestly say, that is a recitation to some stone god somewhere that I will not miss. It was the same selfish prayer daily. I will not repeat it. It still offends my ears.

      • Friend, thank you so much for your kind words! Your Ex did routine morning and evening prayer? The same ones everyday? I come from a background where the same thing was done. Yeah, I can see where you would have an aversion to it. Sending you hugs!

  • The person who said they lack imagination must have been married to my husband or his much younger brother. The OW is definitely redoing my life sans kids (because they are too old!), same restaurants, same events. What fun that must be though perhaps she thinks that all of these places are new to him. However it isn’t all one way. My deranged h talked about her dead husband as if he had known him and read books on mountaineering (he was killed a few years before falling off a mountain) in the months before he left. I think he has assumed his place – after all if he had married her 45 years ago she would have had him and a very different life. Well the one I had and she is having now. Guess they are each leading their individual fantasy lives. Just crazy mixed up kids.

  • Spot on post. This has been one of the uniquely awful aspects of my own situation. He’s gone with her to the same places that we traveled – the spot in Florida where we got engaged and the specific island where we vacationed seven times. For a moment it confused me as to WHY? she would want to go to those same places where he went with his wife (I know that she knows we went there together). Then I realized it’s because she’s now in the role I was in – living his life on his terms. Those are the only places he wants to go so that’s where they go. Mr. Control Freak Creature of Habit can only go to a few comfortable places. Thankful not to have to live within those constraints anymore.

  • Nord, Asshat is not very original but will come up with some pretty harebrained ideas sometimes. Not quite as bad as Lina having to go to Lizzie Borden’s house though…. Anyhoooo, we moved to the mountains to take advantage of the outdoors yet he chose to have an affair with a woman who hates living here. Who criticized my cooking, not even knowing me, yet cooked him overcooked eggs and boxed Zatarains rice? As far as I know, she doesn’t like to hike, bike, ski or set foot outdoors. She doesn’t spend much time online so even though I know she wants my life (house, cars, money, will tolerate the kid even though she doesn’t like kids, and the status) I have no idea what they dreamed they would build their life on? Asshat’s crazy ex-gf had educated, professional parents yet acted and ended up a piece of trash. Wearing tube tops over her silicone boobs in front of our grade school nephews. He professes to want classy, smart and adventurous but I look at his relationships, the ones he sabotaged (actually I think he got dumped from all of them as he is about to me from ours), and think no one who meets those criteria stuck around. He maintains our life is awesome. If he replicates it with someone else, no doubt he will say to put Little Elf at ease, I hope I will be more amused than offended.

    • Chumpy Elf, the worst part is the Lizzie Borden murder house is actually a B & B now and, believe it or not, gets lots of guests and they have seances, etc. Lots of weird people out there. It’s scary.

      I hated every minute of being there. Whether the creepy vibe was just knowing what happened there or actually evil in the atmosphere, I couldn’t wait to get out of there. And I didn’t buy any souvenirs.

      • A former coworker’s brother is into ghost hunting. He and his wife belong to a club like those people on tv who take infrared cameras into haunted houses. Regular day jobs and wonderful people. You just never know…. 😉

        • I can see ghost hunting, but purposely sleeping in a room where someone was ax murdered is a bit much for me.

  • I am sitting drinking a bowl of cafe au lait in Quebec City, the sun is out, the vibe is mellow. And I just realized that it is exactly one year since I stood in front of the judge who granted me the divorce it took three years to organize. And it’s Tuesday, and if this isn’t Meh it’s pretty damn close.

    If you had told me a year ago, shaking, anxious,exhausted, sad, overwhelmed me, that life would be so good a year out I would not even have heard what you said. But here I am.

    If OW has my old life, she is welcome to it. I don’t need it any more – I have a way better one.I am grateful that she wants to take on the care of an angry, aging, impotent man-child and his equally disfunctional parents and relieve me of that responsibility. She can have the old furniture, the tools that will not be used unless she uses them, the camping gear that will sit dusty and forgotten unless she plans the trip, packs the car, books the campsites, coaxes the X to take time off and leave the tv and computer behind.

    I’ve got all the important stuff – my kids, my peace of mind, my freedom, an honest life that doesn’t need facebook posts or instagram to be real.

    Good vibes to all of you, wherever you are on the path. Meh is ahead, and you will get there, one step at a time. Really.

    • “And it’s Tuesday, and if this isn’t Meh it’s pretty damn close.” I just got emotional reading this. It’s Tuesday… hopefully I’ll hear myself saying that someday soon. You broke free; you did it, and knowing that gives me a bit more strength and patience.

      • Keep the faith, IAJ! I know that one of these days I’ll be reading your post, on a Tuesday, and laugh and cry a little because you have finally arrived at the end of this particular road.

        As Dat says, Jedi hugs from Quebec!

    • Well said, New Meme. I currently live in the U.S. but studied art history when I lived in Europe. I learned that many of the masters (e.g., Picasso) changed styles several times in their lives. Instead of growing stagnant, they experimented with new styles, evolving. Many people tried to copy these masters styles. One can be the vanguard (chumps), like these master artists, or one can mimic them. I am too busy evolving (as primitive or sophisticated as I may be both before and after evolution) to notice what the copycats and my not-very-original STBX are doing.

  • Nord

    What we sometimes forget is the life we lived with them sucked. Given that I sincerely believe he is indeed duplicating the life he had minus cake and supply from yours truly.

    It’s a shitstorm. X is still a serial cheater, cheating on her. His plans when I followed always cost me. He took with him his dreams without forward thinking. He took with him his limited interests. Miss piggy gets mr toads wild ride from hell. Yes he is duplicating what I had with him. Yet as she follows his lead as the good guy she will suffer the reenactment. X is losing his income because he never wanted to work. He will sink the money he hid into a cheap florida condo and expect her to support him. True love.

    It’s hard to imagine them with someone else. I remind myself daily exactly what she got for her hookup in a hotel. She got the serial cheating narcissist.

    Yes as chumps we suffer unbelievable pain. We never have to be their frontal lobe again. X never had an original thought that didn’t involve lying or cheating.

    The pain does rear it’s ugly head. When it does I remind myself it was like losing one of my favorite comfortable shoes.

    I loved those shoes because they were comfortable. I didn’t really need them and now that I think about it they never really fit my lifestyle.

  • The biggest karma for me as someone once said is knowing that I kept my marriage vows and my ex wakes up a soulless, dysfunctional,copy cat,heartless,repentless,loser,shell of a human being and he doesn’t even realise it.Good luck to anyone who gets even with all the money he has he is not a generous lover.And to all the adultresses that get him he is your karma.

  • I always thought the OW was like one of the birds who steal another birds nest that took such hard work to build. I just looked up what kind of bird does this and apparently it’s the Cukoo bird. What an irony.

    • “Cuckold derives from the cuckoo bird, alluding to the alleged habit of the female in changing its mate frequently and authentic practice of laying its eggs in other nests within its community.” In French, we have the noun/adjective “cocu” that means the one who was cheated on. It was used in Vaudeville theaters a lot. The coucou (the bird) used to be called cocu in the Middle Ages. Nothing new.

  • I am not sure in my case my STBX’s original schmoopie is still in the picture, however in his case, he couldn’t wait to get FAR away from me, suburbia and the boring routine life of family. Being a family and doing boring things just wasn’t exciting enough for him. He told me so… we didn’t have enough “fun”.. have enough “passion”. “Life was passing us by”. We should have “done more things”. At the root, he’s never satisfied so I doubt the original schmoopie will be the cure all either. He’s searching for something but I am not sure he even knows what it is. But he sure doesn’t want the life we had. At least not now.

    It wouldn’t shock me if 5 years down the road he’s not remarried and living basically the same life with someone else’s kids. This is pretty common I think. Swapping one wife for another. But does this make them happy? The VERY HIGH second marriage divorce rate would suggest otherwise. And since these guys/gals aren’t real good at self reflection… they are likely to repeat mistakes over and over.

    I am working on MY LIFE 2.0 and it’s cheater free!

    • Yep, newchumpatl…instead of self-relfection, they are experts in self-DEflection. The problem is always outside of themselves. Must be too painful for them to admit who they really are after all the shit they do.

  • Great post, Nord.

    Yes, I’ve thought of my ex-wife’s AP living my life, v. 2.0. Don’t get me wrong–I know that they do some different things than we did, and visit some different places.

    But my ex-wife still lives in our marital home, surrounded by possessions that we either (a) purchased together upon moving there from across the country, or (b) received as wedding presents a mere 6 years ago. I have no doubt that my ex’s AP is unfazed in being in such surroundings. After all, if you have no qualms about bedding another person’s spouse, how much do you really care about using another person’s coffee maker?

    I do wonder, rarely, about what it’s like for him to travel to the Midwest and meet/spend time with my ex in-laws. “Hi, I’m the guy that your daughter was cheating with when she was married to your ex son-in-law and lying to you about it for months on end. I also cheated on my my wife with your daughter during my brief marriage. I assume you’ll treat us like good people, even though we’re both cheaters and homewreckers.”

    …and that’s how it will go (or has gone.) He’ll spend time with my ex in-laws, slowly building a relationship and sustaining it until he (or my ex-wife) cheats and the entire house of cards collapses under its own absurdity. That could be in 10 weeks, 10 months, or 5 years. But it will happen, as serial cheaters are called such for a reason.

    The dynamic that I describe above would be totally surreal to me. But that’s the reality for my life, v. 2.0. Good riddance.

    • It is amazing the cognitive dissonance cheaters must employ to simply EXIST. While I am not sure X’s whore is still in the picture, I have often wondered how he’d trot her out to his family.. namely our sons.. when everyone knows who she is, likely my older boy does too. How will that go?

      Hello family, let me introduce the slut that broke up our respective marriages. His family is small and none of them are real into it, they are horrified by the whole thing, I can tell you that much. Especially my SIL who is mad as hell at him.

      But blood is thicker than water and I guess they’d tolerate it eventually, for the sake of the kids and holding it together.

      As you say, it will implode. These relationships have a less than 3% chance of long term survival and the ones that do survive do so only with MAJOR scars. Be glad it’s not you. Your life is cheater free!!!

  • I needed this today. I am right now in the middle of yet another compromise of the contents list to settle my divorce. My stbx lives with the ghetto trash OW….in my house…that I designed…I sewed the curtains…picked the paint colors…reupholstered the tag sale finds… yet she says the house will be beautiful when SHE is done with it… My house was a cover of Better Homes and Gardens…did they come out with Ghetto Slum and Curb magazine???
    It passes me off….I have to go to court to fight for furniture I collected and found at estate sales that he complained about. My stbx wants to keep my antique rooster weathervane. ….wtf??? Well…his whore dies like COCK a doodle doo’$….. her kids go to my girls former schools…her kids are in my daughter’s bedrooms…the daughters got kicked out. It is total mind fuckery.
    I wish I could just walk away..but I am not leaving that whore my furniture or weathervane. She has zero style…and my husband knows it. But without my decorated house it will look like crap…and he knows it.
    It is just sick we have to put up with this crap after having our lives screwed over by the cheating. Now the whore gets my custom made drapes??? Is there no justice?

    • Fucker. I am so sorry you are dealing with that Tracy.. the ultimate insult. I know it seems unlikely now.. but rest assured relationships like this do not usually last. The whore will eventually either get on his nerves or she and her kids will get on his. These things are built on a base of sand and in a few years time, maybe less, the whole thing will explode. It’s exactly what these cretins deserve.

      By then you will be far away from the madness and in a position to simply not give a fuck. No more fucks to give. Hopefully enjoying your weathervane.

      Hugs friend.

      • Tracy, Remember the word – MINDFUCK. That’s what they are. Repeat it over and over until it sticks in your head. They will attempt to drive you crazy. Hang in there. As for the homewrecker/whore, press the mute and ignore button in your head. Just smile she’s got the shithead now. She will have to deal with all the mindfuckery too ya know. Hugs it will get better.
        Life goes on, hold that thought in your heart.

    • Sorry, Tracy. Keep fighting. Maybe if you offer to buy them a naugahyde couch (with clear plastic cover) and garden gnome, they’ll be so excited there won’t be a fight over the draperies?

    • I feel you, Tracy. The week after my ex walked out the OW put up some decorating idea for our house. (She was his married coworker). Gosh, they were such “good friends” that they decorated together. Gag. Anyway, my dad saw that post on Facebook and commented, “Interesting.” A couple of hours later the post disappeared.

      Just sick. I was reeling from my ex walking out and the two love birds are decorating the house I’m still living in. Boy, just remembering that they did that reaffirms that CHEATERS SUCK.

    • Tracy-
      Just a suggestion: it might be good to stop pushing for that stuff. You created a fantastic home once, and you can certainly do it again, but without the taint of your cheater and his woman.

      I found that the few things my husband and I collected together (few!) had cooties to me… they were filthy by association and I no longer wanted them.

      Of course, he boogied without taking anything but my tools and all his stuff, so there wasn’t a tussle over custody of stuff.

      Related: I’m in the design business, and our things get copied All The Time. It used to bother me a lot- I agonized over it- until I read this quote:

      “If you’re good enough to get copied, you’re good enough to make more” Bob Mackie

      So I suggest, if it’s causing you pain, that you are good enough to design, collect, and create wonderful, meaningful things for your new life, instead of getting caught up in pain over mementos from your old life.

      Give it some thought. Some of those things you are fighting over may be anchors holding you to the past that are keeping you from having the joy of creating/finding/making new things that represent who you are becoming… not who you were.

  • Interesting question Nord.

    I just passed the one-year separation and I have filed for divorce!!! Yippee for me!!! In thinking about STBXH’s life now, it doesn’t much imitate our old one but there are some similarities. He now lives with the OW and HER son. He depends on her to help him survive financially. They have a dog. I honestly don’t know much about how they live. The OW blocked me on Facebook soon after I found out about her. Then later, I blocked my STBXH on Facebook. I don’t need to see what he is doing. I do not care. I only care what he’s doing when my son is with him.

    I am now at a point where I am able to look back and wonder WHY I accepted so much responsibility in my marriage. I was 31 on my wedding day. I had been desperate to find love and get married. I thought I’d never find someone who would marry me! I thought I was “too much of this” and “not enough of that”. He seemed to check off a lot of check marks. Looking back, I did not recognize some red flags because of my own insecurities. That won’t happen again. I have survived something horrible and degrading and devastating. And look at me now. I am MORE blessed than I ever was in my marriage. It’s so NOT what I had planned but I am HAPPY. I am at PEACE. I am CONTENT. And remember, I am currently living with my parents and sharing a bedroom with my 8 yo son. This is BETTER. You feel me?

  • Tracy,
    I’m in the midst of a very long ‘settlement’ process, too, and have an idea of what a pain it can be. Even if the Court awarded EVERY object you had ever created or found to your STBX and attached loser, the Court and the jerks trying to use it to their advantage could not deprive you of one very important thing–your creativity. Creativity is not transferable. You can go on to creating new products, new rooms, new homes, and a new, interesting life. The losers will have to wait until people like you create something interesting for them to use.

  • Nicely done, Nord!

    People, a gentle reminder:

    I hear all of this suffering here and I commiserate with it, deeply. I get the property headaches. I get the mindfuckery. I get the pain of only seeing your kid(s) half the time, at no real fault of your own. I don’t forgive my STBXW for any of that shit, either.


    Cheaters are, by definition, liars who lack the life skills necessary to handle the real issues and tough times, and life WILL FOR SURE give us real issues and tough times.

    Who the fuck wants someone like that? Not you!!!

    We shouldn’t sweat them, because they’re NOT PRIZES WORTH WINNING.

    Victory number one is getting out and being free of that disordered, selfish bullshit. So, in doing that, you are already winning.

    Stuff is stuff. Let them have the APs who also liars, let them have some of the property, etc., you already have something that they do NOT have and is worth more than all the property that they could ever take from you, combined:

    Integrity and Dignity.

    Those things are precious. Cheaters and APs throw those things away. Ergo, they throw away things that are truly precious.

    Things like YOU.

    Fuck that noise. I can assure you that no matter what they present, their lives are hollow shells compared to precious people like you who actually live, really feel, and understand the value of principles.

  • Years ago I took some photos of each of us taken when each of us was about 5 years old. I had a photography studio make the pics the same size, and put them in matching frames. The two matching photos were displayed side by side, on our dresser in our bedroom for over a decade. About a year after DDay and him moving in with OW, she listed her house for sale, and there in the online listing photos, was Ex’s photo on a dresser in OW’s house, next to a baby picture of her. This really hurt, and also totally weirded me out. WTF.

    On D-Day itself which was a total surprise to me, he told me he had brought OW to our house and that she was going to come live there, as he was going to find me an apartment to move to.

  • Great post Nord! I really enjoyed it.

    I do my best not to know anything about what my ex is doing. After D-day I blocked him from every social media site I had, because I’m really visual and seeing things that upset me stay in my mind long after they should. Anyway, my ex never wanted to go on a family vacation because he didn’t think they were useful. If we traveled it had to be combined with his business trip. I got to see some cool places when I was invited to go along on these business trips, but I really wish we could have made memories on family vacations together. The one family vacation we took was one I saved for, I really wanted my son to see the ocean. Well, since it wasn’t my ex’s idea he acted like a perfect butt for the first couple of days until he forgot to be miffed and started actually having fun. That was the only family vacation we had.

    Now my ex is flying the kids here and there with their wives to do things together with him. It’s very difficult for me, since I’ve not seen both my kids at the same time for a couple of years. It hurts that my ex now seems to realize the importance of family vacations and making memories together. Unfortunately, I’m not included. I did manage to scrape together enough money to visit one of my kids who lives in another state this summer.

    Dad, on the other hand, bought a resort home with multiple baths and bedrooms. One of my kids has decided it’s the perfect vacation spot for him and his wife. I live in a small house in a town, not much exciting to visit here I guess. Very painful.

    Still, I’ve decided I’m not going to spend time pining after people who don’t reciprocate, even if that person is my child. I’m going to go on and have fun and build the best life possible. In my mind, being happy and self-sufficient will do more to encourage my kids to be around than sulking and feeling sorry for myself.

    It hurts every day, but I get up and try to do something that makes me happy. I’m reconnecting with other family members too. I’ve lived long enough to know that family relationships ebb and flow. Things never stay the same, so there’s a possibility that things will change with the kid who’s more attached to his dad right now.

    Every day I give the situation to God and ask him to take care of it, then I continue walking my new path in Life 2.0.

    • Well done, Lyn. We cannot control what our Ex’s do to lure in the adult kids. They always seem to run to where it’s more fun. I have a son like this from my long marriage (first of two chumpdoms for me); son never even finds time to skype me although he has plenty of time to spend at Dad’s big lakefront property, takes his buddies there, posts photos of them all partying together (along with OW). If he does communicate, it’s all one-liners and never asks how I’m doing! I am always happy and positive but son actually seems to resent that I’ve fallen on my feet. I guess he’s a chip off the old block.

      I look at those photos sometimes and imagine myself there with them at each sunset – and you know what? It just brings back memories of how truly lonely I was among them all. Ex never treated me like his partner – it was more like a business arrangement.

      I don’t envy the OW having to listen to his droning voice, his stupid jokes, listen to his snoring. He was so bad at lovemaking that I genuinely used to dread it; there is no way THAT will have changed much!

      I too have made my own life 2.0. Except for a 1.5 year blip where I was chumped again, it has been smooth sailing. I am much more settled now I’ve accepted that being on my own doesn’t mean I can’t have relationships on my own terms. It just means that no one will again invade my home turf without being invited and when I want solitude, that door gets locked and the phone turned off.

  • I’m way further out than most of you… it’s been five years since final Dday, it’s been three years since divorce was finalized. My ex didn’t end up with the soulmate OW…. she is dumb, but I guess she isn’t THAT dumb. The most serious “relationship” ex has had since then was with a woman online — ex never met her in person, but described her to our son as his “girlfriend” and went on and on about their great relationship — which lasted for around two weeks, all via text/email.

    These days, my life is not easy. I worry about money, I try to raise my teen son right, I have an ill elderly mother, I have a huge amount of baggage and anxiety disorder that makes life tough. But I keep on keepin’ on. I have a career that pays my bills — just barely, but still. I’ve been with Nice Guy boyfriend for almost two years, we are talking about getting an apartment together. I try to be a decent, honest person. I do my best. My new life is better than my old, married life, but it’s still hard and I admit, there are times I think, “Why couldn’t ex have been different, so we could have lived happily ever after?” And then I remind myself, because he CAN’T ever be different, he is disordered — always was and always will be.

    • Glad, that’s the one thing I still sometimes ask myself; why couldn’t he have made just a small effort to make our relationship work? Really, it wouldn’t have taken much. And it would have gained him, me, and most importantly, our kids, so much in the way of stability, security, love and affection, money and just a more comfortable life in so many ways, because of friends, family etc. I actually feel sorry for him when I’m having a great time with the kids (who, by their choice, see him for a few reluctant hours, once a month). He’s missing so much! And I honestly don’t believe he’s gained much at all, in his ‘new’ life, over what we had together, and what he could have had if he’d made a small effort to be good to us, and to keep his pants zipped.

      Then I remember; he couldn’t make that small effort, BECAUSE HE WASN’T INTERESTED. The effort would have been small to me, and to lots of other people, but it was WAY beyond his capacity, and he certainly truly believed he shouldn’t have to try.

      And while in some ways my life is more difficult without him, in many other ways it’s much easier, and more pleasant. It wouldn’t have taken much for us to have a great life together, but in the end, my kids and I have a better life, without him.

  • After my divorce, I began seeing a therapist and she gave me some sage advice, “Try not to assign meaning to other people’s lives.”

    She’s right.

    We can speculate six ways til Sunday but we will never know what’s going on inside other people’s heads or in their lives behind closed doors.

    This advice is what kept me from completely losing it when I learned my Ex married his AP.

    • I don’t worry about that either. They think they are getting the same guy we thought we got. He’s the same guy only more disordered (because they seem to ripen with age) and she’s going to find out. It’s called karma.

  • I read a book that described affairs as escapes. That was the case of my XH. He escaped being a responsible husband and parent by hooking up with other women. Even if they had kids, they weren’t HIS kids, so he could keep having fun. I warned him that OW would become the new Meg after he lived with her for a while. Then he could find fault with her, blame her for his failures. After many OW’s he finally realized that “Wherever you go, there you are.” You can’t escape yourself. You carry with you your own distorted thinking and surprise! you still aren’t happy but can’t go back.

    • So true. It’s so sad they can’t see it in the moment, but so few of them have coping skills (as sephage says) and they lack the ability to be introspective. It’s always someone else’s fault and they are always the victim.

  • My soon to be SxW has done this many times. She’s dating a guy five years younger than me and is taking him on dates where I took her. The first time she told me when she was dropping off the kids. I think she thought it would hurt me, I found it sad, her trying to recreate the life we had with someone else. I wonder if she uses our pictures as dating ideas.

    Only thing that gets me angry is her trying to force these guys into my step daughters life. My wife at first told her she didn’t have to stay with me because “I wasn’t her real dad”. just the guy who raised her. My daughter absolutely lost at it when her mother said that. She knows I’m not her bio dad but in everything else I am. I guess the wife was saying this guy could be become her dad like I did. I’m amazed that I was so blinded to how crazy she is.

  • Because I moved and left soon to be X, he has refused to list the house and can’t afford to buy me out so God only knows who he’s been bringing there and into what was my bed. Well that just came to an abrupt end I believe, court was this morning at 10:30 and my lawyer told me not to go, that she would go on my behalf to represent me because she did’nt want him to see and try to intimidate me (she knows he’s a NARC). I haven’t heard from her yet but I just got an email from STBXH, all it said was “YOU WON”. So I’m trying to work right now and can hardly concentrate waiting to hear from my lawyer!!!!! I’ll let you know. 🙂

      • Here’s the email I just got from my lawyer (with personal info edited out).

        “I am very pleased to let you know that the Court has ordered that the property is to be listed with a realtor. We have two weeks to work out all the details with (STBXH name). If we cannot, we will bring it back to the same judge to make a decision on. I am hopeful, now that he knows it must be listed, he will be agreeable to the terms. I will get the full decision from the Court later today or early tomorrow and will send it to you at that time.”

        Thanks, and talk to you soon.

        Yeah!!!!! Finally that ass is controlling everything and me! 🙂 🙂 🙂

        • Congratulations Kate! I really empathize – I had to go back to court after the divorce to force X to pick a real estate agent to list our house (he was “too busy” or “out of town” or “thinking it over”). The day he did I had that sucker ready to list and it was sold before he had a chance to blink. Such a relief to have one less tie.

          Best of luck with the sale. It is hard, and I know it is a beautiful house, but you will be so much happier when it is sold. I’ll keep sending good thoughts your way!

          • That’s great Kate50! Looks like your cheater is up to his ass cheeks in problems now! After all, it’s hard to try to “chump” smart lawyers and forget about judges! It probably spoke volumes to the court that you were not present. Shows them that he is an uncooperative ass! Congrats!

        • I feel for you, Kate50. My X squatted in my house, paying no mortgage, and entertaining crazy AP there, for a whole year! Drove me kind of nuts, but I moved away just to save myself. The court order to sell the house he tried to manipulate, and stall, but when I told him my lawyer was going to charge contempt, he finally signed. I was never so appreciative of my lawyer, as that day, thank Goddess for her!

          • Thanks you guys, yes he told both my lawyer and I that he intended to live in the house till spring of 2016 and he even prepared an affidavit stating this, the court ruled against him thank God! I’m not waiting that long to start my life, I’m living in a small 2 bedroom apartment right now and working full time and he’s sitting on his ass in my dream home not working!!! And he’s the cheater, there is some justice finally. Hope it sells fast now, that’s the biggest asset we have.

  • My ex has become a teen in his eyes. He is drinking, smoking and doing drugs like he is in high school. the OW (late 30’s) is into all these things. After 22+ years of marriage, he has his childhood back.

    Only problem is he is in Mid 50’s and the bod doesn’t tolerate the abuse very well. Last time I saw him, his skin is drunk red, with lots of broken blood vessels. His family history has lots of cancer, smoking related disease. So I went on line and did the life projection – he will last a couple more years. Me, I have MS, Osteroporosis and am 61. So drinking till I am falling down drunk, never was my thing. Drink to the point I break my hip? That would be Stewpid.

    OW has two small children, which he has tried to parent in front of my son. Kid was freaked out. My son grossed out.

    Both my kids cannot and will not tolerate the OW. She is a tattooed, smoking slutty cheat who learned it in her core family. What an inheiritance to pass onto your kids. He is professional. Can you see something wrong with this picture?

    Their outings consists of something plus lots of alcohol. She is trading sex for alcohol.

    My divorce is in the que at the court house. Can’t wait for it to final. I am doing pretty well, some financial issues but nothing fatal. Health is better off without him. Never realized how much he stressed me out till he was gone.

    I am so much better off. I bought a house with proceeds from family home. He spent his on attys and the outcome was pretty much what I had asked for – after 2-1/2 years.

    So the ex isn’t trying to live our lives. He is doing the exact opposite to please OW. It will probably kill him, but I am okay with that. His choice. He should know better.

    My focus is on my health, my kids getting that good start in life and enjoying friends and family. Blessed in all areas.

    Call me grateful this set back became a step up. God is good.

    • nenebird-
      Same story here. The town drunk (my stbx) has a whole new set of friends….all 15-20 years younger than him. I have recently noticed the red broken blood vessels in his face as well. And EVERYTHING my stbx does revolves around alcohol. No cancer in his family, but that doesn’t mean he can’t start a trend :-). Addiction runs in his family however – grandpa died (58) of alcoholism and his brother died at the age of 24 from heroin addiction. His other brother is also an alcoholic. Good thing that whole entitlistic family has no issues (sarcasm). Right… guys (the whole fucking family) just keep telling yourselves that….. Funny how of stbx and his 3 brothers are divorced. They must have all been horrible wives – just like me.

      • Lady Strange, its sad to think someone chooses ruination instead of fighting for health and love. I do believe the addiction can be inheirited but I also know lots of folks fight for their sobriety because of those they love. My BIL is long time recovering alcoholic. It was a struggle. But he fights the fight every day and wins.

        If he ever gets sober, be prepared for him to contact you with regrets. Sad.

    • Nenebird –

      Your post makes me sad. You seem to be excitedly reveling in anticipation of your ex-husbands death. Those types of thoughts are poison to your soul. My mom was like you, and it defined her, and ultimately destroyed her life.

      It sounds like you are encouraging hostility and rejection between your kids and their father and his new wife too. Trust me, it may take a while but your deeds are going to blow up in your face. Karmas a $&@& as they say. if you aren’t careful, you’ll lose your kids too. They won’t bring your grandkids to a woman wishing death and discord on their father. I had no choice but to stop talking to my mom.

      It sounds like you need therapy, or a change of scenery. If you’re older, perhaps living in an active retirement community would be good for you. My mom, just now is doing better. But gosh, she wasted 20 years. It’s so sad.

      It’s time to reinvent yourself and move on from the past. Go get help, my friend. You need to let go.

  • I kicked my ex out and he moved into a studio where he bought the same ikea furniture, the same ikea bed, the same ikea chairs, and took two of our sofas. Selective cleansing. He’s still in the studio. Recently had the two kids for two weeks summer holidays in the studio. Idiot.

    • Thanks Lyn. I am trying to be always positive!!! I feel like I owe it to myself, my family and my friends who have supported me throughout all of this. Taking the high road, has its drawbacks. Son jokingly calls me a saint. So I run with it. When he texts me and asks what are you doing? “Polishing my halo, what else”

  • My OW wanted my life for sure, but she was so gullible that she believed him when he said he owned half the house, and would get half my assets if we split. Fortunately, I never married him, and most important, I had a formal rent agreement with him (even though he didn’t pay me anything, I made him sign one with the excuse I needed it for tax purposes). He wasn’t the brightest bulb on the string, and had never had any savings, so I guess I knew he was out of my league from the start.

    OW did, however, worm her way into his daily life. She worked with him. She was a snarky bitch, a whore (literally, she turned tricks on an online hookup site and charge for her services). She left her “fiance” for Ex, into whose sympathetic arms she fell…and the cake eating started big time for him. He had me supporting him, lived free in my house, and her on the side. When I finally discovered their treachery, I threw him out as soon as I had my plans in place.

    However, she admitted after D-day in a “victory lap” email to me that she had stayed over at my house when I was away on business, slept in my bed, wore my clothes and lingerie, used my bathroom, ate my food, took flowers from my garden, rode around in my car, watched my TV, used my laptop, and fucked my partner. She also took items from my house – which she sold on ebay.

    I used to think Ex was so helpful – he would wash the bedsheets, stock the fridge, prepare my meals (he was poisoning me it turned out), vacuum, and stupid me thought he was being nice! Then …one of their colleagues outed their affair (because they bragged about poisoning me) and I began my detective work. It sickened me to discover the proof, but that just made me angry.

    I told the police the details and showed them her nasty emails. This even got THEM angry and they doggedly pursued the happy couple and made sure I got everything back. EX and OW both lost their jobs over it -(using company email to send nasty messages). EX also got taken in for questioning and the cop laughed when he told me that Ex cried during the session.

    However, it still creeps me out to this day that a partner could possibly be so treacherous as to bring in their lover to stay in one’s house – and allow that person to think that ALL THIS would be theirs some day! My cheating EX was sent away with nothing, lost his job, and ended up living in a small one room apartment above a betting shop on a scummy street.

          • Here in the UK, I found myself dealing with the local cops who answered the original domestic call when Cheater threatened me with a knife – the day I threw him out (it was my house). They were super helpful in that they listened carefully to the situation, i was lucky -they recognised that I was showing signs of some sort of acute poisoning – one of them looked at my fingernails while we were talking and said to see my doctor right away. I guess from experience they never took domestic calls at face value. When they saw how vicious the OW was, they got quite protective of me.

            Once the evidence was gathered, they took it to the CPS (Crown Prosecution Service) for a decision as to whether there was enough proof to lay charges. Some numpty there made a quick decision that it was only circumstantial and that even though Cheater was an artist with ample access to poisonous materials, and that he was the cook, and that he was my life insurance beneficiart, and that he had plenty of motive (a mistress, he was penniless)… That they would not likely get a conviction.

            So, my only recourse was to take out a restraining order against both of them, since they lived locally and had nothing to lose in continuing to harass me. I spent £thousands on legal advice and fees to file, but succeeded in the end. The amlunt of work was stupid…but in the end, I got a document and they were served notice. I know Cheater is on the local database with a record because the cops did find stolen goods in his apartment.

            The original cops did in fact work Cheater over pretty effectively. They described him as slumped in his chair, weeping, and begging them not to tell his employer. Too bad they chose to interogate him at work and for that, had to see HR first. He did get fired. OW did not have to wade into any of it–she is a hugely disordered waste of space who to this day writes a sarcastic, cringeworthy blog. I see lately that their little love pact is derailing; she is now publicly criticising ex in her blog. The part about the one room lodgings – they had no money between them. I know their plan was to off me for the life insurance which was three times my annual salary.

            Once they figured out that popping a couple of spawn would get them government benefits and housing, they went ahead and reproduced. So sad that such people exist.

            • It did occur to me that Cheater’s previous partner might also have been a victim. He told me she died, and that he had spent their last days as her government-benefits-supported carer. I googled her, expecting to find an obit. Instead she is very much alive and has herself on dating sites.

              To cut a long story short, I contacted her, we met, we talked at length, and the story was so similar it was chilling. We figured I must have been the oblivious OW in her case! She too had suffered lead poisoning but was told it was probably from paint in her old house. However, she did say that after he left, she immediately began feeling better, and wrote the illness off to the stress of living with him.

              We are still in occasional touch – we both laugh at the present “OW” and her blogging. In my book, my OW was at least complicit in attempting to kill me, and was exceedingly cruel in her pursuit of what she thought would be a “takeover” of my life.

              At least neither of us ex’s had kids with him. We have, however, managed to get him fined and pursued for benefits fraud, for ebay shill bidding, for unpaid debts he had with her. He will be paying all that back for some time yet. In the meantime, OW’s parents (just as awful as her) are now having to help subsidise the gong show because there are grandchildren.

              Priceless: when the second wives club becomes an unexpected support group.

              • Yes – priceless!
                I am so sorry Marci. I wish they would have gotten more than the slap on the wrist. That’s too bad. Maybe if you and the courts would have known the ‘X before she died,’ there would have been a stronger case with a pattern of poisoning. Yes – sick people out there, that’s for sure. Too bad it takes good people a while to figure it out!

  • Ah the new life four years on after DDay! Divorced one year ago. The feeling is so sweet. Having found CN just last year gave me a whole language for what I felt and all those stages I went through. Funny cheater’s AP has dumped him and he’s not gloating like he was. I’ve moved on, become enlighten and yes the kids gravitate to me. Dad is too needy.

  • Yup, my ex is now on Life Version 2. I admitted it bugged me at first, but now I am at meh.
    OWife is a lot like me: same hair color, stature, similar education backgrounds, etc. She is 12 years younger than me. This is only important as ex gaslighted me into believing there was no affair 13 years before the final DDay.
    So to me, he rebooted his life to the moment when he cheated [the first time, it turns out], and wished he had left the marriage but was too cowardly to do the right thing. OWife is a younger version of me, and now they have one child, with another on the way. These children are same gender as my kids… so everything is the same order, etc.

    • I also think all the 3 OWs wanted my life. They are all academics but younger, haven´t finished their PHDs, they owe him recommendation letters, their jobs, dissertation advice, conferences (I owe him none of that, did it all on my own). They all came to our beautiful 1960s penthouse and loved to party here , a place which I found and remodeled so it would fit all our books. Cheater took 90% of the books but I kept the apartment(have to pay him half for it but I don´t care). He now lives in a rental, his books are in boxes because they don´t fit. He has very little time or money to treat the OW like he used to during our marriage, and even if he wanted to replicate our lives of travelling and academic -tourism, he can´t because she wouldn´t get a visa or speaks a word of English, or have enough money. I had a bad accident last week and wake-up call reminded me that if I die, he would be the legal guardian of our kids and probably move into our (my) apartment again and take care of it until the kids are adults and the property is fully their´s. I am going to find out if it is possible to leave the guardianship of my property to my sister, so that the OW doesn´t get to move in here with her daughter and my kids and try to live my life as she ambitioned.

      • I never thought about that… It might have been easier for them to cheat and sparkle when we were doing all the work at home. Now that they have their own appartment, there are chores to do, bills to pay, and going out to meet new pussy is not that much fun any longer…

  • Great Post Nord.
    You and I have the same timeline. I haven’t divorced yet or done property settlement but will give an update on my situation that may help new chumps.
    This site has been so helpful. There have been times that i have been reading and just have to stop as the comments jolt a memory.
    Where have the last 4 years gone. Sometimes it feels like yesterday but I think that could be because you are reminded of the shit sandwich everyday, especially when kids are involved.

    Well the ex and Chainsaw man purchased a house exactly 1km away (.6 mile). They bought a cousin of our Golden Retriever, they go walking down the same beach, go to the same restaurants, blah blah blah.
    They live in their little bubble.
    Our sons now 15 and 19 still only visit when chainsaw man is away on business. Coming up 4 years they refuse to and have never met him.
    She goes to their footy games by herself and school functions etc.
    Her fantasy of playing happy families is trashed. I doubt now if he (63) will ever be accepted by the boys.

    I have struggled with the whole thing and obviously changed forever. It is so traumatic, so bloody hard to understand the betrayal and the lies. How can someone live a double life and hurt the very people that are closest.
    And then comes the expectation, the entitlement, the lack of remorse, the pure ignorance.

    Would i like to live like they do-no thanks. We get married and have families because we believe we can together experience life-all its challenges and beauty and then when this cheating happens discover that your wife /husband was never on board-they were on Mars while we were on Earth.

    Of course the whole point in cheating is you never expect to get caught and they are dumb enough to think they won’t get caught. When you expose them like animals in the headlights they become raging bulls, and then they have nothing. They are cheaters labeled forever and anyone who knows they are cheaters is cautious around them.

    For me I am busy with the boys, my business and have a really good girlfriend.

    The boys play rep rugby league and its full on all year with training, Physio, massages, and all that goes with it. They both have heaps of friends who are always over at the house. We go to heaps of concerts. At home nothing is a problem, everyone chips in. There are no fights. We just get on.

    My girlfriend has never slept here when either of the boys has been here. She respects the boys and understands the complex family deal. She isn’t co dependant and is just a happy person. We go out when we can and everyone seems cool with it all including the boys. The boys spend heaps of time with her during diners , concerts etc.

    I am only really coming to terms of living a new life. It was such a shock that i just focussed on the responsibility of been there for the boys.

    The ex has been there for the boys but she’s made many mistakes including maintaining her relationship with Chainsaw man and him moving in without the boys input. Everything she has done says chainsaw man first- boys fit in around us.

    You feel that they have this wonderful life but really think about it chumps- All they are doing is keeping the false lie going. The consequences are huge in every aspect.

    I constantly have to encourage the boys to communicate and be with their mother. They love her but theres the big cloud of her selfishness has changed their lives forever.

    I would rather live an honest life. I would hate to carry that label of cheater. Its like a tattoo that can never be erased.

    To the new chumps live your life. its going to hurt like hell at times and its ok to cry-try to do it alone. Make your kids the priority
    Most cheaters are narcissist. you can’t beat them-just ignore them until they doubt their own existence.

  • I think cheater ex created an entirely new version. He is actually living sort of a complete opposite of how we lived. We lived well but we never lived beyond our means, and now he is. He is in debt and has gone through his share of the settlement, and also raided his retirement savings. He almost wants to prove to the world that he traded up. He now has a trophy wife (final OW in our marriage but I doubt will be the final OW in his lifetime), gorgeous home, goes on first class, expensive vacations and tanking financially in the process. Today, I found out he is on vacation and I felt a little bit of a pang of nostalgia since we went on vacation a lot. I then smiled when I reminded myself, “Do you honestly want to be with him on vacation?” The answer was a resounding “NO” because I remembered all those vacations when I was the marriage police – ensuring he didn’t call an OW, didn’t check out other women, that he was happy. Yuck. Who needs that when today I have peace and surrounded by people who truly love and value me. Toxicity begone!

    Nord, thank you for this great post. Funny how we have temporary insanity every now and then.

    • Ex and Chainsaw man have been away 11 times in 4 years. She took our then 13 year old away for 3 days and thats it. Just doesn’t want to play with our sons.
      I have paid for a number of times so the boys can take her out. I reckon she will regret later.

      She’s just living her life and fitting boys in around it and they wonder why they lose touch with their children. Others (like our family Doctor ) finally wake up ,leave the cheater and form a new relationship which includes the children.

  • Just to amuse myself I drafted a letter to deadHs APs offering them the burial spot next to him since I no longer want it. They wanted my life but they can take my spot in death.

    “If you get cremate and the cemetery folks use the space wisely, a number of you might fit..Im not sure if we should do a “first come, first served” or create some hierarchy.

    If we do a hierarchy, Im guessing that ‘soul mates’ should come first then ‘mystery women fucked at work’ and lastly ‘oh we’re such good work chums you surely wont mind if we have dinner together even though it will look oddly like a date’ folks. ”

    Actually the “spot” is above him…makes me wonder who liked being on top.

    • LOL, unicornomore. You should sell the “rights”. Might as well make money, and they can all rot together in hell.

    • Haha… Such a good point. At the same time, its reminds us that life is limited, that how we behave sticks with us unlike possessions, and shows what a fool they are. Love it. Cartoon material, actually.

  • My first D-day was January 1, 2010. I wish it was some ordinary date that I could forget – what better way to say – in the whole scheme of things – the ass just wasn’t that important. I could have forgotten an ordinary date, and that would have been the absolute pinnacle of indifference.

    He crosses my mind, but in a “how fucking dare you!!!” kind of way. Bittersweet, sad…..nope. Never happens.

    The moral of the story, is that there IS freedom on the other side of the misery and anguish. But it isn’t time that heals you, it’s distance.

  • V2.0 is an older SAHM. He moved in with her a month before our youngest was born. She/family bought their house. He continues overspending, creating the impression he is doing well. Blew though most of his divorce settlement from what I see. Seems to rely on her for the household bills and place to stay. He has been on Match, sex finder and Ashley Madison since they have been together so I suspect it’s only a matter of time before she is Chumped. At first I was pissed he sent her to pick up our baby without introducing her first. After seeing his bank records, I see he was at a hotel that day, not work as he told us. I figure I can ready the popcorn and watch what happens next!

    • Qwerty3.14,
      Ouch! I will take some popcorn and some Depakote for mood stabilization. You get a trophy for seeing (through) his lies. Who could make up this stuff?

  • Nord,
    This one put to words what my thoughts are. Wow, 20 years. You are a trooper. I am so sorry you went through that.
    It still hurts to imagine what power the dark side conquered with each betrayal. I think my heart sinks to my knees. One day, this passion that was born will have a purpose. I am certain.

  • Great post, Nord. I actually have no idea what my ex’s life looks like now, and I don’t care. I’ve cut him completely out of my life, NC on steroids. No FB, no email, no text, no phone, no Twitter, no mutual friends or relatives, nuttin’. If he fell off the face of the earth tomorrow (hey, a girl can dream, right?), I’d never know about it. Whether he is now or gets into a new relationship, I’m sure very little would change. People like that rarely do.

    The only Version 2.0 is gonna be what I make of MY life. I’m still figuring out what I want that to look like, but I’m enjoying the process. One that is for damn sure, it won’t include anybody who doesn’t in some way lift me toward my higher ground.

    • WOW FMT good for you! Do you have children together? I was hoping to do this as well but we have kids and so by cutting him out completely is hard. UNLESS I can get some good advice on how do that with the kids in the picture.

  • “Great post, Nord. I actually have no idea what my ex’s life looks like now, and I don’t care. I’ve cut him completely out of my life, NC on steroids. No FB, no email, no text, no phone, no Twitter, no mutual friends or relatives, nuttin’. If he fell off the face of the earth tomorrow (hey, a girl can dream, right?), I’d never know about it. Whether he is now or gets into a new relationship, I’m sure very little would change. People like that rarely do.”

    You said it way better than I ever could.

  • Great post Nord!

    I don’t think she is living “my” life, as she has practiced with 3 husbands before finally landing my former POS. He’s still a POS, he is just no longer mine thank God for favors large and small. In fact, a large part of her appeal is the lifestyle that she offered him – beachfront luxury condo, the ability to take early retirement and live off her with his pension while pursuing his dream of becoming a world-renowned artist. Well, he’s lost a large chunk of that pension to me and the world-renowned artist part hasn’t come to fruition – and I supported that dream for almost 30 years. Maybe now is his time. Just in case, I took a large chunk of the art work that he had completed that I felt was marketable and if he EVER becomes famous, I can sell it at an inflated price.

    When I was still marginally speaking to him, he would toss out information about their travels – he went several places with her that he had promised to take me and didn’t and he wanted me to know about it. That’s just the type of asshole that he is. The part of my life that she is living is the part where she can never be quite sure of him. She KNOWS he’s capable of cheating so quite of bit of her time is spent keeping tabs on him and being crazy and frantic when she can’t be where he is to keep an eye on him. A crazy, insecure narc is the very definition of psycho bitch. They may have many of the material trappings that make it appear they are living the life, but I would not trade my peace for the mindfuck that comes with living that life with him.

    Thanks for reminding me of that Nord.

  • Yup, from what I know, AP#1 wanted my life. She cheated with my ex for over 15 years before D-Day, sometimes sharing ex with her best friend as well (yuck, don’t ask). She also tried to flatter and groom my daughter through social media, direct contact, gifts, etc. On D-Day she finally got my life, at least part of it anyhow–> she now has my pathologically lying cheating ex who could never maintain success, had his 15 minutes of fame and peaked as a high school athlete, and who is a classic underachiever.

    Ex now lives in the expensive home SHE rents, has to hang around the people and friends SHE has (most of his abandoned ship after D-Day), and Ex still never makes enough money (because the consulting business he’s had since 2005 is still “just about to take off.” ). They married last month.

    They vacation in the same place in the Caribbean where ex and I used to regularly go. Our children refuse to see the ex nor did ex try hard to rebuild a relationship with them post D-Day, so now he ferries around AP’s children and nieces and nephews rather than his own. (This from a man who acted so frustrated with his own children that they assumed that he just could not stand them and that he felt trapped that he had them.)

    The man who raged the house wasn’t clean enough, who couldn’t stand the lacrosse sticks or school books creating a “mess,” who screamed in frustration about the dogs? The man who was usually too “sick” so we had to cut short our family trips? The man who never gave a straight answer and redirected every conversation to be about him? The man who drank rum and coke till he passed out? And who looked at so much porn morning noon and night, so that I actually believed his lame story that this was showing up in the computer history from “cookies”?

    There is one thing I know….THAT man is not gone, THAT man is still lurking below the surface.

    And he will be back, but he won’t be our problem anymore.

  • I have a modified version of this phenomenon. My ex had an affair with a woman who is essentially me, but sixteen years younger. So now they do all the things that we did sixteen years ago, before we were employed, mortgaged and childrenified. Even more frustrating than the whole having my family stolen by a younger woman thing is that she’s also managed to get him to do a lot of things he refused to do with me. I guess he’s more afraid to refuse her than he was chumpy ole me!

  • Wow. Thanks for the post because I thought I was the only person married 20yrs to such a complete ass. Like you, I did all of the planning and executing of activities as a couple and as a family. He then transferred a lot of the stuff onto the MOW. She weirdly cyber stalked me during their decade long fuck fest, unbeknownst to me,and jacked my style! Down to calling my house her dream!

    All of this was shocking to me initially. But not now. These freaks are unoriginal. After DDay, I told asshat I was never ever EVER going to do any of the things with him that he stole and gave to some married hag as their dream fantasy life. These were the things I sought out to do with him, family and couple traditions that I created etc… So I made new ones with me and the kids. You know what? That fucker has tried to take those too.

    These empty soulless creeps cannot think of things to do because they do not bond, attach or put any meaning or effort into their relationships. We chumps did all of that for them and the cheaters played at being normal humans. The best they can do is the repeat cycle of events and activities with their V2.0.

  • This stuff is blowing my mind!!! All cheaters literally follow the same freaking rule book I swear. I literally always planned everything. I loved finding out cute adventures and new places to check out. I always had suggestions. He was always like “whatever you wanna do :)”. Then after he cheated he said “We never did anything fun anymore”. YOU NEVER SUGGESTED ANYTHING. He also complained about everything I suggested. Everything was always catered to him “It’s too expensive there”, “The food there won’t fill me”, “That sounds stupid” etc etc… Once I made the suggestion to go to a nice restaurant and asked him if he could do the very strenuous task of making a reservation for us. He forgot. The place booked up then I was the one who had to call around trying to find us another restaurant to go to. These people actually suck. They are useless. Uninspiring. Lazy. Just wastes of space really.

    • Mine did exactly the same. But then, when his online “friend” visited from Moscow, he arranged EVERYTHING, the whole 2-week trip around our very touristic area, complete with hotels and visits.
      I believe they are able to do it but enjoy doing nothing and watching us struggle.

      • Ding Ding!! You are correct!
        I believe they are able to do it but enjoy doing nothing and watching us struggle.
        That is my marriage in a NUTshell. I got super-capable, though, from doing absolutely everything! I get a kick out of telling people I put a roof on our house, with the help of my 16 yr old son! The X spent that time watching the Three Stooges, no doubt.
        Yes, they enjoy very much doing nothing, being fragile, and of course, the understanding OW has a shoulder to cry on, because the mean spouse would like some participation, or help?
        I used to laugh so hard when X would say how filled with anxiety he was, and couldn’t even think about a JOB. I’d ask him how he had so much energy to go to endless OW parties, and street fairs, etc,etc with her? He sure had lots of time and energy for romancing her! I think he missed his calling as a professional Gigolo!

    • Daphne, I can relate to this!
      “He was always like “whatever you wanna do :)”. Then after he cheated he said “We never did anything fun anymore”. YOU NEVER SUGGESTED ANYTHING.”

  • Narcboy likes to lead a double life. Job is in this small, redneck mountain town and can’t get another one. He’d really like to live full time in a more chi chi place despite calling himself such a great outdoors person and environmentalist. The OWs I knew of were/are very different from me though we were all recruited from the same institution. We are all fit but they’re somewhat younger and more June Cleaverish, not outdoorsy at all, nor environmentally conscious at all as far as I know whereas I am a pretty strident enviro/outdoor athlete/farmer/writer along with the day job. They’re kinda lower level administrators, I’m faculty. I’ve a doctorate, they do not. Im pretty intellectual, they’re more fluffy, scattered. They couldn’t live my life if they’d wanted to. I always have owned my own homes myself so invading my domicile was never an option tho I really think Narky would like to live in my house, as he professed to love it, just not with me in it. Seems like he wanted a source of intellectual stimulation/attention/a peer while he was stuck here during the week and a fluffy June C to look up to him, wash his socks, while he hangs around chi chi land looking like a man about town. More fresh meat to recruit there too.

  • Like so many of you, I spent 16 years making the narc ex look good. I worked & went to grad school, then onto a good professional career. I cleaned, cooked, shopped, gardened, handled cards and gifts for everyone, entertained, paid bills, washed cars, hunted for a year for a home we could afford, fixed that home up for 12 years including designing and supervising two remodels, did the wash, bought his clothes, picked up the dry cleaning, planned every outing, attended faculty wife events, made every sacrifice. If anyone called Dr. Wonderful and asked for help, he delegated that to me. He bought me coasters for my birthday and bare root roses for Christmas. He attended my firm holiday parties, got stinking drunk and embarrassed me, called every day to see when I was coming home, entertained sluts in my home, let them wear my clothes, and promised them my perfect life.

    He finally got a taker. It didn’t last long as no sane person without any skin in the game would accept that mission while receiving little or nothing in return. What’s so astounding is how they are all alike. Taking for granted all they are given as if it is their birthright. Thinking their chump is so easily replaced. Circling back around thinking they can Hoover back what they tossed aside when it suits them.

    But of course, Dr. Wonderful recreated the vacations I planned. Continued our traditions with my stand in. He had nothing original to offer. Then he swirled down the toilet when there was no one to “do” for him.

    • Swirled down the toilet LOL! It is so true, and good to know most do this, take them where you went. I had a sneaking suspicion that my Cheater went to all the same places, etc. It really hurt me for a few years, but now I realize he is just as unoriginal as the rest. I think they get an extra buzz out of knowing they are even betraying even your memories. And aren’t they the naughty boy/girl! Disgusting.

  • Hi,sorry but I’ve had a bad day and I’m in need of support.Have tried to generate a new post but I’m being ‘buffer circled’ constantly.After14 months of trauma with the ex narc since D day and abandonement I initiated mediation with a lawyer to try and express my childrens feelings that they do not wish to spend time with his home wrecking old whore.i thought it was suppose to be
    Non bias and as I had initiated I felt I was supported.However she seemed to be totally spakled by my ex doctors flair and charm and instead of concentrating on the fact that he sees his kids very infrequently,bullies them,refuses to co parent ( no contact with school,dentals,phone calls etc etc) I was reprimanded for not telling my 12 and 8 year olds to ring there dad myself!!!. She made it appear that I as the poor parent.i have come away today feeling as bad as day one.i haven’t parental alienated,abandons my role,overlooked my responsibilities and I’m the one sent home with ‘homework’ to do.meanwhile he can see his kids who live 1 mile from him 4 times a month,never ring them,never ask about there welfare etc etc.feeling shit

    • So sorry, goodbye. If you know anything about these creatures, you know they are in for the win and they snow MCs, judges and everyone they can. Keeping to 4x a month is good for your kids. Eventually, they will figure it out. I think your homework should be a movie at home with popcorn for the kids.

  • Actually, watching my ex and his affair partner (or I think — it is hard to keep track of who he was sleeping with when) have our relationship 2.0 was both heartening and truly scary. My charming ex professed wild love for his new-found soul mate and treated him like a king but subjected him to physical abuse in private to the point where he was arrested for assault on him (why did I never get him arrested?) He cheated repeatedly on the partner he found who was everything I was not and was so much more stimulating & cool than me. . .and was then very sorry that his poor self esteem had led him down that path again. When the partner kicked him out for the 10th time and it didn’t look likely he would take him back again, ex decided that this man he loved more than life itself (and certainly more than his kids) was actually evil all along and the root of all his problems and he would never speak to him again. Sort of exactly like he used to adore me until I finally made him leave over his cheating. And of course it was my fault that he got himself mixed up with this man in the first place because he had been looking for someone “just like me” (who is horrible and evil). In his defense he managed to pack this all into 3 years rather than the 20 it took with me. . .the guy he was with really deserved the pain to be dragged out much longer. I have no doubt he is working on version 3.0 of our relationship right now (while doing numerous upgrades and patches on the side.) Not jealous of that at all.

  • I recently saw pictures of exH & schnoopie’s house on a well-known social media site, and I smiled.

    The main colour-scheme is $h!£ brown like we had (which I hated, but he insisted on having it).and it looks like they are stuck in the late 80’s because they still have a dado rail, and carpets that are a certain pattern that was fashionable in UK in that era. Ironically that was the time we divorced.
    They have a brown leather 3-piece suite the same design as we had. The doors are stripped pine so they don’t need ever painting ( she’s probably realised that his decorating takes years to complete) the whole place looks sombre and depressing.

    They have dogs the same breed as we had.

    Looking at the pictures made we wonder if I had stumbled into a time-warp !

    Now schnoopie must know that it’s all a reproduction of our place because he entertained her in our house when I was out at work, So either she doesn’t care or she’s trying to live my life. Either way it’s sad.

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