Dear Chump Lady, The “Other Woman” wrote me a letter…

meanOWDear Chump Lady,

I discovered this site while trying to make sense of my current dilemma. My husband and I have been together 3 years, married 5 months, and friends for about a year beforehand. We moved to another state shortly after getting married and had our first child 4 weeks ago.

I’m totally in love with my husband and I know how much he appreciates me. He had a bit of a reputation for being a lady killer before we started dating. He has put that behind him. Two weeks ago I received a letter by mail. It was sent by someone claiming to be the “other woman.” My husband denies any wrongdoing and thinks this is just a crazy ex who found out we moved.

I’m hoping that’s the case. Maybe it’s his last girlfriend, who always thought there was something going on between us, is possibly jealous that we are happy together? Or his former friends-with-benefits who claimed to have slept with him while he was with the last girlfriend, (which is why they broke up)? He hasn’t spoken to either of these women in 3 years.

Since reading this letter I have been very anxious and worried, even though I can’t imagine my best friend would betray me at such a happy time in our lives. Can you please help me make sense of this?

Ami

Here is the letter:

Hello ______. When I found out about you I knew I couldn’t walk away without reaching out to you first. I didn’t know what I would say. I could just tell you what your husband was up to, but I don’t buy that you could be living with a man and be clueless about his extramarital activities. I also find it hard to believe that you’re some kind of Stepford wife who turns the other cheek while her husband carries on with other girls. What is this, an episode of Mad Men?! You do live in [Chump]ville so it is possible, as the majority of the male population there cheat like it’s a competitive sport while collecting the military benefits that come with having a wife.

If either scenario is true, I have little sympathy as I feel being a doormat is a choice. However there may be one other option I haven’t mentioned.

I pondered this for a while and I have a theory. This is what I came up with: Maybe you’re really a feminist hero! You’re taking one for the greater good of woman kind. Standing at the front lines trying to keep _______ off the streets and away from all the women he could possibly infect with his venom. Unfortunately he must have slithered out of your sights the night he met me. I’m not the only victim he’s made while with you (the Internet is an efficient tool for tools like him), but I know you try your best. Nobody bats a thousand.

One suggestion though, maybe try harder to keep him away from teenage girls. They aren’t smart enough to see his bullshit for what it is, I guess that’s the appeal. The Snap Chat generation is ill equipped for such a predator. That was a particularly disturbing find. Is Monster High a major part of their role playing?

While realizing I was the other woman amongst a sea of jail bait, wasn’t pleasant, at least I could get up and dust myself off. You however have sacrificed yourself to the cause, giving the rest of us a chance to run the other way when he returns home to you. You must have a truly altruistic spirit, and for this reason I would like to pay homage to you. I want to thank you so much for your martyrdom. I can’t imagine the anxiety that must come with that job. The rest of us are grateful that we don’t have to live with it.

As for _______ himself, he has no idea I found out. I won’t return his attempts to contact me but he doesn’t know why. He probably has my number saved as a male friend’s or has a second phone. He told me he wasn’t on Facebook but I found him and that’s how I learned about you. Guys are so dumb. I almost fell off my chair when I found out that he didn’t just have a girlfriend, but a WIFE and BABY! He lied about practically everything else too. Go figure.

I have no interest in furthering communication with you which is why I wrote this letter anonymously. I’m not trying to hold your hand in solidarity here. We aren’t a sisterhood of wronged women. I’m also not apologizing for things that he’s solely at fault for. He’s the only one who should be cross examined, but I guess I could be a little more forthcoming with details. TMI maybe. We’ve had sex in his black Silverado truck a couple times (my place too), he likes to be dominant in bed, he calls me Turbo a lot (I don’t know why), I have had to push condoms on him otherwise he won’t use them, he comes on strong when he wants something, then disappears, his dad left at a young age, I may have seen a tin of chewing tobacco in his truck but I’m not sure, he has tattoos, a scar on the back of his left shoulder area, he likes to run, used to live in _____, he thinks he looks like Ashton Kutcher? Oh, and turns out he’s married, with a kid!!! He’s not going to tell you who I am or how to contact me because he’s going to deny it all, that’s what liars do.

I figured I’d give you a heads up and a chance to deal with him however you see fit. Unfortunately I think I know how that will turn out as this is not his first offense nor will it be his last, and women are so quick to “forgive”. I know my tone has been condescending and mean-spirited, but that’s because I’m pissed. I was lied to and the kicker is he will likely not be held accountable at all. Maybe this will inspire you to pull your head out of the sand, but I truly doubt it. Guys like this get away with this kind of shit all the time because they marry pushovers. I don’t feel sorry for you, I feel sorry for the other women he lies too while you enable him. He may be good in bed but he’s not worth my pride.

By the way, kids learn from watching their parents. A woman should command and deserves respect, teach them that! If by some chance you don’t already know, get a PI to find out what he’s up too. Most importantly get your ducks in a row. This guy is gonna fuck you over big one day, that’s just a matter of time. Prepare yourself for the blow and come out swinging when it happens. Your husband is a textbook narcissist. Maybe after you confront him he’ll at least put some effort into acting like he’s trying to change, but you’d be wise to get your shit together before it hits the fan and come up with an exit strategy (start hiding some money and consult a lawyer!). Good luck.

XOXO
Formerly, The Other Woman
(One of them)

Dear Ami,

Well, she sure sounds like an OW — condescending, scorned, and… detailed.

But before I get into my advice to you, Ami, I’d like to give a shout out to that special snowflake, “Formerly, The Other Woman” there.

I almost fell off my chair when I found out that he didn’t just have a girlfriend, but a WIFE and BABY! He lied about practically everything else too.

You don’t say.

Gosh, “Turbo,” I don’t buy that you could be screwing a man and be clueless about his marital activities. I also believe that you’re the kind of girlfriend who turns the other cheek while her guy carries on with other women. I mean, surely you KNEW he was a douchebag all those time you did it in his Silverado truck. And your place? Did he tell you he was homeless?

And he comes on strong and then disappears? Yeah, we’re all just SHOCKED that this man is a cheater.

Come on, Turbo. Surely You Must’ve Known!

He was a good liar? Made you pretty promises? Had excuses that were somewhat plausible, until they weren’t?

Yet you find it perfectly understandable how YOU could be duped, but a woman with much more invested, and many more reasons to believe — like a marriage and a newborn — you fail to understand how SHE didn’t know? Fuck you, Turbo. You accuse Ami of being a knowing “martyr,” but then you feel compelled to TELL her? Why?

Because she’s a guided human missile directed at her husbandthe person you really want to hurt. So you hate on Ami, the innocent chump, for being the competitor who won the turd.

Guys like this get away with this kind of shit all the time because they marry pushovers. 

Guys like this get away with this kind of shit all the time because they cheat with losers like you, Turbo. Maybe you didn’t know, but I think you probably did, because if you were truly chumped, there is absolutely no reason to be so hateful to a fellow chump.

But if you’re an OW? There is every reason to try and blow up Cheater’s world when you aren’t getting what you want.

Now then, to you, Ami — you asked my opinion and my opinion is, yes, this nut is one of your husband’s affair partners. (If it walks like a fuck, and quacks like a fuck…)

I’m really sorry. The truth can often be utterly vile and presented in the most abrasive and hurtful of ways — but it’s still the truth. And it doesn’t make that bitch’s advice bad advice either (however self-servingly given) — protect yourself.

A couple questions for you Ami — your husband had a reputation as a “lady killer”?

His last girlfriend, who always thought there was something going on between us…

Was there? Because you were a “friend” who wound up his wife? Any overlap on that? Any chance you were the OW girlfriend once?

Anyway, I doubt it’s someone from four years ago. Sounds pretty recent to me, if she’d never thought to look up his Facebook before.

It doesn’t really matter which ex-girlfriend or OW it is, what matters is that you have knowledge. You could demand transparency, (and if he’s innocent, he should be at pains to give you every cell record he ever had and do anything to prove to you it’s not true…. something is telling me he’s blowing her off as a scorned girlfriend and is being very pissy.) But cheaters usually go underground, so you are going to have to snoop.

I can’t tell you for certain if he’s guilty (and we always want to presume innocence with the people we love), but here’s something to look for — the mindfuck channel. When you bring this up, if he flips between charm (I’d never hurt you, Baby!), rage (WE’VE ALREADY DISCUSSED IT! LET IT GO!), and self-pity (I can’t believe you don’t believe me! Everyone is always trying to malign me! This is so painful, quit bringing it up!) — you have a cheater.

An innocent person would be compassionate — it would hurt him to see you so hurt. And he would do anything, anything at all to reassure and comfort you.

Something tells me you’ve got the former and not the latter. I’m glad you found us. I’m sure Chump Nation can weigh in with its own advice on what to do. Big hugs to you, Ami.

 

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kar marie
kar marie
8 years ago

Listen to Tracy, Ami, run!!!!!!

startofsomethingood
startofsomethingood
8 years ago
Reply to  kar marie

Second this!

Deloris
Deloris
8 years ago

Third this!

Anita
Anita
8 years ago

I don’t know if he’s actually a cheater or not yet, so I would give him the benefit of the doubt. These ex gf whores can be really vengeful , especially if they were dumped by a guy. The things she says are very generic, like the truck, or things she might have learned about him in the past. So just lay low and keep your eyes and ears open.

yo
yo
8 years ago
Reply to  Anita

Dont accuse him until you have concrete undeniable proof. Some people on here have excellent ideas on how to find evidence. Keep all the evidence in a secret place. Start putting money aside now. As much as you can get your hands on. Dont feel guilty about it. Protect yourself from stds. Pretend to have vaginitis which is aggravated by male secretions. You need to use condoms while you “heal” from this ” condition”. Good luck to you.

KarenE
KarenE
8 years ago
Reply to  Anita

Trust … but verify! Especially with that previous rep as a ‘lady killer’, and the pick-me dance w/his girlfriend and his friend.

Stayin Strong
Stayin Strong
8 years ago

I’m sorry that you are going through this right after the birth of your child. That is a tough enough time in your life without having to deal with all of this. I found my cheating ex husband’s online dating profile several weeks after my daughter was born. Either I was too tired to care or I desperately wanted to believe that “his friends put it on as a joke”. (Upon reflection that is my first recognized moment as a chump). Years later I can clearly see all of the lies that he told me that I wanted to believe.

Do your research now. Check the cell phone bills, charge cards, large money withdraws. When he says he is going out see if he really goes where he says he will be. If you can’t afford a PI find a friend who will check what he is doing. If he has an iphone, use Find My Phone to check where he is. Because without the proof, he will lie straight to your face and you will want to believe him. Don’t waste years. You can never love someone enough to turn them into a loving, caring person. If that worked this site wouldn’t exist. All of us Chumps would have loved them into good people.

TrustingGod
TrustingGod
8 years ago
Reply to  Stayin Strong

Fair warning–investigation may lead to to some things that will utterly disgust you (seeing only some of my husband’s comments and how many profiles he had on hook-up sites certainly repelled me. You will need to make sure you have a truly caring and supportive person around you since you have a baby to take care of, who will not understand why you can’t cope because nightmares wake you up every night, or how much anger might build up when you discover just how chumped you’ve been, and how little you really know the person you’re married to. It’s really hard to deal with the knowledge of having a cheating husband when you were pregnant, especially if the pregnancy was difficult and the husband wasn’t very supportive because he was spending all of his spare time trying to hook up with other women or sexting them.

mgirontree
mgirontree
8 years ago
Reply to  Stayin Strong

StayingStrong, I love THIS. “You can never love someone enough to turn them into a loving, caring person.”

Drew
Drew
8 years ago
Reply to  Stayin Strong

Staying Strong, THIS, “You can never love someone enough to turn them into a loving, caring person.”

April
April
8 years ago

Yes, Ami! Run! I got a similar letter out of the blue from the OW after 20 years of, what I thought was, a happy marriage. I confronted my husband and he denied it. He even got the other woman to lie to me and tell me she didn’t send it. That someone who was stalking her had sent it to me to mess with her (she was never clear why it would have involved my husband and me). Anyway, long story short, I snooped and found out the truth, got my ducks in a row and am waiting for the judge to sign my divorce papers any day now.
Run from that stupid f$cker!

SeeTheLight
SeeTheLight
8 years ago

“By the way, kids learn from watching their parents. A woman should command and deserves respect, teach them that! If by some chance you don’t already know, get a PI to find out what he’s up too. Most importantly get your ducks in a row. This guy is gonna fuck you over big one day, that’s just a matter of time. Prepare yourself for the blow and come out swinging when it happens. Your husband is a textbook narcissist…….come up with an exit strategy (start hiding some money and consult a lawyer!)”
Does the OW read Chumplady? Kinda creepy.

dani
dani
8 years ago
Reply to  SeeTheLight

That is EXACTLY what I thought when I read this.

divorceat25
divorceat25
8 years ago
Reply to  SeeTheLight

Definitely had a strong CL vibe towards the end.

ItsAJourney
ItsAJourney
8 years ago
Reply to  divorceat25

Agreed. Very creepy, but kinda gratifying to know that cheaters read CL too!

Kelli
Kelli
8 years ago

The advice to get a private investigator is good. I would suggest a gps tracking device on the truck to start. That will tell you what he is up to. Then, if you need more information, you can upgrade to actually having the PI follow him, take pictures, etc.

I agree with CL. This is definitely another woman. And the accusation of statutory rape is scary.

Definitely keep everything business as usual. Don’t tip him off. You will get your answers.

If you just had a baby 4 weeks ago, request a std screen at your 6 week check up with your OB. Embarrassing, yes. But not as unpleasant as learning 2 years later the jackass you married gave you cervical cancer. Been there, done that.

moda
moda
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

I’d be really tempted to develop some symptoms – say pelvic cramping – and get an appointment ASAP. Then fully divulge everything to your OB/GYN, get the STD testing done, and tell her that you want to use the visit as an excuse for no sexual contact for another six weeks. You have a perfect opportunity here, why not use it? Not many of us get an opportunity like that for ceasing sexual contact. But if the dood is possibly screwing around with half the high school cheer squad, you don’t need that dick at all.
Of course, the next stop is at your attorney. Follow Tracy’s advice on all of that. Don’t tell the dood. You owe him no explanation. Read everything on this site!
I’m really so sorry you’re having to go through all of this. Ami might be a hot mess, but this letter could have saved your life.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Yes! My PI sold me a GPS tracker. Saves alot of time & money in their fees. They can come in & confirm/document once the tracker shows them at a suspicious location.

Carmella1722
Carmella1722
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Be careful about putting a gps device on his truck. A lot of states have made them illegal.

Bye Bye Asshat
Bye Bye Asshat
8 years ago
Reply to  Carmella1722

As told to me by my PI, they are not illegal if your name is on the title.

Loridachump
Loridachump
8 years ago
Reply to  Bye Bye Asshat

Cheaper to just use an iPad turn off the sound and leave it in the truck. Then just use another apple device and turn in find my iPad….instant gps. You have to put wifi on it for about 49 bucks a month though. It took one day for me to find my ex coming out of ow house at 2:30 in the morn.

Movingon@51
Movingon@51
8 years ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Thanks for sticking it to the author of that letter Chump Lady! My blood was boiling reading it! Yes, we all agree here that it’s important to tell the chump of a cheater, however that was a most sickening, nasty, condescending way to go about it. What a pathetic excuse for a human being! There was no empathy or compassion for the chump at all… Just self- serving revenge for the author! Just more of the same victim bashing we all seem to get in addition to the devastation.

Tracy
Tracy
8 years ago

I think Tracy is right…. Ami says herself he was a lady’s man…and the old girlfriend thought there was something between them. But now she is married, new Mom and moved away….the dynamics have changed. She is where many of us were…. stuck and doubting…and fearful she is now tied to this guy with her child.
Me….I’d take the OW advice. I’d get my ducks lined up. OW gave details…. enough to make me think she knew him somehow…some type of way.
You know that you know….but you don’t want to know…so you ignore what deep down you know….
We all have done it. It’s how we were chumped. Red flags flying high…we decided they were rainbow colored with unicorns on them…with glitter…and ribbon tails blowing in the wind.
Ami….listen to your gut. Get evidence. Get your finances lined up….document…..go see a lawyer.

Lucky
Lucky
8 years ago

Well, his track record isn’t good. You just need to look at his past to see who he is.
People very seldom change.

She is a nutter, but I think you should not discount that there may be some truth to what she says.

I would not let your husband know about the letter. Keep it hidden and start to snoop. Do NOT let him know anything has changed between you, because he will hide, lie and deny it all. In fact, these guys can get abussive when confronted.

I think if you can dig up some cash, hire a PI.

Also, start stashing cash. Take out extra money when you grocery shop. Find a safe place or ask a friend to hold on to it. Start creating a safety net for you and your child.

I thought I was special too. He wouldn’t do that to ME. Or our children. I just couldn’t wrap my brain around what my gut was screaming at me for years.

You are not alone. We have all been where you are at one point.

I also think you should have a safe place lined up to go or a friend on speed dial for when his mask slips off. Which it will when he realizes that you aren’t as naive as he wants you to be.

Just be careful of this guy.

unicornomore
unicornomore
8 years ago
Reply to  Lucky

Lucky’s advise is dead on right…the OW is nuts and vindictive but that doesn’t mean she isn’t telling the truth.

I wish that someone had tipped me off way back when because I respectfully disagree with Tracy that we all saw red flags…I really didn’t.

I will admit that Im very trusting and gullible (I actually work with the dying – a field where kindness and truthfulness and transparency and being very real are helpful traits – also traits that make a good chump) but nowdeadhusband covered his tracks VERY well and was a MUCH better liar than I could have ever guessed.

Apparently he hid casual flings for years but “falling in lurve” making his side fuck a Schmoopie was what precipitated his meltdown that got me onto him – but even then, he held fast onto some of his lies until he died and I found the truth later.

Some of his behaviors that were “classic cheater” were things that I didn’t recognize until much much later…I didnt think the red flags were rainbows, I really didnt see them at all.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Just as there were no rainbows I was never a princess. The amount of finess these cheaters learn over time as we continue to love them is what they do. And we HAVE invested our lives and thought they loved their children. After three months of therapy I had to stop saying. I can’t believe he…..
My therapist said I could stop gathering evidence. It took years to see him, years. Once that mask dropped I finally saw everything clearly.
Moving forward I know the subtle tactics and red flags. They were always there yet narcs give just that little thing intermittently that sways you back into thinking, he really does love me.

FreeWoman
FreeWoman
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

Donna, I am curious what those are. You sound like you learned a lot, could you share what the subtle tactics were? I am still shell-shocked from X, and what he did for so long, I really think I still have PTSD. I am also in a new relationship, which is going pretty well, but I def have trust issues. Anyway, thanks if you see this, and can share!

KarenE
KarenE
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Unicornnomore, it’s not Tracey saying there are red flags we knew about, it’s the OW, then Tracey being sarcastic about that. Everybody here agrees, I think, that some cheaters are super good at hiding what they do, and who they are.

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  KarenE

Mine was, stupid me, he NEVER came home late or disappeared so I never suspected any extra curricular activities. He is a tile setter by trade and works in the homes of fairly wealthy people, often the women don’t work or work at home….in hindsight I’m sure he was getting it from a few of them here and there. Working for himself, I’m sure he had no problems slipping away here and there as well to meet up with whomever and whenever during the day. Pretty sure “married” AP’s was his thing, he had nothing else to offer so it’s not like they were going to blow his or their own cover and screw up their own lives. Assholes, all of them!

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I agree, OW (or girl?) is a condescending and presumptuous bitch but that doesn’t mean she is lying. I only WISH someone had done me this favor, I would not have been so trusting of him had I been warned.

Assuming that Ami “knows” and being so cruel is pretty uncalled for so it could (not saying IS) be a vindictive ex. If it is…she’s good. When we love, we trust. Unless we have reason to be suspicious we don’t typically play detective. Ami now has a reason. Do NOT take his word for anything! HE WILL LIE!!

I know there were red flags with X-hole, they were outshined and masked by his alcoholism. I got pregnant IMMEDIATELY and it was already too late for me.

I still chumpily had hope and loved him with everything in me….until the mask came off completely. I never knew him at all. “Unsettling” doesn’t begin to describe it adequately.

Marci
Marci
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Unicornnomore,
That must very hard to find things out after they are gone. My Dad was a cheater, but we didn’t find the extent of it until he died too. My grown son (27) was the one to take his laptop and decommission it – he destroyed the incriminating files then told my husband the gist of what he had discovered. We decided to let the dead rest in peace of course, but it has forever tainted my memories.

I’m sure my son didn’t reveal the half of it, glad he didn’t, but I hope such an experience didn’t mess up his head.

Why does life experience make us so wise so late in life? I really trust no one except myself any more.

Strad
Strad
8 years ago

Don’t confront him with suspicions– he will deny it for sure even if he’s guilty. Confront him with FACTS if and when you have absolute proof of his infidelity. That way you know for sure he’s a liar. My exCheater and his married girlfriend were texting each other constantly, and I took screen shots of his phone while he was in the shower or out jogging. He still denied the affair but at least I knew the truth, and I had proof.

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  Strad

Strad is absolutely right, do NOT confront with “suspicions” as they will deny, these people are not capable of remorse or honesty. You must find proof that he is….or proof that he isn’t. Worst thing I ever did was “drop the ball” the first time I suspected he had cheated on an out of town trip. Could have saved myself a whole lot of money, time, heartache and bullshit.

I did the same thing Strad, found X-holes super secret cell phone hidden in his truck, spent 2 hours screen shotting their text messages. Offered them, and any e-mail and other accounts I had found to OW’s hubby in case he needed them for his divorce.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  NCStevie

This is so true. Kept quiet about panties, but I kept them. And quiet about phone records. Saw this week in his phone records that he has been talking to an STD clinic, and he is super hypochondriac about a cold I had last week…so now I am off to the doctor to find out what his rotting cock gave me the last time he could actually perform (I’m not a hooker so I’m not his type I guess) I really need to keep up the ‘I’m tired’ routine and beg off sex until he has a fucking job so I can kick him to the curb already. And I somehow have to tell my parents not to give me a load of my grandpas estate this Christmas. Keep it too I’m free. I’m so done. I’m so glad I started coming here and just started watching and realized what I should do before I was privy to what was going on. I am not wasting another year with this asshole. Get a job and get out . Dickbag.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago

Thanks you guys- I learn so much just hanging out here! And I’m in canada, so sometimes it’s valid and other times I just have to use mr Google and save my questions for the consultation with a lawyer when it’s time. This would be my moms inheritance and she would be gifting it- and frankly I just don’t want new money to mix with the old- I want to leave this shit box and move on and then maybe have a nice nifty nest egg to start fresh with- or pay my lawyer with. But no soup for asshole. He does have a job but he just finished his degree, and he’s still working retail instead of as a nurse. He worked while I finished school and then we switched, but I was employed for more than Cheetos right after I finished. GET OFF YOUR ASS!

chumpittychumpcump
chumpittychumpcump
8 years ago

Why the hell are you waiting for him to get a job before booting his sorry ass??? To make it EASIER for him?? So he can set himself up better?? Fuck that, it aint your problem. kick his ass to the curb now, he can find some cardboard and sleep under a bridge. Dont keep fronting him-get him OUT!

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago

There’s a mixed bag of why I am waiting. I have no extra money, I am the bread winner and I am barely above water. If we live in this sharada a few months and I pay down some debt so I can get a retainer for a lawyer together- and he actually contributed to that, it’s worth it. I also make 4 times what he does- It’s a support issue- I am not booting him until he has a (better) job so that we are equitable in pay- so that I’m not going to need to support him, as he is accustomed… He only graduated from a program in November. He could really screw me if he continued in his education immediately and move forward with additional credentials, that has always been the plan after working for a year or two. If he was booted from our house and he had no net, he would be able to hold me accountable for his lifestyle, I kicked him out while he’s dependant on me blah blah blah. I would rather pretend to swoon and adore his lying ass for a few months and then calmly make his exit the only option, while we both have the means to be responsible for our own goddamn shit. These are my ducks. I have every Friday in December off to see lawyers and doctors and figure out my real plan, photocopy everything and get my house ready for one of us to move. He is insatiably vain, totally useless and lazy around the house, completely secure in our relationship and nauseatingly loving. He thinks he is in love with me- I get great gifts and great call outs on Facebook about being an amazing wife. If he wasn’t a cheating shithead I would have the best husband/ pet rock. Waiting isn’t trouble for me. I also am super at keeping my shit together so this is an Oscar worthy 6 month performance to make sure that when it’s over, it’s over. Quick. Smart. Done.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago

Yup–inheritances typically don’t count as community property (just keep good records).

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago

Check with a local estate attorney’s office… in many states, inheritances are separate from marital assets unless you co-mingle them into joint use.

AllOutofKibble
AllOutofKibble
8 years ago

hey baby, you know what’s sexy?
full time employment!
you know what’s even sexier now that you have a job?
you out of my life!
Good job in the preparations are creativerational

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago
Reply to  NCStevie

That is really good advice. I would have killed to have hard evidence. Instead, I just had suspicions for years, but dismissed them as my own insecurities! It wasn’t until I finally found irrefutable evidence and confronted him with it, that I was able to witness him lie. He told me I didn’t understand what I read. It was amazing! Even then I was tempted to believe him, after I’d read the evidence in black and white. When you’re desperate to keep your family together and stop your world from falling apart it can be hard to face the truth.

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  Lyn

“He told me I didn’t understand what I read.”

^^^ Yep, heard this bullshit too, and….”you wouldn’t understand, you just always want to think bad of me.”

WTFE….they believe their own lies.

Trudy
Trudy
8 years ago
Reply to  NCStevie

“it is so painful for me that you make me sound like a monster. “You always think I am a horrible person” and the classic “you wouldn’t understand, you always want to think bad of me”.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Trudy

Got stuff along the same lines from mine. It turns out it is a classic “it is not what I did but how you react to it” cluster B reaction (https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-personality-disorders-cluster-b/)…

This is why CL and CN is so important, it is a unique place for chumps to validate that they have been/are being mindfucked by a disordered person. And find out about Cluster B Kryptonite, aka No Contact, or Gray Rock if you have children with a Cluster B (http://narcissistsupport.com/going-gray-rock/).

Roberta
Roberta
8 years ago

Unfortunately, there is more here than meets the eye. Go stealth, do your detective work and get prepared! PI’s can be expensive, but if he has an iPhone and he is on Facebook then use that to your advantage….activate the “find my phone” app and then go to his Facebook and upgrade to the “Find friends” app! It will tell you exactly where he is if his phone is on him and turned on! Much cheaper than a PI! Using technology has worked so well for cheaters, but it can work well for chumps too!
It’s beyond terrible that this is happening to you during a time in your life and marriage when you should be so happy, what with a newborn and all, but it never hurts to be a bit on guard! One of my biggest mistakes in my marriage was trusting my husband too damn much! And he took full advantage of that and me! Trust is good, but blind trust is deadly to a marriage!
Take good care of yourself and your baby and do your “detective” work! Best of luck to you!

Divorce Minister
Divorce Minister
8 years ago

Too many red flags. Keep your eyes open as CL suggested. Doesn’t look good, though. He moght be innocent but those chances look slim from whatbwas shared. How do you know he has turned “Lady Killer” off?

TheClip
TheClip
8 years ago

Ami…. Where there is smoke there is a cheater with his pants around his ankles… Liar , Liar pants on fire!
You will receive plenty of solid advice here… Use it.

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  TheClip

“Where there is smoke there is a cheater with his pants around his ankles…”

^^^ Clip, you always keep me laughing. So true.

Get Out Yo Seat and Chump Around
Get Out Yo Seat and Chump Around
8 years ago

He calls you Turbo a lot and you can’t figure out why? Maybe because you’re not the only OW so he’s come up with a special nickname for all of you, since letting the wrong name slip out could cost him some kibbles. Could that be it, Turbo?

Idiot.

This Chump medicated for your protection
This Chump medicated for your protection
8 years ago

LOL,
A turbo is a blower.
Maybe his nickname for the girls matches their talent.
Turbo
Cowgirl
Princess
Etc

ChutesandLadders
ChutesandLadders
8 years ago

Oh, thank you Get Out and This Chump! I’m howling at the nickname, “Turbo!”
Because you blow him, dummy! That sucks! Bwhahahahahahahahahaha…

UnsinkableMollyXinAlabama
UnsinkableMollyXinAlabama
8 years ago

That’s where my mind went too C & L!!!!!!! Hahahahahahahaaaaa

Lothos
Lothos
8 years ago

Its hard to say if he is a cheater or not. I’ve seen this before where an X is not happy the person moved on and is living a happy life so they make up a story to try and destroy it or cause problems. Unless there are some signs to prove it I would have to say give him the benefit of the doubt that it never happened.

Lothos
Lothos
8 years ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Yes, but even if he is a lady killer he was a lady killer when he was single. There are many people who have the time of their life when they are single and there are not enough toes and fingers to count how many people they have been with but when they finally settle down it is for real. My problem is that in her letter there is just no proof.

I would suggest maybe doing a passive check, look at the current phone records and bills to see if anything out of the ordinary sticks out. Also is her husband having weird reasons to not be home like working late etc… if everything seems normal and he is not doing anything out of the ordinary and there are no signs other than this Anonymous letter well that’s not really anything to go on.

With my X there were tons of signs but I just chose not to believe them. Disappearing acts, schedule changes, expenses on her end going up and phone calls through the roof that burn through our roll over minutes (when Cingular existed). People who cheat are not the brightest in the world and usually let their ego get the best of them and start making mistakes.

Lothos
Lothos
8 years ago
Reply to  Lothos

Wow, some incredible stories. I guess I was lucky that my X was not that smart to pull off such a stealth mode as some of you have reported.

The shower, comment, hmm never thought about that one but it makes complete sense.

Maybe there is some credibility to the letter but I just feel you need a little more proof before jumping to conclusions.

Kristen
Kristen
8 years ago
Reply to  Lothos

Lothos,

My cheater was home for dinner every night right on time. He was careful to call OWhore from a phone other than the one I could check, and sent her email only from his work account, which I could not access. He f*d her during work hours, on business trips, before or after Saturday errands, and whenever he thought he wouldn’t get caught. Just because things SEEM normal, doesn’t mean they are!!

BurntCake
BurntCake
8 years ago
Reply to  Kristen

^ mine was the same. Work phone, work email and work fuck time. There were very few red flags.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Lothos

My X was highly intelligent & practiced at deception, and rarely slipped up. It was mainly in retrospect I could see he made a few minor errors (but with so little information I didn’t connect the dots). Some of these MFers are good. I wish I’d had a letter from an OW to kick mine to the curb sooner.

Dragon Lady
Dragon Lady
8 years ago
Reply to  Lothos

Then there are those that are super stealthy and everything is normal. And I mean Great normal, which makes it all the more sucky. Because it was just a fantasy all round.
Like my STBX.

STBX should have been an actor or politician seriously. Had us all including his family all chumped. Romantic dinners for us, sexting me, great sex, telling me how much he loved me, fussing, no change in work or travel, holidays, called me all the time even while with OW which upset her terribly, poor Smoochie!! No credit card or debit card trails as he used cash, ran it through our business. I didn’t see those accounts!! I do now and have tight control till it’s sold and gone. Everything was done at a distance. He didn’t dig his “ShitHouse” close to home.

The only thing that was different is he showered more then he ever had and at odd hours, for about 6 months before I found out. I used to tease him about it. If I’d googled I would have seen that it’s at the top of the list for signs to look for in a cheater!!

He got busted by an acquaintance who saw him and Schmoopie together at a charity event shingding in the city. Which I knew about but couldn’t attend due to a sick child. He called her in as a replacement, she was sooooo excited. It might have meant things were going her way. Hahaha the laugh is, being a narc he couldn’t stand being along and needed his nightly dose of Kibbles!!

The friend let me know. He said the OW was all over STBX and he was drinking like a fish. Which is why the STBX didn’t even see the friend. Lucky me or I could have gone another 23 years of “Abuse” (that’s what I consider Adultry) with no clue at all. Then I went stealth got all the evidence and confronted. First thing out of his mouth, “It didn’t mean anything, She didn’t mean anything”!! All over Red Rover!!!!!

And while he was still in “I can salvage this Mode”, I made sure I got all Records evidence I could, pretending reconciliation. So I have a pretty picture of how it really was for the last 7-8 years at least. Technology wasn’t that advanced further back then that.

Now on to the future and bigger and better things.

Oh on a side note, there were several OW at different levels who he had been grooming or which for various reasons hadn’t progressed. The last OW who he was juggling with 2 other Schmoopie’s actually left her husband and dumped her two poor teenage girls, destroyed her family pretty much. And for what…. He dumped her like a hot potatoe as soon as he was busted as well as other two OW. Tried to wipe anything that might connect him or incriminate him. Because “I was the Love of his life”. Gag gag hoik!!

She hates his guts now and so do the 2 OW as I made sure they all knew the explicit details and should go and get STD checks because they weren’t the only ones. (I borrowed a few tricks from his manipulator bag, I had to get my head around how to think like one but it worked a treat in the end)

And really the only “Love of his Life” is HIMSELF

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  Lothos

Lothos

I believe the letter was sent by someone who knows about his history. No doubt these lady killers typically hit and run. As many here say a leopard doesn’t change his spots.
There are other red flags including the POA which is unique to someone whose all in with the marriage and having his first child. Many cheaters start cheating when their wife is oregnant and in a vulnerable state. It would be hard to ignore the statement about him preying on teens. And he did move her away from family and friends.

I try not to decider cheater logic because not much of what they do makes much sense to normal non cheaters. Yet, they have so much in common it’s striking. I take my hat off to CL for this site which heightens our awareness so these young newbies have a support system and don’t waste their lives doing all the sweet things innocents do only to be chumped.

Hope49
Hope49
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

Ami, I would like to know more about the whole moving out- of -state scenario. Did your husband do it for some ‘new’ job? I am thinking he might have wanted him and you AWAY from old OW’s, ex-girlfriends etc. who might make you all the more wiser… Maybe he was fired from his old job or ‘transfered’ by a boss who valued his ability BUT worried about sexual harassment issues on the job etc.?

Finally, I just want to say how very sorry I am that you are now where we have all been. There are some GREAT chumps here though and we will internet ((HUG)) you, support and comfort you around the wee hours of the he morning when you are lonely, sad, confused and taking baby steps forward (and a few steps backwards).

Ami
Ami
8 years ago
Reply to  Hope49

The move made sense, several of his team members moved to this area for promotions or more stable positions with fewer deployments when they got married and started families. The letter mentioned “military benefits”, after marriage there are decent benefits and its a nice area to raise a family.

Portia
Portia
8 years ago

I think the hardest thing I ever had to do was act like I didn’t know anything, when I knew almost everything. My idealistic self wanted to leave, my practical self realized I had to “get my ducks in a row” — I had two children to care for and bills to pay. I also wanted irrefutable evidence, and I wanted revenge to the extent that he wouldn’t have a “safety net” woman in place — I knew I couldn’t change his life, but I sure could make it uncomfortable for awhile. I also wanted the OW I knew about to know what they were dealing with — so they would have no delusions about what he coldly and knowingly did – to me and to them. The cold blooded, systematic use of others is just despicable — and I think you should at least make an effort to tell what you know.

Unfortunately, women are not very nice to each other much of the time. We should not get mad at another woman who has been duped by the man who is supposed to belong to us — unless we know she is a predator who knew about us from the beginning and stalked him anyway. We should be mad at the one who caused all the problems, and we should direct our anger accordingly. Easier to say than to do, right? That being said, there are bat shit crazy people out there who do very strange things when they don’t get what they want. My theory is this — SOMETHING went on, or the person would not know who he is or who you are, and they would not take the time and trouble to notify you. With this amount of detail — this woman was clearly involved. Recently, too — she wouldn’t take years to track him down. It is hard to accept that your man is not who you thought he was, but the evidence will speak for itself. I also hated admitting that I had been duped to that extent — but that was a hard fact I had to accept, too. Yes, he will lie to your face. Yes, he will try all the manipulative BS he can think of. Yes, he will do it again, and again, and again. What you learn about him when you snoop is who he really is, and it is disturbing.

This experience will also change you, in ways you probably will not like. You will never again be as trusting and chumpy as you once were. You will develop a BS detector, and you will be alert for red flags — not just from potential suitors, but for people in general. Once you learn what these predators are like, you will be amazed at how many of them walk among us. It is an inevitable part of survival — developing the skill of wary awareness that will keep you safer than you were when you fell into the original chump trap. Unfortunately in this world, it is adapt or die. I just don’t see how I could ever be that chumpy again — I may be fooled again but I think I will figure it out sooner, and I will accept it quicker, and I will react with lightening speed. I don’t have any more years to waste in my life, and I don’t intend to ever be that unhappy again, ever.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago
Reply to  Portia

Like Portia, I lived the lie for several months, gathering proof & plotting my exit while the ex strutted thru that secret life of his thinking he was getting away with it.
I’d read & seen enough to know how useless confrontation without proof is. How cheaters lie & play on Chump sympathy. I wasn’t going to live that shit.

I often wonder how ex didn’t see that I’d caught on. Was I *that* good an actress, or was he just too self-consumed to notice?

It was so damned hard living that way, but I found internet support groups, saw my doctor for antidepressants & started counseling to steel myself for what lay ahead.

He knew none of it. I had my own little secret life. Super sleuth.

When I was close to having all the pieces needed, I asked him what was going on with him, anything he wanted to tell me? Said he seemed so distant, yada. He danced around it saying nothing was up but of course managed to blameshift any ‘off’ behaviors to me. Douchebag blew his last chance to confess.

Within a week I pulled the trigger & had my PI follow him for visual, undeniable confirmation. The shock & awe that he walked into upon coming home that day was EPIC.

None of this is fun, none of us would choose this ending. But the hard work of preparation was empowering. It motivated thru the despair, DROVE. me to stop the victimization & be Mighty. I held all the cards & turned the tables.

Too many Chumps turn to their Cheaters to make them feel better, loved, secure when their shit starts stinking. I guess I just don’t understand putting all that right back in their hands in the midst of betrayal.
It belongs in YOUR hands. You are the only one you can trust right now.
Be smart. Be strong. Be Mighty.

Arnold
Arnold
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumptyDumpty

Similar confrontation once I had proof from my PI. XW came home at 9 in the morning, claiming she had fallen asleep at a girlfriends house after watching movies.
She asked me if I had seen her wallet. I said no, and inquired if she had been anywhere other than Gf’S house. When she said no, I asked ” How about 7224 3rd Ave,S , in Richfield?”
She was stunned,but,shortly went the indignation over being followed route. I just told her to get fucked.

unicornomore
unicornomore
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumptyDumpty

I failed MISERABLY when I found proof…I thought if I confronted him he would say “I love you , Im sorry, I will never do it again!!” but instead he said “I wont apologize for falling in love”. I called him 15 seconds after finding the letter to Susan in Seattle and demanded he get his ass home…he had his whole drive to concoct stupid stories. me fail

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Not a fail. Human. Instinctual. I only know better because I found chump lady while being gas lighted (he was accusing me of being unfaithful and so I was trying to understand where the lines are for most people and found this site, which was funny so I kept reading it… and so started my impending education that I was actually the chump not accidentally a sociopath… Go figure)

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumptyDumpty

This seems to be a running theme today. I never thought that it was a huge part of infidelity management, it seemed like when you know, you blow (the whistle, your top, the guy [or girl- hysterical bonding], your cover) but if you have the opportunity – as this letter writer does- to watch and wait and time your exit it can really make all the difference. Watch, wait, plan, steel yourself, set up ducks, don’t move until you are ready: know where you’re going if you decide to leave, have a new bank account and move half the money, have a confidant and a lawyer and they aren’t the same person (lawyers are only for business of splitting. No tears, no extra time, you’re paying for that shit) … Get evidence. When it’s time, I plan to sit down and be super calm- because that’s who I am. I might cry but I don’t think so, that’s all disappeared. But I expect he’s going to be weepy and clingy and then get mean. Which is why I will have someone there. get out. get out. Get out.

AllOutofKibble
AllOutofKibble
8 years ago

I made it a whole week without blowing my stack! It was all I could do, but I found a lawyer, told some very good friends so my support system was in place, the I got the financial documents I needed out of the house, copied, and put back before he could destroy them, which was really necessary for my attorney.

I didn’t cry at all during confrontation. A couple weeks later when he really set in on gas lighting, blame shifting and attacking me I let out howls and cried for three straight hours (more than an hour of which one of my children watched while trying to comfort me) until I dry heaved and passed out. I never cried about it again, just pushed my lawyer to go as fast as possible without damaging my chances at the best outcome possible. D-day to done in under 5 months.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  AllOutofKibble

Considering fake crying to try to get him to sign off as the adulterer he is in the paperwork (via guilt) so that we can be divorced faster. I cannot tell you how much I want to not wait my year separation period which is only waived if someone signs off that they were unfaithful.

GiveTimeTime
GiveTimeTime
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumptyDumpty

ChumptyDumpty – I believe you just became my new hero.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago
Reply to  GiveTimeTime

Aww Shucks, GTT. 😉

SeeTheLight
SeeTheLight
8 years ago
Reply to  Portia

Ami- Portia and CN are saying it true. Be wary and protect yourself and your newborn. It takes nerves of steel to execute, but come here often for reinforcement.

donna
donna
8 years ago

When I first read this I thought it was written by a much older woman. Who makes references to the “Snap Chat Grneration”. Could this have been written by a family member who knows about his history and doesn’t want you to get hurt? It’s over kill for the OW to tell you to hire a PI, save money, and get a lawyer.

newchumpatl
newchumpatl
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

Very astute point.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  newchumpatl

Such possessive needy fucking whores.

Nolagirl
Nolagirl
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

I found that odd too Donna but a very good point. I felt it may not have been an actual OW, but someone who knows the facts and is warning Ami. If not that, than an older OW who is perhaps much older than Ami. Ami-so sorry you are having to deal with this. I would suggest sitting back and collecting evidence while lining up your ducks. Once your eyes open, you will be able to see him for who he truly is and act accordingly.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Nolagirl

Except that the tone of the letter is clearly nasty, as if the person herself feels betrayed. Ami does say “I can’t believe my best friend would betray me at a time like this.” Is the letter from a friend of Ami’s?

kb
kb
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I read “my best friend” as Ami referring to her husband.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  kb

What OW writes XOXO? To me it’s a mom thing. I out it in every card to my children.

LadyStrange
LadyStrange
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

Good point! XOXO?

kb
kb
8 years ago
Reply to  LadyStrange

Another sign of the nastiness. I can believe this was written by an OW, but an OW who blames the wife for being married to the asshole. My XH’s Schmoopie at one point liked me, but then became really jealous of me, as she saw me as stealing XH from her!

Roberta
Roberta
8 years ago

In my case, Portia, the OW was a predator who used Facebook as her tool to troll for “lonely” and dumb married and unmarried men. She was married also at the time. She had three suckers on the hook at one time before she landed my idiot! He fell for her “I’m an abused wife, dumsel in distress” story line immediately! That being said, I preened most of my proof directly off of Facebook! Later, once the lovely soul mates were in full affair mode, I used the “nicknames ” they had given each other and discovered a Facebook page they had created together to communicate. Through a series of guesses at passwords my Ex always used, I was able to crack into the private chats they had on that and I was able to ascertain who the other “cheerleaders” we’re and who knew all about these two cheating! I was flabbergasted! But it gave me all I needed to go forward to file divorce and name the OW! It was FREE! No PI needed! They buried themselves with their own words and admissions of “Twu wuv”!
This is why I suggest people use the same “tool” cheaters use to their advantage. That IT road goes both ways!

LIningUpDucks
LIningUpDucks
8 years ago
Reply to  Roberta

Yes, the IT road goes both ways. It happened that way with my ex also. The OW was a social media whore and it helped reveal their cheating, big-time. It was more proof than I needed.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago

No matter how hurtful or helpful the author meant to be, her advice to you is spot-on. I absolutely recommend you follow it, if for no other readon than proving her wrong.
There will be no worse feeling in the world than choosing to trust your H & ignoring it, only to find out months or years from now it was all true, and then some.
Doubt is for your benefit, not his. Remember that & seek the truth. If what she says is true it will take very little time & effort to verify. And take special note of the ‘teenager’ remarks. Is your H breaking the law as well as his vows?
You owe it to yourself & your child to find out. Do NOT rely on your H for the truth.

I’m SO sorry you have this shit (whatever it is) in your life, but you came to the right place. Now do the right thing. Because this *is* YOUR life, not his to fuck around with as he pleases – unless you want to be exactly that saintly ostrich of a wife this woman portrays you to be.

Kay
Kay
8 years ago

I’m so so sorry Ami. I sincerely feel your pain. It really sucks. Cheaters really lie. And they will go on and on about how great and honest they are. It’s really strange and scary. Start going to therapy. Find people to love and support you during this crappy time. Everybody says it will get better (unfortunately I’m in the middle of my own hell, so I’m having to take their word for it but I do believe it.) The one bright side is that you know early on and don’t have to waste years and years on this crap. Hugs.

Uneffingbelievable
Uneffingbelievable
8 years ago

Ami take no prisoners. You need to see the phone, facebook, get all passwords, etc. If you can’t afford a PI, have a friend follow him. I know you must feel like all of this is unnecessary. That hubby loves you, but spend some time reading Chump replies to past posts. Most of us were stunned that our spouse was capable of such deception and betrayal. Living with a spouse like this eats your soul – you won’t recognize yourself in four or five years. This is your one and only life – don’t waste ANY of it with a dirtbag, entitled asshole. Find out the truth and if hes cheating, get out of there with your dignity and self-respect. Wishing you luck.

Lulu
Lulu
8 years ago

Even if you’re tempted to write this woman off as a loon, the accusation that your husband is fucking teenagers should not be passed off lightly. If he gets busted with a woman that’s underage, you might find yourself in the center of a legal and financial nightmare, become a pariah in your community (because, like OW, people will think that you knew but ignored him) and might even get a visit from CPS since you have an underage child. Trust me, you don’t want to be like Jared Fogle’s newly ex-wife.

Since you’ve already told your husband about the letter, you should just pretend you believe him, hire a private investigator, install a keylogger into his phone or computer or a voice-activated recorder in his car (or all three).

Best case scenario, you find out nothing and this woman was a crazy ex.

Worst case scenario, you find out your husband is a cheater (and possibly a sexual predator), and you’re able to extract yourself and your child from the blast radius before his sexual improprieties destroy you both.

LIningUpDucks
LIningUpDucks
8 years ago

Yes, the last paragraph does seem very Chump Nation-ish. Weird.

What is the reference to having sex with teens? That is really disturbing.

Do your due diligence on your husband. Stop listening to what he says, and start doing your own research. It’s likely he is cheating.

Free Vixen
Free Vixen
8 years ago

Ami, I went through something very similar. My ex was cheating even when he cried crocodile tears of joy and love on our wedding day in front of our friends and family; he was cheating while he changed our son’s diapers and told me how incredibly lucky he was to have both of us; he was cheating while I packed up and sold my home to move across the country with him so he could stay near his mistress; he was cheating while we had great sex, while I tried everything in my power to make him happy and be an amazing wife. None of the things that I thought mattered to him stopped him from screwing over his devoted wife, his beautiful son, or anyone who dared question his greatness.

The letter you received sounds fresh and raw, not like and old jilted girlfriend seeking to vent. I agree with ChumpLady, Ami. What makes more logical sense, that an ex came out of nowhere to ruin your happiness? Or that the writer is telling the truth? I had such a difficult time rationalizing the man I thought I knew and loved with the jackass that he really is. I agree that you should gather irrefutable proof and then GTFO or you will be battling this for the REST OF YOUR LIFE.

I am so, so sorry. But truly, being a single mom and getting rid of my inauthentic ex really isn’t so bad. It’s no piece of cake and hurts like a motherfucker, but think of it like childbirth: lots of emotion leading up to it, excruciating pain, and then relief and a new life. You just peed on a stick and found out you’re expecting a cheater.

Arlo
Arlo
8 years ago
Reply to  Free Vixen

“It’s no piece of cake and hurts like a motherfucker, but think of it like childbirth: lots of emotion leading up to it, excruciating pain, and then relief and a new life.”

Excellent! Going up on the mirror.

UnsinkableMollyXinAlabama
UnsinkableMollyXinAlabama
8 years ago
Reply to  Free Vixen

Standing ovation!!!! Damn right!!! Love your last line too!!!

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

That might merit an illustration

Free Vixen
Free Vixen
8 years ago

YES!!

ItsAJourney
ItsAJourney
8 years ago

Ami, you’ve got your hands full with a new baby. If you’re not ready, or don’t have the support to kick him out, I would suggest getting your ducks in a row.
Start stashing cash (if it turns out he’s not cheating you can buy him a nice anniversary gift with it).
Gather any paperwork you can find and keep it in a safe place. (It’s good to be organized no matter the reason).
Don’t confront him yet! Do as much research as possible before you tell him about the letter. If you tell him now he’ll go underground and make it difficult to find any incriminating information.
If you find evidence and decide to confront him, don’t tell him what evidence you have…. it will be easier to see how he lies and deceives you. This strategy helped me to see my x in action, and stop buying into his lame explanations, which I was prone to doing.
I’m sorry you’re going through this, and at a time when you should be doing nothing but enjoying your new baby. My heart goes out to you. ((big hug))

Ami
Ami
8 years ago

Hi everyone. Thank you for your insight and personal experiences. I’m currently feel like I’m in a maze and don’t know which way to turn. I love him so much. To those who asked if I’d been the OW before, I don’t think I was. We were never physical but I did fall in love with him while he was with his last GF. She found flirtatious texts between us, that I realize we’re inappropriate. She accused him of lining me up for his next relationship before theirs was over. Part of me feels like this could be karma paying me back.
He has told me that I make him a better person and that he’s inspired to be better everyday. He allows me to look at his phone whenever I want, I don’t think he would do that if he was hiding something. My mom is staying with us to help out for a while. I can’t even confide in her as I don’t want to change the way she sees him. My family has become his and they love him.

Still a Chump
Still a Chump
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, please don’t choose for your mom. If given the choice, she would choose you over him, I’m sure of it. She is there to support you now — that shows that she cares. I too hid the details from my family for 6 long weeks because I didn’t want them to think less of him should we reconcile. My therapist asked me why I put such a low value on my self. This is YOUR family. They want to support you and will be hurt to know that they didn’t have the opportunity. You don’t need to protect him at the expense of your own self and that of your child. Confide in them. You may need their physical support and their financial support as you work through this with a newborn baby to care for.

And just in case you were wondering, we did reconcile (long story not for today’s thread). Apologizing to my entire family was part of my husband’s acts of atonement. Do they treat him differently? Yes for a while they did. Now it is basically the same on the surface, but there remains a bit of coolness there between them and him. When he remarks about it now, I ask him how he would feel about a man who treated his daughters the way he treated me and he backs off right away. Actions have consequences and a grown up person will deal with the consequences of his actions.

GladIt'sOver
GladIt'sOver
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

“We were never physical but I did fall in love with him while he was with his last GF. She found flirtatious texts between us”

Maybe I’m wrong, and maybe I’m an awful person for even thinking this, but this sounds like bullshit to me. How many of us here heard this exact thing from our cheaters? That it was just emotional, that it was nothing but flirting, that it was nothing more than text messages. A man with an admitted history of cheating/playing around would wait until he officially broke up with his girlfriend before having sex with a new woman who was “in love with him” and sending him flirtatious texts? No way. I still think Ami was an OW and knew it. She thought her cheating husband, despite his lengthy history of scuzzy behavior, wouldn’t cheat on her because their love is SPECIAL.

At any rate, I suggest that Ami contact a lawyer and get her ducks in a row, because as they say, leopards don’t change their spots. Get out before you are dumped. And next time, wait until a guy is truly single before starting up a relationship.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  GladIt'sOver

Good point, Glad. How can you really “fall in love” with someone if you’re not romantically dating (whether there is actual sex or not)?

NCStevie
NCStevie
8 years ago
Reply to  GladIt'sOver

IMHO…..emotional affairs are cheating too, it’s still an inappropriate relationship that hasn’t crossed over to physical yet. Big difference between being “just friends” and having a relationship with someone who is committed to someone else. We are grown ups here, we know the difference.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

They love you more. They love him because he makes you happy. Nothing is more important than you and your baby’s safety. Yiu can go through his phone but snapchat disappears- which may be why OW letter mentioned it. And texts can be deleted. My hubby of the year, wants babies so bad, brings me slippers when I get home awesome husband has two Skype accounts, has an alert which shows when his Facebook or email have been activated so he knows if I have been trying to snoop- but still uses his regular text messaging- that’s where I have gathered more dirt than I want. Just keep looking. I worry for you, but you’re here, which means you’re already bounds ahead of most chumps.

KB22
KB22
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

The phone he is letting you view may not be his only device and he has a history/pattern of being a cheater. I’m a little suspicious of the OW letter writer though, I’m pretty sure she knew she was OW (her blatant disdain for you being a clue) but circumstances did not play out in her favor, so she is an “OW scorned” and this is her revenge.

SnakebitNoMore
SnakebitNoMore
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

I married a snake, with a reputation. In hindsight, I think he was lining me up to replace the OW to his last wife before I had any idea I was anything more to him than a co-worker/friend. He conned me big-time.

Ami, sounds like your husband just borrowed the old playbook from mine.

I say borrowed, because the Snake took his playbook back to use on another mark, which is why I left him. He was saying things to a female co-worker he traveled with on occasion that were almost word for word what he was telling me over a quarter of a century ago. Lining her up to replace me, I have no doubt.

I wish I’d found something sooner. He stole half my life away from me. I can’t get those years back.

I have my daughter out of it, but he has her snowed into thinking I’m wrong for leaving him and trying to get what I am legally entitled to.

Do what you have to do, but gather your evidence if the letter isn’t enough, and get out, the sooner the better. Don’t end up with half your life gone, you’re young enough to fix your picker and end up with a decent man.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, two things:

My Ex was a golden boy. My parents loved him like a son & in fact, this bond as well as my kids drove me to try Reconciliation before finally divorcing him. Family attachments mean nothing to cheaters because they can detach so easily from reality in selfish pursuit of their little fantasy world.
Know this : My ex actually left our college age daughter stranded worried & waiting on him to pick her up for Thanksgiving while he stopped off for a 2 hour hooker-romp on his drive down.
Family means no more than marriage vows to a cheater.

Second, cheaters have secret phones & other devices for their clandestine activities. Please don’t let these things that seem normal on the surface prevent you from looking into a VERY not-normal letter & it’s accusations.

Arlo
Arlo
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

You feel like you are in a maze, because you are, and he designed it that way. You feel like this could be your karma coming back to bite you, because you are seeing a pattern. You don’t understand how your best friend could do this to you at the happiest time of your life, because he’s not your best friend. You don’t want to change the way your family sees him, because he’s got image control on lockdown.

I’m so sorry sweetie, but these are some HUGE red flags. Maybe you do your due diligence and find that it was a big misunderstanding. But you do your due diligence. Because you have a baby and you have to look out for you and your baby. You have to. While your mom is staying with you to help out is the perfect time to do this. You have some backup, if the shit hits the fan, you have help. Put on your big girl panties and get to it, quick. Unless you think your mom is the kind of disordered that would tell you to hold on to a man no matter what, be ready to call on her to help you get out of there if you find out its true. She will prob do anything for her new grandbaby, who is more precious than your husband no matter how much they love him.

You wrote to CL, so obviously big parts of this are not sitting right with you. If there is anything you glean from the collective wisdom here, it should be TRUST YOUR GUT. Any one of us will tell you we wish we had acted sooner ( well there are a few extra smarties here that did act very quickly, but too many of us held on for love or fear or desperation for waaaaaaaaaay too long).

TRUST YOUR GUT

moving forward
moving forward
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, PLEASE confide in someone. Do you have a close girlfriend you can talk to? I did not talk to anyone and over time it ate me up inside.

For me, there is something off in this OW letter. It could be from an EX gf, a disordered EX gf or someone else. There is anger but no remorse. And, unless you are very aware, you probably wouldn’t be able to figure out if someone was a narcissist, bpd or sociopath until significantly after the fact. (Or maybe I am a slow learner.) Also this line in particular is very scary “While realizing I was the other woman amongst a sea of jail bait, wasn’t pleasant, at least I could get up and dust myself off.”

From your letter to CL, it is clear that your husband was a cheater in the past. How did he explain having a gf and a fwb at the same time? Listen carefully to his story. Why did he believe that was an OK thing to do?

We could get into analysis paralysis here….so I agree that a good first step is to hire a private investigator. There is no harm in doing this. It would have given me peace of mind instead of living in limbo and uncertainty for years.

Hugs

alias1013
alias1013
8 years ago
Reply to  moving forward

We don’t know when/if she cut things off with him. If the OW cut things off with him after finding out he was married, why should she be remorseful? She didn’t do anything wrong if that is the case. He made the choice for her if he withheld that information. I was unknowingly the other woman. I feel no remorse, shame, or guilt about it all cause I didn’t know. I felt angry and hurt that he played me and his fiance.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  alias1013

Why would she be remorseful? Read the letter. And by the way Alias, NO ONE makes choices for us. Cheaters leave out information, lie, and are very cunning.
X would always say. “But you didn’t ask”, as an excuse when he deliberately told lies.

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami-

Sign into his Google, then click this link: https://www.google.com/maps/timeline

Go through his whereabouts by the day. There’s a little gear icon at the lower right… click that and click on Show Raw Data.

Check the internet history.

Check his Sent folder. A lot of these Cheaters are effing idiots and forget to delete their whore-y emails from there.

Check the apps on his phone FROM the App section, not the icons displayed when you swipe to the side.

Michael
Michael
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

I never get use to how incredibly manipulative and covert aggressive these people can be. Using you Ami, as a weapon for her revenge is not only low and evil, it’s just shameless. Unfortunately, doing what you have to do plays right into her game. But like most of us chumps, we had to choose between a rock and a hard place.

A quote from one of my favorite movies, “Strange game. The only winning move is not to play.”

“She accused him of lining me up for his next relationship before theirs was over. Part of me feels like this could be karma paying me back.”

And that is exactly what my ex-wife did to me. Although I didn’t know until after D-day. She secured a relationship with me before leaving her ex-boyfriend. And she re-secure a relationship with that same person before walking out on our marriage. I had no warning and didn’t even know anything was wrong. It’s how these people operate and until it happened to me, I didn’t understand how selfish, entitled and callous someone can be, especially someone who professed their love to you. And if he’s done that to someone else then he’ll do it to you. It’s not a matter of if but when. I found out after my divorce that my ex-wife had a pattern of this all throughout her life.

Like Tracy said, the Lady Killer thing is not a good sign. And although you love him, truth is that it’s not reciprocated, at least not in the way you want it to be. You and your family loves who he wants you to see, not the real him. I’m sorry for the road you have ahead of you.

Marked711
Marked711
8 years ago
Reply to  Michael

WOW!!! Exactly like mine. I found out after DDay that I was the OM. She secured me before leaving her long term boyfriend (said they were 4 months broken up). She lined up a different high school boyfriend before leaving me (after 30 years, and told our daughters that she was divorced 4 months before she started dating again – a lie pattern?). That’s how they roll. This is the basis of my annulment appeal. I’ll know in a few months.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  Michael

Michael

X always secured a relationship before leaving. The dating started and he would see multiple women until he found the the perfect victim. And yet he loved me.

It’s one thing to never see it coming. Calling your spouse a lady killer? And Ami knows he doesn’t use protection. These are the worst kind Ami. Perhaps your mom knows Ami. Talk to her.

LadyStrange
LadyStrange
8 years ago

I don’t know. This letter is way to long, detailed, and sympathetic. If I were a ‘scorned’ OW, I would probably write a letter and stick to the facts, i.e. The guy you married is a cheating sob. I had sex with your husband in his truck and at my place. Dump the POS. Done.
I don’t think I’d write out a page and a half letter and then advise you on what to do. It just doesn’t make sense…
Otherwise, I would heed the advise given above. Investigate in stealth mode. Your husband already knows about the letter, so you need to make him think everything has been smoothed over. BUT – I would certainly check into his doings for a little while to see if it may be true. Until you find proof, give him the benefit of the doubt. Someone may be just playing a very nasty trick on him (maybe a former friend?) in order to destroy him for some reason. It wouldn’t be fair to him if he were innocent and just because some asshole has a vendeta against him, it shouldn’t ruin your marriage. I know what it is like to be blamed for something I never did and be punished for it for 15 years.

Ali Rose
Ali Rose
8 years ago
Reply to  LadyStrange

Good points. I noticed that the other woman’s letter uses a surprising number of Chump Lady phrases. Seems like it could have been written by someone who has visited this blog before.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  LadyStrange

I’m thinking her mom sent the letter. I sat and watched my daughter being abused by her x after her child was born and didn’t feel as if I should interfere. She was happy and just had a child and I was staying with them. He was demeaning, selfish, and controlling.
Talk to your MOM. She’s there supporting you. Show her the letter.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

Ami – So many good pieces of advice here, but are you ready to apply any of it?

I am so very sorry that you have to face all this with a newborn. I agree with donna, I would recommend you talk to your Mom, if your husband is a cheater, it is best to know this early.

One clear test to investigate who your husband really is is around finances and a post-nup agreement. You have only been married 5 months and have a newborn, this is a perfect time for some grown-up financial talk and changes to test his maturity and how reciprocal your relationship really is.

Did you work while pregnant? Will you go back to work after 6 weeks or were you counting on becoming a SAHM? It might be heartbreaking to leave your little on in a daycare after 6 weeks, but I would strongly recommend that you do everything possible to go to work full-time ASAP.

While your mom is there with you, I would suggest you sit down with her and make/update a household budget with all costs, especially growing baby-related costs, and a savings budget. Then look at your income and his, and figure out a percentage you each will wire to a separate checking account you both contribute to fairly to run your household while keeping your financial independence.

If you are a SAHM, then negotiate with him to have your own separate savings account for part of the household income to become your own personal money in exchange for the household CEO job you are doing.

If you work, then keep the additional money in your own account, and make sure to not use that money for anything but YOURSELF. Do not use that money for your baby, anything for the baby has to come from the household budget.

In addition to this, I would recommend that you require a post-nup with no sunset period and an iron-clad get-him-through-the-wallet adultery clause for both of you to stay accountable.

If any of these financial steps are dismissed by your husband as unnecessary, or a proof you don’t trust him, that is proof that you are with an immature selfish husband. At that point, whether he is cheating or not is irrelevant, if you get evidence that he cannot move towards a reciprocal financial relationship a month after welcoming a baby with you, then GTFO and file for divorce asap!

Eilonwy
Eilonwy
8 years ago

Ami, you mention that you’ve recently married, moved, and had a child. Your life is greatly in flux. Maybe your husband has participated in all this change as a way to cut ties with a past he has outgrown. Maybe he is just setting up a new hunting ground.

One thing that worries me about all the changes in your life is that you might be quite isolated. (I know your mom is there now, but I imagine that is a short term arrangement). Make sure to sustain your family relationships, old female friendships, and try (as much as you can with a newborn) to establish friends in your new community. Isolating a “mark” is a typical strategy for con-artists of all sorts.

Who manages the finances in your household? If it isn’t you, it is time to change that. You should know what he makes and where his paycheck goes. Do you know how many credit cards he carries and do you see the monthly bill for each? If not, it is time to start. Does he spend more than a hundred dollars a month in cash? If so, then he has enough on hand to keep a second cell phone or treat his marks to a coffee after sleeping with them in his truck. I’d say that hiring a PI is a few steps down the road. There is a lot you can do yourself to understand where he is spending his time and money.

For now, you probably shouldn’t be asking many questions. He’s on alert, and you are unlikely to catch him at anything. But six months down the road, things will be different. You can be expertly informed on where his time and money should be going, and if he’s a cheater, his guard will be down.

Like many other posters, I’m not optimistic about your situation, but if he’s as predatory as the letter suggests, I suspect you will uncover hard evidence within the year if you choose to look for it.

And congratulations on your baby! I hope that part of your life, at least, is bringing you joy.

Ami
Ami
8 years ago
Reply to  Eilonwy

What you asked about finances makes me sick to my stomach. During the purchase of our house I gave him power of attorney on a things regarding the property. I didn’t even question it.

Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

My husband refused to put my name on the house as well. You still have legal rights. Also, if things don’t work out, you likely will not want to be stiffed with the mortgage.

Ami, this guy is bad news. I am suspicious of any person who singularly controls an asset such as a house; it is a potential sign of economic abuse. Please start collect and copy all financial documents (including assets) and store them in a safe place he can’t access.

(Also, where there is a will, there is a way. You mentioned somewhere he is showing you his phone to prove his honesty. So what. There is Google Voice, Skype, disposable cell phones, alternate email accounts, etc. This tells you zilch.)

UnderConstruction
UnderConstruction
8 years ago

There are also apps designed to hide calls/texts – Whatsapp and several others. Google “apps that can hide texts or calls” You’ll be surprised how easy it is to get away with non traceable communication these days! Even when searching the device used for the communication!

UnderConstruction
UnderConstruction
8 years ago

*my advice to google is meant for Ami* (and anyone else of course.. seems like you, Dr., are too familiar with the ease-of-sleaze already, unfortunately.

Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
8 years ago

*Sorry for the typo. No caffeine yet.

ChumptyDumpty
ChumptyDumpty
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

The good thing here is, you can most likely rescind the POA without his participation/knowledge. Definitely take care of this asap

KB22
KB22
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Not good. Why on earth would he need a Power of Attorney? You’re not overseas or incapacitated, right? I wonder if he has taken out a second mortgage or used the home for collateral. Get an attorney and then head to the Town Clerk’s office to check the deed, liens, etc.

ringinonmyownbell
ringinonmyownbell
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Get that Power of Attorney thing fixed like pronto. Talk to an attorney and get that situation fixed. He has you by short hairs with that one. He can take out second mortgages without your knowledge and approval. Also you can go on line and look at the tax records and see if you are no the deed. If you are not…you are dealing with a financial snake as well as possibly a financial predator. If it looks like a duck… time to get your ducks lined up. Sorry you are having to go through this…We have your back.

donna
donna
8 years ago

RMOB

I agree! I always thought of POA in terms of the elderly. Ami, if it is in fact on your home run and run fast. Check into an annulment with an attorney. Gather ALL financial doccuments.
There are too many red flags here. And I’ve never heard of anyone requesting a POA for your home. Cancell your name from ALL shared accounts. Moving you away from friends and family is a typical narc move to isolate you. What is the age difference between the two of you? Is he quite a bit older?

moving forward
moving forward
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, POA is like reverting to a parent/child relationship where you have legally agreed that they can make all financial and medical decisions for you – FOREVER. So, for example you could be POA for your grandmother in case she has dementia and can’t understand her bills, etc.

moving forward
moving forward
8 years ago
Reply to  moving forward

Where I live, POA is a legal document. This means you have signed it and had it witnessed. This does not mean you verbally said “OK, baby”.

I have POA for an elderly parent. He gave his permission. We did this in case he is incapacitated in some way. When it is enacted — this means I become his legal guardian because he can’t make decisions for himself. I can do what I feel is right for his finances and health. He has no legal rights because he has already agreed to this. So, and I am reaching here, if I felt it was in his best interest I could have him institutionalized. It is very difficult to have POA revoked.

I know of a woman would had her spouse institutionalized when he was in ill health. POA was enacted. Once he was better, he had no rights because he had been declared unfit.

We also have something called a living will — but this is not the same thing.

Go and see a lawyer. Take your paperwork.

Marezy doats
Marezy doats
8 years ago
Reply to  moving forward

It is not hard to revoke a power of attorney, if indeed it is still active. It isnt that uncommon, or suspicious in real estate transactions. All it means is that only one of you needs to appear at the real estate signing, rather than both. If the original power of attorney specified this ( as it should have) now that the transaction is complete the power of attorney is already void. If you signed a general power, all you need to do is sign a revokation, have it notarized and deliver it to the bank that holds the mortgage. Moving forward is thinking of a “durable” power of attorney which is much broader.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  moving forward

The POA can be removed easily I believe. Ami when he’s not home look for all doccuments you signed and make copies for yourself.

LadyStrange
LadyStrange
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Power of attorney on things regarding the property? I don’t understand why that would have even been done. Aren’t both your names on the mortgage?

LadyStrange
LadyStrange
8 years ago
Reply to  LadyStrange

I was given Power of Attorney and Medical Power of Attorney on my son. He was in the Army and headed to Iraq. I don’t understand the property POA?

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago

Ami, I got anonymous “tip” when my kids were young too, in the form of a phone call. Unfortunately the person didn’t give me much detail that I could follow up on. Just like you, I was overwhelmed with anxiety and fear (and anger). My husband came home especially late that night, and I was sitting up exhausted, waiting on him. I screamed at him when he walked in the door, and he yelled right back at me for yelling at him. He was so overpowering in his indignation that I was overwhelmed, then felt guilty for suspecting him. He traveled all the time for “work,” and it wasn’t unusual for him to come in at 2 am. It’s just this particular time I’d heard almost nothing from him while he was on his trip. He was also known as a “ladies man” before we married.

Anyway, what I’m trying to say is my husband made me feel stupid for questioning this phone call. He explained it away by telling me it was a jealous coworker that was out to get to him. I wanted so much to believe him, I had two little kids that were very sick and wasn’t able to work at the time. I didn’t know how I’d ever be able to support them.

But looking back, I’m pretty sure that caller was telling the truth. I wish he’d given me more details. If I were you I’d say nothing to your husband because he’ll come up with a plausible explanation. Cheaters are such good liars. Don’t follow him around yourself either, you don’t need that stress while you’re caring for a baby. Hire a private investigator, give him the letter, and ask him to find out for you. If it’s true the investigator will give you hard evidence and you can make a decision.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this. There’s nothing worse than being married to someone you don’t trust.

startofsomethingood
startofsomethingood
8 years ago

“I don’t feel sorry for you, I feel sorry for the other women he lies too while you enable him.” I’m sorry but…FUCK YOU OW! You are a piece of total garbage. Just so you know, he picked you because you were easy, you were there, you said yes. That’s it. And I DON’T feel sorry for you, you piece of shit. I feel sorry for Ami and that poor innocent little child. Congratulations OW for helping to destroy that family. You will get what’s coming to you. Can’t wait!

Mich Thomas
Mich Thomas
8 years ago

Not all women are scorned exes.This is similar to my current dilemma,except we have a child together.I was hoping it would strengthen the relationship but after four years and another child (with someone other than his wife)I gave up.I tried co-parenting to no avail.He only wants to argue and make up reasons as to why he’s stop communicating with our child.I do believe if the OW had any proof of this affair she should have included it.I know I have and will if I ever decide to let her know.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Mich Thomas

Let the wife know, and give her the details she needs to get a solid settlement from the cheater. (oh–and apologize to her, if you are sincere)

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Mich
So your not a scorned EX? As in scorned OW who was having an affair and thought having a child with him would seal the deal making the relationship stronger? After four sneaky years?
If that’s the story what the fuck are you doing here? This site is not for OW. It’s about leaving a cheater and gaining a life. Its not for OW who ruin LIVES. I know it’s a catch 22 when you find out your not so SPECIAL. Fuck off.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  Mich Thomas

Are you the OW Mich? I’m confused.

LadyStrange
LadyStrange
8 years ago
Reply to  donna

I didn’t quite follow this comment either….

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  LadyStrange

Salad?

phoebenix
phoebenix
8 years ago

I am so sorry Ami. You have to know that people don’t send crazy letters like this for no reason. There is a reason. I got a letter like this from the OW but in my case she pretended to be an outside party “helping” me realize the truth. The letter wasn’t signed. I will never forget the feeling in my stomach. It was also very scary to receive a letter that wasn’t signed. I didn’t mention it to my EX and within another week I got a second letter. I knew she wouldn’t give up. I got four letters before I said anything to my EX. Guess what? The letters stopped. How did the person writing the letters know that I did or did not say anything? Hmmmm.

I agree with CL, these OW know their place. They know the guy is married. I got hateful letters from two OW. In both cases, it was when my EX ended that relationship. I can’t help but read a letter like this and think – what kind of horrible, vile person does this? She is being as mean as she can to you and yet you don’t know this person at all. You have done nothing to them. Oh, but wait, in their eyes you have. You won the pick me dance. You didn’t even know you were playing. I’m sure it is very sad for these women and how special that they feel to attract a married man, who can’t resist them over their commitments to their wives, to find out that the man never valued them, that they were indeed a side fuck and nothing more. They already have the lowest self-esteem and, ouch, they just got the treatment that they “deserved”.

By the way, thanks CL for posting this letter. It brought up a lot of painful memories but made me realize just how far I have come. In my life now, I don’t have crazy people that I don’t know sending me hate mail.

phoebenix
phoebenix
8 years ago
Reply to  phoebenix

P.S. From her letter, I’m guessing he dumped this crazy, old hag for a younger OW.

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  phoebenix

Or he’s an older guy who likes them young? Teens? Sounds like X. It takes some exoerience to con someone into signing a POA.

Jeep
Jeep
8 years ago

Ami, listen to CL and CN…you don’t want to live your life always looking over your shoulder. It is a horrible waste of time and energy and what will be a wonderful life without a cheating liar. I know, all of us here know what that is like. The longer it goes on the harder it is to climb out of that hole. Your dignity and self esteem become non existent and joy in life is hard to find. In the end of my 36 year union with satan it was all I could do to just breathe…

…CN is also correct about how dangerous these disordered narcs can be so be very careful and do have an exit strategy in place. Be safe! satan became physically abusive once I had seen his super secret cell phone…it is unbelievable when the mask comes off…realizing you are living with a nightmare is soul shattering…

Take care Ami. You are worth more than that.

Over and Out
Over and Out
8 years ago

I was in a similar situation as you newly married with a brand new baby — 25 years ago before cell phones and internet. (My then husband, too, was quite the ladies man before we married, but I believed I was his one true love. He had chosen me over all the others!!) We moved to his hometown to begin our life together.

In the middle of the night shortly after I had given birth to our first child, a woman called our home. The phone woke me up. A very distraught woman asked for my husband by name and refused to tell me who she was or why she was calling. Quite a shock!! He, however, quickly told her not to call again and he explained her away as being a crazy ex-girlfriend who was jealous. She called many times, always in the middle of the night, over the following months. Husband stuck with his story and I had our phone number changed and unlisted.

I made the mistake of believing his story. I was in a new town and didn’t have any close friends there to confide in.

I stayed with him for 23 years and believed many many lies. I had another child with him, too. When our first-born was 16 I discovered my husband’s stash of porn and emails to multiple women on our computer. He lied and denied having any physical relationships. Promised he would stop and swore that he loved me. For another 3 years I foolishly believed the man with whom I had been building a future.

One day while scrutinizing the cell phone bill online, I discovered many late night calls and texts had been occurring on his phone… I confronted him and again he lied. It was then that I finally realized my future was nothing but an illusion. I divorced him and guess who was the first person he ran to?? That “crazy ex-girlfriend” from 2 decades earlier.

Proceed with caution, Ami. Leopards do not change their spots.

TheMuse
TheMuse
8 years ago
Reply to  Over and Out

wow, just wow, the duplicity is astounding!

FreeWoman
FreeWoman
8 years ago

Ami, my sympathies on getting a letter like this, it must be so painful, when you’ve just started your family and are so in love. Do you see a counselor? I would look for a therapist right now, so you have the help you need. And, if you don’t like the therapist, keep trying til you find a good one, someone who is on your side.
Also, sorry, but I would hire a PI, and maybe put a VAR in his truck, because you already know- he LOVES the ladies. He very well may be cheating. Better go into Mama Bear mode, and find out pronto! You have some good things going for you (he has a career, you are young) so stay strong and proud, and find out if you’re being played before something worse happens. Good luck, and love to you and your baby!

CalamityJane
CalamityJane
8 years ago

Launch an investigation.

I am sure the “baby” was a trigger for whoever wrote the letter.

cheaterssuck
cheaterssuck
8 years ago

It would be so easy to discount this advice since this newly scorned OW is an absolute wingnut and a condescending twatwaffle to boot!

Here’s the thing though. I married the same guy Ami. He was a ‘player’ (or slut as I refer to him now). He had one serious relationship before me and he cheated on her because the sad sausage didn’t like the decrease in kibbles once she started college. He played around some more and then set his sights on me. Soon after we were a couple his best friend called him out for hitting on his girlfriend while we were supposedly dating. Ex made it out like she was a crazy bitch and told his best friend that. His best friend pretty much had nothing to do with him after that. I had one red flag after another waving in my face and I ignored all of them and believed I was special enough to change his slutty ways.

Cut to 27 years later and I divorced him because he cheated on me. That happened in year 24 but I wasted more of my precious life with him and chased unicorns around for three years. I found chump lady and thankfully that all changed.

Don’t tell him what you know. Get tested for STDs. I know you want to believe him but he will lie. That’s what they do-It’s almost like a Geico commercial that could write itself. Get your ducks in a row and if you confirm that he’s a cheater then do the best thing you can for you and your baby: leave. Even the disordered apparently can dispense decent advice. Whether it comes straight from her or she poached it from somewhere else (like chump lady) this whackadoo other woman is not completely off base when she isn’t being a condescending twatwaffle. What can I tell you-it’s kind of what they do too.

Regardless, take chump lady’s advice. Best of luck to you.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago

Love that quote, Michael, and how applicable it is to chumps. What movie is it from?

Tessie
Tessie
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

War Games.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Tessie

Thanks! On my to-watch list now.

kb
kb
8 years ago

Hi Ami–

Look, I can’t tell if your husband is cheating, but I think you should proceed with caution.

First, he knows about the letter, but has denied its charges. My advice? Go along with him! If he is a cheater, he’s got enough of an ego to think that he can make you believe anything. The goal here is to keep him from feeling threatened. If he is a cheater, and if he does feel threatened, he’ll take more care to hide his tracks.

Second, spend a bit of time stalking him on the internet. You’ve received some really good tips here. Also, check your bank accounts and credit statements. Look for charges that seem odd. If you find anything, say nothing! This is very hard to do, but if there is evidence that he’s cheating, then you need to go into survival mode for you and your baby.

Third, set up an account in your own name that he doesn’t have access to. If you have only joint credit cards, apply for one in your own name, just to establish a credit history. Pay off the charges so that you have a track record of timely payments.

Fourth, use the account you established to buy an inexpensive tracking device. Personally, the ones that are wired into the car are better than the ones that attach via magnets. You might need to borrow the car to have a mechanic put the tracker in, if you aren’t comfortable doing so. Install a keylogger on his computer.

If you find out something fishy, then go see a lawyer–not the lawyer whom you used for power of attorney! Go check Super Lawyers if you don’t know a good family practice attorney in your area. When you go to the attorney, explain the POA. Ask if you’re in a fault or a no-fault state. Find out your rights. If you have a separation, does he have to pay temporary spousal maintenance? What is child support like?

In the meantime, start building a cash fund. Others have shown you how to do this. The goal here is to have enough to act as a small emergency fund. You can pay your lawyer out of it, or you can use it as a down payment.

And if it turns out that the letter was written by some vindictive, disordered ex-girlfriend who’s out to slander your husband’s good character? Well, in that case, you’ll still have started to establish your own credit, and have a ready fund for emergencies!

Best of luck!

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago
Reply to  kb

KB, that is all excellent advice. It’s so important to have good credit. Thankfully my mother drilled into my head to always have a card in my own name and my own credit account. It turned out that my credit rating was actually better than my husband’s. It made purchasing a house after the divorce much easier since my credit was very good.

Phi Slama Jama Mama
Phi Slama Jama Mama
8 years ago

Sigh. When you hear hoofbeats, it’s probably not a unicorn…We are all so sorry, but all we hear is an ass.

Fifi
Fifi
8 years ago

Ami, I can’t improve on what the others have said, so I’m just going to second (and third) the advice to find out more and be prepared to protect yourself. And it’s always a good idea, no matter the situation, to know everything about your marital finances. So if you don’t already know, I would say start educating yourself pronto. Take care of yourself. I’m rooting for you. Oh and BTW, Tracy — if it looks like a fuck and quacks like a fuck? I read that to my co-worker and she almost choked on her yogurt. You have got a sublime way with words!

Blerg
Blerg
8 years ago

First time poster here. I come here every day, as I was chumped by my ex-husband, and left after D-Day number two over a 1.5 years ago. I only found CN a few months ago, and am so grateful. The support on this site has been wonderful. Although, there weren’t any kids involved, leaving was the hardest decision I have ever made, but it was the right one for me. I wanted to believe him after I discovered the first affair. I spackled and listened to his bullshit like a lot of us here, but once I caught him the second time, I knew I could never trust him again. His character was completely exposed.

That being said, right before I met my ex-husband, I was once an OW for a short time, completely unbeknownst to me! Not all OW know at first or could reasonably know immediately. I actually do feel sorry for women who are duped into being OW, but I would have to suspend disbelief if someone told me that they didn’t realize for many months or years!

Ami-this letter rings really true to me. I won’t get into all the gory details, but I met this guy at a bar. He traveled to my city for work one to two nights a week. He told me he had never been married (didn’t wear a ring of course). At first, things were casual, and I had no reason to question him. I started to notice that things weren’t adding up though, because he didn’t use social media at all. It seemed odd that he didn’t even have a LinkedIn account, especially considering the business he was in. About 1.5 months in, in a serendipitous turn of events (or maybe by divine intervention), my friend actually discovered that his real last name was not the one he had given me. It was completely by chance, and I may have dated him a little longer had it not happened, or if I was a less curious person. I was trusting, and although there were a few red flags, but I was also a spackler.

Once we found his real last name, the floodgates opened, and I found him all over social media. Not only had he lied about his last name, but he did not live in the city he claimed to, and was married with children! I confronted him in a blind rage, and he actually admitted that his phone was a burner phone, and not his work phone like he had claimed. I was shocked he even admitted that, but I am sure it was just the tip of the iceberg. He begged me not to tell his wife, saying she would divorce him.

Needless to say, I contacted his wife and told her everything. She was extremely thankful at first, but she contacted me and asked me questions two more times after our initial 3 hour conversation. At one point, I think that she was overwhelmed, and abruptly cut off our conversation. She also defended his behavior a few times, which was surreal to me. From what I have gleaned from social media, they are still together.

It isn’t fair, but in the end, while I felt rage towards him, I felt angry towards her too. It isn’t rational, but at the time, I felt that he had wronged us both, and that she was the only one who could “punish” him. After it became clear that she had no intention of doing so, although I still felt really bad for her for being saddled with that pig, I admit that there were times I was so angry about being duped that I blamed her too. In my mind it was as if once I showed her how much of a misogynistic predator, liar, gaslighter and sociopath her husband was, I expected her to at least make him feel some consequences. It isn’t rational, but that was how I felt at the time. Having lived if from the other side, WHOA, do I get where she was coming from now. My main point is that although this letter is cruel as hell, and her anger is misdirected, I definitely think the sender of the letter is an OW.

Ami, as others have said, please hire a PI if you have the money, get checked for STD’s, sort out your finances, and run to an attorney’s office. You must take care of yourself and your child first and foremost. The way your husband is described in this letter sounds extremely familiar to my serial cheating POS ex, and people like him are extremely comfortable with living double lives. It is shocking to those of us that are honest and have integrity, but that is why they are so successful at duping us! We may have seen it coming somewhat, but it was foggy out, so the signals weren’t that clear.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  Blerg

Thank you for being here. I am pretty certain being a chump sets you up as the perfect OW in the dating scene for duplicitous narcs like this. There’s no shame in what happened for you. You did it all right. What a dick bag. I’m so glad you’re here.

Blerg
Blerg
8 years ago

Thank you for your kind words creativerational. Your commentary is always really insightful! I appreciate how welcoming and supportive everyone here is, and I am so sorry for what you are going through. It does get better slowly. I promise.

Too bad it took two narcs to help “fix my picker,” as CL says, but I guess that is better than 3 narcs doing the job. It is so hard to explain to people that have not been duped/betrayed just how traumatizing it is, and that is why CL and CN are so important. I mean, I seriously think CL and CN are performing a public service by publishing and commenting! 🙂

Blerg
Blerg
8 years ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Thank you CL! I am happy to be here…is that the right word? 😉

Mouse
Mouse
8 years ago

This isn’t a OW letting the wife know that she’s been cheated on, or rather it isn’t -JUST- the OW letting the wife know. The letter struck me as vindictive, nasty, and even cruel. This person seems bitterly angry–perhaps that she has lost the pick-me dance to a wife who didn’t know she was even in the contest. And possibly a particularly nasty triangulation to blow up the marriage and “win” the husband back or to win another chance at him if he wasn’t cheating.

At this point, I can’t say if the husband is a cheater. But I know that the letter writer has problems and Ami needs to be wary of the letter writer as well while she investigates her husband.

Blerg
Blerg
8 years ago
Reply to  Mouse

Mouse-while I don’t disagree with you regarding how nasty the letter is, I think it makes it less likely that it’s fake. Maybe the OW knew, and that is why she is angry, or maybe she is just hurt and lashing out. I think her letter is awful, and she should be ashamed of what she said, but I still give it a lot of credence.

In my case, I would not have had ANY proof except texts to and from a “burner” phone, which would have meant nothing. The only “proof” I had was that he got sloppy or was feeling confident and left me a voicemail message towards the end.

When I hear someone say “ladies man.” or “he has a way with the ladies,” my first thought is secretive, cheating cad. It doesn’t bode well.

Mouse
Mouse
8 years ago
Reply to  Blerg

Blerg, I hadn’t seen your reply at the time I wrote mine. The letter is awful, but after reading your post from your perspective I can see that it is also lashing out, and you are probably right–it is too precise. Credence indeed.

JK
JK
8 years ago

I am so sorry you are having to deal with this, especially now. It must be distressing and disorienting, not knowing whether it’s true or not. The fact is, it either is or it isn’t – there are no shades of grey. He’s either the person you thought you married, or a person you never knew. You owe it to yourself and your child to find the truth.

You are getting good advice from those who have suffered at the hands of some dishonest, conniving and selfish people, and have paid a very high price for learning hard life lessons. I hope you don’t look at what is said here as coming from bitter people who have been chumped and now see cheating in everyone. That has not been my experience. My take is that they are just, unfortunately, experts in their field. I give due weight to what they say.

I cannot tell you how it feels to find out after 20 years that you have invested the most precious thing you have – the days of your life – in a person who carried on a secret life with multiple long and short term partners for at least 18 of those years – all the while looking you in the eye and swearing to you on the life of your children that it’s not true. It is debilitating and traumatizing beyond description to find out you were used in such a way, but so much worse when you find out so late in life that it’s hard to start over.

Amy, I don’t know if your husband is cheating, but it certainly looks like it. If there is anything additional I would tell someone in your position it is that you have absolutely no concept of how truthful and believable a cheater can appear when they are lying straight to your face. It is truly unreal. Don’t trust yourself to be able to see through it. You won’t.

Valerie
Valerie
8 years ago
Reply to  JK

So true, JK. My ex-husband looked me straight in the eyes and lied to me. It was unreal. After everything we had been through together, he absolutely had no hesitation to lie in my face. Believe only what they DO not what they SAY.

DavidB
DavidB
8 years ago

I would probably guess if she took an honest look at her marriage and what her gut is telling her, she will have her answer. The gut check is accurate as it gets. We chumps are good at denial and ignoring things. I say innocent until proven guilty but listen and pay attention. Cheaters are not really that good at hiding things from us, we just dont want to see the truth.

alias1013
alias1013
8 years ago
Reply to  DavidB

Absolutely!!! Listen to your instincts. I’m an Oprah fan, and there’s something that she said that I try to remember. She said that we need to listen to the whispers, the little voices inside us, even if it is a fleeting voice before we get knocked up aside our head. Sometimes it’s hard to listen to that whisper, but we need to for our own well-being. Here’s a link to Oprah talking about listening to the whispers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ki6X6iPeGig

Arlo
Arlo
8 years ago

I don’t think the stat has come up in this thread yet, but its a common observation that most male serial cheaters begin when their wife is pregnant or has small children. It’s also very typical for them to control/hide finances and maneuver their spouses into isolated living situations. Ami, all things that you mentioned in your letter and comments, so MORE red flags….

Ugh, sweetie, please continue to check in on the forums here and let us know how things are going.

unicornomore
unicornomore
8 years ago
Reply to  Arlo

My best guess is that he started cheating during my second pregnancy…I cant prove it but I think its so

Anita
Anita
8 years ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Unicorn no more. Falling in a crotch is more like it. I refuse to call this cheater bullshit love. It’s an easy commitment free fuck. Always.

PTBarnum
PTBarnum
8 years ago

Totally agree here. I just got the 411 on the Atomic Bomd that in all likelihood will be coming my way shortly from the Friends with Bennifts. Long story short stbxh was working and living overseas, in a”friend from work” apartment. There have been problems for a while, and due to the financial strain of maintaing two living situations, he has “sparkled” the situation with seeking a transfer back to the US, so we can resolve our issues. Low and behold he arrives back the night before Thanksging, with nothing but his briefcase, no suitcase. When guestioned he says airline lost his bag.OK. Over holiday weekend no attempts to contact airline and see if it has been found and can be picked up or delivered. Drum Roll.

He fesses up on Sunday evening that when he returned to the overseas apartment the day he was leaving (where he was only “renting a room”) the locks were changed and he could not retrieve his belongs. OW-BFF went ape shit that he was going back to The US. I am then told that she is a psychopath, and a typical hard drinking Russian that wil go to no lengths to distory him, and that I and my daughter should not believe anything she may send to us via email, outline of events they shared, photos etc. Really.

Chump4Bolero
Chump4Bolero
8 years ago

…”Oh, and turns out he’s married, with a kid!!!”…
…”I know my tone has been condescending and mean-spirited, but that’s because I’m pissed. I was lied to and the kicker is he will likely not be held accountable at all. Maybe this will inspire you to pull your head out of the sand, but I truly doubt it. Guys like this get away with this kind of shit all the time because they marry pushovers. I don’t feel sorry for you, I feel sorry for the other women he lies too while you enable him.”…

^^^That’s some kind of twisted letter.^^^ Two thoughts:

1. -sounds like a recent discovery by a crazed OW (could be an old flame or someone completely new and snowed over).

2. -sounds like a revenge letter aimed at your husband using you (Ami) as the poison arrow.

My bet is hubby may be on his own best image spackling behavior for a while, too. –Until next time. If he texted you while in a relationship, I’d be wondering what else he’s capable of doing.

I understand not wanting to rush to judgement but re: your Mom – ask yourself this, in your mom’s heart, who is important? My bet is on you. Seems it is an awful lot to hold in to ‘protect an image of perfection’ which has been leveled a blow of doubt. That’s kind of the Ivory Tower of isolation.

If you can’t share it with mom right now, how about a trusted friend? I could never have navigated the questions and feelings of betrayal on my own – needed my peeps, and found CL & CN…

Know this – you are no push over because you wrote Chump Lady – IMO. Good for you – it takes strength to ask for insight.

Ami
Ami
8 years ago

After I read all this I went to a few free dating sites and looked up a username he has used for different things in the past, his first name and madeup last name. I found a profile on one of them. It says he hasn’t logged on in a year…we were living with each other for almost two years then! Some of his profile pics are ones I took when he took me home to meat his family!
Someone mentioned that he may have wanted to move to leave his past ways behind him. Maybe he was doing something before? Maybe he wants to start our family life fresh?
I worry about the former FWB, she really hung him out to dry in his last relationship. He says he wasn’t guilty of the things she said back then. Maybe he saw her again or talked to her before we moved and she knows we got married and had a baby and she’s trying to mess with him? I met her once before we dated. He said she was the longest relationship he’d had with a girl at that point but they never really dated because she wouldn’t put up with his shit.
How does this person know where I live?

Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
Dr. I Can't Believe I'm a Chump
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, you keep mentioning the FWB. Have you looked at the postmark on the letter envelope?

Elizabeth Lee
Elizabeth Lee
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, you said he used photos that YOU took on his dating site profile?!? Photos you took when you went to meet his family? He came home and loaded those on a dating site so he could troll for other women?

That’s some pretty strong evidence that he’s a cheater.

creativerational
creativerational
8 years ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Just remember Ami to keep calm and keep this on the down low, while you get ready. Anger is later. Today is quiet burning rage that fuels your plans. Inside. the fury is ok later when you have him in a corner with more evidence and lots of guilt, so you end up with a good secure agreement.

You’re asking yourself if he’s changed, and is trying to start fresh- but how is it fresh if he’s just putting more lies on top of lies he told to get you here.

Had he said ‘baby momma, I was a terrible douche, but now we are married and I want to do right. I’m going to get rid of my phone and get an amazing job and we are going to live next door to your parents and I’m gonna wear an ankle bracelet so you know where I am, and you will have the only computer in the house and the history never deletes… Because I want you to trust me and be near your support system’ maybe then I would think he was paying penance. Right now he’s a cake eater- baby momma and baby for pristine image management … Doing God knows what elsewhere. What matters is you’re alone and you don’t know either.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

I totally agree. The denial, blameshifting, and rage at your distrust of him, Ami, will commence in 10, 9, 8, 7……

KB22
KB22
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami, not to be nosy, but how financially dependent are you on him? Or is he in any way financially dependent on you? I would also question how much each of you contributed to the down payment on your home, would you stand to lose more if it went into foreclosure? The POA is disturbing and for him to even come up with that lame brained idea would appear to be some sort of scheme or scam in my book. Let him think that you believe his story and work on getting to the bottom of this mess.

Over and Out
Over and Out
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Just another thought… Your husband has a FB account. Who are his friends there? It was my experience that my ex had many female friends (back then MySpace was the thing before FB). He was chatting up lots of women and sending private messages. Also check your computer’s history. My ex was in the habit of clearing it to hide his tracks. He got careless about deleting it an that’s how I discovered his extra email account. Check phone records online. They keep track of # of texts sent and received, time, date, length, and phone #’s… You can google your husband’s name and your name to see what information is online about you.

Over and Out
Over and Out
8 years ago
Reply to  Over and Out

Do not alert him to your sleuthing. If he is not being truthful with you, he will be more diligent about hiding any shady activities if he knows you are watching… Good luck!!

Chump4Bolero
Chump4Bolero
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Ami – How does the OW know where you live? Good Q – Omg, I worked with a gal who in a fit of jealousy and doubt followed her BF around herself.

If the OW really didn’t know about you, marriage, baby, thought she was the only one, she definitely did some research to find out otherwise. Maybe work related? At the Gym related? Old flame from school? Internet hook up?

Doesn’t sound like your husband answered you with too many specifics…

I would copy this letter and give it to someone you trust.

chump-tastic
chump-tastic
8 years ago
Reply to  Ami

Oh Ami, I’m so sorry. But I’m glad you found us. You can see how quickly those of us here jump in to try to help you, because we’ve been there. We know exactly how you feel. It sucks and it’s so jarring. And this is the WORST timing for you. It’s so hard for people to learn from the mistakes of their friends instead of making those mistakes themselves, but I beg of you, please do the hard work of splitting up with him now. It will be so much better for you and your child in the long run. I doubt that any of us started out as cynical people won’t don’t “believe in love” or anything like that, and most of us are still not that way. We’ve just given our cheaters second, third, and sometimes 49th chances, and we see how it all turns out in the end. Many of us wish we had the opportunity to find out and get out as early on as you do. Please don’t squander this wonderful opportunity, even if it came from a crappy letter like the one you got.

I was totally the other woman when I met my ex, and I had no idea. He told lots of lies, and used the fact that his ex wasn’t into social media to hide that she even still existed in his life. I felt like an idiot when I had the realization that they HAD still been together when he started things up with me. And of course, he did the same thing to me years later (and let’s face it, during and throughout our relationship probably). Now that I’ve known him for many years, I can see that he always lines up relationships way in advance of dumping the current one. He always has an escape hatch, and it’s all part of his plan. I know you want to believe, and you want to think you’ll be the one that’s important enough for him to stop. The truth is, you ARE important. Just not to him. Please don’t let that stop you from living an awesome life. I know you feel that you’ve invested too much time and energy in him to quit now, but he quit on you long ago. If you don’t ditch him now, you’ll be kicking yourself in another 5 or 10 years. Get rid of him, and don’t let your child see you accepting this kind of abuse as normal.

woahisme
woahisme
8 years ago

Ami,

I’m so sorry you got this letter. I had to find OW’s letter when I was 8-mo pregnant. I’m sure she was threatened by the baby. It was awful. This ‘should’ be the “best” time of your life.

This “OW” is a horrid, scored person. Tracy is right—-no chump would write such a vitriolic letter to another chump. She probably knew about you and got pissed that your husband wouldn’t give her more of a commitment, or “kibbles.” She is clearly character disordered, not just a shitty human being. She is selfish and could care less about the impact this could have on you and your baby (more on that later). But no one would go out of their way to write such a terrible letter–not with so many details–unless they were telling the truth about cheating with him. And no ex-girlfriend would do this, especially after so much time. I agree that the only motivation to hurt a woman who just gave birth would be to hurt your husband.

About your husband: Is he a narcissist? Charming guy? Averse to criticism? Have defensiveness or reactive anger? Is he controlling? Look up narcissism, if you’re not familiar. While infidelity is a narcissistic act, the NPD’s seem to do it more. There is also a high correlation btw promiscuity before marriage and later infidelity. Cheating happens more in the military, too.

Be smart. Hire a PI and don’t let on that you suspect anything. Borrow the money if you have to, but do it. Otherwise, you will stay with him and constantly wonder about his actions. You can also check out “Spy” stores online. They have magnetic GPS tracking devices you can place under his truck and you can log in to check out his travel history. You can also install something into his cell phone to capture text messages, and there’s something you can get for his computer to monitor his key strokes. Then there are voice activated audio recording devices you can place under the seat of his truck. Just some suggestions.

I thought my ex was the “love of my life” and had zero idea he was cheating with OW. I was the happiest I’d ever been in my life up until that time, which made the fall that much harder since I never would have thought in a million years he could do such a thing. Do not listen to what your husband tells you. Instead, listen to your “gut.” I knew something was wrong, but him cheating wasn’t even in my option pool at the time. You have a leg up by getting this letter, sad though it may be.

This is not the end of your story. You will move forward because you have a child now. It is true that your baby will either choose a partner who cheats on them or become a cheater if you stay with a cheating spouse. The shit runs in families. Break the cycle, as painful as it is, and give your baby the chance to have a different relationship template in life.

If a man cheats during your pregnancy, he is the lowest of the low. If your husband cheated, he put you–and your baby– at risk for STDs (PLEASE get tested). You know what can happen to a child that contracts Herpes during pregnancy? It’s not good. Let alone, bacterial vaginosis, which is much more common, and can kill your baby in utero. No, some things change the fabric of a relationship forever.

If your spouse has had such flagrant disregard for the life you’ve built together, than surely you and that gorgeous baby of yours deserve better. Follow the advice from everyone. Get the info you need, and take steps to protect yourself. Focus on being there for your baby, find support where ever you can, and start counseling ASAP. Babies can feel what’s going on around them. If you get postpartum depression, your milk supply can stop. Nursing moms secrete oxytocin, a hormone that helps with bonding and secure attachment. Not to mention, breast milk helps with later immune system support. Safeguard your baby’s health by making sure you stay healthy.

Hugs and better times to you.

WIM

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago

Ami, I know you’re grasping for straws and trying to come up with any scenario that will help you make sense of this situation. But he put up pictures on a dating site that YOU took when you were visiting his parents for the first time? You had been living with him for two years when he logged into this account?

I understand how much you want to believe him. You must be completely overwhelmed with all the info you’ve read here, I’m sure you haven’t even thought of half the things people have told you to consider. Just remember to take baby steps. I still think it would be good to have a professional or a good friend to help you investigate. Then you can focus on taking care of yourself and your baby, and reconnect with friends and family to build a support network. When I was in the stage you’re in, I focused on getting myself into as strong a position as I could. No matter what happens, it will benefit you to have good social support.

If you do discover that he’s cheating, you will be able to reach out for help to your network. You won’t have to do it all on your own. There are plenty of people who can guide you, help you, and support you. Don’t hesitate to ask for help.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Lyn

So sorry Ami, but finding his online profile is equivalent to replacing suspicion with proof. The person you thought you were married might never have existed.

Take screen shots of the online profiles, and all other profiles you might find! Hide these things in a new email address just for you (use google drive and an external memory stick too). Make copies of all paystubs and other financial documents (tax returns included) and hide them away as well.

Then, sit down with your MOM and put together a household a budget (see my comment above). Putting your household budget is more critical than before, if your husband does not agree to a new distribution of your marital assets, you can use the budget during your divorce proceedings.

Cheaters fucking suck balls, I am so angry for you and your kid, finding out about your husband as a new mom is beyond unfair and must be even more heart wrenching than when I found out when my kid was in elementary school. I know you are reeling, but please do listen to CN, the proof you have uncovered is devastating, but getting out now is probably going to save you and your baby a world of pain.

Liz
Liz
8 years ago
Reply to  Chumptitude

Get a credit report as well. There’s little that escapes that review of information.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Chumptitude

Chumptitude is so right–download all the information you can, make copies in duplicate, and keep the materials in two separate places/USB drives (one of them out of the house). I’m sorry you’re in this position, Ami. As much as it hurts, better to find out now than after you’ve wasted two decades of your life with the serial cheater.