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Other Women and the Universal Sisterhood

Isn’t it nice when the Other Woman understands you? No, really better than you understand yourself! She knows so many things about you, and your kids too (the poor resilient little lambs). And just because you’re frigid, controlling, and batshit crazy, does not mean she doesn’t have sympathy — and hey, maybe a few suggestions on how you could do better.

Shall we take a moment to meditate on the condescension of mistresses and have a collective vomit? BleeeerrrrrcccchhhhHHhh.

I feel compelled to write about Sara Symonds and OW of her ilk. Symonds, you may recall, is the professional mistress I appeared on a HuffPo panel with recently. She is a self described “recovering” mistress of 15 years — “been clean over three years” — and once ran the site Mistresses Anonymous.

A bit on Ms. Symonds, who struck me rather as a Mary Poppins of infidelity. Perky in all the wrong places. She claims to have been the OW to Gordon Ramsey, the apoplectic chef of television fame, and more revoltingly, Jeffrey Archer. Archer, if you’re not keen on British politics, is a fabulist and NPD extraordinaire. A disgraced former member of parliament, he was jailed on various scams, but went on to write best-selling novels. (Putting that talent for fiction to good use, apparently.) Ringo Starr once described Archer as a “the kind of bloke who would bottle your piss and sell it.”

So when it comes to falling for narcissist sparkles, Ms. Symonds has quite the resumé. Having spent most of her adult life as a mistress (shacked up in a swanky part of Westminster on some guy’s dime), she missed out on those other things adults do, like obtain some professional rank, marry, have children. She instead now fashions herself as the:

World’s first and only Infidelity Analyst, you can imagine that I’m a pretty busy girl. A real life mix between Carrie Bradshaw, Dear Amy, and a smidge of Jackie Collins thrown in.

And a simulacrum of Gypsy Rose Lee with a sprinkle of  Nancy Reagan. Followed by a light dusting of Barbara Walters. She’s like your girlfriend, Girlfriend!

In the name of universal sisterhood, we need to all get along.

Said Symonds on HuffPo Live:

“As women in the sisterhood, I think we should all be on the same page, because wives and mistresses have got so much in common. They’re both sharing half of a man who’s lying and getting the best of two women.”

Isn’t that funny? Where was the OW’s sisterhood when she was screwing your husband?

I don’t blog about affair partners that much, because it has a tendency of devolving away from the subject at hand — your particular cheater. Yes, I think OW/OM are culpable, yes, I think they suck. But really, at the end of the day, they are beside the point. First of all, they’re usually not the only one, and second of all — if your cheater had boundaries, this wing nut would not be in your life, period.

But I have to take issue with the galling condescension OW have for chumped wives. It really is quite the leit motif among the comments at Stupid Shit Affair Partners Say and the comments of Ms. Symonds, a wannabe celebrity mistress. Oh you poor benighted chump, you just don’t know your man.

Symonds provides a handy list of How-Tos for you to keep your husband, after she’s done with him. (You can have him back, no really.) She calls this “Wife School.” Yes, wives need schools. Sluts? Hey, they’re just born with it.

Have sex with him every day! “Don’t pile on the weight after you get ‘comfortable’ with him, nor let your dress sense go. Looking good will help YOU feel better, as well as making sure your husband only has eyes for you.” Be attentive! Ask him about his day! Put a fresh ribbon in your hair when you greet him at the door.

Oh hang on, no that last one was from a women’s home economic’s textbook from 1955, entitled How To Be a Good Wife. But you get the idea, chumps. Be good kibbles, and they’ll never stray.

Yeah. Right.

It’s easy to dismiss Ms. Symonds as an attention-whore in a leopard-print bustier, but her attitudes about infidelity and marriage are sadly common. I guess that crap sells. But from one “Infidelity Analyst” to another, Sarah — sisters don’t fuck other sister’s husbands. We have less in common than you think.

This column ran previously. Having a SNOW day today! Wheee!

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Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at info@chumplady.com. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • ‘Sister’s don’t fuck other ‘sister’s husband’s – especially when you know the wife. Personally, that makes the OW just as culpable as the cheater. THEY can’t claim. ‘he said he was single’. I treated the OW now 2nd wife like a daughter. Yes she is 21 years younger. And she wonder s if my son’s will ever forgive her.

    • Same thing here. She was 20 years younger. Had dinner at my house tons of time with my family. My son won’t talk with his Dad either. The Double betrayal is one fucked up shit sandwich.

      This OW has no excuse, she knew exactly what was happening in my home, she knew exactly how much I loved my EX, she knew exactly what a great family we were. But yes, he allowed her into our home, and he is the most horrible of the two.

      • Oh man. Hello fellow double betrayals. Mine was my maid of honor. Signed my marriage certificate as a witness! Loved her like a sister. I was with the stbx 20 years. Shit sandwich indeed. Getting to meh though, because now I’m glad they did me the favor and are both out of my life. Still writing through the divorce…

        • Lotus Dancer wow! I think this is the worst. Questioning your entire past. You bf and your husband. Big betrayal. Hard to trust anyone after that. Hugs to you!

        • Your maid of honor! Egads, she is evil. So sorry you were betrayed like this. Glad you are here and recovering!

        • Maid of (dis)honour, Lotus. Maggot!

          Mine had been friends with me since we were 10 and 11. Not best friends. But long friendship. Her mother taught our two youngest children. I served as PTA chair with her mother, a few years earlier. He on the school board alongside her as teacher rep. And I took pity on OW because she was really struggling as a single mum (she stole sperm from a used condom off a client she occasionally fucked – I found that out much later, her version was broken relationship after deciding to have a child together.) So, I invited her everywhere. (Babysat for her at times, to give her a break. Lord knows I never got one parenting three much older kids!) Including to our holiday home regularly. She came when he was there AND when it was just us ‘girls’ and the kids. I still squirm when I think of how they played me. Stupid little ‘wifey. ‘

          These APs that befriend and interact sweetly with us are toxic AF. And the partners who sit back and let it happen, cruel and totally twisted. It is unforgivable. I know because totally remorseful man who ended it before I ever knew (or even suspected) And did everything to try to fix what he broke. I will never really get over what they did. I move on. But the effects are permanent. And although I know I did the right thing ending it, the grief of losing almost 30 really amazingly good years (along with a few shit ones in wreckonciliation) is still strong, despite all I have and will achieve. Betrayal is shit. Double betrayal literally nearly killed me. (Yup, two suicide attempts in the aftermath.)

      • Chompingchump, is the OW a family member/relative? I am curious about how you would end up paying to educate an OW. Of course, on CL we have all kinds of twisted situations, don’t we? Blah! Cheaters are scum!

    • Amen, sister!
      I’m a simple creature, not sophisticated. The sisterhood means you don’t undermine other women. So rule number one, don’t undermine your sisters by fucking their partners. Rule number two, don’t undermine your sisters by fucking their partners. Rule number 3, if you still don’t get it, fuck you, you’re no sister.

  • Upon revealing their affair to me, my now ex-husband’s secret affair partner informed me that I had been in a sexless marriage for years (yes, years). However, I feel she overlooked the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, considering I was 6 months pregnant with our 4th child (aged 5 and under).

    Perhaps I will understand her mathematical calculations better when I graduate from “Wife School”…..

    • It is amazing how their powers of justification can re-write history. And same here…hard to believe that AP continued to believe that husband was unhappy and in a sexless marriage when the wife is pregnant. They are spackling and avoiding the obvious fact that the husband is quite simply a complete liar and manipulator.

      Good luck with that and thank you for distracting STBX so I could go as no contact as possible while having kids. It allowed me to start to see clearly and get free.

      • The subtitle for all CL comments and posts could be “Narcissists Sure Do Rationalize Their Selfish Behavior!”

        Part of the mindfuck Chumpdom is being the gaslighted solo truth teller. While lying would possibly drive you and me crazy with guilt and anxiety, our cheaters have some sort of magic dark super power of rapidly reparsing facts in real time.

        Part of meh and disconnecting from these folks is realizing their narrative exists in some toxic upside alternate universe

    • I also was told that I hadn’t had sex with Fucktard for over 20 years. It’s so nice that my 22 year-old DD was miraculously conceived without sex.

      • It’s uncannily jarring to find out your husband was complaining/lying/mischaracterizing about your intimate/sex life to third parties. Especially randoms.

        • Same. Same. Same. Same. Same. We never had sex. For nine of the ten years we were married. And when we DID have sex I HATED it. It was forced. So for 1 year 9 years ago I was raped. Yeah. That’s what happened. I was FORCED to have sex never in our sexless marriage. It’s all just SO PATHETIC. They come up with ANY lies they can to try to justify whatever it is they wanted to do. In fact our terrible sex life was so terrible he had to tell his mom, his BFF, his boss, his other BFF AND the whoremat. Did he say anything to ME about it? For YEARS?! …………….That is the sound of crickets. He told me once “I need more sex” and that was it. But it wasn’t “I need sex or I will leave you. I’m so unhappy we need therapy. I can’t stay in this relationship any longer because I am not satisfied and I must move on if we don’t have more sex. When you don’t initiate sex to my undefinable but definitely present imaginary levels of what will ‘make me happy’ then that means you don’t love me anymore and I WILL cheat on you.” It was “I need more sex” and then when he got “more sex” that wasn’t enough either, surprise. Surprise that it’s hard to be endlessly horny for your husband when he barely acknowledges you and then thinks you should be ripping his pants off like a porn star. Apparently saying I love you 1,000 times a day and doing all the little things in relationships that make them special means nothing. But when a whore opens HER legs and SHE says “I love you” that’s real and true. I KNOW I could have done more, but it’s not easy to be more and want more intimacy when they are so distant, giving it all to the whore.

          • I hear you, Sad Shelby. But they conveniently forget, gloss over or flat out lie about those details. It’s never what THEY did, only what you did or didn’t do (in reaction to their actions). Sigh. Meh.

          • I could have written this verbatim:
            “He told me once “I need more sex” and that was it. But it wasn’t “I need sex or I will leave you. I’m so unhappy we need therapy. I can’t stay in this relationship any longer because I am not satisfied and I must move on if we don’t have more sex. When you don’t initiate sex to my undefinable but definitely present imaginary levels of what will ‘make me happy’ then that means you don’t love me anymore and I WILL cheat on you.”

            Except instead of flat out saying “I need more sex” he gave me a garbled rant one single time and I had no idea what he was talking about at all. It really made no sense.

            Then later he said he tried to tell me.

              • I wanted sex – but was put off by his 70’s Porno moustache – and the sense that I was a 2 bit extra in the 70’s porno movie – yes rather he went pay for that and left me out of it.

          • Sad Shelby, I got the not enough sex speech, every time I made an effort, more first moves, I got pushed away. Eventually after DDay2 completely sexless because he didn’t want to touch me, not the other way around. Mr “I’ve got the hardest erections for a man my age” went limp. He was just being faithful to his mistress, but didn’t tell me. Complete discard.
            We are part of a sadly large club…
            So the OWs can shove their advice up their arses.

      • Mr. Sparkles often remarked we didn’t have sex the last two years of our marriage. What he failed to add was that it was because I found his ad on Adult Friend Finder looking for women/couples/groups and I was not willing to die for him… get a blood test and come to marriage counseling… he declined. But again – it was my fault. Fuckers.

    • In my case it was STBX himself who informed me that we had been in a sexless marriage before he strayed. That was news to me because I was having regular sex up until that point after which I was left to wonder and fret over why he seemed to be losing his sex drive. Maybe that was his clone I was making love to all those years. If so, couldn’t he have at least left me the clone when he ran off with Schmoopie?

      • I knew ours had fallen off but still to hear Swiss Miss tell me I was having not enough sex pissed me right the f off. I had other stuff going on at the time besides my o face.

        • And maybe if he had helped you with some of that other stuff and romanced you a little it would not have fallen off. Swiss Miss will figure it out when he tells the next one how she was neglecting him.

          • Maybe if he touched you like he loved you instead of as doing just enough foreplay that it didn’t squeak going in?

      • I was informed I was asexual, although we had regular sex, before being informed he wanted a menage a trois with his ex. That “sister” was conveniently willing to oblige. How nice when you don’t even have to look after your own kid 50% of the time, because I am looking after him as part of the shared custody. Who wouldn’t want a free childminder for 10 years, while growing a career and having the spare time to fuck around with one’s ex while the son is being looked after by the chump? Awesome arrangement for the “sister”.

  • My cheating ex-wife and the mumbo jumbo these OW regurgitate share many similarities.

    These are prople who are incapable of “normal” thought process and hinge on an absurd self centerdness and and overwhelming need for attention.

    Yawn…..they are not experts in relationships, there’s an underlying and obvious resentment and competition aspect in their actions. These people take pleasure in destroying others and believing in their own bullshit.

    These sorts of people never experience true intimacy and everything they feel is shallow. These are people who only feel alive if they are killing someone’s life. The drama and deceit feeds their value.

    These people are vampires and they will suck your blood and find pleasure in hurting anyone in their way.

    She ain’t no expert in relationships, just like a butcher is not an expert in life saving surgery.

    • PF, you nailed it! “…there’s an underlying and obvious resentment and competition aspect in their actions. These people take pleasure in destroying others and believing in their own bullshit.” The OW in my case was a “friend” as well, and she knew exactly what she was doing and why she was doing it. She wanted my life and set her sights on getting it, not caring that 4 kids and 2 unwitting chumps were going to get hurt. They are below contemptuous.

    • Amen. Word for word. This is my ex and his mistress. Attention whores that will never know what true intimacy is. They poison everyone in their wake. It’s sick.

    • My STBX ‘s AP was crazily jealous of our family and lifestyle and hopes to replicate now that divorce nearly final. Good luck with that – my three wonderful young adult children had a rock-solid chumps mother and a relatively invested father (until he went off rails) — not a self-centered millennial whore and aged-depressed-divorced dad who has lost respect of everyone who ever knew him

    • “She ain’t no expert in relationships, just like a butcher is not an expert in life saving surgery.” Awesome PF, I’m adding this to my list of come backs if the girltress ever dares to show up at an event I am present at…

    • This, so well put. From the conversations between them that I read, I got the distinct impression that, apart from gaining access to our money to fund her lifestyle, bringing me down was her second most important goal. She saw me as a competitor that she had to beat, and I had never even met her, let alone knew that there was a competition going on until Dday. Ah, the joy of encountering the personality disordered.

  • Came across a text from OW #2 to ex, planning to have her meet me and have a chat to help me deal with the situation as she felt sorry for me and how hard a time I was having. Evidentally ex took me seriously when I told him, very quietly, that if his bitch came anywhere near me or my son, I would not be responsible for my actions . Meeting never happened lol

  • Email from OW#2 was clear eyed about STBX’s deficiencies and how she knew he had been cheating on her even though he lied. She did say that she realised she was getting a taste of her own medicine but I don’t think 4 years of hookups counts besides a 22 year marriage with three boys.

    Then this.
    One section of OW#3 email to me.

    “From the beginning I knew I am doing an awful thing but I was selfish enough to follow my ruthless desire. Though thinking deeper the only reason I can find is I was searching for a family, the happy family I never had. The family supporting each other. The way xxxxx talked about you all, the beautiful family he has, the closeness you have all together made me stoned. I had no intention to hurt anyone of you. I was stoned and blind. ”

    She offered to talk to me on the phone to tell me how we could get past this, that we would be stronger for it and how much he loves me.
    Incredible.
    She was a lot less keen once she found out he had cheated on her too, that she was one in a line and she also might want to get tested for STD’s.

    No true love here at all, sought or given. It was just cheap thrills and sex and company. When all the dust has settled it will look even more of a waste.

    I just really fucking hope what goes around comes around. Sisterhood my arse.

      • What really burns me is that he used us as bait. He used his image of a great family man to tempt them in. How stupid do you have to be to see that this ‘great family man’ is cheating on said family with you. He didn’t say he was misunderstood or not getting any or anything. He boasted about what a great family we were. A mindfuck of epic proportions. I believed we were. They believed we were. Just fucked up all of it.
        It’s right to not untangle the skein as it makes no bloody sense at all.

        • Wow, this is so disordered. OW3 sounds psychologically disturbed. The cheaters sell out their family for cheap thrills. Just terrible.

        • I think using the family as bait must be pretty common. I recall my EX doing his best to attract a waitress 30 years his junior while eating with his family. He was such a “good Dad” doting on his kids. He was such a “good husband” being polite to me and making a show of asking if I wanted anything after he flagged the young woman down (for the 8th time). The meal was surreal. I watched the performance in stunned silence.

          After the meal he suggested I go take the kids out to the car while he paid the check. He never paid the check, so I knew he was just trying to get me out of the way. I circled back to a plate glass window where I observed him cornering the waitress and handing her cash and his business card. To the best of my knowledge, she was smart enough to steer clear of future encounters, but evidently he thought that presenting himself as a fine family man would make him too appealing to resist.

          • Dogs, too. I was so impressed when my X took it upon himself to take the dogs on special outings every Sunday–to the creek, to a park. I now suspect he was using it to pick up women, or to have time for texting his mistress-du-jour.

            • My dog was cover for drug use out in the woods as well as sex phone calls while hidden behind the trees.

              The happy family is definitely bait … how many women would want to be with the loser guy living in his mom’s basement? The OW aspire to replacing the wife in a nice home with stable income and attentive dad for their future kids together. The whole package.

              • And when they start building the replacement family, it is sickening. My STBX left because he no longer wanted the “married and family life.” Within a year, he has set up a home with the 21 year younger OW, just bought a puppy together, got personalized Christmas stockings (that look eerily like the ones we got almost 20 years ago). Next up I’m sure will be a kid. It is sickening and mentally messed up. My poor kids…

              • Yes, but what kind of mental disconnect is there that they see this as making sense? Oh, he’s such a good family man, and he’ll treat me just like he treats her. Uh, yes, he’s cheating and shitting on all the stuff he’s using as bait by the very act of the affair. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

            • The OW in my case gave my X a Father’s Day card signed from all of her animals as well as from my dogs. I found it among his things after he took off to “get some space”. Considering the fact that the dogs were a gift for our daughter, I still find her delusional behavior astounding.

            • Hiking too, hiking many miles up steep mountains of which would be too much for me and our son but not so for his triathlete AP.

              I did some research and found some less treacherous hiking trails and I suggested we go hiking as a family. X wasn’t interested and seemed annoyed at my suggestion. One of those moments when you know there’s something not right but not sure what it is..,

        • I guess it’s not really as twisted as it seems because biologically family men are a better bet than the alpha that runs around banging everything. In the sense that women need men around to keep their children safe and provide family men make total sense. The problem is once the whore steals that great provider away he’s ruined and everything is destroyed, the actual family unit and the desirable committed mate too. The OWhore doesn’t get that everything she wants, the family, the stability, the committed man can be hers if SHE FINDS HER OWN! (PLEASE do not think I condone ANY of the idea that mate poaching is okay!) My idiot cheater was awesome until he wasn’t. I did many of the things on that RIDICULOUS list of how to be your husband’s mistress and he still got sucked in by a whore. And the whoremat in my case is a total mate poacher. She had a shitty husband that she didn’t (and probably never!) love and my cheater was “the nicest person” she’d ever met. And her own mother used to tell her how she was useless and to do anything to keep a good man around (red flags anyone?!). So of course when he came around as “friends” she latched onto him saying “No one deserves to be abused. He should love you and treat you right. Don’t take that from him. He’s dragging you down and you can make it without him.” That’s all she needed. Someone to validate her. And then BAM! She was SO IN LOVE that she Just Couldn’t Help Herself and her legs flew open and he tripped as accidentally fell in. (We all know the rest of how that goes!) What she doesn’t get is that all the good characteristics she liked in him she TOTALLY FUCKING RUINED by cheating with him. Her husband that cheated on her? Now she has MY husband that’s a cheater. The guy that didn’t treat her right? After the devaluation now she has MY husband that devalues women. Her husband that made WAY less than she did and didn’t offer anything financially? Now she has MY husband that makes like 1/6 of what she does.

          I KNOW my idiot cheater is NOT an innocent, by any stretch of the imagination, however at the same time, if those idiot WHORES would just BACK TF OFF things would be much better for everyone. The worst part of all of it is, it actually WASN’T TWU WUV (I’m SHOCKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That twu wuv didn’t exist based on a few months of texting about how awful each other’s spouses were. And BTW not giving enough blow jobs with cum swallowing put me in the same category as an alcoholic that hits and cheats) And ten years of marriage and 14 years of a relationship with BFF ended up NOT being worth sacrificing for the whoremat. The luster has already rubbed off that ragged see you next Tuesday and here we all are in this shit show. ☹️ SMH

          • Sad Shelby
            You are so right. I said to him when I found out that if these women had known him and loved him as I do/did then they would have asked him what the fuck he was thinking of by cheating on these great people in his family? What kind of man did he want to be?
            They would have saved him from himself. But that was when I thought he was actually a decent human being with ethics and morals and such.
            Someone else here said, when I was struggling with how many nice things he had said about us to the OW, that he was probably getting them to do the pick me dance for him. To try and better this perfect ‘wife’ person. Makes a horrible kind of sense.

            • The mow co worker thought that neglecting her 4 kids and husband by showing respect (gag) to wh and his family business made her super desirable and wanted and important. She showed up alone at our family functions, driving hours on Friday nights through snow to show how awesome and loyal she was. She presented as cuckoo pants however. When I opted out of the ensuing narcopalooza boundary-less celebrations of self, I mean funerals, I was screamed at from all sides for disrespecting the family. Dis. Respecting. The. Family. I explained that my absence was not the drama, that my absence was not fucking up the family image. They were a laughing stock of hillbilly assholes with or without me. I was called hateful and then crickets. The ow opened her gaping wet hole of a hot dog bun face too many times industry-wide, ventured into crazy and was fired. They were shocked that she had been a liar about work things. Hard to type with a straight face. Wh et al were incredulous.

              In true narc dynasty fashion, neither I nor the too-dumb-to-sue-for-wrongful-dismissal mow exist in anyone’s memory. After being told “you’re fired and don’t ever contact any of us again” 3 yrs ago, she keeps trying to re-engage people in the company for info. She’s about as subtle as a punch to the tit. To all women fucking yourself to the middle, this is what 50 looks like.

          • There will always be women willing to sleep with married men.

            There are also men who are married and would never even think of cheating.

            Yes,the OW can’t justify their behavior as they are sleaze bags. However, the egg you lost wasn’t poached, Sad. He was rotten.

        • I also experienced X using our lives as some sort a carrot to be dangled in front of OW. She didn’t just want my husband, she wanted my life; she wanted to be me. Needless to say,that didn’t happen, but not for lack of effort on her part.

          What was even more bizarre, though, was how during X’s individual sessions with our marriage counselor, X would tell the MC how much he loved me, what a great wife I was, and how we had built such a great life together. It made me crazy! If everything was so wonderful, why in the hell was he continuing to cheat?

          There certainly was no “sisterhood’ with the OW; she was looking for someone with assets, plain and simple. She was tired of playing the role of poor little church mouse and was ready for the life of conspicuous consumption. I have never seen such a blatant money grab in my life, which actually worked very well to my advantage later on.

          There was another thing that some of my friends pointed out to me. OW had no, and I mean no, female friends. If OW was in a group of women, and a man came into the group, she would immediately turn all her attention to the man. She also looked for ways to diminish women’s accomplishments, often by using her twisted “Christian” logic that women were inferior to men. She made it very clear that she viewed women as competition, and she was constantly seeking male attention and approval. I believe this trait is common among OW. There certainly is no “sisterhood” with these types of women because they are incapable of supportive female friendships.

          • Yes, Violet, this OW also had no women friends – the only friend SHE had was CHUMPY me. I agree most OW do not have real women friendships.

            In her “apology” to me, she actually had the guts to say that “she wanted what I had” that “it was fucked up, but she just couldn’t explain it” Well be careful what you wish for, you have him, nothing else though…

            When I first confronted her, I actually asked her – “What do you like in him – I mean he is 20 years older than you” and she said “well I know he can be an asshole, but he’s a lot like my father, and I always knew that I would end up with someone like him” ew ew ew – I had a good laugh at that one and enjoyed so much telling my EX that..

            • Ah, the women-haters. Put men on a pedestal, dethrone any woman who is viewed as either having a throne or as a rival. I wonder how many cheating men have been raised by man-worshippers? And the best cover, the women-hating women I know work in woman-dominated fields where caring and other “womanly” gentleness traits are traditionally needed. Teachers, social workers (obvs some, not all)…. “but all I do is help people all day! I’m soooooo good”.

              My first shrink told me straight out, “your mother in law and the mow are identical – and they are woman-haters and man worshippers.” Men are always better, special, adorable, charming……girls be bitches lol.

              • Weirdly interesting concept.

                If I were to dig into this because it fits, it would take away time needed in reviewing my taxes. Not.going.there.

    • I’m laughing about the word ‘deficiencies’ coming from one who lacks morals and knowingly has sex with married men.

      Here’s to passing the torch along with the many deficiencies the OW gets to keep including:

      Alcoholic
      Drug abuser
      Serial cheater
      Pathological liar
      Covert Narcissist
      Sociopath
      Multiple partners simultaneously
      STD’S
      Ability to abandon children

      That’s the short list.

      Half a man? Laughing again.. Yup,heaing loss, bed wetter, constant complaints, bad back, lack of work, need for constant adoration of his wee wittle useless dick are all yours for the keep.

    • Ohdeargawd! Cap, “Ruthless desire?” What is that, whore-speak for slitting the wife’s throat in her sleep and then screaming “Snapped!“ when busted? Or was that when ya repeatedly struck her over the head with the fireplace poker until her head looked like a six month “after” motif of a Halloween pumpkin?

      “The closeness you all had together made me stoned.” What in gawds name do you SMOKE? Or vape? “I had no intention to hurt any one of you.” Or is that smoke possibly the scent of the arson you instigated at Cap’s house? “I was stoned and blind?” Sounds like “Fifty Shades of Graves” to me. Listen, when you TELL someone you had “no intention to hurt” them, that’s when the appointed attorney at your Arraignment for Arson and Premeditated Murder busts a baseball bat in your mouth and requests a psychiatric evaluation.

      Cap, here’s the plan for your approval: Just let her lie in the wet spot. Moisture is an excellent conductor of electricity. Maybe this time they’ll try the shock treatments on her ass….

    • Me too, I so hope that he gets exactly what he deserves. That she (20 yrs younger) discards his ass, for younger ass, and breaks his heart into tiny little pieces – I still think that even then he won’t get what he did to our beautiful family.

      This past Sunday, I had both my kids (college age) home, and what beautiful human beings they are becoming. And I was just there staring at them and thinking, “You jackass, you are missing this. These kids are amazing, and for you to not want to be a part of this family- you truly are an asshole” I keep thinking his day will come… it will!!

      • Mighty Again,
        I have one son that just graduated from college and one daughter currently in.
        They are NC with my ex. He left for a MOW who was cheating on her THIRD husband with my ex.
        This was his choice. Chumplady is right. These asshole’s have a decision tree full of choices and instead of putting any thought into things they just bulldoze wives, kids….anybody.
        I wonder if the karma I wait for is here. I’m happy, I have a great cheater free life now and the love and respect of my kids. He’s missing this. He’s missing seeing them become everything we ever hoped for them.
        He just traded us in for a younger family. He’s got a new squeeze, son and daughter (the mistress is 33, kids 8&11).
        He is a cheater with a cheater. I wonder how that works?

          • Paintwidow, You’re right, the Karma we wait for is here for me too. My kids love and respect me. I have only positive and beautiful friends in my life. My family (including his side) have been absolutely wonderful to me. I am healthy, I have a job and I am Cheater Free.

            I got a sneak peak at their cheater life – where she is reading my email correspondence between EX and I, uhhh it’s just about kid/finance stuff – Insecure much?

        • Paintwidow

          “I wonder if the karma I wait for is here. I’m happy, I have a great cheater free life now and the love and respect of my kids.”

          And not incidentally quite a large fan base here!!!

        • They claim to be wonderful family men, while cheating??

          Yes, they bulldoze their family, more importantly their children’s family, the only family they’ve known. Our children will never have their parents together as a family sharing priceless family moments. These human waste products only think of themselves and sacrifice our children having a loving family to come home to who share their childhood memories and the security of knowing they have parents who gave them a solid foundation.
          Cheater’s new GF’s or Bimbos, or whatever aren’t interested in their children and couldn’t care less about their well being.

      • It will come. However, he’ll only think of his pain and misery. Rarely do they reflect on what they have inflicted on others or loved ones. The idea of karma or law of the universe escapes them. He’s already justified his betrayal in his head and he will stick to that justification. I knew/know of a sociopath. He had been informed of karma and ever since then he explains that because he did x, y or z (when screwing someone over) his karma was good or he was somehow immune or covered. Crazy. He really believes he is pulling the wool over karma’s eyes. One of his ex girlfriend’s ex husband called him a Philistine. He must have looked the word up and quoted the complete history of the Philistines but he never got why the guy actually called him a Philistine. It was an insult but it completely escaped him. Their wiring is so different.

    • “I was stoned and blind. ”I was stoned and blind.”

      I have a sudden urge to pick up a jagged rock and aim.

  • This “infidelity expert” brings up so many questions. How pathetic do you have to be to make a public spectacle out of your sex life? Do you have no other skill in life? It’s as if she couldn’t find a decent income once the men in her life dumped her aging butt so she settled on “Hey, I sucked married D, let me tell you about it” as a fallback position.

  • Have sex with him every day! “Don’t pile on the weight after you get ‘comfortable’ with him, nor let your dress sense go. Looking good will help YOU feel better, as well as making sure your husband only has eyes for you.”

    OK…… LIKE he is to get the kids picked up from daycare, help with dinner, help with the kids homework, help get the kids ready for bed, clean up after dinner, do a few loads of laundry and help you with the work you brought home from the office since you didn’t get it all done. I mean you only work more hours in a week career wise than him, earn more than him (but never bring that up to protect his male ego). Let’s not count the family birthdays, get togethers, holidays that you buy/prepare/host. I’m sure he is right with you helping out every step of the way. All the while he doesn’t pile on the weight, he keeps those six pack abs, and dresses straight out of GQ cause looking good makes him feel better and makes sure I only have eyes for him. I’m not sure the sweat pants he wore constantly with no shirt (remember you need to shave my back tonight) qualified, but who am I to know for sure, right??? I mean I only loved the guy for 38 years…….
    Gee, where was this helpful info for the 36 years I was married? No wonder the 29 year old was able to “steal” him from me. I mean who wouldn’t want him. I should have gotten suspicious when he wanted contacts and started to worry about his large facial pores and wanted Proactive, oh and finally went to the DR to see about his ED. Yep I totally messed up… but hey she is “my sister” right?
    What a bunch of bull……. my REAL sister is waiting for the day the new “wife” dumps him and leaves him taking the new baby and what little money he has left (Sayonara social security, you got child support to pay!!!). THAT is what a REAL sister is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Confession time: I was more than an Amazon chump during wreckonciliation. Pole dancer, erotic snaps and videos, and I was even a Pheromone Chump. Yep, I bought the Pheromone perfume because the traitor who “didn’t get enough sex” went all limp and uninterested.
      I am not ashamed of it. I did everything I was supposed to do in that relationship and more on top.
      I’d say fuck the sisterhood, but I know my real sisters are here in CN. The sisterhood doesn’t automatically apply to all women anymore. It’s a select club.

  • The ow was our best friends wife. She had no personality or life of her own. Never worked, had no goals or accomplishments. Not even involved in her own family. Her husband carried the load while she sat on her pedestal trying out new identities every couple of years. Surfer girl, country girl, hippie etc. whatever was the latest cool thing. Always wanting to step into a ready made identity instead of finding her own. She looked at my life and thought it all came from x. She wanted my identity. They both truly thought they could pluck me out and drop her in and life would go on. Riding on their egos neither one of them realized I was the reason financially and heavy lifting wise, that we had the life we did. It was a huge shock to them to find out I would not go quietly into the night. And that my life stayed with me. They both were used to someone taking care of them. On their own together they floundered like little kids thrust into a grown up world. They quickly realized there IS more to a relationship than sex. They will be forever searching for something they have no clue how to obtain. And mowing down anyone who gets in their way. Soul sucking creatures.

    • So true NewDay. Reinventing themselves requires skills they never developed.

      “My life stayed with me.” Love, love the power in this statement.

      • “They both truly thought they could pluck me out and drop her in and life would go on. Riding on their egos neither one of them realized I was the reason financially and heavy lifting wise, that we had the life we did. It was a huge shock to them to find out I would not go quietly into the night. And that my life stayed with me.

        NewDayDawning your words were like a shot of sunshine to me this blizzard morning! Same here!

        • Oh yes. Cheater thought he would fire wife of 32 years and slot in AP and oh take all the money too. He thought because he and AP were so happy that everyone would be happy for them including our adult children, lifelong friends and family.

          AP is a skank – 4 kiddos three men. Lied about paternity on oldest kiddo until he was 15 while collecting child support from wrong man. Crazy sister of AP posted pic of sperm daddy on fakebook and bingo looks just like oldest kiddo. How sad. And cheater tells me when I ask him what makes AP so great – ummm she’s a good mother.

          People. I don’t make this shit up.

          At times I was battling cheater, AP and AP sister – 4 divorces between the two of them giving cheater stellar legal advice. Ugh.

          They all suck.

      • That is my new daily mantra – ‘my life stayed with me’. My children, my standards, my ethics, my morals, my siblings, my parents, my true friends – that is my life and it stayed with me. Another pearl of wisdom from the ever-so-mighty CN!

    • I agree, “My life stayed with me” is an excellent quotation. I think so much of the anger we hear from the spouses we leave stems from their sudden recognition that they aren’t just losing half of the marital property, they are losing all kinds of other things they forgot to account for.

      I may need to embroider this one on a throw pillow!

      • Eilonwy
        Yes to this ‘they forgot to account for’.
        It went clear over their heads while it was full of their entitled magnificence.

  • I believe it is likely that it is true that an AP who truly feels remorse would never try to explain anything to a chump. In fact, I think the only things that would motivate a truly remorseful AP to say anything to a chump at all would be (1) to tell the chump about it right away, and (2) to apologize without making excuses.

    I have lived through situations where a person I knew had sex with someone else who was in a relationship that was supposed to be monogamous. I have watched people struggle not with whether to tell, but with what to say and how to initiate contact to tell. I am not talking about your garden variety AP here, those folks are done a dozen assholes.

    I am talking about a few people who were riddled with shame about what they did, who wanted to tell the truth and asked for help figuring out how to tell someone something they knew would be devastating in the kindest possible way. I know one person who immediately started looking for another job because she realized she couldn’t possibly continue being anywhere near him and he owned the company.

    These people don’t feel good about what they have done. They don’t feel smart or smug or enlightened, and they don’t blame the chump. They blame themselves, deeply. They don’t forgive themselves with time. They don’t justify their actions. When advised to start therapy and figure out why they did it, they get the hell started, fast.

    These people are rare, and you don’t hear about them because they are too ashamed to tell their stories.

    The only reason I am even discussing this kind of person is to illustrate that these APs who think they can tell the chump something useful are, by their behavior, literally screaming that they are sociopathic narcissists who want to use the chumps to gain more tasty tasty drama that they control. Any person who cared a whit about the chump would be too mortified to reach out in that way.

    CL is right. The AP is not the real problem. The cheater is the real problem. Still, an AP can become a real problem entirely on his/her own and the chump needs to shut that shit down immediately. Nothing good comes from a chat with a narcissistic sociopath.

  • I did all of it, stupidly believing it would make a difference, I have an entire Victoria’s Secret store in my home! He still cheated, a lot, and never with Victoria’s Secret models, always gross women with low self esteem. One was one I worked with, who I had to report to HR because she stank so bad, dirty hair, not bathing. So, her “advise” doesn’t hold water

    • Yep.I’d love to hear her tell Christie Brinkley she should have stayed in shape and dressed well.Or Sandra Bullock,Jennifer Aniston.I could go on.

    • I had two drawers of Victoria’s Secret lingerie, too, and stayed in shape. But it was hard to see how I was going to morph into a 22-year old in my 40s, ‘cuz my X preferred em young.

      • STBX actually referred to AP as “shiny and new” – thus making her very hard to resist.

        After 30 years married (34 together) I guess that makes me “dull and old”

        Those kinds of comments used to hurt – now they fuel my anger!

        • Is he not aware crows and vultures are also attracted to “shiny and new?” At least the birds are good for the environment.

          May he drown in a pit of odiferous smegma.

          • “Odiferous —— SMEGA——”

            omg – you’re cracking me up Tundra.
            For those that don’t have time to look it up –

            SMEGA – a sebaceous secretion in the folds of the skin, especially under a man’s foreskin.

            • Just Ewwww! I agree that these OW and the cheater want the chump to fade into fairy dust so the OW can take our place as if we are a puzzle piece! My ex’s Schmoopie was an idiot who was as subtle as a train wreck. She came into the small SW Georgia town we lived in and introduce herself as me or his wife. In a town as small as we lived in it was in record time that I knew about it. This OW had balls of steel. What she didn’t realize was that everyone knew she was a side dish fuck! The minute she would leave these businesses, doctor offices, etc. I would get a call from these folks! How stupid did she think they were??? Mr. Cheater and stinky Schmoopie apparently did not spend much time on personal hygiene either. I got a call from my CPA who was also a good friend about them stopping by to try to screw with the taxes. She said they smelled so bad she had to open every door after they left because they had fouled the air so bad. I got word of thier terrible stench more than once. It was embarrassing as Hell! Schmoopie would drive by my home often. I think she was sizing it up for a sale because she wasn’t about to leave her Florida condo! Then I had to put up with her constant texts telling me how she was a nice person even though I was not! Old girl was VERY interested in assets and it was obvious. I shut that shit down in the divorce because I hired a pitbull lawyer and got everything. Then after the divorce lover boy got horribly ill, had no job, no money, etc. When shit got real Schmoopie was done. So much for true love. The kicker: Schmoopie is coming after him legally to get money! Jokes on her, he has zero! She cleaned out his accounts to zero before his tires left her parking space. She’s sounds like a real sweetheart to me! Far as I
              can tell, he is getting what he deserves! He chased this whore all over the place so I must assume he thought she was the greatest!

      • THIS!

        I had two drawers of Victoria’s Secret lingerie, too, and stayed in shape. But it was hard to see how I was going to morph into a 22-year old in my 40s, ‘cuz my X preferred em young………………

        not only did mine like them young, he also preferred Asian & pay-for-play……and porn.
        So, how does Symond expect a long time wife to compete with that?

        • Same here. Now I’m back to the cotton bikini underwear that Assholio called “granny panties.” I don’t know if I’ll ever wear sexy underwear again, too many triggers…

          • Sausalito, I say wear what makes you feel good,but I still wear my Victoria’s Secret, largely because I have my retirement fund in undies and panties 🙂 I refuse to let him take any more from me!

  • I just read some of her column,

    I need a bucket to vomit in then a scrub with steel wool in a scalding shower.

    She has got to be kidding – Wife school? Advice to be a wife? From her???? Without the likes of her there would be almost none of us (Chumps!)

    I love this little tid bit of advice from her 12 Steps of wife school –

    Lets set the scene for the clueless chumps out there who were doing this all wrong all those years….

    You get up at 5am every morning (Oh we always let sweety honeypot hubby sleep a little longer) put coffee on, iron and lay sweety honeypots clothes out on spare bed in EXACT order so they look like deflated scarecrow but so he knows which order they are put on (thinking is solo stressful in the mornings, don’t have shower yet (we don’t want water to go cold for sweety honeypot), wake children quietly (snookums sleeping doncha know) at 6am and start breakfast, GENTLY wake sweety snookums honeypot with blow job at 6.30, tell him how wonderful it was for you and if he was any bigger you wouldn’t know what to do with it (with enthusiasm!) bring him coffee to relax and wake him and proceed to “Lay the table” with flowers and a full hot breakfast with more coffee (freshly made, previous pot stale now), eat in silence (He gets headaches if there is unnecessary noise in the mornings) clear table while he luxuriates in hot shower, dress kids, make and pack lunches, make sure children and you (with briefcase held out) are lined up at the door in ascending height order (Keys in other hand, oops nearly forgot!) farewell father of the year and stud of your life with a “have a glorious day my sweet”.

    Rush to have cold shower, help kids clean teeth, feed dog, bird, cat, lizard and neighbours dog. Throw kids lunches in bags whilst helping Timmy with the math homework he forgot last night. Hustle kids and dog (needs to be dropped at Veterinary clinic some oozing penile disorder) into car, run back in as you forgot sweety snookums honeypot’s dry-cleaning, reverse out of drive and neighbours kids come running, oops forgot your day to school car pool. Drop kids at school, run dog into vet, drop off dry-cleaning, arrive at work 10 minutes late to a desk overflowing with work due today.

    Leave work pickup kids, dog, dry-cleaning, go back for neighbours kids that you forgot, arrive home. Need caffeine…..

    Make afternoon snack for kids, wash a couple of loads of clothes, start homework, start to prepare dinner……drink that cold coffee and sit down for 3 1/2 minutes. Serve kids dinner. Bath and shower kids and arrange said children in descending height order at door (all clean and fed so no offensive odours) to greet oh mighty father of the year. Rush children off to bed (he gets headaches when unnecessary noise)

    AND THEN

    do as this wonderful “MISTRESS” “Advisor” “Counsellor” “Teacher” or what ever the fuck she calls herself other than a filthy OW advises you to do – Although please note here you really should have been more organised and had said bath poured, candles lit etc.. beforehand it really is NOT acceptable that he should wait AND don’t forget the clutter, god knows we can’t have a dolly or crayon laying around!

    12 STEPS OF WIFE SCHOOL – Teaching wives to act like Mistresses –

    9. Ambiance – Create an environment he will enjoy when he comes home. Focus on soft lighting, scented candles and gentle music playing. Maybe run a hot bath, or jump in a steamy shower with him. Have his favourite drink ready, or enjoy a glass of wine together. Hide the kid’s toys, and any other clutter.

    Sara Symonds………

    Fuck off

  • While pursuing reconciliation with STBX, the OW went crazy that my STBX had dumped her and sent me the following email:

    • You should know that I didn’t seduce X – he kissed me

    • You should know that X told me he was in love with me and told me he never loved anyone in his life the way he loved me

    • You should know that X got me pregnant and pushed me to have an abortion and told me that we would have another chance for children but the time wasn’t right with his kids

    • You should know that X promised me he would be with me and marry me and take care of me

    • You should know that I feel insanely stupid for allowing myself to be manipulated and lied to

    Craziest thing ever — she was simultaneously shocking me/ sabotaging any reconciliation while also asking me not think badly of her/excusing her behavior.

    I immediately (within 2 hours) went and met with her – first and only time – and realized that OWs tell themselves incredible lies to exonerate themselves. She sobbed when I met with her and had the nerve to tell me – the wife of 30 years – between sniffles, the following:

    • He never even mentioned you when he talked about leaving, he just didn’t want to leave the kids (ergo I, the OW, am noble because I am “rescuing’ him from you – horrible, mean Tired Chump.)
    • I thought you were just staying with him for the $ (Clearly, Tired Chump, you are just using him to fund your lifestyle, as opposed to me, a virtuous “pure-as-the-driven-snow” 28-year-old who is interested in your 56-year-old husband because of true love – not his money)
    • Your kids will be fine – they are adults (Even though I am only a few years older than your children, I have deep knowledge of psychology and betrayal and “say it is so” – your 18-22-year-old offspring will not be devastated – see, not my problem)
    • I know how to use birth control but “forgot” (e.g. “IT” just happened, conception and termination – and now, I, the OW feel so much better letting you know the one thing your husband would never want you to know)
    • In high school, all my friends’ parents got divorced and remarried and they were way happier (So Tired Chump, this affair will be good for you too!)

    Ultimately – STBX went back to her (and she accepted him despite feeling insanely stupid being manipulated and lied to, per her email), and I will be divorced in about 60 days. So, remember, the OW is generally just as delusional, self-centered and revisionist as your cheater!

    • Wow, this is VERY insightful. She went back to him??! Whatforever for? She knew his was lying, AND he had her get an abortion? How could you choose to begin a life with a man like that? I do know they pursue the AP. Your STBX sounds predatory and abusive.

    • My ex’s AP also wrote me (pushed through the UBT https://www.chumplady.com/2015/11/ubt-ow-i-just-want-to-reach-out-and-help-you/) and you know, my self esteem was so low that I almost believed her concern for me. After 30 years of gaslighting, it was hard not to believe the skank and her TWU LOVE. Thank you CL for putting clarity on such stupidity! I have no idea if they’re still in LOVE, but my guess is that now that they’ve been together for 2 years, the excitement of the illicit relationship has worn off. At times my insecurity is still there and I plague myself with thoughts that they are still in LOVE and he’s much happier with her and that there was really something wrong with me that he just couldn’t be happy with me. But then I pull my head out of my butt and say, “He’s the same man now as he was then! He’ll pull the same crap on her.” And I really, really hope she hurts! And I cannot help but hope that she goes batshit crazy and does a Lorena Bobbitt on him.

      • Wow Amazon. That’s some crazy OW there. Unbelievable.
        Thank goodness you got away. I hope you are well on you way to Meh.
        I’m still stunned by that letter.
        Hugs to you for having to endure that.

      • Amazon Chump–I remember that letter. Egads, what a self-centered, pretentious twat your X chose. I think this is the time when Rumblekitty would have mentioned a ‘throat punch.’

        • Amazon Chump, I just re-read that letter. So perfect for the UBT, which made me snork as much as it did the first time. Especially breaking down that SAD signature as “Shits After Belching”. I know the subject is anything but funny, but CL just does this too damned well!

      • OMG Amazon Chump! I want to smack her worse than I want to smack satan 🙁 Bitch.

        I’m so sorry you had to read that vomit. She blows and your x deserves to have to endure her condescending bull for the rest of his time on earth…may she be tied to his cheating ass for eternity. They deserve each other.

        You deserve way better 🙂

        (((((((Amazon Chump)))))))

    • OWhore #3 told me I should be grateful to her as if Fucktard had decided to stay with me, it would be harmful to me.

      Even though she was correct, still, the entitlement and general fucked-up-ness of that comment still floors me.

    • Yeah her tune will change after the divorce. She’ll nag him to no end to get married, he may do so as most men are lazy and the thought of finding someone new may be daunting. He’ll marry her to keep the peace and then he just won’t be so special. I mean he is hitting 60 and a woman in her early 30’s is going to resent the old man sooner or later. Once she has financial security the desperation to be with him will evaporate and she’ll be looking at younger men. She’ll throw up in his face his “deception” to her while married to you. This will not end well but it will end. He’ll be in his 60’s and not as well as off financially as he once was due to two divorces within 5 years I’m guessing. Too bad.

    • Yep. One of the men I evaluated decades ago in response to my question about his Marital Status looked at me with the saddest eyes and said, “I went out for chopped meat when I had fillet mignon at home.”
      He was the saddest sausage that ever sausaged.

      And monetarily castrated as a result. (I so DID NOT laugh! Well, not that was obvious.)

      • Sounds like sad sausage wanted to be a Nathan’s Famous 100 percent Beef Bunlength Hotdog, but in reality was one of those cheap little red dye #2 Great Value weiners … in the quick sale bin. He’s still out there looking for a cheap, stale wonder bread roll.

        • Well, it was a professional setting and not of the medical variety so I couldn’t exactly request a Show and Tell, Yk?
          Anyway, I get the feeling it shrunk in the Divorce Cycle.

  • So I should have put a ribbon in my hair, cooked dinner after work and fucked him every day! But my cheating ex could get fired from every job he had, not work for the last 5 years, sit around in sweat pants getting high and sometimes not shower for days on end? What was I thinking? I guess it’s all my fault.

    Yeah, no. Sad thing is, there was a time in the past when I believed some of this nonsense. I tried that old bullshit of being a “cook in the kitchen and a whore in the bedroom”. He still cheated. He cheated if I fucked him or not. He cheated if I cooked or not. He cheated if I wore sweats or if I put a ribbon in my hair.

    Guess what Sara? Cheaters gonna Cheat. They are lying, blood-sucking whores–to their core. Just like you.

    • Not shower for days on end?? OMG. So THAT’S where they cribbed the scent of dirty jock straps. Did he have a home-grown mat of pubic hair on his back??? Did the fuck-buddies “groom” him by picking tics and other insects off his body?

      Maybe you could get an annulment because you weren’t into beastiality.

  • Hmmmm, I guess it never occurred to the Cheaters or Ms. Symonds if the cheating husbands spent the money and time on the wife instead of the mistress, perhaps the wife would be in a more tenable position to provide more of that preening and fawning that are so, so important to the cheating husbands of the world.

    When you’re “hired” to serve as a trophy and prostitute with no other responsibilities, I would imagine it isn’t all that difficult or odious to focus on providing those trophy and prostitute services.

    The rest of us, who thought we were signing on as partners in ALL aspects of our spouse’s life have substantially more responsibilities, like providing a portion of the family income, running the household, childbearing, parenting . . . .

    Yeah, my “sisters”/Other Women really helped me out by telling my husband just how gladly and enthusiastically they did scads of things they didn’t want to do just for their husbands, just to keep their husbands happy. Why, oh, why couldn’t I be like them? [Somehow my Cheater didn’t clue in on the tiny little detail that these women who were claiming to be “so happy” with that marriage dynamic were cheating on their husbands. Head scratch.]

  • Whatever happened to decency? APs should feel shame, not flaunt their mistake like it’s a skill set.

    He shopped around for my replacement so there were many. When they found out he was married, they called it off. But the most recent one was either content to be a side piece or happy to wait because I met her face to face and told her we were in counseling, had kids, and were having sex. She did not care. She wanted him.

    Who are these people? I told him nice people don’t sleep with married people. He disagreed. He didn’t believe infidelity necessarily indicated bad character.

    His family says she is smart. Really? How smart and secure could she be for sleeping with a 60 year old married man with kids? She’s 29. On my worst day as a twenty-something, I would not have been seen with a 60 year old man much less slept with one.

    She has a police record, but he doesn’t care. When we were wreckonciling, he said she tricked him by feigning a pregnancy, and she had a gun. He called her a trap and, yet, couldn’t stay away. ? Now they are together and have a brand new life. It is twu wuv. Whatever. I guess they deserve each other. Absurd to call that love.

    Cheaters are the problem. But APs are disgusting.

  • Sisterhood my arse… we are not the same. Not. At. All. Anyway… the only thing I can tell these “females” is… “Wanna play with my used toy? Fine, you can keet it, I’ll find a better one or I get a cat… in both cases I will be happy”. And for the “advises”, only one comment: “Honey… keep your idea for yourself…. I mean… you are not having an outstanding and happy relationship… I mean… you are a mistress! If one day I will be interested in knowing everything about low self esteem, poor judgment and no standard… I’ll give you a call”.
    Emm@

  • A’right, Ho: If you’re so qualified to believe you have the credentials to run a “Wife School” why aren’t you one? Instead of one of the festering food poisoning side dishes at the buffet table? The one with the fruit flies circlin’? Or the larve hatching in the congealed gravy next to the roast beef carcass?

    Never a bride, always a bitch-in-heat.

    Does this ho realize dogs stick together longer post copulation than her ilk does?
    Wadda nut mutt.
    Arf! Arf! “Lassie Cum Ho-me.”

  • All OW stuff just makes my anxiety spike. She knew me, knew our kids, spent a long time lying to and in front of them. His fault all the way–she was far from the first–but she was and is complicit. I think of her without fondness every single time I have to help the kids through the deep damage here. A lifetime’s gift that they will always carry. The marriage that they expect will legitimize and redeem will only deepen the wounds. Breathtakingly thoughtless and morally bereft decision-making, all around.

    • Chumpionsahm
      Yes. Agreed. All of the OW in my case knew lots about all of us. There is no way to minimise the damage they have done to our kids.
      My middle child is completely and utterly NC with his dad and I believe it is because he was so traumatised to discover that his dad had shared deeply personal information about him with these random others.
      To them it is a ‘thing, a fling, nothing serious, bit of something they don’t think twice about’ but it has just devastated three innocent boys.
      I hate it that they have become part of our family story albeit the sordid part. That makes my blood boil.

    • Their arrogance is breathtaking. Gradwhore gave X an ultimatum, then stayed in the room to hear him ask for a divorce, by telephone, from his partner of 16 years. Stayed in the room for a private conversation. I hate them both as much for that little nugget as for the affair itself. She got her comeuppance the next week when he dumped her instead and “came back” to the marriage (only because I didn’t know he’d had an affair, or there wouldn’t have been a marriage to come home to).

      • Arrogance is the perfect word, Tempest. Complete and thoughtless devastation. For me, the contrast between words and facts finally tore it. He “loved” us. They “tried not to hurt” us. Not harming the marriage was a “condition” of the affair. JFC!! Meanwhile, the lies piled up, they planned for marriage, she pressured him to divorce, but he says he never said one negative thing about me. Rigggggggght. It’s so maddening. The OW rabbit hole is a dark and dangerous place.

        And who gets to try to mitigate the damage? Help kids heal? Try to model moving along and rising above while taking deep and enriching lessons from it all? Why, we do, of course. And it is utterly draining.

        The damage to the kids is absolutely the worst of it to me, Cap. They both quite knowingly and carelessly did that. Unconscionable. Unforgivable.

      • (((((((Tempest)))))))

        hannibal and satan are sittin in the same place they were when we left em…in our dust

        🙂

        WE rock…they suck at real life.

  • My husband was jacking off to porn, so the “other woman” was internet cam girls and porn stars. I ran across quite a few articles from web cam whores trying to inform wives on how to “be better”. I also ran across peer review research studies that showed the average life expectancy in the US is 78 years of age, while the average life expectancy of a porn ‘star’ is 37 years of age. Yeah, keep your advice for yourself little girl and try to make it to age 40. I have celebrated that date and beyond and still have a lot of life left in me. Probably because I feel no need to go under the knife to try and earn more 50 cent tokens and don’t have to hop myself up on drugs to try and make it through yet another cam-to-cam session where I am faking up a storm and having to watch some man twice my age pleasure himself while I pretend to get something out of the scene.

    Don’t get me wrong, I feel sorry for the vast majority of these porn girls. Many are runaways, drug addicts, and trafficked women after having gotten bamboozled by fake Craigslist job postings. But, when that one out of twenty teenie bopper that chose the ‘lifestyle’ instead of getting forced or tricked into it decides she is going to school wives on how to ‘keep their men’ when the day she actually hits puberty she is going to be thrown out like trash – and yet those videos will leave on forever, I get frustrated. Hey little girl, you can keep my ‘husband’, but only after he hands over the child support and alimony every month. But, paying tokens to you might not be much fun now that that he has to support himself and have adult responsibilities. He doesn’t feel so ‘manly’ watching you pleasure yourself now that the secret is out and everyone is laughing at him for throwing away a great marriage and a great relationship with his kids for webcam whores.

    • Well said, coolbreeze. Weird that so many do not think of this as cheating when it is so clearly damaging, and an obvious breach of marital boundaries. Hint: if you have to hide it, then you obviously should not be doing it. I love and enjoy technology and the possibilities it opens for us, but sometimes find myself thinking that fidelity is doomed in the digital era. Porn and the means quite easily to forge secret connections right in everyone’s pocket. Our technical capacity has far outpaced our ability to deal with the moral implications of how, why, and when we use it.

        • Chumpion – “Our technical capacity has far outpaced our ability to deal with the moral implications of how, why, and when we use it.”

          There’s a lot of truth to this, especially for the somewhat ‘mainstream people’ .
          I do think the carelessness of so many of these internet ‘relationships’ are like Russian Roulette. They throw themselves into the abyss and assume they are so clever they will never get caught. I think for the majority of these really stupid people, is – they will wonder what the fuck they did when all the consequences eventually hit. That is a one-two punch of Karma. And, it will keep punching them in the gut. They are not getting any better as they age, that’s for sure.

          I don’t think Karma is easy to see…..but, you know when you mess with the universe, it screws up a lot of things in a weird way. Like, suddenly your own family is ostracizing you and your whore…Too bad.

  • Hey chump nation, this isn’t about today’s topic, but could use some feedback. After fighting for a a year and a half to get divorced, I finally got what I wanted and signed the final papers last month on Valentine’s Day. I thought that once the divorce was final, I would feel a new sense of freedom to start over. Now- I actually feel like I have post divorce depression or PTSD. Instead of being excited for the future, I wake up and still can’t believe that this is where my life is… I’m disappointed that instead of living at my beautiful house, I’m living with my parents, that my loving husband turned out be a lying cheat. I’m turning 34, and now have to consider freezing my eggs, (the OW got knocked up after they had broken up) still a little shocked about that news and now have to think about getting a new job to provide adequately for myself. How did I get here??! Any advise on how to process the painful reality of divorce?

    • NotThisGirl–now is definitely the time to seek out counseling and other support to see you through this rough transition. Of course the reality is setting in, now. Very normal. Do not worry at all that what you are feeling is strange. Of course it is going to take awhile to process everything. Do that on your own timeline–different for everyone. You are very young, and lots of possibilities lie ahead, still. I think 34 might be a bit young to worry about fertility, so perhaps a trip to your gynecologist would be in order. Get a full physical, discuss concerns, bring up depression and anxiety. A good doc will help point you to the right information and resources. Hard to live with parents and feel like you are moving backwards, but that is just for now. Good that you had them to turn to while you decide upon the next steps. You already accomplished one big step toward independence with the divorce. Now, just keep going–but get good counseling and support. You can do it!

      • Thanks Chumpionsahm! It’s such a long journey to healing. You think you’ve made major progress and then the next day it feels like your right back where you started.

        • Oh, exactly! And you really have made progress, but agree with CL that accomplishing the divorce leaves a big gap where your energy and attention were focused. So now, dealing with that blank spot is the new challenge. You are way ahead of me on that, and I thank you for sharing this and reminding us all that this deal is a long haul–many phases, many unexpected twists and turns, and many finish lines along the way, without the journey being quite over yet. Day by day. Step by step. All we can do. You have already come a long way. I know your “get a life” phase will gradually start to take over your time and attention. Wishing you so much success with that. ❤️

    • It’s totally normal to feel blue right after the divorce. Leading up there’s always the fresh drama to keep you busy and focused. Then… blank slate… and the scary exhausting reality of having to rebuild. Be kind to yourself. Take steps every day, little steps, to move forward — that’s mighty. Even though it doesn’t feel like it. This shit is a marathon.

      34 is young. Better days ahead, I promise.

      • You nailed it- the “scary, exhausting reality of having to rebuild”. For some reason, I didnt think all these emotions would be coming back. Thanks for this forum of support. I wouldn’t be this far without your blog.

        • There’s a reason “waiting to exhale” doesn’t always mean “into a breathalyzer held by my new buddy inna uniform while standing/swaying by the side of the road.”

          NotThisGirl, this isn’t your “life.” This part is just the break for the advertisers to get what they paid for-their commercials. (gently pats hand before passing some Twinings peppermint tea and a box of tissues.) The day you got married you meant every word of your vows including the part where you said, “till death do we part.” Death was waaayyyy down the road-not an imminent drive-by shooting. You didn’t purchase the weapon, load it, add a few extra clips and play “Bonnie and Clyde Do Chicago” with some bogus script.

          You kept your word. You were who you said you were. And you still are, with or without the moral midget who pretended to be Mr. Integrity. His corruption is no reflection of your decency or honesty. I can’t tell you exactly what night you’ll finally start sleeping regularly, when that thoat closure thing that hits the second you wake up will cease, those memories will stop haunting, your belief in yourself will slowly start to ease back into your daily awareness. But all of these-and more-will happen.

          Please understand this: Your light never stopped shining. Your beauty was never diminished. Your decency never went MIA-and never will. You can be the most perfect creature in this universe, but…
          when someone else is blind, their blindness doesn’t change the reality of your light, your beauty (in every way) your decency or your perfection. It’s always there. Even when it’s dark, cold and lonely, you’re still the lovely person you always have been and will be. And it is those timeless qualities that will remain with you until your last breath. Just remember to exhale, OK? It’ll come.
          Promise.

      • That’s a good reminder. In my head I was thinking I just have to make it to the divorce and then it will be plain sailing.
        This is the most exhausting thing ever. And I did childbirth three times with no pain meds. A bloody breeze compared to this.

        Well. If this is a marathon we should have those numbered vest things we can frame. Only marathon I’m going to be doing!!!

    • Don’t be too hard on yourself. You had the sense to get out pretty quickly. Take stock of what you want (maybe it is freezing your eggs or maybe it is saving up money to move to an exciting new place). Start doing the things you need to do to shape a new life. I agree that counseling might be helpful.

      It is impossible, I think, to feel “grateful” that you’ve suffered such a disappointment so young, but those of us with 20 years on you have faith that you’ll move forward into a great new life. Standing further up the mountain, we can see that you’ve got great horizons in front of you.

      What do you want to do for yourself today? Apply for a job? Eat lunch at a new restaurant. Drive to the nicest park you know for a long walk? Sign up for MeetUps and start experimenting with new activities?

      You deserved better than a life time spent as a betrayed spouse. You made a tough decision because you are smart and have self-respect. Take pride in the steps you’ve taken already.

    • You likely DO have adjustment disorder, and possibly C-PTSD. Why wouldn’t you! How you feel is so. utterly. normal. And it gets much better. Things which can speed up the process: a good therapist who “gets it”, deliberate self-compassion, lots of mindfulness and introspection, etc. Do your best to think about your self, rather than perseverating on your ass of an ex. At first, it’s a triumph to stay focused for 15 seconds, but that increases to minutes and hours and days and forever. Be patient and kind to you.

    • NotThisGirl–building a post-cheater life is a one-step at a time endeavor. Ten minutes of self-care everyday (minimum), find a new hobby or re-invigorate one that you gave up to cater to a man-child. And most importantly, expand your social network–new friends who share common interests (including chumpdom, if there’s a meetup group in your area–check the forums), and re-connecting with friends from your past, are probably the best predictor of future happiness.

      There is a kind of “what now?” aspect to post-divorce life. Fill it a little at a time.

    • Sorry to have you join Chump Nation, but follow the advice and you will THRIVE.
      Trust that your cheater “sucks” and that you have a bright future ahead of you.
      Like all of us, your cheater stole your expected future along with your trust – and i’m sure many people look at your youth and think you should be able to “move on.”Hard for anyone to understand how shocking this “theft of expectations” is unless they’ve been through it.
      Totally normal to feel depleted, sad, and unclear after divorce is final. It took a lot to “close that chapter” so be kind to yourself every day. We look forward to hearing what you do to become MIGHTY over the next few months.
      Hugs

      Most important is to know that many of us feel

    • Grieving is normal. Trauma and stress from having your entire life uprooted and rearranged is normal. Even missing him is normal, though I think what we miss is who we thought they were, and not who they really are. Be kind to yourself. Seek professional help if you need it, and use that support network of people who love you. You and I are not far from the same age (I’m 37) so I do get you on the fertility worries. But we have a little time yet. And if there’s no husband on the horizon when the time comes, there are sperm donors. It’s not that weird to have a baby as a single woman anymore. It’s my plan, and most people haven’t raised an eyebrow. Mostly they’ve said “Yeah, do it!”

      • Thanks everyone for the encouragement and advice! I’m in weekly therapy but sometimes it’s just hard!! So thankful to have this site and fellow chumps who are rebuilding their lives too. ??

    • Your life has been turned upside down so it’s only natural to be out of sorts. First work on getting a job to support yourself, maybe take a few courses to improve your skills or even take you in another career direction. Make a bucket list and work on crossing items off. Not sure of your lifestyle but maybe sign up for a half marathon or check out sailing classes, dressage lessons, something new and different. Volunteer at some shelter. I would stay away from dating till I achieved something on my own that I never thought I could do so your self worth is boosted. We tend to attract losers when not feeling our best or are in any way insecure, not confident, etc. These are just some random tips but the waiting to date till you feel really good about yourself is solid advice.

      • Great advice! I like the list idea, I actually could take sailing lessons. Thanks for the tips that helped.

    • You just cleared a huge hurdle (divorce) and now you have to face the next hurdle (rebuilding your life). It’s perfectly natural that you’re a little exhausted – you used up all your energy for the first problem, pushing everything off until you were done – now the overdraft is crashing you hard. Relax. Take some time to just be emotionally exhausted and recoup all the energy you spent on getting the divorce.

    • Well keep in mind you are literally going through the grief process. You probably sort of put the emotions on the back burner to get through the divorce. Now that the logistics are sorted out, your brain is trying to process all the emotions. For most people, it’s not that they don’t have these emotions, but it’s more like they sort of shut down when going through the logistics of the divorce. Then when you think the “worst” is over… your brain is like “I don’t think so motherfucker… now we are going to the emotional heavy lifting. Let’s spend some time crying and being irrationally anxious today.”

      It’s very disorienting as well… you know that you are good to be rid of him, but then you don’t actually want to be single, but you don’t want your relationship to be lie, but if you knew what was going on maybe you could have made it work. This is not thinking that lends itself to peace and happiness.

      Your situation with your job and your parents etc. is not your forever. It’s your right now. Take all the help you can get. In 6 months you will look back on this time and (hopefully) say “well that sucked, but I feel better now. I wonder how I will feel in 6 more months.”

  • For a fleeting second I almost felt sorry for Ms Symonds. A person who couldn’t rustle up enough of an identity on her own to actually invest in herself and build a life she could be proud of. She became a parasite on the lives of others. She obviously bought into the tabloid version of a mistress. The men were not fooled obviously. They chose smart, capable, trusting women as wives and mothers to their children. She was there for fun and sex and to be what they wanted her to be. Doubtless if she had shown any identity or desires of her own that conflicted with theirs she would have been out. She was ‘winning’ not just a side fuck but the job of ‘mirror’ to whatever these guys wanted to see about themselves.
    Now they have moved on to younger versions of her who make them feel still powerful she has lost her usefulness. Now her only remaining currency is to make us believe in the same sort of tabloid shit she believes in. Trouble is we know mistresses better than she does. We know most of them look like they have been run over by the ugly truck. We know that they were more often that not just ‘there’ and were willing.
    She still believes (and is probably now correct) that she has no value as a person unless she is either a mistress (evermore unlikely) or as someone wives might be afraid of and so might listen to. Here we all know better. That despite being hurt by her and her kind we are all the better for it eventually sort of in that we do lose a cheater and gain a life. And some of us gain faithful spouses who love us regardless of how comfortable our love handles are and our strange fascination with ugly knick-knacks.
    She will never know anything about being an authentic person, nor being valued for who you are. She is going to toddle off into old age becoming more and more shrill and panicked as her body behaves as badly as they tend to with time. Her only chance will be to find an idiot who will marry her but even then she will be very aware of what to be afraid of.
    As I say, I almost feel sorry for her but we all have chances to make the right choices and she and people like her do real damage to real people. We KNOW her. She still doesn’t.

    • (((((((Capricorn)))))))

      …you said a mouthful…

      So sad…so much unnecessary pain and anguish…

      …to this day I wonder, but won’t indulge, do they regret?…nah…trust that CL’s and CN’s collective experience demonstrates beyond a shadow of a doubt that they do indeed never change and we chumps that got out, dodged a bullet… 🙂

      Live your best dreams from now on CN 🙂

  • So excited it’s a snow day and I’ll have time to read all these words of wisdom!
    Cheating is always the cheaters fault – but the depravity and manipulation of the OWs is equally reprehensible

  • The silver lining is that Symond’s stint as a mistress kept her from procreating.

    And if she was so fab, and the wives so drab, why did neither Ramsey nor Archer leave their wives for her? Hmmmm….

  • The fact that my X had so many other women helps me to not get too worked up over the thought of them. The disclosure revealed that I knew two of them: 1) a bimbo secretary that was sugary sweet to me via all interacts we had over the years (she’s about as sharp as a bowling ball), 2) a higher up professional in my x’s work world who turned cold to me over the years in my interactions with her. I never knew why! Ha! When I became very suspicious (on a “partial D-Day” because my X jumped when I came in on him using his phone), I went on a rampage and found an inappropriate text between this bitch and my X. This gal was not very attractive at all (rather masculine). And, I would have read her as the type, though, who would have boundaries of some kind. X’s reaction to me finding text. “Beth?!!! Nikki Lynn, you think I’ve been with Beth?!!!!! Nikki Lynn, I think Beth is gay!” — Ganster gaslighting!!!

    I’ve day-dreamed about what I’d like to say to ole’ Beth if I ever ran across her (very doubtful it would ever happen). Best I could come up with is “You Do know you were one of *dozens*?

    I’m sure that X has zeroed in on a new “main squeeze” victim. But I know of no details of who it is. She’s in for a lot fun!

  • I called the OW. She told me she was the girlfriend and knew about me and our son. She told me I had ruined everything. Then she told me she had ‘won’. At the time I felt kicked in the gut. Now I’m so happy she won her cheater!! Enjoy the prize of always taking second place to hours of porn and Craig’s List hook ups.

  • It makes me incredibly angry that women like this perpetuate this garbage and reinforce two incredibly stupid social beliefs that women have been fighting for centuries:
    1/ A woman’s primary goal should be to find and keep a man
    2/ A woman’s primary value is in how they look

    eFF you Sara Symonds

  • I never had any hard feelings towards my ex’s live-in stripper GF because she came along after we separated but before the divorce so I viewed her as more effect than cause; she was just the last in a long line of stripper/hooker partners. The only time I took issue with her was when she called me and in the course of a long rambling 1:30 am phone call, told me I needed to work on my adult kids’ nonexistent relationship with their dad (like I’m taking parenting advice from a drunk stripper who doesn’t have custody of her own kids…). Mostly I found her highly amusing, especially when she called me a second time to complain that the ex is cheating on her too. She played the “sisterhood” card too – telling me I’m the only one who “understands” what she’s going through with him and what sort of person he is. I got suspicious when she started asking me if I had a good man in my life, and she hoped so because I deserved to be happy. Hmmm…. we’ve never met so we’re not friends, definitely not sisters and your desiring my happiness is questionable. After she kept pressing it became clear that she was asking hoping I’d be stupid enough to answer and she could try to get my ex’s spousal support reduced, giving her more of his money. Well “sister” that ain’t gonna happen. Lesson learned. The disordered may be amusing at a distance but they ARE disordered and are dangerous if you let them get too close. The only thing we have in common is that we were once involved with the same “man”. Other than that, nothing. We don’t live on the same plane of existence.

  • I have never acknowledged the skank despite her attempts to reach out to me under the guise of “healing for the sake of the children.”

    But today’s post makes me wonder how it’s going over in Clusterfuckdale six years in to twu wuv with a raging, unemployed, self-important asshole. From what my kids share,

    They’re on their third try to stay together.
    He moved out of their shared bedroom two years in, which is right on schedule.
    They continue to drink every night.
    The fabulous vacation trips have ended.
    He’s blown through half of his inheritance already. At this rate, he’s looking at a pauper’s twilight years.
    My sons have no respect for their father and outward disgust for Skanky.
    Because X is too good to work, she is basically his meal ticket now.

    Yeah, it hurt like a motherfucker to get divorced. But it’s over. And aside from having to continue to parallel parent with an idiot, I am not part of that disordered clusterfuck of a man’s life or his control any longer.

    All yours, Skanky! 🙂

  • Where the fuck is the sisterhood? Where the fuck is the decency that no you don’t fuck with other peoples lives, husbands, children, well being, families, work, you fucking name it.

    Advice from a slut??? haha no thank you, you are the LAST person from whom I or anyone should ever solicit advice.

    But I have some advice to give to you, wannabe celebrity, GO FUCK YOURSELF!!!

  • Interesting , the OW met me 20 years ago and decided to f***k with my life top it off my husbands family knew her very well to the point his mom had lunch with her and suposedly my husband says they never knew yea right! Plus when I was doing other things not home at times the OW was in my house one occasion i was visiting a relative they decided to have a party and my younger son was in the next room and I believe she went upstairs to my closet and poked around, I found a suspect hair in my bath tub!! yea this OW was a PIP! I am still perplexed at these kind of Women and Sisterhood they do not know the meaning as what was said before sister’s do not F***K your husband!! Makes Me SICK!!!!!!!!!!!! But this one is way off after their so called break up now she plays games on a social site, can you say WACKY!!!!

    • Yep, my OW was the same. Made a deliberate decision, after playing all nicey nicey and sending nice gifts on the birth of our baby, to fuck with my life, behind my back, while I was busy adjusting to having my first baby. She saw me as a priviledged bitch with no idea of what life was, and thought that I didn’t deserve to be able to stay at home being supported by my husband, because she was a solo mum when she had her child. She is one of those people who plays the perpetual victim, NOONE has had it as hard as she has, (mainly, by the sound of it, due to many of her own poor choices), so she felt justified in taking whatever she wanted. One of those ones that sees the spouse as a cardboard cutout, bitch, fat, sexless etc, so that she doesn’t feel any twinges of remorse in indulging in the kind of sneaky shitty behavior she did. She honestly expressed surprise that it wasn’t me moving out of the house with our baby when hubby and I split, she genuinely thought that hubby would stay put and she could slip into the gap left by my absence and take over my life. She was even trying to make friends with his friends. Stupid and creepy.

  • My ex-wife-traitor-bitch-liar-home wrecker-NPD master-gaslighter extrordinaire, slept with my cousin as an answer to her “unhappiness” that I only heard about after the fact.

    Fact: I was a super loving husband and provider, great father, moral, strong, passionate, leader and lover.

    Also, blind to the signs that lead to her decisions.

    I would love it if my cousin (who I have not seen since before the DDays) tried to coach me on how I could have been a better husband. Sure, cousin, come on over to discuss. I would only hear grunts and partial words coming out of his mouth as I pull my fist out of it, over and over. Picture the “pow” and “smash” logos popping up like in the old Batman series. There should be an exemption on assault and battery when it’s a AP.

    PS I wouldn’t take the ex back is she begged. Still, kicking the cousin’s ass is a matter of principle.

    • rickb89 I am so sorry for your pain, I believe the two worst kinds of cheaters are spouses who fuck family members and Jesus cheaters.

      Neither of them are worth you getting arrested. I hope you can start Muay Thai, Krav Maga or Boxing to help you punch something but stay legal!

      (((rickb89)))

      • Actually, I studied kung fu for 25 years and practice yoga so these things have helped me master my anger towards these two fuck-wads

  • I never saw a photo, nor heard a peep about the OW. Even though she worked with xh for 10 years.

    I know enough about her. She wanted my life. They {she} had this plan….
    My Spouse
    My home.
    My daughter was going to live with them and attend college
    My church – I was going to run up to a tribunal for annulment. So they could get married at the alter.
    They did not want to be exposed as cheaters, but saviors of each others miserable marriages.
    I was going to sign off the house and properties, and move into a trailer with my sister….
    I was going to do this “for the girls”.

    She even wanted my pet bird! Unfortunately, she did not get what she thought. A blabbermouth parrot that sang the location of the love shack apartment. hehehehehehehehehehehehehe.

    Oh, she also got investigated at work and whatever lovelies came out of that. Plus police reports (that were refused to be taken due to no proof or credibility) about how much “danger” she was in…
    They are both fit for one another. Two pieces of poop, that are well matched.

    • Yes, what is it with these, ‘Oh, they’ll just roll over/step aside and I’ll ease on into their life and things will carry on and noone will even realize there’s a different person at the spouses side? It takes a special kind of delusion to be able to swallow that one. Or just perhaps a lack of imagination. Because the betrayed spouse might have a free will/different plans, you know? Oh, perhaps they’ll hand over the keys to the cheater, but their children, reaaaally? I know of no mother or father (on the chump side of things, anyway) that wouldn’t fight tooth and nail, to their last breath, to protect their children from harm, and that includes stupid people. I’m glad you’re OW was investigated at work, too, they deserve the pressure to put on somewhere. There is no real legal compensation for cheating but often someone with disordered ideas/a dishonest enough streak that allows them to cheat, will have that spill over into areas of their life, that thankfully, people can take some action against.

  • Also in reference to the”ribbon in the hair” cute phrase but still I did everything cooked meals had them ready gave him what he wanted , also I didnit mention when the affair life long mistress started I was pregnant with my 2nd son?? so this guy wanted it all this OW was older she is almost 60 now she was 5 years older when they met and let just say she is not growing old gracefully hahaaa, what he saw in her i will never know and when I first came to BOTH of them they denied it for years 6 year of this torment because neither one has balls!! Now since she gave him the Heave Ho, I am his Good Woman and he loves me what about the feelings I am sorting out that I do not know what to do with?? plus he is a narcissist with sociopath tendencies ?? I believe she is the same!! I am left with the damage they just go on!! Not Fair! I did my job and what did I get Betrayal, Deceit, Loss, & PTSD! Thanx Alot!!

  • So do the OMs have any advice for the chump husbands? Work hard at your job so you can make more money for your wife to spend. Do that without working more than 40 hours a week, however, because your wife also needs you at home to help with the housework and raising the kids. When you come home take some time to comb your hair and straighten your tie before you walk in the door. You should also bring a spare shirt to change into so you are fresh and be sure to bring flowers. Once you get home offer to make dinner so your wife can take a much needed break. After dinner do the dishes, read to the children and get them to bed. Don’t take too long about it, however, because you need to leave time to romance your wife too. Compliment her on what she is wearing and thank her for all of her hard work. Be sympathetic and understanding as she tells you about her stressful day. Don’t tell her your troubles, however, that would just be a downer. Then light the candles, run the bubble bath, and make sure you message her feet for a couple of hours before you even entertain the idea of sex. Then be the first one up in the morning to get the kids up and out the door so that she can get her much needed beauty rest (of course she is always beautiful and you need to tell her so several times a day so she knows you noticed).

    So guys, did you do all of that? No? Well no wonder she left you.

    • I was going to comment on this subject (OM), in that given what I’ve read, seen, and experienced, that (in general) OM have a completely different mindset than an OW when it comes to their goals. OW seem to fantasize/envision themselves taking over the chump wife’s place and seamlessly transitioning the chump’s marriage over to them. They view the chump wife as some kind of failure for “failing to meet” her husband’s needs. In this regard, the mindset of an OW isn’t so much different than that of cheating wive’s (like mine), who also envision seamlessly transitioning the OM into the place of the chump husband who (in her mind) was “failing to meet” her needs. My wife talked to her friends about how much the kids would get along with OM – gag.

      OM on the other hand (and in general) don’t seem to fantasize or envision themselves as taking over for the chump husband. In fact, they have no desire to have to deal with all of the baggage of permanently taking on somebody else’s wife on a daily basis. OM just want free sex. So they’re completely happy with the chump husband continuing to take care of all the cheating wife’s real life issues, paying for their bills, dealing with her day-to-day needs, etc., while all the OM has to do for the wife is have sex. It’s really a nice arrangement for them.

      My wife envisioned slipping me out of our marriage and just moving the OM in. The problem was i) her OM was married and liked sleeping with both his wife and mine (why sleep with one woman when you can sleep with two?), and ii) he wanted absolutely nothing to do with kids (and we have school-aged kids) despite my wife’s ridiculous opinion that he’d be great with ours. So………yeah, the OM wasn’t looking to “replace” me so much as enjoy the fruits of my labor while leading my imbecile of a wife on.

      • Ok I guess all of that is really what the wayward wife is imagining OM will provide. Good luck with that.

        In the case of my STBX I think he really does think he can be her night in shining armor rescuing her from her lousy husband. I don’t think he has really thought this through, however. She has five kids. He can’t afford child support for his own kids and help her support hers too. I don’t see her sticking with him for long if there is no significant financial contribution eventually. Great sex only goes so far for most women. Never mind that the attentiveness she is getting from him right now will eventually fade and then he will be the one demanding the constant attention to his needs.

  • I don’t even know where to start in describing the peachiness of my OW. She started off giving ‘friendly advice’ on new babies to my husband, who she met through their mutual hobby, and (while I was kinda busy with our new child and had not even an inkling of what was going on) ended up (I read their messaged conversations) abusing me as a woman, a mother and a ‘priviledged, rich bitch’ who didn’t appreciate him, where as of course she would (and by that, she meant lots of sex) and he needed to leave me and our infant to collect his prize. When he expressed doubts about this course of action, she told him to just think of all the fun they would have enjoying their hobby together. Yep, implode your life motherfucker, because think of all the carefree sex and fun that awaits!

  • So many massively famous and beautiful women–and men–who get chumped, in spite of having great bone structure and a good stylist to manage hair and wardrobe. So I’m thinking “wife school” is probably not what’s needed in marriages where one partner cheats.

    • Oh and the MOW in my case? Dumped by Jackass. Now divorced, single parent. Working 2 jobs. Her kids hate the new boyfriend. And she is STILL pining for Jackass, who has moved on to the next victim. There’s more, but you get the picture. She blew up her whole life because he wanted a few months of kibbles from chasing her and helping her devalue her husband of 20+ years. And this is just what SHE puts out on social media. Imagine the real problems.

      • Yeah, for the life of me I can’t figure out why the other woman in my case would blow up what looked to be an amazing life. She had beautiful kids, a hardworking husband who loved her, a gorgeous newly remodeled house, tons of money. We had similar perks. Full Krakatoa for two families that no one should have been tossing aside for a year of ego strokes and clandestine love from the Facebook messenger . It still baffles me.

  • What an arrogant, self-serving, narcissistic witch. Sounds just like my H’s sweetie. No morals whatsoever and no way would I want to have anything to do with her.

  • I started to carefully craft a point-by-point “Chump Husband’s Response to the 12 Steps of Wife School,” but it’s storming pretty badly here today and at some point I decided to invoke the typing equivalent of ‘save your breath.” So I’ll summarize my thoughts to Ms. Symonds thusly:

    None of your steps amount to anything if you’re dealing with a disordered fuckwit (male or female) with a sense of entitlement. Whatever you do, the goalposts will shift:

    – “You kept your appearance in check, but not enough or in the right way. That’s why I cheated.”
    – “You were intimate with me, but not enough or in the right way. That’s why I cheated.”
    – “You stroked my ego and other parts, but not enough or in the right way. That’s why I cheated.”

    Your list and book are bullshit. Your self-bestowed title as “the World’s first and only Infidelity Analyst” is bullshit. You present as someone thoroughly and hopelessly in love with herself.

    And “Be Intimate with your husband everyday” should be “Be Intimate with your husband every day” . . . dumbass.

  • Oh goodness, what a sore subject.

    I try not to think too much about the OW. It can put me into a tailspin that ruins my day. I knew her and used to like her. Now I want NOTHING to do with a person who’d willingly lie to and destroy her own family, actively participate in destroying mine, walk into my home smiling when she knew she was sleeping with my husband, and send GIFTS to my children as if she just gained two sweet kids from the deal, how sweet…WTF.

    In the middle of my horrible “pick-me-dance” stage, I heard some condescending crap that alternately infuriated and crushed me. My STBX passed on all sorts of woo-woo instructions from her to update me on where I was in my “stages of grief”, on what I should be doing to “move on”, on how I needed to be more agreeable to their master plan and stop fighting for my marriage…that she didn’t think I was in a healthy place and it wasn’t good for my kids….BARF! BARF! BARF! Whenever he opened his mouth and said strange things, I knew I was essentially talking to HER instead of the man I married.

    The idea that my spouse and this horrible person were sitting around deep into the night…nekid in one of his work hotel rooms, I’m sure…discussing how to “manage” my healing process, absolutely crushed me.

    Then when I talked to her STBX and discovered the big series of coincidences between both our spouse’s mysterious absences over the last year, she was apparently furious with him because “you’ve set poor Chump back MONTHS in her healing process”….At first that crushed me too, then it pissed me off something awful. Um. Hate to break it to you, Mrs. DoubleHomewrecker, but learning the depth of the lies did not set me back. Instead, it CATAPULTED me from “pick-me” to “where’s that divorce lawyer’s number!”.

    But I still squirm to think of them talking about me and my feelings…or how she might pity me now.

    Hopefully someday I will not care so much. And may the karma bus arrive before my kids get too much exposure to her toxic dishonesty and ideas of a healthy marriage.

    • This woman is a sociopath.
      As she kicks you in the face with steel toed boots, she is murmuring consolation & concern over your concussion and bleeding head? Digest how disordered that is.

      She may have a “hot minute” of superiority….but people 99.99% of the time people do not change.

      People don’t go from pathologically dishonest sleaze bags to beacons of morality, cozy families of trust and stability who read scriptures at night and have chaste thoughts. Just give it a moment. The games will begin between two shit bags.

      And then that bitch can work on her “healing process.” But never forget- your spouse is the person who exposed your family to this filthy sociopathic slit.

      I am not sure which is worse-rage or grief. But as far as what she thinks….don’t give that another nanosecond of your life. She is a boil on the ass of pedophile.

  • I hate OW and AP(s) like a vegan hates an abattoir. They are subhuman to me.

    However- we must never lose sight of the terrible fact- that if our partners had a stick of integrity- these maggots silly machinations to “have our lives” would have been something that the couple, in that bliss that is exclusivity- would laugh about behind THEIR backs. And the H/W would have told the bitch/asshole to fuck off on speaker phone so you could hear and be in the loop.

    These cheaters navigate dangers everyday. They don’t saunter out in front of dump trucks or dip their penis in acid or shove dynamite up their vagina. No one could make them- no matter how much they talked, cajoled, sexted, or manipulated or plotted- to betray, to be in or “steal” our lives.

    OW/AP are fungible. Like grains of rice in a bag. Interchangeable. They are a hole and a kibble dispenser.

    They deserve a ton of hot coals heaped on their heads, but our XH & XW, they invited destruction, disease and soul death into our lives.

    They picked up the revolting stranger, gave them the keys to the front door and let them take a shit in the middle of the dinner table. And then asked us to clean up it and then fight for a crumb of their putrid “love”.

  • If being a mistress is such a fabulous role, why is this parasite serial OW “recovering”? Without knowing what she looks like, she reminds me of Judge Judy’s saying: “Beauty fades; dumb is forever”.
    The advice I got from OW (via ex) was “if you want to repartner, you should make a bit more effort with your appearance”. Coming from a woman who wears inch-thick freakish theatrical makeup on to teach primary kids, a crazy side ponytail and an assortment of ill-fitting brightly coloured mismatched clothes.

  • Great subject today! I recieved snail mail! Gosh how wonderful the OW sent real mail complete with heart stamps no less. In this mail which included glamour shots of her in bathing suits with my husband of 30 years, OW admonished me for being a horrible wife and mother. Hilarious. Projection much! She was married and childless! My husband and I were in the middle of a divorce and I used her thoughtful correspondence! Hmmm! Not sure how much that lovely letter cost him but he was shocked to see it during our proceedings. Nice touch!

  • I only met the gold digging whore once when she showed up at an Alanon meeting to canoodle with my husband all through the meeting. I had to chair the damn thing, which I did with as much class as I could muster. Their attempt at a public humiliation was a bust because I was able to call up my inner classy ice bitch and take care of business. She later dumped cheater boy because he drastically reduced his income in an attempt to dodge child support. Her visions of hitting the mother lode evaporated along with his big juicy paycheck and she was gone like a fart in the wind. Of course, according to cheater boy, that was all my fault too….bhwaaahaahaaa!

    • Tessie – as always, your wisdom is always welcome.
      No doubt we could (and should) all tap into our Inner Classy Ice Bitch!

      I had the unfortunate opportunity to have this OW as a BFF. She definitely wanted my life – yes, this is interesting post today.
      It’s oddly funny that they are out the door the minute they see the finances diminish, thanks to the 50/50 law.
      The X was supremely thrifty when it came to his paycheck – one more reason I’m glad I dumped him. She’s been hanging on for 3+ yr now and he’s resorted back to his very tight shfinkter butt muscles. Plus, he had his prostate completely removed the day our divorce was final.

      She lives with him in a new beautiful home but, I will place bets that she’ll run out of ways to convince him to share his money.
      My advantage here is, really knowing this guy after 35 yrs, and she will not see a dime or a fuck from him.
      Ha Ha Ha

  • My (ex)husband told me that she was divorced or in divorce?, he’s always confused and forgets when it comes to such unimportant details, and poor she was having credits to pay, but also full of life, sporty, and needy of sex. He showed her pictures with me and my sons. So he convinced her to fuck him. I guess she also understood me very well and she was only trying to give me a hand.

  • I want to place a bet right now that this repeat column about the “sisterhood” will get 500 replies. Any female chump has learned the hard way that there are many ghouls among the presumed “sisters”.

  • I’m another one who never really involved his whore in our divorce. Don’t get me wrong, I am unrelenting in my characterization of her. Around the house she is literally known as “Dave’s Whore” when she comes up. Mine also did the whole “oh we are just friends and you guys will be friends too.”

    In the short time I knew her (before I full grasped what the situation was), I remember thinking she was just a mess/horrible person. I knew that she had gotten a DUI, and she had at least one STD. I also heard that she somehow got uninvited to a wedding (like the bride said “it’s better if you don’t come.”). Ex and I went her college graduation party and I remember chatting with her parents and I was like “wow, these people really don’t like their kid.” Literally, on her graduation day, her parents dislike of her was glaringly obvious to me. There was more that I won’t detail, but I just remember thinking “This is so weird that ExH is so chummy with this person who is kind of a walking dumpster fire.”

    So once I actually sorted out the truth it all made sense, she’s such a mess she made him feel better about himself. He didn’t age well, he has a laundry list of health problems, he’s an asshole, he has no friends, he models himself as the next Elon Musk or Steve Jobs, but he’s not actually a good businessman (sloppy, poor decisions, bad at record keeping) etc. She’s like 15 years younger and has no friends (because she’s an asshole) and they have this whole “us against the world” thing happening. He was literally paying her to be close by. She was doing “projects” for his business… she was literally his whore.

    So yeah – I don’t have anything to say to that. They were both smart enough to realize that I was not to be fucked with. My profession (a specific science) requires being good at research, careful comprehension of complex information and attention to detail. I have said “never divorce a specific scientist. I will fuck your shit up… with carefully completed paperwork.”

    I did ask him once if he was going to get a place with Whore, and he kind of acted surprised and was like “no, I’m not going to do that”… but he’s liar, so who knows. I like to day dream that he drags her home to the family some day. She’s very rude, immature and an asshole. I like to think the whole lot of them being like “Really, you destroyed your life with CA for this.”

  • Amen. Sisters don’t stab sisters in the back period! The ow I met tried to tell me I was a good samaritan for being taken advantage of and helping my husband even just after I admitted it to myself. She told me I should feel good for my service and kindness. Craziest woman I’ve ever met yet met. They’re married and she’s still competing for him and bending over backwards. No thanks! So happy that crazy ship has sailed.

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