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Stupid Cheater Life Plans

A discussion broke out Wednesday about Stupid Cheater Life Plans. You know, that ever swirling kaleidoscope of Potential and Opportunity that is a career in soap making/kiteboarding/beer brewing/puppy snuggling/clog recycling…

You gave up your day job?

PUPPY SNUGGLING IS A GROWTH INDUSTRY!

Stupid Cheater Life Plans are those passing whims cheaters want to pass off as substance. “Hey, Beauregard University DOT com is offering a MASTERS in Puppy Snuggling!” And make unilateral decisions to pursue. “Oh, by the way, I refinanced the house to pay for my P.S. degree.”

…And then abandon halfway through for another Stupid Cheater Life Plan.

“Tofu Taco FOOD TRUCKS are the FUTURE!”

Puppy snuggling?

“It was not my passion.” There were challenges and hardships. “A puppy peed on me.” They were not sufficiently appreciated. “Can you believe they did not meet my salary demands?”

Stupid Cheater Life Plans are escapism dressed up as adult-ing. “Of COURSE I can run a FOOD TRUCK! Look at my spiral notebook! I’ve drawn lots of schematics! Check out my logo design!”

Um, but food trucks require permits and inspections and stuff…

“DO YOU DOUBT MY ABILITIES?” That’s just like you, being a killjoy. Why don’t you prove your fealty to the wingnut with a little down payment? Just to prove you care. I think you should. Schmoopie understands. You should be more like Schmoopie. Schmoopie is a tofu visionary.

Anybody live this particular Stupid Cheater Life Plan nightmare?

Tell me about your chaos. And TGIF!

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  • Stupid cheater wanted to move to the coast for retirement so that he could open a fishing charter that catered only to firemen & cops. He can’t catch a fish in a pond to save his life, but SURE!! We’ll invest our retirement into buying a boat & all the accompanying gear. But slow down, he’s stressed out NOW!! He needs a change NOW!!! So in what I now see as the pick me dance, I told him to quit his side job (my marriage is more important than $$!) and he also hated the family dog. Demanded that we got rid of it … so we got did. Turns out I should have gotten rid of stupid cheater (duh, right?) Never, EVER pick a man over a dog – especially one that is willing to take that dog away from his children. I don’t think they’ll ever get over having to give their dog away. We went and got another one (we’ve always been a dog family), but they still talk about stupid cheater making them give their dog away.

    • Omg, my stupid cheater wanted to give our dog away too! What is that? She was a super-sweet golden retriever and about 12 at the time! I didn’t but considered it “if that would make him happy and improve our marriage.” On the upside, he did make ow and kids get rid of their guinea pigs when he moved in with them. What a prize she won in him.

      • They are jealous of animals because animals are far better people than they are.

        • This!! So funny & TRUE!! I think they’re jealous of the attention the animals get. Takes away from SLL the focus being on them every second of every day!!

          • My ex actually scolded me for calling my son’s Golden Retriever and Yorkshire Terrier “babe”. Now I realize it reminded him of what he was calling someone else! Also, Sociopaths are weird near animals and small children…I think that they sense that small children and animals can detect their defects, falseness and insincerity. This is something that I always noticed about my ex, but, did not fit all the puzzle pieces together until the past two years. Oh, what an education it’s been!

        • Sociopaths don’t like pets because pets require empathy. ( A friend of mine made that observation about why our current prez doesn’t have pets, but it fits here).
          About 15 years ago one of the family cats (that had been with me from single days) disappeared suddenly. X told me she must have run away or got hit by a car. Turns out later I found evidence that he’d dumped her off in a park somewhere because she’d pee on the piles of dirty clothes the slob left on the floor. Trust that they suck!!

      • He used to threaten me when my dog did anything wrong that my punishment was I’d have to go stay with my parents for 2 days. He’d yell now you need to leave for 2 days! As a married woman in my 30s and the co-owner of our house i was told I had a 2 day punishment. My dog was a polite sweet old man and a treasure on Earth. The other dog was his before we were married… that dog did things “wrong” too as dogs will do by accident (muddy paws, throwing up, and eating a snack off of a counter) but funny how that never lead to HIM being punished. I think he used the dog as a way to get me out of the way for 2 days of easy cheating. I found out not long after this that he had a howorker. Why else would I be getting banished for what our dog did?

        • Why the hell can any person banish you from your own home? That’s crap, no matter the reason. He who doesn’t like the way things are here should leave. Adios, Dude, and leave the dog you like, too, he doesn’t need your crap either.

          • Actually…..he should go and leave both dogs. He doesn’t deserve to own a dog……dick.
            I’m so happy you managed to escape him, but even prior to my 4 d days my ex knew better than to banish me from my home.
            I hope you got both dogs AND the house from that asshole.
            If any guy on this planet told me to leave my own house I’d tell him to go fuck himself.

      • My ex took the dog( I encouraged it because i bought him the dog). He gave the dog away not even giving me a chance to say I would keep him( I would have). He was 11 and elderly for a daschund. I mourned the dog too.

        • The only time my STBX cried was when he told me the children would never forgive me if I didn’t let him have the dog. The only time he showed any emotion I realise now was for himself! I shall miss the dog, he’s great, Mr Cheaterpants not so much.

      • ex had our cat put down before she was really ready to go. I let him do it because I didn’t want him to think I was picking the cat over him. Getting a dog instead was his idea. Thankfully he likes the dog. Dogs are better at worshiping their owners than cats. Cats make you earn it.

    • Mine wants me to give away our two very small dogs as well, because THEN he will be happy. With all his cheating and fake promises to change, why would I do something to devastate our kids when he always has one foot out the door? Never mind that while he’s constantly gone, they sit with me ON THE COUCH and don’t judge me when I watch HGTV.

    • Our dog (ex-cheater-troll’s favorite) died and we went through a pick me dance of sorts to get us the kind of dog he likes, and then he hated it, and surprisingly the new dog hated him too. Lesson learned, keep and trust the dog, ditch the cheater!

  • Mine had a fantasy about having a little corner shop in the suburbs where he would have a law practice. But he’d only open it when he felt like it.

    I pointed out that if he wanted to get any clients, he’d actually have to open when they wanted, rather than when he wanted.

    The look of disgust was almost palpable. And this from a man who was always telling me he’d studied economics at university.

    (Actually this was part of his mindfuckery; the little corner shops were always near where I lived, and we’d be having a walk in the evening, and he would pretend that he was actually interested in having a future with me, and moving out of his extremely comfortable home that he had no intention of sharing with me or anyone else …)

    • I was clearly divorcing my cheater but in the week that I still talked to him I asked him what he was going to do to try to be a better person (and dad)- for the kids. His response was that he was working on eating healthier- more salads.

      To clarify, I’m a dietitian. My ex was cheating on me, had online dating profiles and was carrying out all sorts of bank account sorcery to cover his habits, but his road to recovery mainly centered around increased leafy vegetable intake. Neat.

      • ???????? I cant help but laugh at thus cause I had the exact same response!!

      • Well, he clearly hasn’t hit bottom yet, because the true testament to his commitment to reform is … kale.

      • Omg! You can’t make this shit up! X is telling everyone that he is going to become a better dad (almost completely absent now and we are divorced) by….. eating mushrooms!

        Yes folks, mushrooms are the answer to all character disorders, substance abuse, mental illness, etc etc etc

        I hate mushrooms, always have.

        What a delusional fuck

        Thank God I’ve moved on.

        • Maybe he meant psilocybin mushrooms. Getting high and escaping his rotten self and the great darkness within.

        • I can save him the trouble, fuckwit loves mushrooms, ate them all the time: he sucks at being a dad!!!

          As I have said before, he even treated me like a mushroom; fed me shit and kept me in the dark.

      • So funny! Clear he has no idea what being a decent father is – and this was his feeble attempt! Stupid, but still all focussed on on him and his world, not that of his kids at all. He was obviously just saying what he thought you would want to hear.
        When in the final lot of RIC we had to write a list of what we were prepared to do for the other. Mine wrote down increasing his 2 weekly psychotherapy that he had been having for 4 years (that had simply given him a forum to justify his abuse, and during which time it had gotten progressively worse) to 3 times a week. Huge cost, no benefit to anyone else – although he obviously got a lot out of it. And I’m a psychiatrist! I’m not saying there is no benefit in therapy, BTW, I do a lot of psychotherapy but not psychoanalysis (so outdated) – and with a narcissist it is just adding fuel to the fire. I know good nutrition is very important but not sure how that can improve character!

        • outofsparkles: Do you think psychoanalysis makes narcissist more selfish and justifiable?and if yes, how? This idea struck me because I kind of believe that psychoanalysis justifies the wrong doings sometimes in that the wrong doings is blamed on buried issues!

          • Set this is of interest to me too. Right after DD but before his first therapy session, when I started asking why, he said because he was lucky as a child growing up at home because they had a house, a summer house, and belong to a country club. So in effect he was saying he has nothing now. This was said in the context of entitlement. But seriously, he worked well off and never have been. His father just knew how to budget and save, which mine clearly never learned how to do.

            I was the one that asked him to start therapy since I let him stay under the same roof after D day since he had no job, no car, no money…until he got the job offer. He did three therapy sessions while he was still here and he did two separate group sessions per week for a few weeks. Once he moved out, his work schedule conflicted with all his therapy. I noticed he went to his therapist this week.

            I can’t believe he’s actually continuing therapy. My sister pointed out that I was mistakenly taking it as a sign of him wanting reconciliation. She feels it’s more like he’s really hit bottom and his therapist, who he must’ve really liked upon meeting him, is what is keeping his little world together right now since he’s living at his older sister’s house and just started a new job.

            With cycle analysis really be what’s motivating him to continue doing therapy? I assure you, he is not a therapy kind of guy. He was so emotionally anorexic the whole 30 years I knew him – could never have a conversation deeper than a puddle.

          • Exactly… and the wronged partner sits there having to watch the person who was supposedly their confidant and lover, get out of the fact that they were lying to their face& that everything between them was a lie ,,& that everything the faithful partner ever did for them was a waste of precious time .

            • Emotional anorexic… I LIKE that! Is that the opposite of emotional intelligence?? Mine was full of it the first 6 years or so of our relationship and marriage,, then completely lost it after realizing that whores existed and that he could afford them.
              I became a dishcloth at home but the change was more gradual and I was busy with two babies and just waiting and killing myself hoping he would revert or that it was bad stuff at work ( law enforcement) by the time I had 4 babies with him he was suddenly this MONSTER who would not look around and everything wrong with our relationship was somehow just that ‘he didn’t love me anymore’. None of it made sense and I didn’t even have time to take a breath, kids who adored him looking at me and listening every time i would make any progress in an argument … then , lo & behold I found out there WAS an actual reason for all of it .. he was able to pay for instant gratification elsewhere and this gave him extra time for his work!!! Ah what the hell i don’t need her !! I just need to keep her here for the kids otherwise she can rot. & I’m still rotting ten years later .. no way to get away from him.
              Older parents rely upon him etc etc my life is a total waste.

      • Hilarious! “bank account sorcery”. Oh yes, I have a feeling my STBX might be practicing a little of that black magic as well.

        I was just starting to feel bit sorry for myself and your post has made me laugh, once again at the absolute absurdity of my situation.

        Mine was full of ways he was going to improve himself to be. Better person and father. Ha. Big flipping HA! He has not done one measurable or visible ounce of self improvement.

        Thanks!

    • Mine was a slight variation of the corner shop. One plan was to buy a place big enough for us to live in one part and he would open his practice (physician) in the other. That way he would never have to drive to work and be annoyed by the other drivers who push his buttons and those damn cops who enforce those pesky speed limits.

      Another was that we would buy a place where I could open a shop and he would take a room to see patients once in a while. Kind of like a walk in clinic but only when he was available and felt like it.

      And last my favorite. He was going to buy a van and drive around to see patients. Kind of like a bookmobile or a food truck.

      • I’m sorry, was he proposing that I get my Pap smear in the back of a VAN?

        • Luckily it never got far. He gave up on the van idea when he needed to spend time working in all the logistics. All I could think of was that it was a law suit waiting to happen.

      • A variation on the corner shop theme: the former whined about… well, most everything.

        One of his big whines was he hated driving to an office. Since he was a self-employed freeloader- oops, I meant freelancer ???? I arranged and built him a man cave/home office/studio consisting of a 2,000 square foot building 28 steps out the back door and across a dirt driveway.

        Then he complained that the office had no windows (it did but he put his main desk in an interior room) and that his shoes got dirty when he took 5 steps across the dirt path.

        So I (**Chump Warning**) had the dirt path paved for him.

        He was still unhappy so he interviewed soulmates from Ashley Madison until he found Twu Wuv, or as a friend calls the OW, having seen a photo, “Gullet Schmoopie.”

        And after 7 years of litigation, I got me and he got her. I couldn’t be more pleased.

        And I got the corner office as well, which I rent to a neighbor for a princely sun.

        • That makes me feel like a freeloader. I own my own small dog business. I asked STBX over the past nine years if I should get another full-time job with benefits once I had recovered from my tick infections. I was previously a paralegal and so I was making about $35K more then. He always told me no but I’m sure that was part of the reason for devaluing. $35K, no benefits and my 401(k) gone because he was crap at budgeting.

          I should start a new thread on this. Because now I’m wondering, like I did for the past nine years, if I should just ditch the dog business and forget about alimony. It was always my greatest fear that he would die or divorce me and I wouldn’t be able to support myself on the dog business.

          And what a fucking asshole he was. We had this conversation so many times,and it turns out that he’s been whoring around with ho- workers and anonymous people for at least seven years. Do you think he would’ve had the balls to tell me that I should get a full-time job knowing fully well that “he wasn’t happy.” Nope he could care less about me; it was all about him.

          • If you had gotten a full-time job, you wouldn’t have been such a good wife appliance, Nver. Gotta have the flexibility to provide good service to the narc! And you’re right, he clearly didn’t give a flying fuck what that mean for you, down the road.

            DEFINITELY go for alimony!!! You were contributing to your family as YOU BOTH agreed you should do. You have the right to alimony, and you deserve it! Then, later, if YOU feel that would be best for you, you can look at other work options. Or not!

        • Exactly.. why exactly is Ashley Madison a legal thing?? Ohhh I remember,, because men still run the world .. which is why the strip clubs and porn sites even exist… they use them to get what they need,, act as if they are policing them somewhat so that they can make money off of it also, & never try hard enough to shut them down so that they can get what they want while their unsuspecting wives are home ,,& out ,, working their butts off thinking that they have independence and loyalty… meantime the whores are eating up all the extra money.
          I could go ON and ON but the bottom line is that the majority of wives have NO idea what TRULY goes on in those clubs or what truly does on at lunchtime. Etc etc.
          Or they wouldn’t be around anymore. They don’t go just to watch dancers. There is a VIP room in the back that serves every place for a 5minute to 1 hour ( or more ) long quickie depending on how much they have to spend ..& the ATM is INSIDE THE BUILDING. And they serve lunch and the risk is NONE ,, because all of the other men who they might run into inside the place are there cheating also… code of silence brotherhood of honor… we didn’t see each other here!! I’ve got your ass and you’ve got mine.& if you think your man is unfaithful for any reason other than that he became able to pay for it ,,, or that the opportunity became available – then You are just making excuses for his lying ass that has NO integrity.

    • Mine was gonna be a famous guitar player/musician/lyricist. It’s how he wooed his women. He – and they -thought he was SO great. But in reality, he was mediocre, at best. So pathetic, and kinda funny at the same time.

  • Ahhh – memories – another cheater of mine wanted to get a job with a major NGO at senior corporate level with only a BA in anthropology.

    Again, when I suggested going in at a lower level, the LOOK.

    What is with the LOOK?

    • Lola i know that look. I still cringe when i think of it. By the time i got it he was plotting to get rid of me, in anyway necessary. I was clueless. I was clueless because he was also always chatting away about all the fun things we were going to do. What a psycho.

      • Speaking of psycho’s, mine was constantly telling me I was his “best friend, I remember thinking that there was something wrong with me because I just assumed we were and I never thought there was any reason to tell him.
        Looking back, he was saying I was his “best friend” so I would feel secure in our relationship and not suspect anything while he screwed around.
        Another clue he seemed awkward when he’d say it and instead of making me feel warn and fuzzy I felt uncomfortable. Like being with Ted Bundy..

        • Brit omg mine said i was his best friend too!!! And it always creeped me out!!!

          • Oh how I wish… mine didn’t say anything at all.. just suddenly one day was a raging drunk who was the total opposite of the man I had gone all through college and three years of marriage with , without ever taking a drink !! Talk about blindsiding!! There I am,, I’ve got babies all around , a clean home beautiful dinner waiting and have spent the day (day after day after year after year doing demolition and restoration ( as in PLASTERING AND WOODWORK RESTORATION ETC ETC YOU NAME IT , while at the same time teaching little ones under my feet to read and giving them all the confidence in the world with nonstop LOVE and discipline and just teaching them all they need to know and just never letting anything slide) and one day he starts walking in the door every night late for dinner and drunk but covering it UP…!!! .. pick a fight with me and fuck this I’m OUT of here.. me just like a deer in the headlights kids like wtf and then he would be back in an hour acting normal and apologizing .
            Day after day year after year no way OUT. Everything was HIS,, everything was never enough. His mother up my ass at every turn and nobody ,, no not ANYBODY with any nerve to speak up to him. I spent ten years diffusing the situation and just trying to keep alive enough to protect the children. Stay upstairs don’t come down until I tell you if he’s stable enough on and on .. it became so bad that he was watching every dollar I spent on groceries making sure I didn’t save any money so that I wouldn’t be able to get away.. in time the meantime he’s screaming get out!!! If you don’t like It GO!! Where to go?? I don’t know. One night he was so bad that I had to run for my life into the freezing snow with bare feet. Nobody around to run to and the kids still in the house asleep. No phone no money . .. on and on..
            Teach your daughters their worth and tell them from when they are very little “ you are not here to entertain BOYS,, you are not here to worry about what BOYS think of you,, you are here because you are smart and because you can change the world with your strength” trust me it works..& never ever stop watching anybody they date or marry. Back them UP and believe them. Let them know that they can always come home.

            • Let them know they can always come home. That is so important. I think sometimes we stay because we don’t want to admit something is wrong.

          • Leavealyingloser, the your my best friend creeped me out too, there would be this awkward silence after he’d say “your my best friend,” I wouldn’t know what to say.
            I remember feeling weird, wondering if it was me that was missing something.
            In retrospect, what I was missing is you’re my best friend was probably image management.
            Brit will be less likely to suspect anything if I tell her she’s my best friend.
            Who knows, what I do know is they’re weird.

            • Brit they are so weird. I think they really do want to be your best friend. They smother you with it. They are jealous of your friends. They want to isolate you. Its all about control. I just remember thinking you are my husband not my bestie. Of course he was my friend but somehow him saying that felt so weird to me.

  • In the interests of balance though I will say some have made good businesses in what could be seen by others as niche fantasy careers/businesses, I know we did and it depends very much on talent, luck and temperament. However from the other angle I did live with someone who was into whatever was the flavour of the day and got bored very very quickly, usually after spending my money on it!! As I was the one with the sensible job,

    • I have a lot of respect for anyone who’s a self starter and makes a go of a business, especially in a creative field.

      What I’m talking about here is chaos, and careers as aspirational life fantasies.

      Just like other aspects of their lives it’s I want all the perks, and none of the responsibility. You lesser people do the heavy lifting and clean up.

      • We lived in a “developing” country, where the local rich people and expats have drivers, maids and nannies – and it’s considered normal!
        Cheater had no real qualifications from his home country, and the only thing he had going for him in the country we were living in was the fact he could speak the language. So, he was like the “go between” for investors from his home country who wanted to invest in this country’s booming business opportunities. He called himself a “business man”, but he knew very little about business. Basically, he wanted to be the BIG MAN being driven around by drivers, making faux important calls from the back of the car, with local staff doing all of his dirty work. He felt powerful, and abused his perceived power. Talked down to local staff, who were the ones doing all of his dirty work. Made them work like dogs, and didn’t pay them properly. Rarely paid overtime. People there are poor, and accept bad working conditions because they need the money. He took advantage of them and did VERY LITTLE actual work himself.

        I never knew much about his business because he kept a lot of it private. But during my snooping days, I uncovered a lot of dodgy things he was doing, like paying off people in power. I still don’t understand how he weaseled his way into the business world. He didn’t have the qualifications, the education, or the knowledge. He was just very CHARMING, and had an air about him – people ASSUMED he had money because of the way he carried himself. He’s tall and very handsome, and used his looks to get his way. Very cunning indeed. Mind boggling!

        It gets to me that he’s still over there using and abusing his staff. Hmmmm, I might have to make some calls to immigration ????

        • It isn’t South Africa is it? I live in Cape Town and it astounds me regularly how people who really and quite seriously believe themselves to be decent, moral, kind humans treat their staff like little more than slaves, with zero grasp or understanding of the realities of their lives. ”If they don’t like it they can leave”. Um, no they can’t. Unemployment is ridiculous, actual starvation and desperate poverty is widespread, so ”just leave” is not a realistic choice at all.

          So PAY YOUR STAFF PROPERLY AND DO THE DECENT, HONEST THING. Contribute to pensions, ensure they have fair access to legal help. Seriously, it is a tiny fragment of the least we can do!!

          • That is correct , ‘just leave ‘ is not an option for many,, here or there..& it is used as an excuse or a cop out by many ,, MANY who want to close their eyes and at the same time still be experts with their advice. just leave is the first option the hopeful option the option that doesn’t exist for many who are truly trapped.

          • No, it’s not SA. He’ll never go back to his home country because he is a NOTHING there. And that what I meant to point out in relation to this topic of “Stupid Cheater Life Plans”, because he intends to spend his whole life like that, living in that country, taking advantage of the poor, and continuing get around like the BIG MAN on campus. He’s a would-be if he could-be. He needs to stay there, because he has nothing back in his home country, no qualifications. If he stays where he is, he can live like a KING. I hate it. For the people there, I hate it that they have to put up with yet another expat like him!

      • Fuckwit has found that business in a reality. He only works about 3 day’s a week when he is in town so he has plenty of time for hobbies and whores. He has a minion one step below him (who is also a narc and I have no doubt steals from fuckwit) who hires people at as low a wage as possible and treats them like shit- can you say high turnover? Fuckwit’ higher level employees tend to have the personality of chumps and there is always a power over theme.

        Did I mention his mother does his books for free and never questions any spending?

        My kids used to work there so I have heard all the stories. I mean, who wouldn’t want to work for a boss that when the ac quits on a 100 degree day, comes marching into the warehouse to check the breaker kicking boxes and shouting f bombs because obviously the heat only effects him and it must have been a personal attack.

        He makes noice of starting all kinds of businesses in Florida- it ‘lol never happen, he would have to work.

        • FeelingIt.. Yup!!
          I know exactly what you are describing. You can spend your entire life watching and trying to figure around a person who makes an entire life based on lying and from lying and manipulating. Heaven forbid you unwittingly wind up with one& have children with him.

      • My ex DID have a dream business going, with me in the background with a normal job to support us because the dream didn’t. So my ex was already living his dream, with me financing it.

        Then he had the nerve to complain that I didn’t seem to care about it as much as I once did and never helped out anymore. (after we had KIDS)

        Whenever I mentioned any dreams I might like to pursue, he was disinterested in supporting that.

        Then he decided to become an artist on the side, and was always away, working on this even more. I accepted this and sacrificed even more for it because it seemed to make him so happy.

        Then I found out there was a muse in the background, and it wasn’t me.

        Now she finances the dream business and I have no idea if there is any art being made anymore.

    • Most entrepreneurs are risk-takers, and they need to be. (I have taken my fair share of career/skill assessment tests and you would be amazed at how the questions regarding entrepreneuship focus less on business acumen and more on risk avoidance to determine if you’re cut out for it.)

      The catch is HOW people take risks. Do they take *calculated* risks? “We have enough savings in the bank to try this tofu taco business for three months. If we’re not cash flowing at that time, we’ll close shop and I’ll get a regular job.”

      versus

      “I cashed in our entire 401k fund and sold your grandmother’s diamonds without telling you because I knew you’d say No. The business hasn’t made any money in the last two years but I just KNOW things are going to turn around because I redesigned the logo — with Schmoopie’s help, because she BELIEVES in me. Oh, by the way, we owe 12k in tax penalties for pulling the retirement funds early. You can cover that, right?”

      Oh fuck no.

      Been there and it sucks. People are welcome to take their own risks — but don’t drag my uninformed and chumpy ass along.

      • This is exactly it. Successful entrepreneurs in solid businesses take concepts to reality through a combination of calculated risk taking and general business acumen. Then they adjust as needed in response to their experiences. They don’t just wildly fantasize, leap into the fire without plans or forethought, then ditch when they get bored.

        And yes, exactly, it’s fine for a person to fantasize and leap all they want if the person’s life is constructed such that s/he won’t harm others. If you are single and childless and financially independent and you want to risk blowing up your life, leap forth and let the chips fall, says me.

        However, if you share a home or money or children or anything else that matters with a person, that person’s actions have an impact on you, like it or not.

        This thing about narcissists getting pissed when we don’t support ideas that we can easily see are going to cause us harm is ridiculous. It’s immature, petty, and illogical. It is ludicrous to choose partnership if you don’t want to make life decisions jointly and for mutual benefit. The only people who do that are the people who are AOK with harming others people.

        • The alcoholic always bragged about how good it was to get rich using other people’s money. Yet nothing he tried ever made us rich, because his expenses were always bigger than any profits he hoped to make. But he bought himself cool toys.

          What tore the shreds of our relationship completely apart was when he bragged about having a secret investor for his hairbrained schemes who had given him about $10,000 in seed money, but he never would say who the investor was, not how he planned to pay the investor back. I would ask because I know that people who hand you large chunks off money do want it back, and we lived in a community property state.

          Later I discovered that the secret investor was me! He’d taken my grandmother’s jewelry and sold it!

          • AC that is so horrible! What a smug little piece of crap bragging to you about that. I hope he went to jail.

      • Back in 2011, my ex withdrew every last penny of his life’s savings and borrowed money from me and friends to do a custom-logo job on CDs for a past client. After spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on blank CDs and printing them up, they decided they didn’t want them after all. Because he didn’t have a contract that stipulated “no returns on a custom product,” we were left with an obsolete product with a logo that ensured nobody would ever want it. Brilliant.

      • My ex was an unstoppable entrepreneur/risk taker. I don’t know how many businesses he started, because he didn’t tell me about all of them. Many narcissists are entrepreneurs. As Margalis Fjelstad points out in “Healing from a Narcissistic Relationship,” money is a priority for these people:

        “For the majority of narcissists, money is the only sure thing they trust, so they want as much of it as they can get. Male narcissists who made more money than their female partners frequently think that all the money belongs to them in the first place. Many of them have talked their wives out of working, but during a divorce, blame them for not “contributing.” They expect to keep all of the assets. In some cases, all of the assets may already be in the narcissist’s name alone, so it can be difficult to get your reasonable share.”For the majority of narcissists, money is the only sure thing they trust, so they want as much of it as they can get. Male narcissists who made more money than their female partners frequently think that all the money belongs to them in the first place. Many of them have talked their wives out of working, but during a divorce, blame them for not ‘contributing.’ They expect to keep all of the assets. In some cases, all of the assets may already be in the narcissist’s name alone, so it can be difficult to get your reasonable share.”

          • ^^ THIS!!!^^ OK to double paste it — for my cheater, it’s double true! Money is absolutely the only thing in life he respects, though he hoards all kinds of objects. I think maybe a side effect of lacking empathy yourself is not trusting other people not to all be manipulative assholes also.

        • They think it’s all theirs doesn’t matter who makes more. I know from experiance. Drained savings accounts in two months, then stealing money from my family members to boot.

        • I do have to say that I was surprised by how many things were in his name only. He even went so far as to change a joint car registration to his name only when he sold my car and bought a BMW. The final straw was forging the title of my 1968 Camaro and then declaring that it “had always been in his name”! It was my car in college.
          He also had lots of ridiculous “investments “(all big money losers). Was always going to get this big job or that(instead was getting fired from the one he had). But, his most laughable idea was to “patent” this ridiculous metal disk as a tool for scratch off lottery tickets. I wish I captured my facial expression on that one. What a moron.

          • After reading all the accounts here about cheater exes stealing chump spouse’s $$$$$ and valuables, just like mine did, I can’t say I feel any better about being a victim. But I do feel less lonely.

            What really makes my blood boil, still, after all this time, is the betrayal behind the theft. He stole money I’d saved, sold family heirlooms at pawnshops and on eBay, even stole the kids’ coin collections, and denied doing it every time. He accused our teenage son (behind his back) of being the thief. He told me the jewelry went missing (from the safe!) because I must have done something careless. The heirlooms in particular were treasures with far more value as family history than their current eBay price. But to him they were all just a source of quick cash.

            I did get to hear him slip and admit it, one night when he’d had too much to drink. He started bragging on himself, including how smart he was to get a really good price from the gold-buyer on some of the jewelry. Somehow I restrained myself from killing him on the spot; going to jail wouldn’t have done me any good.

            Then he had the stupidity to say he could go get it back (a year after he sold it- as if!). And he said he felt bad about things he’d done in “those days.” He never once apologized. He made no effort at restitution. He had no remorse for hurting me or his kids. He just told me that HE felt bad. Then he told me that he can’t change the past, so I need to stop dwelling on it.

            As CL says, watch their actions. He didn’t really feel bad about doing any of that. He just felt bad about being caught.

            Anyway, thanks for listening and telling your own stories of betrayal. It’s very hard to forgive when the person who hurt you just doesn’t care. But at least I feel a little less alone tonight.

            • I suggest looking up his ebay acct and finding items he sold and reporting it to the police. No he can’t change the past but the police tend to dwell on that kind of criminal activity.

  • Lol!! I sold my own home to give Cheater the stupid Cheater Life Plans ughhhh lol.
    Yep Cheater’s first qualifications gained TICK. Cheater failed on THAT one because I didn’t SUPPORT it enough.
    Wow hey?
    Second quals mmm. SSDD. TICK.
    Third excuse me while I vomit.
    Repeat and INCREASE demands.
    Tick tick ticking time bomb lol.

    So while I’m raising all the children, working 24 / 7 and doing the laundry, I wasn’t supportive enough AGAIN for the amazing talent of Cheater head to write a world famous song. Whilst doing all the housework I had to listen to worse than a screeching cat voice and say 1000 x “oh that’s interesting!” I could barely lie.

    Then the Cheater wanted me to pay for a 5 year uni course ahem AFTER D Day.
    No way buddy.

    But like every entitled lunatic Cheater THERE’S MORE!

    Now Cheater wanted to travel the world doing card games. It had no job.

    Good idea. FANTASTIC in fact. I’m done. Well and truly.

    Dear Chumplady when will you write the romantic stories of how Schmoopie wives emasculate the Cheating husbands by having a JOB?

    I guess they think kids eat air, dress in air lol and we pay for educations with air.

    Yours in true admiration, CA.

    • Card games? Like playing poker? Or like magic tricks? or making money off uno somehow ? or selling decks of a game he invented ? This is crazy.

      • Damn, stole my retirement idea, playing cards…oh right, Everyone does that at retirement homes, its called Recreational Coordinator

    • I’m so sorry, this one really had me laughing!! I apologize, but what a loon!
      Too bad the world was robbed of the EPIC song, that would of also made millions!
      Hmm, how about work, while you write the song? Tons of waiters and taxi drivers did this, oh yeah, it’s way easier to let the Chump work, she likes to do that!
      Life plans that don’t work…

    • Chumpantidote I sympathize. Mine was going to be the next John Denver. You should have HEARD that noise – Christ it would clear a blocked drainpipe at 100 metres. The real JD would have been turning in his grave.

  • Leaving the job we had moved for (and the income we had based purchasing our house on) to start his own practice. He hired a dishonest office manager, spent our money to start, took out a loan on my minivan (without telling me, of course) to keep it afloat. Got me to work there, for free. Worked there himself, for free (“earned” $10K over a 3 year period). Sold the business to his previous group, at a loss. Paid the final tail insurance by taking money from youngest’s college fund. To this day, maintains that it’s all okay, because we only lost $55K of our own money (that doesn’t account for any of the free labor – at market rates, $300K x3 year’s… you get the idea.) It has taken years to recover financially. And I know I’m “lucky,” because some people lose everything.”
    Thanks for the reminder. Seriously, I sometimes, somehow forget this stuff. Not that he isn’t an awful person on a regular basis, but it is always good to look at the account books.

  • So the saddest part of this admission is that my life’s stock in a company I gave to the cheater actually planned out well. Very very well. 12 years ago he came to me with a business opportunity he wanted to persue with someone he worked with. After much MUCH deliberation I cashed in my stock options and write a huge ass check to him. He was so happy and nearly tore the check he grabbed it up so fast. 2 weeks later the partner left with $50K. More than his share and ALL of mine. ????????‍♀️ But. Cheater was convinced and convinced me too WE could forge ahead. And forge ahead we did. For 12 solid years. I was his main source of office support. I worked my day job in a doctors office and came home to pay bills, invoice customers and balance books. I took night classes at our local adult ed community centers to help further MY knowledge of HIS DREAM. His dream became my dream. I quit MY DREAM 2 years into it. 5 years into that and much major growth by then, he cheated on me with the bookkeeping I was able to hire. And I took him back after he discarded me and slept with half the city while he was on wifey vaca for 7 months. When we got back together, his stipulation was that I get out of our business bc it was “killing our marriage and (he) wants out marriage to work out so badly.” Fast forward 7 more years (we have been married for 20 years) and he cheats on me with a 25 year old outside vendor that works in his industry. Yup, they’ve gone one 4 vacations together..all paid by vendors and our bueisness. And here I sit, he’s been gone for 6 months, and I’m struggling to get my licenses back so I can go back into my fir,ed of work…. do you k ow how difficult it is to get back into any field when you’ve retired your credentials for 4 years and haven’t been in it longer than that? Meanwhile, our business has grown to over 250 employees, and he’s living the life…… the life I apparently can’t keep up with bc I dim his light. He goes around saying I’m the one who cheated….I’ve done my part in the sharing process….much to my dismay. But it’s done. My only restitution is that my attorney will get me a great settle,ent based off that business and I’ve been a stay at home mom for the last 7 years.
    So, there’s that at least.

  • I don’t live on that planet because I don’t engage AT ALL. I read CL early in the process and am no contact except for custody or illness and injury of kids.

    That being said, he has always fancied himself a race car driver and spend lots of time at the track. He and a buddy (cheater McCrazy) have invested in a local track and store cars there etc. It has ‘living space’ which allows them to keep up their lifestyle. I’m sure they are both continuing to use ‘escorts’ even though they are both still with the AP. Vomit.

  • Cheater ex came up with these gems when I found out about affair:

    1) We could continue to live in the same house. He would live in the basement and daughter and I would live upstairs. ( this is the sweet deal mistress had going on with her hubby). No thanks… next
    2) I could move to another state like I wanted. He would continue to pay health care and car insurance. I could come back in 1-2 years. Uhh… no thanks… next
    3) Fine if I felt I needed to go, but could I find a house with a basement so he could stay with me when he came to visit daughter? Oh and could we go out to breakfast as a family?
    4) I voted for fuck you and No Contact… thanks.

    • Pret, my cheater expects the same. Can’t we just cohabitate, it would be soooo much easier?! Only pay one rent and utilities bill, and then he could see the children more. (ie. whenever it’s convenient for him, and so he doesn’t have to do any adulting/scheduling/driving) What’s the big deal? Lots of couples divorce amicably! Why can’t we celebrate birthdays and holidays together?!

      Because — no more cake for you, motherfucker! You don’t even deserve the crumbs.

      sigh I was at meh just moments ago before typing that. Need to take a few deep breaths and get back to that wonderful land.

      • Lol…. mine wanted to stay married and do the above things. He didn’t want a divorce, just a separation. Feel like being Plan B,C and D? They deserve nothing and hopefully that’s exactly what they’ll get… with whip cream and cherry on top!

        • My ex wanted to do the same thing. We would continue to live together, raise the kids together but live separate lives! Oh, and I get to pay all the bills just like before so there “really wouldn’t be any change at home for the sake of the kids”. It was total cake on her part.

          Fortunately I had already found CL and CN so the fast answer to this was no, not going to happen.

          • Mine actually suggested this in an open forum where the court gave us another lawyer to mediate a settlement before going before the judge later that morning. He wanted me to ask my tenant who lives in the basement to leave so he and Schmoopie could move in…for the sake of the kids of course. Thankfully, his lawyer was the first to object….God, we can’t make this garbage up. Previously, his dream to provide better for his kids was to win the lottery…

        • Hah! What is it with these sick bastards? Mine said we could split our duplex between us and he could live next door to be there to “make dinner and mow the lawn with the boys” then 14 and 11. The mediator we were working with at the time said, “Uh, that would be rather unhealthy, cheater-ex,” and the lawyer I was working with to settle my brother’s estate (who passed away while fuckwit was carrying on his affair and who used to own the duplex with us and lived next door) said, “Your ex has rocks in his head if he thinks that’s a good idea.”

      • Whoreface, just in the last month, asked if I would be willing to let her come live at the house one-week on and one-week off. See, she currently lives with her mom rent free in another City, and I have the kids full-time currently and she “misses” them.

        So, if I got this straight, you want to live in the house for free where I still pay the entire mortgage and all the bills and then you will also live at your mom’s for free. Meanwhile, I continue to pay the whole mortgage while living there on half time, and then I get to incur a new expense of paying for some studio that I will live in for only half time.

        And, wait, this deal gets better! When the house is finally sold, even though you won’t let me reduce the sale price to a reasonable level because you insist that if I do, you won’t sign any escrow papers, you still get half the profits while currently not assuming any of the risk or maintenance costs.

        Tell you what, why don’t you get a job, rent a studio yourself, and we will see about you seeing the kids more.

        I am really starting to understand the sickness of a cheater’s entitlement.

        • BINGO! THIS! When my brother passed away, I had to handle his estate, clear out his side of the duplex we had owned with him, make repairs, hire a painter and carpet/flooring installers, hold a garage sale, make several visits to the landfill with his final belongings (amidst tears of grief), arrange with realtors to find suitable tenants, pay the entire mortgage, taxes and interest payment out of life insurance funds left to me, all while ding-dong was off doing ‘hot yoga’ and jazz gigs. Then he expects to be bought out for half the equityWITHOUT having to take a hit on the $15K I spent investing in the property before it was rented. Luckily the judge agreed. Half the expenses were deducted from the equity in the property. But it just shows, cheaters feel they are entitled to everything, even if they haven’t worked or invested themselves in anything. Reminds me of all the losers in the story of Chicken Little.

    • Why would you come back in 1-2 years if you’d taken the time to move?

      • So he would have time to play house with the mistress and have me as Plan B. Mistress had 2 kids with a very involved father. Ex barely acknowledged his own kid when we were married. I asked him if he realized that he was going to try to parent another man’s teenage son. “I didn’t think that far ahead”…. have at it cowboy. His lease is up this August…maybe her divorce is final as well. I smell “It’s time for us to move in together and be a happy family” says mistress turned girlfriend hoping to turn wife…

    • Mine wanted to share the house and the apartment and we would just swap every other week. No thanks. Even aside from not wanting to live by myself (he had schmoopie, I had nobody at that time) in a studio apartment every week, I told him I had no desire to co own a house with him anymore.

      • Wha? You declined to clean & grocery shop for TWO houses for him? How selfish …

    • Wait and see how much help precious Schmoops gives them. Turns out they are often not so interested in providing a free basement either … that was YOUR job. Ha Ha Ha … amusing to think of them scrambling around trying to recapture that happy situation they thought would last forever.

    • Yup mine tried to pull #1 during what I thought was a reconciliation. Fortunately I caught on quick and kicked him out two days later.

  • So the saddest part of this admission is that my life’s stock in a company I gave to the cheater actually panned out well. Very very well. 12 years ago he came to me with a business opportunity he wanted to persue with someone he worked with. After much MUCH deliberation I cashed in my stock options and wrote a huge ass check to him. He was so happy and nearly tore the check he grabbed it up so fast. 2 weeks later the partner left with $50K. More than his share and ALL of mine. ????????‍♀️ But. Cheater was convinced, and convinced me too, WE could forge ahead. And forge ahead we did. For 12 solid years. I was his main source of office support. I worked my day job in a doctors office and came home to pay bills, invoice customers and balance books as well as our normal life responsibilities. I took night classes at our local adult ed community centers to help further MY knowledge of HIS DREAM. His dream became my dream. I quit MY DREAM 2 years into it. 5 years into that and much major growth by then, he cheated on me with the bookkeeper I was able to hire. And I took him back after he discarded me and slept with half the city while he was on “wifey vaca” for 7 months. When we got back together, his stipulation was that I get out of our business bc it was “killing our marriage and (he) wants our marriage to work out so badly.” Fast forward 7 more years (we have been married for 20 years) and he cheats on me with a 25 year old outside vendor that works in his industry. Yup, they’ve gone on 4 vacations together..all paid by vendors and our bueisness. And here I sit, he’s been gone for 6 months, and I’m struggling to get my licenses back so I can go back into my field of work…. do you know how difficult it is to get back into any field when you’ve retired your credentials for 4 years and haven’t been in it longer than that? Meanwhile, our business has grown to over 250 employees, and he’s living the life…… the life I apparently can’t keep up with bc I dim his light. He goes around saying I’m the one who cheated….I’ve done my part in the sharing process….much to my dismay. But it’s done. My only restitution is that my attorney will get me a great settlement based off that business and that I’ve been a stay at home mom for the last 7 years finding it terribly difficult to find a sustainable job after giving up my career so HE can fly in his. Pillar of the community he’s called. The next up in commer that say. Such as outstanding individual the deam. Look what HE made HIS company into, isn’t he impressive?
    So, there’s that at least.

    • I feel you on staying home to support him and then finding it impossible to find work afterwards….

    • I hope your lawyer goes for the jugular. You can enjoy your settlement and not have to worry about being associated with a business that is very likely to be run into the ground.

    • What a user. I hope you get a great settlement and you can do all the things YOU want to do. Onwards and upwards.

  • My cheater was an aspiring rock star who left me in order to continue tearing through the great American songbook , ruining every single tune you ever held dear , singing off key cover versions with his beloved schmoopie.
    In retrospect , I’m more upset that they destroyed perfectly good music and spent hours in a Dunning Kruger circle jerk Facebook group blathering about how talented they were.
    It was a place all failed, sad , old droopy musical failures went to die and pretend they had all finally “made it”.
    Vomit.
    Ps- ex was venomous when he realized he needed to finally get his shit together and buckle down at his real job in order to make his alimony and child support payments. His schmoopie continues to pretend she’s a withered Marianne Faithful…

    • Dunning-Krueger. Had never heard of this so I looked it up. What a perfect description of my FIL! How many times have I struggled to describe just how much his arrogance is only possible because of his ignorance, and his ignorance remains unaltered because of his arrogance! And the condition has an official name!

      And having looked up Marriane Faithfull (very funny reference btw) I then went in a roundabout way onto the namesake of Masochism and learning about the Byronic Hero. Very interesting jaunt through Wikipedia links for a Friday morning.

      Thanks for your post. The references, once I understood them, made it both a perfect picture and a hilarious rip on your cheater and his schmoopie. Well done!

      • Yeah, it’s really funny how these fools think that they and their Schmoopies are all so unique and special; then you look closely and they’re all characters in various comic operas and Shakespearean dramas.

        Close the curtains!!

  • Oh yes, the plotting and planning that went into his escape, i mean his”new job.” Then after securing housing and cars(all to his benefit) he decided to blow up his family’s life. He got everything he wanted and guess what? He is complaining about how unhappy he is. What an asshole.

    • That’s the constant, they never stop complaining.
      No Contact, the path to the truth and the light is also the path to peace and good sleep.

  • So mine may not sound as stupid as others, but he used to work in hospitality, specifically in hotels, and not in the dirty behind the scenes parts of hotels but in the front office…. anyway he got it into his head that he wanted to buy a pub… you see his cousin had bought a pub and was happy and doing well and anything the cousin can do he can obviously do better right? Nope. Pubs are not like offices, they are dirty and hard work. Even when we used to work in a hotel together I used to work in the pub, doing the dirty work, the heavy lifting, the stacking and unstacking, the washing up and all the rest of it. He worked on his little computer in the front office and occasionally helped me to change over a keg.

    So directly after leaving me, he and Shmoopie signed on the dotted line to create a partnership. She mortgaged her house to the absolute hilt and they bought a pub in their town. Sounds like cheater is going to drive off into the sunset living his little cheater dreams right? I thought so, I spent a good few months having to get to MEH about it all, but in the end I did.

    A year, almost to the day that he left me and only 7 months after he took ownership of the pub it burnt down. It was a charred wreck. 4 months later Cheater-pants was arrested for arson, endangering life (because there were people upstairs asleep when it burnt), fraud, conspiracy to commit fraud. He was one of 5, he had recruited his best friend to find some guys to beat him up and burn it down for the insurance money….

    Right up until literally the night before trial he was telling anyone who would listen that he is innocent. His poor mother was beside herself, she spent months fretting over him and paying his legal bills. The day of the trial we all hear that he has changed his plea to guilty. He’s going to spend the next few years in prison…. couldn’t have happened to a nicer person….

    • And they would have gotten away with it too if it hadn’t been for those meddling kids! Sorry, i just love all the completely idiotic ideas that ows and spouses come up with. Two heads are not better than one in their case.

    • Ha! In a lesser way, my ex did the thing with wife #3 (16 on their wedding day less than two years after wife #1, me, divorced him, and he was 30) that he had always wanted me to do and I always refused because it was clear it couldn’t succeed. Long story short, it fell into pieces, literally, taking the entire investment it took to build it downriver with it. I only know because he blogged it.

      Oh, but I was such a wet blanket for not “believing in him”. They always equate the lack of willingness to dive headfirst into the proverbial meat grinder with not believing in them personally, as though the only way to demonstrate true loyalty would be to volunteer for death. Marriage terrorism.

    • Alice, I think this is the best story I’ve ever read here. OMG, I feel all warm inside just thinking about it.

    • I love that Karma happened to him, but I am also relieved that nobody got hurt or killed or this wouldn’t be such a great story.

    • OMG, Alice, your arsonist cheater wins the sociopath award, or at least a spot on the podium!

    • Does shmoopie put money into his prison account for essentials like drugs, paying Bubba off not to become his “girlfriend?”

  • Raising quail, building a haybale house, smuggling cigarettes, etc…all pipe dreams on my dime. Thank god I never did any of it. But I came close! I get shivers when I think of all the money I almost lost. Happily I plunked it all down on real estate that doubled in value in a few years. He is still living off public assistance. With a new victim…er… girlfriend and their 6 month old baby. I feel so sorry for the child and the mother too who must be losing her mind living with a violent psychopath. Single life is the best!

    • Smuggling cigarettes..maybe he watched “Beverly Hills Cop” one too many times.

  • Not a lofty life plan but she went to hsor school when we first got together. I paid for books . Looked after my step daughter.
    She of course after a frw months working promptly switched jobs. Then back to it. Then switch jobs.
    When i decided to move my business to anothet smaller town she worried whst shed do. So i told her to follow her desier to be a barber and id set her up in my shop. Family business!
    Long story short. She found a place she could learn(franchise mall barber shop aka mens salon) but liked it mich more than the thought of moving. Few hiccups in the job in my shop was up on the air but the move was better for our family i thought
    Anyway. Stepping on toes in our new town i decided her happiness was paramount and the business in my business was a go. She was pushing me to get iy started borrowed money from her brother. Did all the work to get it done. I was so proud! She would tell people when they asked how it was working with your husband that ‘if i didnt want to see him everyday i wouldnt have married him”
    Her part of the business started in febuary 2016. I went away im may and she cheated. Stating when i finally found out she was unhappy. Not in love. BEEN FEELING THIS WAY FOR YEARS DESIRING TO LEAVE FOR A LONG TIME!
    needless yo say she moved immexiatky and back at her mens franchise salon life.
    I dont even know to this day why she’d either start a business with someone she clearly jad no desire to be with or at thst point gaslight when all evidence was to the contrary .all i know it cost me a lot

      • There are times when passion precludes accuracy, and telling stories of fuckwits is one of them. ????

      • That’s okay. It read it as, “she went to hor school,” and I thought that sounded about right….

  • Well, I mentioned the golf course plans the other day. He also had a wonderful idea to open a soccer shop (until I confronted him post DDay about his sham carreer in Merry Ole as a “professional striker underneath Ian Wright” his con with most people was that “professional striker” was his first gig until a knee injury), but really had no skills as a business owner let alone starter! He couldn’t even get himself out of bed most days to go to his real job! And it was a job in an artistic environment he could have moved up in if he wanted to. Ugh. Really a big part of all these fantasies was responding to my supportiveness….me-“well, that is a great idea! Let’s focus on getting out of debt/get you some business classes/write a business plan/put something down on paper”…followed by his disgust with me for even making the suggestions. His response was always, “I have no time because of the job I have now.”-followed by a lot of huffing and puffing and mean looks to me. I got wise to this process and stopped offering suggestions because it was just excuse to blame me for his current life. But I was always verbally supportive and inwardly terrified that he would just quit his job one day. I allowed him to be “the boss” of our family, and it was a huge mistake. I had never been a person comfortable with debt and within a very short time in our relationship he had me saddled with it.
    Actor, photographer, web business were other’s he knew he could do and would be great at doing but never took steps towards them. In the last couple years of the 10 year marriage he added jobs out of the country in his current field to the mix. Then the red flags really started smacking me in the face but I STILL spackled.
    I can say that I can actually laugh about it now. My life after 2 years and change from DDay, a divorce, a new home, and no debt is truly wonderful now. I wish that for all of us at CN!

  • We moved across the country together when we were engaged. (She had wanted to live in this city her entire life). She said we should “just get jobs as waiters or bartenders until we land on our feet.” As two late-20s professionals with graduate degrees (and she had an engineering license), this was patently ridiculous.

    I’d never waited tables or tended bar a day in my life. She’d barely bartended for a year, and she waited tables at a Greek diner as a teenager.

    I have total respect for the service industry, but it looks like hard work, and work that one can’t just simply jump into at 29 years old and assume you’ll make any sort of decent living, given you’re competing against people who’ve been doing it since they were we’re 15 years old. Who in the world would hire me to tend bar?

    And we were moving to one of the most affluent places in the world, where housing costs were forcing people with these exact jobs to to move away.

    I insisted that at least one of us have a full-time professional job in our chosen field. We lucked out and BOTH got such jobs.

    Crisis averted. But it was a red flag that I didn’t see: wife was BIG on fun and getting what she wanted, and LOW on responsibility and maintaining what she’d built (in this case, her career). How d’ya think those traits played out five years later?

    • Have a career!…No! Wait tables…wait no, career!…No, wait, quit the career!

      Have a boyfriend, then have a husband! Wait…no. Have a boyfriend again, and a husband. No, wait…wait husband! No husband, but…boyfriend!

      Have a baby!….NO wait, panic! No baby….wait, YES baby!

      It seems like stupid life “plans” might be a little too sophisticated for our exes. They mostly careen from one shiny object to the next.

  • In 2000 while I was in my last year of graduate studies doing massive clinical hours he up and moved to Florida to be a bartender and get a job while living off my brother.

    He was supposed to send money. I lost my home as he couldn’t pass drug tests. I lost my home and was forced to move there.

    He decided he wanted to set up a business renting beach chairs and umbrellas. He was making under a hundred dollars a week and quit every job because of his back problems.

    He was a bar back. He decided that he had supported me an now it was my turn to support him. He never made any money and I moved back north after he told me someone st work missed him.

  • During my divorce, I was clearing his paperwork off the counter and found a MLS sheet for a property on the other side of town (near MOW) and an earnest money check. So I called him to ask if he was moving. I got a song and a dance then, but two hours later when I was at work HE called ME begging me to call his lender and agree to cosign on the loan. See, he found this house “for us!” I laughed and hung up the phone.

  • The cookie cutter behaviour astonishes me – so right on the mark again. I always thought my cheater was uniquely crazy but this shows again that he was not. My cheater wanted me to leave with him – buy a sailing boat and go on a trip around the world. Stupid me saw no possibility at all with 2 kids on the brink of puberty and going to secondary school. Fast forward – and yes, he is with schmoopie on a boat on the other side of the world. She had the answer to the problem… she left her kid. Funny how this never entered my mind.

    • My ex donkey, whose only sea faring experience was the ferry secretly used the kids school fees for a skipper course. Schmoopies husband was an under water photographer, and they planned to steal his boat and sail to the Greek Islands.

      When I found out I snarkily asked if she was going to sell seashells to tourists – the look on his face said ‘yes’. But he would bartend and teach English! It didn’t happen, yachts are trackable and I doubt they could have got out of the harbour between them! Too bad, I’d still be laughing.

      • These bitches are always plotting to steal something. Kids, money, husbands,wives, sailboats,houses,ideas,personalities…

  • The day after I filed for divorce, he booked a trip to Mexico. The week before departure day he asked me to join him….he said he thought we’d work everything out and this trip would be “for us.” I stared at his two heads and thought riiight! GF must not have a passport. I’m a last minute fill in…and can pay 1/2. (Did he request time off from my work? Arrange week long care for child? Nope.) He left a day before the flight (found ticket later), sent one smug selfie from the plane, and returned two days after he flew back. Later I found (in plain sight) a cute picture of him and MOW in a restaurant with MY name. I outed them to her husband after that.

  • Entitled risk takers make decent entrepreneurs. They don’t take a business no as a final answer and that’s exciting, and not something I can do. The only downside is that they love to hear how awesome they are and how rich they’ll get, and how they’re the only one getting in on this deal and can get conned easily. When he surrounded himself with fake ass kissers things weren’t great “hollowbunny is such a judgy bitch!” financially, which was where the married coworker entered, on cue, mouth and legs open. It was easier to find someone to tell him he was awesome than to actually have to do the hard work to be awesome. Mommy said so. As easy as walking out the front door. He didn’t view ow at 50 with 4 kids, crap education and a let’s say dynamic past, relationship-wise, as someone to take along on his rocket-like rise to riches, but not NOT telling her made her an enthusiastic blow job giving pencil pushing fucked-herself-to-the-middle dirty secret. Plus she was married, so discreet. He thought. He was also dead broke, but this wasn’t the time for truth telling where a swallower was concerned. Lies for everyone! You get a lie! You get a lie! The people he brought around who I didn’t trust, weren’t trustworthy – obvs I have a blind spot, a big one. When I was a partner in decision making both on paper and for realz “I trust this one, he’s not making empty promises” things went really well. Really really well. Which was where it all was when I found out about her, well after the fact and with her long gone and his guilt having put everything in my name. So the ow, now on to other penises, was sucking the wrong teat and had to get multiple jobs to support her family since her husband is a teacher. I would feel bad for him but he had already been her om (she was married to his fucking brother) and he knew about the affair and didn’t tell me, over a year before. The lifestyle she thought I was leading and sucked so hard to get is the one I’m leading now. Bwahahaha. Amazing what can be accomplished when you’re not busy wiping your mouth and icing your knees. Is that too harsh?

  • I really have to idea as to Cold Slab O’Meat’s current level of Life Satisfaction, we don’t talk. He could be blissfully happy in his shitty apartment by the freeway and having ended up in a family of convenience WITH the Sluterus and Adultery Baby after fighting with her over custody and CS for three years. While living with a third woman and Insta Family.

    They could have finally inherited money from his father, for whom this fifty year old man’s affection was limited to Waiting for You to Die so I can Inherit Money. He wanted this.

    They could be awash in friends and invites. From people who don’t know how their child was conceived. But probably not. The man never left the house to meet friends in the entire time I knew him. Near the end he left the house to fuck Schmoopie. According to 3rd Chick, he did the same with her. He only had her friends by association.

    They could be traveling the word. Nope. Probably not. Because of paying Child Support he never had money according to 3rd Chick and it was a source of tension.

    He could have promotions and a great new career. Maybe. Going to all those internal interviews with untucked wrinkled button ups from WalMart and badmouthing his supervisors constantly and never completing the goals from his evaluations year to year probably impressed dozens! As well as conducting a workplace affair that resulted in a pregnancy and divorce.

    But I doubt it.

    He could have a better relationship with his older daughter. But since his workplace capers caused him to lose custody and begin paying CS to his other ex wife, and she hates the Sluterus, I doubt it.

    One of the best things about No Contact is I don’t really know. I do get told stuff occasionally and at one point I had questions of my own. I feel like I got enough answers to establish I Matter Only to Me. He’s got a Bad Life Choice Pattern going on and I was just one float in the Interchangeable Lego Lady Parade.

    • “Waiting for [Parents] to Die so I can Inherit Money” was my X’s retirement plan for both of us (so he said/lied), even when my business was in the black and every year I wanted to add to an IRA.

      So I never saved for retirement, and when his parents died and left him millions, he and his sister secretly created a trust so I couldn’t benefit from it.

      • I am so sorry. Cold Slab has a pension from the bank, but after he burned through 7k in our money he couldn’t access any of mine. And his dad’s home is the main asset. He used to quote how much that was, at least 349k quid! All.the.time. But he would be sharing that with several siblings.And used to speculate with his brother how they could cut their sister out.

        His biggest agitas was when his widowed dad got a girlfriend and he was afraid his dad would leave her the house. Sight and meet unseen in the states, he declared her a ‘Specky (spectacled, wearing glasses) Old Bag and refused to say hello on the phone.

        This I remind you was a 50 year old man angry that his aged dad wouldn’t die alone. Jesus they have no bottom, do they? It sucks when they win.

        • Yup. I’ve come to realize my dignity and self worth are more important than financial security. But how much easier it would be to not have that stress.

    • “The man never left the house to meet friends in the entire time I knew him.”
      Mine too, must be a red flag.

  • Thankfully I never invested in a business with him but I commuted several hours a day (2 hrs each way) for years to be the main bread winner so he could pursue his dream job and I had given up my dream job by then too cos we needed a decent well paying job to get a mortgage.

    After being blindsided by D Day he cited that he wanted to move away / change jobs he HATED his job – the was no OW!!!!!!!!

    That was 2011 – he’s still in the same job – living closer to his parents ( that he hated and visited 2 times a year) and our visa approval for emigrating to another country came through 6 mths after he left ( yeah he would have been happy abroad in Canada ) he said “ we would have probably never gone anyway”

    Yes, he was correct, I had left for another country halfway around the world by then.

    He was a dreamer – I have endless stories of his failed career launches or business ideas – when I meet couples and I can tell they are married to a “ dreamer” I wish I could tell them to run for the hills – there’s loads of them out there – including my poor sister.

  • The cheater always had big fantasies about real estate. Places that were on 20+ acres or more, usually on some rural mountain road. And the conversation would go.
    Him – looks it’s so cheap and it has a view.
    Me- But it doesn’t have a useable kitchen, furnace, bathroom…
    Him- But just look at the view
    Me – It’s at least an hour the grocery store, etc.
    Him – We’ll be able to see the stars at night. We can have more than one dog.
    And it would go on.. I think you get the idea. It never mattered that I would be the one isolated in these places, alone all day at home trying to cope with everything while he went to work. There was always this grand fantasy.

    One of my favorites was his plan to sell all his stuff keeping only the essentials that would fit in a grocery cart and live on the beach in Florida. But he soon realized he wouldn’t have anyone to cook meals or do his laundry and at some point he may even have to get a job again.

    Those damn practicalities of life get in the way every time. ????

    • Mine did this too so when he left I thought for sure he was destined for the wide open acreage of rural life.

      Nope he moved just a few streets over so he can continue to do drive bys.
      Damn, he couldn’t even get moving out right.

    • Also, if a person can get you isolated, it gives that person an advantage. It can be an orange flag if a person constantly pushes for isolation that you clearly don’t want.

  • Cheater ex was always outraged that he didn’t make it as an actor, that was his dream. He still thinks it might happen (he is 57, and fully employed doing other stuff, but gets involved with a few no-budget projects). He thinks he is pretty hot, and doesn’t need to improve his appeal for his any-moment acting career by dying the grey out of his hair or whitening his yellowing teeth (why should he? he is perfect right?) but he is outraged if an old local-town-theatre colleague doesn’t seek him out to offer him a role. Life fantasy + outrage, perfect narc salad. Funny thing is he makes a great living as a corporate consultant, but you know, never satisfied…..

    I guess we now know that acting/film is a profession where narcissists hang out.

  • Plan 1 : singer song writer and producer. He claims that I drove him to it! One of his songs was about a girl with a heavy tongue who was in love with him.

    Plan 2: a line of sauces. He wanted someone to develop the recipe for him and he’d slap a label on. He asked prior to leaving if I wanted to be his lawyer for the venture. I replied that a c- class lawyer wouldn’t do for him . ( He had said I’d make a c-class lawyer) he replied my loss. I turned and conserved the air in my lungs. It is a sin to argue with fools.

    Plann3: be awesome and rich without the children and I.

    None of those projects have come too much.

    • A girl with a heavy tongue?

      Gosh, who can’t relate to that?
      Let me get my lighter, it’s like Freebird all over again here.

      • OMG, AOoK, that made me laugh every til I coughed!!!
        ????????????????????????????

    • 4) Borrowed US 10 000 from my retired father to ‘complete house’ without telling me. Told me he had borrowed US 5000. Never completed house.

  • My ex wasn’t interested in opening a business.. too lazy. Mentioned to me when he retires wants to move to a warm climate & ride his motorcycle 7 days a week.

    Vomit ????

    • Stbxh thought getting a motor home and living in mh parks all around the country was the way to go.

      No thanks.

      • Yes. Mr. Clean wanted the RV too. Made no sense. We fought all the time, when I would try to defend myself from his narc abuse, (not possible). Finally, I just avoided him as much a I could. I sure. didn’t want to be trapped. in a small. metal box with him!

      • Soldiering On

        That’s so funny!! ????????????

        Wishful thinking on my part ????
        (Terrible I know..,but?)

        • I know, I know; but it’s only thoughts, right? We can forgive ourselves for our thoughts if we don’t tamper with the brakes or something. Right???

  • Narkles the Clown still harbors dreams of giving seminars to others on how to do what he does as a living. As a matter of fact I was told upon confrontation that I had it all wrong, that the Flying Whore was helping him with this. She was going to manage the bookings and the set up while he gave the seminars. She even set one up at her place of business where they paid for his travel and a nominal fee. Her email to the employees gushed about how this was an exciting opportunity as Narkles the Clown is renowned and respected in his field and usually charges $600 a person for these seminars. I’m sure the look on my face when I read that was priceless, had anyone been there to see it.

    In the story he told me he was going to charge $1000 a person and the hotels would give him a cut of the bookings related to his seminars. That was nearly three years ago. As far as I know the seminars section of his website still says “coming soon”

  • I told my golf course plans the other day…opening a soccer store, becoming an actor and more specifically a “heavy” in mob movies (this one brings me many chuckles now-some guy from the cast of the sopranos told him he would be a great “heavy” so he should be, right?!), a photographer, an online business…I’m sure there are more…the 3 to 6 month cycle was this…complain about his horrible life (strangely his horrible job did not begin at his long time job until after we were married-before that everything was SO wonderful and he was always just a “happy guy”), come up with a fantasy, be it a dream job that also makes him rich, or a dream trip that will shine up the image that he is rich and all will be wonderful. I learned to not try to help give him direction because he would get very angry at my “why don’t you write a business plan” suggestions. I knew X was unbalanced pretty early on but was completely devoted to him and his ideas. I thought if I could give him focus he would succeed. He is a classic cluster b and looking back, I do have empathy for that bottomless pit…but never again at the expense of mine or my daughter’s life or happiness.
    If you are a newbie, please know it is possible to get a life without your albatross! I am proof. I have gone from being devoted to a pathological lying, mentally ill, substance abusing, cheating bully who I allowed to put me in debt and make my life as chaotic as his mind to a strong divorced mom with no debt, a new home and a lot of happiness and complete calm. ????????

  • Mine wanted to quit his job as the main breadwinner several times. Two of his ‘better’ ideas:

    He wanted to make ‘horse videos’. Yep. Videos of horses. Specifically race horses. He would take pictures and video of horses and create a montage and sell them to the owners of said horses. He did a few (with people as a subject – I guess the horses weren’t interested) but soon realized that anyone can do this on a smart phone. His family were very encouraging and were extremely miffed when I wouldn’t support it.

    (Insert dozens of get rich quick schemes here)

    He wanted to make hamburgers. Open a little shop and sell them. BUT there would only be hamburgers and only with the toppings he liked. So no pickles. And nothing else. Just hamburgers. He would ‘practice’ by making hamburgers for myself and my daughter EVERY Friday night. For years. Eventually, I decided to invite friends and family around to enjoy these hamburgers. That was all fine except he could only make one at a time. Many times there were 15+ people sitting in my house waiting, waiting, waiting for the hamburger that HE wanted them to eat. He would actually cook one hamburger at a time. No production line. Then he would get really shitty that he spent his whole night in the kitchen- and don’t get me started on what would happen if you deviated from his ‘regular’ burger. Ugh. This went on for years, during a time when food trucks and hamburgers exploded in our country.

    I’m glad his current girlfriend has to eat his bloody ridiculous hamburgers every fucking week and not me.

    • Hahahaha!!! Good riddance to burger man!

      Schemes that thank God I nixed (so perhaps don’t qualify for today’s topic, but they’re kind of entertaining):
      1.) Take an expensive course to become a professional chef and “own his own restaurant chain” (he took the course, but still burns toast).
      2.) Start a pet crematorium business — in our garage (eeek!).
      3.) Fence in our back yard and put a pet baby white rhino in it (you can’t make this shit up).
      4.) Get a side job as the guy that administers lethal injections at the local penitentiary (I thought he was just saying this just to shock me and wasn’t serious, but now that I know his criminal streak, I’m not sure. Anyway I told him then, 10 yrs ago, that I’d leave him pronto if he even thought about doing that).
      5.) Become a rich addiction psychotherapist (after going through alcohol rehab himself and discovering there was money in it) — AND HE DID THAT ONE. Thank goodness he settled on that, though, and not number 4. (Though since consenting hooker OW is one of his patients, I’m really not sure he’s doing less damage…)

    • ???????????? oh my! One….burger …at..a..time.
      Lord ha mercy!
      Thanks for the laugh

  • Expat STBXH was a military officer. 6 months after – as I learned 2 years later – he had taken up with OW, he made the unilateral decision to retire 2 years before he reached 30 years of service, with no job lined up. (I have never seen anyone do this.). He was determined to pursue a plan to go work in the United Arab Emirates. While unemployed, he spent $10K we did not have to travel to China to see his adult daughter – as a cover to stopover in the UK to visit OW. After 6 months of “retirement,” he finally took a normal job with a government contractor outside the DC area, where we lived and I worked. We went to the Xmas party, he introduced me to his new boss. However, he decided that his experience was too valuable for this job – they had a Colonel Covert Narc working in a cubicle! So he unilaterally quit after 6 weeks. And did not tell anyone until he had the family on a trip to Orlando. Halfway through the huge line for the then-new Harry Potter ride, he announced that he had just gotten a job offer and was moving to the UAE. He claimed he had already signed a contract, though I learned later that he quit, left and moved to the Middle East before signing one. And there he sits to this day, living in a villa with 4 other men much younger than he is. He has also stopped paying US taxes, so the IRS has placed a lien on his military pension for $84K. Winning!

    • Mine retired from the military in the DC area and annouced to me that he had to move to SF because “there are no jobs here!” This was 2005 and the post 9-11 build up was still in full swing and he could have had a job up and down the road, but he would have been a Major in a cubicle, so he moved to SF …drove west in a new SUV I named the “Scrotumobile” (because it was so manly).

  • When I met my husband he was a former rock star turned youth minister. Then he became a Marine. Then he became an MMA fighter. Then he decided to be a graphic designer. Then he tried to start a band. Then he started drawing animation. Then he started writing a book. Then he got back into the church. Then he decided he was going to get back into music. Then he talked about going to culinary school and becoming a chef. Now my husband (because technically we’re still married because God hates me and our divorce will never, ever be finalized) is trying to design electric skateboards for a living because last year he decided he would take up electric skateboarding at the age of 36-years-old. He’s also progressed to the status of MMA coach and MMA logo t-shirt designer. All of this over the course of ten years and I’m probably leaving some stuff out. I think he tried (and failed) to create a couple of apps along the way. He might also consider himself a professional cyclist now because he recently brought a bike and probably the matching outfit.

  • Argh! So many chaotic life plans but, I’ll limit my experiences.
    Firstly ex narc left a lucrative partnership (partner had enough of crazy bs) in realestate agency. Decides to take a gap year rather than put settlement from partner into mortgage & sit around ‘thinking’ about his life plan?!? I am made to feel guilty & told it’s best I go out & work. He then buys a another house without consulting me & forged my name on docs!!!! Eventually leaves ( needs space) then hoovers me back with sob story. Tells me he wants to open his own realestate business which WE do. I bring in most of the listings (he is really jealous that I can do this) & then runs off with receptionist just as business is doing well! Leaves like we never existed & begins new life, wants half of everything! I lawyer up, get 70% but, am forced to sell the house. 2 children & homeless, car leased & sold etc….he’s now full blown alcoholic, lives in rundown old house & installs cabling or something. Ap lives with her mother because, she’s agrophobic & he made sure she won’t be able to move in with him since he got an inheritance (small but, still won’t share it)…..that’s just a snippet, he’s done more! Stupid shitty cheater!!!

  • He bought used stuff and fixed it up and resold it. There was a profit margin. He bought in cash (our money) and was paid in cash. He then took the money for himself and I never saw a penny.
    So if this is a side business to supplement our income why does the money never get deposited? He’d say DID YOUR SKILLS make this possible? No. So it’s not your money. His scheme was to make money out of our house while keeping me on a tight budget. And this went on for the whole marriage. He said if i want spending money then I can sell my stupid wedding dress. Its sad seeing thousands in cash being put in his pocket while I’m making dinner knowing I’m not even allowed to get my hair done.

  • He was going to climb all the mountain peaks in the world. But oops hip replacement happened and now on crutches after tearing his Achilles. So might be awhile for all that climbing :).

    • For me it wasn’t mountains. He wanted to do a different marathon every month. The plan was for me to travel around with him acting as support crew.

      He did go on a pilgrimage to the Camino in Spain to find himself.

      • Holy hell, you’re describing my friend’s surgeon husband. He is constantly doing marathons all over the country (1 in every state is hus narky goal) while his wife appliance does all of the adulting, including raising their 3 small kids and working outside the home.

  • Mine had plans to open a yoga shop and be a personal trainer. I pointed out that she would need start-up money to lease and improve the space, pay employees, buy equipment, etc. That and the fact that the only experience she had in either area was just that she had been going to the gym for a few months. I’m not sure that certifies you to train others or run a yoga studio. But I didn’t tell her she couldn’t do it, just that she’d need to start saving money and make a plan. But that takes work and time, and was not the instant gratification she was looking for. So I was being an a-hole, I guess.

    Pointing out reality can be like that.

    • Yep. I offered financial divorce, as in, if you are willing to get legally divorced so our finances are totally separate, then you can do whatever you want business-wise and I can totally support it without intervening. If you want to start a business while we are legally married, I need to participate in the decision making because it impacts my life and retirement. Apparently that’s a shocking thing to say. I’m still not sure why. Control, I guess.

  • My cheater wanted to buy a property or two in Poland to use as rental property/vacation homes. Mind you neither one of us had ever been to Poland, nor did we have the expendable money to purchase a second home overseas (let alone in the U.S.). But that was his big plan on how to get rich.

    • I can’t believe you wrote Poland! I’m of Polish ancestry and he thought we could get citizenship. Neither of speak the language. Not to disparage Poland but all of my family left Poland because for them it was awful. So of course we should go back.

  • Ex had some strange ideas.
    1. Because I stayed home/worked part-time/completed a masters degree for the first years of our relationship, he thought he should get to “just stay home” during the next years. Umm…I only pulled back on work during that time because I ALSO birthed three babies in those five years, idiot.

    2. He always had a vision that he would sell our business and just “cut grass at a golf course”. He viewed this as the ultimate no-pressure fun job. Hmm… pretty sure the minimum wage and 3 am wake-up calls would have squashed that dream. Did I mention that I nearly always cut the lawn at our house?

    Epilogue: Though he was broke from the divorce, he and Schmoopie bought land and are developing an acreage. So now he can cut lots of grass AND work for the rest of his life to pay for it all.

  • This is my ex to a T. Even before discovering the cheating, I remember constantly having to explain to my family and friends that “yes, he has another new job…his last job didn’t work out because blah blah”. It got embarrassing pretty quickly. My ex would cycle through jobs faster than packages of toilet paper. I think one year, doing our taxes, I collected twelve W2s. Waiter, Life Insurance Agent (he studied and passed the test but never took a job), Real Estate classes, car dealership after car dealership, auto mechanic school, door to door salesman. Really. He also enrolled in community college twice and dropped out twice while we were married, obviously never intending to pay the school loans. It was always the boss’s fault, or the teacher’s fault, or they didn’t pay him enough, or some other BS reason, but obviously never his fault. 2+ years post divorce and he’s still at it. I had to garnish his wages after he failed to pay child support on his own (shocker!), and every month or two I have to report yet another new place of employment to the state. Sometimes I feel bad for him – like why is he so broken that he can’t address and fix this problem? But whenever I feel that way I come to this site and get the sense knocked back into me.

  • Funny that this is the topic of the day.

    My cheater XH emailed me a couple of weeks ago to discuss adding DD to my insurance through work & that he’d reimburse me per court order. When I asked him why he just responded that he was changing jobs & wouldn’t have benefits. After talking to my attorney, I told X that was fine.

    A couple of days later, X calls DD and informs her that he was leaving sometime in April for Alaska. He will be gone for approximately 7 months. He will be in a fairly remote area, ya know limited cell phone/internet service & that they will probably have to schedule times for them to talk to one another. Apparently, he thinks that gold mining is his calling.

    I have a feeling that this is going to affect child support, benefit reimbursement (see above), and the vehicle payment that is drafted out of his account. He was awarded the debt for that vehicle (this was a graduation gift to DS) in the divorce, but after talking to my banker about other matters, I found out that since we took out the loan while married & I signed the loan papers along with him, if he doesn’t have the funds in his account to make the payment, they will be calling me. YEAH!!

    He has yet to tell me what his plans are. He probably knows that I’d ask him, “WTF, are you nuts??”

    One other thing…Alaska?? He HATES cold weather…

    • I’ve got another angle on the bank loan. The alcoholic borrowed money from a major credit union where we had a small joint savings account (the membership account). I financed my car through that credit union, in another account with my name only. In that separate account I kept a few hundred dollars, enough cash for the next car payment plus enough to not pay monthly service charges.

      That is, until he defaulted on his loan. It was a loan I hadn’t signed for, and couldn’t get them to give me a status report on. But the loan was tied to that joint account. So when it went past due, the credit union wiped out MY individual account to make his payment.

      Apparently there is a rule called “bankers right of offset.” Since my I was listed as listed as a joint holder on the first account, they were allowed to take any money I had there in any account to cover the delinquency. But they STILL couldn’t give me a report on the loan status. Because I hadn’t signed his loan papers.

      I got that shit fixed quick. Took my name off of all joint accounts. Transferred everything that was really mine to a different credit union and told him to stay the hell out. It’s too bad, because the major credit union had some services I really needed, and the new credit union was a one-location shop offering limited services and run by idiots.

      The worst part is that this wasn’t the first time he did this to me. About a year before he poisoned our banking relationship the same way with the local bank where we’d had our primary joint accounts for over 10 years.

      The hyena may move to a new den, but he doesn’t change his spots. Dear Lord, why did I put up with him do so long?

  • Mine had this fantasy about his failing car business recovering. That’s why he asked me to remarry him after he cheated. I fully engaged in the hopium poison and proceeded to pick me dance until he had spent all of our retirement savings “investing “ in his business( I have it all in stock!! Nope no he didn’t). Now I get to face my golden years without my retirement fund and have no pension. It is my greatest regret after staying when he rejected our son as an infant.

    Don’t be me please.

      • Chumpy me felt really bad because I really am an intelligent hardworking businesswoman ( my own business not the shit show he was running). But I now realize I was suffering from cognitive dissonance, was abused and gaslighted and didn’t know down from up. Thank you

        • Oh and Awakening Dreamer karma does happen when we least expect it. I managed to keep our home( funny how banks want him to actually be employed to give a mortgage). I got the mortgage kept the house in the settlement and sold it for $250k more than he was paid out on. I have a nice house I fixed up for myself now. I pay my own way without a fuckwit spending my money on booze cigarettes and sluts. I will be ok in the end even though I have to keep working until I decide to sell my house. ????????????????????????

          • Yep, got that too. Fuckwit was forever down at the bar buying rounds (one time that I know of it was rounds of champagne). Plus the cigarettes (I never smoked) for both him and the slag. I was so, so relieved to get the mortgage in my name and buy him out so I could keep my kids in the only home they had ever known. I earned about 500 dollars a month more than him (but I also paid the kids medical insurance/bills too) but I have so much more money now that he is out of my life with his never ending spending. Life is good – not so sure about him even though he is now on a damn good pension. I hear latest Schmoopie “decided to go back to work” – think it’s more like they needed the money. Damn, they can’t make it on 8000 dollars a month!

  • Wait, what??? I didn’t realize this was an actual thing. My Loser STBXH used to talk plans like this all the time, but achieve nothing. It took me a LONG time to see that he was all talk. A lot of BS ideas were talked about before D-Day, however, after D-Day, it went like this:

    1. He was going to open a weed farm. He could do this on our 2 acres of land (the same land he needed to sell for option 2), have 2 areas with crops, 2 harvests per area per year, and make $120k per year. All this as our small kids grew up on the land at the same time. He is a pot head without weed production experience, however, is an expert on weed consumption, and its this knowledge that would make him hugely successful.

    2. He was going to do day trading. This made me cringe as he was going to invest up to $250k from the sale of the house and he would have lost it within a week as there’s just no way he’d have invested wisely. He was too lazy to actually read and educate himself. I was going to have the kids 100% of the time, and he wasn’t going to contribute financially to us in any way, as he had to focus on establishing himself.

    3. Mud balls. This one cracked me up after my original bafflement subsided. It’s like Volleyball, but played on mud. He was going to go to the nicest park in town, have trucks bring in mud to cover the ground, proceed to have every one pay $5 to participate in this most excellent novel tournament (he knew nothing about Volleyball), and he would then have people take all the mud away. He was going to make $5k per tournament, and travel across the US making good money from each event. He had planned it so he would be set up as a charity, but had researched that only a minimum amount had to go to the actual cause, and he could pocket the rest. He even had someone design a logo and was beyond proud of himself for beginning to execute this very smart, money making plan.

    4. He was going to grow his gym, and franchise it out. This BS I had heard for 9 years, and I had believed in him for maybe 7 of those years, even invested some money and a copious amount of time and brain sells. He had never earned enough to support the family, always worked part time hours, and spent his time complaining how no one did their jobs properly, but I was his biggest reason for failure and lack of growth & income, that I complained when he would be gone all day long (gym, followed by drinking sessions, and then sneaking off to be with his gf), but if it wasn’t for me, he’d be able to be an owner-operated facility, he wouldn’t have staff to pay, and he would be earning $10k per month. When I pointed out that he hadn’t ever supported us financially, he’d tell me that he is the largest gym of it’s kind on the East Coast and that he gets offers to be bought out frequently, so I should just shut the fuck up as I was too dumb and ignorant to get it.

    I thought it was only me, having to listen to these moronic ideas, so moronic that I wouldn’t share them with friends until much later, as they would think I was as idiotic as him. It was his delivery, said with such seriousness, importance and wisdom that made me feel as though I was an unspporting bitch for questioning his genius.

    Thank you for your post Chump Lady, thank you so very much for making me laugh and realise that it wasn’t only me wondering WTF was going on, and questioning my own sanity.

    • Mud ball. You poor thing how could you ever question the *pure genius* that is mud ball. My favorite part is that he would just have the mud brought in.

  • My ex wanted to buy a second home, a lake house. We got a realtor and looked at houses. He then suggested that I could live there full time and he could visit me on the weekends. WAIT, WHAT??? I said no way that would be stupid.

    Fast forward 4 months where I find emails to the OW, and the affair had been going on for 2 years. So, maybe not so stupid for him.

  • I had a cheater one time try to snow me into beleiving she was being abused but her husband whom she had just walked out on. She was flailing about verbally about his abuse in trying to get her to be domestic – she didn’t work a job at all, and it sounded like he just wanted her to do normal things during the like fill a dishwasher or change some sheets while he supported them both. You know – do her part. She was raving that she was in her nature an entrepreneur with big dreams and could not handle his sexism and abuse. This was among other reasons she was leaving him – the whole thing was an narrative control move and I could see it exactly for what it was. As a chump myself, it hit all my crazy buttons too. I chewed her out, loudly, right there in Panera and told her I knew exactly what she was doing. It was dramatic and loud and I know it scared both of us but whatever. She disappeared with her shmoopie (best friends husband too).

  • No career fantasies for my cheater.He was at the top of his game professionally but Shmoopie ( now ex) lived in a big mansion on the outskirts of our city,set in several acres of land.I heard he bought a tractor and a couple of Black Angus cattle to fulfill his farmer fantasy.These had to be sold when he fucked her over for a much younger model.Schmoopie pocketed the money.
    Then Schmoopie #2 dumped him for…….surprise,surprise…..cheating.
    Now he’s alone and waiting for the next love of his life to appear.

  • Multi-level marketing how the alcoholic planned to get rich. He planned to recruit a few hot sellers, then he’d stay home in bed and the money would flood the house.

    He was the classic gullible loser these companies look for – ready to spend spend spend (you gotta spend money to make money!) and paying no attention to the fine print. So he crashed and burned every time.

    Then the alcoholic decided he was going to be a movie producer. He paired up with a high school dropout who had the writing skills of a middle schooler; this joker was his script writer, even though he couldn’t write a coherent paragraph. He actually few to New York and Dallas with the crap this guy wrote so that he could sell it to big production companies looking for break-through new talent. Bought himself a new suit and everything for the trips.

    There are some small things I’m thankful for. His failure to sell that trash is one of them.

    • I’m still deeply troubled about the movies he thought he was going to make. I read the grammatically incoherent script summaries and parts of a script, and got nauseous. Real bottom-feeding stuff. Psychotic killers, blood and gore. Sex too, of course. He thought he really get rich with this scheme. He was so impressed with himself. He matched the incoherent scripts with totally incoherent film budgets he drew up in Excel, using unrealistic numbers he pulled out of his ass. He hired an artist to do disturbing cover art and movie posters, as if the script summaries weren’t enough. And he bought and watched similar disturbing amateur DVD movies he bought from the internet.

      Oh he’d make some nicer stuff too, whatever he could get anyone to fund, but he was really hung up on the psycho stuff.

      If you read up top you saw where I posted that he had a Secret Investor who’d given him some $10,000 in seed money to do this. The Secret Investor turned out to be me. He really did steal and sell the jewelry I inherited from my grandmother.

      And he actively tried to market this garbage. He promoted himself on IMDB. He headed off to New York with his new suit, his sheaf of incoherent paperwork, and my money… but absolutely none of my support. He connected with a B-movie actor who (he claims) agreed to play a lead character if he ever found a producer willing to support him. Fortunately that never worked.

      I asked him just where he thought he was going to sell that stuff. He said he’d release these movies direct to DVD and sell them in Europe and Asia, which he insisted had a big market for this shit.

      Then I asked him why? Why sicko slasher films? Why psychotic murderers? He looked at me, his eyes narrowed, and they seemed to glow a bit. He snarled at me: “Because there’s money in it!” Totally disturbing.

      It took me a while to find an apartment I could afford. But when I did I was gone.

      Fortunately he blew through the money he got from his theft. His movie making efforts went nowhere. He never got his hands on another pot of gold. But to this day his LinkedIn and Facebook pages still list him as a filmmaker, with web-links to that really sick cover art.

      And he never understood why I rejected his every attempt to be my Facebook friend.

  • When our son was born, ex was living in another state. I had moved back to my hometown, bought a house, and started a well-paid new job knowing that our son was on the way. Ex wanted us to be together as a family and was looking for jobs in my hometown, but he never applied for any of them because they just didn’t measure up. He was like Goldilocks: this job is too boring, this job is too urban, and on and on. I was making enough to support us both and my family was there to help, and so I told him that he could be a stay at home dad, change careers if he wanted, try something new, spend his days taking our son fishing, whatever he wanted. Nope, he was so committed to his career that he couldn’t possibly leave his very specific job, even for something in a similar line of work. His identity and personal fulfillment were so tied up with this job that he just couldn’t entertain being with our infant and me at the expense of leaving his career.

    Fast forward two years and I’m an utterly exhausted mostly single mom of a toddler with a full time job and no help at home. I finally give in and decide to move to where he is (where neither of us have family) so that we can be a family and he can keep his beloved job. Within weeks of having gotten married, quit my job, sold my home, and moved several states away to be a stay at home mom in a tiny apartment in support of his career, ex decides that this job isn’t his calling and he wants to be a DJ instead. Trying to be supportive yet realistic while quelling internal panic, I reminded him that I now had zero income and asked him why he didn’t propose this previously when the opportunity was there and he could have actually done it. He shrugged and continued prattling on about how much he always wanted to DJ. I asked how we’d pay the rent and buy food and diapers, and he started to get mad that I wasn’t being supportive. I told him I was supportive if that’s what he really wanted, but that he’d have to wait until I could get another job so we’d have pesky things like health insurance, and retirement contributions, and food. Instead of engaging in actual strategizing and planning, he instead gave me the shark-eye stare and mused that some days when he was driving home from work, he thought about just continuing to drive past the exit to our apartment and never coming back. He again started getting pissed off when I told him how scary that was to me with a toddler and three pets and no job, and being several states away from any friends or family. He glowered at me. I suggested that he go fishing to clear his mind and think about a plan for changing careers to be a DJ if that’s what he needed to still come home at night. He left for several hours and, I now know, probably went to fuck the now-divorced OW and complain about how selfish and unsupportive I was.

    Post Script: It’s now 4 years later, and he’s still in his same job and *not* a DJ. He and OW have a toddler of their own now, and she recently quit her job to be a stay at home mom and pursue stupid life plans of her own. I’m sure she’ll be very supportive of him when he’s ready to just keep driving at the end of the day, because who needs diapers and insurance, really?

  • I haven’t read all the comments yet, but a very common theme seems to be quitting jobs because “they didn’t appreciate me”!

    Mine was no different; I lived 40 years with this “blue sky” attitude. He quit job after job because “they wouldn’t listen to me!”, “They don’t know what they’re doing!”, “They don’t appreciate me!”, with no regard to supporting his family or keeping up with our bills.

    We’d refinanced the house a couple of times to pay off credit cards, then a second mortgage was necessary, so the payments kept going up. His preferred industry got creamed in the recession and went to no income other than mine, not enough to cover everything, but he would not look for salaried work (he was 100% commission) until there were no jobs available . We fell behind in the mortgage, actually had the order to auction our home delivered before a last-second restructuring was approved by the bank. We finally had to declare bankruptcy to clear the $125k in credit card debt as they were threatening to sue us. Even bankruptcy was a bone of contention: I wanted to restructure and pay off as much as we could, he wanted chapter 7 and walk away. I firmly believe that if I had agreed to that, part of the “walking away” would have included him away from me and the family, 10 years before he did just that.

    I was blamed for the recession taking value off the house as he’d wanted to sell a few years earlier and move into his father’s old home 100 miles away, simply because of the garages. We have two kids (DS and DD) who were just starting high school; they’d have been uprooted to a house that had only 2 bedrooms, far away from friends and activities. I prevailed, but he resented us for that. When he left, guess where he and Schmoopie bought a house? Yup, same 100 mile away place with big garage.

    Nearly 40 of insecurity that I was expected to support unquestionably. This place is great! Till he hated it. Once get rich quick scheme after another that he’d never put the work into as he was the idea man and the work was for others. One grandiose dream after another, promise after promises of big things “in the pipeline.” Any hobby I picked up he tried to monetize by telling me to make more and sell them! 40 years of not knowing if there’d be a paycheck this week, or how much. 40 years of his not giving a damn about making the bills, as that was my problem to figure out – he was not to be questioned.

    I’m sure he’s selling Schmoopie the same bill of goods. Me, I have a stable income. I can pay my bills. I am free of his sunny mindfuck. I am so much more secure and stable and proud to support myself. And calmer.

  • I have a financially successful cheater. Narks actually often kick butt at business. Lack of conscience and empathy have their uses in the cut-throat world of finance, as do empty charm, and chameleon-like ability to become whatever the audience of the moment most wants and needs.

    He failed to get promoted to the position he coveted at first big job, likely because the good family man who held that position was a smart guy who had a good read on him, and had no intention of passing it on to him upon retirement. Then, he moved to the second big job, bringing along, I now know, two of his female underlings, both of whom he had long affairs with, seemingly simultaneously, and definitely during my pregnancies. He “resigned” from that position after some years, due to many credible allegations of sexual harassment. Then he spent close to a year hunting down the next thing. Was a horrid, horrid year, with him angry and up in my day-to-day world endlessly. Accepted a new position that would have had us moving far away, but then at the last minute withdrew from that and formed a partnership with colleagues. I worked hard for that company, and it was successful, though one side-business that cheater led utterly failed and ended in bankruptcy. Somewhere in there, he started the current affair. And he began raging at everyone, which ultimately spelled the end of that partnership. Then, we formed our own company, taking along several employees, including–surprise, surprise!–the current schmoops. Did pretty well financially, but treated just a few too many people like shit, so fired by one big client, and sued by another. Transcripts of depositions in that case make interesting reading. The word “arrogant” pops up a lot in relationship to him. Along the way, all employees except the schmoops get dismissed. But a new client hours away in another state. They go there frequently, hire a few independent contractors, fire one of those for having a little too good of a read on things, buy a house together, and get the faux marriage going in that small town. Financial bonanza, parlayed into really good high-powered, high-paying gig of the sort he was always after.

    Piles of dead and wounded along the way: biz partners, assorted OW and their kids and families, employees, underlings, wife, kids.

    But he got where he wanted to get.

    His current plan: ditch the wife as cheaply as possible, enjoy all the spoils with the young schmoops, look like the poor, poor guy who just had to get away from the horrid wife who never supported him and is (or so he apparently endlessly hints to all) darkly evil in some way beyond words.

    Yuppers.

    Oh, and in there were countless lies, a DUI, a year (no clue how he hid this) of driving on a suspended license (open alcohol), plus assorted strippers, prostitutes, and lord only knows what all else.

    Quite a guy. Always survives. You know, like a cockroach.

    Which I think will be my new nickname for him.

    • Oh, and in an instance of projection par excellence, he once accused me of being an incompetent person who was “fired from every job you ever had!” I have never been fired. The cockroach ended in flames every time but this last one (so far), which I suppose he attributes to the love of the schmoops. Troubles him not one bit that success, such as it is, is built on a pile of bones and lies.

  • I really didn’t have the ‘dreamer’ entrepreneur thing with XAsshole. But I did go thru various ‘hobbies’. First he spent all of his spare time hunting. Then that changed to fishing. Then came golf of all things. He hadn’t golfed a day in his life but spent all of his spare time golfing. Plus he was a drunk.

    He is a contractor and would hire ‘flunkies’ as I called them to do the real work while he was off ‘hobbying’. He would check on their progress later in the day and I would hear how they could never do anything right.

    In reality, he would tell them what to do, then leave to go ‘hobbying’. They would do it, but when he showed up, he had left out an important step in what they were to do arguing with them he had told them but they were just too ‘stupid’ to remember.

    When I heard the same thing from more than 5 of his ‘flunkies’ at various times, I started to wonder if it was deliberate on XAsshole’s part. He went thru ‘flunkies’ like water for they would always just quit. I wonder why. LOL

    But every now and then a ‘flunkie’ would excel and he would make them his confidante and ‘foreman’.
    I guess the work had to get done somehow.

    I never saw any money from his business ~ I now know all the OW did. But I did pay all of our bills, buy all the food and cook it too. If he was ‘hobbying’ I would get a text saying he would be home soon. Many dinners got ruined this way as soon turned into all night drinking or with the OW. Who knows.

    He decided to quit drinking and joined AA, left me for the leader of the AA group, moved into her cottage to get his head together and embrace the ‘sober’ life and divorced me for her. He now lives with her as Hurricane Harvey destroyed his little love shack and took all he owned. I would imagine she now pays all the bills and the ‘hobbies’ continue.

  • Running a successful (solvent/profitable) small business is hard work… sales, marketing, compliance, employees, long hours, payroll, taxes, many sacrifices, etc. I know because I’ve done it for the past 32 years and have zero regrets. Some people are cut out for the commitment, and some aren’t. Like getting old, being an entrepreneur isn’t for the feint of heart!

  • To be honest, we made a good team. We were both involved in decision making…up until he started cheating when I got pregnant. His lies caused chaos.

    My STBXH had so many different business ideas. I supported him on the good ones. The problem: he only had the ideas, but nothing else to make it happen. Network of people who could help him carry out those ideas? My network, my clients. Understanding of tax laws, accounting, business licensing & processes: wife chump. Money/capital: wife chump.

    While on vacation in London, he thought of the stupid idea to import used luxury cars to resell in US…without understanding jack shit about tariffs and trading laws.

    After our separation, he invested a chunk of money in cryptocurrency and lost 50% of it in 2 weeks (last I heard). Of course, he didn’t dare consult this financial advisor. Thank goodness this is AFTER we separated our assets.

    Let’s just say chumps are the glue that keeps things together. Usually we are chosen and kept around because we are damn valuable.

  • Yep this hits home. My NEDP (Narc Ex Domestic Partner) was an organic farmer who wanted to start a farm in our community. I bought into this hook line and proverbial sinker. Growing and planning the flowers, raising our child pretty much by myself with help from our parents (he was sooo busy with the farm). Working full time in a stressful corporate job so I could pay for all the other stuff…aka life..pouring energy and time into his start up.. All for love, all for the silly old fashioned idealism I had that you support the ones you love, and work toward building a future together.

    What I didn’t realize is he also had ‘relations’ with the female workers he hired..(so unfettered with children and real responsibility..you get the gist).. at least 1 maybe 2 that I know of. It was sooo hard to run the farm, he had to have other interests like salsa dancing, and joining the local fire department (with one of is AP’s come to find out). Which is such a great move for a Narc..a volunteer fireman think of all that adoration, “look I am saving kittens from burning houses, every one loves me!” – Now I can give myself permission to explore my character flaws freely.

    He would develop an interest and then get instantly distracted by something else, meanwhile family and I would still be supporting his initial idea..all of this was fraught with emotional outbursts, angst and anger at how wrong everyone else was when this got hard. When things got hard he just abandoned it, and my biggest fear when I left was it would be the same with our son. (Thankfully not so far)

    Meanwhile here I am in pigtails and maxi dresses, picking flowers, in charge of his marketing plan designing posters, flyers etc.., working full time and getting micro-kibbles of affection and a whole lot of emotional abuse…trusting..trusting..ignoring red flags that were big enough to wrap the farm like Christo. Oh did I mention I also got a certification at night in food preservation so I could teach classes? It is a strange thing to be so all in and have that simultaneously never be enough.

    A few months after I found out about a long term AP that was a married friend of ours. It was all too much.. She was ‘in love with him’, send him the lyrics to Burning Ring of Fire (barf). I think his sociopathy did not give him the ability to treat her any differently than me. Don’t get me wrong, I loathe her. But I am also ambivalent to her existence. I refuse to give her my emotional energy. I moved out two weeks after D Day. The farm folded a few months later, he couldn’t keep it going (not a surprise as he devalued my and others contribution at every turn).

    I had to jettison my whole community, everything I knew for 8 years and invested in, his family (also his enablers), and no one in it has reached out to me, which I get because I did not broadcast my defense of his narrative, so I have no idea what they know or thing. I had no desire to ruin his reputation in a small community knowing what this would do to our son. I just cut bait and ran. This is where his investment in being a fireman paid off. A pillar in the community..And oh…that corporate job and lack of income for him, means I cover child support…joy…(he bought a new truck).

    For two years now I haven’t been to a farmers market, I joke about only buying GMO, and the words ‘acreage’, ‘harvesting’ and ‘crop plan’ gives me PTSD. I try to move on but after investing so much of my self and loving someone so damaged there are still times that I just feel empty. I don’t miss walking on eggshells. I don’t miss lying next to a professional liar and feeling alone with someone right next to me. I do sometimes miss all the ignorant blissful moments..I miss all the sounds, smells of the farm, but they bring me acute sadness.. and I see those blissful moments for what they were…

    Phew I guess 2.2 years later I am still processing…Ugh!!!

    • And you process brilliantly. I could not possibly love your writing more. Reference to Christo? Icing on the cake he is forever denied.

    • “getting micro-kibbles of affection and a whole lot of emotional abuse”

      Yes, this. Glad you are out of there !!

  • Years ago Stupid Cheater fuckwit decided to up and move the family to another state for his job, same work with same company in a different city. You see, he was a Big Fish in the Little Pond of our town, and wanted a Bigger Pond. Except he couldn’t get a job a that branch in the merry town of Big Pond, so we stayed on high alert waiting for an opening. Told our kids we were moving, told the folks, visited Big Pond and picked out a neighborhood near a good elementary school and met with a realtor.

    In the meantime while waiting for an opening in Big Pond, Stupid Cheater fuckwit found a big old broken house that needed extensive remodeling. Change of plans! “We have to buy this house!” he declared.

    OK, fine, plans to move to Big Pond were set aside and we bought the big old broken house instead.

    14 years later, $300K in remodeling that I ALONE MANAGED, I was abandoned in that house. I had to finish the last $30K in fixes and get it on the market. And while the fuckwit was back in the house for 2 days, standing in the gorgeous kitchen cooking something over the 5-burner Wolf cooktop on the massive granite island I designed, he declared he never wanted to move there. He never wanted it and was fucking tired of DECISIONS BEING MADE FOR HIS LIFE and he was going to break the fuck free from the Controlling and Judgmental Wife that was the source of all evil.

    Doing taxes this spring I had to go through all the receipts for the work done on the house. Looking back was a horrible reminder of the hundreds of things I had to manage there–he NEVER stayed home even one time to meet a contractor, pick out a fixture, tile, paint, none of it. Projects we did ourselves were always him starting in and then abandoning the work at some point and leaving me to finish it. Countless times.

    And now Stupid Cheater fuckwit has moved to an Eastern European country where Schmoopie lives, to pursue his dreamz of great twu wuv and happynez. And his daughters hate him.

    But it is not his fault!

    • Oh, and in an instance of projection par excellence, he once accused me of being an incompetent person who was “fired from every job you ever had!” I have never been fired. The cockroach ended in flames every time but this last one (so far), which I suppose he attributes to the love of the schmoops. Troubles him not one bit that success, such as it is, is built on a pile of bones and lies.

    • Can so relate to how they get us caught up in managing these huge projects so that we will not see what they are truly doing.

    • During the screaming match, when I pointed out to the fuckwit that buying the big, broken house was HIS idea and it was ridiculous for him to now be denying he ever wanted to do it, he simply said, “Yeah, but you never disagreed!”

      So disordered. He somehow can make the mental leap that my failure to refuse to go along with his grand plan absolves him of having made the decision in the first place. I just can’t make my mind do the backflips necessary to shift the blame to someone else the way he does, constantly. What a miserable existence it would be to never hold yourself accountable to anything and act like a victim of circumstance and everyone else’s machinations. I guess children do that with ease until they realize it doesn’t work, but these disordered fucks just never ever change.

  • My ex said he shouldn’t have to work anymore since he worked at his business for 20 years( yes—worked it into the ground and took $500k of our retirement money with it). This was also after he gave up the business on my insistence. So I was the only breadwinner plus I was paying for our house, cottage and house in Florida including two mortgages. They really are Wackjobs!

  • My XH is a mechanic and works in the family business. He occasionally bought used cars that people didn’t want to put $in, fixed them up and sold them. Last couple of years we were together he started doing more and more of this. (Schmoopie had come along around this time). He started putting hours and hours into 2004 pontiac sunbirds! Could have built a brand new car for the time he was supposedly working on these cars. I never seen a penny of this extra $. Im sure schmoopie got a few nice things out of it! It got so bad that he bought an old car from MY boss, fixed it up and schmoopie supposedly “bought “it for her 16 year old daughter! I think I bought schmoopie’s daughter a car????!

    • My sister still swears my ex bought first schmoopie( a good friend of ours) her car as he was a car dealer.

        • Yup the first dday he drive her car home after I arrived home from a visit to my sister and found my bedroom with all kinds of their roll in the sack evidence including unchanged sheets and candles.. dirty pigs…

      • Not only do i think i pd for that car but she was our neighbor in the alley so i had to look at that fucking car every day for 7 months until i moved out!

        • I’m afraid I’d have been looking at it through a veil of flames.

  • My ex was a capable guy. In his younger years he was able to follow through on a lot of his plans. No matter how bad things got, he always came out on top in the end. I would brag about his capableness to friends and family. That was one of the things I loved about him although in all fairness, he did get a lot of encouragement and support from me which I do believe contributed at least somewhat to his successes (not that I ever pointed that out to him, I gave him full credit). This started to slip in the last few years of our marriage. He just seemed to slow down, like he was worn out by life. None of his previous accomplishments meant anything to him. No matter how much he accomplished, he still felt like life had failed him, and no amount of encouragement, praise or support from me made any difference. New projects/hobbies petered out halfway through. Unfortunately, he did follow through on his plans to have an affair, then another one. Once he started having affairs he didn’t have time for much else.

  • First one job related, X is an airline pilot, every two months he would bid for his flying line along with the other pilots. The senior pilots have priority on the preferred flying lines. X would bid the on-call line which means if a plane breaks or someone calls in sick is when they call the on call pilot. He would get called to fly maybe once a month for an overnight trip. X is a senior pilot so he could fly a preferred line which would increase his salary. If I were to suggest he bid a flying line to put away for a family trip (or give me a break) I got the look of disgust. Having X home all the time was like having a big immature teenage son. He’d watch the same movies over and over and full volumne. When I be watching a program , he’d walk in the room and make fun of what I was watching then turn the channel
    He’d like to brag to our working friends that he had only worked one day in 60 days. I would ask him to please think of our friends or neighbors feelings. One couple we know both work overtime to make ends meet.
    He ignored me and would tell them
    If I were to be so brazen as to ask him to do something for me he’d respond with “not right now,” which in translation means never.

    • My computer isn’t reloading at random so I’m typing fast before I lose everything. When X did fly a flying line for whatever reason or an on-call trip that lasted a few days, he’d complain about everything.
      Listening to him whine and complain, you’d think he was digging ditches in the hot sun all day.
      I would sometimes tell him to consider the alternative, not having a job, or income or great medical/dental benefits which I no longer have today.

  • My ex isn’t bat shit crazy like so many other cheaters but occasionally he had his paranoid crazy moments. He bought 100lbs of dried food, two 100 gallon water tanks, a water purifier and a couple of guns in 2008 so we would be prepared for Armageddon. It all came with when we moved halfway across the country. He left it all behind when he moved out. I guess the kids and I will still survive when Armageddon hits assuming we can find firewood.

    His dream when we retired was to live in a remote cabin in Montana somewhere (seems to be a common theme here). I am glad he won’t be following through on that one with me as I would just as soon have easy access to things like hospitals and infrastructure when I am old enough to not be able to get around so well anymore. Have fun Schmoops.

    He caught the gold bug in 2009 and we ended up with ~$40,000 in gold. This came in handy, however, when we needed liquefiable assets to cover 1. The divorce, 2. His first year’s rent when he moved out 3. The high balance on our credit card when he was spending money on Schmoopie and I was trying to play catch up by hoarding maple syrup, olive oil and toilet paper (seemed easier to overspend myself than to try and claw it all back in the divorce agreement).

      • Well maybe in the real world, but some of the cheaters described here set a pretty high bar for crazy. It’s been quite amusing reading through today’s stories (when it isn’t sad).

        • My ex wanted the isolated cabin too; he also had post apocalypse style fantasies running. Was obsessed with Peak Oil.

          Had to be sustainable etc he would butcher animals (no experience obvs). No other topic of conversation for months and was actually driving my anxiety levels through the roof with his neurotic behaviors.

          • Yep mine wanted the log cabin in Montana too – not that he’d ever been there. And here we are working in Switzerland but living just across the border IN THE FRENCH FRICKIN ALPS – why not build a log cabin here where we both have good jobs, the kids are happy (and bilingual), I have expat benefits (paid education for the kids and so on), damn good medical insurance and pensions. Those good jobs are now paying him 8,000 dollars a month in invalidity pension and he has permanent medical insurance. Yeah, let’s give all that up for a log cabin in the middle of Montana.

  • Setting up a café with his ex colleague/affair partner/our tenant. Using my savings and our kids savings to fund it. Joint signing a loan with me, so he could tell her it was his money…. Can’t even pay household bills or work out a budget – how the fuck was he gonna run a business and keep secret that it was their business as well as our family business?! Then telling me he was going to give ‘our tenant’ a job in the cafe once it was up and running….?? WTF?!
    Then to add to the delight he lured in a 2nd colleague, started another affair with her and wangled his way into moving 100 odd miles away to set up a new life with her and her family, conveniently forgetting about his children….. And ends up living in a caravan ???? ????… And stealing my shoes to give to her for Christmas…..and not sending his kids any Christmas presents… Can’t make this madness up!
    And telling some folk he’d bought a ‘food truck’ and it was in storage…!!

  • Wash and always eMyed to have his own shop. The only thing he enjoyed in high school was shop, where they painted cars. He did that one semester.. .. But His dream was to open a shop to custom paint cars and only open whedn he felt like working. He would not even put the effort into finding out what all was needed for a shop like that, what kind is tools were needed, where do you buy these tools and how much.. .. he would get angry at me for asking these questions. I was bringing him down and making him feel bad by asking questions… .. Apparently his dream was just going to pop up like magic and he would waltz in a take over.. .. so of course that dream never happened.

    His other dream was to have many many many vehicles as possible. He would buy cars for 500. Spend 200 to get it running, put rims and stereo in it, drive for a year tops, then sell it for 400.. .. drove me crazy!!!! I have no idea how many vehicles he went thru. At one point he told me he wanted a junk yard, and to run a tow truck business. ..

    It’s been 4 years later and I am STILL clean g up car parts and vehicles from my yard.. .. he never amounted to shit. Like he is stuck in high school doing shoo. But without the responsibilities of cleaning up or prepping or taking care of equipment.. ..

    • Sorry that should be wasband always wanted.. .. smartphone not so smart.

      Please excuse the typos

  • I bought her a horse farm so she could pursue her dreams of being a professional horse trainer, then she ended up screwing the guy who cut our hay. After a few months dancing the Pick Me Dance, I moved out and filed.

    She thought she was going to buy me out with the money I paid in alimony. I told her over and over that I could hardly pay for it with my whole income, nobody would approve a new mortgage based on just a partial income. Meanwhile she dragged the divorce out why she tried to get her business up and running.

    After about a year she realized it wasn’t going to happened and got a job a thousand miles away. managing some rich person’s country estate. Pays hardly anything. From what I understand she lives alone on a farm in rural Pennsylvania and takes care of things until the weekends when the owners come from Manhattan.

    If she hadn’t fucked around her own horse farm would be up and running today.

  • Ex did have this crazy idea that he should quit his high paying job in investment banking to become a flight instructor. Guess what. He did follow through and he did become a flight instructor. I was so proud at the time (before DDay). He has now worked his way up to flight school director. Guess what? He still isn’t happy. It turns out that the new job is stressful and thankless too and now flying isn’t fun anymore. Even when they do follow through on their plans, it doesn’t make them any happier or satisfied with life in the end.

    • They are NEVER happy. Mine loved to reminisce about his crew chief days in the army. He *missed* flying. He always wanted to be a pilot. You know what? He was in the military for the first few years of our marriage and HE HATED it. He intentionally pushed the envelope with their “rules” (Like cutting his sideburns just on the verge of being asked to trim them up, etc). And yet, after a few years of being out, it was all rose-colored and nostalgic.

  • Ok, mine’s plans went the opposite direction. Instead of wild dreams of building a business, she aspired to do…nothing. Specifically, she said she was tired of having to do household chores, work at a job, and be active with me. Mean old Mr. Chump was always trying to do things outside the house, while all she wanted to do was just watch TV for 5 hours after dinner. That a-hole Mr. Chump had also insisted she get a full-time job, when she was perfectly happy working part time doing office work making $14000 a year, while spending everything from Chump’s miserable job. Somebody had to work enough to pay her $200/month college debts and $350/month car payments, and it wasn’t going to be her.
    So, she looked forward to a life free of a real job and housework. This lasted about a month, when she those bills that Mr. Chump was no longer paying came due. Now, she’s really miserable, as she’s broke AND still has to work a lot. Poor thing.

  • There is a common quality among these guys, mainly disorder. After our son was born, he had to quit his band. They were going to kick him out anyway. He was going to start his own drum making business, lawn mower company, news aggregate site, motorcycle parts, etc…I suck because I refused to gamble our non-existent money. They never can finish anything, get bored, and move on. I am still waiting to hear that he is taking that South America motorcycle ride. Somehow, I don’t think it is going to happen. Now he is on a quest for happiness. He blathers on about that to DS that still talks to him. DS needs to finish college and get on his feet, not some mystical search for happiness. They live in a fantasy world. I used to oil paint in high school. I let that go as family and life obligations took over. He once told me, it would be sooo hot if I took up painting again. Eye roll…

  • My Ex fancied himself to be a writer. He wanted to quit his job and write all day. He actually did finish one of his books (he said he had a total of four ready to go), but the book was never published. He would spend tons of money “tweaking” parts of this book and then printing it at Staples or Kinkos! Last I saw of this great novel it was printed and placed in a box. While I was packing his trash for him to leave the box accidentally fell over and all the pages got jumbled together. I haven’t seen it since. He was so concerned I would try to ride his coattails financially once he became the “great novelist” that he actually had it written into our divorce decree that I and his children could lay no claim to the proceeds and sales of his writings! The kicker is the book was awful. He felt it was at least on a James Patterson level, but in reality it was more on a “watch Dick and Jane run!”

    • I can’t believe he put that in his divorce decree. Greedy idiots. No one is getting my money that i don’t have and never will!

  • Ugh….
    Mine wanted to be make signs in metal. This from a male who had TENS of THOUSANDS of dollars (my money bought it all, of course) of wood whittling equipment that he never used. I used call him the master crapsman. And there was the off road vehicles…..too many to count. Never completed.

    So. Glad. To. Be. Free. Of. That. Shit !

  • Oh yes. I keep remembering new things. He had another dream too. He wanted to own his own business, by having me start an engineering consulting firm. In short his dream was for me to quit my job and start a business (when he wasn’t wishing I would quit my career to be a stay at home mom – he had that dream too). I will admit that idea did have some appeal and I considered it when he was still working at the bank. I went so far as to put out feelers to see whether or not I had enough contacts and there was enough demand for my particular skills that I might actually have clients. I looked into what kind of hour rates I could charge to out bid others and still make a profit as well as trying to guestimate how many hours of work I might actually be able to get. I figured I might have a chance if ex would allow me to take advantage of things like “historically underutilized business” requirements for government projects (designers have to use them and they are always looking for competent people to fill those roles on their teams). Then he quit his job and I didn’t think it was the right time to start a business. He continued to push for it, however, implying that owning your own business is the only way to be successful. Again, he almost had me convinced. I had my own daydreams about the possibilities. While I did the billable work, he would do the accounting, marketing, and all that other stuff. It would be a joint effort. We would work together and have more time for each other and take breaks to make love in the middle of the day (yeah right). Then suddenly he wanted to move half way across the country back to his home state. I wasn’t crazy enough to try and start a business in a new location where nobody knew me and my capabilities and where I wasn’t familiar with the local codes, market needs, etc. I told him we couldn’t move unless one of us found an actual paid job there so he found me a job there and we moved. Now I am relieved that I got a good new job instead of trying to run a business with someone who had nothing but contempt for me and saw me as the cause of all of this problems in life (she wouldn’t quit her job to start a business).

  • This hit it on the head today. Especially after the week I had managing my stbx’s medical practice. Yes, I still manage the business, albeit from another state, but I don’t trust that guy with money AT ALL. Anyway, after he finished residency and fellowship, lo and behold he didn’t like working for someone else..so for the past 15 years we moved around while he found his perfect job. Sometimes he was his own boss but that was hard too. The kicker is he finally had a good position, at Kasier, but it was stable, good money etc. He was bored though. Two months before making partner he decided moving to Las Vegas to take over a friend’s practice was better. At this point, I just found out he had an affair and in the foggy mist I went with him, and our child, to try and make a better life together in Las Vegas…10 months later he asks for a divorce because he found the love of his life, after us being together 24 years. This time I left and moved back to California with our 6 year old. This week he was throwing a temper tantrum because “it’s MY business and I’m the BOSS!” Yes I say, but you can’t be rude to patients or you will have NO business buddy. He wants his own practice, HOWEVER, if that means working hard forget it! And btw when he asked for divorce he admitted to years of cheating…..he’s a real winner.

  • Mine wanted a homestead. He researched raising farm animals and growing our own food. The huge garden he planted the summer before his affair…well that fell into disarray. You’d think now that he had the opportunity to buy a nice house out in the country he’d do that right? Nope, tiny corner lot on the edge of the city (not even can be classified as suburbs).

    He wanted out of our marriage, he couldn’t handle the home life responsibilities anymore. Well, after he dumped the OW, he’s moved onto another that has a young child of her own, just like him. They are already spending all of DS’s weekend with his new adopted family. Like, you said you were miserable with me and now you’re gonna go build the same fucking life but with even more responsibility???

    And where are your chickens and rabbits? Hm?? I thought those were important!!

  • Mr. Sparkles fancies himself as the next Flip or Flop titan. Since he couldn’t even get approved for a mortgage with is credit score and I already had a mortgage (that I wouldn’t take out a second mortgage on for him), I was blamed for holding him/us back from making real money. The fact that we both already worked full-time and had a new baby, so where was the time going to come from to do the work?

    What should be noted is that when I met him, he lived in a house where he had removed all of the plaster (so the walls were just slats) and he had blankets on the windows for curtains. Took him 18 months to put up the drywall so he could sell it… FLOP.

    Flash forward to our marital home… he took down a ceiling in the garage to install better insulation… I waited 12 months then hired someone to do it and gave away the stack of drywall he had purchased (at the wrong dimensions)… and that is just one example of his half-assed approach to rehabbing houses.

    New GF, however, BELIEVES IN HIM. So they’re going for it. What she doesn’t know is that his favorite part is the DEMO, not the restoring (a metaphor for the way he lives his life too!).

    • Some people just like to watch the world burn. The joker.
      Mine could destroy things never build or create only dismantle and sabotage.

  • Nowdeadcheater told me angrily one day that I had RUINED his chances to become a professional mountain climber … he met one once. He (masters degree and elite undergrad education) said he would have liked to have run a bull dozer but I ruined that too.

    His theory that I “ruined” things is that he claimed I forced him to live a boring, normal suburban life (I didnt) but he was trapped in working because he always (against my pleading) always bought the most expensive house and cars we could possibly get. My bro and his wife called us “The Payment Masters” because we had payments on everything.

    Well into his cheating and wreckoncilitaion (where I gave in too much) he got us DEEP in debt for a huge house and 4 cars then said he intended to not pursue another corporate job, he was going to start a business. I would have been FINE starting a business but we could have done it without massive overhead costs. He said I wasnt supportive. His endeavor actually kept us floating (with a half million $ interest only mortgage payment).

    One way he saved money was to reject the military retirement life insurance (like $250 a month) in favor of a $97 policy that was only good for 20 years but had the benefit of a large pay out if he died young (I think it was part of the guilt reduction during his departure phase). He died suddenly 7 years into this madness and I took the large payout and paid off the mortgage, all the cars, the student loans, credit cards and every other debt I ever thought of…I later I married a man with no debt.

    Very strange that his plan actually worked.

  • When I met crazyex, he was transitioning from a career in finance to one in psychotherapy. Of course his first wife “did not support or appreciate his wishes.” Can’t believe I fell for this! I was going to be the wife that fully supported him, emotionally and financially, to be what he dreamed of being! During the 4 years we were together, he did make the change, but along the way:
    1. He dreamed of running a riverboat up and down the Hudson and really looked into it;
    2. He wanted to start a “psych referral business” in which he would refer patients to other therapist and get a piece of the fee;
    3. He said, (sounding like Gollum here) “No woman is ever going to have a piece of my practiccccccce….”
    4. He (wtf) applied and did not get, a finance job in the Federal Reserve.
    Later, when I tragically discovered that he had been a sex addict for the past 25 years and was using lunchtime to visit his favorite dominatrixes, I realized that being a therapist is the perfect job for him — because no one knows where he is but him!
    5. Now he is getting married for the 3rd time — I shudder for her. I tried to reach out, but she did not accept my message — which was just to give her my phone number in case she ever wanted to talk.

  • Mine was less economically lofty than emotionally ridiculous. He planned on us continuing to be best friends after divorce and was shocked and pissed when I informed him that wasn’t gonna work (“when you cheat on someone and divorce them you give up their companionship”). He wanted family dinners and even continued shared holidays—ummm no.

    He also went out and bought a giant house with the equity he got out of ours in the settlement, and then lamented the payments. Yea homie, maybe downscaling woulda worked better.

  • Oh my. Where do I start. My ex’s entire existence is all about grandiose plans, none of which have come to fruition. These are the ones that come to mind, but believe me, there are more.

    1. He was going to be a corporate trainer. He actually did get a couple training jobs at local corporations. The second one, after his first presentation, the company refused to pay him the full amount because they said he was so bad and his “training” seminar was bogus.

    2. He started a “dinner club” locally. We lost a few thousand dollars on that one before I could get him to understand that a business is not successful if the owner is spending more than he is making.

    3. Many, many jobs over the years, most in sales. Some quite sketchy.

    4. He finally became successful in banking industry, but quit his $100K job eight weeks after we separated to pursue his ‘dream” of becoming an actor. This story is well known here, so I won’t bore you beyond saying that it’s been eight years and he is still not famous, despite his repeated claims that “God opened all the doors to his success.”

    5. He wrote a book about himself, paid some sketchy vanity publisher $5K to print it, and told our son he was going to be doing book tours all over the country and would bring son along. Needless to say, his only book signing event was at a donut shop in Cleveland.

    6. I’m not going to give details or names of the character because I’m sure ex Googles it daily and I don’t want to lead him here or give him views, but he’s got a lot of videos on YouTube that he spent thousands on.

    7. Three years ago, he claimed he had a “three year plan” of employment, which was that he would work part time for his sister three or four months each year. This is third year, and he’s not even fulfilling his agreement.

    8. His latest scheme is anti-bullying children’s books. Ironic, because he is a bully.

    9. His most successful “life plan” so far: he’s found a woman who has some money, a good job, and a home to agree to marry him. He still has no job, still is full of grandiose dreams, and no doubt is still a lying cheater, but I guess she’s good with all that as long as he keeps the charm coming, and he IS a master of charm.

    There’s a lot more, believe me. And that’s not even getting into his staggering amount of cheating, his con artist ways, or his diagnosed narcissistic personality disorder.

    • Oh shit the book signing in a donut shop, too funny!
      Big red flag of the narc. People who say they are one day going to write their biography.
      Umm nope your life really isn’t that exciting and you can’t write beyond grade 11.

  • Omfg. This is another one of those “its like chump lady knows me and my ex personally “ moments. I wish I had known decades ago that spending every moment of free time on dumbass business ideas was a character trait consistent with narcissism and cheating.

    I’ve lost count of the failed business. He would spend a good nine or so months developing something. Then as soon as he gets to the point where it was time to launch, it would just go away and never be mentioned again. Then peace for six months, then the next one would start. The last dumbasfuck idea right before he left: Selling cookies in a jar over the internet. He spent a ton of time baking and trying to figure out how to solve the problem of Cookies Without Preservatives Get Stale Really Quick lol.

  • Stupid fool cheater has done well at his life goals and ambitions of being the town drunk and drug addict. May still be working on being a dealer

    • oh my giddy aunt!!! you know the ex!!!

      wasband is the town drunk and drug addict with the neighborhood party girl meth head that he left me for.. .. (because she “respects” him/his drinking) but i am oh so lucky that he moved to another town 90 minutes away to do that .. ..

      we have not seen or heard from him in over a year. .. . blissful peace

  • F**kwit emailed a sugar baby (code for regular prostitute with perks) to say that he was retiring soon (to live off my income, apparently) and would “…have lots of me-time”. Presumably he intended that “I” would continue with full time work, full time parenting, housekeeping, meal prep, bill paying etc. while he had this “me-time” with hookers and used my money to pay for it. Needless to say, upon finding this and other emails to prostitutes, I declared D-Day. He is indeed retired, living in rented accommodation with rented furniture and using his remaining assets to pay child support… and he has a lot of “me time” because his children don’t want to see him.

    • Im incredulous reading stories like this one…my cheater was a huge shit to me but I cant start to imagine this. It would be awful enough if he spent money he earned but him spending money I earned on prostitutes – I cant even wrap my mind around that.

  • Backstory: 56 year old baby who “fell in cosmic luv” with a histrionic serial homewrecker after 2 weeks of knowing her.

    1. He said (in a therapy session) that I needed to allow him to see if what he felt for his new soulmate was “real” or just an “infatuation” so he wanted my permission to spend time with her (3000miles away) but then come home too. Oh, and bring her to visit as “we would like each other”. Polyamory was his solution. I told him I wasn’t his mommy and our 26 year marriage was not a summer vacation where he could come and go…
    2. He wanted to run away to work on one of the boats that fights whaling in Japan…
    3. Also wanted to run away to drive the entire Pan American highway and live on the road…
    4. Wanted to run away to Costa Rica, live on the beach, surf, and support himself by playing the guitar…so picture THAT–a middle aged man with a receding hairline and a gut strumming his guitar for spare change…

    What eventually happened was none of those things but he is virtually homeless, a collapsed narcissist who can’t understand why I wouldn’t go along with any of his ideas to be married but single at the same time.

  • I confused intelligence for character. Met Dr. Cheaterpants at work. He became an ICU doc as he couldn’t see himself slugging through a full week of patients in a clinic setting. His colleagues take night call AND work Mon-Fri in the office, doing research, administrative duties, teaching students. Their hospital coverage amounts to about 2 months per year spread out. He had a colleague tell him he should atleast show his face in the office a couple of days per week for a few hours as people were talking about him.

    He went through 3 bosses who started out the greatest thing since sliced bread and eventually were ‘awful and didn’t appreciate the specialness of him’. He would be all in on research, coming in extra at night and weekends, to zipola. They didn’t appreciate him and give him enough support staff. Towards the end of our 20 years together, I would simply ask him if he was going in today? We would sometimes have lunch together. He would give me the stink eye and ask me what I meant by that, that’s if he was up out of bed.

    I got the kids up, ready for school, I work full-time + in nursing administration directly supervising about 25 people (some of whom supervise others too). I did all the adulting, cooking, cleaning, grocery shopping, child doctor appointments including 2 kids with braces. We would try to be quiet in the mornings as to not wake him cause he would be super pissed off by this.

    Dr. Cheaterpants would cycle through hobbies including coaching our kids sports teams. I thought this was his contribution and he was being a great dad. He discarded DS when he wouldn’t put every waking hour into practicing outside of team practice. DD was willing and became the ‘star’ player. She was the golden child that produced a lot of kibble for him. Second schmoopie was DD14’s 20-something asst sports coach while he was volunteer coaching.

    So we still work at the same hospital and I’m guessing he’s still his same ‘underappreciated, you’re not the boss of me’ narc. He wanted to cut back his hours (like he even worked much) by the time he was mid 50’s. Since he’s now purchased a $450K home, eating dinners out at the most expensive restaraunt in town, planning trips to Hawaii with the kids and his young schmoopie, he’s probably going to be ‘working’ til he’s 105 years old. As long as he has his current chump boss, he can live the life of a slacker.

  • My cheater’s life plan has always been to be worshipped and taken care of by chumpy women. First, there was Mommy, then me, and now Skanky. He has been unemployed since divorcing me so as not to pay full child support for our three kids. He spends his parents’ inheritance on beer and hair products to cover his bald spot with a swoop. His skank does his “adulting” and pays those pesky bills.

    During one of his several unemployment stints when we were married, he told me he always wanted to be a cartoon illustrator for a conservative publication. But he never once drew anything or submitted anything. I guess yelling at the TV in the basement while drinking was his “try” at it.

    And now, he’s all hers! Bwhahahaha!!!

    • While falling down the well of unemployment, booze and depression X2 was parked in front of the tv complaining drunkenly about all “those people” on welfare. M’kay

  • My story is a lot more modest than everyone else’s but I’m sure resonates with other guy chumps.

    Mme YogaPants tried all sort of things. Nothing big, but fairly modest. She was going to make extra money at one time making cedar scented hangers. We bought lots of supplies and guess what? Never happened. She was a sucker for home parties too. There are a lot of gizmos still in my kitchen drawers that I’ll pull out and do my best Gandalf impersonation “I have no memory of this thing”. Oddly, no matter how many parties she went to, whenever she hosted one nobody came. I always found that very very odd because I thought she was everybody’s friend and everybody loved her.

    After either her third or fourth home party representative try where she’d buy all the catalogues and “starter packs” that would then gather dust she got made at me when I suggested that her latest idea wasn’t likely to pan out any better than the others.

    The one big one was something called Melaleuca. She got suckered into that multi-level marketing environment. Bought binders and catalogues to sign people up with (gathered dust). She tried to sign up family who were polite and bought stuff from her but refused to add to her empire. A key thing that bothered me about this, beyond the money that we spent every single month on cleaning products and vitamins etc was the fact that if she forgot to order that they would just send us random crap and bill us anyway. A few times I asked her to please disconnect and she told me that there was no way to exit from the agreement. Hotel California marketing? Or just lies.

    After she moved out there were two boxes of random cleaning products that I had no idea what they did that were on average years old that got packed up and given to her. When she and OM were on temporary hiatus and she did a minor hoover of me she was complaining that she kept getting men’s vitamins but that nobody including her own son wanted them. I didn’t offer to take any. I kept the stain remover though – it works rather well. As of last check I probably have a literal life-time supply.

    BT

    • Excellent LOTR reference!!!

      The cheater is a person who cannot sustain the discipline to make anything work. Jobs. Relationships. Wiping off the kitchen counters.

      They get bored easy. ????

      This is a tremendous red flag. Someone who does not have the sense and the inner resources to entertain themselves is not an adult ready to protect your heart.

  • X1 actually moved our little family to another state to pursue his “dream business” as a contractor. We discussed his opportunity for months prior while he had been working there for his employer. X (allegedly) had a financier to kick start the first project, a shopping center, which would take 2 yrs to build.
    We had settled in at our new locale (financed by me, a gift from my dad and my credit). 4 months later I realized I had been working, while his project ….. just never started.

    I quizzed him mercilessly to find the “project”. The bank had declined to back the project MONTHS before we moved. Months!!
    “I thought it would just work out” was X’s mealy mouth excuse for not sharing this information with me.

    I retreated back to my parents, got my old job back while X and I engaged in a cross state divorce because he stayed in New Place with his Schmoopie. I’m sure he met her earlier and she was the real destination for his moving us.
    Our poor kids had to deal with our mess for years.

    • I forgot this gem! He wanted to be a music promoter! So he lent (gave away) a majority of our savings to some younger work buddies who had a garage band so they could cut their demo tape. The Big Plan was X would get them gigs.

      Of course I was the nag who made his buddies sign a contract drawn up by my lawyer uncle for the “loan”.

      X refused to ask for the money back. The demo never went anywhere and it was a lot of lost work hours to save that money down the drain. Not to speak of our children’s safety net. So when the “move to the new state” crashed I immediately knew Peter Pan would never grow up. And he never did.

  • Early in our relationship, x had a vision to get advanced degrees and create a healing center as part of a spiritual vision, which turned out to come from a different woman. I started suggesting things we could do to research how retreat centers were set up, developed, and successfully operated by visiting some places. Nope, but it stopped the recitations.

    10 years later, as the marriage and our finances were failing during the great recession, x decided to he wanted to quit his federal job and start his own company, using a business model that was successful in another state. God had told him to do this, what steps had to be done by what dates. But x had aged very poorly, behaved as an overt asshole, he could not have presented to persuade anyone. I was pretty sure the business wouldn’t get off the ground and he’d never be employed again, and I couldn’t afford to support him.

    X repeatedly pressured me to cosign an equity loan (that I couldn’t afford to pay back) so he could quit work and do this. I asked for a business plan with back up if the business didn’t work, some idea of how much he’d need to set up and support his lifestyle. Cue rage sneer while telling me he would just make up the numbers. But he was sure that buying a new motorcycle was the first item of the plan.

    When I learned that there was no way to enforce cosigning on equity loan draws, I just dropped the rope. X brought it up in marriage counseling session, the counselor validated X’s (copied) business ideas but not the raging or timing. I suggested we sell the house and split the equity and x could do whatever he wanted with his share. Oh, and that included a divorce. I never could figure out why he was so surprised.

  • Thanks for everyone’s patience with the spam moderation queue. It’s been extra twitchy today. Assurances I will get to EVERYONE eventually. Fear not if the Filter Monster grabs your comment. I’ll fish it out. (Unless you’re a troll.)

  • This post and the comments here are so incredibly validating. My ex changed jobs every few years (no-one appreciated him), insisted on grad school financed by me (2 useless masters degrees and was talking about getting his doctorate) and countless other nonsensical plans – and I mostly believed all his bullshit. As I wised up and began to ask more questions or pushed back on his “dream,” I was the problem causing him to rage. Just counted – 11 jobs in 23 years of marriage – sheesh. Finally summoned my courage (it only took 3 d-days) and threw the cheating fucker out.
    Divorce is final (yay!), I have the house (yay again!) and he moved back home with his mommy and daddy. I am still working on freeing my mind though, and these comments (and CL in general) are the best help.

    • Yes, I always heard about needing to support his “dreams” too. I will never again support someone else’s dream at the price of my own!

  • I have noticed from reading these columns that the cheaters are the same person. They are not unique, different, special or wonderful. As much as they would like to think and tell everyone that will listen.

    All of their tricks are the same. All of their cheating behavior is the same. The lying, raging, gaslighting, silent treatments, too tired for sex etc.

    But anyway. My cheater wanted to own a McDonalds. I think the only reason was that at the age of 50 he thought he would have a lot of barely 18 year olds available to him.

    He took money out of his 401k to start a car dealership. Failure.
    He took money out of his retirement to start a trucking business. Failure.
    He wanted me to take out a loan to buy a trailer for his truck. NO.
    He wanted to start a taxi business.
    He wanted to start a thrift store. I would buy everything for the store, he would sell it and keep the money. NO.

    Thats all I can think of at the moment. I’m sure I will remember more. It was always one get reach scheme after the other.

    And the lottery tickets. Hundreds of dollars a month for lottery tickets. But couldn’t feed his children or pay bills.

    As my son told me, every parasite needs a host. I was his. For a while.

    • Well stated. They never want to roll up their sleeves and get to work.

      I once told the X that the world didn’t owe him a living. That the world didn’t owe him anything. I will never forget the look of amazement on his face.

      A grown man who likes to sleep until 2 PM every day but yet wants the newest and the best gadgets, meals out and clothes. I do have to thank him for being honest one time because I asked him what it was he actually wanted to do and he said -I just want to sleep late and party but still have a lot of money.

      ????

      • I found $9,000 worth of spent scratch tickets in the shop desk. Apparently he bought a lot of lottery tickets too but didn’t save those because you can’t write those off if you win big.

        And before I kicked him to the curb, he said I wanted for nothing. While he’s wasting money on tickets, booze, cigarettes, weed and ho-workers, I’m wearing 15 year old clothes, cut my hair twice a year, have no hobbies, don’t go out, buy makeup twice/yr, and he told me we couldn’t afford health, denatal or vision care.

        What cheat, liar and thief.

        The stuff I kept finding…

  • My ex was always going to hit it big with the next horse he got. People would give him retired racehorses and they’d stand in our pastures eating and pooping, but I never saw one of them turn into a big money maker. I always wondered why he thought he’d have time to train these horses when he worked and traveled about 80 hours a week. All those horses just turned into pasture ornaments.

    • Hope they didn’t cost you too much to maintain! But at least it DOES sound like a nice retirement for the horses!

  • For about 5 minutes my fuckwit wanted to grow hops on a friend’s hobby farm. He had done some home-brewing and thought it was cool. Thank god he didn’t have a molecule of ambition to make it happen so there was no money spent by him kn the venture.

    When we had the landscaping done (all attended to and monitored by me, he couldn’t be bothered to deal with the actual work of meeting contractors) we had a tall pergola installed in the back and I put a hops plant in each corner, using the supports to trail the fast growing vine up along. I managed to over-winter them so they came back every year just great. The dumbass didn’t give a micro-shit about it and of course he didn’t appreciate the effort it required. I know it pissed him off that I continually could turn crap into cream by simply showing up every day and trying. I am great at follow through and committment which he loathes. Sooooo boring! He is an idea-guy, not an actual DO guy.

    All of his brewing equipment was sold at auction for pennies on the dollar after he abandoned me. He never could make anything but skunky beer in any case, his stuff sucked.

    I threw the hops out when I prepped the house for sale.

  • Marijuana cookie making freedom fighting part time lawyer aiding the cannabis community, in a state where it was illegal, with two kids, when he was licensed in a legal state and admitted to the bar in that state. Yup ladies, he was all mine for 26 years!

  • My exhole didn’t come up with any wacky career plans. In fact, after he was pushed out of the company he started, he deliberately took a new job that would require minimal travel and would enable him to work from home or leave early the days he has the kids. Because NOW he understands the damage that can be done to a relationship when you travel 60% of the time and work long hours. And god forbid twu wuv with shmoopie should suffer the way our relationship did.
    But he is doing some wacky shit in his personal life. Namely, having a baby with 50 year old schmoopie. This after she allegedly aborted their first baby 2.5 years ago when he and I were in the midst of wreckonciliation.
    I mean, I would kind of understand if she didn’t have kids (she has 3) and this was a last desperate attempt at motherhood. But this just seems like a vanity project.
    I hope she gains 75 pounds and that baby is colicky as hell!

  • Patisserie school was the thing KK brought up most often — other than a brief foray into elementary education, most of her time was spent complaining that “I have no life” and “but I don’t KNOOOOOOW what I want to do.”

    She would get so resentful that I’d gotten a masters degree, and I would say: “You’re forgetting — my employer paid for my degree through tuition reimbursement. Draw up a plan for how we can get a return on an investment in patisserie school, identify what we have now that you’re willing to give up, or find someone who will pay for it, and I’ll drive you down at sign you up myself.”

    Nothing.

    I said later: “the non-profit you work for offers tuition reimbursement — find what types of things they’ll pay for and get your masters that way.”

    Nothing.

    In MC, the counselor even called her out when she said I “keep refusing” her patisserie school: “UX isn’t saying that. He’s saying you need to come up with a plan for how that would work. Are you willing to do that?”

    Nothing.

    Now here we are, a bit more than a year after the divorce is final, and she announces that she’s going back to school to get a masters in …

    wait for it …

    Non-profit Management

    We’ll see.

  • He would aggressively tell me “I am a genius!!!”.

    The snafu was that all of his ideas were already on the shelves at Walmart. At first, I gently tried to tell him that someone had already thought of these ideas. He would become wildly combative and tell me I was wrong. That he was going to be a billionaire ! He even went and met with several patent lawyers who told him that his ideas were about 15 years too late.

    He once did have a clever idea for an app. However, he could not even program a new cell phone. I told him we would have to hire a tech firm to design the app and it would probably be $20,000 -which neither one of us had.

    He became so irate that his face turned red and he screamed at me and I quote :

    “Stop ruining my ideas and my dreams with all your technical bullshit !!! You are a bitch dream killer!!!!”

    Runs away like Forrest Gump, sobbing.

    (He wanted to create an app)

      • He would sue me for copy right infringement!

        I actually did get a big karma cookie- if it is true.

        Even though I told his family to put the kibosh on telling me anything about him, his uncle told me that Cry Baby Genius is homeless and living behind the Dunkin’ Donuts in Miami Beach.

        Please God let this be true. ????????????

        • LOL He’s sharing the parking lot with my X! X won’t share his bottle though.

  • My X changes jobs frequently, sometimes of his own volition sometimes (mostly) not, and it was never his fault. He started a business that was sure to make us huge amounts of money that actually made us about -30k. Fortunately I came on board to do the bookkeeping (he was doing none!) just in time to realize that he was financially ruining us so I pulled the plug. During the last few years he was constantly talking about designing an oyster shucking knife that was supposedly going to be so much better, because oysters haven’t been shucked for thousands of years.

    • That said we weren’t poor, he always made plenty idk whether from great bullshitting or real skills. He is not doing well now though and has been going downhill financially since he walked out on us, and this is without paying the court ordered alimony.

      • I confess that I have checked on his stock accounts a couple times since divorce. I moved all my assets away from the brokerage that couldn’t seem to unlink our several accounts— if you signed into the (former) joint brokerage account you can get to all the others without a new sign in so I don’t have to know his passwords. When I found them incompetent to protect my information I simply moved all my stuff. Fuckwit apparently has no clue since I did all the administrative adulting with money. I originally went in to be sure there were no tax items or lingering dividends due to me from the joint account and found the links still active, so I peeked.

        He bought a couple individual stocks that have not done well. Put in about $70K in them just in the last couple months, apparently on some clickbait headline news, and they have suffered badly as he bought right at the peak.

        I wonder how he will make that my fault in his mind. Well, soon I won’t look at all but I might add those 2 stinky ticker symbols to my own watch list just for fun to watch the slide and think of how he is screwing up things for himself at every turn.

  • Mine opened up a photography studio with his Soc sec disability checks. He could legitimately take pics of scantily clad or nude women. He never made any money at it but did get a gf and fathered a child. Ugh I feel nauseated typing this.

    • I am sorry. ???? That is nauseating. ????

      They are Douchebaggery Ass Clowns.

      Fuck him.

      *They never change

      But you can still have a beautiful, meaningful life. ????❤️????

  • First, I want to say that I am absolutely a proponent of education. I’ll be the first to advise people to take a few classes to brush up their skill set, or if they’ve been out of the workforce for a few years, I’ll suggest that they work with their community college or undergraduate institution to get the credentials they need to reenter the workforce. I also support those who want to return to school to get the graduate degree, whether to make themselves more attractive on the job market or out of a desire for personal satisfaction.

    My CheaterX went back to school because he liked the student loan money and he was unhappy with having “only” an undergraduate degree.

    CheaterX had a good upper mid-level management position. He made twice the county’s median salary, and nearly three times what I did. His company offered partial tuition reimbursement. They’d pay 50% of the costs of any course in which the employee made a grade of B or better. Schmoopie used this to earn a bachelor’s degree, and I don’t begrudge her that.

    However, when she was getting cozy with CheaterX, she was in the middle of an online masters program and she explained to CheaterX that going back to school was a great way to have a bit of extra money. All you had to do was apply for a student loan to pay for the course, and then earn a B, and then apply for tuition reimbursement from the company. The company cut checks made out to the individual. There was no follow-up in how these were used, so hey! Spending money!

    I knew that CheaterX thought this was a really smart idea. I also knew by this time that he was cheating. I asked him his motivation for returning to school at age 55 to get a masters degree that would qualify him for the position he already held. He looked at me and told me that if he wanted to earn figures a year, he needed that Master of Science in Management.

    At that time, he was making nearly that amount anyway.

    Then he enrolled in a doctoral program, though he’s not finished that.

    When I moved out of the marital home two years ago, he’d spent close to $100K to boost his income by about $6K

    Smart, very smart. 😉

  • “Stupid Cheater Life Plans are escapism dressed up as adult-ing.

    First year we wer married he wanted to sell pot.
    Then it was realestate. He went for classes and quit at least 5times;I lost count
    He wanted investment property and he forced me into bankruptcy.
    He wanted to be a drummer invested thousands into being a basement rock star. He invested thousands into antique junk cars.
    The last year he wanted to buy a company that made…9-10 thousand a year for well over that price.
    Wannnnna beee….
    As far as I can calculate he went at least 45000 into debt since he hooked up with the addict.

  • My ex was stable during the marriage, but as it ended claimed he never wanted to be a professor nor get a graduate degree in his field. Really? News to me.
    So he quit his tenured position and moved away with OWife and new baby (less than 6 months post divorce) and got his “dream” job working for an NGO (same field, just different industry!). That lasted 8 months. Then he quit to take a federal job doing the same thing…. after 2 years he quit again and has now started his own NGO. But now he is hustling for contracts and had to give up a contract so our youngest can visit for spring break (I told him, do not make child feel badly about it– child ALWAYS goes for spring break, it is understood).

    Grass is always greener. The absolute irony is that he was the golden boy at his university- his department bought him out many classes so he only taught 2-3 classes per year. It was a very cushy gig, and he barely worked. But he was bored.

  • If I was going to critique myself for the worst trait I had and ended up having to change so that I could have a better life, it would be that I looked at people and saw their potential. I didn’t accept who they were, and I didn’t judge them for who they were when I met them. I always saw who they could be. Even when I looked in the mirror, I saw who I could be.

    Now, I am not saying having dreams and ambition are bad things. It is great for a teacher to see potential in her students, and to facilitate personal growth in those students by establishing a plan and constantly evaluating the plan to see if it is working. Parents do that for their children. But I finally learned my lesson — I could see all the potential in the world in my husbands — but my dream for them, or even if I believed in what they told me their dream was, and tried to help, — was never going to work. I believed in what I “saw in the future”, and ignored crucial reality in the present. I have been told I am too conservative, and I do not see the “Big Picture.” I have been told that by no longer supporting “his dream” I killed the marriage. I am a bit conservative — I believe in living within my means, and paying my bills on time, and working for the money which affords me to do those things. I believe in doing without things I may want, in order to eventually get things I believe I need, like a home to live in and a new(er) car every now and again. I believe we need to have decent food to eat, and I believe we need a decent education. None of those things are “innovative” or “cutting edge” and I am not “sophisticated” or “suave”. But I have good credit, own a home, drive a late model car, have a college education and my son’s had dental and doctor care growing up and graduated from college, and are working and paying their own bills. Maybe my “Big Picture” did not involve miraculous riches or fame. Maybe my dream was to have a reasonable life.

    Because I did try to support my husband’s dreams, for awhile, I was not able to put back as much for retirement, or pay off the mortgage on my home. These decisions will have a negative effect on the way I am able to live when I do retire, because I will have less income to spend on other things. If my husbands had shared my dream, we would have had two retirement incomes, and would have been able to afford a more affluent lifestyle when we retired. If I had followed their example — none of us would have anything, and my children may have learned a very different life and work ethic.

    It’s the old story of the Grasshopper and the Ant. Was the grasshopper frivolous for dancing the summer away while the ant worked and stored food for the winter? Was the ant mean for denying the grasshopper food, and advising him to try dancing the winter away, too? Was the ant compelled to feed the grasshopper when the ant did all the work? I think not. There is a difference in showing compassion to someone who has fallen on hard times through no fault of their own, and in allowing a person who refuses to do their share to live off the sweat of your brow. Our cheaters were dancing Grasshoppers. We were worker Ants. Maybe the ant should learn to dance, every now and then, but that food and shelter is certainly appreciated when the cold winter winds blow!!!

    • Portia: “There is a difference in showing compassion to someone who has fallen on hard times through no fault of their own, and in allowing a person who refuses to do their share to live off the sweat of your brow. ”

      A few months after my kids and I moved in with covert narc ex bf and his 2 kids, I had a rude wake up call. Ex was a butcher at a local grocery store. Everyone there was, according to him “a chump” (funny now, that he used that word a lot), lazy, unappreciative of his hard work, etc. His boss was an idiot, didn’t know how to manage people, ex thought he (ex) was the best thing since sliced bread.
      I honestly don’t know how he got any work done at all considering he texted me every hour on the hour and delighted in “pooping on company time”.

      During hunting season, where we lived, he cut deer on the side. The side business had been started by his father, also a butcher, using his fathers heated garage, freezer, sausage machine, shrink wrap, knives, etc.

      I can look back, now, and realize how ex was grooming me in the lead up to deer season. He would tell me things like, “you know, when I start cutting in November, you won’t see me very much… I might even have to spend my nights out at the folks….” which panicked me – the thought of living without him for one whole day! which cued me to promise to “help him, I always wanted to learn to cut and process deer, the kids can help”!

      Then as it got closer, we were over at his parents and his mother stated that she wasn’t going to deal with the same crap between ex and his father. I questioned this. Apparently, every year they fought over who would go and buy the supplies, the prices they would charge, and how the work would be divvied up. It became apparent quickly, that ex was abusing the priviledge of cutting at his parents house. He didn’t pay them back their fair share, they asked for some money towards electricity, he ignored them. If customers paid ex instead of his dad, he didn’t tell them. So, in general, he was a shit.

      At the end of last year, his father had stated to them that he was getting too old to cut deer, it was hurting his body and he wanted to hand it over to ex. Ex was giddy at the thought of all the money he would be getting for himself (esp. that it was under the table.) This was all he talked about. Then his father decided he would “help” again this year and wanted to split the profits 50/50. This sent ex into a week long rage where he screamed at his father that he was stealing ex’s money by expecting him to split the profits, that his father was a shitty butcher and ex was better than him. Total drama. His parents were enraged that ex insulted his fathers butchering skills (I mean the father DID teach ex the trade!). So they told ex to setup his own shop at our house, buy all his own stuff, and see how well he did.

      What happened? Chumpy me was left to price out all of the equipment (his dad owned everything). Figure out how to process all the deer and store the meat until customers picked up. We lived in town, so it would have been pretty hard to hide the “under the table business”. Conclusion: ex was not willing to fork over all the money needed to start up. So he needed to apologize to his father.

      One night (before the apology), ex was on the phone with his mother. Ex to his mother: Oh, poor him, he just sees everyone around him with everything nicer than what he has – bigger houses, better trucks, pools, etc. He just wants better for himself. He just wants to move out of this stinking town. (This was total news to me.) He just wants all the money to himself so he can better himself. Wah, wah, wah.

      End result: He apologized to his father. His mother and I took over the bookkeeping to keep it fair. He would carve the front half of the deer. His father the back half. I processed everything. Ex would be finished his portion of the work in about 30 minutes. Then he was off to the house visit with his mother and drink beer and annoy the children, while his Dad and I stayed in the garage processing (2 more hours work) the sausages, shrink wrapping, boxing and labelling everything. I would finish by washing all the tables, knives, equipment etc. His father and I carried the whole operation. Occasionally, the kids would come in and help shrink wrap. Kids got paid. Me? Nada. I felt too embarrassed to ask for money. Ex kept saying the money he made would pay off his bills which would benefit me by freeing up money for the whole house. We could buy a boat! We could buy a trailer!

      “a person who refuses to do their share to live off the sweat of your brow. ” Did he do his fair share? Nope. Did he care that he upset everyone with his temper tantrums and entitlement? Nope. Did the money he make ever improve my life or the kids life in any way? Nope.

      Found out from his ex wife after we broke up that he pulled the same shit with her. She did the same work with the deer that I did, but once he stopped cutting and tried to go visit with his mommy, leaving her and his dad all the work, she would just wash up and hop in the car and drive home without him. She said she got tired of arguing with a brick wall. I love that image in my head of her driving away, him eating dust, all “WTF? Where is she going?”, head cocked to the side. I should have done that.

  • When I was still married (at the end) she wanted a 5k King Size bedroom set (that was her fantasy). Seven days after she moved out her cheater boyfriend gave her the bed by purchasing it on his credit cards.

    She wanted me to borrow the money to buy it to. Glad I said NOOOOO. I suspected something was up.

  • This is a great Friday challenge, I have really enjoyed reading all the nonsense and I feel for all of us who have had to experience this “disordered mindfuckery”, we certainly don’t deserve it. I cannot add much to the fantastic tales already posted other then to say I too was chumped (as were our kids) for decades indulging ex crazy ideals where in the end, on DDay4 we were just discarded and abandoned for schmoopie and his need to find his “happy”. We are strictly NC, so I think we all know the rest of the story…Lets all go be Mighty!!!

  • She changed careers/occupations/positions like it was her job.
    Roofer to pizza delivery person to electrician (non-union to union) to nursing (psych to home health care to hospice to management) to manager of a health food co-op. While in a relationship with her, I never stopped to consider what it meant about her personality that she was able to walk away from so many jobs and so many co-workers without any remorse. It wasn’t until she announced– after 16 years, $40K in student loan debt, and an adopted daughter– that she’d found someone else and was now done with us that I started to think about how much practice she had at walking away from people. I’ll give her credit for not being a cake-eater, but I won’t give her credit for much else.

  • My x fiancé blindsided me with a “I can’t do this anymore” after 8 years together engaged for two years with a wedding that was suppose to happen this year. He is having an affair with a 28 year old married woman mother of two toddlers. He never had children. I have 2 grown from previous marriages . We are 56 and both own our own homes. However. I spent 90% of my time living at his home. 2 1/2 years ago we bought a BMW together where I invested $5k and he paid the car off aprox $21k. The car was purchased 2 days before my bday where my x said this is your bday gift! I was elated and had him take pictures of me in front of the car at the dealership. I posted the pics on Facebook and shared with everyone. “I love, love, love my fiancé and I love, love my bday present.” Fast forward to where we are now. He is wanting to talk about the car he said it was never a bday gift and he wants me to buy the car from him or he will give me $5k. I believe the bday gift is that a gift. I have not responded to his last 4 text messages. I’m wondering if I should try to talk to him or continue to let it ride out. When he broke up with me I was unaware of his new flame and he was not kind with his words or gentle when he left. I thought he was the love of my life and I told him so during the breakup. He said “your not mine” “ I will never call you again” etc. so here I am trying to move on and still stuck. We both ate on the title of the car. Your thoughts? Thank you in advance. Your advice andvsite have been very healing and truer words have never been spoken. Georgia

    • Georgia, I am sorry he did this to you and of course it hurts and sucks. But, if you didn’t live together and aren’t married, each have your own home, it sounds like the car is the only tie you still have. That’s a blessing. Let it go!!! A few thousands dollars and your birthday present, and what it meant to you (believe me, I get it!) is a small price to pay to escape this disorder. Run far and run fast, don’t look back. It sounds to me like a lucky escape you didn’t get married. (((Georgia)))

      • You’re right that a gift is a gift; however, just think of what a cruel person he is. What kind of a disordered person even THINKS of asking for the return of a gift???

        If you really love the nice car, keep the car and tell him to pound sand.

        If you want to wipe the last stains of his mud off your life, take the 5K and go buy yourself a really nice car with no such mess attached.

        • My ex asked for a necklace back, that he gave me after a breakup. I love all things dragonfly. We had broken up 3 x all due to relationship crimes on his end. When we had broken up the last time, I asked him if he felt loved by me. “Of course”, he replied. “Well, I don’t”, I said. Normally, I am not a material person, but I had waaaay over-invested and had given a lot during the relationship, and it was blatantly unequal.

          ME: “What have you ever given me, to show me that you love me?”
          HIM: “Well, I bought you that sub that one time…”
          ME SCREAMING: “THAT SUB! From subway! The one made the way YOU like, bought with the 2-for-1 coupons we got in the mail? That’s it? That’s all you can think of? (I didn’t bring up the dishwasher pods he bought me for xmas, that was still a sore spot)”

          Yeah. So I told him to prove that he loves me (sadly shaking my head as I write this, that I even had to say this to him) he had to buy me a gift and it has to be a surprise.
          HIM: Well, what do you want?
          ME: We have dated long enough, and if I am the love of your life – you should be able to come up with something. If I have to tell you, then it’s not a surprise.”

          A few weeks later, a dragonfly necklace. Pretty cheap from what I could tell, couldn’t get it wet for fear it would fall apart.

          Then he commits another relationship crime. He says it’s because he’s not sure I’m 100% invested in him. I’ve already left him 3 x. Calls me demanding I return said necklace.

          ME: So you need a guaranteed “return on your investment” before you can be in love with me? Really?
          HIM: I want my necklace back.
          ME: (EXPLEXITIVE)

          Next morning he drives to my house to get his necklace back. I looked at him for a long moment. Debating the dramatic *rip the necklace off and throw it in the bushes for effect*, but I just wanted the asshole gone. Took it off. Gave it to him. Turned around and walked away.

          We get back together a couple weeks later.
          ME: Where is my necklace?
          HIM: I kept it on my rearview mirror in my truck for a while, hoping you would come around, but then you didn’t, so I returned it.
          ME: But I had the box, how did you return it without a box?
          HIM: Uh (shrug), I just did.

    • Hi Georgia, I suggest keeping the car, and IGNORING his requests (actually, block him everywhere!). IF he gets a lawyer and starts legal proceedings against you or takes you to small claims court, and IF you briefly consult a lawyer and your lawyer says it’s not worth fighting, then and only then, offer to sell the car and you each get half, since you are both on the title.

      I’m betting he’s too lazy to actually do anything about this car, so enjoy it to the max! It was a gift, after all.

      • Well could it get any worse. My insurance agent felt I should have my 2.5 carat diamond engagement ring appraised. The jeweler said wow that’s a very brilliant diamond. Let’s see what we got. She cane back and said “the good news is it’s set in platinum and the diamonds surrounding the band and the center stone are real. The center Stine is a man made stone”. He played this ring off as if he had spent $$$$. The jeweler said it would be worth $2500.00. Once again, I am beyond hurt. WTH. Who does this kind of stuff.

    • Since his name is on the title, he might have legal rights to half the current value, but don’t accept $5k and just go away. You might consult a lawyer to learn your rights.

  • Mine was a musician. Except he never really contributed anything financially with this so-called profession (Before you freak, I support the arts. I have lots of friends who are well paid musicians and others who work full time AND play music). He. Was. Not. Either.

    First, he was gonna make a living teaching music. But, there weren’t any students. Then, he talked my mother into buying him $6000 worth of tools and equipment so he could make his fortune by making guitars. Except, he never made a single guitar. And he sold each piece of equipment on CraigsList but didn’t reimburse my mother. One. By. One. Gone.

    Didn’t hold a full time (or part time) job for 8 years because it “was just too difficult to work AND find time to practice”. Plus, he “can’t work on weekends because, well, gigs.” Um. No.

    $11K behind in child support for 3 kids before I showed up and now he hasn’t paid a penny to me since he moved out 8 months ago to help support our child. He seems to have lots of time to date though. Yep, that dating and fuckery and absent fatherhood must not interfere with gigs. Sigh.

  • My idiot did the real estate bit for a while. But was not paid as he was in training – lucky i was working and keeping the family. Then he bought a beautiful work ute new with all shiny tools. Invested in logo and bright uniform. He would go out as a handyman each day. He was not handy. Meet men in public toilets. I was paying for everything. Working 12 hr days at times. He would ‘work’ while the kids were at school. He averaged $40 a day. I was bringing in close to $2,000 a week. I was killing myself “as he was so unhappy”. At night he would put pillows down the middle of the bed so i did not touch him or disturb him during the night. Turns out