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3 Chumped Women Expose Army Lt. Col. with Double Life

Kane Mansir
Photo from LinkedIn

Several alert chumps sent me the story this weekend of serial-cheater Army Lieutinent Colonel Richard Kane Mansir and his double life.

Three chumped women  — his wife and two unwitting OW — banded together to take Mansir down and now the army is investigating.

That part of the story is amazing — the pluck and tenacity of these women, one of them 9 months pregnant! — the existence of a sociopathic cheater, not so much. Crazy Secret Life! headlines the Daily Beast story by Emily Shugerman.

I’ve been reading my blog for too long. The crazy is far too common. Dirty John? Shrug. This guy? Another freak who thought he was impervious to consequences. Until he wasn’t. Which is the sweet part.

The Daily Beast reports:

Chelsea Curnutt didn’t plan to spend the day before her baby was due driving 16 hours to bang on the door of her fiancé’s parents’ house, but there she was.

Nineteen months earlier, she’d started Instagram messaging with Richard Kane Mansir, a lieutenant colonel in the U.S. Army whom everyone called Kane. He was 10 years her senior, had two sons from a previous marriage, and lived 600 miles away, but she didn’t mind. He was smart and funny, and they talked easily. He liked shooting and skydiving; she loved the first and always wanted to try the latter. They met in person for the first time in December 2019, when she was driving home from vacation and offered to meet him at his post in Fort Bragg. They’d talked every day since. At the beginning of 2020, when he told her he was being relocated to Virginia, she volunteered to move with him. In October, she found out she was pregnant with their first child.

But now it was June 7, the day before their baby was due, and Curnutt hadn’t been able to reach Mansir in more than 48 hours. So she packed up her belongings, waddled out to the car, and set off to find him.

Of course, Chelsea’s not the only one.

Another woman, whom we’ll call Jessica because she did not want her name used, told The Daily Beast she was engaged to Mansir in 2017, while his wife was pregnant with their third child. The pair went on several trips together—including with one of his coworkers—and he’d even met her parents, but she says she had no idea about his wife and family at home.

How does Col. Douchebag juggle all this? He suddenly “deploys” when anything is required of him. He also invented stories of PTSD and a dead child. And fakes his divorce papers. A real charmer.

When confronted with anything suspicious, he mindfucks. Because, of course.

“He did his typical thing of belittling me, making me feel like I’m the crazy one, and then [saying,] ‘I love you, everything will be fine, don’t overthink it,’” [Chelsea] said.

Mansir had a way of doing that, she said: Making her feel like she was the crazy one. When she was pregnant, he’d often blame her suspicions on her hormones, saying they were making her paranoid. She’d been cheated on in past relationships, she said, and figured she was just hypersensitive.

So poor Chelsea, about to give birth, hasn’t heard from Mansir in days, calls the Army base.

 A secretary there passed her to the sergeant major, who called her by the name she thought belonged to Mansir’s ex-wife. When she told the sergeant her baby was due any day and she needed to see him urgently, he responded: “Ma’am, Kane is on leave.”

So Chelsea calls his wife.

“I was like, ‘Listen, I know you probably don’t like me because I’m the new person in his life, but I’m calling you out of desperation because I haven’t been able to find Kane,’” she recalled. “And she goes, ‘Chelsea, we’re still married.’”

The wife tells her that they actually have a divorce hearing the NEXT DAY in Illinois — so Chelsea (about to give birth) drives 16 hours to Illinois to confront Mansir. Who is hiding at his parents’ home. Okay, she may have threatened to burn the motherfucker down if he didn’t come outside.

According to a police report from that night, Mansir’s father told a dispatcher that Curnutt parked outside of the house and threatened to burn it down if his son didn’t come outside. (Curnutt denies this.) She told an officer who arrived on the scene that she was 40 weeks pregnant with Mansir’s baby, and provided photos of them together and a lease agreement with their names on it. When the officer interviewed Mansir, he said he had no idea who Curnutt was and that she was probably stalking him—a scenario that seemed “impossible,” the officer wrote, given the information Curnutt had provided. The officer let her go.

But that’s not all. Chelsea also shows up in court and testifies for the wife in support of her getting full custody.

Then, the three women — Jessica, Chelsea, and the now-ex-wife, banded together comparing phone charges and credit card receipts and identifed four more women. The Army is now investigating because Mansir preyed on subordinates and recent military widows.

Hats off to Chelsea, Jessica, and the unnamed ex-wife for not eating the shit sandwich and allowing Mansir to walk. They didn’t internalize it, or blame themselves, or buy a $400 course on how to win back a fuckwit — they exposed him.

The Beast reports:

She also thinks, in some way, that what happened to her was fated. She isn’t like many of the other women, with their livelihoods dependent on keeping Mansir’s secret. She has family, a career, and a life of her own. She can expose his lies in public because she has nothing to lose.

“I think what I went through, I went through for a reason, because I was going to be the one to speak up,” she said.

“He’s been getting away with it for over a decade,” she added. “Your time is up.”

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at [email protected]. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • Although this is obviously one of the bigger and worst examples, on some level all of our FWs are this sociopath asshat. They all do whatever they want and lie and gaslight to make us crazy and feed their egos. So happy this ass was finally caught. Those women are superheroes and I hope they can all move past the trauma of this and live their best lives. And may Army Col dickhead end his days in prison. I only fear that his retirement and earnings will be taken away from the wife and children that deserve it.

    • Yes! This is so true.

      He comes across as a total freak, but our cheaters are freakish, too. All of them use people for their pleasure and think they can get away with it. When they get caught, they choose from a smorgasbord of reactions: gaslighting, blameshifting, faux apologies, rage, DARVO–whatever sticks to the fridge. That said, I doubt any of our cheaters (well, at least mine) would see ANY similarities between this story of cheating and his own. Fools fool themselves.

      No doubt Kane will justify the beejezus out of his behavior and his parents will stand with him.

      It’s a story we know too well.

      Hats off to these women for banding together.

      • Michelle and Spinach, you nailed it. In terms of character, all FWs are alike…any difference is just a matter of degree. A few lie, gaslight and blame “only” for sexual matter, but most do it for everything. They are disordered individuals who hurt the people who love and trust them, and their response to our agony ranges from indifference to evil delight. Mine would harshly judge this cheater and see no similarity to himself. It is mind-boggling for us normal people.

        • I truly can’t grasp this. Even though I’m 2 years divorced and several years out from DD 1(of how many?) I’m always wondering how much “stuff” was there and how is it even possible to pull off??? As a human being, it’s hard to accept that people really do suck to this degree. I’ll struggle with that until the day I die.

          • I have struggled with understanding just how he could have hidden so much for so long. Some had to know, but I know a lot of folks didn’t, and I obviously didn’t for a long time.

            I mean just two years before Dday, we were working together in the community, working together for a political party. Boating, going to church, having great sex and often; yet he had been committing adultery for at least ten years of our 20 year marriage. How, did he do it? What caused it to all fall apart at once, when he had hidden it for so many years. I think I know the answer to that, he was outed by someone who was pissed at him I am sure, or maybe the last whore was pushing for marriage. But, I really think someone dropped a dime tot he city counsel and it all started falling apart.

            I have to assume that some folks do it for a life time of marriage, since he pulled it off for a decade or more.

            • I think of it a little like murder … there’s no number of murders that are ok.

              Some FWs “murder” one or 2 … while this Army fuckhead is more like a “mass murderer.”

              Either way… all of these FWs are sick in the head. It takes a special level of fucked-up to be so cold and heartless to lie and gaslight and fuck up the lives of your trusting partner and children. Whether it’s one family or many — they all suck and they are all sick.

              But I hope this Army creep is charged as a criminal. If only all of them could be.

              • When I was in the Army JAG Corps (which I joined since the DOCTOR owed the Army for school), I did legal assistance for awhile.

                There, I represented a woman who was married to an Army policeman.

                They had a son who was going blind and required a lot of medical care, which was her main concern and priority.

                She came to see me because she heard her husband, to whom she was very much still married, was engaged to a fellow soldier who was pregnant with his child. She was still in love with the idiot, but she was resolute about doing right by their child.

                WHILE I was interviewing the wife, my paralegal called me to say “a pregnant soldier is here to see you about her fiancee – because she’s afraid he’s still married.”

                I referred the pregnant OW to another lawyer due to a “scheduling conflict”…(OMG!)

                The policeman soldier was returning from overseas where he was rumored to have impregnated a local there.

                HE came to see me and again I had to refer him to another lawyer (& we were running out of legal assistance lawyers).

                He looked cute in a trashy way with tacky “undercover” clothing (right out of the Godfather).

                He was actually a bigamist and the Army did not hesitate to punish him.

                Unfortunately when he got discharged, the wife and vision impaired son lost their health care. I don’t know what the solution should have been but that always bothered me.

              • Reply to DOCTOR’s1stwife

                THANK YOU for serving Soldiers in a way they often need very much.

                It’s a pity fuckwit and his married howorker will likely never be punished under the UCMJ – my kids could lose their insurance and education benefits, not to mention a bunch in support. Howorker’s Chump has been awfully considerate in not exposing the cheaters, even though he stands to lose very little himself. There are some very good men, husbands, and fathers serving our country too ❤️ and women like DOCTOR’s1stWife.

  • I am so sorry that all of them were hoodwinked by that asshole and SO GLAD they banded together to bring the FW down.

  • Investigate, yeah, riiiight! Why spend more taxpayers’ money. All the info is in the court records.

  • And Mansir will soon have another victim on his hook!
    These people are sick.

    • OMG! The photo of him in the Army Times story! Holding a big cake! Did ChumpLady photoshop that? Just too perfect. ????

      • The cake looks less pastel pink than blood and guts. Perfect metaphor for FW cake eating, like something out of the Santa Clarita Diet.

  • Wasn’t he at his parents house with yet another woman too? The same one seen running with him in a couple races that Chelsea had questioned and Kane had brushed off lol.

    • Yes, that is what was reported. That takes chutzpah. And his parents! Wow.

      • My sentiments too! You know, I have a son (as many of us here do), and I would protect him with my life.

        But I would never allow him to parade different women around my home with some ridiculous fabricated story.

        If you’re a parent, you KNOW when your kid is lying. They knew because they raised that sociopath. They just didn’t care. Shame on them. I hope they don’t get the privilege of being in their grandchildren’s lives.

        • “If you’re a parent, you KNOW when your kid is lying. They knew because they raised that sociopath. They just didn’t care. Shame on them”

          This is my in-laws. They knew when my stbx was lying and having affairs, they could sense his unhappiness in everything and they saw the devaluing. I hate them all even more now because it seems like they all covered for him. When I finally figured out an affair his mom said “you have to stay for the children.” Right, and end up like her?! She looks 100 due to the stress of living with a covert narc. Like father like son.

          They also used to tell me I was stuck with him bc I married him, and how happy they were he got married and he could be my problem. He’s now been spending a great deal of time at home with them, they raised the devil they can have him.

      • Possible that he was manipulating mom and dad too. If he’s following the FW/psycho playbook, he probably told his parents what a long suffering victim he was in his horrible marriage and how badly his wife had been treating him. The visit with his new schmoopie was probably part of his “I’m so much better now that the divorce is almost final” story. Whoever she was, she was probably more palatable than poor pregnant Chelsea raging in the car outside (obviously a “crazy” person and not replacement daughter in law material). Plus, he had clearly been involved with Chelsea some time before the divorce (awkward!). That was their grandchild… really makes me think his parents were getting played too.

        I LOVE that Chelsea appeared at the divorce hearing. That’s 100% badass.

        • I agree, master manipulators.
          The poor parents probably don’t know which way is up when it comes to their son.

      • Yes, the parents enabling his cheating and the dad’s obvious lie about the pregnant woman’s threats (one day from giving birth, I doubt she could even stand the smell of gasoline or kerosene) makes me think of the term “repetition compulsion.” Dad is no doubt a big cheater/ab.user/gaslighter and sonny boy must carry on the tradition to show loyalty. Abusive parents make themselves like gods in the eyes of children who internalize the abuse. That’s kind of the point of abuse– to hijack god-like status within the family. According to one dv researcher, some adult abusers are so terrified of their own abusers from childhood that even after their own abuser *dies*, the adult child continues to lie for and cover-up for the past abuser. Fear-driven fealty to the omniscient abuser-god beyond the grave seems to be the mark of serial freaks.

        The fact that this FW’s mother went along with it is creepy but not surprising. I know from my time as a dv advocate that there is a very odd breed of women who will heatedly defend their own abusers and defend their sons when their sons start to repeat the patterns. It’s certainly not all victims, even the ones who haven’t yet escaped, but it’s a certain type. I learned not to discuss my work in advocacy at random because of the risk of automatically setting off that rage/hysterical fealty reaction among victims who’d internalized abuse to that degree. I was all filled with the do-goodery spirit and tried to rescue people I’d come across when I first started working for this advocacy service but soon got over it. To quote something from the series Downton Abbey, “Never make an enemy by accident.”

  • I swear they all have the same play book. Guess they are to busy with cake to be original. This so sounds like my ex.. dead child PTSD that I was to blame for . oops. I thought I was divorced when I met you. No that isn’t my picture on craigs list looking to hook up with a guy and by the way I’m bisexual didn’t I tell you and it’s because I’m a twin. Who can make this stuff up??? When I think of it…living inside their heads has to hurt. I can’t remember what I had for dinner last night let alone which wife OW house life they should be with. Gotta give them credit for that. I just give a big sigh of relief it’s over and he is gone. Bless the OW for putting up with that shit…but then again they kinda deserve each other since they both cheated and lied. Thanks chumps. We are an amazing group

    • I remember so many times out shopping with klootzak or making reservations when asked for his phone number and he stood there blankly trying to remember his phone number to give when asked. He would laugh and say, “I never call myself so I never remember it!” Really!?! Because you have to put your phone number on things all the time and you have had it for years. It turns out he had another phone he was using for all his OW and he would blank out trying to remember which number was the “correct” one to give. It’s the only detail he consistently stumbled over. When D-day 1 hit, I was crying to my SIL – who thought klootzak was an a-hole until she became a flying monkey – and she suddenly went “OMG!” She had a stack of bills from the other phone carrier. He told her he was having the bills sent to her house to keep his residency established in his home state. She just trusted him and didn’t ask questions. She sent them all to me in a big manila envelope. Because she had never opened them, she didn’t know they were for a different phone number. These FWs take advantage of everybody. No so-called friend or family member is immune. They will burn a bridge with everyone they have ever known just to get more kibbles with the AP of the moment.

    • My ex said he was 2 years younger than his drivers license so he was only 8 years older than me, not 10. He said his parents had lied about his age when he started school in the US because they didn’t want him to repeat the years he’d completed in Europe, I believed it because his sister had confirmed they’d lived overseas. I never thought to ask her what year he was actually born. I never thought he was lying. I found out the truth when his ex wife and I connected during my divorce and she told me about the ridiculous 40th birthday bash he’d thrown for himself. Sick indeed.

  • I want to know what the Army’s response will be. I suspect it won’t be much. They seem to breed this kind of crap.

    In the meantime, I wish more women had Chelsea’s obvious sense of morality.
    Unlike my FW’s AP, she didn’t knowingly, maliciously, and gleefully mess with a married man. She was duped, and she fought back. Hard.

    All Hail Chelsea and her Cadre of Mighty Chumps!

    • “Unlike my FW’s AP, she didn’t knowingly, maliciously, and gleefully mess with a married man.”

      Right. It’s only the APs who know the person is married or otherwise in committed relationships who deserve our opprobrium.

      It continues to amaze me that my ex thinks his “twu luv” walks on water even though she willingly slept in my bed with him. She saw my books and other crap on the bedside table. She probably touched my alarm clock. She probably used my shampoo. She saw photos of our kids while fucking their dad. What kind of sicko can do this?

      Of course, my ex deserves the most blame. But I do marvel at this woman and how my ex can view her so positively. Likewise, he slept in her marital bad and probably used her husband’s shampoo. WTF?? No shame? And my ex ALWAYS acted like he was on a moral high horse. Always!

      They DO deserve each other. Both suck!

      • “And my ex ALWAYS acted like he was on a moral high horse.”

        According to my daughter, my ex and the OW still do. They actually have the audacity to judge other people as morally inferior according to the way they dress, what they drive, what they do for a living, and their ethnicity, to name a few. Here’s just the latest example:

        They’re going to dinner at a restaurant where they walk past some gardeners. Once they’re seated, the OW says, “Did you see all those Mexicans? They’re the chihuahuas, and we’re the golden retrievers.”

        I don’t even know where to begin with that. I don’t know how to process that kind of sociopathic hypocrisy from a woman who fucked my husband in our bed.

        Not to mention – the man I was married to for 17 years was supposedly a die-hard progressive who disdained any kind of prejudice. A pretense of that sort is mind-blowing.

        • ChumpQueen, same with my ex-cheater and his cheater wife. My ex has family money that I was never interested in parading about; we lived modestly. Now? They live in an embarrassingly giant, fancy house where they are currently installing a toilet in the pool house; the house I live in only has one bathroom! I wouldn’t care if they also didn’t act as though they were superior to everyone else. They are cheaters, and he doesn’t see our kids anymore, but because they have money, they think they’re better than everyone else when they are rotten to the core.

        • FW was a lifelong democratic socialist and we lived in a very blue state where right-wing evangelicals are thin on the ground. So how in the world he managed to find three evangelical office floozies in a row (two bailed out and wouldn’t screw him, the last one was the porn-reenactment jackpot) from heavily Trumpian tradcon families is a bit of a mystery. Even his suckuppy lesbian “work wife” and affair “beard” grew up in a mega right-wing household and called FW “captain” (gag) as tradcon wives often do.

          It was so strange that the only explanation I could come up with was a Freudian one and I’m not typically a Freud fan: FW’s mother had grown up in an extremely right-wing family. Though she did the PickMe thing of melding her politics to FW’s lefty dad (until she realized he wasn’t going to be rich and famous as hoped, then threw him to the curb), she worked in an NGO capacity where she’d frequently serve under these major neolib political figures and bragged about getting crushes on them (all of them married), as if this was a testament to her dedication to her work. For the long years I endured being around her, you never really knew what you’d get as far as her political take. One second she’d be defending Fidel Castro, the next she’d be spouting antisemitism and blaming the Versailles treaty for causing the Holocaust. One second she’d be lauding women for going topless in NYC as if this was the ultimate expression of feminism, the next she’d be lobbing misogynist hand grenades at me. There was no “there there” as CL put it.

          God, I hated that woman and am so glad she’s been exorcised. I work in environmental health advocacy alongside right-wing and left-wing and everything in between. We all manage to get along and agree to disagree. There’s a way to be what you are in an honorable sense. But someone with NO cohesive principles other than self-interest and status is something else entirely.

          Apparently, in order not to make his Shmoops pout and sulk, FW had to completely tone down his past politics when around her to the point that he began spouting all this weird middle-of-the-road drivel and apologism for Trump policies that he formerly and ragingly didn’t agree with. Later after D-Day, I thought it was a bit funny that he’d started the affair being buttered up and flattered by shmoops that he was “the big man in contwol” but, in the end, she was calling every shot, to the point of actually morphing his politics. He was becoming a clown in every sense– a drunken Viagra bunny with a wallet being rolled by Jesusy hookers in an alley.

          I guess in trying to reconcile his splintering and splitting psyche, FW blathered this lukewarm political garbage so much that he did it in front of me (hello? The guy who nagged me to remove jewelry so it wouldn’t incite the poor and downtrodden?) and an old, highly respected friend with whom he’d formerly aligned in a political sense. The old friend is one of those quiet, pleasant people with a vesuvian temper on social justice issues. He tore FW’s head straight off, really ripped into him. FW was so upset he could barely contain the tears and then, as a way to lick his wounds, he FINALLY read the Howard Zinn book that I’d recommended for 15 years. Though this was before D-Day, I remember being glad that someone other than me called FW on his then recently developed inconstancy.

      • Yeah, FWs who don’t hide their married/attached status are basically setting up a reverse version of municipal water filtration systems where only shit and filth come out of the tap and the clean water gets put in barrels in the landfill or sold as fertilizer. Who else is going to knowingly bonk and bilk a married person, particularly one with children? We chumps are usually too blindsided and shocked to see it at first, but adultery is definitely its own punishment.

      • They probably do have shame about it… Deep down. I mean….. they try not to admit it, but would you want to live with the knowledge that you did it with someone in their marital bed whilst photos of their family were on the walls I mean…. you have to live with that for the rest of your life and I think that is very haunting. It’s yucky and gross and they know it, deep down. And they know that other people will think it’s disgusting. That’s why they have to make a real show of their “true love” – here look at the evidence! A fancy house! Togetherness! The big love of my life! It’s “the real deal” and that is why it was fine for me to do it in your marital bed, see?! Actually we kind of HAD to do it in your bed, such was the power of our genuine love. And that’s why it’s so cringeworthy…. The rest of their life becomes a pathetic charade of “true love” acted out so as to provide an excuse for what they did. But deep down I do think they suffer. My ex’s OW said she had nightmares about me (she’s left him now, and when she did, apparently she said “now the nightmares can end!” hahahahahaha I thought that was funny…. me, the big bad wolf, like the whole thing was my idea). Not sure if they did it in my bed… but if they did, that’s their memory to be haunted by. I mean…. when you do stuff like that, you create your own nightmares. Sorry that you had to go through the disgusting experience of your ex doing that to you. It’s sick, honestly, it’s sick. I just like to think that they’re suffering more for it in the long run. 🙂

        • I think you’re projecting your goodness onto them. At least in my case, OW certainly doesn’t have shame. She brags about her new life on Facebook-publicly in her main profile pics – that’s not shame it’s brazen entitlement.

          • You might be right about the projection on my part.

            In the whores case, it has been years since I looked at her Facebook. I opened one to see pics of grandchildren. (I lived far away and they lived near them) I looked at her site, and it was full of memes about Jesus, faith, God how to treat others etc. Oh and my favorite was one of those little stupid computer games you play where it tells you about yourself. Her response to one of them was “whore is the sweetest person you will ever meet, but she can not stand a liar yada yada yada” I doubled over in laughter. Can.not.stand.a.liar; priceless.

            But, I saw it as her feeling shame desperately trying to show folks she is not the low life she appears to be. Maybe as you say, she really looked at herself that way. Who knows.

            My ex had the decency to never open a FB account. He really laid low for most of the rest of his life. Which was a real contrast to how he loved to be around people and he had a very dynamic personality before.

            But, again; who knows.

            • It’s really neither here nor there lol/ but I think the type of people who would feel shame about this wouldn’t do it in the first place. I’m sure there’s exceptions. I’m sure there are a few who blow up their lives, maybe get good therapy and then have regrets and feel shame.
              I’m just not sure how a sense of entitlement coexist with shame in most cheaters and their accomplices. And when they publicly brag about their new life…, I would have to do mental gymnastics to see shame in that. A lot of us chumps gave the FW’s chance to work on themselves and turn this around. We were willing to support the person who gave us a shit sandwich. The ones who write here didn’t end up with that rare type of cheater. They are in their lives maybe feeling shame but really working on their stuff. Making amends. My 2cents.

        • I agree, I do think that all but the totally psychotics have shame. Many just put on that plastic face and barrel through, because they have to survive. Or they think they have to.

          As you said you just can’t wallow around in the marital bed/offices/back seats of cars etc with a whore, or even as a whore and not ever think of it.

          I am convinced that is why once my fw retired (early) he fled the state. He and the whore had to find a place where no one knew, they likely rewrote their whole relationship; at least until their true nasty selves came out again.

          Also, they had blown up their (his) relation ship with our son. Whore never really had a relationship with them. She was nasty to my daughter in law from the get go.

  • Hahaha this sounds sooo familiar. My ex and this COL could be related. My ex is current Army, sexually assaulted a female LT, used his rank to sleep with lower enlisted, told women he wasn’t married to get their #s, told.them he would give them babies (even though he was fixed), had threesomes with military spouses, and even had a girlfriend while we were going through marriage counseling….and even admitted to war crimes. This is just the tip of what he did and what he admitted too. Army did a 15-6 investigation and guess what… nothing happened.

    • TooooooFunny, I hope you are a 20/20/20 spouse. I hope that asshole is down at the VFW whining about how you took everything from him. I hate it that the Army found no fault with his actions. He was judged by other officers just like him. For them to convict him would be to face their own crimes. He sucks and I hate him.

      • I didn’t meet the Python until after he was out of the military, but I wonder if that’s where he learned to perfect the art of conning other women with the “I’m not married” bullshit? These assholes con their wives AND their many girlfriends. I’ve compared notes with some of the Python’s girlfriends (ones he bedded while still married to me). They were completely duped. Just like I was.

    • That’s why I won’t bother reporting. They don’t do anything. The military doesn’t care. I have hard evidence of an ongoing intimate relationship with a foreigner which should threaten his security clearance. The affair went on over 10 years. He sent her photos of himself in his military office. I have copies of his clearance application when he had to renew it. He never disclosed the relationship. There is more even worse.

      He would lie and tell women he was stationed in Germany and only came to the States occasionally when they sent him for training. Lies. He was NEVER stationed in Germany. It seems he lied to them early on but then after D-day #1 when I found out who he really is, then he admittted being married but – boo hoo – his terrible wife. After initially saying how awful I was, I didn’t seem to be a topic of conversation with any of them. Focus after that was just sex and the excitement of keeping me in the dark.

      But yeah, I have evidence that would land him in jail if anyone cared to listen. But why do that and keep him from working and providing support I will need for our son. He is a sick individual. The military is filled with them so they cover each other.

  • I was never able to “band together with my husband’s other women” because the OW in my life were all very complicit people who actively encouraged the affairs. Tellingly, *not one* of those women ever reached out to me. I’ve always told myself ever since that should I ever want to date again (I don’t), I would do some due diligence and reach out to my dating partner’s family, friends, and even his ex-partner to confirm that what he’s telling me is true. I simply cannot trust any man telling me stories about how he and his ex just “drifted apart” when she might be back at home anxiously waiting for him to come back home… because I used to be that wife waiting at home while her H was feathering his nest elsewhere. I never want to do that to another woman.

    I expressed this plan on another forum and was met with skepticism: “You can’t just do that! You can’t reach out to the ex of the person you’re dating!” I think, “Why not?” I’m not in a position where I can trust, sight unseen, the word of a person I really am smitten with; look at where that got me. If a fellow begins to panic because I want to sit down for a coffee and a chat with his supposed ex, then that’s a red flag. I will never be an affair partner if I can help it; I will never do to another woman what the OW (plural) in my life did to me.

    Another response was “No one wants their new love to talk to their ex! You’ll never date if that’s the case.” And, heck, I don’t see any problem with that either. 🙂

    My story didn’t end like this one did but I do appreciate a good story where the other women and the chump band together to compare notes.

    • Don’t let others get you down. The first two women I dated after my divorce were old friends of mine (one I dated in high school and the other was the daughter of one of my mom’s close friends). I knew they were divorced years before mine. But my current wife was an acquaintance of an old ex high school girlfriend of mine. Before I went on our first date I asked for her divorce decree. I also met her ex that same day as he was picking up her youngest son. I showed her mine. This Colonel faked his. I would NEVER date a woman who was separated, filed, or whatever else people use to justify dating while legally married. I wanted a woman free and clear. So do your due diligence. I was married to a diagnosed NPD/BPD so kept my girlfriends away from her because she would have told them I was all these horrible things about me. My wife’s ex was living with a woman and never told me anything bad about his ex.

      • My ex wife lied about her past so I even did a background check on my wife before we went on our first date. Heck, my wife did the same thing to me. I wanted to see if her stories matched up to the known facts.

    • Hmm. Your story just made me realize that my husband met 5 of my ex boyfriends, all on friendly terms – two of them even flew in to visit when my son was born. I’ve only met 1 of his exes and that was in court when he was trying to get his child support decreased. Hindsight… it’s so obvious. Yuck!

      • Exactly! I wouldn’t want to be “friends” with my potential partners, but I would want to meet them and ask a few questions… y’know like “John says that the two of you just drifted apart. Is that true?” If any of my FW’s partners had even thought to ask me something like that they would have seen my eyebrows leave my face.

        Slightly invasive? Yes. But I’m beyond caring at this point. I simply cannot trust a potential partner who presents himself as amazing without getting some third party verification.

        Hindsight is 20/20, yeah. I never had a good talk with any of my FW’s Exs and he actively kept me apart from his last partner. We were out in a park once hanging out with a group of friends (she was “just a friend” of course) and I took opportunity to pull her to the side, alone, to ask her why she and my husband were sending each other pictures of each other in their underwear. She lost all the color in her face and stuttered for awhile and FW swept in quickly to rescue her. He was furious with me for attempting to talk to her without him around. I get cowed by anger quickly, so I didn’t fight it.

        I look back at that now and am furious that he even thought he could be mad at me for attempting to talk to his not so secret girlfriend alone. The gall.

        • Sorry, typo. Meant to say “I wouldn’t want to be “friends” with my potential partners exs”

        • “I look back at that now and am furious that he even thought he could be mad at me for attempting to talk to his not so secret girlfriend alone. The gall.”

          I think that is part of their entitlement. They really believe they are entitled to their “private life” and how dare us question it. That doesn’t of course apply to our privacy, just theirs.

  • I just recently was messaged by a woman who wanted to apologize to me for not letting me know nearly 20 years ago that she had been seeing my ex husband and had ended up pregnant. He had told her he was single and she found out too late he was married and I was pregnant with 3rd child. We were getting ready to move cross country. He convinced her he didn’t want to lose his family blah blah blah She said he offered her $500(right for what) and she never heard from him again. She didn’t want to hurt me and kids she said. So just recently she sees my name in a comment on a public fb page about narcissists and messages me and first I hear that he had fathered another child that’s about to turn 19. Just when I felt I was making progress, his past of apparent double life which he led for decades is coming up and I just don’t know what to think. Kid is definitely his. I think I’m still in shock even though I should not be surprised.

    • I am so sorry. I cannot imagine what you’re feeling right now. (((hugs))) ????

    • Hi ICMEH:

      So sorry you are going through this hell. Just know that everyone here understands what you are feeling and experiencing, and is wishing you the best. Not one damn part of this is easy and none of it is fair. None of us knew what to think at first either: it is like stepping on an IED and having your world explode. The pain at first is overwhelming. But you can survive this and you will eventually be stronger.

    • Wow! what a punch to the gut. Sorry you have to deal with this fresh new hell. Sending you positive vibes…..

    • It’s too bad this woman wasn’t fully in the dark about your ex FW being married. Because, had she been duped as well, she might be viable friend material. But since she knew and did what she did, that’s a deficit and a red flag. Not so much a scarlet letter but a shit-brown one.

      • Hell of a Chump
        That’s what I thought. She knew all this time and she said she felt guilty because she could have saved me all that pain! As Chumperella said it’s like a punch in the gut! She was alleviating her guilt by not telling me previously and while I am trying to heal but out of the blue 2 years divorced and 2k miles away from him(turns out she is living nearby to where I am now and never lived where we had moved to for the 20yrs) here she tells me news that my 5 children have another sibling age of my middle child!!! She doesn’t want anything and her kid is past age for support and no desire to connect with FW. But, here’s a little something to ease her guilt and open up my wounds and pour some salt in it. My ex wouldn’t even care more spreading his seed. More people to harm. And how many more kids are there…it was fun for him!!

  • So on the one hand, hats off to the chumps for going to all the trouble of exposing him (which I agree is ????????), but on the other hand, the everyday ordinary FW gets to move on in all their impression management and blame-shifting and we are to gracefully gain a life – or we will look crazy/bitter. The ordinary FW’s consequence is being a FW. Yet the chump’s consequences are endless and no fault of their own.
    It just doesn’t do much to help change the conversation. And Esther Perel is huge.
    Just venting.
    And as far as labelling these extreme FW’s off the charts – our children have to believe that these people are not the norm or they will never want to couple up.

    • I agree with your venting. What does it matter if a FW abuses his partners in mass or serially? Which is better, a mass murderer or a serial killer? The crime is the same. The fallout is the same.

      • And OW’s going to his parent’s home is great – but we are advised to soldier on quietly, with a dignified strength. IMO gaining a life while smiling publicly, like some famous women have, only serves to reinforce the ‘grew apart’ narrative, and everything will be just fine – a victimless crime. If all the publicly famous chumped people, banded together and told their stories – perhaps famous FW’s would be held more accountable for being a shitty person. Not their job, I get it. They are just trying to get through it.
        Anyhow, it’s shitty that only the disordered high on the spectrum are worthy of public righteous anger and only because there are 3 chumps is it ok to have it go loud.

        • I told people I was cheated on in the beginning. My ex wife launched a WW2 size smear campaign. I have remarried, have a few friends left, and have moved on. My ex is still this bitter, hateful nasty woman. I have been healing and enjoying life. It’s like if you slip and fall down. Do you stay down or do you get up and continue walking?

          • Well, it’s more like your best friend pushes you down…but yes, the point is that you get up, walk away, and keep walking.

          • We definitely continue walking even though we were pushed /we didn’t slip. It just sucks that the average cheater is not exposed. And because the narratives out there tend to favour the cheater…. the masses aren’t aware of what cheating really is and isn’t.
            But yes, I forgot about the whole smear campaign that cheaters can do against the chumps.
            I just wish that cheating was associated in the general public as a lack of integrity, lying, entitlement and abuse.
            Rather than a quest for aliveness, a marriage that wasn’t working, a spouse who is very flawed etc.
            This blog is a sanity saver, however we are preaching to the choir. And thank goodness we have this support… It’s just that we are an isolated community.

            • Yes imo we live in times where individual needs count more than ever, and we’re seeing the consequences of it.

              I’ve become weary of progressists from the big city (although I count myself as one) that are in open relationships and consider you backward thinking if you don’t buy their shit. I mean, I run into these people on dating sites. What are you doing on a dating site if you’re already with someone in the first place?

              And then polyamorosity, the biggest bullshit out there! I’ve come across a few guys proudly announcing their polyamorosity to me, as the perfect excuse to lead me into being one of their responsibilitity-free darlings. I mean, what’s in that for me???

        • Just for the record, I haven’t been quiet or “graceful.” I tell the truth and treat him the way he deserves – like the lying, deceitful, con man he is. It’s great because he doesn’t try to manipulate me with his “nice guy” bullshit anymore. He keeps to himself now and doesn’t dare show up anywhere that I might be. In effect, I’ve forced *him* to go grey rock and no contact. Makes my life infinitely easier….

          • Yes, where he is concerned I have been neither quiet or graceful- to the point where I got the condescending “he’s worried about me.” What I mean is, he and the married 0W both kept their upscale jobs. No consequences.
            Consequences to the two families destroyed, but they went on their merry little way together and who knows what narrative they spun at work.
            It’s not like any of his colleagues reached out to me…a person they knew and supposed really liked. People are busy with their own lives, they don’t really care. Life goes on….. FW’s get the go free card. It just doesn’t satisfy me to know that they are stuck with themselves! They don’t even know who they are so it’s of no consequence to them.

            • Interesting comments, Zip.

              Society scorns the serial cheater–like Kane here–but cheers on the cheater who finds twu luv–a romance novel come alive1

              Yes, this blog is a life saver. Yes, we preach to the choir.

              But I would push back on the “go-free cards.” I don’t know that these cheaters are all happy-go-lucky. Many suffer consequences, such as: loss of adult children and grandchildren and loss of respect from colleagues and friends. Those who deluded themselves into thinking that they could simply replace a spouse with a new person find that it’s not so easy. Not all people will accept a new person. I also think that a lot of these cheaters never realized how much they depended on their spouses for their emotional wellbeing. Without it, they suffer unless the new person can fill in the void.

              • Spinach: I agree. But I don’t think anyone or anything can fill a void so deep as they have.

              • Sorry spinach I don’t think this is true ( well at least not in my case ) there is absolutely NO consequences and he did get a free pass .

                His family ( my ex in laws ) stood by him and as well as him totally abandoned me .
                He’s now got new in laws who by pictures seem to think the sun shines out of them .

                They both kept their jobs . I had to pay him off , he kept the car and savings and now has a bigger house
                We didn’t have children so I’m just invisible to the story

                He just seem to click his fingers and someone said “ oh you don’t want that wife you’ve got ? Ok no problem here is another one and here are some babies for you 2 as well because you deserve it “

                Karmeh – oh her fuck her she doesn’t count
                That’s exactly what happened

                There are NO NOT ONE SINGLE ONE consequences

              • I hear you Spinach, some cheaters have to live with some consequences of their own making.
                However many really don’t -especially the ones who are great at impression management and who have some good qualities about them. And not all cheaters lose their children and grandchildren – not that I’m advocating for that!
                But there are cheaters out there who have been good to their children and lousy to their spouse, and what’s a kid to do! And of course thank God they were at least good to the kids. But it’s just an extra shit sandwich for the chumped partner to have to put up with the 0W or OM. Many don’t lose their friends or family. Many have zero consequences at work even though it was a workplace affair with an underling. Agreed that if they are an empty box they will continue to be an empty box… but I don’t know if that’s a consequence.
                I’m preaching to the choir I know! It’s just these nut jobs like the Dear John’s or this three time loser almost makes the average cheater look decent. I just hope I live to see the day where the narrative changes and people who lie, cheat, devalue and rob their spouses of so much… are exposed for what they are and that their actions are exposed for what their actions are.

              • [email protected], I agree with you – no matter what they really do have consequences even if it is not immediately obvious. I think many of us create our own narrative of the “shiny new life” the cheater is living and don’t see anything but wine and roses. As my children often remind me, their father’s new wife(not an AP as far as I know) is married to him – at best their life looks great on social media – but he didn’t change, in fact he didn’t see a problem with his behavior so he made the conscious decision not to change. On a good day he is a sparkly turd, on a bad day- well psycho-narc doesn’t begin to describe it.

                On other thing that really bothered me in this thread was the notion that a cheater is a good parent. I don’t understand how one can logically label even your garden variety cheater a good parent. You cannot be a lousy spouse and a good parent – the main responsibility of a parent is to model behavior – honorable, decent, healthy behavior that helps children make positive choices on their path to adulthood. Good parents help their children learn how to form strong and healthy relationships – cheaters don’t do that, they do the opposite. Good parents don’t lie, and cheat and hurt the other parent in a calculated manner – that is what cheaters do. Good parents set good examples of how to treat others, particularly those who love them – cheaters don’t do that. Good parents sacrifice for their families- cheaters destroy their families. Good parents don’t spend family resources, time, money, love, emotional attachment on relationships that bring harm to their spouse and children. Good parents do not put their selfish motives – in the case of cheaters – their adolescent happiness ahead of the children. Cheaters do not make good parents.

          • Karmeh and Zip,

            Different cheaters, different outcomes.

            Mine might be whistling a happy tune, but he did lose his kids and grandchild as well as friends, so I assume that must hurt. But I could be wrong.

            I appreciate that other cheaters seem to suffer no consequences. That sucks.

            • They suck. Unfortunately FW in your case, is not the only one who lost – I feel for your kids – and you of course. At least they have you.

          • Chumperella, I agree that Fuckwits are not great parents.
            I was thinking of the ones who are still financially, emotionally and physically involved, and who still have loving and good relationships with their kids. Sometimes these things happen when the children are older, and the older kids simply adore their parent. Having said that a cheating parent always does big damage even if it only comes out years later. And there is no role modelling of integrity and everything else you said.
            But when people say their fuckwit hasn’t changed and has remained a Fuckwit… I just don’t see how that is a consequence.
            Consequences to me is society has let it be known in no uncertain terms that their cheating was not acceptable and therefore they will lose things. Things that are important to them.
            I know some Fuckwits do experience consequences and that’s a good thing.

            • “I was thinking of the ones who are still financially, emotionally and physically involved, and who still have loving and good relationships with their kids.” The financial part I can buy into. Maybe it is because my cheater was an overtly abusive narc my vision is clouded but I have a hard time accepting that the emotional involvement and the good and loving relationships are more that window dressing/image management on the part of the cheater. Mix that with the desperate need on the part of children to see their parents in a positive light (I am 58 and still working through this) and something that looks good on paper emerges. I take it your children adore their dad. My experience has been the opposite, my kids brought me out of the denial I had been living in after and walked away from him first. I guess that explains the difference in our world views.

              As far as changing the World’s view on cheating, it takes time and a whole lot of rebranding on the part of us chumps/women scorned/raging harpies who deserved it – you know what I mean. It seems to be slowly evolving. Unfortunately, cheating has been glorified and excused since the beginning of time…read the stories of the “Great” King David in the bible. There is just a lot of history and tradition to overcome. In the end, I guess we can agree to disagree – I think that being a sparkly turd on a good day and a raging Narc on a bad day (and an ugly/tortured soul on the inside everyday) is a true punishment with or with tangible or legal punishments.

          • How can we distinguish cheating from abuse? I also wonder how many abusers are cheaters. My guess is most. And even the “kindest” cheater – ha! oxymoron – is, by definition, abusive. For most chumps who comment here, the emotional and psychological (and often physical and sexual) abuse that accompanies cheating is severe and occurs for years, if not decades. Even if you do not take this into consideration, cheating means robbing a person of their agency and is the very definition of abuse.

            Cheaters feel entitled to cake without consequences. Many chumps (myself included) are stuck eating shit sandwiches, the role we feel obliged to accept if we want to escape the abuse and have a chance at safety and peace and maybe even happiness. I, too, hope that one day this BOP and cultural narrative will shift, and that with this will come more justice and power for chumps – and more consequences for cheaters.

            • I just read this great article from referencing the New Yorker article about Britney Spears
              ‘A story of abuse, exploitation, gaslighting, emotional trauma, resilience, and power. She finally put her own voice to a narrative that did not belong to her’
              The article mentions the importance of telling our stories, and the debilitating effects of trauma.
              Cheating is abuse because it traumatizes the spouse -and sometimes the children. Trauma has serious consequences for people, it doesn’t just go away easy Peezy. The stories Cheating trauma are yet to be told to the masses, hopefully one day cheating will be shown as more than something funny to laugh about on a sitcom. Hopefully one day it won’t be so socially acceptable. Hopefully one day, people in the public eye who have had to suffer this type of abuse and have had to painstakingly heal from the damage to themselves and their children… can speak honestly about it while they are gaining a life or after having gained a life.
              – So that society will understand the truth about the damage that cheating causes and that there are victims of other’s entitlement.
              Hopefully one day it Will be important for people to consciously raise their children to have integrity and to not make excuses for them when they fail to live by the do on to others as you would have done to yourself rule.

  • LTC (R) Fuckface has company. He isn’t alone in this band of brothers, I mean cheaters. I have harped on Adultery being a part of military culture for years now. Ask General David Petraeus if adultery is part of military culture. They have no honor.

    • And Petraeus is making plenty of money and his chumped wife just keeps eating the sandwiches. Stays quiet like a good little wife. Petraeus was given a pass because guys figured the OW was more attractive than the chump so hey, why not. If he hadn’t given OW access to classified info, he’d be sitting pretty at the Pentagon.

  • Ex was an Air Force Pilot, this story doesn’t surprise me. I remember ex telling me stories of fellow officers having girlfriends in different cities in the states, as well as overseas. These relationships were known to other officers and evidently it’s common and unreported. So much for the military code of conduct.

    I remember a Pilots ex wife telling me she recorded phone conversations between her husband and his AP. On their wedding anniversary he proposed a toast to her, saying how happy he was and he would marry her all over again. She replied, oh, really Ken, and proceeded to play one of his phone conversations with the AP with him telling the AP how much he loved her.

    In 3rd world countries as soon as they land (married) crew members have taxi’s waiting to take them downtown to find a prostitute or two to bring back to their hotel room.
    Not my Ex, he wasn’t like that… (eye roll)

    • Yes, the other guys stories. I got told so many of them pre the year of discard. This guy screwed his girlfriend in his office. This other guy screwed some woman at his family reunion, Glen screwed three women when he was on leave after returning from Vietnam.

      Guess who all those stores were really about.

      Oh and my favorite was at the beginning of the year of discard he told me his direct report, let’s call her Trollup; Trollup is dating a 50 year old married man. (he was 40) so he changed the age to protect the guilty, wasn’t quite ready to kick me out yet, still needed to get me to sign for that river property.

      Oh Trollup had dated several married men before him, but I have no doubt he was confessing. These ass wipes are sick.

      • I also heard so many stories. It wasn’t until the discard I realized they were his stories. I even remember getting upset at him a few times and asking him not to tell me about the sickos he worked with. I didn’t like hearing it.

        In the last year before discard he started telling me about this guy he works with who sleeps with all these really hot women but the mother of his child is ugly. This guy was so upset because with all the models he screws, how did he manage to knock up the only ugly girl he ever slept with?! I hated this story and every time he started it I asked him to stop.

        Eventually after the dozenth or so time he was laughingly telling me this story I ended up screaming at him in the car. I told him his “friend” was a fucking piece of shit and I didn’t ever want to hear that fucking piece of shit misogynist sick fucking pervert’s name again. I didn’t give a flying fuck what the mother of his child looked like, she was good enough for him to lie down with and he should respect his child enough not to go around saying disgusting things about his mother. I called “his friend” a shitty father and a piece of shit human being. And I said the only way attractive women were having sex with him was if he was paying for it.

        He went dead silent. He was so pissed, like shaking with rage. I couldn’t figure out why he was so attached to this dirtbag friend from work. It was all so weird. What did we last after that? A month, maybe two? Took me way too long to realize every offensive story he told me about “some guy” was really about him.

        He’s the friend. I’m the ugly girl he knocked up. And apparently the supermodels he’s having sex with are women who weigh double what I do, have greasy hair and dead eyes, are either covered in bruises or dirty spots, and hold their butt cheeks wide open on the Internet so you can see every single pimple in their butt crack. Somehow I’m not jealous of them.

        • Talk about delusional. Your ex has some serious issues with reality.

        • Yep, I remember him telling me of one of our mutual friends who per his story did some cheating. I remember saying, why would he treat his “wife’s name” like that? I am now convinced this friend never once cheated. In fact this friend and his wife are the only couple who showed me real compassion after Dday. They both came to visit me, and he told me that he talked to fw and told him he was going to regret this. They are still together after all these years.

          That meant a lot to me. A little over a decade later this sweet couple lost their only daughter to Ovarian cancer just before she turned 37.. Breaks my heart to this day, as we spent so much time with them when our kids were young.

        • Your story illustrates what a really disordered person can do when you see behind the mask. He was enjoying devaluing you and duping you at the same time. And your righteous response meant he couldn’t do that again because he knew at some point you would have evidence that he’s the “some guy.”

        • As an aside, how in the world do these skanks post closeups of their ani on social media ?! Dark web ? Inquiring mind wants to know ????

        • Yep, jealousy of his whore was never an issue with me. By any objective standard, I was better inside and out.

          That I had loved someone who could treat me the way he did, that hurt. It embarrassed me that I was married to someone like that. I had been so proud of who I thought he had grown into.

      • Yes, always someone else, she was all over him, then “the other guy”took her back to his room then he’d continue the story with the unnecessary gory details. It’s a sick game they play, watching our reaction of disgust then feeling smug and empowered. In their sick mind they’ve won..

        One of my favorite stories, the drunk girl at the bar who wouldn’t leave ex alone. A bar full of male crew members and a drunk girl zeros in on ex, wouldn’t leave him alone, even after he told her he was married, and told her to stop.., so Brit, if you hear any stories from anyone…, I just want to let you know…, nothing happened.., must have been a good night.

        • Thanks for sharing this Brit. My first dday, about a year and a half into our 20 year marriage I got the…, Chumperella, if you hear any stories of me cheating with ho-worker #1…..I just want you to know it isn’t true and I want you to hear it from me. I always knew that one was a lie, I stayed because we just bought a house and I was literally holding our 10 month old son when he told me. Today’s CL post and comment section has me thinking about all of the “other guy” stories-(palm hits forehead).

  • I often wonder how he financed juggling all these women. But the guy needs a bobbit. I guess my advice is to at least do a credit check or hire a PI to clear your new boy or girl friends. Isn’t the cost cheaper than having to go to court like these women???

    • I did a background check on my now wife before going on a first date. My ex wife lied so much about he past I didn’t trust anyone. My wife told me after we got married she did one on me AND my ex wife. It’s easy and cheap. My other girlfriends were old friends (I knew they were divorced well before mine) and their best friends and others all vouched for them.

  • I don’t believe anything a traitor says unless it can be verified.

    I have no idea what he told the one I knew about, if there were others, what he told them, who knew about whom, what they believed. Trying to assemble a spreadsheet makes me crazy and there is no point in it because there is nothing to recover or repair. It’s sufficient for me to know that he is pond scum, lies to everyone in his orbit, that I was duped, abused, and endangered, and that makes him and anyone else who knew about me and our daughter total losers.

    My heart breaks the most for children who get caught up in this, because trust and safety are so especially necessary for powerless and vulnerable little folks. How dare those selfish AH’s intentionally foist that rotting package onto involved children and use love as wrapping paper.

    I watched Damage with Jeremy Irons again last night. I haven’t seen it since it was released. I see nothing remotely romantic or desirable or attractive about illicit relationships. It’s just sickening and gross and despicable. Insects having sex are light years more romantic than two cheaters banging themselves together. I skipped over the sex scenes while watching the movie because the void where love should be was so glaring and harsh.

    • I still have my spreadsheet. I have means to list every one of the OW for depositions. OK… maybe not ALL of them, but certainly the ones who have info which puts his job and shiny image at risk if it goes public. I don’t look at the spreadsheet but I will use it. He in essence made the list himself. I am preparing the questions that would be asked. I know the pressure points. I’m getting my share of everything before I walk off to meh.

  • Hi ICMEH:

    So sorry you are going through this hell. Just know that everyone here understands what you are feeling and experiencing, and is wishing you the best. Not one damn part of this is easy and none of it is fair. None of us knew what to think at first either: it is like stepping on an IED and having your world explode. The pain at first is overwhelming. But you can survive this and you will eventually be stronger.

  • “She’d been cheated on in past relationships, she said, and figured she was just hypersensitive.”

    Let’s unpack this. A woman has been cheated on before and may not (at that point) have realized she needed to fix her picker. But her instincts tell her the new BF/fiancé/husband is cheating and she dismisses it by saying she’s “just hypersensitive.”

    One time I heard a terrible cracking sound and instinct told me it was a huge tree coming down and to get to the other side of the house (it just missed us). I know if I ever hear the preliminary sounds (branches and leaves dropping) and then that thunderous cracking noise, I will know what it is.

    If you think a partner is cheating on you, it’s either your survival instinct telling you to protect yourself because he or she is cheating or a warning signal that you do not feel secure in the relationship and there is work to do. I suppose in rare cases people are “hypersensitive” because they aren’t really ready to be in a relationship, at least with that person. But first, take the emotional early warning system seriously and investigate (quietly).

    Either way, those feelings are not to be ignored.

  • This story doesn’t surprise me. My now wife was a military brat and a military wife (twice). The stories she tells about cheating in the military is so horrible. Her father and her husbands were serial cheaters. They sleep with each other on deployments, training, on post, with their friends wives/husbands, and when they go out with their buddies. It’s sick.

    • Yes. And let’s not pretend it’s always consensual either. What a bunch of boys tell each other is often quite different from what actually happens. I know because I was a soldier once. What my (married) commander did to me was not consensual, but you’d never know it from the stories that went around. Fortunately, I was able to get him dishonorably discharged, but his wife stayed with him regardless.

      • CQ, I am wondering if the military can really do much more than release him. Unless he’s stolen state secrets or stolen equipment or money or raped somebody I would imagine there’s not much the military can do to him. I guess the women would have to sue him. This just stinks. That poor baby and his other children. Imagine having him for a father.

        • Theoretically, they can. Adultery is a crime in the military, so he could serve time. But he won’t. They’ll drag out the “investigation” until he makes retirement. Then they’ll discharge him with a full pension.

          • Chump Queen I am hoping Mrs. Mansir is a 20/20/20 spouse and is entitled to 50% of that pension and military benefits. He done fucked up. I hope she has the proverbial “pitbull of a lawyer”. I hope this psychopath has to work the rest of his life to pay alimony and child support. I hope there is a civil suit.

  • Correction: Mansir was a Lieutenant Colonel (lower rank). Updated the text.

    • Speaking of double lives….my cheating double life serial cheater died prior to me divorcing him. Some family and friends know the truth, the others just think I’m a widow to a great guy who EVERYONE LOVED. Actually turned out better for me financially this way (I know that sounds awful).

      So, it looks like his brother is currently living a double life. This was brought to my attention by my adult son who wants me to confront him about it. Thoughts from CL and

      • I have an acquaintance. She’s an elderly woman whose husband took up with a younger woman. Cough cough. The younger woman was in her 70s if that tells you anything. He was taking everything away from this woman but died before he could change his will. She got everything and the other woman got nothing. Sometimes karma does work.

        • Yep, I like to see when it is quick and painful.

          But, likely the wife would have gotten most anyway. Unless there were trusts and lots of assets that were previously agreed on, he could not will anything to the OW that was not his to will. In most states the most he could give to someone else would be 1/2 of his half. So 3/4th to the wife and 1/4 to the whore. And if wife could show fraud, likely nothing for the whore.

          Yes she would have to pay a lawyer, but better money to a lawyer than the whore.

          • Seeing what some of my friends are going through post divorce and having to deal with child custody issues makes me even more glad my cheater died while I was trying to separate. Chumps shouldn’t feel bad that their cheaters are dead, just glad that the abuse has stopped. If my cheater is in his own special place in hell, well he earned it.

      • Smiling,

        So this is your brother-in-law ? He’s married ? Tell his spouse so they can make a fully informed decision about the rest of their life. Don’t bother confronting the b.i.l. If he cared, he wouldn’t be cheating on his spouse ! Direct the spouse to this blog and buy them a copy of Tracy’s book.

        • Amen Sucker Punched by a Saffa. Please Smiling tell your b.i.l. wife the whole truth, she needs and deserves to know. All of us here have prayed for some proof, let her out of her misery. Please.

      • I don’t know about the confrontation, but as for saying it turned out better for you; that does not sound awful at all.

        My own mother in law Big married Christian that fucks and had an affair with a married man)on hearing he had left me for another woman, said “you would have been better of if he had died” Her husband was awful to her and then he died suddenly of a mass heart attack. Though she was an attractive woman, she never even wanted to look at another man romantically after that.

        Now, I know she didn’t really want her son to die, she of course loved her son; but that was her initial gut reaction from her own experience.

        She later kind of turned on me, but we both know she knew the truth. She just had to depend on him, I didn’t. I never bashed her son to her, but I answered truthfully if she asked a question. I never did tell her or anyone how horribly he treated me in the year of discard. I didn’t tell anyone until many years later, except for my husband of course. I should have told more folks.

  • I guess people will lie about anything id they have no conscience. I hope Chelsea gets full custody of her baby.

    • But why is she a badass and if I would have walked into my ex-husband’s office with proof of his office affair -I would’ve looked like a sad and sorry unwanted wife?
      So instead, he got to control the narrative -and he and married other woman brought their relationship to their boss -and I’m sure impression managed the hell out of it.
      Neither of them received any consequences at work. He was offered time off because he looked like he needed it.
      Is it a quantity thing?
      Is it passable to do this to one wife but really not OK to do this to one wife and two single women?
      Inquiring minds want to know!

      • Yep. I agree.

        I had to control my anger, thankfully I was raised to control myreactions, otherwise I don’t know what I would have done.

        I should have been able to walk into the mayors office and say your Captqain and his dogcatcher whore have lied to me and stolen from me for years; just wanted you to know.

        He did bust the Captain, put him back out on the street; and moved the whore to another position in the city, so I like to think that was a fist bump to me while still doing damage control and avoiding a lawsuit.

        I didn’t find out until just this Feb from my son that he hated the mayor after he got busted, and told my son that he had trusted the mayor to take care of him, and friends should do that to friends. I laughed and told my son, likely he said all that with a straight face. If my ex had said that to me, I would have said “really your best friend betrayed you, I wonder what that feels like”

        My son said he just told his dad “dad you are talking about behavior that people can lose their jobs for” the mayor was not going to lose his job to cover for you.

        • Susie Lee, all this goes so deep. They cover for each other, otherwise this kind of shit could not go on forever as it has. Mine was in city administration, he lead a double life for 15 years that he admitted to. Most likely much more than that. I would be very sure many people knew about his cheating, just never told because it cleared a path for them. Don’t expect justice in a system set up like this.

          • Many do, I know several POs had to know.

            I am certain the Mayor didn’t until someone dropped a dime. Had he known, he wouldn’t have promoted the fw. There would have been no reason to, as my fw’s value to the mayor was getting votes. Once the town folks knew what happened that was gone. The value my ex had was his image, which he shit all over.

            These guys don’t tell what they know until it benefits them.

            There are good folks in PDs in the military etc, but so much corruption too. I like it when it gets busted open.

            Good news is my fw got his, as did his whore.

            I wish every chump could witness that. As time went on, it didn’t matter to me much anymore, but at the time; I won’t lie it put a bounce in my step.

  • I am reminded that my FW’s double life blew apart our 30 year marriage and he would still claim to be different from a serial cheater. He lied for months or years to me and his best friend (husband of AP). I suspect he asked various family members to keep it quiet or lied and said the relationship began after we separated. All very muddy.

    When a case is as clear as today’s story, there should be victim’s services and money for legal fees available. She is going to need both.

  • Can we focus for a minute on how he claimed one of his children had died?!

    That statement alone should cost him custody. Those poor kids.

    • Agreed.

      People in the narcopath’s orbit are merely actors for their benefit and are not real to them. He needed a dead kid to cover his lies and assure an uninterrupted supply of pussy, so to the actor playing “Daughter,” exit stage left.

      His family is lucky he didn’t decide to simply murder them ala Jeffrey MacDonald.

      • Now I.C., I had never heard of Jeffrey MacDonald before but checked his story. What a sicko. I cannot believe someone married him 18 years ago. He’s trying to get a “Compassionate Release” from prison right now. Just sickening.

  • Shame on the Army. A man could not have led this many lives without the complicity of fellow officers.

    • Lifeisgood, I can goddam guarantee you his fellow officers knew. They didn’t care. They may have even helped him with his cover stories. The Instagram article said that he was with a fellow service member at his parent’s house. That side side chick sure as shooting knew he was married. The investigator in this case is most likely a cheater and a member of the good old boy’s club of senior officers. They won’t convict him of what they do themselves.

      I feel so sorry for LTC Mansir’s wife. When he gets busted she gets no alimony or child support. All of those years she spent supporting his career and following him around the world are worth diddly squat now. She will have nothing but bad memories and PTSD.

      • Not true. If he is in prison, taking everything into consideration, the judge might award her the lion’s share of marital assets so she has resources to care for her children. If he is not in prison and can work a job somewhere, she can still get alimony and child support. My guess is this guy will get a slap on the wrist and ride out a desk job in Alaska until retirement. Depending on the overlap between his active duty service and their marriage, she would then be entitled to part of his retirement pension as a marital asset. If he gets VA disability, that income is calculated in for his child support responsibility. She is going to lose healthcare unless she is 20/20/20 but the kids will keep healthcare while he is still active duty. And she can get a sponsor pass to grocery shop for the kids at the commissary to save some $$$. She sounds like a fighter. I am sure she will figure it out. Life without FW is infinitely better. The pregnant fiancee can collect child support but her child will get reduced/leftover from what he owes his first set of kids. There is hope if she has a good attorney. I hope she has a bulldog!

  • One of the things I always wondered about was “why” anyone would want to live a life filled with this type of behavior?

    I enjoy spy stories, and the life and death situations double agents, or undercover agents risk to do their jobs, but I would never want to try to actually live a life like that. I was always terribly busy trying to live my one life, take care of myself, and later my children, and work and pay bills and keep up with the laundry and groceries. My family was more than enough to deal with. Why would I ever want to juggle more stress and lies, and people, and for what? A roll in the sack with someone new? Seriously?

    These serial/multiple relationship cheaters can’t possibly accomplish much if they spend all their time searching for new strange and keeping their stories straight. How could they ever feel anything for anyone boinking around all the time? All the wasted energy, time, and money, all the abandonment for any partner or children to endure, all the lies — all a waste!

    The women in this story are also amazing! They banded together instead of fighting over a worthless man. That they were all able to see it is amazing to me. I hope this man’s career and any relationship with these women and any children are over. I am sure he will immediately seek out a new chump, then another, and another, and he will die as worthless as he has lived. I just don’t believe this type can ever change.

    I never liked dating more than one person at a time, and I didn’t care for the barrage of inquiries back a long, long time ago when I tried online dating. I could not handle all the stories and evaluations For me, the truth is much easier to tell and you don’t have to remember any variations. I do not want a “man of mystery” for a partner or a friend. I want someone who does what he says he will do, keeps promises, and if he has had failures, owns up to any part he played. The truth is worth more than any glammed up lie will ever be.

    • I think, from what I read, that he had guys that knew what he was up to. There’s no way he had that kind of lifestyle that some of his buddies weren’t onto it. I always wonder how someone can just lie to themselves that they are never going to get caught. It’s obvious he was going to get caught. What heading is he under in personality disorders. Sociopath? Narcissistic sociopath? Whatever he is I hope his face is out there enough that no woman will fall for him again.
      If he was married 20 years then he probably has teenagers. I can’t imagine the angst those kids are going to feel.

      • He’ll probably find one of the women who falls for men in prison, becomes their pen pal and marries such a spath ! “He’s misunderstood and I can love him proper”

  • Maybe I am particularly sensitive because I just watched a Neflix episode with a young child hostage. Or because I just mailed my name change application, divorce decree and birth certificate to Social Security.

    Fuck these cheating motherfuckers who deliberately jeopardize their children and leave the victims to do ALL the work of cleaning up after their cowardly asses.

    We need a national campaign to hold these monsters (and their accomplices) accountable.

  • “Although this is obviously one of the bigger and worst examples, on some level all of our FWs are this sociopath asshat. They all do whatever they want and lie and gaslight to make us crazy and feed their egos.”

    I really am not shocked anymore at the double, triple lives cheaters live. I have nothing really to add to all the excellent comments. It must hurt to live inside their heads…lol. So the military doesn’t have an edge on this behavior, I was married almost 32 years to my x, he was in LE. Let me tell you the stories are all the same. After I did all the pick me dance moves (before CL & CN) I realized he was FUBR. But not only was he the cop who walked on water at work he was also Jesus Cheater from hell. Everyone thought he was the awesome. ONLY me knew who he really was. He had a slew of excuses from having red hair, being picked on, to having a stutter when he was young and the best was his parents were ministers and expected him to be perfect. He reveled in the fact he had perfected lying to the parents bc otherwise he wouldn’t have had any fun. WOW, looking back at it all I would have ditched him in a hot minute.

    And how precious it was we met in church. Got married 3 months later, and in 5 years we had 3 kiddo’s. His cheating continued and as far as I know it started immediately. He said he did it bc he had so much opportunity. Fucker, I had opportunity too but I was committed to our vows. The 2nd DDay I wanted to divorce him and he completely fell apart and begged me not to, said he would get help. But I was so angry at one point I demanded to see who the whore was he was f’g. He drove me to her business and called her to come outside (she was not expecting me) and I yelled out my window for her to stay away from my husband and I may have called her a slut. Anyway, she called his Lieutenant and wanted to complain that I had threatend her. The LT called me and said he would advise me not to do this again and in return he wouldn’t do any investigation on my xh. They covered it up and like the military ALOT of these people are serial cheaters as well. In hindsight I should have been brave and exposed him them to everyone. But I chose to stay, I had 3 youngins and I needed insurance (my youngest was a type 1 diabetic). He love bombed me for years and years. Another point to make was his parents knew he had cheated on me and his pastor dad told me to “forgive and help him” that God hates divorce. I said HE also hates adultery. So after he retired and went back to work as a contractor ( lots of traveling) he was free to cheat anywhere and everywhere. The lies and trying to keep his stories straight started catching up to him. I would come home from work and catch him looking at porn (and entertaining himself) and literally I couldn’t stand him anymore. I went full out exposing him and outed him to our grown kids, family and many friends. On the outside we still looked like the perfect family. He fled like the coward he really was and fought me tooth and nail in court. I gave up fighting him for spousal support, but got ½ retirement and our home. After 5 years we only have to see each other at grandkids bday parties. He still lies, looks old, worn out and wanders the earth living IMHO a very unfulfilled life. Tomorrow is the anniversary of our wedding, 37 years ago. WOW, the show he put on and using me as a prop in his movie is inexcusable. Sociopaths are unfixable….. run for the hills. I’ll never understand how people can live double lives and also disappointed at all the people that cover up for them.
    Peace Out ….. meh!

    • How horrible for you, fireball. That’s quite a story. Red hair? What in the actual fuck? The guy is nuts. I’m so glad you got half his pension and the house. So did I. It’s some measure of justice at least.
      It would be my 30th wedding anniversary today and I thought I’d be sad. But I’m doing okay. I have come to accept that my marriage wasn’t what I thought it was. I no longer torture myself trying to figure out if he ever loved me. I assume he didn’t and it doesn’t matter anyway. Onwards and upwards to the golden land of Meh!

      • Hugs, OHFFS. Glad you’re doing better than expected today. And glad you’re not “celebratin” with a fuckwit.

  • My ex was very similar to this. I found out he already had a child after I was already pregnant. What I didn’t know was that he was also still living with his wife (she was not his ex as he told me) at the same time as he was supposedly living with me. He split his time between us and still had time to screw other women as well, none of which I knew until I finally left. He also tried to isolate me from my family.
    His parents totally enabled him. They knew all along that he had another family but begged me to move in with him for our baby’s sake. I thought this was proof of his sincerity. Surely his elderly parents would not lie? I guess he may have told them I was happy to be his mistress (I would not have been! I didn’t even know that’s what I was!) but I’m pretty sure they knew his wife didn’t know.

    • My ex didn’t tell me he had a child at 15 who the mother had adopted out. We were only 18 when we married, but he should have told me this. I asked him why he waited until we were married to tell me. He said and I quote “I was afraid if I told you, you wouldn’t marry me” yet 20 years later he told me he never loved me. ????‍♀️

      • That’s totally it, my ex knew damn well if I’d known he already had a family I’d never have got involved with him, let alone had a child with him! Once he had me though he didn’t value me. I was just a plaything to be taken up and dropped.
        I can’t regret having my daughter, who is the centre of my life. It’s just a shame he is no use to her as a father. He dropped her too as soon as things got a little difficult.

  • There was a tenant in the flat behind me that was keepin’ busy with different men. Former Marine, completing her undergrad at our local top public uni after two years of community college. Divorced and screwing the married man who took her shopping at Agent Provocateur, Needless Markups and Jimmy Choo. I overheard her mother telling her to get as much as she could from him. Plus strange men knocking on my door looking for her. I think it was more than sugaring-full on sex work. Why did she install a doorbell with a camera when only the tenants go past her door to the laundry ?

  • I don;t put a lot of stock in the news these days. Especially the daily beast. But the evidence from multiple sources is pretty damning, and the way he reacts to it is especially so. Yes, beyond narcissism. This is a Sociopath, could be psychopath as soon as they find the bodies. Sadly, it’s always good to read the stories that seem worse or crazy to us chumps. The end result is still the same. We get our hearts shattered and our world reframed. Unfortunately, no matter how bad the other story is, ours is still just as tragic to us and our children. Thinking it would be better if we had some BOMBSHELL NYT front page story about how horrible our Ex was, wouldn’t make our realities any different. Those women will still deal with what every chump here has to deal with. Only difference is they made the news.

    • ‘front page story about how horrible our Ex was, wouldn’t make our realities any different.’ I hear you and I guess I’ll never know, but I think it would have made my reality very different. I would have felt vindicated rather than partly responsible. My therapist would not have talked about the 50-50 marriage equation and would not have made me feel badly about any of my self perceived faults that I brought up. He would have had consequences from work and society, and that would have made me feel better. I would have been very spooked to have married and had what I thought was a loving relationship with a sociopath…. but I would take that over the feelings I was left with (Mr perfect discarded me for OW). I would be seen as a strong woman for going into his work and exposing him – instead I sat on this information because I knew there was nothing I could do with it that wouldn’t reflect badly on me. I would not have spent endless amounts of time trying to think about how I would explain this humiliating trauma to people. I would not have felt any responsibility or felt unskilled in relationships knowing that the Fuckwit was a sociopath. People from his work probably would have reached out to me. My pain would not have been so isolating. I would not have thought that he was having a psychotic break for months and months and that he would come back and beg to have ‘us’ back. If the OW was complicit and that was also made public, that would be more vindication for me again. Instead, the two of them are playing house with furniture I bought with him to set up our home. If I felt that society ‘got it’
      I think it would have made my journey not easy but easier. Just saying…

      • It made my situation a little different. Our story was not world news, but it was absolutely local news. By that I mean word spread like wild fire because of his position and her being his direct report. Add to that I was well known and respected in the town because of my volunteer work, and in part because I treated folks well, and everyone also knew I was his wife. He lied to a lot of folks.

        He could not hide what he did once it hit, oh they scurried around like rats trying; but Boom.

        He got busted and kicked out of his cushy office. He is lucky he didn’t lose his job, which I am convinced is only because he married her. If he could have saved his Captains bars by dumping the slut, he would have done it in a heart beat. He knows it and I know it.

        Did that change my heartbreak/pain at being betrayed. Nope. Did it put a little bounce in my step, you betcha. I also think his public position made him go along with a long legal separation with a generous maintenance plan. Had he not had his balls caught in a vice grip; trying to save himself, he would have fought that agreement.

        I know without a doubt that mayor was telling him, if this shit causes me any trouble you are history. He was dancing like a little organ grinder monkey, no pun intended.

        I know how pissed the mayor was, because I still had a few friends of my own who worked for the city.

  • I honestly think that the limit of what these asshat cheaters do is what they “can”. How much time they have available is the determining factor. Not their morals, like they want you to believe. The asshat I was married to had to limit his activities to emailing the whore during work hours, taking her out to lunches, stopping by her place for Quick Visits in the way home, and occasionally sneaking out on the weekends under the guise of seeing his friends. He sprouted off he was ” in love” with her, and had been before he knew me, but I really think she was just a low moraled whore like himself that was an easy lay. If he was in love with her he wouldn’t have stayed married, he would have left to be with his True Love. Ugh. I think she could have been anyone, the love part is just to make them look like less of a shit to themselves and others. I also think if he had more leeway and time like Captain Dickhead in the story there would have been multiple other women, not just the one. They just need more time. I do believe occasionally that someone might fall in love with someone else when they are married but if they don’t immediately leave their marriage they’re just using it as Cake.

  • This guy is a psycho. He claimed the pregnant women outside his parent’s home was stalking him. They really do come up with some crazy victim stories. That woman is an idol, she even went to the hearing.

  • There is a big push now to remove military sexual assault and harassment investigations out of the perpetrator’s chain of command. Wouldn’t it be good to also remove the adultery investigations?

  • they are only good for two things: making lots of payments and insurance, and being soilent green.

  • I get so jealous and frustrated when I learn about cheaters losing custody. Being in a “no fault” state means I have to not only share my children but even pay child support to my ex FW and ex babysitter for 15 years. The state participated in the abuse. I’m glad these women found a better justice.

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