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UBT: ‘My Ex Owes Me Money’

Dear Chump Lady,

I found out my 40-year-old ex-husband was cheating on me with a 19-year-old in Feb. 2018, shortly after found out she was pregnant. Also found out that he ran up my credit cards, told everyone he was taking half of my house and retirement funds and expected our divorce to fund his new lifestyle. I kicked him out and divorced him super fast, he got nothing, but actually owed me money for a car that was, of course, financed under my name.

We came up with a payment plan where for a little bit he was paying me a couple hundred dollars a month. Then karma came for him — he lost his job, moved out of state, had another kid, lost another job, etc. He communicated with me from time to time that he was still looking for a job, and when he found one I thought he would start paying me again. I sent him a brief two sentence email in December asking him to resume his payments and this was his response:

“WTH?? I just sent a payment in the middle of last month and that was a stressful payment. I’m seriously trying to work with you to get back on track but I don’t need the attitude.

If the last payment was made in the middle of last month and I struggled to make that, what makes you think that my next paycheck is available for you??

I had to pay rent this month and I’m still 2 months behind. So please, BACK OFF!

I get paid next week so I’ll make another payment then and even that will be a struggle.

I’m getting so close to getting back on track and having a positive attitude about the future. Please don’t destroy it.”

I did respond with a fairly expletive-laced email saying if he read attitude in a two sentence email that was his problem, and it’s not my concern that his life is a shit show. Not my finest moment, but it felt good.

So he did NOT pay last month and said he will pay me double this month, but I’m not feeling very confident. I have a call scheduled with an attorney to discuss wage garnishment, which since I already have a judgment against him will be easy in the state he lives in. I feel guilty because I know he is having a hard time, but at this rate if he continues paying me what he has been, it will be YEARS before he pays me off. I really don’t want to deal with him at all and just want this done and over with.

Also, he and the teenage girlfriend got married a couple of weeks ago — two days before what would have been our anniversary, but whatever. He got fat and wore jeans and a cowboy hat and looked stupid anyways. I realize he will turn me into the angry ex-wife if I pursue wage garnishment, but I’m pretty sure he’s done that anyways. Should I go forward with wage garnishment or give him more of a chance to pay this balance off and just deal with him?

Megan

Dear Megan,

You’re his ex-wife, not Quicken Loans. In the rest of the adult world, when you default on your payments, there are consequences.

You already did him a favor by financing his car. Now you’re supposed to extend him credit?

As he’s a fuckwit, of course he feels entitled to this. And of course he went to the rage and self-pity channels when you inquired about the missing payments.

Back in your box, chump-o. Can you see he’s got a wedding to pay for? He probably had to buy new jeans.

Yeah. No. That was the old regime. Megan The Accommodating. New Megan has boundaries. (See also: “Divorce,” and “Kept Her Retirement Account.”)

Should I go forward with wage garnishment?

Proceed with the boundaries. You didn’t create this situation — he did. And he’s not exactly the best credit risk, as he has an iffy employment history.

In fact, I’d ask your lawyer how you can get out of this arrangement all together. I wish there’d been some provision in that settlement for what happens in the likely event he defaults. (Please — to anyone divorcing — work this shit into your settlements! Especially on child support.)

Can you repo the car? Sell it? Make him pay the difference on whatever is owed? I fear you may garnish his wages, but he’ll just find another way to default. But I’d go ahead and enforce the court order anyway.

Now then, let’s UBT that request. The Universal Bullshit Translator has just been lolling about here, in lebkuchen withdrawal since the holidays.

“WTH?? I just sent a payment in the middle of last month and that was a stressful payment. I’m seriously trying to work with you to get back on track but I don’t need the attitude.

I am a beleaguered man who has performed great feats of adulting — I sent a payment last month! Will nothing appease you? I am the victim of your unwarranted requests and cruel snark.

I don’t need the attitude. But I do need the car. Scolding you seems like a solid move.

If the last payment was made in the middle of last month and I struggled to make that, what makes you think that my next paycheck is available for you??

What makes you think I will pay my debts? How dare you!

My paycheck is sacred. I don’t just whore it about, spending it willy-nilly on fripperies like car payments. I reserve my funds for babies I can’t support and my Stetson hat. #FWcowboy

I had to pay rent this month and I’m still 2 months behind. So please, BACK OFF!

Would you imperil my hat? Would you see that fine felted chapeau out on the street? Cold, misshapen, alone. BACK OFF!

I get paid next week so I’ll make another payment then and even that will be a struggle.

I’m getting so close to getting back on track and having a positive attitude about the future. Please don’t destroy it.”

I could feel the corners of my mouth twitching to form a smile. But then you, Destroyer of Positive Attitudes, demanded money. Now my smile is turned upside down.

I was so close to having a future. SO CLOSE.

***

Megan, you don’t have to give him any more chances. Please give yourself the gift of no contact and hand in your repo man responsibilities. Make the wage garnishment people go after him. He’s already painted you as the bitch, so embrace your destiny. The attitude is extra. 😉

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at info@chumplady.com. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • Megan, go after him with both barrels blazing… or rather, have your attorney do it. He deserves no consideration otherwise.
    Then go live your happy, authentic life. You are mighty!

  • The entitlement is never ending. I do agree with chump lady about working the likelihood of default into settlements. I usually speak up on my groups and say if there’s any way to take a cash settlement to get the fuckwit out of your financial life do it! My fuckwit was an unemployed bum who blew our retirement in his failing business ( this why he was unemployed and he didn’t try to do anything about that). With the screwed up system here in Canada mr unemployed bum could have asked for spousal support ( I could barely support myself on my income). In the end I had to pay him to get rid of him so not only did I get no spousal support( after a 36 year marriage), he ended up with 70% of our assets with what he blew. I still say it was worth it to get rid of that loser. Let the new mommy/wife/appliance/slut take care of that shitshow.
    I am fully no contact and there is no financial shenanigans continuing to abuse me every month.

    • “I still say it was worth it to get rid of that loser. ” (physically and financially)

      So true. I am glad our finances were resolved in the settlement. I had no way of knowing, and honestly it shocked me; but just a few years down the line he ended up filing bankruptcy due to his and schmoops gambling debts. I would have hated to be wrapped in that mess.

    • Same. I am paying him six figures, even though he didn’t work and didn’t take care of the kids. I was able to get him to waive spousal support, but he could have pushed for it and gotten it.

      The thought of giving him so much of my hard earned money hurt, and kept me stuck for a loooong time.

      Then I had a thought, “If I was in unjustly imprisoned, how much would I pay to get out? How much would I spend on my legal team?” The answer? Every last dime I had.

      Freedom is priceless. Cut your losses.

    • Megan oh Megan….why are you still being a chump after 4 years? Hand the outstanding bill over to the experts (which you are not), go no contact & get yourself into therapy or a divorce group pondering the big question “why do I still continue to engage & fight with a train-wreck of a man”?! This truly can’t be all about money; you are still co-dependent for some reason.

      • Thank you, I’m the OP for this story. I am basically no contact with him other than arranging for these payments. All of my responses are very short and to the point. I’ve been in therapy and feel I have a healthy distance from him with good boundaries, but this last email sent me over the edge because we have no role in each other’s life.

    • Newlady15, I am also here in Canada (American who relocated with FW a few years ago) and worried about the system here that seems rigged for no-fault even where there is a huge number of faults. Also rigged for an equal split on all assets and also custody. And I hear that they END the official marital asset count the day of separation. WTF?

      • CHBD that’s absolutely correct. And since many of our “toys” were in the company name ( the one he blew our retirement fund in) he legally stole them and sold then, no doubt pocketing the cash. My lawyer said I could hire a forensic accountant for a starting price of about 60k and get maybe 60k. I still find it mind boggling that a man who worked pretty much his whole life ( significantly under income) could get away with suddenly being unemployed ( he went back to work 3 months after leaving /-funny that). Cut your losses is exactly right. I still spent 45K on a lawyer and north of 200k on top of the 500k he blew and 2 years trying to get rid of him.

    • How fast will that teenage bride have to grow up?

      I hope she enjoys fucking and raising a 40yo man. She’ll have nothing to show for it but exhaustion and Eau de You And Me Against the World. With customized Bitch Ex-Wife top notes.

      • What is with these people and the “you and me against the world”? We had that engraved on our wedding bands. I thought it was romantic. Now I know it’s an isolation tactic that leaves you dependent on the narcissist because no one else can be trusted (in their view). Ugh.

        • There was even an old song about it (Helen Reddy) though in that case it was about a woman and her father.

          I think triangulation is engrained a bit. It is kind of like small children. Two can be playing great then a third comes in and fights ensue. Two usually bond against the third.

          • Actually, it was a woman speaking to her child (listen to the song – there’a a child’s voice saying “mommy” at both beginning and end).

    • I was in a similar situation. If Xh had asked, he might have gotten spousal support. Instead, in our no fault state, he just insisted on his “half” of MY retirement. The last thing I wanted was him coming to me later in life wanting that money! Offered him every penny we had in savings at the time if he would drop his claim to my pension. Thankfully, he took the cash on hand! I didn’t have much to start with at that point, but in the long run he actually gave up more money than he got and I don’t have to worry about him wanting money when I retire. Worth every penny and I would absolutely do it again!

  • “I’m getting so close to getting back on track and having a positive attitude about the future. Please don’t destroy it.”

    ****I could feel the corners of my mouth twitching to form a smile. But then you, Destroyer of Positive Attitudes, demanded money. Now my smile is turned upside down.

    I was so close to having a future. SO CLOSE. ***

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    That one made my morning (seriously laughing out loud) and has been swiftly placed in my file of Award Winning Chump Quotes I keep.

      • Sincerely, why do you care if he thinks you’re “the angry ex-wife”? He’s an idiot who impregnates teenagers. His opinion is meaningless.

        He also sounds like one of those incompetent loafers who can’t even hold down a job, so I doubt he runs in similar social circles as you – or if he did, that anybody would listen to him.

        I agree with Chump Lady, ask your lawyer about repoing the car, anything to get your money back in full, faster. At the very least, garnish his wages. Make the government be the heavy who gets your money back.

        Don’t waste your time trying to play fair with this guy. You need an impartial, all-powerful authority to kick his ass or else you won’t get paid. Screw his feelings.

        Also, suggest you block him and let all further communication go through your lawyer. Email’s just another way for him to screw with you.

        Ten bucks says he’s dragging this out because it’s another way for him to control you. Deny him that. No contact.

  • Megan,

    Since your Ex either can’t do the right thing (ie paying off his debts) of his own free will or, more likely, is deliberately choosing not to do the right thing because he knows that it will cause you grief, then get a Court to make him do it. Don’t feel bad about this, as it is about protecting yourself and getting that which is due to you.

    And, whatever you do, don’t wait. The longer that you wait, the greater the likelihood that he will split up with AP/Wife #2 and ends up on the hook for child support. At that point, if you don’t already have a Court judgement and Court mandated arrangements in place, you really will be at the back of the queue for what is owed to you.

    LFTT

    • Great point, LFTT. Teen mom might not put up with un/underemployed FW for very long. Get what you’re owed and get out ASAP, I’d say.

  • I can’t tell you Megan how much your letter made me smile .
    2 small children and married to AP – this is also my story .
    I like to make up stories in my head that they are beyond their economic means what with her not working and him being in a just slightly more than minimum wage job . What with bills / child care / nappies etc it gives me a giggle some times

    But you’ve got the actual proof !

    Enforce the consequences his new family nor him are your responsibility

    • My ex and his AP were in serious financially straights even with two incomes that totaled well over six figures. Entitles people often seem to have no idea what to do with money. My ex and I were always teetering on the edge, often in the red, and no matter how many raises or better jobs we got, our finances never seemed to improve. Once I separated my finances from his, lo and behold, I have more money than I’ve ever had in my life. I paid off all my (our) credit card debt (well over ten grand) in one year, and even with paying my attorney an exorbitant amount of money every month for the last few years, and with expenses for myself that aren’t much less than they were for the two of us together, I somehow have no trouble paying my bills and even have a sizeable amount of money in the bank. I never got child support (well, one check in four years) or spousal support either. I wouldn’t be surprised if your ex and his AP struggle with money. It seems to be a trend.

      My ex died in September, and now my kid is pretty well set up with the life insurance money and Social Security survivors benefits.

      It’s so weird to not have to pinch pennies and constantly check my bank account. I even have enough to treat myself to something nice no and again. My ex had no idea what to do with money, how to budget, etc. I handled all of that. But he also felt he “deserved” things and would spend money even when we didn’t have it to spend (he seemed to think that if there was money in the bank account, that meant he could use it, not understanding that it was all earmarked for bills, etc. His AP was just as bad with money as he was, apparently. And she gave him thousands of dollars, which of course, she’ll never see again. Girlfriends don’t get shit when there isn’t a will. I’m thankful he died (killed himself, actually) before the divorce went through. There were no issues at all with his estate (such as it was).

  • My ex still owes me $25,000 from our agreed upon divorce settlement in 2014! I have a lien on properties, sheriff will go into his home within next month to confiscate anything worth selling, including appliances. He currently pays me $100/month! Interest alone is $106/month!

    He has done everything he can to keep me from getting paid including putting his house into a trust, which he did AFTER the judgement against him – umm illegal! He offered me $10,000, I told him through my lawyer to go F himself, the time for negotiating is long gone

  • If he has a spotty employment history even garnishment is an iffy proposition (he has to EARN wages to have them garnished). So perhaps consider working with the lender to have the vehicle repossessed and sold to satisfy the remaining debt. Your credit score might take a hit, but it’s finite and IMO preferable to spending years immersed in a whine-fest with your ex (and likely having to pay for a significant portions of your ex’s car).

    • “… consider working with the lender to have the vehicle repossessed and sold to satisfy the remaining debt.”

      ^ This was my first thought as well. And don’t give him the ‘heads up’ that it’s being repo’d.

      • Thank you. I actually has it worked into our divorce agreement that if he couldn’t refinance or sell the car in 3 months he had to give it back to me, I would sell it and he would owe me the difference. He signed a judgment against him it’s just a matter of collecting it. I had a great divorce attorney.

        • So, then what’s the problem. Seize your asset. Garnishing his wages is just a way of prolonging the problems, and not getting all of your money. I think you need to get him completely out of your life. I know that you don’t agree, but I think that you still are wanting the contact with him, or to get to see the trainwreck or karmabus hitting him or something. Sometimes, taking a financial hit is just a learning experience, and an investment in your bigger life. Your time, and lawyers, cost money, too. The fact is that buying a new car loses you a third the moment you drive it off the lot. You made a bad loan, and a bad investment. Time to write it off. You owe him and his young family no loyalty or reliable transportation.

        • OMG, for real?? This is your answer.

          Move ahead and repo the car so you can wash your hands of him. Don’t even bother with garnishing wages, he’ll stay unemployed to spite you.

  • In this case I actually feel bad for the teenager gf. She’s just a young stupid bitch who has no idea what she got herself into.

    As for the ex, you did great! You got rid of him and kept everything. I agree that you should have a lawyer repo the car and be done.

    It’s of course a much smaller scale, but my ex stayed on my family cell plam for a year with a verbal agreement that he’d pay at the end. It was $360 for the year. He’d been having his skank ex gf, who he’d kept around our entire relationship, call him at work to hide it from me. But once the divorce was final she went back to calling his cell…I know because I saw the activity.

    Loads of texts and a few calls a day with the trash he claimed he hadn’t spoken to in ages, but I digress.

    He finally got his own plan and I reminded him that he owed me for the year. He simply didn’t respond to that text.

    I think he was trying to use it as leverage to get me to talk to him again, but for $360 it wasn’t worth dealing with his phony nice guy shit. He’d been emailing and texting me looking for am angle to get me to respond and I ignored everything beyond the cell business.

    I made sure to tell people in the running community, of which we are both part of, that he couldn’t even get his own cell phone plan to talk to his whore.

    He’s super obsessed with image management and these things have a way of getting around.

    • The TA who covered up a school staff assault on my tiny, chronically ill son was 21. I would have happily sent her to jail with the rest if not for the legal and illegal (DCF and police refuse to investigate school personnel, claiming it’s not their jurisdiction) loopholes public school staff enjoy even when they– oops– rape or kill students in some districts. You know who was actually “young”? My seven year old son.

      The aspiring mafia punk in Queens who stabbed my veteran dad in the same arm already disabled by a bullet was 19, a year older than my dad was when sent overseas and shot.

      It’s all relative, isn’t it?

      Then FW tried to argue that Shmoops was “young” when I called her a scheming embezzler. Regardless of the fact that I’m 15 years older than Princess Panhandler, I had two kids in Kindermuzik, one on the way and was editing scientific papers in three languages at the same age she was humping drunken old FWs in office parking lots and plying them to pay for her bar tabs and bad wall art. All relative.

      • Oh, I’m not arguing that young people shouldn’t be held accountable for their actions…they absolutely should be.

        I’m saying that young people often don’t fully grasp what they’re doing because the risk center of the brain isn’t fully developed.

        I think it’s possible to acknowledge that and still understand that the community needs to be protected from them.

        • I know what you mean but, all the same, I knew better than to mate-poach in seventh grade. I’m actually against children being tried as adults but the whole “developing brain” thing is getting a bit worn out these days and I’m not sold on the science. I also get sick of the generational wars with boomers bashing millennials and X’ers and vice-versa, etc. But there’s this “perpetual youth” trend among under 35s which is tiresome. I actually saw a professional presentation on Zoom where a bunch of 30 somethings huffily refer to the “refreshing lack of ageism” in tech. They meant reverse ageism against themselves. It was cringy because maybe that applies if you’re, say, running for president but where on earth does 32 mean budding virgin neophyte status? These people were already getting fillers.

          The entitlement and Peter Panism really started in my generation. Maybe because my parents were pretty old by the time I was born, I was raised with different expectations than even my peers and I think it makes a difference in sense of responsibility and even “brain development.” I also notice a class difference in how quickly people have to develop.

          • “the whole “developing brain” thing is getting a bit worn out these days and I’m not sold on the science.”
            Same here.

            I was raising a son at age 20, I knew from early teen not to be a whore and sneak around. I knew to respect others, and I knew to stay away from those that didn’t. I understood if you have to sneak it is wrong. I was also raised to fear consequences of bad behavior. God forbid we even mention that now.

            Unfortunately I didn’t know I was living with a viper. He either kept it well hidden, or he changed. Who knows. Doesn’t matter now.

            Wasn’t perfect, but I knew the basic rules of society.

            • Having a normal degree of empathy helps. I’ve never heard anyone other than a clinical narcissist call themselves an “empath” or advertise themselves as empathetic, but just a normal sense of the golden rule will do. I remember getting a very charming campaign from a pretty prominent and very good looking media personality when I was an 18 year old intern. I was terrified of alienating him but sputtered out something that still seems very wise 20-something years later. I said, “I admire you and if you chose this partner, I have to admire her too.” He looked kind of stumped like “hur dur… what?” and never caused me any problems, thank God. When I met her at some later function, she seemed suspicious and I so badly wanted to tell her that I was on her side.

              If I was some magical “empath” as a teen, I probably should have told her her mate was a big sleazebag and taken the consequences. I was self interested and careful in how I handled the situation, I feel a bit of shame over that. But even at that age, even when eating ramen noodles and even when I thought the guy was all that and could help my career, I could imagine how much cheating would hurt the victim and wanted no part of it.

              When I had more experience, I developed actual principles, not just gut reactions. But I don’t think basic empathy only comes with maturity.

          • I just wanted to chime in, semi-off-topic, to agree wholeheartedly with your disgust about the current generational wars. I’m a boomer, as is my current husband, and we’re awfully tired of his stepdaughter (from a previous marriage) blaming us, along with our entire generation, for her woes. Maybe if she hadn’t married a lazy unemployed man-child who’s been “establishing himself as a DJ” for the past couple of decades, or if she’d find the wherewithal to insist that he actually, you know, work for a living, she’d find herself in a better position. I think this whole boomer vs. millennial BS is a setup in order to distract everyone from the very real problems we’re all facing.

            • THANK YOU, SLEEPYHEAD!

              My sentiments exactly. I suspect the generational war is nothing but wag-the-dog divide and conquer. And my feminist side thinks it’s a way to keep younger women from listening to their elders among other hidden agendas.

              Before D-Day, my husband’s niece spat out some weird accusation that gen Xers (my gen) were responsible for betraying feminism because I mentioned that I was teaching my kids that porn and media kink-promotion weren’t exactly healthy guides for sexuality since the media was heavily cross-invested in porn (Google “Murdoch + pornography”). The niece had mentioned she was into anal. Personally I wondered if she was experiencing deep trauma from her dating experience because she’d suddenly put on about 60 LBs.

              But was she she really into anal? Did she even know what she was into? Or was her sexuality just influenced by the biggest media industry in the world, which is pornography? For one, women don’t have prostrate glands. I probably made a mistake in debating any of this but it was telling about FW’s extended family values. Why hadn’t her parents warned her?

              I was so encouraged when the Gen Z singer Billie Eilish finally came out and stated that her sexuality was scarred by seeing porn at a young age. I imagine her cross-invested global management company was not pleased. No, I don’t want my daughter thinking if she objects to choking, anal and bondage, she’s “vanilla” and boring, Girls are dying and ending up on colostomy bags as teens from this. It’s all profits and trafficking. My kids talk about this with their friends because I’m the hand that rocks the cradle.

              Generations are a bit of an invention. Humans don’t evolve that fast and people are people. Abuse is still abuse. Betrayal is still betrayal. I felt sad that my husband’s young niece had been so “trained” to ignore solid feedback.

              • “And my feminist side thinks it’s a way to keep younger women from listening to their elders among other hidden agendas”

                I have wondered about that, and maybe it is just that I wasn’t around it much, but one thing I noticed is it seems so many younger women now hate their mothers, and seem to resent anything an older woman says; unless it is a celeb.

                I don’t know, just musing.

                My ex a couple years before we separated while we were still having a very active and what I though good sex life, asked me to try anal. I refused. I rarely refused any adventure with him, but this was the only what I would call “kinky” thing he ever mentioned. He didn’t seem upset; but I wondered where it came from.

              • Yeesh, where’d he pick that fetish up?

                We forget how extreme anal once was since now it’s seen as the new BJ, along with choking (excuse me, “breath play”), etc. I have a sense of horror for my kids’ generation. They’re in danger.

                There were surely porn zombies back in the paper mag and peep show days who probably fetishized anal and the rest. Ted Bundy was reportedly heavily into violent porn. Maybe the degree of effort required before streaming porn made up for the lack of today’s easy access and those old timey zombies (excuse me, “addicts”) weren’t as numerous but all the more committed.

                I’m a favorite of my friends’ daughters and ny daughter’s gal pals. They’re always easedropping in adult convos and ask to hang out. But then these are all mom-centric girls in healthy families. There was one friend-of-a-friend acquaintance of my daughter’s with a violent dad who you’d say was more male directed and starting to show signs of jaundice towards adult women.

                Makes you think. In abusive households, it’s sometimes safer for kids to side with the loudest, most dangerous parent against the victim parent. I’ve seen the same to be true with women who lean the wrong way and knee-jerkedly victim blame in workplace harassment scenarios. I would actually poll these people about their childhoods and surprisingly they’d answer. Yep, all grew up with dv.

                I had a close friend in high school whose mom cheated on her hard working dad. She was heartbroken and furious at her mom but this never generalized into hatred of all women. She was always a wonderful friend. So I tend to think female misogyny is mostly a result of captor bonding from childhood. It doesn’t help that the media seems to be capitalizing on this.

                I don’t know how this works when the mother is the violent parent. Statistically, the other scenario is the most common but I’m sure specific patterns emerge either way.

                Yes, I read a lot of anthro and behaviorism lol. Got skeins, will travel.

              • The oldest millennials are 40, the youngest 25. Anyone you get than that is Gen Z.

                Differences in how older & younger generations think aren’t anything new- the sociological theory of the Generation Gap was established in the 1960s, but there are also writings surviving from the times of Ancient Rome where someone is decrying the lack of respect & propriety of the young people of their own times.

                No setups necessary, and ascribing a sinister agenda to a normal experience that has been happening since humans existed seems, well, a little silly to me.

                I’m 55, and I gotta say, I think the up & coming young generations are AMAZING. They are politically aware & active, socially conscious, and working to make this world a better place for everyone. They give me hope that we have a chance against climate change, US fascist extremism, bigotry & hate, the Plague, and all the other terrible problems facing the world today.

                And young people today are closer to their families than ever, and do not feel the same need to rebel or assert their independence as our generations. Not only do I see this with all my friends & relatives who have teen or young adult children, it’s a widespread social phenomenon: https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2019/09/04/teens-seem-be-taking-longer-grow-up-one-reason-closer-bond-with-their-parents/

                (PS Most feminists aren’t against porn, they are against the Porn Industrial Complex. BIG difference.)

              • Nobody says you have to like or do anal, but classifying it as ‘extreme’, a ‘fetish’, or something that only serial killers would do is pretty rude to the millions normal men, women, and non binary people who enjoy it (giving and receiving.)
                It’s also pretty homophobic.

  • Talk to an attorney. Garnishments can push some people into bankruptcy. If that happens, you might end up worse off than you are now. To be honest I think your chances of collecting the full amount due to you are slim no matter what you do. Not fair of course.

  • Megan, I have a fantastic settlement. On paper! The reality is I am in the process of getting LTC Fuckface to pay me. This week he instructed me to only use his private email address. Seems like he doesn’t like the idea of Systems Administration seeing my repeated requests for payment. As he is no longer the boss of me I will now send the requests to BOTH addresses. He knows he owes me money. He just doesn’t want to pay me.

    That aged fat fuck under a cowboy hat knows he owes you money. The Courts know it too. Don’t back down. Continue with your efforts to get your money from that cheater. He doesn’t get to partially pay you. Turn it over to the wage garnishment folks and prepare to hound him for the money.

    My lawyer tells me he will collect on this debt to me. Fuckface makes bank, has money in savings, and will continue to make bank. He just thinks he is entitled to do as he pleases. I will not relent until I am paid in the entirety. Don’t you give up. I won’t either.

    • “He just thinks he is entitled to do as he pleases.”

      Yep. This is what separates cheaters from the rest of us.

      A cheater’s credo: “I want what I want when I want it. I deserve it. To hell with others. If you dare enforce consequences, you’re the bad guy.”

      It boggles my mind and reminds me that X and OW acted angry with ME. What the everliving fuck! I did nothing to them. They’re the ones who conspired to betray me. Together they lied and cheated for years. At one point after D-Day, my x hissed that the OW doesn’t “want anything of yours.” He couldn’t appreciate the irony.

      p.s. I love that you doubled down on using BOTH email addresses. Well played!

      • “It boggles my mind and reminds me that X and OW acted angry with ME. What the ever living fuck! I did nothing to them. They’re the ones who conspired to betray me.”

        Yep, and not just to me, but to many others. Their plan was outed, and they pretty much were shamed out of the community dripping with self inflicted shit all over them; because someone dropped a dime on them; (filed a complaint) but still it boggles the mind that these folks do what they do and think they are just fine doing it.

        Thank God for who ever outed them/and for CC and bank records, or I would have been so screwed.

      • I will never forget my husband’s AP sending me a threatening text telling me I had “NO RIGHT” to be involved with HER life. !?!?! SHE was the one who chose to fuck MY HUSBAND. The she was upset that his wife didn’t like that? She got involved in my life, with my kid, my house. And somehow was angry with me for existing. I suppose I was the barrier to their “happiness”. I was the bad guy who had ruined his life and made him so unhappy and held him back from achieving his dreams. LOL. He was an abusive alcoholic who would rather have moaned about how unfair life had been to him than actually do anything to improve it.

        Except that when I walked away, they were absolutely miserable. She found out the hard way what he was like. And when she did, she bolted (fled the state, in fact). So much for “true love”.

  • It takes practice, but if I send a simple request for something I am entitled to request, no matter what comes back at me I don’t react to the barrage other than to simply re-send the original simple request.

    Mental aikido is a daily practice.

    An example from my own life is that I recently requested information regarding a the automatic toll road account related to the vehicles attached to the business I still own with Traitor X after I logged in and saw he had deleted the company truck. He ignored the request. I waited 24 hours and re-sent the email, which consisted of one question about the vehicles on the account. Ignored again. I simply resent, every morning, at 8am, for three days.

    #humanrobocaller

    On the third day, he responded. I saw that he needed time to go into the automatic toll road account and add his truck back which he had done in a childish effort to cover his lie. He had deleted the truck to conceal his movements around the area from me, most likely. Which I do not give a crap about. The attorneys and I need to keep an eye on all the accounts related to the business for the purpose of enforce legal consequences if necessary.

    Megan has left the mirage. You are now RoboMegan, who is going to get what RoboMegan is entitled to get.

  • Ok, I have to quickly chime in on this one – hi, y’all! Woke up early today.

    So my divorce happened when internet was still dialup. Live journals were new and mostly computer geeky people used them. Others thought such public behavior was odd. LOL.

    My ex had emptied our large joint savings account within a few days before I knew what was going on. I had a financial agreement in place that was based on paying back half of what he had taken from the pot of shared marital assets, per the court.

    My ex kept resisting keeping up the payments, claiming severe financial hardship. I started searching and found his live journal. I didn’t tell him, just kept copies in case they would ever be needed. Every time it was payment time, he posted something either about the loads of money he had just spent on trips or toys, or whining about having to pay “alimony” to his “abusive ex wife” who “tricked the court” (damn I’m powerful) into “destroying” him financially because “judges always side with the wife”.

    Point is, any guilt I felt for making him own up to his accountability and consequences came to a swift end every time I checked that journal after getting an email from him. Then I’d reply “Things are tough for both of us. A court order is legally binding and we must both honor it. Please honor it so I don’t have to report that we’re out of compliance.” And BOOM the money would appear. Sometimes with a nasty email at the same time, but it appeared and I just saved the email as documentation.

    Remember, liars lie. We may feel guilt, but we aren’t required to act on it (or even to believe it.)

    • My first thought too: LIARS LIE. And often by omission.

      “I had to pay rent…” […and buy liquor and sex toys and go out to eat at expensive restaurants and get racing flames professionally painted on the car.]

    • LOL. My ex was the same. Always crying about how broke he was and complaining about paying shared bills, but posting pictures on Facebook of all the new toys he’d bought (video game systems, expensive deluxe collector’s sets of Blu-Rays, a new skateboard, etc.). I too kept screenshots of all of those things.

        • He never grew beyond 19. He dressed the same (backward baseball cap, wallet chain, shit-kicker boots, band t-shirts), had the same interests and hobbies, the same taste in music and movies, and the same attitude. A 45 year old skater punk.

  • Dear Douchecanoe,

    Thank you for sending the car payment.

    Sincerely,

    RoboMegan

    Then hit SENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSENDSEND until you get it. As often as you like. While consulting with your lawyer. And sipping your tea, filing your nails, sitting in your comfy chair, watching Netflix and whistling a happy tune.

    Doot da doo…..

  • Pfffft. How dare you inconvenience him with telling him the car bill is overdue!

    Because that’s what it is. A bill. The same as the electric or gas bill. He got the car (that was in OP’s name), so he gets the bill. Bills aren’t something you can pay once and never think about again. It’s monthly. You pay it whether that stresses your finances or not. Even if it means you can’t afford your new wedding and cowboy hat.

    Go for the garnishment or get the car repo’ed. Him and his teen bride need the wake up call about consequences.

    • I know, the rent comment killed me. “I paid rent this month.” Yes, that’s what we renters do. Pay monthly rent. No kudos or pity warranted. What a big, mean, dumb baby.

  • I’m assuming you’re still making car payments for the car you no longer have. Can you afford to call it a wash and call the finance company and have them repo the car? Explain to the finance company the situation, which I’m sure they’ve heard of before. (A friend of mine was in a similar situation and had a great relationship with the financiers.) Also, ask your tax person if you could write this off as a loss?

    Long shot, but could you ask your ex to refinance the loan so then he’s paying the financial company directly? He probably has bad credit so maybe his current wife could back him?

    • I asked my ex (through our attorneys) to refinance the car in his name, and he never did.

      In the end it worked out, because he died and it was super easy for me to sell the vehicle (which had a million unpaid tickets and administrative flags on it, which would have cost me thousands if I’d needed a title transfer). But is was still annoying AF.

      My point being that if he’s not making payments because he’s unable to afford them, there’s small likelihood that he would qualify for a refi.

  • Just my two cents… who holds the title to the car?

    If you own the car – or hold the loan – take back the car. Stop the triangulation.

    Sell the car at a loss if you need to #sunkcost.

    The day I was able to limit how much connection I had with Mr. Sparkles (we share a son, so there is still a fair amount)… the quicker I got to Meh.

    And, I’ve been where you are… I walked away from $7K he owed me for paying off the car his ex-wife had that he was supposed to be paying on… he had let it get repossessed and she had the kids… talk about a red flag, UGH.

    Take the sunk cost and get more distanced from this fuckwit. Not worth the hassle in the long game.

    • I totally agree. If you don’t have minor children together, this stupid car is the only thing tying the two of you together, and he knows it. If there is a loan in your name, stop making payments and let the chips fall where they may. People talk as if bad credit is a life sentence, but it’s temporary and doesn’t even matter unless you are thinking of getting a loan in the next 6 months (then you might decide to keep paying until the loan clears). Credit scoring is a tool the capitalist oligarchs use to keep people compliant and under control.

      At a bare minimum, stop hounding him for payments. Send him a bill each month and tack on whatever he owes in back payments. If interest was part of the agreement, include that. I know it felt good in the moment to unleash a profanity-laden screed at him, but that made him feel even better. He knows he got to you. Silence is a worse punishment for these types.

    • Agree with selling the car at a loss. All the time wasted contacting, reminding the dipshit he needs to pay and factoring in his sketchy job record will be well worth the loss when that nonsense comes to an end.

    • Exactly. I have a feeling we aren’t talking about a Model X or Maserati.

      I’m sure it feels good to have him by the balls over something and make him angry. And I’m sure the nagging him to adult is a part of a old dynamic of codependency. Really hear this – he enjoys all the centrality and drama.

      Minimally, don’t adult for him anymore, he fired you from that job.

      The car was a mistake you made, a contract you never should have signed. Swallow the loss and get free!

      • Agreed. Thanks everyone. I did take the car back and sell it for a loss, the money he owes me is for the difference owed. No hit to my credit thank god!

        • I’d walk away from the money owed at this point. I know it is money and we all have bills… and I know it is the principal of the thing. BUT… nothing tells a fuckwit that you could absolutely not give a last care (or dollar) about them… NO CONTACT is priceless and the peace you will find over time will replace whatever money you had to write off. Leave the argument… tell him debt paid and do a mic drop. No contact is the way to meh.

          I promise you, I don’t say this lightly, my sunk costs were almost $100K when all was said and done. I focused on the divorce and my freedom and within 5 years got my financial house back in order (debt free)… it’s amazing how it rains money when you don’t have a leech on your back.

          Good luck!

  • I am glad you came out on the winning end with the divorce settlement. My ex wife had over $10,000 in secret credit card debt. My state is 50/50 when it comes to debt whether you knew about the debt or not. I came out of the marriage debt free and $898 in my pocket. Personally, I would go after him for the money unless it’s going to cost you more to chase after it. 😃😃😃

    • My state was 50/50 too, but he ended up paying off all the debt, as he racked most of it up. He also got to keep the property (most of it) but that was ok with me as I got a small dwelling that was free and clear; and he had to pay all my living expenses for a year to pay back some of the funds he stole from me to romance the whores.

      Still all in all he got most of the assets and I am fine with it as I escaped debt free; with an affordable living arrangement.

      The fact that after he and the last whore he married, they went on to rack up massive gambling debts and had to file bankruptcy (second time for her) had nothing to do with me.

      He could have managed his properties and come out smelling like a rose; but as CL said folks don’t get character transplants, he took himself with him when he left.

    • I didn’t even go after him for all of the money he racked up on my credit cards, which was probably around 15k. He didn’t have an attorney (couldn’t afford one, shocker) and basically had to agree to my terms but I prioritized getting the car out of my name because I didn’t want to be liable or tied to him due to the vehicle. I took it back and sold it for a loss which is the money he owes me.

      • How much does he actually owe you? I walked away from $26k I’m due from a private IRA. I knew my physician ex easily can and will make me spend that much to collect via court because that’s exactly what he did during 14 months of divorce proceedings followed by 9 months of post-decree nonsense related to simple tax refillings. Fortunately for me during those periods he had to pay my legal fees. But for a collection matter like this, I’d be on the hook for an attorney. I’ve actually come to accept this loss for now and maybe forever. If I’m aware or even care anymore when he kicks the bucket, I’ll file a lien against his estate.

        • He owes me around 7k. Not a huge amount but I had to borrow it to get out of that car. And I forgave him the additional 15k that he racked up on my credit cards. A collection attorney will take 1/3 of what they collect as payment but honestly it’s better to get what I can now than let it drag out and let him pay me whenever he feels like it.

  • Because nothing from nothing from broke embezzling FWs equals nothing, I’ll continue to pipe in that chumps should be able to legally pursue shmoopies for marital assets spent on extracurricular relationahips before divorce. $200.00 bistro dinners? Hotels? Gifts? Bar tabs? Trips? Shmoops pay half.

    • I agree. Theft is theft and if you are with a married person, you already know you are with a liar and a cheat; so whatever happens is on you as well as them.

      But, until that happens, at least I was able to legally get some of the whore money back from the FW. I was lucky in that he was still desperately trying to keep his job and his promotion so I had some leverage. Not everyone is that fortunate.

      • I was lucky in that sense too but many aren’t. I think dissipating marital assets for affairs should be legally viewed as embezzlement and receiving stolen goods. If a shmoop or sex worker even suspected a FW was married, then the “should have known (that goods were stolen)” standard could apply.

        Since the 2008 crash and student loan crisis, at least in terms of female side dishes but possibly true of financially strapped side dudes too, economics is a likely a big incentive to hook up with a financially stable-seeming married asshole. Given a little economic disincentive, I think FWs would find the pool of willing proxy cheaters drastically shrinking. Hey, then all that would remain would be in it for “twu wuv.” It would have to be because affair date night would involve a pack of expired Twizzlers and a hump in a corn field by the side of the highway.

        • Yep, I would vote for that law. I know I was fortunate to come out as well as I did.

          “It would have to be because affair date night would involve a pack of expired Twizzlers and a hump in a corn field by the side of the highway.”

          Whore definitely got better dates than I did, (you are welcome whore) as I was dating an 18 year old in the Army and neither of us had any money. But, I did love him.

          But, I also got to go on with a good life, several promotions, and met and married a great guy. So I even got the new romance and all it entailed. I just did it honestly and not with someone else’s husband. But to be fair I had better bait than whore did, she couldn’t compete for single successful men; all she could get was a fw.

          • After D-day when I stupidly agreed to wreckonciliation and was worried Shmoopie might be a bunny boiler, some allies, my lawyer and I sleuthed Shmoop’s social media for clues. One thing was clear,:she aspired to wealth, glamour and status, the finer things in life, etc. But heavy use of Instagram Facetune, full-priced fast fashion mall-wear and tacky-swank selfie locations couldn’t make her or her friends look like much more than Pine Bluff Walmart greeters.

            It made me cringe because you could sense the political ramifications of it which are all too common these days. People living in debt and above their means and having sad aspirations to tacky appearances of wealth and absolutely zero sense of what it all means, who’s being victimized in the process or the forces that are influencing all of it. That’s what’s trashy about it– the awkward, mindless grasping, not the state of financial struggle itself. I have far more respect for the single mother who cleans toilets to feed her kids. I have more respect for my rich friends who don’t show it off and give a lot to important causes.

            And FW, who was raised socialist and sort of thought of himself as a social justice warrior (at least when he was trying to talk me out of a new stove to replace the old, broken one or kind of/sort of urging me to ration basic dietary staples) quickly started shifting his politics to mesh with trasherella’s vapid, materialist stance the more he paid for kibble. He started bellowing political nonsense to the point that one of his closest friends tore his head off for it and left FW shaken and near tears and looking old, bloated and stupid in his skinny young-dude jeans and man-ho stretch shirts with gapping buttons.

            Waste, pretense, delusion, emptiness. Bleah. I need brain bleach. And I’d like to get back the marital money that boosted Shmoopie’s ticky-tacky full-price lifestyle for nearly two years and put it towards the kids’ futures. But that precise amount remains as unpaid debt on FW’s credit cards.

            • I totally get this. Klootzak is the dictionary image of cheap when it comes to buying a winter coat for our child or to replace the old oil furnace that no longer works (“Just run the gas fireplace 24/7 to warm up the house! We don’t need the furnace running.”) but not when it comes to schmoopies! The OW get to stay at fine bed and breakfasts, feasting on salmon, and lounging all day in the spa robes he bought them to remember the experience by. He spares no expense on them. But on his actual family, no, he can’t be spending money. We need to reuse everything, limp along, and make do.

              Klootzak benefitted financially for 20 years on my sewing things for him and repairing things. All that savings was good for the environment but also was supposed to buy us an early and comfortable retirement. But he was spending through the nose for the sparkletwat of the month. And the minute he is gone, it will be boo hoo that he has to pay support and can’t control the use of funds. He has an incredible lockdown on my finances. I’m looking forward to that ending.

            • I hate you are stuck in that.

              My fuckwit put a woodstove in our house, ripped out the gas furnace, and put in cheap baseboard heaters that were so ineffective. I was living like Little House on the Prairie. Meanwhile unknown to me he was wining and dining assorted whores including the whore he married.

              I got some of that money back; but dam it was cold in that house. I could keep the wood stove going; but after he left and we ran out of wood I was left with just the baseboard heaters. So I jacked up those cheap heater to high, put in a couple safe stand alone heaters and let the asshole pay the bill.

              Then I sold the wood stove and the freaking water bed that he had insisted on, to pay for the new heaters. He likely wanted the water bed so he could sneak whore in while I was working.

  • WTH is is with FWs and missed car payments? Both cars were in both names (I naively thought I was protecting myself by insisting I be on both titles along with him), and the decree stated that he had to refinance his car in his name only and that I would get his name off the title to my paid off car. Of course he did no such thing and then proceeded to miss payments, which impacted my credit. Did he face any consequences with the court or otherwise? Of course not. In retrospect, when the loan company called me, I should have told them to go ahead and repo the car and taken the hit to my credit. I have high credit, so it didn’t take terribly long to go back up, and I was able to refinance my mortgage and buy a new (to me) car a year or so after that happened. The quicker you can sever any ties to him the better. I wouldn’t be surprised if he enjoys the kibbles he gets from your collection requests. You reacting is actually an incentive for him to not pay; he gets a nice ego boost. He gets to remain in contact with you and has a degree of control over you. Drop the rope and let others do the dirty work of dealing with FW.

    • And I’ll bet he loves playing the ‘I’m so struggling to make ends meet Oh so Sad Sausage’ part. WOE IS ME!!!!
      Megan has to listen to this shit, every month, and he loves it. Whether it’s true, or not 😉 is another question!
      Megan, please, let the bank repo the car. It will end this torture, plus it will be sort of satisfying.
      Then block his contacts!

      • I didn’t even go after him for all of the money he racked up on my credit cards, which was probably around 15k. He didn’t have an attorney (couldn’t afford one, shocker) and basically had to agree to my terms but I prioritized getting the car out of my name because I didn’t want to be liable or tied to him due to the vehicle. I took it back and sold it for a loss which is the money he owes me.

        • Ok, glad you’re not on a note anymore!
          I took a HUUUUGE financial hit, because my X is a Borderline PD, and an alcoholic that doesn’t work. He tried to cause so much trouble, like delaying the sale of our house for so long. I was just glad to get it all done. But now, my income is my own, and doing just fine for myself, plus I can help my sons if they need it.

  • When my wife left she took the her car (that I signed for , mind you) and it was in good shape. I told her it was her responsibility to make the payments (it really wasn’t that much but her irresponsibility caught up with her). The car was repo’d and I , having my name on the title , got a letter that it had been impounded for non-payment and to pay $500.00 to get it out. I went to get it and …OMG , it was in terrible shape , flat tires , dented hood , full of trash. I paid the fee and took possession , took it home and fixed it the best I could and you better believe she never got it back. That car was no more than 2 years old. ExW is/was worthless!

  • I’d garnish him for that snotty email alone. He created the problem by financing a car in your name without your permission (isn’t that identity theft??) and now he wants to be an asshole about it? Let there be consequences.

    My ex just returned the kids’ wooden Advent calendar broken (he carelessly dumped it in a box with no packing) and I put him on notice that from now on, if he breaks the kids’ shit, I will buy a new one and Venmo him for reimbursement. If he doesn’t pay we’ll go back to court.

    Felt great.

  • I think the worst part of your predicament is that it is long term and will always be a hassle month to month trying to get the payment from him.
    It keeps you locked in to his BS drama of a life that you do NOT need in yours.
    There have to be some benefits of divorce and getting rid of the toxic spouse completely needs to be the very best one.
    Your mental space is way too valuable to give up to that. You have a precious life to live.
    It’s a tremendous emotional and physical cost to stay in that loop with him, how much is your peace of mind this very day worth to you?
    I heard on the news yesterday that prices on used cars are up 37% right now! Probably since hard to get the parts on new ones and the supply chain is way backed up.
    If you hold the title on that car, get it repo’ed and sell it and be one and done.
    You do not need the aggravation of continuing to deal with him, as he tries to guilt you about all his sad life choices.
    How many passes have we given these people?!
    What do you deserve in your life?
    It is not selfish, it is self protective for peace of mind that will be putting you on a path to joy in your own life again. You deserve peace.
    Life’s too short, disconnect from that train wreck who is well on his way to his derailing trajectory. You are not on that track any longer.
    Choices have consequences, you didn’t make that rule.

    • This is what I needed to hear, thank you. The car has been dealt with this is the money he owes me when I sold it for a loss. But it doesnt help me with moving forward when I have to continue to deal with him and hear his woe is me stories. Thank you.

      • No matter what you do, you don’t have to “hear” anything. No phone calls, no texts. You don’t have kids. There’s no reason to be open to this sort of contact.

        If he’s whining by email, ignore. You are either getting money or you’re not. If he’s sending money, nothing needs to be said. If he’s not, you either garnish or you let it all go.

        NO MORE CONTACT IS THE GOAL. Do what you will about the money

  • Sell the car. Is it the one you use? Or is it the one he has? Either way, if it’s financed in your name, you can sell it without his permission. If it’s yours, trade it in for another. Even if you take a financial hit and have to roll part of the old loan into the new, it will spare you a lot of stress. You’ll probably spend more on a lawyer. My attorney advised me that sometimes it’s better to take a financial loss for the sake of your mental and emotional health. Used cars are selling for a good price. I sold my ex’s car for more than we owed on it (not a small amount) even though it had been in several accidents and had over 100,000 miles on it. I opted to sell our marital home, even though I had loved it. I can’t tell you what a burden off my shoulders it was to do both of those things. It stings a bit to start over, but it’s often worth it for your peace of mind. Your ex’s response sounds a lot like what my ex would say to me. The less you have to deal with a person like that, the better.

  • Re “teen bride” and taking you for a ride:
    Megan wrote, “I found out my 40-year-old ex-husband was cheating on me with a 19-year-old in Feb. 2018,” and “Also, he and the teenage girlfriend got married a couple of weeks ago .” Other writers have also referred to teen wife. If she was 19 in Feb. 2018, she was 22 when she married in Jan. 2022, and will be 23 next month. (The alternative is that she’s now 19, which means she would have been 15 and he should have been prosecuted.)
    Megan, you want to untie him, and made a great start, but you need to let go of the apron strings. He’s living in another state, yet you know he got fat and what he wore to his recent wedding. Why do you care and why do you know? You didn’t mention kids of your own, although you said you ‘re getting some kind of support. Unless you are getting info from shared kids, block those info channels.
    Every day you delay is another day he has to drive the car into the ground and drive down the value. I doubt he’ll treat it any better than he treated you. Get the most you can get for it through court and repo.
    Assuming you got the car loan before you found out about the affair, it’s been at least 4 years, and most car loans back then were for less than 5 years. Are you paying monthly, or did you pay it off?
    Here’s something even worse he could do: transfer the car into his new wife’s name. Get it now, before it’s gone.
    You were mighty in the divorce and did not let him force you to finance his new life with Schmoopied, as he bragged, except for his wheels. He’s tying you up in knots over this. Every month, whether you get a check or not, you get a reminder of him. Time to cut that rope. Good luck.

    • Thank you. I actually had it written in my divorce papers that he needed to refinance or sell the car within a couple of months or I would take the car back and sell it for a loss- which so what I did and what he owes me. I was still Facebook friends with some of his high school friends which is how I saw what I did- since deleted. I’ve done a really good job at distancing myself from him and not engaging about anything other than these payments but just being tied to him in any way for a couple more years makes my blood boil. I just want my money and for him to go away.

  • Oh man this would tick me off!

    After D-Day but before we I moved out-the ex and I bought a brand new camping trailer (totally stupid of me-but at that point I didn’t want the kids to think anything was up and we couldn’t use our 30 year old camper we had).

    We financed it in both our names (I didn’t want this thing AT ALL).

    I had it put in my divorce settlement that he had 2 years to put it in his name only and that HE had to make the payments on it.

    He had the audacity during mediation (before negotiations broke down) that I was the one who INSISTED we get the dang thing!

    He’s scared to death to fuck up his credit (because of his employment with the government)-so he makes those payments every month like clockwork.

    After I moved out-but before the divorce was final-he kept pushing me to use it with my boyfriend. Um-since he had used it with his Schmoopie several times-no thanks. AND-I didn’t want him to be able to tell the lawyers that I had used it even after I moved out and therefore should keep paying half on it.

    I never paid one dime on that thing after I moved out. He kept a log of what I would owe him on it after the divorce-and I never had to pay it.

    I’d get that car repossessed to guarantee it wasn’t a problem anymore.

    This is actually really common on Judge Judy (who just happens to be my Spirit Animal 😂).

    Good luck and may you have the patience of a saint to deal with this douche canoe!

  • Thanks everyone- for clarification, it was written in our divorce papers that he needed to either refinance or sell the cafe to get it out of my name, and when he couldn’t he had to give it back to me. I sold it for a loss and he signed off on the judgment against him so that’s what he’s paying me. We have no children or any other ties to each other whatsoever and I’ve kept communication with him to a minimum and only to discuss these payments.

    I spoke to an attorney who said wage garnishment would be very simple, but they would take 1/3 as their payment. It’s not a ton of money and I’m still thinking that the odds of him paying it all off over the next 3 years are unlikely, but if I go that route I won’t get the whole amount. Then again I would t have to deal with him lashing out at me over the bs going on in his life so it might be worth it?

    • You do don’t have to deal with him lashing out if you don’t want to. You can block him and he can deal with the attorney. You don’t even have to tell him this or announce you are going no contact. Or you can receive his communications and just not respond at all in any way, full NC. It is interesting that the natural result (of anyone really) of no response —no matter how hard they try to engage (charm, pity and finally rage) is to give up. If a Chump has truly kicked their co-dependence and is ready for the drama free life, then the long sought after silence should be the goal and everything you do should be directed with that in mind. You can’t reach Meh if you have to have the last word, or you have to refute every lie, or still try to get FE to see the light and be a decent person or convince him to pay you—they aren’t and will never be any of those things we wish they were. Cut your losses and cut ties.

    • FWIW, I would either go with the lawyer and assume he will likely default on the garnishment at some point, or just take what he sends (without contacting him) and write the rest off as an “Asshole tax,” necessary for your sanity. Either way you are going to have to write a chunk of it off (as unfair as it is), in order to preserve your sanity and serenity.

  • Sell the car even if you take a financial loss. Remove your very last tie to him.

    And, I don’t think I’ve seen this in the comments yet (?), *be careful.* Change your locks, get a home security system, maybe a couple of german shepherds…?

    I don’t trust FWs not to do harm to their Xs and their Chumps if they feel that their chumps are their enemies. I don’t want to get too pessimistic about this, but if a FW (who is already entitled and unhinged by nature) sees you as an *enemy* blocking their path to happiness and not merely an obstacle… well.. I’d worry. I’d really worry.

    Get rid of that last tie that binds you to him. It just means that he owes you money and the two of you are connected and when you angrily demand what you are due, he continues to assign you the role of being “the only thing that stands between me and my happiness.” That’s a dangerous spot to be in.

    Get rid of that last financial tie OR hand it over to a third party to facilitate (lawyer?) and have no more contact with him ever again. He’s not someone you should have any ties or communication with anymore; the longer you do, the more dangerous he could become to your safety, even if he’s only just fantasizing about it.

    I read his email and shivered. It scared me. I’d drop the car situation like a hot potato, in whatever way I can, and would run as fast as I can in the opposite direction.

    • Apologies, I just read your above comment and realized I misunderstood some of the details: the car was sold.

      I amend my comment then: it doesn’t matter how much you do or don’t get back from this car repayment situation, just get out of it as quickly as possible so he’s out of your life as quickly as possible. Even if you don’t get everything you are due to get. Money can’t buy that kind of peace. Getting that dangerous man out of your life completely is worth the price of ten cars.

      A caveat, of course: this is all just my opinion and doesn’t need to be heeded in any way at all. I am just naturally wary and, yes, scared of FWs.

      • Thank you. I would like nothing more than to never speak to or thing about him again! I’m very lucky that after our divorce he moved out of state so I don’t have to worry about running into him, as we worked in the same field. I think the money I spend will be worth it for peace of mind and I’ll take what I can get, even if it’s less than what’s owed. But the fact he is still blaming me for his misfortunes instead of them being results of his own decisions are pretty telling.

        • Agreed! Very telling and, honestly, frightening! I am so glad he doesn’t live near you. Mine still lives near me because we have kids together. I have gone through the Labours of Hercules to ensure that we never really cross paths at all. I’ve heard on the grapevine (the kids chatting about it from time to time) that he’d like to move to another province after they’re grown up and I *pray* that he follows through with that. The idea of him living far away is a dream come true.

        • I agree with Fourleaf. Your ex’s letter scared me. He’s an aggressive bully, and he’s lashing out and blaming you for his shitty circumstances. He’s angry and out of touch with reality. No Contact ASAP, and be cautious and take care.

  • send your lawyer into court wearing a duelling cowboy hat, and garnish the fuck out of his wages. yes, he has to have an income to garnish and if he doesn’t, well, you know what happens. it’s the symbolism of the garnishing his cowboy wages.

    good luck.

  • “Should I go forward with wage garnishment or give him more of a chance to pay this balance off and just deal with him?”

    Yes, do go forward with wage garnishment. No more chances for FW.

    I bet he wouldn’t give you a fight chance if places were reversed (with him still being homewrecker cheater), and would just do everything in his power to make your life hell. Ask me how I know.

    He is asking for time (in an entitled and unacceptable way) only because he was dealt some well deserved karma blows. Boo-hoo! If he had gotten the upper hand financially, the motherfucker would steal from you even more than he already did, your peace included.

    By the way, kudos for being mighty, acting super fast, and not letting this happen.

    Don’t. Pull. Your. Punches.

  • As many others are pointing out, what you agree to during the divorce and what you receive after the divorce are not always the same thing.

    I suggest you do the math. How much will it cost you financially to go after him vs. how much you might receive? In my case, it has rarely been worth it. Yes, this means my EX gets more and more while I get less and less, but the alternative is even less fiscally sensible. (I pay an attorney and still get squat.)

    Just this month I agreed to one more adjustment in his favor (10 years after the marriage ended). But both kids are past 18, and I finally decided it was up to them to stand up to their dad (we are talking college expenses these days). I simply am not willing to go to court one more time to enforce an agreement that he still will be unlikely to pay. Once an EX lives in another state, in most cases the court order to pay up is barely worth anything. Finally, even if the court repossessed his car or garnished his IRS refund or otherwise put teeth into the order, the kids would complain that I was hurting their dad, even though I would be giving all the recovered funds to them for college expenses. No longer. It is their turn to play hardball or deal with the consequences. I’m retiring from my position as family court warrior to the position of sympathetic ear: “Really, your dad reneged on his promise to pay for your books this term, honey? How sad. Here, have a chocolate chip cookie. Have you tried the library?”

  • I have experienced theft of marital assets, and not receiving legally owed debt repayment from ex’s and renters. I’ve gone to court and garnished wages. I’ve fought to protect my remaining assets and to get support for my children. The lawyers get paid, the court costs get paid, and sometimes you get some of your money. The entire situation is stressful. It is a burden you carry, and only you can decide if you will continue to carry the burden, or you will cut your losses.

    In the end, although I suffered from some financial loss, I feel that I won. I lived with integrity, and was able to stay employed, and house and feed my children. It was not the life I dreamed of or wanted but it was the life I had. Overall, I learned a lot about the value of truth and dependability, and how to choose friends who exhibit integrity. I wish I had learned these life lessons earlier but at least I survived life with FW’s.

    We change when it becomes too painful to continue as we are. You have a pain tolerance. Choose accordingly.

  • send your lawyer into court wearing a duelling cowboy hat, and garnish the fuck out of his wages. yes, he has to have an income to garnish and if he doesn’t, well, you know what happens. it’s the symbolism of garnishing his cowboy wages.

    good luck.

  • I don’t have much to add to all the great advice and support for Mighty Meagan (well done, you!), just a suggestion for our fearless Chump Lady–

    Wouldn’t “LIKE A FUCKWIT COWBOY” make a great cartoon?

    Stay Mighty, Chumps! #lovethelandofmeh

    • Omg yes. Also, I’d like to add that when movers showed up to move his crap to a storage unit, the truck had huge snakes on it. And the movers got boxes from an adult store so all of his stuff was packed in boxes with porn labels on it. I wish I could attach photos because it was truly amazing.

  • The beauty of not sharing children with a FW is that you can enforce these types of payments and not have him/her running to tell the kids about your ‘cruelty/money obsession.’

  • You didn’t force him to cheat on you with a teenager, you didn’t cause her to get pregnant, you didn’t cause him to get fat, move out of state and lose him job. I get the impression you propped this immature being up financially. He has to adult. He has to stop being a thief.

    If you don’t mind me saying so, do you really feel guilty? Or is it fear? These low-life scum bags know how to gaslight and manipulate to get what they want – $$$$ from you and – free sex/housekeeping services from teenage bride. Take a look at jaxwritessongs and ‘adding sad violins to my ex’s bs apology text.’

    • I do honestly feel a little sorry for him. My life has gotten so much better and his clearly has not. But again that’s part of his manipulating me into feeling bad for him and not holding him accountable.

      • Hi Megan, I feel sorry for my ex, too. The best thing for him is to learn to act like an adult. He’ll model appropriate behavior to his new kid and be better at keeping jobs and money in the bank.

        Taking him to court and showing him that the law shoots down bs may force him to grow up. That’s truly what he needs. It’s a win-win situation.

        Good luck to you, Megan. Am so sorry this guy is still putting you through the wringer.

        • That’s how chumps get hooked, stick around too long and continue working as their “chaos janitor”. Because we feel sorry 😞 for them. Enough/basta

      • You can feel sorry for him but that doesn’t mean you act on it. The fact he had the nerve to give you attitude instead of being contrite. He is not your responsibility. All this that happened is because he chooses to make these decisions. Go on and get this done through the courts. You have nothing to feel bad about.

      • If you had no contact you wouldn’t know how he was doing and shouldn’t care. He fired you from the wife job right?

  • Very few men can afford a wife and a girlfriend. He’s her problem now, no do over’s. You have earned freedom, enjoy it. Tell him to pay up and scurry away.

  • Something that just crossed my mind: do you have any means to be sure that he is really in such dire straits that he cannot afford to pay you a couple hundred bucks a month? Sometimes it is not that they don’t have the money, they just prioritize something (everything?) else other than paying what is due to the chump (wedding bills maybe?). In fact, being a chump is never being a priority.

    My fuckwit got me convinced of her not being able to contribute *anything* to our kids school tuitions and health care (even past due bills I wasn’t aware of) due to the massive debt she ran into during her affair. She told me she would be struggling even to pay her rent although her job pays very well. Chumpy me then offered to take sole responsibility for these expenses (not her rent though) *forever* and set it in stone in our divorce settlement. Now, if I fail do so, for whatever reason, I would be in trouble (there are extenuating circumstances that could take me off the hook, of course, but I don’t intend to fall into any one of them). Here where I hail from, private schools and health care are both expensive and a good call if you can afford them, because public services are somewhat unreliable. I chose to take one for the team, since my XW is (always has been) such an unreliable source of income. The point is: even before the ink was dry on our divorce decree there she was parading in social media several cosmetic treatments, expensive new clothes, nights out at fancy clubs and restaurants, a personal tennis coach (!), and trips to resorts. And she still complains that I “screwed her up” with the divorce! Un-fucking-believable.

    Let the motherfucker explain to the judge if and why he cannot afford to pay you in such modest installments. He may well be hiding money. And even if he is not, his current predicament is not your problem.

  • This is a different situation. She can get her money as she should. She has a way forward which can be pursued. No reason for her to walk away from this money. This is his problem. I agree with CL to the point she can also try to find a way for this to end.

  • Megan, so sorry that you ex-cheater has got to face adult issues like paying bills and holding down a job. You are out of that business of doing the adult part and his new teen bride has that job.get your money through a garnishment if you can. The sooner you can be free of contact the better life will be. I am in the midst of going through assets with a FW and he has whined through the attorneys that divorce is expensive. He has a sadz. Yep, guess you can’t provide the money to Schmoopie that you could before you got busted (my thoughts to the cheater). I say nothing to him unless needed and then it is totally grey rock. Of course, I think all kinds of shot that I would really like to say to his sorry ass.my main goal is to get this FW totally out of my life. Schmoopie has the prize,she won the pick me dance and I may end up with a mere toaster which is oh so much better than a FW.

  • Megan, I was ripped off financially by Cheater #1, in my early 20s.

    And yet when we broke off our engagement, his awful mother wanted ME pursued to return very small gifts of money his grandparents gave us at Christmas.

    I was broke, deserted, and young and scared. But I used that disordered freak show to ensure that I never heard from him again.

    I cut my losses – several thousand dollars’ worth, at a time when I was living alone on a tiny income, eating rice and potatoes and the occasional meat pie (and living pretty much on cigarettes and coffee otherwise).

    And you know what? IT WAS WORTH IT. And it was partly worth it because I get to tell the story of just what a lousy man he was.

    I can’t imagine how awful it must feel for you to wait for FW to show up with a stupid hatful of excuses every month like that.

    I know we believe in consequences. But why do you have to be Mommy still? He’s not your child. He’s a grown man and not worthy of a minute more of your time.

    If you can, I’d cut my losses, write this debt off, and tell him you never, ever want to hear anything from him again.

    Ever.

    And I bet that you never would.

    And if you did, you’ve got the weapon ready: “I wrote off the debt, so fuck off.”

  • In considering what I’d fight for and what I wouldn’t, I also considered what would give me long-term peace and space in my head. Peace and space was important.

    As an example, I decided to stop quibbling over college funds and health insurance for them when the oldest was about to graduate and the younger was only two years behind. My ex wanted to “help” and put that into one version of the draft agreement, but in a cringey, red-flag way. They were commuter students, going to a state school, so borrowing tuition/fees and insurance money would not have been a huge debt for the younger. I had enough for just one more semester, no more. My attorney pointed that out, and I agreed. Out it went. I told my ex how to contribute to the school bills if he so chose, but he never did (of course). It was all a game to him, apparently. The youngest one scrambled and got more work and another scholarship, and we never had to borrow.

    For me at least, being done with all necessary interaction was worth the short-term financial loss. In a place similar to Megan, I might go after him for a while and then just drop it and tell him never to contact me again. As Chumplady has said, trust that they suck.

  • Megan,

    Garnish his wages. Go no contact. Let him get so far behind in the rear-view mirror that you can no longer see him.

    This is a great moment to say to one and all that one key to gain a life happiness is not caring one bit what a lying, cheating jackass who can’t pay his rent says about you. He sees you as his bitter X? That’s projection, baby.

  • What is it with these dicks and cars? Mine quibbled over the agreed value of the car I took with me during the property settlement. So I parked it in his drive, left the keys, and added the value to the cash component on my submission. Then I bought my son’s car off him. For less. Ex signed the new settlement so I made a profit from ex’s bs. *eyeroll*.

  • I’m in the ‘write it off and tell him it’s worth it to never see or hear from him again’ camp, unless you are still actively paying off the loan then set the collections agencies directly onto him. Man child gotta mamchils and all that.

  • Ah, my ex loves buying new cars! What is it with cars. When we split, he wanted to take my car off me. He had a brand new car! Yes, he paid for it, but then I paid every other bloody bill except for the Broadband! I told him to come and take the car from me. I did not want that hanging over me.

    You’d think he’d be the same! Just hand the car back to you and then be done with it. Go and buy a banger of a car until he can afford otherwise! It just makes no sense.

    I still have that car. It is still going strong. Ex has had 4 brand new cars since then. A few months ago he asked me if it was ok if he could skip paying child support for the month ahead, as a one off!

    My response ‘No, it’s not ok’. I got the money!

    When I told my sister about him asking if he could not pay child support this month, she responded with ‘Why is he still fucking with you?’

  • Without knowing your personal financial situation, I too might consider writing it off as a loss. But first I’d take him to court (hopefully small claims…that’d be cheaper for you cause you could do it yourself without an attorney) for the remainder balance, on the premise that he broke your contract by failure to meet the payment schedule so must now pay in full (hopefully your contract has this very common clause in it). After you get your settlement, you can decide any number of routes. Not that he owns real property, but in a lot of states you can attach your settlement to his property so that it can’t be transferred to another person without payment to you. Or maybe wage garnishment is a possibility…but I think the laws about that are trickier. And so on. Then go about your life knowing that you may never see that money again. And never do business with a fuckwit henceforth!

    • That’s a great idea. Get him every way you can.

      Standing up to him in court sets a boundary. These losers can abuse the court system to make you suffer. Show him you won’t put up with the small bs and he will think twice about pulling some big bs on you.

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