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Did the Affair Partner Tell You?

One of the lousier ways to find out you’re a chump is having the news sprung on you via the affair partner. There are worse ways, of course. (Via your kids, via a paternity test, or walking in on the festivities… #worse). But Schmoopies outing themselves is pretty common.

And it’s generally not done in a spirit of warm bonhomie. More like a Pick Me Dance throw down. Abandon the field! They are claiming their prize!

(Really, it’s the dumbest competition ever. For starters, you didn’t even know you were in a competition. I mean, how fabulous are you if your opponent is completely oblivious and has to be informed of your existence?)

Anyway, today’s Friday Challenge is answering the question — did they tell you? How’d that go over?

TGIF!

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at info@chumplady.com. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • She didn’t tell me directly, but she did post screenshots of their conversations on socials, hoping I’d eventually look her up. When I did, she then had the audacity to post about how she was being “stalked” by me. I gathered all the evidence she left lying around and never looked back.

    • I feel like the obsessive need by (knowing) APs to harass the chump and paint them as a psycho is some kind of cognitive reaction to their own guilt. They have to believe that the chump is a crazy jerk who deserves punishment in order to protect their own self-image as a good person in spite of their immoral actions. In your case, she deliberately crafted a scenario to bait you into behavior that she could tell herself counted as “stalking” in order to vilify you.

    • I’m a stalker too. We can start a club, it’ll be fun. When my Alexa device informed me that her butt plugs and book on polyamory from my husband had been delivered to her, that was me stalking her. That’s how the ex and all our former friends (his shitty ass friends now, he can keep them) spun that shit. I was just standing in my kitchen and Alexa told me a package had been delivered and I asked what package? I didn’t want to know that. I got smacked in the face with stuff over and over again long after I’d stopped looking. I eventually got rid of everyone who had anything to do with him or his girlfriends so I could stop getting emotionally drop kicked because I couldn’t take it anymore.

      But I’m a stalker. Yeah. It was infuriating for awhile. I was just trying to move on with my life. They couldn’t be decent in any way or use any kind of discretion but somehow that’s my fault. It’s like they rub all the information in our faces and then scream that we’re stalking them because we saw it. Like yeah, no shit ho bag, you publicly said something (or used someone else’s amazon account) and people saw it. That’s not stalking.

  • She didn’t tell me. But she hinted plenty. She kept mysteriously appearing wherever we were… what a coincidence!

    We were at a Sports Authority getting little league gear for our 9 year old son and suddenly there she is all sweaty and running in… while her 2 boys were at little league games of their own (she left them there to do this!). And then bought nothing — just said hi to me (I think it was the first time we “met”) chatted with FW and left.

    FW last minute told me about a BBQ that his “coworker” (AP) was having after work for everyone to stop by. He said “bring our son, there’s kids here to play with.” I messaged several times “do you need me to bring anything? Wine?” No response. I showed up with a bottle of wine and our son… she answers the door and says “I didn’t know YOU were coming!” (Huh??) And when I walked into the back I see FW sitting like a King at a table. No one else from work. A few neighbors there. I had no idea but got really uncomfortable. She was acting hyper and odd. At one point the conversation turned to AP saying “it’s so funny …FW is the only in our office who isn’t divorced!” Huh??!! It was a set up to get her boys and our son to meet each other. And FW was relishing this weird configuration of having us both there. I don’t think she expected him to invite me — just bring over our son because I had book club that night. He totally set that up to feed his ego. But she was sure to hint to me that she was moving in on him.

    APs creepy hints were how I figured out what was going on.

    • Ugh. They’re awful people. Both suck! I’m sorry that happened to you. Yeesh.

      And I can just picture your FW sitting at that table like a cat in cream. #kibbleoverdose #CAKE

        • MS,
          That is exactly what I did! He knew my boundaries, he knew I’m out the door for ANY hint of cheating, period! Dumb-ass couldn’t help himself. He felt entitled. The sickest part,… and I am not making this shit up, During our 4 year relationship, I was waiting for an organ transplant, due to a genetic, autoimmune disease. I was 36, and he was 49. I really thought I met someone mature! WOW! Lucky me. I did online dating for 2 years and met some nice people but the topic always went to sex. It got boring fast.

          Anyway, I felt this person understood me because His brother had a heart, liver, and kidney transplant, and then died by a drunk driver. ( actually that was partly a lie too! It happened in reverse order, and he diid not het killed by a drunk driver! His mother, of whom I love, corrected me! I believe he lied about the tragedy of his brother to get pity, sympathy, and whatnot, He told my best friend the exact same tragic story! Now lie. In essence, housed his brothers horrible story and tragedies together women to like him. My friend. was like, ” why would he lie to me? Why would he lie to everyone? Especially you? I said he tried to get into my pants that night, and for you, he needed a backup alibi to support his story so I would stick around. He gaslighted everyone. Thats why all of our friends think he is so great. Well that, and because he is captain of arcading sailboat that I crewed on, until my bones /paprathyroids from 8 years of dialysis waiting for a transplant stopped me for sailing.)
          Point being, I did so much work for his lazy ass while I had to do hemodialysis every other day, across town, drive myself, take care of every tiny thing, for my health, appointments, research how to register outside of California, for a kidney, because I was developing heart problems. I also worked a part time job, I somehow got conned into being his housewife so, that HE could easily accomplish his job (which included a long affair with his ho-worker) receive his lazy accolades, and come home to an ultra clean, well managed, house, with hot dinner ready for him. Ohhh what an idiot I was! I was trying to save us money by cooking, and showing him I loved him. (he got FAT! Not my problem) I should have used that valuable time to get my nails done, hair done, work out, Take care of my mental health, further my career, spend more time with my friends who love me. He went from writing love letters to me every morning with a cup of coffee, and trips to Hawaii, and Nappa to moving into his condo, me finding all new furniture/housewares for him, he bitched about the price. I am a great shopper! (He became soooo weird and indecisive! He couldn’t make a decision about what color coffee table he wanted and what size, and what shower curtain to get!) It was hilarious in a way. I could never figure it out. Why he needed me so badly to re-design his downtown condo. Anyone have any ideas?
          For 4 years I dated Mr. Amazing, but I became more and more exhausted. I asked him to make dinner on my dialysis nights, and he fell asleep on the couch at 7 pm after eating a whole bag of chips. I did get chili dogs. It must have been exhausting living a double life! Like he took her to concerts, dinners, France, and paid, she was just another 50 some year old city project manager who has a long nose. I called her 2x to tell her to back off and don’t talk to my boyfriend as I already confronted him, she claimed nothings going on. Bullshit! She needs kibbles just as much as he does. Second time, I called her stupid sneaky ass up, and said, he is all yours, Come get him. I don’t date liars and cheaters. I believe you two would make a fine couple together. He already bought you concert tickets, and told me that he bought them for me! Hahahaha. I liked the Doors in fucking High School. Thank you apple for clarifying the mystery because I was in fucking hell. Jekyl and Hyde! Even 2 years later I find more and more lies, and I want to get away, but I still cry, My heart is so angry. His behavior is a sick sick selfish fuck. Oh he refused a vasectomy after I got my IUD out. (it expired) then we used condoms. He could’ve killed me if I got pregnant. or HPV. I wish I could sue him for attempted murder, Because he knew the rules with dialysis and pregnancy. Sex was over so fast, it wasn’t worth it. It felt super anxious, definitely pre-mature. I’m hot stuff. I can model. But it would be for me only, as I have a masters degree. I still find out lies, he got a lot of girlfriends fast. which makes me laugh. I loved this person so much in the beginning, for 3 years. He was such a gentleman. Then he turned into an asshole. I feel it is because I spent my time getting OFF of dialysis as it was causing my heart to have problems. More pressure on me, less kibbles for him. Im frustrated Still feel smooch lightning bolts of pain. I did nothing wrong. He helped himself to an entire relationship. I don’t need to use people to make myself happy. Thats fake and its wrong. He has my cats, as I had no choice but to be homeless in San Diego or live with my abusive hoarder mom. Ironically Covid started shelters had long wait lists, I could not get a transplant if I stayed in a shelter, due to diseases like Hep C and TB, just like prison. I had to have a 30 day health period. So iff to the monster who made me, at 3 am. That just magnified the pain terrible. I was and still am blessed with friends and his family has been a better family to me than my own. I moved out 6 months ago and I got a donor kidney at the Mayo Clinic by myself September 24 2021. I paid for everything, Including my racist anti-Semitic and vocally anti-gay Sister in law, who never once came to my appointments. That was 5 weeks of recovery hell. Dickhead texted me, (no card no phone call-oh well who cares?) to tell me very formally that congratulations are in order??? Who says that shit? He was with me, living together, sailing and winning races for 4 years, I spent every holiday with his family. He knew I spent every free minute trying to find a kidney, so I would get off of dialysis and stay alive! Did he help me? Nope! Only for orientation at ONE hospital. I’ve done 7 of them. California’s wait list is 10-14 years long. Arizona, Texas, Utah wait list is 2-3 years. The only deterrent is cost for hotel, flights, waiting for a random call at any time. My family did not and wouldn’t helpmeet. Because it’s better to be out of sight and out of mind. That way they could go on their vacations and ski trips with no worries. After dr, Jekyl quit on being my caregiver, my mom said yes, and 4 weeks later said no she cant. She has an over active bladder. Next local sibling is my sister who doesn’t work but has 2 boys 11 years old. She can ask her ex husband for help, but again she said yes of course she would help. And then when the social worker called her to confirm, she said a big fat NO. Because her kids are starting school and she cant just drop everything to meet me at the hospital. Mayo Clinic relies heavily on caregivers. My sister was told that I would therefore be de-listed from receiving a kidney transplant since I have no caregiver. And sister said thats fine! That was a huge painful gut punch. My own family and cut 4 weeks or less of their life to just be present. Its hospital rules. No caregiver, no transplant. Oh and it was in the middle of covid. So thats the excuses my mom and sister used. On top of being rejected by my sister, mother and ex boyfriend (I had no body, my friends have jobs and kids, and this is an impromptu thing. I would have paid for a 2 room suite. I was organized. The icing on the cake was that when the social worker called my sister to confirm. My sister freaked out badly, became so angry, called me during my 4 hour treatment with my 3 masks on, and bitched me out so badly! It was stunning. She had already agreed. She knew all of my annual tests were finished, and she was caught off guard. Sorry cant plan that ski trip to mammoth (eye roll). Are people afraid? She made a unilateral decision to cancel her caregiving offer without telling me, and therefore the result was that I was de-listed from getting a transplant for 4 months. I will never ever forget that letdown. My mom supported her choice. If I had time to prepare to find someone else, and innadition, she had told me earlier, she couldn’t make it, thats something I can respect. I was in shock. I had several panic attacks, I saw a therapist, and a psychiatrist who gently helped me. I was diagnosed with complex PTSD, I lost my best friend who I thought cared for me and loved me, I lost the safety and security of our home the built, I lost my 2 kitties we adopted together for life. Funny thing… he had NO PLAN for what to do about our kitties if we ever split up. They were my emotional support animals and would pile on top of me after difficult dialysis treatments. He never talked to me about him taking them. I felt it fair I take them and he can visit whoever he wanted, just like he told me. (he had moved on, 1 month after I moved out,-but he lied about it. He had many many short term girlfriends during covid. (I laughed!) So… My dear Chump nation, for me, I had health problems and lived with another abusive monster who stole my covid relief money from me, and would eat all of my food, and wouldn’t shut up! Every morning, I dreaded making coffee because she would corner me and yammer away. Thank God for therapy and anti anxiety medicine. What mother steals from her daughters SSDI money? I believe she had munchausen by proxy. She never ever encouraged me to get better and get a transplant out of state. She enjoyed me being sick. She was punishing me for leaving her to live with Dr.Jeckyl. She is a big time grifter at manipulating corporations to her benefit. So if she passes, we 4 kids must pay capital gains taxes on 3 million worth of property, land and real-estate. It was so hurtful when she stole my transplant savings from me. I live on $1200. a month SSDI. for rent, food, bills car, insurance. All of my family knows that. And if I make too much money, I loose my benefits.
          So in summary, add all of the health crap and transplant recovery with my racist, Anti Semitic, Anti-
          Gay, anti wealth, anti any color or ethnicity, SIL, for 5 weeks, I kept my mouth shut or I would have killed her. I did report her to the hospital for patient abuse and demanding of money from me. Which I never said I would pay her. I said I would pay for gas, food, lodging, groceries, shopping for little things. So a free vacation where she never even went to the hospital except to pick me up.I thank God for all my friends for support, and my ex’s family. They called more often than my own family! I suppose a transplant isn’t life and death. So fuck them. My SIL left early for “vacation” without telling me haha. What a nutt. Vacation from quilting? Vacation for smoking bongloads all day? Jesus, I don’t make this stuff up. It all started with an office ho-worker…. and I could have lost my life. Please Chumps, trust those littered flags now because they get bigger. I have never felt so hurt, destroyed, robbed, betrayed, made a fool, and thrown away in my life. 4 years, and it ends so badly. It started wonderfully and I was so happy I found a great guy who I had so much in common with. I would love to se karma work her magic as he has never been cheated on. I want him to feel what I feel for as long as I felt the pain. He uses women to move on and feel better. I told him that doing so is wrong. baaahahaha he doesn’t care. He wants what he wants. Words from his family. His older brother is nothing like this monster. He is a sweet house husband who get screwed by his ex wife, who one day, picked up everything and left taking their daughter. Its just crushing. How can people act so horribly? I would Neve in a million years ever consider screaming and yelling at any spouse or partner for tiny things. Never! I respect myself too much.

          Thank you CN for reading this book. I poured my heart out at 4 am, now it is 7:30 PT. I have no desire to meed another cheater. I want to find a decent honest guy who has self respect and self love for himself and for others. Just don’t cheat or lie, It isn’t that hard, And what your actually doing is sucking the life out of your partner. If your not happy, let them down gently. No one can read your mind. Just be a fucking kind, decent human being. I share my story with you CN because it is the most incredible pain and betrayal I have ever been through, in my life. Funny coincidence, I got my life saving call -and I have high antigens, so although in my 30’s I am a difficult match, making the wait so much longer on dialysis. Anyway My call came September 24 which is the exact same date My ex’s brother got his call for a new heart! And this was revolutionary at Stanford University in the late 80’s. Ex’s mom told me before going in to surgery, that Mark is watching over you. he is your Guardian angel. He will protect you. And I prayed and talked to him. It was very comforting. How did my ex end up such a rotten selfish entitled person? and everyone else is not in his family? On a good note, I am doing fine! I have a heart valve problem being fixed in May, and that is from dialysis. But physically I am fine. I live alone. Its ok, lonely. No kittens. But one step at a time. I pray a lot and I check in with my tribe, my chump nation.

    • Michelle

      That’s awful. Some people are really f***ed up. Sorry you had to go through this.

      Hope you are your son are doing well now that the trash was taken out.

    • How horrible of them both! Totally narcissistic of him, ugh, I can just see it. But really pathetic of her too. Like, you were an unknowing victim, but she seriously sat there and knowingly allowed him to humiliate her by having you both there and didn’t catch on that this wasn’t right? She deserves whatever he pulls on her in the future. She’ll have no one to blame but herself, because it’s not like she didn’t know she chose a douche who gets off on humiliating his partner.

    • ““it’s so funny …FW is the only in our office who isn’t divorced!” ”

      So creepy. I have mentioned befgore I think that fw had come in the day before his work Christmas party and asked me if whore (his direct report) and her date could sit at our table. I didn’t know he was fucking her, so of course I said fine.

      So whore and another woman who worked for the city (her best friend sat at our table) whores best friend made a joke about them being dates; then she said:

      “oh you and fw are so cute together, you guys are always walking around holding hands; the whole city would be shocked if you divorced” Yep, as God is my witness, that is exactly what she said.

      I was already suspicious fw was fooling around, as he had turned mean and nasty; but I never suspected whore. Mostly because she just wasn’t that attractive, and she wasn’t really bright. I didn’t suspect whores friend and I don’t know why but I didn’t.

      Imagine my surprise when it turned out to be whore (direct report).

      I don’t think he was relishing that moment. I am pretty sure he didn’t plan on that little performance because he was sitting there sweating like a hooker in the front pew.

      I will never know, but I am pretty sure she insisted on sitting at our table that night and he went along.

      I believe it was about a week later that someone dropped a dime on him and filed an ethics report. Things tumbled quickly after that.

    • Mysteriously appearing wherever you went – is this on a list somewhere in the OW Handbook? I knew OW worked in the office across the hall; I knew she’d said “I always work for doctors, I always have an affair with the doctor, and my husband always makes me quit”….but I’d never spoken to her and suddenly the woman was everywhere! I literally could not leave home without encountering her. The lightbulb went off in my head when I saw her ghosting through the aisles behind me at Walmart, but not approaching until my husband joined me – then she rushed up, greeted him, stood too close, etc. I had no idea how she found me until I realized (years later) that she’d been in our car and had put a tracking app on the cell phone we kept in the car.

  • My ex-H told me, not his intern/AP. They blew up their marriages in the same weekend. I know it’s not a pain competition, but it was pretty awful to hear out of the blue (when he said we were sitting down to discuss next steps to buying our dream home) “Actually there will be no home for us at all. ILBNILWY and never have been and I’m leaving you for intern.” He had no interest in saving our marriage even for appearances or for cake. She didn’t have to force his hand. He told me with what looked like *glee*.

    • FW ran the same playbook. I actually confronted him because I guessed he was cheating with coworker (although I didn’t really believe it) and he answered “I don’t love you anymore. I love AP!” with crazy *glee*

      FWs are lunatics

      • Yeah, that glee look on their face. The lies they have to tell to believe they are still good people. Super weird. They are lunatics!

        • That look of glee on their faces is another trade mark commonality of cheaters. It’s also in the black market rule book on how to cheat they all have very worn copies of. I’ve seen that look on him myself when he’s delivered the Ilybinilwy blow and sadly, two of my kids have witnessed it from him.
          He decided to make a ‘come clean, cat out of the bag’ type confession to them and actually rambled off a long list of many of his indiscretions in traumatic detail to them.
          The kids and I have never shared all of that incident together( they prob know more than me of who he’s screwed, but way too painful for any of us to go there).
          But they did share with me their terror in seeing a proud of himself smirk cross his face when he described it all as “ back in his ho days”.
          That mask does slip from time to time and you get glimpses of the darkness that lies beneath.

  • The first one slightly stalked until she couldn’t take it anymore. That one ended with drunk phone calls at 2am saying your husband is cheating on you. Woke him up to hear the voice and he knew it was her. A pot of coffee and twenty minutes of staring and deep breaths later came his confession. 20 yrs later she acknowledged and apologized for interfering in our family and marriage.

    Present one confessed to her friends about herself and another one apparently she knows about. She also subtly confessed to my daughter (her employee) that she befriended that it’s like winning your rockstar high school crush(she is 15yrs younger than he is and closer in age to my kids). They both used my daughter in the middle to cover and babysit for their moments thinking she would be cool with it all. Part of her job description. Well, kids are not cool with their “friend” banging their dad and using them to lie about it.
    There are no coincidences and the picture is clear. It’s also in their behavior, attitude, anger and guilty consciences to both ex spouses. Innocent people show empathy compassion and respect. Guilty people seethe while drowning in their own pool of lies so that is the best confession.

    • When they use the word “winning” (in this case instead of poaching) that says a lot about who they are. Of course, since she was the AP, everyone that knew including your daughter already knew how low-class she was. I hate it when the AP or FW delights in others’ pain.

  • Not quite a direct tell but one morning I woke up to an email that said ‘You know that XXX is having an affair, seen in Soho’.

    I had just started a new job and this came to my work email. I couldn’t believe it and he looked so shocked and said I would NEVER do that I’m not that kind of person.

    Long story then about how I’d received other random emails from the same account so I took it to be some kind of spam which I explained to him at length – how relieved he must have been.

    Undoubted now she sent it to me, to hurry things along a bit….. Or someone in her camp did.

    That was some royal spackle there but in fairness my friends, his family and others were absolutely sure he would never be capable of such a thing… We know the ending.

    • It’s amazing how many of us were with men who NO ONE believed would ever do such a thing. Such pillars of the community. The summer of ex-H’s affair he was being so mean to me on a group vacation with our friends that I sat down with one friend who had noticed to talk about it and how I had no idea what was going on. She said “at least you know he’d never cheat on you.” lol. (She really believed that at the time and has been the person who stuck by me the most since everything blew up.)

      • Bless her. It’s hard to face the fact you were so completely fooled. Lotsa people would continue the denial and cut you loose. (Bet lotsa other people did.)

        • This is hilarious! My FW is also named Larry and always presents himself as highly religious/ pious/Godly/Christ-like. Fucking hypocrite. (And we are from Florida)

      • ML was he a Covert Narcissist. STBXW is and therefore nobody will believe me when I told them she was serial adulterer. They all think she is too nice and that I am making it up. So frustrating

    • Similar story. I got an anonymous letter at work telling me about their affair. I later came to believe she was trying to hurry things along because he wasn’t ending our marriage quick enough for her liking.

  • No, she didn’t tell me. She lied to my face about it and said that “nothing is going on” when she’d been fucking my husband for over two years. But in a way, she told me a lot, as she was VERY indiscriminate with her social media, so I learned a lot from that, which confirmed that I was being lied to. My ex would tell me he was going somewhere with so and so, except she’d post photos of the two of them together (or herself at my marital home).

    • She probably lied to your face so that she’d have deniability to your ex-husband, all the while doing The Most on social media so that you’d find out. In the AP Pick Me Dance, every move is calculated.

      • I understand why my ex didn’t tell me (cake is nice – money, help around the house, no lawyers, no child support, sex, etc.) but I often wondered why SHE didn’t tell me. I would have exited that situation quickly and started the divorce and she could have had him and welcome several years before it all finally came out. Instead she let him string me along for over three years while she hung around waiting (including during our 3 month wreckonciliation, when I moved back in with him). It always struck me as odd. My guess is he told her I would go ballistic and hurt her or something, as she was VERY paranoid about me, accusing me of stalking her, following her home, breaking into her apartment, etc. Which was all BS and all totally crazy. I never did anything to her, other than report her to HR when she sent me a threatening text (we were coworkers at the time).

        • I wouldn’t put it past him to have done some of those “stalking” activities, just to keep her paranoid enough not to contact you. (My paranoid father once sabotaged things around the house to “prove” he was being harassed. But he was authentically mentally ill. Although also a cheater.)

          • Oh I totally think the “breaking and entering” was him, to keep her paranoid and make her cling tighter to him and never talk to me. He accused me of stealing his copy of her housekey. I never touched it (and he swore up and down he had “no idea” what that key was for when I asked about on the new key hanging on his wallet chain). Apparently only her little shrine of their mementos got messed with. Something I had no idea even existed (though it explains why my ex basically had always persuaded/forbidden me to come to playdates at her house, even though she often came to mine – yeah, our children played together, and I often made dinner for everyone). He was the only one who had a key to her place, which he somehow “lost” and then accused me of taking. Except my kid found it in my ex’s bedroom and came down the stairs in all innocence saying “daddy, don’t forget your key!” one day when I was there to pick him up. I would never have been so stupid as to commit a crime, especially in the middle of a custody dispute. Lord have mercy. But he even accused me of it in the court documents! Where’s the police report,? That’s what I wanted to know. Apparently she changed her locks after that. Lol. I know it wasn’t me.

            • They enjoy imagining that we are as wrapped up in the drama as they are. If we’re breaking into their houses that makes it edgy and dangerous, rather than banal.

              I know (because she told our daughter) that XW is convinced that I vandalized her car. Passion, drama! Her AP retaliated by sticking a nail through my tire – revenge! Violence! In reality, she was parking her new car in a public parking lot, and I’m sure it got dinged by other car doors. The reality was boring and banal, but she (and AP) constructed a whole fantasy in which I’m a vindictive, dangerous, bitter ex who can’t let go. They have every incentive to imagine we are obsessed by them, and are plotting to undermine or damage them – even if really all we want is to be left alone.

  • The AP told me. I have posted my story before, so sometimes i feel I am being redundant. But the AP was one of my closest friends and also our neighbor. I had suspicions off and on for a few years but was always made to believe I was being ridiculous by both of them. My Dday came about 1 year after my 16 year old son’s funeral (car accident). Which, by the way, she sat with me during trying to be so supportive and caring (ugh). I later would find out that they had actually been sleeping together for 7 years at that point. Its funny what our minds can do, i should have known. All the signs were there. My daughter (who has some mental heath issues) saw an exchange between them while i was out and told me about it. She was 14 at the time, STBX started yelling at her that she was just causing trouble and then proceeded to ask her questions as if he was a prosecuting attorney and she was on trial. By the time that was over she wasn’t sure anymore what she really saw and was confused about her reality. But one thing that stuck with me was the words he said to her, “You will never catch me doing wrong by your mother”. When everything came out a year later she kept saying” I knew what I saw,! I knew I was right!” . AP was later arrested for stalking myself and my youngest child, who she was absolutely obsessed with. She has no children of her own. He was 7 years old when this all came out and had just lost his older brother. The next several years are all a blur. I am embarrassed to say that I am still here 6 years later. I want out but i feel frozen, paralyzed. the thought of not seeing another one of my children every day is too much for me sometimes. But I do have most of my ducks in a row and I now have an awesome therapist, my hope is to get up the courage to give myself permission to be happy. STBX says if I truly loved him I would forgive him and fight harder to keep our family together. (Dick)

    • At the same time you lost your son, you lost the the two people who should have been there to support you: Your husband and your close friend. I can understand your reluctance to push forward and lose your marital status and possibly your home and social circle. Could holding on to your marriage (and perhaps with it, your family home) be a way to hold onto memories of your son? I’m so sorry for his death and the loss to you, your younger son and your daughter, and any other children if you have them.
      STBX and his AP played mind games and worse with your family and your daughter’s mental health. I’m glad you have all your ducks ready know, and wish you strength as you move on to a better life.
      BTW, The Compassionate Friends organization has many resources for people who have experienced a death, including special materials for siblings as well as parents, spouses, etc.

      • GoodFriend, thank you for your reply. The minds games, ugh that is the worst part of all of this (aside from the loss of my son). Right now I am working on reality based thinking with my therapist because i was gaslighted for so long that i do not trust my own reality, i don’t trust myself to know what is real anymore. I hate to sound like i am stuck in a victim mentality but the last few years have really done a number on me for sure. It’s sad to read all of these stories and realize that this is so common. I fear i am losing all faith in love and relationships. I don;t want to be this resentful, scorned woman!

        • GoodFriend. Also, as far as your comment about the family home. Yes at first i just couldn’t bare the thought of another loss. I stayed in a fog for a few years, but now that i know what happened in my “family home” it is all tarnished to me. I am sad to leave the amazing memories of my son here in this home but I also know way too much to ever see only that. the AP was very eager to write out exactly what and where they did there shenanigans. She told me her favorite place was MY bed while she started at our family picture. every single room of my house (even the garage) has been tainted with her slug tracks. I don’t want this house. I do worry about my kids though, especially the youngest. this is the only home he has ever known and he is currently in his older brother’s bedroom which is so special to him. So even if I leave i feel like this will always be home to him – not my new place. Navigating the separation and how much it will hurt my youngest has been very difficult. I feel like I am the one hurting him by splitting up the family, especially after this long 🙁

          • OW sounds completely unhinged. Your husband knows she’s crazy, which is probably why he’s not too eager to divorce. Leave. She will be his boobie prize, and if you’re lucky, he will feel the need to marry her so his ruined life looks ‘legit.’ You come across as a very nice person who wants to do the right thing and not ever hurt anyone. Hurt him. Get angry. Get what’s yours and then some, and leave that asshole in the dust. While you’re at it, spread evidence of her horrible behavior around to friends, neighbors, her employer, etc. No one thought I was the type to ever to thngs like this. I did, and it helped give me solid ground to stand in. Seven years and you’re not righteously pissed? Get going.

          • Oh CP, Im so sorry for all you have suffered. I can see how a serious tragedy could contribute to being overwhelmed and subsequent paralysis.

            Speaking as a Chump who stayed too long (7 years after Dday) I urge you to think about the sweetness that life could offer you in a small, safe, calm home you could create for yourself and your kids.

            My young adult kids had mental health issues which impaired their launching and I was so worried about where they would go if the family home were no longer an option, so I stayed.

            I was SO accustomed to living under the harsh bullying of my cheater that I had no idea what life without him would feel like. It is SO much better

          • After 45 yrs of gaslighting, reality was hard to find. Everything I thought I knew about those yrs a lie. Even to little stupid things. Liars have to lie, to breath. I learned from therapy, all those items are just things. Inanimate objects. My love, memories are real, (now) things to hold onto. Slut slim all over the house, not real. A special room is just a room. What I remember and feel about the person who used the room is real. This was very hard for me to grasp in my heart for a long while. Like hoarders who keeps a Kleenex someone used, broken toys, after children are grown. Losing a child. Would put me into twilight zone brain fog. No idea what objects would mean then. Sorry for anyone experiencing that pain.

            • Before the house sold I occasionally wandered around waving sage and wishing myself and my children the best.

          • You are not the one who split up the family! Fuckwit did that. It’s 100% on him.
            I’m so sorry about your son. You’ve been through so much and that heavy load of grief and trauma you’re carrying is probably what has stalled you.

          • They are the ones that caused the split of your family. Cheaters are SLIME and it is never the betrayed one who is responsible for what the slime thinks is just incidental. Sometimes we for whatever reason can not make the decision to split. You are doing the right thing. Wishing you and your son happiness at the new place. Very sorry you have been through so much.

          • She’s evil. What a pig. However, if you want to keep your house, keep it. It’s just a house. My brother said that ‘you can’t get the stink out’. But it’s just a house. My ex and his skank fucked in my bed. I got a new mattress. The ‘stink’ is only stinky if you allow it to be stinky to you. I’m still sleeping in my bed and I kept my house because it’s my dream home. And a few years after my divorce I asked one of my sons, “Do you think it bothers your dad that I kept the house?” Without any hesitation, he said, “Oh yeah. I know it does.” That was nice to hear and I bet it still burns his craw. But that’s not why I kept the house. I kept it because I love it; it’s my dream home. I have a great view of the mountains behind me. I have a hot tub and swimming pool. It’s a home that I could never have gotten on my own. I enjoy it and the dick and his skank (and their shenanigans) never even enter my head.

          • Paralysis. I lived in this, too, for some 7 plus years. I did move out 7 years ago. I was on the fence. Literally. At the very top. 49% and 51%. Until I read LACGAL. And my now X was staying at my house after be hospitalized for COVID (not together together). I finally realized that I didn’t trust him and was never going to go back with him. There was nothing I could imagine him doing that would change that.
            Making the decision was the best thing ever.
            In only 3 months, I’ve moved to live near my son and his family. My job allows remote working so I have the same job. My boss offered me to be part of this company paid business coaching thing. About everything happening came so easy – like a “yes”. This was after 9 years of feeling crappy about life in general.
            Just know that life is better on the other side of tolerating lies and the disrespect that comes with it. Everyone else sees it, including the kids.

        • CP, I’m so sorry to hear about your loss of your son.

          I don’t think you sound like you’re in victim mentality and I like hearing people’s stories more than once from different angles. After a while, you get to know people, mainly by their stories only because they retell them in the context of the new question. Sometimes I find rewriting my story when something here sparks the urge helps me understand something new or let it go.

          For what it’s worth, it sounds like major mind-effery has gone on for you and your child. Maybe your child’s well-being will spur you to the next move. For your kid to have a father that makes them doubt their own reality … that’s abuse. He’s setting her up to be abused and lied to by men, and doubt her own reactions, for the rest of her life. I’m almost 50 and I’m still dealing with the damage done by many exploitative men because I was trained by my own father not to believe my own instincts.

          Recently, I’ve gone down the wormhole of a YouTube series called Soft White Underbelly and it’s full of people with addictions, and almost all of them had parents who lied to them and gaslit them. I’m also grappling with addiction and not in a stable recovery. I actually find it comforting to think that at least I didn’t end up with worse afflictions, but in some ways that’s luck, and just my own mightiness. I wish I could say my mother, who was an excellent model of financial common sense, would have also modeled sticking up for herself.

        • Take time to heal and don’t even worry about ‘love and relationships’. I’m so sorry to hear of your loss, but you will get through this. Just be kind to yourself and be patient.

    • I’m so sorry you had to go through that terrible tragedy. Please leave this terrible piece of crap and put you and you family first You deserve better. Good luck 👍

    • My deepest sympathy to you for losing your son. Glad you have an awesome therapist and that you have CL and CN on your side. Keep lining up those ducks and you will feel mighty. You are ENOUGH. You do not need permission to be happy especially when it involves removing an FW from your life.

    • So very sorry for the loss of your son.
      Ignore the STBX. If HE truly loved YOU then there would have been nothing to forgive.
      After all your trauma and loss, you have absolutely nothing to be embarrassed for. This stuff is hard.
      Do what you need to do on your own timeline.
      I wish you and your children much happiness and love.

    • I am so sorry for the tragedy of losing your son. Big hugs to you. You’re incredibly strong, ChumpParalysis.

    • Don’t be embarrassed. We are all different and process stuff in our own time. Take as much time as you need to get where you want to be.

    • ChumpParalysis – This is a chain of devastating traumatic events that I can’t fathom, so no apologies or embarrassment needed for where you are right now. I’m glad you are here and posting this. I wish you strength and you are getting your ducks in a row. Grasp onto the anger because right now it is accurate. Yes, he is dick and and an incredibly damaging abuser.

    • That is absolutely shameful how they both gaslit you and your daughter to deflect from their atrocious behavior. Hugs to you.

    • I’m so sorry for all you’ve been through. What they put you and family through is truly deranged.

      You sound as though you are gaining strength, I’m glad you are with a good therapist.

    • Oh, the “If you really loved me” mindfuck. They love that one. They’re too stupid to see the irony- that if they really loved you they wouldn’t have cheated.
      I hope you get out soon. That guy’s a scumbag who gaslights his kids, too.

    • ChumpParalysis, A BIG (((Hug))) to you. I am so sorry for the loss of your son and I can totally understand your wanting to stay for your child after such loss.

    • CP, it’s the first time I read your story, so I’m lucky you posted it again.
      I just wanted to say that I am very sorry for all you and your family have been through and to give you a virtual hug. Some day you will overcome the paralysis and will get the life you deserve. But I know sometimes it’s just too much to bear on one’s shoulders. Seven years of cheating, backstabbing and gaslighting you and your kids atop of all the sadness your family had to endure is too much. Your STBX and the AP are heartless creatures and the way they interacted with you and your kids is just demonic. I can’t even begin to imagine how you feel right now. There is nothing to be embarrassed about, no one is judging you and no one could. You’re mighty. Notwithstanding so much pain you didn’t give up, you didn’t settle for misery, and you’re still fighting. I hope to read here some day that everything went well for you and your kids and that you’re enjoying a FW-free life. (((Hugs)))

    • Chump Paralysis, sending you an enormous hug. The pain and trauma upon trauma really does paralyze us. I can so relate. I feared I would lose time with my kids also but the judge gave me full custody and XH, who sounds a lot like yours (he also gaslit, threatened, and blamed our suicidal 14 year old daughter when she caught him) never availed himself of the pathway to earn more time with our youngest who was 10 and was the reason I went all the way through a trial to protect from him. There were years when he only showed up to one dinner a month in a restaurant with her. Fast forward 7.5 years. Kids are grown and I’m so glad I saved the youngest from his daily emotional abuse of her and myself from further harm. These types really do harm everyone in the family and it’s not their dicks in orafices that do the most harm (sans STDs), it’s the devalue, the lies, the gaslighting, the blameshifting, the rage, the psychological ABUSE that harms us. The only anecdote is to get away. Go no contact. Then the healing begins. I do know the terror of losing the kids …. But I hope you take the leap. I don’t think you’ll ever regret it- I don’t!

  • Ugh. I hated that Schmoopie made himself known to me— seeing the Christmas cards with my children that he posted all over social really hurt me and was clearly calculated on his part. My ex simply replied when I confronted her, “I’m sorry you saw those photos.”
    Hindsight, the APs insistence on being known, somehow one upping me in every aspect of my life is just repulsive behavior and really talks about these two freaks character. Insecurity, hatred, self loathing are all imbued in his actions, and she chose him over me which speaks of her.
    Good riddance, but it’s really an awful experience that still echoes pain when I think about. What a bunch of narcissistic freaks, TBH.

    • So he took fake-family Christmas pictures with your wife and kids? That is harsh…I cant imagine how that would feel

      • Haha yeah, he didn’t stop there ( stalked me, harassed me, threatened me, contacted my friends and family, tried to have me arrested for driving down my own street and called my work which got me terminated), but that photo makes me vomit when I think of it.
        Still, he did me a favor by winning “the prize” ( she’s not a prize ) and I’m told children are resilient so I’ll fix my relationship with them when this guy cools down or disappears.
        Such is life with a cheater.

        • Those Shit Sandwiches have putridity dripping off the crust. Im so sorry you suffered that. You are my hero for surviving such a storm. I hope you got a better job after the unfair termination.

        • Man, I concur with Unicornomore, you’re a hero.
          “Insecurity, hatred, self loathing are all imbued in his actions”.
          Yes and I’m sure your kids will sense it too and get distance from this freak. Stay strong.

    • “One-upping you” – I have a very unique hairstyle and damned if OW didn’t copy it exactly, right down to the curl. I wouldn’t be surprised to discover she used my hairdresser.

  • Ex never admitted anything about anything so I went to see her.

    They had been work partners for years and me and my kids thought she was our family friend. Vacations, major life events, dinners…

    She told me what I needed to know and was pretty righteous about it.
    I asked her how she could do this to my kids and the response was “if you told them, that’s your problem”. Realized only a never married with no kids fool would say that and I walked away.

    She isn’t allowed in my orbit so he has to attend weddings, grandkids’ birthday parties or visiting his grandkids alone.

    She “won” quite the prize! If they’re married it’s a secret. He’s miserable, frumpy (previously meticulous), overweight, post-heart attack and old in body and spirit.

  • Since they numbered in the hundreds (3 Amandas alone), and many of them he paid for the privilege, there would have had to have been a lottery (or fantasy league draft) to determine which would tell me.

    • Lol that reminded me…
      He was trying to find out how I found out about his shenanigans. He asked, “Did Kelly tell you?”
      I replied, “Maybe”
      “Which Kelly?” He asked. (Apparently there were at least 2)
      Sad, but it was all I could do to not laugh out loud til he left the room. God only knows how many there actually were.

  • On the way into the Orlando airport to see our son in Kansas City, MO on my 60th birthday flying as husband’s companion on his rewards account. She ran into the elevator and said he’s having an affair with me and the massage therapist. I looked at her and said “I believe you”. He said “I’m having affair with AP”. I said “we have a plane to catch”.

    She tried to trip him and hit him in head. He yelled to others in hall, “call security”! She was 27, him 60.
    We went on trip, he cried on plane, said he’d call therapist, 2 months later I discovered he was on drugs….

    He convinced me we couldn’t fire her bec pause she’s racially mixed and possible sexual harassment issues. She’d quit, give her a chance to find another job, blah, blah. I was so ridiculous to believe he had actually talked to attorney about this. Claimed to fire her then brought her back.

    I filed 3.5 months after Dday. There had been many clues, phone calls, texts, and disappearing acts, late patients, missing money, We had been together since 18, married 36years when I filed. He refused treatment for drug problem. Nothing to work with.

      • Thank you. He used to be a good person. My middle child said someday you’ll realize that was your best birthday, not your worst. The AP is younger than all the adult children. YUK. No relationship with children, grands, or his siblings for him.

  • Yep. AP called my home phone to speak to my husband in DD#1 and the cat was out of the bag. I thought it was a one-off, so I spackled while I pick-me danced. Eleven years later, DD#2 the AP contacted me through social media with a manifesto of transgressions. They were done and we had two small kids so I forgave and said never again or I’m out. After ten more years, DD#3 the AP called my cell phone and we had a conversation. Soon, an avalanche of infidelities were exposed and the house of cards came down. My next move was to lawyer-up.

    Hopium is a horrible thing. I had my reasons (good intentioned and noble ones but was wrong-headed thinking). I kept my troubles to myself. If I had only reached out and spoken to a good counselor or had CL or CN I might have saved myself a lot sooner. I’m two years post-divorce and I’m much better now, but what a waste of my life—I deserved better. When they tell you who they are, believe them the first time. 30 years folks. Don’t be me.

    • “Hopium is a horrible thing”. That is something every chump needs to remember. And our hopium came from big bags of lies from our FWs.

    • 30 years for me and two DDays. At least you’re out. Don’t be hard on yourself. But honestly, I cannot regret those 30 years with the fuckwit because there was a 50-50 chance I could have ended up with somebody worse. You can’t go back and change things so it’s pointless to ‘regret’. We could all have had worse lives. I knew one woman that her fuckwit abusive husband threw gasoline on her and lit her on fire. Other people have lost their lives. You survived and became stronger in spite of the douche that you were married to.

    • Married 31 years here, together for 34, met when I was 17 and he 18. 3 x DDs with many other possible betrayals that I keep having lightbulb moments about. FW convinced me the first 2 were ‘just friends’ ughhh!! The final one he denied was anything. He called her a ‘distraction’. I pick me danced for 3 weeks then hung up those shoes. I threw that trash out. FW and distraction now live together, he still denies this even on the divorce documents in court.

      It’s been 2 years since the strange began. 18 months since separation. Freedom is about to happen….I can taste it!

      The stories are not unique. I am so glad I found CL and CN. This literally saved my life as I found it while searching for how to top myself. I feel so sorry for the woman I was then. I was scared to read the book in the beginning, the ‘leaving’ bit freaked me out. I’d actually bought several books on how to save the marriage 🤦🏼‍♀️. One book was about saving the marriage on your own.. Hahahaha. I mean, really.. whatever. What a waste of money. So the last book I read was LACGAL. Wished I’d read this first would’ve saved me dancing like a goodun.

      I’m almost on the other side and so thankful for every post I read here. Hugs to you all.

      • LACGAL was the last relationship book I read, too. Filed for divorce about 2 weeks later. This after many many RIC books and lots of money spent on a relationship coaching program. Pretty sure I’ll never read another relationship book, or go to a class about how to do it better. After plenty of that (and counseling) I ended up with Cheater Peter. Did that dmaned pick me dance for 9 whole years. Gheez….

  • Nope, Sgt Sugardick didn’t say a word; he was married with kids, after all. It was my ex-wife’s behavior that tipped me off and, with the aid of gps and voice-activated recorders, I soon discovered all I needed to know.

  • Wasband swears to this day that they were just friends but over 1000 texts leading up to his decision to divorce bc “I’ve been unhappy for a while” say different IMO.
    In a way, howorker did out him. When he returned from a month long trip from London where Im pretty sure things went to the next level, she friend requested me on FB. I had no idea who she was and only used FB to post pics of 3 year old for friends and family.
    He was showing me some pics from his one day off and I semi recognized her from pics and mentioned the friend request. He said..oh yeah…she thought it would be easier to share pics that way……um, it’s my FB? Lol.

    So then 2 weeks and 500 texts later when wasband is acting so weird in family vacation, she (I think intentionally) blew up his phone at 11:30 one night. That got my attention and the beginnings of me realizing what was going on went from crawl to warp speed. Wasband was NOT ready for that. Neither was my sanity, but hey whatcha gonna do?

    To this day, I think part of the reason he hates me so much is that I found out before he was ready and went into full alpha mode externally while internally I was shutting down fast. I forced a conversation, I forced a conversation w out MC who called him out hard, I prepared for the worst and got set up to move money, change direct deposit. So when he decided it was over and thought he had all the power, I hit him w some whammies:
    Ok, this is your decision? For reasons incomprehensible and utterly surprising to me and a third party we’ve been talking to for almost 2 years? Fine. Pack a bag, get out, leave keys and garage opener. Then he freaked out the next day when he saw what I had done with the money. 1/3 left for him. 1/3 taken for me. 1/3 taken for our daughter in “trust”.
    So, I guess I owe the AP a small measure of thanks in a way. Nothing like a 2×4 to the brain and soul to force radical acceptance.

    • I love what you did with the money, albeit it was far too generous to FW.

      Two days after Dday, I took all the money out of our joint savings and opened a new account in my name only. FW didn’t have the nerve to complain and was all for it as he wa trying to get me to reconcile. He also signed the car over to me. You have to do it fast, while they are still in grovel mode. My lawyer said him giving me his uncoerced, enthusiastic permission means he can’t get any of it back. Them I got him to buy a house deeded 99% in my name (the most the law would allow since we were still married) but the mortgage is in both names. He won’t default. He’s obsessed with his credit rating.
      I had no intention of reconciling when he did all this. Suckered him good.

  • Like most male chumps, my then wife’s male APs seemed to have lived in fear their presence might be known. I found out from my then 12-year old son, who’d seen texts his mother had sent. Worst day of my life. The only text I ever sent any of her several APs was when I heard a rumor one (married himself, with two kids under 12) was talking of marrying her. I told him we were still married. He texted back, ungrammatically, “Nobody is marrying anybody.” Today? Of course the two cheaters are married. No tag backs!

  • Didn’t happen to me. I think it’s more of a female AP MO. I dont think a male AP would ever do that, for fear of being murdered by the husband or at least beaten up. Doesn’t mean it never happened of course, but probably very rare.

    • I agree, GuideDog. Of course we both know we’re generalizing, but I think male APs most often want to remain a secret, both for fear of retribution as you describe, but also probably because to them, the affair is little more than no-strings sex on the side, and they would prefer to keep it that way.

      • Agree, former spouse said to me when trying to convince me he wanted to stay married, “ I don’t want to lose half of everything I’ve worked for my whole life for a piece of ass“…..lovely

          • I said did you hear what you just said to your wife? Then came more lies. I don’t want to break up the family, I don’t want to lose you, blah, blah. Oh and the kids don’t need to know about this….

  • OW’s oldest daughter got her driver’s license, she and sister followed Mom and saw her meet up with Goofy. Poor girls. They told Dad, he wrote me a letter, we talked. If you ever wonder if you should tell the other chump? Do it!

  • How many AP spouses told? That’s how I found out. She came up to me at a Cub Scout meeting. Turns out, I’d helped the AP make breakfast for a cabin full of our kids the winter before. Fun times!

    • That’s rough. From what I can piece together, I was only told because the AP’s wife was threatening to tell me. Cheating X also said it was to end the affair and try to save AP’s marriage. He’s still married, thankfully, I am not. Apparently not working and living with a FW is better for some people than breaking up the home.

  • In my case it was my (then) husband. He never came out and said it outright (he’s a coward), but he dropped a trail of hints. She was an ex-student in our department (he had taught her in several classes; I knew her because I was department chair and served on her honor’s research committee). He used the professor-student/alumni connection as a cover. While she was a student, she started a Facebook fan club page for him (he told me this, with a self-satisfied air, while saying he didn’t know what to do about it ); after she graduated, the two of them got together for coffee. Unbeknownst to me, she began “helping” him “explore” his alternative gender identity. I knew things had gone further when first, he left me in a T-Mobile store waiting for our new phones to be set up because it was taking so long and he was late for a coffee date with her, and then, later, he began driving to the town she lived in to go to her short spoken word performances, after which he said to me, in a put-upon tone, that he was “finally having fun again.”

    • Seriously. No wonder women run out of shits to give as they get older. Here’s something in a similar vein. I copied this from Facebook during the beginning of the pandemic:

      Relax, mom.

      Relax. Just stay home. Except if you need to work. There’s no childcare though. Why would you risk it? Don’t worry about money, your health is more important than your groceries. You can defer mortgage payments. But you shouldn’t because it’s not a good financial choice. You should stay home, though. Unless you’re essential, we need you to work. How could you put your kids at risk though? You should stay home. But keep paying your bills.

      Relax. You can just order groceries. Except if you can’t, then go out to get them. Not often though. Don’t go out much. Except it takes 5 stores to find bread. Don’t forget to wash everything you buy. Just eat what you have at home. But also use this time to do lots of cooking with new recipes. Don’t overeat though, be healthy.

      Relax. Take vitamins. Keep up the immune system with lots of vegetables. But you shouldn’t go out for vegetables, just stock up on pantry and non perishables. Only the healthy ones though. It’s okay, we are all stressed, treat yourself to some junk food. Not too much. You need to be healthy and fit in your jeans.

      Relax. Get exercise, it will help. Drink more water. Just have a glass of wine. Go for walks. Take naps. Keep a schedule. Work from home. But spend more time with your kids. Use this time to get in shape. Don’t stress over it though. Be easy on yourself. Accomplish something new.

      Relax. Don’t touch anything. Disinfect everything. Use this time to clean the house. Stop touching your face. Scrub every surface all day. Ensure your toddler practices social distancing. Don’t worry them, though. Wash your hands for 20 seconds. And again. And now all the kids, too. And again. Why did you even bring them outside? Keep them home. Except you’ll need food. Remember all those new recipes you have time to try.

      Relax. Make sure your kids have a schedule. But don’t worry, let them be kids. You can homeschool. You don’t need to homeschool, you’re trying too hard, they’ll be fine if they don’t learn. They still need to graduate this year though so make sure they keep up with school work. It will be fine, don’t push them. Let them enjoy home life. Teach them life lessons. And common core. They’ll remember the good times, so don’t worry them and create positive memories.

      Relax. Don’t watch the news. Make sure you’re informed. Keep off social media. Stay connected. Try and focus on the positive. But be sure you know how serious it is. Don’t worry needlessly. Don’t take it too lightly. Don’t let the kids see your fear. Don’t bottle things up.

      Relax. Don’t hoard. Do you have enough supplies for your family? What if they get sick, do you have medicine? What if you have to isolate, will you be able to feed the kids for two weeks? Don’t worry about it, though, just focus on now. But be prepared, otherwise you’re just being irresponsible.

      Relax. Is that a cough? Does your kid feel hot? Is the tightness in your chest anxiety or the virus? Just breathe. But don’t be irresponsible. Stay home if you feel sick. That’s not sickness that’s your fear. Don’t let your kids outside. Don’t leave them home if you go out. Give them fresh air. Keep them home.

      Relax. Someone else has it worse. You can’t complain. Learn meditation. Learn a new language. Learn to relax.
      But not too much, because these are scary times.

      It’s easy.
      It will be fine.
      Relax.

  • Yes, the second DD she was the one who dropped the bomb. So he had been having an emotional/physical affair with her for now about 5 yrs. The first dd I found out by catching them playing together on his phone. He did the usual im sorry ill never again I promise to stop drinking and never talk to her again or have sex with her again and counseling. ok so this past Mar 2021 I get a message from an unknown person while I’m lying in bed recovering from surgery. Asking me ” You might want to know what your husband has been doing in NJ the past trips here”. to which I respond so this is &%$$a? Yes yes it is…. So you guys are back to screwing around again? Yes we are…. we only stopped for a couple months when you found out the first time… She was upset that he ghosted her after their weekend together when he went home for his uncles funeral and to be with her and he had been with her over several other trips that were supposedly family related. He promised her the world and when he came home I guess felt guilty. She sent me text messages and emails and I just kept pulling her in for more info. I was done I was devastated and heartbroken but I knew I would never trust him ever again. 32 yr marriage is history we are divorcing and after all she did he ran right back to her and they are together. She deserves everything he puts her through.

    • Hugs to you, Moving On….Very sorry for what you have been through. Two thoughts: Wonder what makes AP think she is so special that she is the only one and if she has any sense at all, she knows she is getting a cheater. Either she is not so special or he is DUMB. APs are not relationship material.

    • Be patient. Truly! He will ‘deserve’ everything he got with the skank. It took me a good 4+ years post divorce before I honestly believed that ‘they deserved each other’. Prior to that I kept imagining how happy they were. I kept imagining how wonderful their lives were as they took trips, hung out with ‘our’ friends, etc, etc. Many years later I realized that the insufferable narcissistic fuckwit and his equally narcissistic skank-wife are still the same people now that they were then. And they’re both still the same selfish, entitled, no-compunction-with-hurting-others fuckwits. People do not change who they are. And I’m at peace knowing that I’m no longer an innocent bystander in their carnival shit show.

  • The OM was to chicken shit to talk with me. I called him numerous times and he would hang up. It actually made his wife suspicious and she called me. I gave her all the information she needed. I think it is a woman thing telling the chump they are cheating with your spouse.

    • My wife was banging a single guy, so of course he wasn’t about to give up easy, no-strings sex.

    • AP wanted my life that took 36 years to build, he kept moving the bar, she was encouraged by her mother and uncle to get the ball rolling. They had no concept of asset division, smh. They thought I’d be leaving with 0. Dumbasses.

  • My ex’s AP invited me on bike trips and camp outs. He planned adventures with just me…really wanted to get close to me. Then, when I started putting it all together and confronted him, he said he was leaving us alone to work things out in therapy, wishing us the best. Of course, he never did…motherfucker.

  • Mine did it in the form of a text claiming to be a co worker of both them. The number was from a timed anonymus message service. I wanted her to meet me at HR. She refused. She then wrote a letter. I thought it was strange that a co worker would use a phone # that couldn’t be traced and then she followed up with a letter. No return address, of course. Then it all made sense when the divorce attorney said that 90% of situations like mine were from the AP. She won the dance. Hope she enjoys all the back hair and excessive gas.

  • Nothing from AP. Found out when he started being very protective of his phone. Fortunately, he never changed the passcode so I got a mountain of info. Made sure I backed everything up. Confronted him, he claimed he would never do it again. We entered the RIC where they wanted me to take blame for just being a bad wife. Then had Dday2 by finding more of their sexting. Confronted him and he went into all the channels ending with he had found his twu wuv. Started lining up ducks when my son found a boatload of more of their videos and pictures on his shared account. He can never unsee this even as an adult. I lawyered up and my lawyer has great evidence due to the FW not being even remotely technical. He tried to put up a fight but once his attorney saw what we had in our wonderful fault state, they decided to try to settle. We will no doubt sign an agreement soon since the court date is looming and they don’t want the mountain of evidence to go on record. My son and I are no contact and that has been a blessing. His 32 years younger Schmoopie has won the pick me dance prize and I am happy with (hopefully) getting a decent settlement and being rid of a FW. Lots in between though and as the chump everything is my fault. Oh well.

    • Hope it goes as expected. My settlement took 2.5 years, gf is 33 years younger. I had lots of office records, pics of his drug paraphernalia, video of her in his personal office saying “I’m don’t believe you until you come home with me”. He was uncooperative whole time but each our lawyers told him I’d parade her around and present lots of evidence. I prevailed. Good luck.

  • That might have been her next move. I think she was behind him telling me because what he said (a few days after totally weird wedding anniversary #20) was, “For the past few months, I’ve been thinking about moving out by myself, but I don’t want a divorce.” In one of our truth-laden therapy sessions. WTF does that mean?! I asked him immediately if he was involved with someone and he said no. I put my PI skills to work and found an email to her confirming otherwise.

    Then he tells me the only problem with their relationship is that he “always has to leave.” And she, advertising herself as lonely and cool with no-strings sport fucking in her Craigslist Casual Encounter ad, wanted more and was mad at him and issued the ultimatum. Luckily for me, as I may never have suspected the Nice Guy who was my husband was a total fraud and my marriage was a total MIRAGE.

    I’m pretty sure he wanted me to hang around as Plan B in case his test drive with her failed. (Plan B was keeping me on around as Wife Appliance and shopping for more dirty secrets he could fuck).

    He’s not my Plan A so I could not be his Plan B.

    Healthy people do not have affairs or screw around with people in marriages or committed relationships. End of story.

    When you find out your married to a malignant brain tumor, surgical removal is your best chance for survival.

    • “I asked him immediately if he was involved with someone and he said no.”

      Same. Then I asked, “Do I need to be tested for STDs?”
      Again, he said, “No.”

      A couple days later, when he confessed to the affair, he would tell me that he knew she was “clean,” which is why I didn’t need to be tested.

      In all matters, he removed any agency from me. He made choices about my health and wellbeing (present and future) without my input. Like all cheaters, he acted with no regard for me.

      In the end, he said he almost stayed with me (after his nearly 3 year affair) but that I acted badly in the last day or two. So you see, I tripped on the dance floor at the last minute (after 35 years of a mirage) while AP was nailing the competition! On pointe and with a killer tutu!!

      I doubt x sees anything odd about any of this. He thinks it was his right to sit in judgment of two women and choose. The reason the affair lasted so long is that I was in the running until the end. Lucky me!! By his logic, I should feel flattered.

      Anyhow, I’ve had that malignant growth surgically removed. Path report indicates “Section shows an abundance of covert narcissism with entitled, poor character. Succeeded in removing all assholery cells from margins. Patient is clear.”

      • To be clear, I didn’t know I was in a dance competition. He said he wanted a separation but denied there was another woman. I asked the STD question because I strongly suspected there must be another woman. His coldness during this period chills me even now.

        Also, I’m still astonished that he wanted every condolences when he fessed up. I still don’t get it.

  • I’ve seen the long term ow three times to my knowledge. The last time I saw her was when her husband who I went to high school with, came by to see the ex. Ex wasn’t home of course and he wanted me to see his son who even before this point I felt was my ex’s. She gave me a dead eye stare like the ex, pulled down her mirror and fixed her face. I knew.
    At that time I was so broken, without self worth, a bit overweight etc. that I didn’t do what my gut wanted me to which was to say he resembles my son when he was little. I had zero proof and ex always denied my questions so I couldn’t blow up her husbands world.
    I’m not into reunions but we had one after we left and I couldn’t go even with friends having my back. I didn’t want to see her and her husband. I was at the explosion vomit stage. I thought of sending him paternity test info with a suggestion. The kid was born on my birthday and I used to hope it was a curse reminder but now don’t care because I know nothing bothers him that hurts others. That was the most happy and animated I’d ever seen I’m in our marriage was when he told me she was pregnant and all through it. After the birth he told me she was the best mom ever. I never got anything but a public statement around friends how it changes for the worst. Pure humiliation.
    Over the past year circumstances landed and I was given evidence that it’s actually still in full swing. I did take a picture in case I needed it. He was furious in court last year which gave him a time out to recompose when I presented other stuff that was mixed in with it. He knew I knew.
    Im not sure why they haven’t gone full on open and don’t care. I used to be jealous thinking she was going to get the life I deserved. Ha ha. I wasn’t ever going to get that life with him. Maybe she accepts she’s a needle in his chaos of prostitutes, porno etc.

  • Neither of the long-term APs contacted me before I found out about them.
    But both of them harassed me after their respective breakups with the ex.
    What’s weird to me is that both of them wanted ex back and thought that by stalking me and relentlessly calling and texting, the ex would run back to them.
    Wish he had.
    It was hard AF to divorce the creep.

  • Never got that revelation from her. But to say she was and still is afraid of me is an understatement. Well, we’ve been divorced 6 years and they have been married for 5. They deserve each other.

  • Ok this is not exactly the AP telling but rather her parents outing his evil behavior. I was in my “I must fight for my marriage” stage. I went to confront her parents( “fine” local farm folk in this small town full of farm folk). I thought they might well tell her to stop ( 🤦‍♀️). They said we were told he was separated for 2 years( to which I held up my hand and said nope, married for 29 years). I could tell they absolutely knew. Then they said he even helped her dad on the farm( instead of coming home to his family). What a fine future scum in law they had!! There are no depths to which they or their flying monkeys won’t go.

    • A different topic, but your post reminded me of the night he was confessing (ish), he told me that whores parents wanted what was best for her too. (I assume he meant to have him).

      I had not yet spoken to my dad (he lived in another state) but I wish I had, because instead of standing there staring at him and saying “and they think her fooling around with a married man is best?” I would have been able to say “yes, and my dad wants what is best for me, and that is to never let you near me again” because that is exactly what my dad said. (my mother had died years earlier).

      • Sorry about your mom. I’m sure it helps to have a parent who supports you leaving, and I salute your dad for it. My dad had died two years before Dday. He would have torn a strip off FW with a blistering take down had he been there and been well. My mom, otoh, wanted me to stay with FW.
        I think my dad, even in his sick bed, suspected FW was cheating. After Dday FW told me my dad had questioned him. He demanded to know why FW wasn’t treating me right and accused him of not loving me. FW said he just stood there with his mouth hanging open in shock (like the idiot he is) and didn’t answer him. Fucking coward.

      • Susie:

        Your FW showed his stupidness when he indicated that you might care what whore’s parents wanted or about the whore having what she wanted or thought was best. I guess this was maybe just “filler” conversation when FW was reaching for a way to explain why you had to lose him or whatever.

      • I think one of the main reasons I was so fucked up and stayed with that dick was because of my dad. My dad was abusive to my mother. They eventually divorced after being married for 26 years. I postponed introducing my ‘fiance’ to my dad till just a few weeks prior to getting married. We sat at his desk, me across from my dad on the left and the dick across from my dad on the right. My dad grilled the dick (as if he gave a shit about me) asking him how much he made, how he was going to care for his daughter, etc. And then my dad said to the dick, “If you have to step out, well, she’s just going to have to understand.” And then he said, “And if you hit her, don’t you hurt her, because if you hurt her I’ll kill you.” Post divorce when I was seeing a counselor and I told him this story, my counselor said, “Oh my God! You were groomed to be the wife of this man! He not only told your ex that he could cheat on you, but it was okay to hit you too!” I remember crying and saying, “Why do I still love him?” My counselor said, “Maybe because that’s all you know.” It was true. I grew up with it. If I didn’t live it, I can see where it would be hard to believe.

    • This reminds me…OWs parents are Chinese immigrants to the US and Im not sure that they speak any English. I almost sought out an interpreter to translate something like “Your daughter is dating a married man who has a family. Please make her stop so that he can treat his family properly” . I was concerned that instead the translator would write something like “This anglo woman is batshit crazy and says awful things about your daughter”.

      A few years after the affair ended, Cheater told me a story. He said that his father had admitted to him that during a break when his parents were dating, his dad dated an Asian woman whose hand in marriage he asked her parents for. He was told no, so he went back to his old GF (Cheaters mom) and married her.

      Cheaters dad always treated his wife as if she was not his first choice, so the story sounded like it held water. Cheater also seemed to occasionally make confessions that were cloaked in some manner. At the time, I took his story as an actual recount of his parents events, but now I wonder if he was maybe trying to tell me what happened with OW.

      If I ever ran into OW (unlikely, she lives very far away) I would like to tell her that she was Cheaters great love and they should have been together forever …that it is a shame that he died. I figure that would torment her for the rest of her life.

  • The AP / co worker never outed him directly, but when I called her one night after months of suspicion, she hung up on me.
    We had been “friendly” so the hang up was just as good as her saying: I am having an affair with your husband.

  • My kids and I went to Applebee’s, my ex hated Applebees so I took them there as a treat on my day off. The waitress (I’d never met before in my life) said my really hard to pronounce name perfectly, before she had my check, no way she could have known who I was.
    I went home and my ex asked if I went to lunch I said, “Yes I went to Applebee’s” That’s where things got weird. He acted like he won something and went on and on about how awesome Applebee’s was. I had a doomed feeling when that lady said my name, but his sudden love for a place a hated before clinched it. So weird.

  • I found out via a text I saw on his phone between the two to of them commenting on the fact that I’d be blindsided when I found out… She had been what I thought was my best friend. The only contact from her after I asked her to leave our family alone and let us heal was “she couldn’t help it – she was trying to help my marriage, but she fell for my husband and ‘fell hard”. Those words haunted me for way too long – and I still don’t know what person with morals would destroy a marriage. 3 years out – and I can see more clearly – they deserve each other. She can live feeling insecure with a man that has cheated on his long time wife (me) twice, and he can have a person that has no problem crossing others boundaries.

    • So sorry to hear your story.
      My friend found out when she came home from work to find the police in the house. Within a few hours she had got him to confess to child sexual abuse material, online sex with (he claimed) adults, and had kicked his ass to the curb. She then had the truly awful job of explaining to her elementary school aged kids why daddy was leaving and they would never be able to see him again, and later on why he would be going to jail, and why they would have to move house and school to a cheaper area (daddy now being unemployable so couldn’t pay child support), etc etc. Shit sandwiches with a filling of shit sandwiches.

  • Yup. My ex swore up and down that it was just an emotional affair, that nothing physical ever happened. After months of “pick-me” dancing and getting nowhere with him, I decided to file for divorce. A long while later, I received a series of text messages from an unknown phone number. The texts contained screenshots of text messages between my ex and the affair partner (sexually explicit ones of course) revealing that they were in fact having a physical affair all along. Even though the marriage was already over, it opened up the wounds all over again and was a huge set back. But looking back, I’m relieved to have those, because it confirms that I made the right decision leaving him.

    • GbM: Sorry anyone that admits to an EA is already having a physical affair. NO ONE admits all. It is always levels above what they admit to.

  • Nope, the AP didn’t tell me, just kept showing up at random places… she’s “Just a friend!” my now-ex screeched! “She’s your friend too!” Uh huh… ok, and so… out of ALL “our” “friends” why is SHE the only one you text daily? Why is she the one you volunteer to help out constantly? Why is HER organization the one that suddenly needs a donation? Why not any of the other worthy organizations that OTHER friends run/donate to/volunteer with? Why is SHE the only friend invited to our neighborhood park after dark to watch the comet with us? Why did she hang around at the park after we left, and why did you turn right around and go back out again “to walk the dog”? Uh huh… her house is where you spent hours “picking tomatoes” as though we don’t have the ability to buy excellent local tomatoes, or hell, you used to grow tomatoes for US, you know, your family. UGH, this is awful to remember. They were both rubbing my nose in it because they both liked the duplicity and it’s disgusting. There was more, but I want to get back to MEH.

    • I can certainly relate to the “rubbing my nose in it” statement.
      The ex got me to buy gifts and help out both of his long-term girlfriends.
      The first one I was never introduced to, she was just a “struggling single mother”.
      He forgot to mention that she was single because her husband found out that the ex was banging her in his spare time.
      The second one was a neighbor. I initially liked her, but then over the years I saw many shady things she was doing (child neglect, a seeming case of identity theft and obvious drug dealing from her house) and decided that she just wasn’t someone I wanted around me.
      I expressed that to the ex, and his passionate defense of her should have clued me in.🤦‍♀️ I just asked that we slow down and limit any engagement with her as a couple. I didn’t ask to completely shun her, just being less buddy-buddy.
      So imagine my surprise when I would come home from work and find her lazy ass lounging around watching television and eating my food. She had a perfectly comfortable couch and plenty of food at her house.
      I guess limiting the relationship AS A COUPLE wasn’t something that he would buy into. Wasn’t enough that he was fucking her behind my back, he also needed me to see them interacting, going so far as to ask me for something for her right in front of the whore, really putting me on the spot.
      And then of course I later found that they had sex all throughout our house, including in our bed.
      I consider this an act of hatred, contempt and absolute disrespect.
      So the rubbing your nose in it garbage just adds another layer of “fuck you” to the chump.
      On the other hand, makes it easier to turn your back and walk away. At least it did for me.

  • The OW’s husband sent me a message through Facebook that the night before he learned of their affair from her phone and felt the need to tell me. It was five days before Christmas (I have two small children) and I read the message while shopping for Christmas dinner. A moment in life that will always feel fresh with pain.

  • Rather than telling me, 3 of the multiple Schmoopies (at separate times) sat with me and assuaged their collective guilt by telling me what they had done, where he took them, and what he told them about me (the violent alcoholic who spent so much of his money, we couldn’t get a divorce). All were “engaged” to him (of course, no ring) and were actively making wedding plans (looking at venues, picking out dresses, etc) with their FAMILIES. Meanwhile, he led me to believe we were great and all his absences could be explained by work trips.

    Funny, the Schmoopie he knocked up and consequently married actually DOES have a drinking problem, and I haven’t seen her in years (way before D-Day). She’s also been around the longest and is just a pig. A gross, drunk pig.

    They must be so proud of each other.

  • My ex never actually admitted anything… she just painfully drew everything out with lies and gaslighting – her AP actually used to follow me round the base reporting on my ‘doings’ he would tell my ex who I’d been speaking to and what I was doing, when he couldn’t find anything bad he started making stuff up like ‘I’d asked someone out’ or that I was ‘meeting with a girl’

    He would actually take photos of me and send to my ex about where I was – it was creepy…. The thing is my ex is not really a catch at all …. If she’s have just been honest rather then all the weirdness

    Worst of all she sent my young daughter off to stay with her mother while she fucked him in our bed.

    When I found all the messages it was like ‘oh he’s a stalker’ and you should ‘not let him see your daughter’

    It was a full on smear campaign! I mean this guy could have run for government haha!

    My ex never actually broke it off – she just kind of kept doing stuff in front of me till I ‘got the picture’

    Someone posted here that their ex posted pictures on Facebook of them together – my ex posted whole albums of them whilst blocking me

    ‘Something is wrong with Facebook!’

    She would say – little did
    She know she forgot to delete her auntie of my cousins husband and so we saw it all – it was disgusting

    To top it off? She was trying to get pregnant by him whilst we were together and I was none the wiser

    FW even proposed before I even knew anything !

    Pure evil

  • A friend of his told me he was trolling for young cheaters on FB. I was stupid and spackling for years, but this hit a raw nerve. Saw a divorce attorney asap.

  • Also why do cheaters do the same thing? It’s absolutely mad –

    I caught my wife and her AP at a hotel – she had the gall to say ‘we’re you following me! When I phoned her mum to say ‘I’ve just caught your daughter’ she said ‘I bet you were following her’

    Funny thing is I wasn’t – she was just to stupid – crazy thing was afterwards she was like ‘we didn’t have sex’

    Riiiiiiight

    • ‘It’s not what I did, it’s your reaction to it that’s the problem’. Straight up DARVO.

      • For me, it was:
        It’s not what I did but how you found out about it.
        Caught the ex in several lies and then woke up one night and he was on the phone with a woman. He lied about it.
        This was the first one and back when Radio Shack was still a thing.
        So I made a recorder for our landline and busted him within two days.
        His reaction? Tapping our home phone was illegal and I could go to prison! Yeah, you’re going there when I could burn your world down with one call to your employer (much of the affair took place during his work hours)?
        He decided that he would be generous and not report me to the police. His schmoopie wasn’t happy about that decision.

  • Schmoopie didn’t tell me, but her best friend stalked my now ex husband and I in a restaurant (both co-workers of my husband). Best friend came up to us and chatted while we had lunch – he seemed nervous. My leg was in a brace for ACL reconstruction surgery I was about to have the next week and she asked lots of questions about my surgery. He filed for divorce a few weeks after my surgery. Early in the divorce process, I received a FB friend request from the best friend I met only once in the restaurant. I didn’t know about Schmoopie, but being that I didn’t know we were having marital issues and now were divorcing, I was very suspicious. I found out about Schmoopie through the frequent flyer account as he used a companion ticket to book her a flight (he denied the affair, of course). Once I had her name, I knew they were coworkers – the best friend was actually her direct report at one time.

    • NK4U: Wow. This site is educational. I have never thought about the beans being spilled by a frequent flyer account. No affair of course but he just bought her a ticket……

  • I never officially met her, much to her dismay. She kept trying to finagle situations where she could meet me. She asked FW to invite me to workplace holiday parties, a black tie gala to celebrate some anniversary of something at work, and some concerts “with friends from work.” I turned every invitation down. His coworkers do nothing but drink on social occasions. I don’t drink and I hate watching people get drunk. If I had gone to any of these events I’d have known they were having an affair by the way they looked at each other. I think she wanted me to know in order to create drama. She probably figured I’d get angry and look bad in front of all his colleagues and FW would dump me. She finally succeeded in getting him caught by demanding they go someplace where FW informed her somebody who knew me would be. FW went along with it and was shocked that this person actually told me. He had thought his “friends from work” introduction was going to fly. I’m certain she engineered it to break us up, not because she wanted him for herself (she had no intention of leaving her chump) but just for the sick power trip of knowing she had destroyed a marriage and a family. She had nagged FW about leaving me but he hadn’t, so she found a way to make it happen while still having some deniability that breaking us up was her intention. With FW, that is. He’s that stupid. Everybody else saw right through it. Bitch is a bigger, even more degenerate narc than FW.

    • OW quite honestly banged every married man in our building, then notified the wives. Google “women who target married men”. Apparently, there are enough of them that the psychology community has finally taken notice. Who would have thought it?

  • I think Chump Lady should do an article about AP’s stalking the OP’s it seems like it so common!

    I thought it just happened to me!

  • I am grateful to schmoopie; but then, she didn’t realize she was a schmoopie. He’d left his email open on the family computer and their communication was right there on the screen in front of me. I contacted her and she was devastated, we were devastated together. I felt bad for her. She had no idea he had a family, he’d told her he was divorced and only had custody of his kids on the weekend, which is why he couldn’t see her on weekends. This was pre-covid when he was commuting for work and only home on weekends. Chumpy me had bought his insistence that his kids go to school in our home town, and that he’d be willing to sacrifice for that by commuting to work during the week. He’d been successfully living this double life for a year and a half when I found out.
    She sent me plane tickets for places they’d been, photographs, emails, and text logs. She told me she’d be willing to testify in court if I needed that.
    She was a lovely person. We decided that he has very good taste in women.

  • No. The AP did not tell me.
    I met her once at a funeral. X introduced us. I shook her hand and made small talk. That’s it, as far as I know.

    After D-Day, the two of them did panic that I might try to contact *her* husband. Both cheated on their spouses. So those two cheaters had had me on speaker in the car when they told me that if I contacted her husband, I would have blood on my hands. X (my personal emotional abuser) added that the AP’s husband was emotionally abusive. So you see, this white knight was trying to PROTECT HER. And I was supposed to be worried about her, too, I guess.

    Days later I was accused of calling the guy because the AP’s husband started to accuse her of poor character and entitlement etc…My x said it sounded a lot like the kind of stuff I’d been saying. I can only hope that AP’s husband found CL.

    Also, funny how righteous x felt about accusing me of contacting that man. I didn’t. But in x’s mind, it’s as if my contacting that guy would have been just as bad as having a multiyear affair. Such effed up thinking.

    Ugh. I’m upset all over again.

    • “Met her at a funeral”…oddly enough, before I knew she was also banging my FW, he insisted we attend the funeral of OW’s son. At that time, I knew OW was banging the doctor who employed her. I was horrified that she had that doctor acting as pall bearer while her unfortunate husband was burying his only son! I remarked on it, that I had never seen such an instance of disrespect and hatefulness – and my FW, already in her clutches, said absolutely nothing. I can’t stop thinking about that episode. I was baffled that I had to attend a funeral of a child I didn’t know, from a family I didn’t know, but FW said “The whole building is going”…I wonder to this day how many of her APs were there, eyeing her unfortunate husband. He’s got to be the unluckiest man in the county.

      • Wait. What? Let me get this straight:
        So she was having an affair with a doctor when her husband’s son died.
        She got that doctor, the one she was fucking, to act as a pall bearer, which is beyond gross.
        And then (some time later?) she started screwing your x. Also gross.

        And your x was well aware that she was the kind of person to have her AP carry the coffin of her husband’s son and that she was also someone who’d had an affair already with another doc.

        I don’t understand these people.

        It’s like a bad soap opera.

        I’m so sorry you experienced all of that. Ugh. And that woman’s poor husband. Jesus.

        • That’s exactly how the situation unfolded. She was working for the doctor whose office was across the hall from our office. I think the men in the building passed her around, and I know for a fact that she caused two divorces by contacting the wives of the men she was banging. My husband knew of her behavior, except maybe he didn’t know she told the wives. He certainly looked surprised when she phoned me as I lay beside him in our marital bed at 1130 at night. She is a disgusting predator and he’s a damned fool. Her husband, who has remained with her through it all, is a long distance truck driver and away from home Monday through Friday. I was told that the doctor who acted as pall bearer gave her $30,000 and I know our business was short $100,000 while the affair was in progress. The doctor in the office beside ours fired her for “stealing”…yeah, and his wife divorced him too. A predator and a building full of over educated idiots.

  • The AP messaged me on Facebook, but informed the fw she was going to do it. She was already done with him, but found it distasteful that he was flirting with her best friend. Bc she messaged me, he told me that night.

    I’m so thankful this girl (18) decided to take no shit, bc I am now free from all of it. I did reach out to her after to tell her how much I appreciated being told and I wish her the best. The fw (53) is a gross human and neither of us deserved his manipulative BS.

  • No and still denies it to this day even though he was supporting her before we divorced, bought into her house with her kids and lives with her. This was after a 30yr relationship. He don’t need to say a word, so much information is out there and social media was the way I found out, along with some people who were real friends.

  • In 2009 I was contacted via email by a woman asking if she knew my (then) boyfriend. They had been chatting online for about 6 months and things had just got ‘serious’ (and physical) and she decided to look up his ‘roommate’ on Facebook to confirm we were just that. To her credit she ended things with him immediately upon learning the truth (he and I had been together 3 years at the time) and she even sent me all their chats (which I thought I wanted to see. Was pretty painful to read but I was young and dumb). Here’s where I get dumber: I sought ‘counselling’ and forgave him. He told me all the pretty words and I was too insecure (and afraid of ny biological clock) not to fall for them. We got married in 2011, and had kids in 2015 and 2019. I’m here because obviously he’s done it again. Thankfully this time I am older, wiser, stronger, and have daughters to protect. This time I am filing for divorce.

  • The AP didn’t tell me, but my boyfriend Mr. Cheaterpants’ behavior did. He had a phone answering machine that would display the caller on the tv, and then any message would be heard out loud. I couldn’t help but notice that anytime a certain name displayed (his “old school friend”), he’d about fall all over himself to grab the phone before the message could start.

    One evening, he did the mad scramble for the phone , and he was taking it downstairs to talk in private, and said “I’ll just be a few minutes, Honey.” He had never called me Honey before, but it sounded so casual I knew he’d sure been calling someone else Honey. That was the loose string that unraveled the whole sordid sweater.

  • My ex bozo legit never told me he wanted a divorce or that there was an ap. We were in marriage counseling because he was depressed and I was concerned I needed to change something I was doing… imagine my shock when it took the PI I hired 1 follow to discover the affair. But before that the marriage counselor told me he wanted a divorce! I said are you seriously the one telling me this and he isn’t even here at this session?! A whole new wondrous level of taking it in the teeth!

  • OW worked at my nephew’s school. So did my ex. My nephew would tell me that OW would approach him in the corridors and ask him how he was, if he was ok. He would joke about it with my ex and I. He’d explain it was odd. I had no clue at this stage.

    Then, when I’d just found out I was pregnant, my ex invited me to a night out with work colleagues (He never went out with work colleagues, but all of a sudden had this need to out). I didn’t go as I was suffering from bad morning sickness. She asked my nephew how I was feeling. At this point, I had got a bit suspicious, but not enough. I passed it off as paranoia, until ex went AWOL on 26th December when we were supposed to be going away for a few nights with our son. I spent a hideous 3 days with a man who turned into a teenage boy. I wish I had just gone with my son.

    My son and daughter now do the same 3 days away every year and it so nice, but I just think back to that time of how he made me feel so crappy and then moved out when we got back home as he ‘was depressed and wasn’t sure what he wanted’. And in February I discovered for sure why the OW was so interested in talking to my nephew. Urrrghhh

  • My fw started discarding me last spring. In August he drank too much on our 21st anniversary vacation, and I caught him trying to video chat a woman. After months of gaslighting and emotional abuse, he admitted to stalking multiple women and having an obsession over basically any grown female on the planet. I filed for divorce in February.

    • I am so sorry that your fw is a fw. I know how hard it is, but you can do this and you are doing it. Keep going. They are totally disordered.

  • At the time of discovery I was viewing our family cell phone bill. I had never clicked on call/text logs prior, but that day I did. At the time my husband had taken a part-time job driving a cab. There were a lot of numbers, but one number kept coming up over and over. The next day I confronted him about it and I was told it was a cab customer blah blah. Didn’t sit well with me and I later text the number and got no response. That was a Saturday afternoon. The following Tuesday my phone rang and the women on the other end said to me “ Hello, why did you call my number?” I asked who is this and she informed me that she had been having sex with my husband. As the conversation went on she told me that it actually all started with her girlfriend that was strung out on drugs and needed the money and was blowing my husband for money. Then it became the both of them. They were crack addicts my oldest sons age and he met them taking them to a methadone clinic on Medicaid calls. Then it became direct contact via his cell phone and trading free rides for sex and blowjobs. I got in my car with her still talking and drove to my husbands work. I passed him on the road as he was heading home. I pulled over, got out, he rolled down his window and Could hear her voice through my car, as her voice was coming through my car stereo on Bluetooth. She then dropped the nuclear bomb on me saying “ tell her about our sleepovers”. She explained that while I was out of town with my boys on a school trip, he invited them both to our home after he bought them drugs in order to have sex with both in my bed. She went on to tell me “ do you think we liked him? What is he 60 fat bald and can’t keep it up- we wanted his money.” His only reaction during this exposing phone conversation was to that comment. He said “ thanks, thanks a lot….poor guys ego torched. I found out that while in my home they stole all my jewelry from my bathroom.
    Crazy crazy shit…

    • I’m so sorry you endured this, GtM. I’m new to CN, but your story is heartbreaking. No one should be subjected to such horror. So painful for you.

      • Thank you. I’m new here too. Never thought I’d be here. I’m happy I landed here and found out I’m not alone. Sometimes you feel trapped in your own nightmare.

  • So OW messaged me on a fake Instagram account pretending to be her “friend” who was concerned for her. Told me about “girl power” and how we should stick together. But in reality she was feeling rejected because we had recently got back together after a break. I had given her a chance to tell me 6 months before, when I originally left him, by emailing her and telling her what he was like. I was told they were just coworkers. My FW told me I was crazy and nothing was happening. I knew. So when the Instagram messages came flying in, I was more upset about the content than the affair. “I’m a size 12, big boobs, blonde, and was always told I was too good for him!” “We were pregnant twice, once with twins!” (I had two miscarriages before I left, over a much longer time period and much more grief) “His family love me more than you!” “We fucked in your bed and couch!” “He can’t keep his eyes off me”. So much more that is physical vomit inducing. They even carved a tree with their initials like they were 15 year olds.

  • Nope. Nope nope nope-ity nope.

    I dated some very good compartmentalizers.

    Cheater #1: They were women from his former job who he was ‘friends’ with. Towards the end, there was a woman from our extended friendship group- but not too close to me that she’d blab.

    Cheater #2: Carefully hidden and no connection with me at all. I doubt she even knew I existed.

    Cheater #3: Someone from the same broad social milieu. I think he lied to her about how involved we’d been, and were. But at every subsequent meeting after they started dating, he always looked terrified to see me.

    Cheater #4: Are you kidding me? It took six weeks of interrogation to unearth the multiple layers of cheating in his life.

  • April 2, 2020. I woke to my phone being missing. He was afraid she’d tell me so he tried to get to my phone and delete a message from her(his ex) this is the same ex who alerted me in social media nearly TEN years ago that she had been messing around with him while we were dating (and that’s putting it mildly) I went a year with him not knowing. I felt invested and so sad and duped. I took him back after a couple of weeks and here we are sitting in this one. For 2 years tomorrow. I don’t believe he’s cheating but he sure doesn’t want to talk about it and gets pouty that his apology and sad attempt at counseling isnt sufficient. Yes I am slow. But I love y’all and appreciate every ounce of effort put into this site

    • Shann: So he is about on his fourth chance with you. I have similar story just more years invested (many more). First DD I found a document he had left out by accident. 2nd DD EA person (actually an X of his) notified me indirectly. FW minimized etc. 3rd DD Many many years later I accidentally discovered another betrayal. That was during covid. Complicated situation. Limbo. Not separated but not reconciled. This would be a very grey divorce but we are both not in good health to say the least. Much responsibility falls to me as I am the most able-bodied. Before 3rd DD, we had just complicated our lives financially with long term care plans (complicated means we invested a ton of money for future LTC and it is a joint investment that can not be split–one of us would lose the right for future benefits under that very complicated policy) Also I would be embarrassed and a split would hurt several people who are near and dear to me as he is such a “great guy”. I do care about him. Truth is I do not know if I would have the strength and courage to leave anyway. I should have ignored the gaslighting from years ago and gotten out. Probably TMI. I see your situation is similar to mine (even though there is no child involved in my case). Oh, the tangled web some people weave… I think of you and wish you the best.

      • Lee Chump, I can only repeat: it’s not too late to make changes, and you DO have options.

        Plenty of Chumps here have walked away from bigger financial losses and more embarrassing situations. They were scared and fragile and unsupported. But they made it to the other side, and they’re thriving.

        Is this relationship you’re in acceptable to you?

    • Shann, it’s so hard when there’s sunk costs.

      But it’s not too late, and you DO have options.

      Is this relationship acceptable to you? You sound deeply unhappy in it.

  • Of course I’m glad I know about the affair but how I found out just makes the AP that much creepier.

    If AP was such a big mouth at work about the affair and defied FW’s “opsec” rules about texting and emailing in order to “expedite” the dissolution of my family and win some Pickme dance contest I had no idea I’d been signed up for, it certainly blew up in her face.

    Before I learned how common it is for side pieces to “helpfully” inform chumps, I figured AP might have blabbed as a way to cockblock imagined potential rivals in the office. Like most narcissists, the AP and FW overestimated their own and each other’s attractiveness in early stages. She didn’t know that three other veteran office doorknobs before her– every one of them a soggy Cabbage Patch barfly– evidently got the ick and decided not to follow through on their initisl flirtations with FW. And FW didn’t know that the younger guys at work had various nicknames for the AP, like “Tammy Faye” or “Tammy-wise the Gutter Clown” because of her thick pancake acne makeup and reportedly because she was hounding any younger guy she thought might have a trustfund before settling on older married targets. No one else wanted either of them other than their too-trusting respective mates.

    So maybe competition was part of it but in retrospect I think the AP was moving in stages to spill the beans to me. She was certainly heavily invested and dancing like her twat was on fire.

    The first time I threw FW out of the house about a week before D-Day, AP went giddy with anticipation and got so sloppy that the kids intercepted some of her messages. The AP seemed unable to stop taking the temperature of the situation. Yay, yay, home almost wrecked!! Immediately after this came the whistleblower emails to me and I quickly retained an attorney and PI. More evidence. By then the kids were all hacky eyes and ears, sleuthed out the full story and tore into FW.

    The seven-pronged bust was like the murder medley from The Godfather– one blow against FW after another and blood and body parts everywhere. There was nothing left for FW to spin or deny. He had to demonstrate to the kids how he was dumping the AP on the spot with an email so brutal that it couldn’t be retracted so that they would even agree to talk to him again.

    It was so obviously about optics. The kids finding out meant that if (when) we separated, FW couldn’t even try to backdate the affair to pretend to colleagues, etc., that cheating wasn’t the reason the kids refused to breathe the same air as “Beefy the Danger Pig” as my daughter called the AP. So Beefy/Tammy had to go and FW tied on his dancing shoes– but mostly because FW felt betrayed by B/T’s big mouth and saw her as a professional liability.

    So AP got hoisted on her own petard, ha ha and ha. But how did love for his family even play into FW’s MO? Precisely because of how it all went down, there couldn’t be enough hopium in that pipe or the world to duĺl the memory of three heartbroken, hysterical kids. I kept quietly getting ducks lined up even through the RIC fiasco. When the ducks were all in a row, I threw FW out. The kids didn’t protest it.

    The kids are at least happy they don’t have to tolerate even the peripheral existance of the AP. When I hear people policing chumps for the blaming of APs as if assigning a slice of responsibilty to a co-embezzler reduces the sentence of the main thief, I just roll my eyes. What about when kids blame? Are they just scorned, “bitter” and possessive? Plus there’s solid disparity in consequences. FW is serving lifetime probation in the eyes of his kids while the AP couldn’t have cared whether the kids lived or died. No skin off her back except the kids’ rage foiled her big plan. That’s hardly consequences, plus, come to think of it, she never offered to pay back the part of the kids’ college fund she bilked, gobbled and chugged with that great big yapping mouth.

  • I learned in jigsaw puzzle pieces from my son and mother, and in riddles from FW and OW. The pieces and riddles were randomly tossed in my direction for several years.

    Of course, direct confrontation yielded pure denial from FW. And why wouldn’t I believe him? I knew something was going on, but I thought it was a flirtation. I chalked it up to mid-life issues, the routine of 17 years together, and that the OW was an evil psycho (Lost Soul from yesterday’s blog, I hope you’re reading this).

    What was I supposed to think? After all, he initiated marriage counseling. What sane person would pay hundreds of dollars a month for 2 years to lie to a therapist?

    People like to accuse chumps of knowing, as in “but you must have known they were cheating?!” Excuse me, but my brain doesn’t walk that path. I didn’t sleuth around for clues because I refused to become that person. Marriage is based on trust. I wanted a marriage. I didn’t want to sneak around, cross his boundaries, and violate his privacy. I’m glad I didn’t lose myself in that way. I looked at the puzzle pieces and pondered the riddles and decided not to invest my energy or compromise my values.

    I did the same when FW hoovered and tried to triangulate. I don’t compete for any man, let alone my own husband. You would think he would know that about me after 17 years. Anyway, I suspect this is the reason he put so much effort into screwing me over. How dare I deny him centrality and kibbles, as Chump Lady would say?

    I’ve made some serious mistakes on this journey, and there’s a lot I wish I could do over. (Newbies take note and please follow the advice you find here.) But I will always be proud that I didn’t devalue myself by participating in that three-way mindfuckery.

    • Love your Mighty. Do you have kids with FW? Just asking because I am so so so so sooooooo STUCK because of my (our) kid.

  • He told me only because our 10 year old caught them naked together on the floor of his cabin . I still hate her and what she exposed my baby too. She was married and left her husband for my ex. They are still together almost two years later and my heart still hurts so much for both me and my child.

    • Yes, 2 years later those 2 skanky people may still be together, but YOU have your dignity. “They don’t leave you for someone better. They leave you for someone who can’t see their bullshit.”

  • I was STUPID — let me say that again…, STUPID, in believing the dick that his skank was just a ‘friend’. Maybe I was swimming that river in Egypt (Denial), but I thought if I could just explain to her how their ‘friendship’ was causing havoc in my marriage, she would be shocked and immediately vacate herself from our lives. I went to her office to explain. She fairly quickly replied, “Well Amazon Chump, we’ve been having an affair for 11 years.” I was shocked and said ‘how could you! He’s a married man!’ She said, “He told me he didn’t love you anymore. He told me he wanted a divorce.” I don’t know who was more stupid, her or me. She was cheating with him while she was married, and after her husband divorced her, she figured that her ‘investment’ would eventually pay off. She had already been waiting 11 years for him ‘to get a divorce’. I immediately filed for divorce and as the divorce was proceeding, he saw that half his military retirement check was going to be mine, so he re-thunk his decision and asked me not to go through with it. He even told her in front of me, “Amazon Chump and I are going to make it work.” Apparently she was pissed and she sent me an email. “Without going into a lot of detail” she went into a lot of detail. But I smoked that hopium pipe with big drags and didn’t go through with the divorce. Four years later he was acting very suspicious again, so this time I went directly to the ho’s mouth and asked again. After confirmation, I told her that she could have him. In my anger I sent that email to all of our children. After finding CL shortly after my divorce, I even sent that email to the UBT for a translation. Well, her 15-year investment eventually paid out and she got him to marry her. But there’s no doubt in my mind that I am the real winner. She won a liar and a cheater, and from what I hear, she checks his cell phone regularly for texts/phone calls. It has been said here often; when the mistress becomes the wife, there’s an opening for a new mistress. I cannot imagine living my life as the marriage police.

  • UGH. Just finished typing the whole sordid story (I’ve told it on this blog before) and it disappeared. The gist of it is the other woman told me but she had just found out herself that he was married, so she was a victim too. Some of you may remember that she came to my house to tell me when he was on a business trip and she brought me a box of chocolates. She called him from her cell without letting on that she had discovered he was married, and asked if when he got back “would you like me to wear the French maid outfit again?” You can’t make this shit up.

    • Glad to know I’m not the lone ranger! Sad this happens to anybody, let alone multiple people as this thread reveals. I hope you put the news on blast.

  • I was the last one who knew but she didn’t tell me, neither did he. I overheard him face timing with her while while we were visiting my parents.
    When i confronted him he got the deer in headlights look and then it became “woe is me, I feel bad now that I’ve been caught” but I fell for it then. Took another fake “I’m changing” and another confrontation of seeing his car at her place (he had told me where she lived!) Before i said f-u

  • In an episode of stupidity and ignorance that years later continues to shame me, I was an AP. I should have known but managed to avoid painful reality for awhile. Within a few hours of grasping the truth, I had busted him to everyone I could find who knew him, including his employer, and contacted his wife to advise her that she was married to a skank ‘ho and should get tested for STDs. Because, as I realized, I was not his only victim. To this day I’m not sure if I was wreaking revenge (I was blazing with fury) or performing a community service (he had to be stopped, or at least slowed down, and his wife deserved to hear the truth as gently as it could be delivered).

    Through the years I have been very, very careful to avoid a repeat. I’m now married to a man who seems to take his vows seriously, although nothing surprises me any more.

    • Violet, I think using the words “stupidity and ignorance” is being too harsh with yourself. A lot of us here were married for many years – decades in some cases – and had NO idea we were married to highly skilled liars. (I think the down votes here are being harsh too; did some people maybe skim your post and only see “I was an AP” without noticing you didn’t know that he was married??)

      Anyway, I don’t know if my ex was cheating all along but I eventually found proof that he had lied to me about several aspects of his life story from the day we met, some of which were very significant lies. We all feel stupid at some point, wondering how we could have believed all those lies.

      But we hopefully come to realize the problem is THEM, not us! They lie so well because they have practiced so much, and because they have no guilt about lying (normal people have “tells” when they lie about important things). We are victims because we are so trusting, because we know we wouldn’t deceive someone about such important things. It’s not our fault for falling for their bullshit.

  • Classic line from my ex-wife. It came after I threatened to divorce her on the grounds of adultery.

    This is what she emailed me: ‘I don’t know what planet you’re on but I’ll never admit to adultery. Nor will any of the people I have slept with.’

    • BtR, this would be an hilarious statement by your ex if it weren’t so damn sad and delusional!
      There is a whole different set of rules for these ppl and they see absolutely no issue in trying to get others to swallow them. Idiots, the lot of them.

  • She didn’t have to tell me… I caught them! She was my best friend and I had invited her (and her teenage son and three dogs) to move in with us after she decided she was leaving her husband in Texas for greener pastures in Florida. Little did I know those greener pastures included my husband! All I can say is be VERY CAREFUL who you bring into your home. Best friends can be backstabbers in sheep’s clothing.

    • Your story is the plot of The Duchess with Keira Knightly based on the life of the Duchess of Devonshire. It also kind of reminds me of Rosemary’s Baby. Good thing demon spawn isn’t a real thing but human evil certainly is and you were surrounded by it.

    • “Best friends can be backstabbers in sheep’s clothing.”

      Absolutely, including the person we are committed to.

      I know folks differ on it, but I considered my spouse my best friend.

      Cheaters and their adultery co conspirators are vipers.

      • Ex would often remind me that I was his best friend. It felt awkward when he’d tell me. I’d shrug it off and think maybe he was more sensitive that I am.., and I should be more understanding (yeah right).
        Now that I’m wiser I think telling me I was his best friend was a ploy to build my trust after one of his flings.
        I’d be less likely to question him, after all, he did say I was his best friend. A cheater wouldn’t say you were their best friend now, would they?

  • Here’s another classic text from my ex-wife when I became upset after discovering her affair(s):

    ‘OK. You’re good. I’m bad. People have affairs. Get over it.”

  • The OW left enough “bread crumbs” for me to follow. I had a “Nutter-Sluter” for an OW. I was actually shot at during the divorce process. Bullet still in my roof liner in my SUV. She would also come on my property and try messing with my vehicle. Later on she’d come on my farm property and take pictures. She’d send the county inspectors to my place for supposed infractions on building permits. I now have a 4-5 ft fence around my property with a locking driveway gate. I have 6 cameras and 2 guard dogs on the inside. Ironically I worked in a prison most my life and am now living in a fortress.

  • Meta comment. I’m trying to figure out the down-votes on comments here. Are they useful? Is there a through-line? No and no as far as I can tell.

    Not many comments on this post have been down-voted–around .03%–so apparently the commenters aren’t too far out of line. Scratchin’ my head, though.

    • Good question. Also, I can’t figure out how to follow responses to posts, since I don’t get any more emails that show clear responses, and to whom.

  • Actually, my ex told me himself – or rather, dropped obvious hints. Our first year living together, he’d disappear for hours and then tell me that he had had to go over to his ex-girlfriend’s house and do maintenance work. It was plausible because at the time she was renting an old house from a college professor we knew who would do the jobs himself and would occasionally ask for help. My ex was apparently “grandfathered” into helping because he had also lived there at one time and was oh-so-helpful. He continued to cheat with a law school classmate in the next place we lived, thinking that I wouldn’t realize but I figured it out quickly because she used to call the house all the time. [That’s a long horrible story in itself which I may tell in full at a later date.] I had nowhere else to go at the time and was gearing up to continue my education so I (stupidly) ignored the conspicuous red flags until years later when we’d moved away. He and I were visiting my parents while I had a couple of professional school interviews (he was planning to move there too) and my sister showed up from halfway across the country to boohoo about her rocky relationship with her then-boyfriend. I left for a day trip to interview, and when I got back he very coyly told me that my sister had been so upset that he felt obligated to comfort her, and then smugly followed up with some rather suggestive details, all the while watching me to see how I’d react. I managed to preserve a poker face until a day or two later when my sister abruptly left, with him tagging along. I had to stay there because I had one more interview, and didn’t hear from him for several days. He came back, grabbed his suitcase, and disappeared. I’d like to say that that was the end of the relationship but he ended up following me to the school I was attending and like an idiot I allowed him to stay in my apartment while he “searched for a place to live,” all the while regaling me with stories of the women he was meeting at his new job – long story short, I had to call the cops to get him out of there. Looking back, I can only shake my head at how powerless I felt. (I wish I could go back in time and have a long talk with myself.)

  • 2 days before my 30th wedding anniversary I got a phone call at work. I was leading a meeting and was told I had an important call. I took the call in the room full of my peers. I had to listen to that crap then finish the meeting. I honestly don’t remember much of what I said. As soon as I was done, I left for the day mumbling something about suddenly no feeling well. I called twiddle dick at work and asked him who she was. I was told she was someone crazy that used to work for him AND he had to get back to work we would talk when he got home. He denied denied denied for 3 hours and then finally fessed up…. a month later I found out she called me because he was cheating on HER too with another sloppy crotch. Even 5 years later after divorcing and hours of therapy I couldn’t find any signs that I missed. No one could believe that he, such a “wonderful guy” could do this. He must of “really been going through some things”. Those people who try to find excuses for his behaviour are no longer in my life either. I consider him dead. Sounds harsh but the person I believed him to be no longer exists. He married the second sloppy crotch less than a year after the divorce. Didn’t tell our kids, they found out on facebook.One son no longer speaks to him at all. The daughter refuses to visit his house or meet the woman but will meet him occasionally for a meal out. The other son has a very strained relationship with him. He caused so much emotional damage to so many people

    • I’m so sorry. They’re human sharks. Anyone who can erase an entire marriage and family like that is not capable of bonding.

      You are capable of bonding. You win.

  • I found naked pictures of the other woman on his computer. “We’re just friends. Stop being so paranoid and jealous.” Yeah, right. In the future, there are not going to be opposite sex close friends attached to any romantic relationship I have. Don’t care if that isn’t PC. It’s practical. I also can’t handle another “old friend”, “like a sister to me”, etc., after what I’ve been through.

  • It was one month into the first COVID lockdown. My long distance boyfriend lived in a separate country. We talked every day by video. The last time I’d seen him was two months earlier, and all seemed well between us. We had been together for 7 years and I felt very content and inspired by our relationship.

    A few weeks earlier, he told me that his ex from 12 years earlier, the mother of his 12 year old, was going to come from another city where she lived and be in COVID lockdown with him and their kid. The idea bothered me, because they seemed to have an acrimonious relationship for as long as I had known them, arguing about money. Their original relationship was a fling, when she got pregnant by accident, they briefly tried to be a couple but they just weren’t compatible.

    The child lived with his mom full time except he would spend Spring and Winter breaks and all Summer with his dad. dad paid the rent and extrA living expenses for the ex and his son. I once leant them money to secure a new apartment for the ex and their son.

    Dating people with school age kids, I’ve had to be respectful of the parents’ need to be in contact frequently, but I expected boundaries in return. The ex would sometimes stay with my boyfriend on one of those school breaks, and it made me a little uncomfortable. The ex wears a very sexy style of clothing, satin and lace lingerie and Daisy Duke style shorts on a regular weekday. She is a selfie queen. I take care of myself and make an effort with my looks, but I am a middle aged hippy, and my style is more conservative.

    I was talking to him on video, three days after she arrived, and suddenly she came onto the screen and announced that she was now living with him and they were a couple. It was a bizarre moment. I looked at my boyfriend, and his body was angled toward her, he wasn’t reacting with upset, just kind of reliance on her. He was with her. She was rude to me, also. He didn’t try to defend me.

    I matter of fact my said, « well then, Pedro, we have to break up. Let’s talk in 30 minutes. ». He didn’t call back for 45. He barely had any explanation. I did not yell or cry. I just said, « we have to break up now. » I do think this was the time I asked him if he used condoms, where he bought them, how many were in the pack, and how he got to the place to buy them. I said that we had an agreement to notify each other if monogamy was not going to work anymore, and before having sex with another person. He had plenty of sober time to call me before doing what he did. He totally replaced me with this woman.

    I am proud that I didn’t give her the satisfaction of fighting for him or fighting with her. She sent me photos of them having sex (?!) and a letter calling me a pathetic whiner and declaring that he was not great to her but he was with her now, and I sent a note back saying that she doesn’t have to stay with a man that is not good to her, and that I hope some day she has enough money of her own so she doesn’t have to depend on any man. That was our interaction.

    Karma was swift. Friends who lived with him said they fought constantly and that he was deeply depressed. She would taunt him, « Stop thinking about your PERFECT girlfriend! ». Referring to me. She posted a sex photo of them on his business related Instagram. That affected her income source!! Another friend told me she was on Tinder during that period, so it didn’t sound to me like a love affair. After 3 months, she left him and her son there, with the agreement that Pedro would parent the kid from now on, all year with no breaks. She has been back to visit them once, a year later.

    I was shocked , disappointed, done wrong worse than ever in my life by my favorite ever boyfriend. He did not adequately apologize ever. I always choose a break up song for every ex. For this one it was Stevie Wonder, « Maybe Your Baby ».

    Maybe this is a wrong move, but eventually I stopped being mad, (I wouldn’t say I’ve forgiven him) and we became friends again. We talk often. I have pledged to myself I will not see him in person for at least 5 years (when his kid is 18 and the parents have no excuse to be in contact) and I will never be his girlfriend or sex partner again. I am dating other people now.

  • She told me on Facebook in so many subtle ways. Drove past me slowly in a school zone and saw me. Later in the day put up a post that while looking for Christmas music( it was December) she ran across this oldie but goodie.
    It was about hot sex in the summer.
    The best one….
    After finding my husband looking at cabins… 2 weeks later she put up the same cabin. The one my husband had been looking at. She took her entire family there including her husband. Mine was already trying to cover his tracks and obviously changed his mind so she took them… lol
    For months she put up pictures of her and her husband in hotel rooms with rose petals on bed and all kinds of things .
    She put up posts of work they had done together.
    She finally put up that she divorced her husband. She went through this entire pathetic post. Over 100 people were supportive of her. She found my Instagram page ( very specific and unusual name) and made a post with the name of it. I “ liked her posts” and she blocked me! Good! She didn’t end up with my husband. She’s dating a registered sex offender. They can all rot.

  • she liked to scream outside my house, me and fw split up 9 years ago last month, she put my phone number on to a porn station and they called me, asking if i was interested in making porn videos. i wonder how they got my number. i think the sti(s) affected her brain, because they can do, she thought my ex was wonderful, she even dumped her kids for him. im thinking she has always dumped her kids. she calls me, i have a new number, must be in contact with my ex, to get my number, i get a screen shot, and call the police and get a crime number. police say u shouldnt answer private nos, but im having medical treatment from 3 different hospitals, and clinics and have kids. the police said i shouldnt give my no to dodgy people i didnt, cheeky bastards. calls from hospitals, clinics, social security in uk are from private numbers. shes probably on this site,

  • Text received at a mutual friend’s birthday party. He’d “ended it” (18 month long affair, with my “friend,” conducted almost exclusively in my home and holiday home) 6 weeks earlier.

    I carried on. 23 years of sunk costs at that stage? I dunno. (I truly loved him and he pretended he was so sorry.)

    Showed him the text as I sober drove home. Loads of fake remorse. Eight years of wreckonciliation. He shagged her again when I threw him out at the two year mark.

    After eight years of really good fake remorse, he announced he was leaving.

    For a new Schmoopie.

    He’d been internet dating for two years.

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