Tim Elliott, Chumped But Not Down
You want to see something gross? This is my “wife” reading vows to my daughter on our “wedding” night! The guy holding the microphone was my “friend/teammate” my wife cheated on me with this guy the same night! and they have had a relationship our entire “marriage” Gina mazany pic.twitter.com/oVesuFnNgz
— Tim Elliott (@TElliott125) May 13, 2023
Even Ultimate Fighters get chumped. Last Friday, UFC athlete Tim Elliott outed his cheating wife, Gina Mazany, on Twitter — and her affair partner, his teammate and wedding guest, Kevin Croom.
Tim’s not down for the count, however. Did he pick-me dance? Order affair recovery books on Amazon? No. He blasted this:
You want to see something gross? This is my “wife” reading vows to my daughter on our “wedding” night! The guy holding the microphone was my “friend/teammate” my wife cheated on me with this guy the same night! and they have had a relationship our entire “marriage” Gina mazany.
According to the Twitter thread, he found out via her texts to a friend, and Mazany later admitted it. As for the interval on his wedding day when he was momentarily without his bride? He was home putting his daughter to bed.
I mean, you have to admire the ingenuity of cheater multitasking. It takes some stone cold sociopath efficiency to chump someone on their wedding day. To fit that shit in between thank you cards. The mind wobbles.
Two beats into the Twitter thread comes some idiot peddling chump blame. Surely, you made her do this.
But did Elliott take it? No, he did not.
Let this be a master class, CN. See what he does here? He states EXACTLY what he did — he brought his goddamn A game — to his friendship and his marriage. He was in Croom’s corner. He was his teammate. He supported him.
And while many people might chide him for “airing his dirty laundry” about Mazany and Croom, I think Elliott handled it like a champ. He stated the facts. The harshest language was the quotation marks around “wife” and “friend.”
And gross? Pineapple on pizza is gross. Betraying someone on their wedding night is monstrous. Vile. Transgressive. Abusive. Sick.
Elliott is showing restraint. And like the ultimate fighter he is, he’s not backing down. From what happened. From shaming narratives. From shutting up.
But, but the children!
That’s not Mazany’s daughter. It’s Elliott’s daughter. Mazany betrayed her too.
Fair point. This wedding picture is already out there. And why shouldn’t that child know that this woman who promised to be a loving presence in her life, broke up the family? It’s simply the truth. It’s a horrible thing, yes. A painful, adult situation that we never want our children to encounter or experience at any age. But the fact remains, Marzany is being ejected from this child’s life. You’re going to blur her face and what? Cut off her ability to Google? Again with the chump shame — It’s Not What The Cheater Did, It’s Your Reaction to It.
It’s what the cheaters did. I applaud Elliott for putting it out there without apology. Air it, expose it, disinfect it with sunlight.
Better days ahead, Tim.
****
Hey! Big news! CHUMPALOOZA the Chump Nation gathering and conference is happening the weekend of Nov. 3-5, 2023. And tickets are now on sale here. Hope to see you there!
Tim sounds like he knows how to keep his child safe. Hope he stays strong in the face of blaming him for her BS. { FYI pineapple on pizza is great.}
I’m with you on the pineapple on pizza! It’s just delish!
🍍 🍕 😋 I know, I know Italians are probably horrified by such culinary sacrilege 🤣🤣 Sweet and salty
Also team pineapple on pizza.
I hope the Karma Bus hits the assholes who blamed the chump between the eyes sooner than later!
For someone who lives their life in the public eye, he handled this with courage and grace and factual accuracy.
For someone who doesn’t, I’d suggest staying away from social media accusing cheaters of anything in anyway that might be used in court against you. Same goes for email… or anything that can be reflected back on your mental state (especially with custody issues). Go no contact (email and text for only the “must communicate” information), stop following the cheater(s) immediately on all social platforms, and keep coming back here to say every thing you need to get out. We get it, we’ll listen.
Good point. As Mr. CL says, “If it feels good, don’t do it.” Especially if you have children together or are in the middle of divorce litigation. And since I posted this column, Elliott took down the tweet. I still applaud him for stating the truth of what happened to him. I think the balance is really off on protecting abusers vs. shaming chumps into staying quiet about it.
Agreed. Even if avoiding factual public disclosure is the better move from a practical or legal standpoint, we should never confuse this with being the actually better moral position nor accept the unfair social conditions that force public silence of what is essentially domestic abuse. Below is a good argument from an old Guardian article about the unfairness of courts protecting the “privacy” of cheaters in the UK before the publication seemed to go tits up infidelity apologist. The article has a few problems: Even if the author’s misogyny angle applies to the statistical majority of domestic abuse, focusing only on that instead of including the wider humanist issue of cheating/abuse by either gender leads to the typical faux-feminist defense of side pieces as if a) sides pieces are only ever female; and (most politically problematic) b) women are too weak and incompetent to be held accountable for their conscious misdeeds. Would the author argue by extension for a special legal concession to protect the privacy of she-cheaters because, when cheating wives are exposed, they’re more likely to be slut-shamed? How long before male abusers start to claim the same shield, what with the increasing popularity of terms like “himbo” and “man ho”? Barring that muddy bit, the author makes some excellent points.
“Wayne Rooney’s infidelity exposes law’s misogyny”
Gill Phillips
Mon 13 Sep 2010 https://www.theguardian.com/media/2010/sep/13/wayne-rooney-infidelity-law-misogyny
“There has been a lot of public discussion in the past few weeks about celebrities getting injunctions to protect their private lives. The commentaries suggest that these injunctions are being obtained predominantly by high-profile celebrities including a number of Premiership footballers to prevent publication of their (alleged) peccadilloes.
There is, however, another aspect to this debate. The more of these stories I read about, the more they seem to me to represent a rather sordid misogynistic world where Victorian value judgments prevail and where women seem to be treated as bits of property. I am concerned that this is a world that the courts seem happy to protect.
In Max Mosley’s case against the News of the World, Mr Justice Eady said: “It is not for the state or for the media to ex-pose sexual conduct that does not involve any significant breach of the criminal law. That is so whether the motive for such intrusion is merely prurience or a moral crusade. It is not for journalists to undermine human rights … merely on grounds of taste or moral disapproval.”
There is a much deeper moral danger about these orders and that is that the courts in granting them are allowing men to treat women like chattels – they are not just condoning these celebrities’ conduct but also creating the impression that it is acceptable to behave like this and not to tell your wife or partner what you have been up to. This is where the real vice lies. It is not about stopping the tabloids exposing sexual misconduct – I have no desire to read about Wayne Rooney’s latest infidelity – it’s about perpetuating and protecting a view of society where men can behave like Neanderthals and then be told by a court of law that it is absolutely fine to treat women like lumps of meat. The real harm of these orders is not that they gag the press – it is that they stop the wives, partners and families from finding out about the bit on the side.
In 2009, some of these orders appear to have been obtained by men who were seeking to cover up a variety of affairs. Guardian News & Media was notified on 10 occasions of injunctions granted to individuals whose identity was protected by anonymity, and eight orders so far this year. It is also of concern to me that the vast majority of the orders are given by male judges in cases where these male celebrities are represented by male barristers. I worry we are missing a really serious issue – little or no regard appears to be given to the rights of women in these cases, whether the “other woman” or the wounded wife or partner.
The effect of the court’s willingness to grant these orders is that they seem to condone the treatment of women by these celebrities – a woman can gratuitously be called a tart and a slag without any opportunity to defend herself publicly, and all credit in that regard to Vanessa Perroncel for speaking out.
Much has been said about how distressing it must have been for Coleen Rooney to have read about all this in the papers – but that misses the point. If Wayne wanted to avoid causing Coleen distress then it’s quite simple. Don’t play away from home and if you do, then fess up: that’s what those who aren’t rich and famous enough to go to court have to do…”
The whole thing falls apart when you put the lens of consent over it.
I always think about that when I think about the viral trend in the media of defending cheating as some kind of groovy, sex-pozzy pastime. Considering that Google invested $3.4 billion into streaming porn a few years ago and that most major media companies are doing the same, I get the feeling that the real point of frantic media cheating defense is that it’s simply part of a general, cynical campaign to muddy public concepts of consent because “consent” is the sturdiest and most enduring ethical contention against the porn industry and sex work in general– a contention that gets around the usual free speech defenses of porn. So many performer– like other sex workers– are trafficked as minors. Performers have little say over what happens to them on set. Performers die at alarming rates and scarcely profit from their participation in an industry whose profits dwarf those of all over media.
The porn industry is filled with women who were abused as children and are often addicts. 97% of violence in porn is directed toward women. It’s a disgusting ‘business.’
Gay porn, too. I had a neighbor– a young former porn actor in LA who contracted HIV. Smart kid with a good heart from a challenging background. He would have naturally wised up as he matured and made other choices if he’d known he had them. That industry can’t be shut down without taking free speech with it but it should be regulated to the Nth degree.
ICanSeetheMeh… looks like his Twitter post was taken down. Not sure If his attorney encouraged that or what
i’m curious about if Tim was a woman and posted the same material. i think there’s a fair amount of misogyny with regards to women stating their truth. “she’s bitter and can’t let go. i think she’s unstable, did you hear, she’s been stating her truth? disgusting. so messy.” that sort of thing.
the whole thing is tiring. the level of betrayal is hard to take in. who are these people, these betrayers, and where did they learn this behaviour? i know, i know, it’s selfishness and entitlement, but STILL. the planning involved.
I agree there is misogyny and a double standard. Which is why it’s additionally important for women to speak factual, truthful information about why their marriage ended. I’ve always been a very strong advocate of speaking the truth of what happened in a calm and measured way and would love to see a Friday challenge about that. Truth is a defense. Truth is liberating. I’ve shared here before exactly what I said to the family and friends and work colleagues of my ex about his walking out. It was a fine piece of writing, I reviewed every word for truth and accuracy, and then let it rip. One of my finest moments. I’m still proud of it now 6 years later. Happy more of us are coming around to that point of view.
Dame – Would you consider sharing this piece of writing? I would love to read.
My guess is that he consciously made a choice to follow the Shakira model to the extent that the “bitter bunny she-chump whining about cheating” thing is beginning to burn out in “public discourse.” There certainly was some bitter-bunny flak following Shakira’s disclosures but– even when the usual cheater-apologist media tried to push that angle– it was dwarfed by worldwide applause and the breaking of multiple world records. So there’s another way to look at it: Shakira made doing this seem so appealing that even the he-chumps are risking being smacked with the dreaded “cuck” label.
I think the recent Gallup polls showing that public acceptance of infidelity keeps plummeting even as acceptance of gay marriage and single parenting rises reflects an increasing understanding of and critical attitude towards emotional abuse that, probably for the first time, seems quite separate from traditional religious prohibitions against adultery. You wouldn’t know it to read cheater-celebrating media spin but I think we may be entering a new era of awareness that began in fits and starts with Oprah’s focus on toxic family dynamics and hidden abuse in the 80s.
I don’t think you can change a narrative unless you’re willing to face name-calling. (And misogyny and whatever else people who have a vested interest in the narrative not changing want to throw at you. Doesn’t change the truth.)
I was blamed for stating the truth. My former sil told me it was messy and “there are two sides” (her brother hiring hookers vs … my pain?). He could say anything—dead marriage BEFORE our 18 and 19 year old children were even conceived? He’d been a martyr to stay. The chump wife gets the blame. She’s supposed to shut up and take the high road while the whispers continue about what she did that “caused” him to stray. My x cheated because he felt he was entitled and he could purchase sex.
Mine as well and his family, my SIL clearly place blame on me, I must have deserved for him to lie, cheat and steal my money for sex workers… my response to SIL, I will never accept responsibility for his behavior and I’d never ask you to take blame for your ex’ criminal fraud!! Unbelievable
Oh yes, that old chestnut Faithful
That and ‘you never know what goes on behind closed doors’
Blah blah
Yep, it’s all about their entitlement in reality
I would absolutely love to out my ex husband’s AP on social media.. But I’m afraid of the stinky poo water splash back I’d get from doing so.
As much as I understand that there’s potential blowback for chumps publicly disclosing the facts, it’s all the more unfair because chumps can’t even do so to defend themselves. There’s a very real problem of cheaters and APs having free reign to commit character assassination against victims that can cause social isolation not to mention job or reputational loss. So I think it would satisfy a sense of justice and give chumps a chance to correct the narrative if it were possible to solve another huge problem caused by affairs– embezzled marital assets– if it were possible sue APs (not just cheaters) for the value of any gifts or amenities they profited from via affairs.
A case like this succeeded in CA but I don’t think it’s being used as a precedent yet. I hope it will be in future. Alienation of affection laws might be antiquated but the concept of retrieving stolen property is never out of fashion. Plus, laws related to transfer of stolen property don’t allow recipients to claim ignorance. They still have to pay the money back regardless of whether they knew the source of the money/property. It would be hilarious if sex workers refused to do business with married johns and began using vetting procedures because of the risk of being sued by spouses for the fees.
This probably applies mostly to female APs because of common sugar daddy/sugar baby dynamics but it can go the other way. Male chumps have reported being fleeced of joint assets to pay for affairs as well. Either way, enabling suits like this would create a greater public consciousness that APs in general are often on the take and that affairs frequently come in tow with financial abuse. APs who accepted gifts wouldn’t even be able to ride the trope of the vengeful ex impoverishing the poor put-upon cheater. The optics are just different because many APs are, after all, taking other people’s money, not guarding their supposedly ‘hard-earned’ own without simultaneously admitting that they “earned it the old fashioned way.” They might STFU about the chump after losing a case like that hoping no one finds out. Either that or the verdict sticks to them like napalm and makes bystanders question the blameshifting a little more. In terms of female APs, it’s harder for side pieces to wave a faux feminist flag and claim that being held accountable for their role in cheating is “misogynistic” because, if they didn’t like the implication that taking gifts and money during an affair is ‘whorish,’ they could always have said no.
The above is on my long legislative wish list, somewhere below overturning Citizens United.
Male chump will raised the ap’s child… It’s sad
Agree that male Chumps get ripped off too, just not always in the form of gifts given to AP. Cheater MiL got a facelift ($15k? $20k? Idk) while cheating with plans to run away with AP. Oh and guess who nursed her through the recovery? Chump FiL should have divorced and been compensated for marital money AND time. Of course he knew he wouldn’t be. They’re still together.
i hear you.
my X embarked on a workplace affair with his direct subordinate, who he subsequently promoted to a director level job. then he was forced to move his VP position (the company accommodated their affair and shifted the organization chart), and they continued to work for another year. my X just lost his job in a downsizing and his AP was “forced” out of her position. she has found employment in another big company. he has not. i guess no one wants to hire an angry 60 year-old alcoholic living a stereotypical life.
at the time, i felt like i couldn’t say much on social media because if my X was fired for cause, my settlement would have evaporated, etc. etc.
but they both should’ve been fired on the spot. but karma has it’s way and i’m in a much better position because of it. time moves slow.
i do state these things privately because transparency is a good thing.
I made the mistake ONCE of losing my temper in front of my child about the AP. The FW grabbed onto it and tried to take me to court for full custody. $12,000 later, he lost, but that was a really expensive lesson. Nothing good ever comes of putting them on blast. It’s a wretched shit sandwich, but you lose your right to free speech until the kids are 18.
My counsel here is if you have kids with the cheater, do not engage. In this guy’s case, he did not have a kid with her.
I really admire his action: we ought to all of us have responded to marital treason in this exact fashion. It is too easy for the adulterous slug to slide right out of sight.
“It is too easy for the adulterous slug to slide right out of sight”. As a gardener plagued with these destructive veggie pests, I fantasize about emptying fistfuls of salt on one and watching her melt into a slimy gooey mess but the sight would give me nightmares and retching for days, not worth the brief high. FW are the slugs in our life gardens (apologies to actual honest slugs out there just keeping it real) but fighting them can be a gross affair..
I’m glad he shared. His restraint is ADMIRABLE…What skanks!
He will have NO problem finding someone who deserves him and his daughter.
I admire how he just started it with “you want to see something gross?” Haven’t we all had that nauseating, skin crawling, throw up in your mouth a little bit feeling looking at our FW’s?
I liked how he worded it too. Because it is exceptionally gross. It’s a picture of two smiling adults just absolutely delighting in how they are actively and purposefully harming a child. It’s disgusting.
Tim Elliott, chump legend. I love that he put it on blast but did it like a total boss while shutting down the “you must have done something” blameshifting tweetwad. Standing ovation.
The chosen pic is shade genius too: the shifty eyes of the teammate that you can’t unsee as he holds the mic as temporary stand-in — this is the ultimate duper’s delight face…
The shifty eyes plus the mullet !
I rarely disagree with Chump Lady but here I whole heartedly do. Pineapple on pizza is the. absolute. best.
I don’t follow Ultimate Fighting but Elliott has my respect. Would love to see him at Chumpalooza.
I like your user name IPickMe.
Cheating on her wedding day?! But how can this be? Everybody knows people cheat because they are unhappy, met someone, and fell in love!
😜
NOT.
Good one, hammer!
Good for Tim. Why do the victims need to keep the cheater’s secrets?? They don’t!
My ex cheated with the woman who bullied me when we attended the same highschool. Nice eh ?
“What did you do to make them angry?” sounds way too much like the victim-blaming question often thrown at abuse victims. “What did you do to make them hit you/yell at you/break your family heirloom?”
Nothing. It’s a choice made by the abuser.
It’s so important to have your reality validated. For sure, I totally understand that desire. In my fantasy, I wanted to put together a PowerPoint Presentation with all the screenshots and evidence that I found to prove that FE was a lying dickhole. Who would I present it to? That wasn’t the point. The point was I had empirical evidence and not just “feelings.”
I didn’t have a powerpoint, but I had a whole file folder filled with other file folders on my computer with documented evidence (texts, emails, phone records, photographs, etc.) that showed FW’s ongoing abuse, the affair, the lies, OW’s complicity, her abuse of me, etc. I had it all ready to go if we ever got to trial. It felt good to be armed to the teeth with concrete, dated evidence, most of it straight from FW’s mouth (like the texts where he was berating me because I didn’t destroy the photographs of the bruises he gave me when he told me to…).
We never got to trial because FW died, and part of me was almost sorry.
I would LOVE to call out OW in public. She paints herself as a feminist, activist, social justice warrior concerned for the oppressed, advocates for kindness, posts about abuse and trauma, on and on. AND YET. And yet she knowingly and willingly fucked a married man for YEARS, lied to my face, told me I was lying and just trying to hurt FW’s reputation by talking about my abuse, smeared me to anyone who would listen, tried to get me fired from my job for harassing HER (???? – I literally sat in my cubicle alone and cried), threatened me with police action because I was involved in HER life, and on and on. She put my kid through hell, breaking up our family (even if it all ultimately led to a better life for me and my son, OW certainly didn’t have our best interests at heart) and then abandoning him AGAIN when she left FW. She never explained to my son why she left, nor did she apologize. She just cut him off after being in his life for over 5 years and pretending to care about him.
My son still deals with trauma and fear of being abandoned. OW’s a steaming turd pile and everyone on social media, and many of my “friends” just love her and tell her she’s amazing and wonderful and I’m just like…??!?!?! But I haven’t said a word. She has to live with herself. She basically drove FW to suicide, telling him he was “too much of a pussy to do it” (his letter laid it all at her feet, and yes, I take everything he said with a huge grain of salt, but I don’t doubt she was as volatile and abusive to him as he said – I’ve seen her in action).
She wrote two really crappy “novels” and I really, really want to leave them a scathing review (all the reviews she currently has are written by friends and family – I know most of the people), but I haven’t done that either.
Oh well. Most of the time I’m busy with my own (very good) life, but once in a while it really irks me that she basically got away scot free. I mean, she has to live with herself, but I sincerely doubt she’s learned anything from the experience.
I did put a PowerPoint together for lawyers. After it was done I sent it to her friend who was very vocal bashing me on all social media. Told that flying monkey to show it to FW and if the shit didn’t stop it would go public with it. Also told friend to tell FW our son(16) knew what she did and he had asked to read her deposition (which is very bad). Told friend that I would leave deposition where son could find it (I would never let him read it but he really did ask a couple of times).
She has stopped all social media bashing
FW not FE
I like the fact that someone with a social following is calling some skanks out on their skankery! I think it’s hugely beneficial to other chumps and in starting to change the accepted narrative out there. Similar to Shakira singing about her dick of a spouse, it’s brave and helpful is what I see.
I also agree, if that were their daughter as a couple, he would need to zip it up for the daughter’s sake and for the best divorce outcome.
But cheating on their wedding day with a friend he deeply trusted?!
Wow,wow, wow, always shocking how low these snakes can slither.
Good for you I say, Tim! Go ahead and hang their dirty laundry on every clothesline you can access. They deserve to be shamed for their actions.
I felt the shame when my FW ran off with his mistress and avoided social engagement for way too long. I didn’t want anyone, except the very closest to me, to know what happened. The shame was not mine to bear, I now realize. What an advantage to a FW for their deceived partner to pull inward in pain.
I think it helps greatly for other chumps out there to know they can hold their heads up high, these revelations by well known people can be really powerful
The problem is the chumps are so devastated by the betrayal, their grief and silence gives the A-hole cheaters plenty of time to establish their BS narratives before you can come up for air. They also hold all the cards, because the cheating isn’t a new revelation to them, it’s just business as usual. We, on the other hand, are so shocked by their actions it’s difficult and painful to react for our own advantage.
The less time we spend shocked and crushed, the better the outcome, I believe.
So, I’m happy to see these losers exposed more and more, even if chumps might be advised to stay tight lipped until the divorce is done, I think even hearing others shouting the abuses out loud will give them strength to get through their own hell.
Actions do have consequences. Some are more delayed than others, but I don’t think any of these FW’s walk through the forests they knowingly torched without getting burned themselves. No one is ‘living the dream’, destroying others. I will never believe that to be true.
I don’t wish harm on anyone, but consciously harming other people will not work out for anyone in the long view. You create negativity, you will reap it too.
I thought Kevin Costner’s PR person came up with some suitable (but ambiguous) language: “It is with great sadness that circumstances beyond his control have transpired which have resulted in Mr. Costner having to participate in a dissolution of marriage action.”
No allegations of cheating that I know of – just liked the clever wording.
On the cheater’s IG there are quite a few pictures of the three of them together.
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cl61sKhJV_G/?hl=en
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cl-WyCFjZMO/?hl=en
https://www.instagram.com/p/Coyg0eSr_Q5/?hl=en
I look at these and am on Elliot’s behalf. It reminds me how easily people who see no problem with lying lie. All the lies COMBINED with all these fun, buddy, bonding times! What a mindfuck.
Tim must be feeling devastated. It’s a massive betrayal from the two people he was probably closest to (daughter aside)… I hope he finds his way to CL and LACGAL and doesn’t backslide into depression paralysis or PickMe dancing having been so dignified and cool… from the IG pics the “wife” looks like she enjoys the kibbles / attention maybe a little too much…
As someone who found my first husband (a mere 13 month marriage) passed out naked on top of my friend (also naked), I know how shitty a spouse & friend can be. That ex even tried to hook up with me again upon hearing of divorce #2. Bahaha NO. Dump them both, champ!
CL (and to all the Chumps),
This is tangential to this topic. How does a Chump balance ‘the outing’ versus ‘if it feels good don’t do it’ to the children. I know a friend that is a chump 🙂 and they have letters, emails, texts, photos, ….. Wouldn’t it be grand to put a website up with the timeline and just the fuckwits and twu luvs own words and actions?
The big thing this friend hears as for a reason not to do it is ‘for the kids’. I am not so sure that this reason holds water for them and i can understand why. The kids are sort of in a ‘pick me dance’ to a different song than us chumps are. They want their parent fuckwit to be someone they can trust and care for their well being in that parent sort of way. In any other case i would move that it might be your duty/obligation as a human being to warn someone about the character of that person. They have already lied to, stolen from, betrayed ….. the child. Thoughts?
To meh!
“You have brought our personal life into the hockey community just to tarnish my name, I am sick and tired of your childish immature ways you made a complete ass of yourself this weekend just to let everyone know that I cheated on you grow the f* up please and leave me alone” – My response: “YOU tarnished your OWN name (FW name) you destroyed your OWN honor – I don’t get how f’ing narcissistic you have to be to not SEE that and bringing your white trash little kid hillbilly whre out on a mother’s day weekend (hockey) tournament it serves you 10000% right for people to be like wtf is going on why is that old man with that ugly little kid whre holding her hand??” (I had to sit there all weekend and watch him in the arena sitting with AP – I told him NOT to bring her there, I proceeded to tell him I would let everyone know WHO and WHAT she is and whenever I spoke to anyone I very friendly but openly said “can you believe he brought his affair partner here and they are sitting just over THERE?” And I would proceed to point openly at them laughing – you bring the AP anyhow even tho I told you not to and ruin my mother’s day weekend you better believe I’m gonna have my chances to speak up !