Infidelity Advice for the Newly Chumped?

paralysisSo assuming some of the newly minted chumps from the Ashley Madison data hack wash up on our shores, what advice would you give them?

We’ve all Been There and Done That — the knee-buckling shock of discovery, the spackling over the lame excuses, the hyper-vigilant marriage policing, the therapy appointments (that we book, not them), the sobbing, the weight loss, the raging, the pick me dances…

So what would you tell a new chump today? What would you do differently based on your own chumpdom?

Newbies — if you did just find us, welcome! It gets better (on a Tuesday). But the pain is a motherfucker. We can help. (((Hugs))) to anyone just finding out this week.

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ExNihil0
ExNihil0
8 years ago

Hindsight being 20/20, I would’ve gone back down to the courthouse and immediately filed for divorce. I found out two freakin’ days after our marriage that he’d cheated…(with my uncle…yeah, whole ‘nother story). I would’ve ignored his tears and pleading and promises to never do it again, blah blah blah. I would’ve kicked his ass to the curb, moved back to my home state instead of staying with him and going back to Florida where he would end up cheating again (big surprise). In fact, I would never have got with him in the first place, had I a choice to go back. I wouldn’t have overlooked all the red flags and pardoned him so much.

At any rate, I’d tell new chumps to just fucking cut your losses and get out. It’s not worth it. They’re dirty dicked waste of organs, and sacrificing your dignity for that? Just no. End of October will be a year since the divorce was final and I came home to WV. Better than I’ve been in so long and going back to school for what I truly love, medicine. I have my own house now, a better life for my little one, surrounded by supportive family and this amazing scenery.

And it was stumbling upon this very site that made me wake the hell up and say to hell with this bullshit, I’m out. I’m forever grateful for all this site does.

Long time reader, first time commenter–
J

Cletus
Cletus
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

As a fellow Mountaineer there is something to be said about the comfort of coming home and being hugged by our beautiful mountains…Our state motto is a great chump motto as well… “Mountaineers are always free”…especially from narcissistic asshat cheaters!

ChumpB
ChumpB
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

Sitting at the courthouse waiting to get married, 1989. Fighting. “Do you want to do this?” In that moment, in that pivotal meaningful moment, I wish I had followed my instincts that were screaming, “Nooooo!” The only blessed thing that came out of that union was my kids and of course I would not have changed that for anything. My biggest advice is follow those instincts, especially when you are in suspicion mode. Even kids sense it and know it. I am a Chump Child and was taken on little outings with my mother and her AP. It was awful to feel it but not know it cognitively. So not only trust your instincts but follow them. Much love to CN. My hand is injured putting in my new floors so I’ve been a bit behind the scenes lately. Ps, also best advice: trust CL and this site. It is and continues to be lifesaving for me.

FreedomFromCrazy
FreedomFromCrazy
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpB

I really wish newly chumped Anna Duggar would visit this site. Unfortunately, I figured this would be the response…internalizing blame and thinking Josh will change. She needs to get out of that cultish life & protect her babies. He’s already proven he doesn’t consider young family members off limits sexually. Ugh…I’m sick after reading.

http://m.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/anna-duggar-absorb-blame-cheating-hubby-report-article-1.2332918

KenderJ
KenderJ
8 years ago

Anna is quiverfull. From what I’ve been reading on the Patheos blogs, it is an extremely patriarchal christian sect. All of her family, friends and everyone she knows is quiverfull and, likely taking Josh’s side. For Anna to leave Josh, she would have to be willing to leave everything she knows, possibly including her children. They practice shunning, so she would be losing her parents, siblings (some of whom she probably helped raise), all of her friends, her church and anyone else you can think of. I guess the equivalent would be if any of os walked out our front door with only the clothes on our back and the money in our pocket and moved to Shanghai. Most likely, she is getting little to no support and is probably being told by everyone, not just Josh, that his cheating is because she wasn’t a godly enough wife. That’s why, to me, Josh is even more despicable than most of our cheaters. We could get away.

SueB
SueB
8 years ago
Reply to  KenderJ

I just want to give her a hug. I wish someone she knew would step up and stand by her and be the family that she needs. Psalm 68:6 says that God places the lonely in families, that He sets the prisoners free and gives them joy, but He makes the rebellious live in a sun-scorched land. I hope God gives Anna her family and her freedom and joy soon. If I were Josh, I would not gloss over what happens to rebellious people in that verse.

newchumpatl
newchumpatl
8 years ago

I feel sorry for her, she’s brainwashed.

KenderJ
KenderJ
8 years ago
Reply to  newchumpatl

I do too, she was raised this way. Have you ever heard of blanket training? It’s pretty gross. They are also raised to be completely obedient to their parents, to be completely obedient to their husband after marriage and their only value to parents, husband and god is their ability to make babies.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago

I tweeted her this site. 🙂

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Good for you Nord!

LiningUpDucks
LiningUpDucks
8 years ago

Ugh. I’m sick, too, reading that. I don’t understand why many hard-core Christians ignore the fact that adultery is a sin and 100% validated as a reason to leave your spouse. How do they all skip that part!?!

SueB
SueB
8 years ago
Reply to  LiningUpDucks

I think part of it is our own fear honestly. It is scary to think about ending a marriage and experiencing the unknown. You’ll hear comments from other places that “it takes two” and your spouse probably shifts blame onto you, so it is easy for the loyal, betrayed spouse to feel responsible. If you’re responsible, you can change things by doing the pick me dance well enough and, theoretically, you won’t have to face whatever you’re afraid of should the marriage end. It also felt wrong to me to leave a marriage after only a couple years without giving it another shot to fix whatever was wrong. I think it is common for people who are devout and take marriage seriously to feel like they need to try everything possible to make the marriage work before giving up.

Also, the greek word used in the Bible passage that gives betrayed spouses the right to leave and remarry is “porneia”. There is a debate on what qualifies as porneia. Most places that mention viable reasons for divorce simply say porneia in that verse means adultery period. I did, however, read something by a minister referring to porneia as being more of a lifestyle choice, a persistent, unrepentant adultery. So, a cheater cheating once and then being truly sorry and promising to never do it again may not qualify as porneia under that reasoning. It is easy to feel like you need to try reconciling to prove whether or not the adulterer is truly unrepentant. After all, cheaters do like to lie and pretend to be repentant…

I grew up Lutheran, so I never had any doubts on whether or not it was ok to divorce and remarry due to adultery. However, from what I understand, Catholics believe that the passage mentioned is referring ONLY to the engagement period. So, once you have had your wedding day, it is impossible to divorce your spouse for any reason and remarry without the remarriage being considered adultery. However, according to the catholic faith, some marriages are never valid in the first place, which is why there is a catholic annulment process. There is an investigation that can determine if the marriage was valid and, if it wasn’t, you are then free to remarry without the remarriage being considered adulterous.

Is this confusing enough? With all these reasons, I think it is understandable why betrayed spouses have a hard time leaving. It took me three years.

WhereisMia
WhereisMia
8 years ago
Reply to  SueB

Rules in organised religion???….. Psychopathy in action … Just sayin

Nicole S
Nicole S
8 years ago
Reply to  LiningUpDucks

As a devout Christian I can tell you we know adultery is 100% wrong. In Moses’ time they stoned adulterers to death. We get caught up in the redemption thing. We think our spouses are going to see the error of their ways and repent like the good little “Christians” should and that is the only option for our kids. What we realize too late is that this rarely happens, we have every right to divorce them no matter what and they’re Christian act was all bogus. Thank goodness for Divorce Minister and my Christian counselor! They set me straight. We need to tweet Anna DM’s site too!

Fireball
Fireball
8 years ago
Reply to  Nicole S

Christianity is clear for those of us who are believers. Adultery is SIN and it is 100% the choice and fault of the betrayer. We faithful ones are kicked around by the WRONG counsel of forgiveness/forgetting, and God forbid be angry! 31 years I stayed taking in this sick advice, which left me a shambles. FINALLY and with God’s help alone, I am breaking free, I filed for divorce in March and it has been a living hell.

My advice to the newly CHUMPed is NO chances, just think long and hard what has happened. Its not a little mistake, you have been betrayed by your spouse/partner in a way that can not be reversed EVER! I fully regret staying after my 1st DDay 25 years ago. I had 3 little ones and felt i needed the financial support and I stayed. It was never the same and the serial cheater continued in his activites. ALL the while lying to me that he was living in freedom. blah blah blah.

For anyone struggling with their faith, visit Divorce Minister, you will understand that the provision of divorce was given to us to protect us. HE knew we would most likely not get over what happened EVER and that the perpetrator, manipulator, liar, cheater, self absorbed, disordered person would most likely not change. It hurts, but cut them loose or you will live a life of disappointments one after the other. 31 years of my precious life was all a lie. My 3 angels are the only good for me that came from this union. GOD wants the best for you, and these people are NOT the best!!

Peace

Flowerlady
Flowerlady
8 years ago
Reply to  Nicole S

Forgiveness and restored trust are two different things. You can forgive someone but it doesn’t mean you have to trust them or stay married to them.

LiningUpDucks
LiningUpDucks
8 years ago
Reply to  Nicole S

Yes, agree. BTW, I am a Christian as well, and I definitely felt pressure to stay and forgive, for the reasons you mentioned. I imagine the pressure is much higher in the Duggar environment where Anna was raised and is still living.

brittneyk
brittneyk
8 years ago
Reply to  LiningUpDucks

I was a christian before I was married, during, and after the cheating and divorce. I will forgive, but never forget when a pastor told me there are always two sides to every store. In adultery there really is just one, the one of betrayal. I am so sad that women allow their husbands to rise back to glory by stepping on the back of our necks. God orchestrated every piece of me escaping my horrible marriage. His desire is for our spouses to love and respect us.

FreedomFromCrazy
FreedomFromCrazy
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

“dirty dicked waste of life” LMFAO ???
So funny and so true! I almost shot coffee out of my nose from laughing so hard.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

Yep, in a nutshell: cut your losses and get out. Life is truly better on the other side. When I look back I cringe to think I might have spent the rest of my life in that gilded cage.

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

If you’re here because your spouse cheated, first, I’m so sorry. You must know that you’ll likely go through all of the stages of grief and loss, and maybe even experience symptoms of PTSD.

That is NORMAL; however, keep enough of your brain juice flowing so that you can:
a) Open a separate checking account w/ your personal direct deposits going into it

b) Hire an ass-kicking lawyer & file for divorce

c) Request immediate child support and spousal & household maintenance support in the Temporary Order

d) DOCUMENT everything day-to-day (you won’t remember)

e) Change ALL your passwords to your phone, iPad, computer, whatever stores YOUR personal stuff

f) Change all of your personal life/death policies and retirement beneficiaries to a trusted parent or family member (you’ll forget about it unless you do it, and you can’t think in terms of “we” anymore. This is about protecting yourself and your kids’ future.

g) Chump Lady says: After getting busted, if they profess their “love” for you and that it was all a mistake, then demand a post-nup and a credit check immediately. If they balk at these demands, that’s your answer. Don’t waiver – file.

h) Get a counselor for yourself and your kids. Ask them one question before you start paying: In a typical marriage and family relationship, when emotional and/or physical adultery occurs against one loyal spouse, who do you believe is the responsible party?

If you get ANY wind of a bullshit answer that “there are two sides to every story,” just get up and walk out. You’ll waste time and money, when the only answer is: THE CHEATER is responsible for his or her lack of character, lack or morals and ethics, and lack of personal integrity. A loyal spouse is NOT responsible for their cheating spouses’ behavior. END. OF. STORY. You’ve been through enough emotional and mental abuse right now, and you certainly don’t need to pay some moron to tell you that although you were loyal and engaged with the family, and were likely always pulling more weight than your cheater, that somehow YOU are a part of their active CHOICE to commit adultry. F-that! Same goes for any family members who think “there are two sides…” F-that. There’s ONE story here: they cheated, and you didn’t, and you BOTH lived in the same shitty or great marriage. Again, END. OF. STORY.

i) When you get a tiny grip on yourself, begin to slowly move through Chump Lady’s archives, and buy her book. Don’t waste money on the “you can save your marriage alone” books. Just don’t. You can’t. It takes both spouses, and right now, one spouse’s genitals are more important than their family or spouse they took vows with.

j) Don’t social media blast the cheater or give their whore affair partner your time. Threats and nasty posts could be used against you later – EVEN though you are the loyal and sane spouse. No matter what or how bad right now, you want to always be able to look at yourself in the mirror and know that you maintained your integrity throughout the hell this asshole has dumped on you and your kids.

k) TELL THE CHEATER NOTHING ABOUT WHAT YOU’RE DOING. This might feel somewhat like a mental and physical game of chess, but you’re not the one drunk on dopamine and oxitocin from your daily adultery. Use that to your advantage and consider and think about every move your making. It’s all to free yourself from a deceiver and from someone perfectly content to stab you in the back. I know. It was the person who promised to always have your back and love/honor you, but that’s not who they are anymore. THIS IS. It’s in black-and-white for you to deal with. Don’t give away your moves.

l) Connect, or re-connect with Jesus. He’s just waiting for you to run to Him, and is the only one who will never lie or cheat. You have to connect spiritually with what’s much bigger than you and what’s happening. If it’s not Jesus for you, then connect in your way with your higher being. If that’s hard right now, try a free podcast called Daily Hope with Rick Warren. He has a series call “Seasons of Life” and focuses on a season of loss. This is what you’re in no matter if you stay or go. That marriage you thought you had is done. It’s a loss. Learn about it.

m) Exercise & fuel your body even when you don’t want to. Your family needs you, and YOU need a healthy you for the mighty life you’re about to discover for yourself. It might be a few weeks before you feel like you can even do this, but you’ve got to work out those toxins running through your system as a result from all of this immediate hell, and working it out through sweat keeps you from sitting and self-destructing. I ran about 100 miles while crying. It was worth it. Do it.

You will be mentally, spiritually, and physically numb and exhaused, and you’ll feel like you’re living in a dream, just going through the motions of existing when you first find out. You HAVE to accept that more times than not, these are chronic lying douchebags, who are more concerned with their next orgasm than about the safety, security and financial future of you and your kids. However, you don’t need to “think” about this until you’ve taken steps to protect yourself. THEN you can move through the stages of grief and disbelief and loss, knowing that you’ve done what you can to insolate yourself and your kids.

It’s hard to process what’s happening, or to think in terms of yourself separate from “him/her” but that’s only because you’re a good and loyal spouse. That is NOT how your cheater spouse thinks about you or your “marriage,” and they obviously are willing to destroy you, your childrens’ immediate family, and your marriage, and they’ll do it right from within your own home. They are NOT your friend. Process this shit later; protect yourself and your children from his/her chaos NOW.

Keep coming back to Chump Nation. We’ve been through it, we’re dealing with the same personal and family struggles that you will move through, and are our own mighty family. Everyone is welcome. You really aren’t alone, and there are people all around you who love you, and who WON’T make excuses for that douchebag cheater’s behavior.

Massive (((hugs))) and prayers out for all the new, unfortunate Chumps.

QueenDingbat
QueenDingbat
8 years ago

I need to read this everyday! Thank you.

NorthernLight
NorthernLight
8 years ago

“It’s hard to process what’s happening, or to think in terms of yourself separate from “him/her” but that’s only because you’re a good and loyal spouse. That is NOT how your cheater spouse thinks about you or your “marriage”….”

I realized this is the first weeks from something my ex said. He was using a lot of “I” statements, and I realized that when he talked about “my future”….that alll along that is how he must have been thinking, whereas my instinct had been to think of “our” future…. Sigh. It took me a while to stop talking in “we” terms, but I eventually switched over to calling it “my” home.

Also, that “Gives You Hell” song was great blasting in my car, driving along on a sunny, beautiful day with the windows down. 🙂 I also like Ok Go’s This Too Shall Pass song.

Patsy
Patsy
8 years ago

A MIGHTY post kibble free, that is the post of the thread! Well done. Brilliant advice on counsellor question.

ChocLemonGelato
ChocLemonGelato
8 years ago

Brilliant!

Omheck
Omheck
8 years ago

So nice to know that I am not the only who cries WHILE they run. Heartbreaking!

walkingthruhell
walkingthruhell
8 years ago
Reply to  Omheck

Omheck and KFMM, you are awesome for being able to run AND cry! I have too much difficulty breathing and have to stop my GPS while I wait to collect myself… lol. Just a couple of weeks ago while running it was too hot, my bruised toenails hurt, I was crying… found shade by a fence and just bawled not far from the road! Gathered myself together and made it home only to feel stronger and better able to face what life has thrown at me. So newbies, if you are a runner just keep running! Looking forward to downloading “Gives You Hell” per MsChump’s suggestion and running to it.

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago

walkingthrhell, MsChump, and all Chumps who run or want to start running – my anthem for my first half marathon in April this year was “given” to me by a sweet friend who knew what the x-douchbag had done to me and my children. I made sure to que it up as I was about .5 miles from the finish. Hellz yeah!!

Florence + The Machine

Dog Days Are Over

Run fast for your mother
Run fast for your father
Run for your children
For your sisters and brothers
Leave all your love and your longing behind
You can’t carry it with you if you want to survive

The dog days are over
The dog days are done
Can you hear the horses?
Cause here they come

LOVE IT!! Get it, Chumps! (((love & hugs)))

walkingthruhell
walkingthruhell
8 years ago

Wonderful lyrics! Thx for taking the time to write them out. Listening to song right now… love & hugs back to you, KFMM, and to all the fellow Chumps who find solace in this blog.

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago
Reply to  Omheck

It’s a perfect physical, mental, spiritual and chemical therapy! Keep it up, Omheck! (((hugs!)))

Nomorebs
Nomorebs
8 years ago

Excellent advice. I wish I had known about CL when I started finding out about my ex. I would have done a lot differently. A LOT! I would have had very different rules of ingagement with this disordered f###.

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago
Reply to  Nomorebs

You’re so right, Nomorebs. I think we ALL would have done many things differently. I know I wouldn’t have wasted 8 mos. being patient, waiting for the x-douchebag to “wake up from the affair fog,” and other shit that doesn’t work. My list is what I know now, almost 2 years post DDay, and 8 mos post divorce. I just hope some of these new AshMad Chumps take our advice, lawyer-up, and move forward a tiny bit each day toward a new, cheater-free life.

(((hugs!)))

Karan
Karan
8 years ago

So love ALL of this……ESPECIALLY ” the cheater is responsible….END. OF. STORY!!!!!!! don’t even go to “there are two sides to every story”….!!!!!!

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago

“They are NOT your friend. Process this shit later; protect yourself and your children from his/her chaos NOW. ”

So true KibbleFree, awesome list and advice, thank you!

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago
Reply to  Chumptitude

OHMIGOSH, you guys – I completely forgot one of the most important steps: ZERO CONTACT after you file. Once you file, have him/her work with you through your lawyer. Of course, if he/she is still in the house, this becomes even more difficult, but you have to try. Unless it’s about kids or things he/she needs to pay for FOR the kids, ZERO contact. It’s the only way you can stop the confusion, gaslighting, continual lying, etc.

MsChump
MsChump
8 years ago

Yes yes yes. And I found playing ‘gives you hell” by the all American rejects kept me sane through the lies and bs. Buy it for 99 cents on iTunes…..along with chumps book – you’re golden. Do not waste money (like I did) on anything else. Trust they suck – now. Get out. Now. I wish I’d got out ASAP and gone no contact…..instead of waiting around for him to make good on his promises. Why oh fucking why? Because He was a narcissist who manipulated my chump ness. The only way is to walk
Away and don’t look back. It hurts like a motherfucker and you’ll feel confused and second guess yourself everyday. But I wasted 12 months……please please don’t. put your earbuds in, listen to that song, read chumps archives, book and new posts every day. Say a prayer, hug your kids, call a friend. Post here. You are are no ones plan b (and there’s even a CL article about not being one!). And everyone here is with you. The pain is finite and birthing pains to your new life xxx

valkyriemad123
valkyriemad123
8 years ago

KibbleFree_MightyME

Brilliant ROAD MAP! (I’m going to make copies for others I see twisting in agony) it is clear and urgent that people hear this truth over what we are generally advised….. Bless you

KibbleFree_MightyMe
KibbleFree_MightyMe
8 years ago
Reply to  valkyriemad123

Aww – so sweet, valkyriemad123. Thx – but sadly, I know we ALL have a list just as extensive. =(
(((hugs!)))

not Juliet
not Juliet
8 years ago

Great post, Kibble Free! Especially the part about not listening to the Own Your Part/ Two Sides to the story shit. Total crap!!

koshkamat
koshkamat
8 years ago
Reply to  not Juliet

AMEN! RE exercise….I was doubled over in bed all day/night…that part WILL take time. Just the THOUGHT of food made me gag…..

Marked711
Marked711
8 years ago
Reply to  koshkamat

Exactly. I lost 50 lbs in two months. Very unhealthy. 1+yr later I’m finally back to normal. It is hell feeling sick all the time.

Sara_esq@yahoo.com
Sara_esq@yahoo.com
8 years ago
Reply to  Marked711

Agreed with all comments. However, post-nuptual agreements are unenforceable in many states. They are not enforceable in my state (I looked into it based on CL’s and CN’s advice).

That being said, it might be worthwhile to demand that your asshole sign one. And get it notarized. If he/she refuses, that tells you something.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Isn’t that the true!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

Thanks for your first comment, J–filled with wisdom.

I completely agree; cheaters don’t reform. Gather your dignity, march thee to a lawyer’s office or court house to file (then lawyer up). Do not pass GO, do not collect $200 (until after your settlement, or withdraw some money from the bank account before Soon-to-be-X finds out you’ve had enough).

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I was going to type the monopoly slang but it comes better from you. I just love you to bits!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Love you, too, Beth! And you have been mighty on CL!!

LittleLady
LittleLady
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

My advice to the newly chumped:
“It is not your fault!” How long I struggled to see my role in the mess. Poor me. I liberate all new chumps from the monkeys, the circus, the graffiti and the skein.

Elizabeth Lee
Elizabeth Lee
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

HE cheated with your UNCLE?!?!? OMG. That’s messed up.

CocoVoe
CocoVoe
8 years ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

I am still stuck on cheating with your Uncle?? Seriously?

PucksMuse
PucksMuse
8 years ago
Reply to  ExNihil0

Wait. Whut?

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  PucksMuse

Hi J and welcome to the site. Sending you hugs and we are here to support you no matter what. Sadly nothing shocks me anymore when it comes to these disordered assholes. Just remember you are mighty!!!!!

DQ
DQ
8 years ago

The only down side of the great AM reveal. The most important thing to know is you are not alone in this, don’t be ashamed to reach out for help, and its not your fault. It was a choice that the cheater made, a bad one, but a choice. You will find out who your real friends are and learn a huge amount about yourself, the only upside. Big hugs to all of you who are just beginning this sad journey.

Hesatthecurb
Hesatthecurb
8 years ago
Reply to  DQ

I am curious if anyone else saw the IDIOT Director of Couples and Family Therapy at Drexel Univ, Argie (sp?) Allen on the Today show? I am sure Today’s intent was supply newly minted AM fallout chumps some valuable insight as to what to do next. Poor Tamryn Hall looked as though she was drowning when the “expert” espoused such gems as ‘you need to decide what are the dos and don’ts of cheating’. WTF?

Hey, does anyone know what the does and don’t of cheating are? My guess is—- DON’T CHEAT AT ALL!!!

I imagine you can find this valueless interview on Today’s website.

kitkat
kitkat
8 years ago
Reply to  Hesatthecurb

I saw it too and I was thinking the same thing – horrifying! And they also had the founder of SI in the piece. I was thinking “no – wrong site to send new chumps to!”

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Hesatthecurb

Tracy is back Monday; I think we need to alert news organizations about interviewing her after the next round of hacked information comes out (I can’t WAIT to see cheater’s user names [BigDaddy12 anyone?] and the boxes they checked off about what they like and their sexual preferences [necrophila, sheep, being spanked, long walks in the woods with sheep….]).

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Tempest, I’m pretty sure I read that you can have sex with sheep here (we have lots and some will literally wander into my yard in the spring and fall) and it’s only a misdemeanor. Yet, for some reason, Asshat chose to commit a felony ;O

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

At least Flwhorence could give Informed Consent; the sheep, not so much.

ringinonmyownbell
ringinonmyownbell
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Dr Demento moved to eNVy… which has a large tradition of herding sheep and whose unofficial state motto is. Nevada: Where men are men and sheep are nervous. 🙂

KenderJ
KenderJ
8 years ago

Hey!!!

Sunny
Sunny
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I can’t take the credit for this; one of my housemates made the crack after Josh Duggar’s Trashley Madison/OKCupid/FB profiles got revealed that he couldn’t wait ’til they found his FetLife account. Something to give CN a Friday giggle. 🙂

Hesatthecurb
Hesatthecurb
8 years ago
Reply to  Sunny

RE: Josh’s AM profile–

The type of woman he sought—-confident, professional, who dislikes routine and has a secret love nest…..sounds like the antithesis of Anna, doesn’t it?

Speaking of fetishes, the info from an interview with the woman who wore a wire to get the goods on Jared—-OMG. Asking to have sex with her horse, for one. Would she set a up camera so he could watch her two young daughters/which one would she prefer to ‘sacrifice’ for his prurient interests for another…and there’s more.

I feel so sorry for her having to endure almost 4 yrs of communicating with him in order for the FBI to make their case.

not Juliet
not Juliet
8 years ago
Reply to  Hesatthecurb

I remember one time on a show called To Catch A Predator ( which set up guys thinking they were meeting underage girls), the guy kept asking the girl if her CAT would be there. I still laugh thinking about it. Guess he thought he would get a little pussy. Bad pun intended.

ChumpFromF
ChumpFromF
8 years ago

What I would do differently:
after D-Day#1, demand temporary separation, while still keeping contact via text messages and email. He was going to rent his own place anyway, so talking him into not separating while he would be away all week was stupid. I got the worst of the two situations: loneliness all week, and no chance to renew my world on weekends.
I did not know the extent of the cheating then. It was presented to me as a one-time mistake during a vacation abroad, so I did not see it as the long-time betrayal that it was.
Staying together prevented me from asking cool-headed questions in writing, while I kept discovering the pieces of the ugly puzzle. It kept my anxiety level very high, I felt humiliated and unable to act. As for him, it gave him the impression that he had the power to do whatever he wanted, instead of experimenting the consequences. That’s how I finally got his suggestion of a vacation with ‘platonic’ OW#2, the thing I can’t get out of my head because it was so weird and demonstrated so much entitlement.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpFromF

Good point, ChumpfromF. Anything a spouse knows about his/her husband’s/wife’s affair is tip of the iceberg. If the cheater says it was just an emotional affair, it was a physical affair. If cheater says it lasted 3 weeks, it lasted 5 months. If cheater says it just happened, they actually planned many events together. If they claim just one affair partner, there have been 5-10.

StrongerEveryday
StrongerEveryday
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

“Anything a spouse knows about his/her husband’s/wife’s affair is tip of the iceberg.”

Yes to the thousandth degree! This is something I couldn’t wrap my mind around in the initial months; just the little I knew was bad enough! But it was way worse.

Cheaters lie. That’s their baseline. You can never, never, never take anything at face value from a cheater. Never.

Chump Change
Chump Change
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I truly believe that once the marriage vows are broken, that sacred line crossed, there is no going back to monogamy for the disordered. These cheaters, once discovered, just hide it better. My stbxh never looked at another woman around me or flirted at all that I noticed. I’m 8 years younger, and looked up to him as a 19 year old girl, while he showed me the ways of world. Looking back, red flags revealing a complete lack of integrity were waving! I forgave him a “one night stand” in the early years of our marriage and we had months of counciling. I truly thought we had put that baby to rest. We have lived a beautiful life and raised 2 smart, accomplished sons. It’s often hard to remember its not about us, its about them. I am reclaiming myself, my life and my value after he nearly destroyed me. I am a smart, strong, talented, creative, successful – people still say beautiful – woman. The man I am trying to untangle from is extremely smart, very sparkly, former Rocket Scientist, all about passive agressive covert narcissism, pathological lying, and getting away with whatever he can under the cover of a happy family man. Ugh! I did not know the monster I was partnered with for 4 generations. The serious mounting debt, poor credit, major legal problems, living way beyond our means while I wasn’t working as he’s playing Big Shot, pretending he’s got money (while spending over $200k on our line of credit)… It’s a complete and horrific mind fuck. But. He. Will. Not. Take. Me. Down. I am focusing on building my business and my new life. Next week will mark our 37th year of marriage, only because we are not through the divorce process yet. We had been in an 8 month wreakonciliation after a separation because of his constant lying and a much denied d-day. In hindsight, after connecting a lot of dots and further discovery, I realize he has been a serial cheater all along. January 2014 I found out about 55 year old widow Schmoopie. He of course lied and said it had been going on “only a couple of weeks”, but from old texts I could see exactly when I started having trouble reaching him, “his phone battery was dead, he was working late, out to dinner with clients,” or other lame excuses. It had been going on with her well over a year. I did not do the pick me dance. Fast forward and he is now living with (off of) Schmoopie, and I’m very sure he is lying to her as it could be no other way. The reality is that he is so deeply in debt he will never recover, in ongoing partnership lawsuits, owes IRS back taxes, student loans, drives an old broken down truck with a missing tailgate, and she thinks he’s her Golden Ticket! I have it on good authority that he’s already cheating on her too. Sadly I wasted my life with this scary, sad, disordered man, and he leaves a pathetic legacy for his sons. Cut your losses CHUMPS, and trust that they SUCK!!! We are mighty!

CalamityJane
CalamityJane
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Great list, Tempest, I just want to add:

If the cheater says, “I didn’t inhale”…uh, he did.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

And if the cheater says they just created an account on Ashley Madison as a joke, or “to look,” wait for the credit card transactions to be released as that will show that the cheater was active on the site.

If you need proof to move ahead with divorce, hire a Private Investigator pronto, before cheater can hide or destroy evidence.

LiningUpDucks
LiningUpDucks
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Anyone on AM was looking to hook up.

Some are spinning it as if there’s no way any man would have actually been able to hook up (given the large # of men and small # of actual women). Don’t buy that B.S.! http://finance.yahoo.com/news/hackers-leave-message-ashley-madison-founder-second-data-191100177–sector.html#

Sad in Seattle
Sad in Seattle
8 years ago
Reply to  LiningUpDucks

Just to weigh in about Ashley Madison … I’m a former journalist who in 2005 went online to do a story about it for the newspaper I was working for. So yup – my email is in there too! Although I certainly have a good reason for it!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Sad in Seattle

I agree–don’t attack our own. Sad in Seattle is a card-carrying member of CN, with a horrible tale of betrayal (just like the rest of us). She has been posting here for a long time, and did not deserve to have her character nor motives called into question. She can hardly post a link to the published article without giving up her identity.

SiS–hugs to you, friend!

AussieChump2
AussieChump2
8 years ago
Reply to  Sad in Seattle

Sad in Seattle. Ashley Madison revelations provide you with great opportunities for backup stories.

WhereisMia
WhereisMia
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

SIS does NOT have to justify herself to you IOH … I’ve read your comments before and am amazed with your unfounded aggression towards fellow chumps.

Whatever her reason for being on Trashley I for one am thankful she shared. I went on Trashley as field research as planned activity with both my psychologist and psychiatrists blessings after I explained my need to understand what’s in the head of a fucktard and let me tell you all these Johns melted into ONE!!!! No lack of Johns by the way they were a dime a dozen. I took detailed notes and covert pics as they led me to the coffee table or as we left the cafe as I followed. JUST TO NEVER FORGET WHATS REALLY REALLY OUT THERE !!!

None but one I chose to inform knew I was spying on them … At this point I’d had enough…. I could not hold back after I unleashed hell upon him after a coffee in public about his “reasons” for cheating and his microscopically detailed roadmap as to how to successfully conduct an affair right under your spouses nose!!! Lucky it was coffee and only spoons and not knives in the vicinity!!! I learnt much in that dark dark time and have never looked at humanity the same ever since 🙁
SO STOP WITH THE JUGMENT PLEASE

GreenGirl
GreenGirl
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

insistonhonesty:

Maybe she does. If you are her spouse and you find her email there, ask her to show you why. But as a stranger on the internet, she has no obligation to turn over private emails to you,

FMT
FMT
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

Wow, WTF! Where is all that vitriol coming from?

How about insisting on compassion for fellow chumps? Too often your version of honesty looks a lot like a license to attack, with little or no information to go on. What’s up with that? I agree with SiS–these kinds of comments need to be moderated. It’s hard enough having to be here in the first place without having to defend our life experiences. Jeebus! Who appointed you the Grand Poobah?

Sad in Seattle
Sad in Seattle
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

insistonhonesty, why on earth are you speaking to me in this manner? I am a long time chump and loyal member of CN who just left an 11-year relationship to a serial cheater. I post here almost daily. I have no reason to lie about this and am horrified that you feel at liberty to call me names when I was simply making an observation and sharing a funny anecdote. The story in fact was published, I’ll thank you very much.

CL – please moderate comments such as these. It’s very disheartening at this incredibly difficult time in my life to be attacked on a forum I used to feel was a safe place.

GreenGirl
GreenGirl
8 years ago
Reply to  Sad in Seattle

Sadly I’ve been attacked by chumps too. The part that really hurt was the mocking and the accusation that I thought of myself as “enlightened.” It was painful to be attacked in a place I thought was safe. Stay strong.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  GreenGirl

GreenGirl–you ARE enlightened! Own it, girl–it’s a good thing. We look down on “medieval” thinking for a reason. Sorry you were attacked in the past here. Hugs to you!

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

Surely, you have emails where it wasn’t published because it was rejected by the editor? Or a text from him/her? Or original, time-stamped drafts? Or DISCUSSED it with your Significant Other/Family/Friends? Or can appeal to your previous work-superior, in such dire circumstances, and they’ll confirm that you were writing a story only and not actually being a selfish prick?

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

“I was going to write The Great American Novel from a modern perspective!” Uh huh.

Where is that story, dipshit?

Sad in Seattle
Sad in Seattle
8 years ago
Reply to  AussieChump2

Ironic, I know, considering I’m a long-time chump and member of CN! But it’s 100% true

ChumpFromF
ChumpFromF
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpFromF

And then of course, once the extent of the cheating is revealed (NOT a one-time mistake in the heat of the moment while vacationing abroad), decide that the separation is final.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago

1. I would gather all the facts about his cheating and not let him know that I know he is cheating and keep that information in a very safe place.

2. I would also get Chump Lady’s book.

3. Then look into an exit plan to get myself out of the place we shared and get a plan sorted so I can move out without him knowing (he would go out of town a lot for work-that would be great timing). With this also see if I can move pretty far away from him with finding a new job and a new place to live. I would not tell a single soul that I am doing it also (hence my family is still “friends” with and told him some mental things I was doing during the divorce).

4. At the same time with 1 to 3 find a kick ass attorney to insure what my rights were then.

5. Change my numbers and go full no contact.

6. Close the bank accounts.

7. Get myself into some serious therapy.

8. No looking back he and his attorney would stay in contact with my attorney. There is no need for me to every see, speak, or think about him every action. Yes of course deal with the emotional side of the break up.

All of this might take some time but having a good plan is the key.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Order ChumpLady’s book TODAY; it cannot be sold after the 24th (per her contract with the publisher of her upcoming book).

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

You mean pre-order? Will it be available on Kindle?

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Boudica Reborn

Her first book won’t be available anymore after the 24th; the next book is out in October (not sure if you can pre-order it).

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I understand. I got the first book when I was still married to
Mr. Deviant.
Eagerly awaiting the new book!

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Boudica Reborn

Is her new book going to be downable also?

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

*think about him every again. damn autocorrect.

9. Listen to my gut about him. I had so many red flags about him and I didn’t listen to them.

sending hugs to all the chumps.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

10. Get a STD check and HIV/AIDS. Get that information to the attorney also. Also a general health check up to make sure everything is ok.

11. Believe in what I am doing and start living the life that I am living today. The first few months are not fun but it is worth it.

12. Get myself educated about Cluster B personality disorders and even speak to the attorney about this and if the ex could be viewed by true specialist in this matter to help me with any type of legal or harassment issues from the ex and his family/friends.

phoebenix
phoebenix
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Yeah! Looking back it would have been great to blind-side him. Newly divorced I obsess about how he screwed me over and still came out on top. I know deep down that he never has and never will be happy with himself and that I am the one who took control and divorced him but… It would have been nice to have a little something where I felt like he got a big surprise. Jerk.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  phoebenix

From my experience phoebenix that is such a normal feeling. I think us normal people want these disorder things to feel something but sadly they don’t. They just don’t care. They don’t have souls. No empathy, no compassion, nothing really!

I trust they all suck!!!!!

Maree
Maree
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Beth, when my daughter was about 2 years old and I was pregnant with our son, my sister was observing my now ex husband. We went into the kitchen to prepare some food and she looked at me and said “he doesn’t care Maree”. I remember that comment as clear as a bell. You see he had just been sacked from his bank job for stealing and the 1st thing he went and bought was a record player!! I never missed any of the signs, I just chose to ignore them and I have, together with our 2 adult children paid a very price. He now lives with a girl young enough to be their kid sister and they accept this as if it is normal. I am very disappointed in my kids even though I love them dearly and would give my life for them.

Susannah
Susannah
8 years ago
Reply to  Maree

Maree, your kids will come around when he rejects them. It took a little bit, but my dad eventually treated me the way he treated my mother – pompous-assed letter and all. I am sorry for the pain my mother went through, but now we have a great and beautiful relationship. My dad, not so much. I am kind of waiting for him to unfriend me on FaceBook, at this point – he will as soon as I post something he “just can’t tolerate.”

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago
Reply to  Maree

It’s hard, Maree. I don’t understand how one of my sons seems to think the cheating was no big deal, except that he bought his dad’s explanation. Not sure he’ll ever understand. At least my other kid gets it. They still love their dad, though.

So strange to have brought children into the world, raised them, sacrificed for them, and then get tossed out on your ear. I look back at other family relationships and see that some of them improve over time, or something happens that changes them. There’s always hope that things will improve and they’ll come to understand you better. Just do what you can to make yourself happy, because they’re more likely to come around if you are.

One of my grandmother’s was a fairly bitter woman. I didn’t much like being around her. After she died I learned more about what she’d gone through during the depression. She was abandoned with 6 hungry children to support, her husband was having an affair with her best friend. I actually drew strength from her life story to get through my own experience. Everything comes full circle eventually.

Tessie
Tessie
8 years ago
Reply to  Maree

Hugs, Marie Honey. I’m keeping you in my prayers. We are so vulnerable to our kids. I hope someday they can see what a gem you really are.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Maree

So sorry to read about your horrendous story Maree, what you have to go through is so devastating! I don’t know if that can bring some solace, but know that I am most grateful for your posts.

I often tell myself everyday that if Maree can go through all this and forge on, so can I!

(((Maree)))

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Maree

Sending you some hugs Maree. There is no words to describe how sorry I am that your children accepted what your ex has done. I know it is hard to deal with and sadly we cannot control what other people do or think. I am dealing with that same that of treatment with my family and friends. They all are in daily contact with the ex. They all knew and saw what happen with all of the D-days. The best thing I can tell you is go NO Contact.

If you like you can adopt me? I am potty trained. I know how to cook and clean after myself also and I can tie my shoes. Plus I have morals and character and I know what the difference of right and wrong is. Sometimes I do need a good walk in the park. Think about it and let me know. I’ll be more than happy to be your adoptive daughter.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Great list Beth!

To me the most important is DO NOT believe a word s/he says from this point on. Repeat to yourself as often as you need to “You abused my trust, I no longer believe your words, I will only believe your actions.”

Your cheater is likely to want to stop you from doing anything. S/he benefits from the status quo, it keeps you under their control. First, read CL’s post on the 3 stations in a cheater’s mind (https://www.chumplady.com/2014/09/the-mindfuck-channel-only-has-three-stations/)

If your cheater asks why you are taking any action, tries to minimize your pain or the extend of his action (e.g. well, yeah I betrayed you, but I’m not as bad as Hitler), look him/her straight in the eye and say “you abused my trust. If you hope I will ever trust you again, this is what needs to happen.”

Then show with your actions that you are mighty and will do what needs to be done. Remember that people with NPD traits will ramp up their abuse in the hope you will cave.
If your cheater becomes threatening in any way, stay safe and go into stealth mode. I did all of the following without my cheater was at work or otherwise occupied:

* Download all the statements you can from all bank accounts, CC, and any financial accounts you share with your cheater. Save them on a double verification cloud service (e.g. icloud, azure, dropbox) or on two thumb drives and place them into a safe place (I opened a safe box at my local bank). You probably are too upset to look at this stuff now, but having them will help you during the discovery process.

* Get your and your kids’ passports, your social security cards, as well as your marriage certificate, and your kids birth certificates. Get all this to your safe place.

* Open a new bank account under your name only, and wire 1/2 of all your liquid assets (1/2 of your savings and checking accounts) onto that new account.

* Get all your tax returns and financial paperwork and get them to a safe place, I used an abandoned corner of the archive room at my workplace.

* Get all proof of his/her affair (e.g. texts, screenshots, secret emails, multiple skype accounts, multiple FB accounts, all CC under his name via a credit check), and get them to your safe place.

* If you have enough money, interview lawyers and secure a great lawyer. I don’t recommend mediation or alternative divorce solutions if your cheater does not show any inclination to behave in a way that shows real remorse (see CL’s post on what would look like – https://www.chumplady.com/2013/02/if-youre-really-sorry-cheaters-let-me-help-you/

And most importantly, understand:
* The theory of cake – https://www.chumplady.com/2012/04/the-unified-theory-of-cake/
* The importance of your kibble strategy (https://www.chumplady.com/2012/04/ego-kibbles/)

If you have that kind of fortitude, adapt your kibble and cake strategy to appease the cheater and get him/her distracted or compliant with things that are to your advantage as you divorce him/her.

This is going to suck balls, and when you need a pick me up, read CL & CN’s post on being Mighty in the INSPIRE ME section at the bottom of CL’s front page.

Believe in your own inner strength, you can do this, and we are here to cheer you on!

Miss Sunshine
Miss Sunshine
8 years ago
Reply to  Chumptitude

See if you can get your hands on a copy of their pay stub, if they get one. Ex was siphoning money into a direct-deposit savings account I didn’t know about–and it showed up on his pay stub.

(He’s sooooooooooo dumb….)

During the divorce, he wanted to split the little bitty index fund I’d been contributing to from my paycheck, but didn’t mention his secret savings account. In the end, I used knowledge of his account as leverage to keep “our” little account for myself.

SueB
SueB
8 years ago
Reply to  Miss Sunshine

And take your own paycheck stubs so that your stbx can not look at them.

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Beth, this is perfect! A step-by-step instruction guide that can help a person still in shock from the profound betrayal just revealed.

I heartily agree with educating oneself with the dynamics and mindset of Cluster B’s. The sense of malignant entitlement, chronic, if not pathological lying, and duality of cheaters – keeps pointing to those terribly destructive disorders. Yes, I know I’m stating the obvious.

You hit it out of the ballpark Beth. Super hugs!

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Boudica Reborn

Hugs right back to you Boudica Reborn and onthehill. I am in the kick ass type of mood today. Sadly I just got news of another chump in my life. Trying to give them the support they need. Oh yes, I gave them this site!

ohthehill
ohthehill
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

All of that ^^^^^^^

Justine
Justine
8 years ago

Two bits of advice from me:
1. Ignore everyone who tells you that there must have been problems in your marriage anyway, to try to understand why the cheater did what they did, that it’s worth trying again etc. Utter bullshit.
2. Keep telling yourself that “in two years time none of this will matter” (for those bad, bad days when you feel the world has ended.). You’ll get there is the end, just like so many of us have.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  Justine

I’d say closer to 3 years but it’s different for everyone. Just know that the day will come when you’ll look back and think ‘I was married to that asshole?’, shake your head, and get on with your day with a chuckle.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Thanks Nord and Doop, knowing that this marathon can take 3 years is both a punch to the stomach and a good reminder that this is a marathon, although I would like it to be a sprint or at most a 5,000m Steeple chase. But no.

There are no shortcuts, no ‘he will be nice on this one’, just a whole lot of tenacity to get through the whole 26 miles and 385 yards!

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  Chumptitude

He’ll most likely be a huge dick. My ex was one of those ‘nicest guys ever’ but once I took the gloves off, pushed through the divorce and no longer listened to his bullshit, instead calling him out every time he lied he went full rage mode and remains fairly ragey to this day.

Chumptitude
Chumptitude
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Thank you Nord, he indeed went from ‘nice guy’ to gigantic asshole as soon as the mask came off. As far as dicks go, well I am sure he wishes he was huge, I stopped spackling that side of him a while ago ?

Doop
Doop
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Took me three years – a long, arduous journey, but I’m here to tell the new chumps that life gets so much better on the other side.

Kelli
Kelli
8 years ago

My advice:

1. People do not set up affair dating profiles if they do not plan to use them.

2. This is probably NOT the first time.

3. NOR will it be the last.

4. Promises from cheaters are what Mary Poppins calls pie crust promises–easily made, easily broken.

5. Know (and accept) the Ugly Truth. Ashley Madison profiles aren’t for meeting new people to read bible verses with or vaccinate children. Ashley Madison profiles are marketing tools to attract someone to have sex. That’s it.

6. Make an informed decision. Now you know. What to do?

7. Divorcing a cheater is a marathon. Not a sprint. Not even a half marathon. If you’re divorcing a disordered narcissist, it’s less marathon and more wrestling tigers at the Colosseum, Gladiator-style. Be prepared.

8. Divorce is like a poker game. Never show your hand. If you know about the Ashley Madison profile, but haven’t said anything, good! Get a PI and act business as usual. (Yes it will be the performance of your life) Gather evidence and take it to your attorney. Then, like one of those SWAT attacks on TV, stage a multi-level attack: serve divorce papers, move out/move them out, file restraining orders, move assets (with lawyer approval), etc.

9. Find a shrink. Again, marathon, not sprint. Or possibly tiger wrestling, which is not nearly as fun as it sounds. Therapy is good. You’ll need it.

10. Do something every single day that makes you happy. Drink wine. Eat a cupcake. Take a walk. Buy yourself a treat. Whatever! Just do something special for yourself every day. Say yes to yourself for a while. You’ve earned it.

This is a hard road, but the pain truly is finite. It does end. And you come out on the other side wondering what in the hell you ever saw in that loser and why the hell did you stay so long.

Big hugs. We are all here for you.

RockStarWife
RockStarWife
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

If I had a chance to go back to D-Day #1, I would have spent my time differently. I spent a lot of time asking cheater why he cheated and collecting information about his cheating from him and the affair partner I learned about on D-Day #1. Result: I confirmed that both of them were really screwed up ‘people,’ I should have used the time to prepare for divorce by trial (as STBX insists on repeatedly dragging me into court for a divorce he requested), To me, divorce by trial (preceded by a dozen hearings) feels like marathon-length gladiatorial combat with tigers, OWs, players in the legal system, etc. in the Coliseum. I hope to come out alive, having lost only a couple of limbs and hope that my kids will come out only moderately injured with wounds that will mostly heal.

FMT
FMT
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Great post, Kelli. Love this one in particular: “People do not set up affair dating profiles if they do not plan to use them.”

I bet lots of us got the line about how it was ‘just for fun.’ But as a very wise friend of mine said, “You don’t go and sit in the barber shop unless you’re planning to get a haircut.”

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Wonderful insight Kelli!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Kelli: Fabulous. The pocket-size guide to divorcing a cheater. Excellent advice.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Kelli

Great post Kelli. You are so very mighty. Big hugs right back to you!

Marci
Marci
8 years ago

I totally agree with the above three posters. Cheating, or even attempting to, is a major sign of character flaw that is not worth teaming up with.

This person who married you is now your adversary.

Cut your losses and leave, but plan quietly and don’t let on you are aware. You will gain more by filing once you have lined up your plans, calmed down, and put on a good measure of hate for your opponent. Remember, by cheating, they have already started hating you. The reasons why will not matter after all is said and done.

And your life afterward will be immeasurably more free.

Lucky
Lucky
8 years ago

I think the hardest and most important thing to do is accept that this is who they are. I projected a lot of my ideals onto a man who ultimately was not what I needed him to be.

I thought he was a strong, moral family man. He was not and I had a hard time wrapping my brain around this.

Once you see who the real person is – remind yourself daily – this person thinks so little of me that they would solicit sex from strangers outside of our marriage.

Taking out the garbage or suddenly helping with dinner ( he’s such a nice guy ! ) does not cancel out infedelity.
The profile on AM is just the tip of the iceberg . Once you start to open your eyes you will see things that just don’t add up in your marriage ( unexplained debts, weird work hours, justafriends and more ).

Follow people’s advice here and act right away. It doesn ‘t go away on it’s own. It gets more ugly once you know the truth!

I just finished my clown juggling, tiger wrestling, midget tossing event at the coliseum and it was a narky 3 year process. Should have done it 10 years earlier but the kids were little, The Leafs were losing and I hadn’t finished all the varieties of shit sandwiches on the bouffet yet.

Chump Change
Chump Change
8 years ago
Reply to  Lucky

Lucky – my feelings exactly. I projected my values onto him. It is so hurtful to realize your closest confident, best friend, lover and partner has become your worst enemy. With a big head start on messing with you. I hope this Ashley Madison mess will bring the true devistation of cheating to the forefront of society. Great post!

KarenE
KarenE
8 years ago
Reply to  Lucky

Brilliant, Lucky! My situation too, as for so many hear.

But really, if you were waiting for the Leafs to start winning ……… 😉

Lynne
Lynne
8 years ago
Reply to  KarenE

Well put Lucky. That is so true – I just could NOT wrap my brain around the fact that the man I married was not who he pretended to be – 31 years of it. Accepting it only happened a few years AFTER we were divorced. My brain shut that out and I suffered longer than I ought to have.
Agree KarenE – waiting for the Leafs to start winning………..hehe

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  Lynne

Just shift your focus to the Jays for the time being 🙂

newchumpatl
newchumpatl
8 years ago
Reply to  Lucky

I thought he was a strong, moral family man. He was not and I had a hard time wrapping my brain around this.

Me too. I think this is the story of so many chumps. And it’s why in the early days it’s so disorienting. This person you thought was your very best friend just freaked out on you.. but the truth is, it’s who he was all along and like others have said, the cheating you know about is probably not his first rodeo. Also keep in mind cheaters don’t only cheat sexually, they also cheat financially. As someone said.. unexplained debts, weird behavior, gambling… all of this is part of the personality type that tends to do these things. They don’t change folks.

It took me a LONG time and I still struggle with it when he seems like the guy I married but he isn’t. He isn’t who I thought he was at all. And he will not change.

Heather
Heather
8 years ago
Reply to  Lucky

This is brilliant. I needed to open my eyes to the fact that the man I married had become my adversary. I wish I had left him 25 years earlier than I did!

Live and learn… The hard way.
C H U M P

kathyld
kathyld
8 years ago

This is good information. My life changed recently when my husband rebuffed me for the second time when I approached him for sex. Things had inexplicitly cooled in the bedroom for the past six months and I was concerned and frustrated. I though he may have been buying sex and I even tested it on him one night by texting him when he was out of town. He has his phone glued to his hip and never ignores messages but he ignored two that night. He admitted to being with a prostitue that night. Turns out he had gonorrhea and so did I. That was six weeks ago. He was on every hook up site you can imagine with lots of porn sites. He travels, so there were websites with prostitues in those places on his computer as well, although he denies hooking up there. Yea right. I haven’t figured out how to crack his profiles yet. He had told me very little. He says that this has been going on for more than a year (not likely true, he flirted with buying sex ten years ago, I found his electronic correspondence), that the sex was protected but blow jobs were not hence the STI, and about the STI. Said it started because he thought I did not want sex. However he only wanted perfunctory sex twice a week and drank himself into an unable to perform situation the other five nights. About six months ago he really turned away, and he hasn’t said why, denies that things changed. I think he got off on the power, the deceit, the thrill of illicit sex, the different pussy, that he feels entitled and priviledged. He seems very contrite, tells me he loves me, and he is being extremely solicitous etc, has booked an appointment with a therapist yadda yadda, but I wake up everyday in a state of heightened anxiety, my body thrumming. I find it hard to concentrate at work, sleep is disrupted and I have no information or understanding. Our kids are out of high school, I can support myself financially and I don’t actually need him, but I need to know what he has been doing and for how long. I feel extremely humiliated and in the dark … He on the other hand is playing up his emotional and mental fragility, looking for places for us to travel so he can take time off work and get his shit together and we can pretend to be a couple. Nothing can change if we don’t look at what happened and why. Should I give him an ultimatum or go straight to a lawyer?

RockStarWife
RockStarWife
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Kathyld,

STRAIGHT TO A LAWYER.

On D-Day #1, I learned that my now STBX had been having an affair with a co-worker. On D-Day #2, I learned that my STBX had been having sex with prostitutes and had lied about having sex with men. At that point, I knew my marriage was truly over. I recall numbly telling STBX, privately outside a venue for a major family event with our kids sleeping nearby, that indeed we were going to continue working toward divorce and the next day we would resume the legal process.

Whether your excuse of a husband got the STD from sexual intercourse or a blow job (almost any form of sex can transmit most types of STDs), your cheater’s repeated offenses against you, his wife, and well as his treatment of prostitutes as objects, shows that he disrespects women and possibly men, if he uses them for sex, too, as mine did. Hope that you can get away from this jerk soon and come over to the light side, where you get to spend time with and energy on kind people who will honor you.

Regarding the feeling of humiliation, my STBX has repeatedly tried to humiliate me in court, especially during his cross-examination of me, for my failure to earn more money, raise the kids ‘better,’ finish certain life-long endeavors, etc. (These cheaters will hit you where it hurts.) I constantly remind myself that he is making himself, not me, look bad. If a stranger ambushed you in the middle of the night, stealing your car and your purse, I am guessing that you would not feel humiliated. No reason to feel humiliated in this situation, either.

Lyn
Lyn
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Kathld, his mental fragility is no longer a concern of yours. YOU are the one you have to concentrate on now. You have to save yourself. When he hooked up with prostitutes, he broke the contract. He fired you from the job of caring about him and his wellbeing. Don’t fall for the “woe is me, this is so hard” crap they pull. This is MUCH HARDER ON YOU. Put yourself first and let him deal with his own issues. You’ve got enough on your plate.

Chump Change
Chump Change
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

RUN don’t walk to the top several divorce attorneys in your area and take advantage of their usually free consultations to discuss your case and learn everything you can. Pick the one you feel the most comfortable with. Then when cheater hubby needs council you will have narrowed the field, because he wont be able to hire the ones you condulted with. I saw 5 or 6….

He will not change, he can’t change. Cut your losses!!!!!

donna
donna
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Kathy

You have ALL the evidence you need. There’s no fixing this CREEP you are married to. Get the hell away from him and never look back. His behavior speaks volumes. Get tested again in the future to rule out HIV. Don’t cover for him. For better or worse excludes unprotected sex. And prostitutes use or insist on protection. I wouldn’t be surprised if he had a drug problem. Get away today. Divorce.

Doop
Doop
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Kathyld – please take extra special care of yourself at this time. In addition to what everyone else recommends, I encourage you to think about checking out Al-Anon, or an online forum such as SoberRecovery.com friends & family forum, or downloading the Language of Letting Go app. With my ex, I lived through the five nights a week of drinking himself into oblivion, the references to his emotional and mental fragility (and the whores. Oh, those too.) That behavior is called crazy-making for a reason. Recovery from life with an alcoholic and recovering from life with a cheater requires remarkably similar skill sets.

NewlymintedChump
NewlymintedChump
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

One more time, I will repeat: GO STRAIGHT TO A LAWYER AND THEN IMMEDIATELY TO A DOCTOR. You can dig all you want after you separate yourself from this POS. From experience, we fellow chumps know, whatever evidence you find-they will lie about it. Always. You will never know the whole truth. That’s why you just have to trust that he sucks.

violet
violet
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Accept that you will never know the full extent of his betrayal. The “need to know” will only prolong the pain. At first, I was obsessed with wanting to know all the gory details and for what? If offered the opportunity to learn the full extent of X’s betrayal now, I would have absolutely no interest. The only thing you need to know now is the name of the best divorce attorney in town.

kb
kb
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

What Beth said.

KathID, your cheater is blameshifting. He’s blaming the blow-job–and the fact that he gave you an STD!–on you. He says that YOU were the one withholding sex. From your post above, it looks as if you’d have liked more bedroom activities more often and with more enthusiasm.

Okay, so he’s lying about that. What else is he lying about? He’s lied about the length of time he’s been seeking strange pussy. You have the electronic correspondence to prove this.

Remember, when someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE THEM!

You’re not going to get long-term change with an ultimatum. You will achieve long-term peace with a divorce.

See a lawyer, find out your rights, secure your finances, and file as soon as possible.

{{Hugs}}

Lulu
Lulu
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Get a lawyer and file for divorce immediately.

The only thing that’s going to change a man whose been whoring around for a decade behind his wife’s back is REINCARNATION.

He put your health and your finances in jeopardy. I don’t know if you’re planning to have children or have children already, but gonorrhea (as with other STDs) can cause infertility for women and birth defects for an unborn child. He care more about getting his dick wet than whether LIVE OR DIE.

There’s no coming back from this.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  Lulu

Hahahaha…REINCARNATION. I nearly spit my wine out (but didn’t because that would be alcohol abuse).

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Also, you’re going to be in pain no matter what so better you have the finite pain of splitting with him, rather than the prolonged and will probably kill you pain of staying with someone who you will most definitely catch cheating again and again and again. How could you even have sex with him again without fear of infection?

I’m being harsh because my therapist did this to me and it helped me snap out of my ‘what if’ phase. It was very necessary for someone to knock me upside the head.

Crimson Comet
Crimson Comet
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Agree: There’s pain either way, but please realize that if you stay, for the rest of your life, you’re facing “triggers,” those incideous daily reminders of the betrayal, in the form of songs, roads, landmarks, stores and restaurants, names, anniversaries, foods, etc. So many reminders so frequently, that it might be tempting to get drunk and generally stay that way to avoid thinking about it all the time.

When you forgive, you’ll be cautioned that you can’t bring it up anymore, cause that’s abusive. So you’ll swallow it all down, sweep your heartbreak and disillusionment under the rug, drink yourself into oblivion, while the cheater, spared your pain, goes back to the old tricks.

Face the fact that it hurts either way, cut your losses, follow the advice offered here by everyone to get out, and lose the cheater. You’ll actually be able to move on from the nightmare, and put it behind you. Healing can begin, and you’ll “gain a life,” as CL says.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Go straight to a lawyer. And don’t bother trying to crack his profiles. Who cares at this point? I know you do but really, IT DOES NOT MATTER. The man infected you with an STD, boned hookers, and blamed you when he said he ‘thought you didn’t want sex’. Yeah, sure he thought that.

Divorce him, get on with your life, get through the pain that will be a part of your life for a bit and know that you’ll one day look back and know you made the right decision.

HE GAVE YOU AN STD. It could have been AIDS, for fuck’s sake. Shed the loser. Value yourself. And hugs.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Hell YES!!!!!!

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Yes, a therapeutic two by four – strategically and vigorously applied.

Couldn’t we just go Van Helsing on these proto-primates? Alas, I fear the standard-issue monster weapons won’t work on cheaters. I wish we could develop a wearable iconic deterrent that would repel cheaters in our future. Just wave it in front of them as a Litmus test: “Get thee back, unclean creature!” Then watch if they hiss,
recoil, and slither away.

How cool would that be?!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Nord–I am loving your badass self today! Excellent and pithy advice. Sometimes a 2 x 4 comes in handy.

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

I would suggest a 2 x 4 with a nail in it.

Shechump
Shechump
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

Rusty nail!

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

KathID–HIGHLY unlikely he got gonorrhea from a blow job. He is putting your physical, emotional, and financial health at risk. Get ALL financial documents you can copied and put in a safe place (including a credit report), stop having sex with him, and get thee to a lawyer.

The “poor me” act is just that–an act. Let’s face it, feeling sorry for someone is the best way to get those of us with empathy to do what the person wants. Anyone paying for hookers is NOT, repeat NOT, going to reform. Ever.

That constant state of anxiety is telling you something–your primitive brain knows you are in danger. Pay attention to it. I’m so sorry you’re here, but we’ll support you each step of the way.

Nord
Nord
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

And really, who cares if it was from a blow job? Is that somehow ‘better’ than fucking someone? Dump this loser and get on with life.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Nord

Sending you an AMEN today Nord!

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Go to a lawyer. Don’t have any more sexual contact with this guy and I will refer you to what I wrote above. Get the hell out. Life is way to short for that mess you are dealing with. You got a serious STD from him. He does NOT care about anyone including himself. Do not let him know what you are doing. Get a plan sorted to divorce and leave.

Trust that he is disorder suck turd!!!!!!

Leave a cheater and gain a wonderful STD free life!!!!!!!

We are here for you no matter what.

newchumpatl
newchumpatl
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Go straight to a lawyer and walk into the light. I am so sorry this has happened to you but they don’t change. Believe all the people on this site. You cannot fix these people. Big Hugs.

KB22
KB22
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Straight to a lawyer. These disordered people cannot change and even if you think they can be “managed” think again. You’ve wasted enough time with this creep.

Marci
Marci
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Kathld,
“He is playing up his emotional and mental fragility”

I’ve heard that crock before. What about YOUR emotional and mental health, oh, and the STI as well?
If he was fragile, he’d be seeking comfort in the arms of his caring wife, not bangin’ strangers and wasting his money on them.

He has disregarded your health and welfare in a most horrible way. The only thing he’s fragile about is the financial cost that may come from divorce.

If you are financially self-sufficient, then it’s a no brainer. I see an upgrade in your future.

Rebecca
Rebecca
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Do a free credit report on him and yourself immediately. He may have cards in your name.
Get to the best lawyer you can find and let the lawyer demand all bank records and credit card statements going back 5 years or more. Demand everything sent to your spouse’s work address as well.
Sadly, that will “tell” you more than your spouse will.
Open a new bank account for yourself and take out half of what is joint.
You will need it for a lawyer. You may have to give some back before the divorce is final but let the lawyer worry about that.
When I removed a large chunk of money (with my hands trembling) I immediately sent an email to my spouse saying what was removed and that I needed it for a legal retainer. My honesty and keeping that email made it OK in court.
You will never understand what happened or have enough proof to feel like you know what happened.
Repeat that 100 times a day,
There is a saying here that you have to “trust that they suck”.
The pain is horrific but it is more important to get the black and white paper trail than it is try and figure out what happened.

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  Rebecca

Somewhere in the last six months, I forgot about my credit reports but the AM slapped me out of my daze. I checked all mine and they are clear. Is it legal to check your spouse’s reports without their knowledge?

Shechump
Shechump
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

ChumpyElf – yes, technically. But easy to do without their knowledge. You know enough about the details of him (favorite car, etc) that they may ask as part of their questions to identify you. I tried 3 different free sites and got in on the 3rd. Good luck – just keep it to yourself 😉

Shechump
Shechump
8 years ago
Reply to  Shechump

Assuming you are talking about Credit Reports?

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  Shechump

Yes, I am just talking about credit reports. Hmmm. I don’t really need to know. He already has a card that I never see or use. Doesn’t really matter as i have access to all bank account statements and do essentially all the financial stuff. There has been nothing weird. Maybe for a day when I’m really pissed off with nothing else to do….

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

Well, no, i would not but he has no other income source from which he could fund a secret account. I handle all the bonus/reiumbursement cheques that are not direct deposit and he doesn’t get stuff like commission which I have read is how some cheaters get additional funds. I admit I am suspicious about everything but O have several months to investigate this further if I need to. Can they really hide this stuff from lawyers? Oh and I do the taxes too. Oh dear, now i am all paranoid. Add it to the list of things to check up on this week!

Miss Sunshine
Miss Sunshine
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

How do you know you have access to all accounts? Would you know about a secret account?

ChumpFromF
ChumpFromF
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

Sleeping with a prostitute would be a deal breaker for me. Even once. It’s way too creepy.

Digbert
Digbert
8 years ago
Reply to  kathyld

What Beth said …………

Lucky
Lucky
8 years ago

He is NOT going to change. He wNts you to go back to being a submissive little chump so that he can do what he wants to do without consequences.

He is throwing you a bone in hopes of making things go back to how they were.

You cannot unknow what you already know. You cannot make him be a good person and he has shown you that he really really sucks as a husband.

The day he stuck his dick in somebody else ( whatever hole ) was the day your marriage ended.

Now you need to move forward and get yourself to a lawyer’s office.

Marci
Marci
8 years ago

If I were an Ashley Madison chump (the newly-informed spouse), here is what I’d right away to save myself time and more agony than the divorce itself will bring.

Cheaters generally are charming actors who can muddle your brain with their behaviours, deceptions, and arrogance.

In the end, it does not matter one bit what any issues might be in your relationship. What matters is that you exit this nightmare with your sanity intact, and often that means having as little discussion as possible with Cheater…just accept that s/he no longer qualifies as your chosen partner.

1. Accept that a cheating spouse will NOT change their ways. They will only lead you on a long journey of hurt and wear down your self esteem.
2. Ask yourself: If I were no longer in this marriage, how would I like to lead my life?
3. If the answer is, I don’t know because I never thought about it, then start giving that thought lots of time in your head.
4. Do not discuss your thoughts with anyone at first because they will just mush your brain with distractions.
5. If you need emotional support, speak with a professional stranger – but not one who tries to convince you to reconcile. That is just a money-making business.
6. Consult a divorce attorney to know your rights and have a list of questions prepared in advance to save time and money.
7. Important: YOUR financial future utterly depends on your determination and vigilance NOW. Make copies of all assets, bank statements, pension accounts, tax returns, 401k, RRSP, tax shelters, mortgage records, yours and his both not just the joint accounts. Take photos of statements if you want to save time. Catalog house contents with your camera…things disappear. Keep the records in a safe place.
8. You will feel incredibly tired. Sleep, rest, have massages, pamper yourself when possible, but don’t drink or eat excessively. You need your wits about you.
9. Meltdowns are normal, just have them when you are alone, and be gentle. No point in fighting with Cheater, they’ve already “left the building”
10. Declutter your life. You may have to move homes.
10. Once you have a plan in place for your next place of residence, or a move, or fighting to stay in the marital home, then go about executing the plan you have made.
11. Have patience, it takes time.
12. The sooner you can get away from daily contact with Cheater, the better. No conversations beyond absolutely necessary business.
13. Each situation is unique. Keep Chump Nation in mind for asking questions. We give objective answers and will be here to support you.

ElectricTulip
ElectricTulip
8 years ago

IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT. Do not accept any of the blame. The classiest chump I’ve heard of caused her ex-bf to spend two years in therapy working out his shit because she refused to speak to him at all. Zip. Nada. Gone. Admittedly they didn’t share property or children. He was so shocked at not having anyone to justify his behaviour to he walked smack bang into himself on the way out; it was not a pretty sight.

Did I say it’s not your fault? You did not cause it, your marriage didn’t cause it, the fact that your soufflés sink did not cause it. Lying and deceit are character flaws. You are not a ‘moral crusader’ for pointing that out.

I read that a great many cheaters are making pre-emptive visits to lawyers, newly minted chumps should try to get to the good ones in their area first. Make appointments for initial advice asap, whatever else you intend to do. Do it now.

And if you’ve found your partner is genuinely on AM (they’re all being told to deny, deny, deny, so assume that he’ll (she’ll) deny everything) just remember that AM is a site specifically set up for married people to meet other married people, whatever experience your spouse actually had on there. The whole business is uber nasty. Do you really want to spend the rest of your life with someone who thinks it’s cool?

Marci
Marci
8 years ago

Quote: “Top data security expert [Krebs] predicts people will take their lives over the AM leaks”.

Hopefully this would never include the chumps out there. What Cheater is worth sacrificing one’s life for???

Do us all a favour, cheaters, and take a long walk off a short dock.

OtherChump
OtherChump
8 years ago
Reply to  Marci

I think he means the cheaters will take their own lives. I’m having a hard time dredging up any sympathy for them. I know it’s awful. But when I think about society…just think of all the people a narcissist/sociopath who will never be hurt or fucked over if said N/S killed him/herself. I know. I’m awful. But it’s kinda how I feel.

uneffingbelievable
uneffingbelievable
8 years ago
Reply to  OtherChump

I think that BP and Bank of America and Nokia, et al. should fire every arrogant asshole who used their work email addresses for AM. Those companies should give the cheated-on spouse the remainder of their cheaters salary for the year so they can lawyer up. I had to laugh when I saw the looong list from B of A. One of the whores my cheater fucked around with worked there. This is a sick, sick world.

Nicole S
Nicole S
8 years ago
Reply to  OtherChump

I just think you’re very honest and a lot of us feel the same way but are afraid to say so- but, being chumps, we also will feel guilty about feeling such a thing.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Nicole S

The only reason to feel guilty is if you actually push a cheater off a cliff (not just because you thought about it). Though if it should happen by accident as you turn to take a picture of the scenery……

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

A little gallows humor–I’m having a delayed reaction to the news my X had an Ashley Madison account + just moved into an expensive spiffy new house overlooking the water. On a cliff.

Boudica Reborn
Boudica Reborn
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Tempest, I’m so sorry he’s used AM as (one of) his personal booty-call warehouses. And, though he’s moved into a new home on a cliff, it is a haunted house now, because evil lives in it. Hugs and love to you.

Mehphista
Mehphista
8 years ago
Reply to  Boudica Reborn

I am thinking erosive thoughts……

hugs, T!

CalamityJane
CalamityJane
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

He has too, Tempest. He has NOTHING ELSE to offer anyone.

Loyalty – Nope
Love – Nope
Trustworthiness – Nope
Courage – Nope
Kindness – Nope
Courtesy – Nope
Tenderness – Nope
Faithfulness – Nope
Caring Father – Nope

Oh, but he has a home on a cliff.

Loser.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  CalamityJane

Thanks, CalamityJ, DoneNow, and Boudica–it pays to keep these truths in mind. I know better than to expect the Karma Bus, or justice, but does Hannibal have to keep seeing MORE success?

These cheaters, though, are like glittery Easter eggs–hollow on the inside, with nothing to recommend them except the superficial dazzle of external trappings. And like sparkly eggs, they are prone to fading and always at risk of cracking.

DoneNow
DoneNow
8 years ago
Reply to  CalamityJane

What she said ^^^^

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  OtherChump

Eh. Narcissists don’t take their own lives… they’re too valuable and they’d have to actually feel shame about their actions.

They might fake it and start over though, elsewhere.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago

The ex threw the bit of wanting to kill himself and he was so depressed and on and on. I didn’t buy it and no one else should.

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago

They do sometimes like to pretend they would go through with it. Fucking drama queens!

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

Indeed. My second boyfriend ever “attempted suicide” and was brought to the hospital… because I’d broken up with him after 1.5 years of bullshit and he found out I was at dinner with a guy. My 20 year-old self was too immature to understand that it does NOT require the consent of both parties to break up, finitely. I was so upset that I let him emotionally leech for another 4 months before I stopped the madness.

In the midst of D-day madness, when Cheater wasn’t taking responsibility as I told him all the horrible things I’d found out, he said “Well, I guess I should just KILL myself, if I’m such a terrible person, huh?”

My reply? “Don’t threaten me with a good time!” He was so pissed. lol – I can’t think of anything that stops any hope of a Pick-Me dance faster.

freefall
freefall
8 years ago

Insistonhonesty! Wow you are mighty!! LOL I was not the five drama times he threatened suicide. Seriously – one time he disappeared fir two days. I called the cops and about had a heart attack. Ummm now that i have put the peices all together he had gone away to spend the weekend with some whore. LOL maybe he chickened out because, her thong wouldnt work to hang himself??

insistonhonesty
insistonhonesty
8 years ago
Reply to  freefall

In full honesty, I DID chase it (thinking he actually might, with all of us home, and traumatize our children… suicide/passive harm like knowing you have cancer and not saying so runs in his family) with a swift turnaround and haughtily saying that HE *WOULD* TRAUMATIZE HIS FAMILY BY KILLING HIMSELF AT HOME.

But I really didn’t care if he did.

He always was truly not thinking about consequences… just what he wanted in the moment. To hell with everyone else… I mean, “there are others to consider?” Oh right. ::duh::

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  freefall

“LOL maybe he chickened out because, her thong wouldnt work to hang himself??”

ROTFLMAO 😀

RockStarWife
RockStarWife
8 years ago
Reply to  ChumpyElf

My STBX narc told me that he thought about killing himself and that he then looked in the mirror and said to himself, ‘Who could kill someone with such a beautiful face?’ Doesn’t this line just sum up narcissism?

ChumpyElf
ChumpyElf
8 years ago
Reply to  RockStarWife

Wow. I am sure that Asshat doesn’t look in the mirror and think that, at least 😀

I told him if he acted up again, this includes the weird self-flagellation, that I would have him committed which would be extra embarrassing considering he works for the hospital. Funny, he doesn’t seem so suicidal anymore.

not Juliet
not Juliet
8 years ago
Reply to  RockStarWife

God, what an asshole.

Let go
Let go
8 years ago

First, I am not a Chump but the sister of one. He was blindsided. He thought his marriage was fine. So, I am not going to repeat what others have told you. Consider your spouse as a thief. Imagine that you discovered he/she had stolen the ring your mother left you, or the watch that was left to you by your grandfather. Imagine that he/she took food for your children and gave it away. Imagine that he/she stole from your wallet, your bank account. Imagine if he/she stole your car and wrecked it. That is the same brain that signed on AM. He/she has plotted, lied, connived, gaslighted and stolen from you. Do you really want this person poisoning your life anymore?

OtherChump
OtherChump
8 years ago
Reply to  Let go

Well put, Let Go. Sorry to hear about your brother.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  OtherChump

Hugs to your brother. Hugs to you for being a great supportive sister. Great post also.

Let go
Let go
8 years ago
Reply to  Beth

Thanks

Kimberly
Kimberly
8 years ago

Following

Copper
Copper
8 years ago

Walk away and never look back.

Qwerty3.14
Qwerty3.14
8 years ago

This is all great advice. My XH seemed to hit AM and others every 6-9 months. (Yep, I stayed too long to see this pattern,). One thing that sticks out is he told me “he decided” to have an affair after I said something that made him feel dumb. When caught again, he said he wanted his CAKE and to eat it too. I should have believed him when he showed me who he was the first time. Atleasy I split finances after DDay1!

I think one of the best pieces of advice is to direct the newly chumped here. I found CN near the end of my marriage. It helped to see I wasn’t alone, that cheaters were all using the playbook, that we can overcome this and be mighty!

Uniquelyme
Uniquelyme
8 years ago

I’m one of the queen of chumps who stayed with the cheater ex for over 20 years, spanning three affairs (yep, different women) that I know of. Here’s how it will go:

1) They will be so terribly sorry and they have no idea why they did it. They will throw some “hints” that you had a role in their cheating. To the chump: this has NOTHING, I repeat, NOTHING, to do with you. The cheater had tons of options, starting with filing for divorce. Instead, the cheater followed his dick (limp at that) and you and your children were simply acceptable collateral damage. Stated differently, he doesn’t respect you nor value you. Why stay with this piece of garbage? No dumpster diving.
2) You will feel horrible. I cannot even begin to describe the pain you will go through. But it is finite. Never forget that even if your mind is telling you the pain is unbearable, it isn’t. You will get through this.
3) Contact a lawyer ASAP. Protect your assets while you ponder what to do. Remember, the person you marry is not the same person you divorce. Drill this into your head because it is the truth. Don’t wait to find out.
3) Get help – a good therapist for yourself, support from friends and family. Do not bother with marriage counseling. Use that money to buy something nice for yourself instead. Marriage counseling is a complete wast of time with cheaters.
4) Direct your energy to yourself. Focus on being kind, loving and compassionate to yourself. Rediscover the person who you really are, not the one that the cheater is attempting to paint you. His opinion of you is none of your business. NONE.
5) He will promise to change. Yeah, right. Cheater ex went to individual therapy and promised me the world – after all the affairs. Words are terribly cheap, that’s for sure. Do you really want to be around for the next affair? In my case, the affairs were spaced 10 to 13 years apart. I.wasted.my.life.on.an.asshole. The best news is that I have been cheater-free for two years, the best two years of my adult life.
6) File for divorce because when you think you are reconciling, you actually are not. Another day of reckoning will come. Yes, alas, your spouse/partner will cheat again. Cheating is a choice, a character flaw. Ask yourself what circumstance will ever bring you to a point where you will cheat. I bet the answer is a resounding NONE because you have character.
7) If you look really hard, there are actually more affairs. But why bother? One is plenty.

And lastly, read as many articles on this website. You will save your life. I am not kidding. Chump Nation is here for you. You will be okay. You will get to a point where you can look back and say, “Whew. I’m glad I had a second chance in life.” And when you think of the cheater, you will winch and say, “Gross.”

Sunny
Sunny
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

Might be the best post EVER. You’re awesome. And this is SO dead on.

Tempest
Tempest
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

Uniquelyme–Thank you for sharing your story. Reading you and several other posters who reconciled once only to have another D-day 5, 10, 20 years out is what motivated me not to attempt reconciliation during the inertia period after D-day. I know it must feel repetitive to post your story multiple times, but know that what you do is a public service and it has an effect; your tale has saved many of us years of misery.

Uniquelyme
Uniquelyme
8 years ago
Reply to  Tempest

Thank you, Tempest and all. CL has been such a blessing in my healing journey that I have to give back so other chumps don’t even entertain reconciliation. Reconciliation assumes BOTH parties want to make it work. Unfortunately, the cheater only pretends to want to make it work, and the chump sparkles away.

Uniquelyme
Uniquelyme
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

*spackles. I guess sparkles works, too. 🙂

Heather
Heather
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

I was the Queen of chumps! Married 33 years. Two husbands called me at least ten years apart to report his affairs with their wives. Who knows what else took place? I was stupid. I loved him. I had children. I believed he would change and love me back. Until one day my eyes began to open and I began the most difficult teeter totter ride of my life! But, I got out and now am happily married to my best friend. Now I know what love is. And I also know what narcissism, lying, hypocrisy, black mailing, gas lighting, and all the other things which go hand in hand with the ultimate betrayal. I never dreamed he was such a shit!

So many of us write the same story. Only the names have been changed.

Goodbye drego
Goodbye drego
8 years ago
Reply to  Heather

Oh heather please tell me that you have ended up happy,as you sound it.amd that your hideous ex is now miserable and broken??

Heather
Heather
8 years ago
Reply to  Goodbye drego

He is living in the same town in a new house, has a girlfriend, still goes to the same church. I have removed myself and relocated. My grown children are supportive of my decisions and love my new husband very much. My youngest is a bit distant but I have finally learned that it is who she is. My new husband is a wonderful man. I’ve been in counselling and had to establish a new life in a new country, making bit impossible at this time to see my loved ones without incurring financial hardship. 🙁
I left behind a life that i thought we would share in our twilight years. But it wasn’t real. That said, I would NEVER wish to live the lie again.
As for the Ex…. His kids were hurt by the realisation that their father was not who they thought he was; he knows that there is a chasm between them. I’m sure he told people that he’s only responding to them by how they want it to be. He’s a coward. He’s a PA who is only concerned about his image. And being a narcissist he doesn’t know what it is to be loved and to love. So, he would not know what misery and brokenness is. He is a shell.
Because I loved him I do not wish him harm, but I do believe that in the end there will be justice.

Beth
Beth
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

Uniquelyme,

Great great post! This is the same stuff to the letter what I had to deal with the ex. Same amount of affairs and the same amount of being with the ex. Sadly after years out of the marriage I found more affairs. Truly disorder individuals. Thank you again for your great post.

Another thing I would add is to not believe that he/she has ended the affair. He just knows how to lie about it even more.

ceres
ceres
8 years ago
Reply to  Uniquelyme

thank you, needed this today.

Marked711
Marked711
8 years ago

Number One, and most important, if you have any thoughts of ending the pain for good because it’s so unbeatable, PICK UP A PHONE AND TELL SOMEONE! Anyone! Your life will eventually return and you will go on. And it will get better again.

newchumpatl
newchumpatl
8 years ago
Reply to  Marked711

EXCELLENT Advice Marked thanks for saying that!!

Shechump
Shechump
8 years ago
Reply to  newchumpatl

Marked – both apply – Unbeatable and Unbearable.

Marked711
Marked711
8 years ago
Reply to  Marked711

Unbearable, not unbeatable….. darn auto correct.

WhatJustHappend
WhatJustHappend
8 years ago

Watch what they DO and NOT WHAT THEY SAY. The cheater will scramble and say ANYTHING to cover his or her OWN ass!! Know that he or she WILLINGLY went on a website specifically to engage in an affair. TRUST your gut!! It’s usually right! 🙂

Heather
Heather
8 years ago

I would say get out as soon as you hire the best attorney you can find. Don’t listen to ANYONE who would suggest you forgive and win your husband and marriage back. It will NEVER work long term. Once trust is broken you will ALWAYS be uncertain. Look out for you and your children. In hindsight, it’s much better to leave right away.

Someone needs to share Chump Lady with Anna Duggar….

Uniquelyme
Uniquelyme
8 years ago
Reply to  Heather

Heather, so very true. Trust is like