Cheating Wife Has Incurable Cancer

cheating wife cancer

His wife was cheating, but they delayed the divorce and now she’s dying of cancer. He doesn’t know how he feels.

***

Dear Chump Lady,

I have an interesting story for you, but I don’t know that there is a 100% right answer.

My wife had a brief affair in 2015.

The physical part only lasted a few months, but she was certain enough of her feelings that she was willing to give up her marriage and two teenage sons in order to chase her heart.

As soon as there was a threat of a real future, her affair partner changed his number and ghosted. He’s also married and our local group (of which we all were a part… I even coached his son in baseball) was changed forever. He and his wife were rarely seen in public and everyone broke into their own pods.

We did counseling, both professional and in church, and although I was committed to trying to make it work, she could not re-engage and I couldn’t see her in the same way either.

I stayed until our youngest was graduating high school then relocated 1500 miles away.

My boys never really saw us as truly apart, we never divorced for no real reasons other than insurance and that neither of us were in another relationship. It was a discussion had many times…almost lazy about it. Both boys have actually relocated to where I’m at and it was probably the first awakening she had in 8+ years as to the damage done and what she gave up. She wanted reconciliation and a plan that would end up co-located again in a couple years after she unwound from the business where she was an early partner and needed to get to value. Ok. Maybe.

On July 4, she was admitted to the ER and referred for a CT scan where they told her she most likely had stomach cancer.

Fast forward 3-weeks and it’s confirmed to have spread outside the stomach. She’s Stage-4 and not curable… undergoing chemo and an upcoming clinical trial at Mayo but prospects are still not good to see Christmas 2025.

We shut down everything — her business, her condo — packed everything into storage units and prepared to try and battle the cancer. She’s very needy…I don’t say this in a bad way. Obviously, she has needs given the situation, but the desire for touch (not sexual) is non-stop. I can understand and accommodate. Most times, it’s both sad and comfortable. That we never divorced and she stayed on my insurance is a financial blessing (over $200k in costs in 2.5 months), but all of our lives will be dictated by her care and there will be another 100k out of pocket for me in the next year, at a minimum. I’m dealing with the financial fallout of her world now that she has no income and most days is confined to a bed dealing with the treatments.

There is ZERO point, in my mind in talking about the past.

If she wants to bring it up, that is her decision, and I honestly don’t know what I would say or how I would react. I can’t help the thoughts of, “Was it worth it?” and “Look what you gave up and now don’t have the chance to get anything back”. I know these are very self-serving things to have running through my mind.

Do I love her? Of course. She was my wife… is my wife. She’s the mother of my children for whom I know she would do anything. But it’s not the same. I’m not able to entertain the same feelings and a true desperation about the situation. i will again be impacted by this for years to come. Emotionally, my concerns are for my sons. I was very careful never to make her look like she was 100% responsible for what happened to our family. They are now young men, and smart enough to make their own assessments and responses.

But this is their mom, and there will come a point in time, she won’t be there.

I’m not sure if I’m doing the right thing. It feels I’m doing the honorable thing and I’ve never considered going about this any other way. I will be there for her trial and barring something happening to me, I will be there when she passes. Maybe that is what will be closure for me and allow me to move on. I’m honestly not sure.

Mick

****

Dear Mick,

I’m very sorry for your situation and this complicated grief. Other chumps in this community have also been caregivers for dying spouses who cheated.

You didn’t ask my advice. For what it’s worth, I think you’re navigating this honorably and decently. And perhaps that’s all you want, is validation that you’re a good person. It’s normal to wonder what you owe a partner you’re separated from. Who broke the marital contract, as it were. A lot of people would say you don’t owe her anything, but you didn’t divorce, so that puts you in a very awkward and complicated situation.

This is what I think is difficult about caregiving your wife, who was once cheating on you, but who now has cancer:

You know she wouldn’t do the same for you.

Once you’ve seen the devaluing, you can’t unsee it. You know she was prepared to leave you and the kids for her affair partner. She got a vote on the value of her family then and she shat on it. Had it not been for the Other Man throwing her under the bus, she would’ve left. Instead she stayed. You’ll never not feel like you’re Plan B.

although I was committed to trying to make it work, she could not re-engage and I couldn’t see her in the same way either.

Funny how cancer has focused her mind. Now she needs you.

This story underscores what cheaters lose.

Not that cheaters read my blog (except for the few who stalk their exes here — waves, Hi!) but I think your story could be a cautionary tale. Imagine being vulnerable and no one gives a shit about you, because you treated them like shit.

I’m sure they don’t think of it in those terms. You’re there being a spouse appliance, providing insurance and caregiving, so if you’re transactional, that’s “winning.” But still, I honestly cannot think of anything worse. It’s hard enough feeling like a burden to someone — but a burden to someone you’ve harmed? To reach the end and know that you’ve failed your family this way? That the most feeling anyone who once cared for you could engender is pity?

She’s very needy…I don’t say this in a bad way. Obviously, she has needs given the situation, but the desire for touch (not sexual) is non-stop.

Total nightmare.

I imagine your grief feels inauthentic.

You don’t say who all knows about your wife’s cheating and her cancer. But I imagine not everyone in your circle knows about the infidelity, especially where you live now. So they’re naturally going to be sympathetic to your plight. They’ll project their feelings of loss and sadness on to you, and in a weird way that might feel unearned. Like you’re living a lie of the caring husband who is losing the love of his life.

You’re entitled to all the kindness expressed to you now. You ARE being heroic and caregiving. Your children are losing their mother. But you’re also entitled to every complicated weird feeling.

She’s the mother of my children for whom I know she would do anything. But it’s not the same. I’m not able to entertain the same feelings and a true desperation about the situation.

Why would you? You moved on when you moved 1500 miles away. You’ve been emotionally disconnecting since 2015. This has been a long goodbye.

I will be there when she passes. Maybe that is what will be closure for me and allow me to move on. I’m honestly not sure.

Closure is a myth. There’s just time and acceptance. Big (((hugs)) of support from me and Chump Nation. I’m sure others who’ve been there can offer some words of comfort now too. We’re here for you.

Subscribe
Notify of

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

79 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Stepbystep
Stepbystep
1 year ago

The legal implications of marriage – both beginning and ending – should not be taken lightly. Divorce brings a clarity of responsibility and the beginning of healing.

In rhe absence of that action, it is important to not take on caregiving without support. Hospice services are available to help navigate complicated situations.

JadedSysAdmin
JadedSysAdmin
1 year ago

Schadenfreude is one of my big vices, but I saw a relative go out from stomach cancer. It’s horrible. I can’t snicker at this.

You can troll her by watching Ikiru, though… It’s Kurosawa! Culture!

Orlando
Orlando
1 year ago
Reply to  JadedSysAdmin

My cheating uncle lived 17 years after being diagnosed with stomach cancer. He was on death’s door several times. Where was his live-in affair partner? In the wind after securing another guy. Thankfully my aunt had already moved far away & stayed away, including divorcing him.

LookingForwardsToTuesday
LookingForwardsToTuesday
1 year ago

I think that Mick is trying very hard to do the right thing here in what is an almost impossible situation … and a situation where he had every right to say “you made your bed, now lie in it.” The only person who will have the right to judge him for his choices is him.

I would simply advise him to remember the first principle of First Aid; do not become a casualty yourself. It will be all too easy for him to give so much of himself to supporting his wife and his sons as well, that he leaves nothing of himself for himself.

LFTT

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago

This is so true and this happened to my husband, who put so much into taking care of his demented father for 10 years that he became very sick himself right after his father died. He seems to be in remission now but I’ve seen this with others too, you really have to know when to say no or put limits on it or ASK FOR HELP. Or demand help. People have to be careful not to overestimate what they can do, you have to put your own seatbelt on first, or in the airplane, your own oxygen mask on first. Don’t become a casualty yourself is such an important lesson.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago

Mick, I’ so sorry for what you’re experiencing. I haven’t experienced the death of a spouse or partner yet, but all of the parents and other elderly for both of us are gone and some of that was very prolonged. My FIL struggled with dementia and other issues for 10 years. It’s so draining.

You are an incredibly good person for doing this. I’m not just patting you on the back, but you are, you’re an incredibly honorable man and your wife truly does not deserve you or this. And considering how many cheaters just abandon sick or dying spouses, it’s particularly remarkable. She truly never deserved a man like you. But one thing I’ve learned about doing things in life, at least for myself, is that you do them because YOU BELIEVE IT IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. Not because you owe someone or because they would be grateful or it’s what people expect or it’s what God expects or your religion, but because you believe that this has to be done and you are the person to do it and it’s the right thing to do in your own mind. We actually should do these things for ourselves, and not for other people because we believe it’s the right thing to do and we are the ones who have to do it. It’s an acceptance of responsibility that we neither owe to someone or that they have earned, but because it has to be done, and we step up to that plate. I think this is how you feel, in addition to the love you once felt for your estranged wife, and it’s the kind of strength that quietly builds families and nations.

Some people would say just walk away and leave her….and really you SHOULD have done that after her affair, maybe she would have developed another relationship in that time and you would not be the only one in this position. I think this site does try to get people to walk away and most of the time it is the right thing to do because…..you never feel the same way about them or the relationship again after the affair. We just don’t. But here you jolly well are and to me, you are doing the right thing and an amazing thing, and you’re the wonderful husband she does not deserve, but….there it is. To me, we should do things ultimately because we believe it’s the right thing to do, especially if there is no one else or not enough otherwise.

The one major caution I would give to you in this situation, because we experienced it directly, is to watch out for your own health and not drain yourself. Taking care of a sick/dying person can be an incredibly draining experience even physically and it is not uncommon for caregivers to become ill themselves at some point because they don’t look after themselves and they give too much. Be moderate in what you do, and take care of yourself too. Be very aware of this. Be willing to seek out and accept as much from others, including your children, as possible because one person just can’t do it all. Get as much help as you can in different ways, not just with her, but maybe taking care of your home, food, etc.

When she does eventually pass, you will know that you can be at peace with yourself and not have any doubts about what you should have done, and I hope the next season of your life will have joy and fun – never underestimate how important fun is – and whatever you want, just for you. You’re a hero to me.

SortofOverIt
SortofOverIt
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

“To me, we should do things ultimately because we believe it’s the right thing to do, especially if there is no one else or not enough otherwise.”

This is the core of it. I’d also add, if he didn’t help her, I wouldn’t judge him.

In some ways it’s not just about what is the right thing to do. That implies that there is always a definitive right or wrong way to handle any given scenario.

Judging by his words, I don’t know that this is just about what is right but what he thinks is right, or more accurately, what HE thinks he can live with. Good people will do things they don’t have to but do it because that is what they feel ok with.

I can’t even imagine if I was put in this position. My STBX would really have no one to help. And he is the father to my kids. I’d have to do it I think.

DrChump
DrChump
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

“it’s the kind of strength that quietly builds families and nations.”
So well said 👏👏👏👏👏👏

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Yes, just because you have decided to do this doesnt mean that you have to do it alone. Take advantage of every service and available hour of help that you can get and leave the house to clear your head.

I didnt know the extent of betrayal when my Cheater died and I gave him a hero’s funeral. In the end I was proud of myself for having been decent and respectful even more than he really deserved. I could only control me and I did a good job.

SortofOverIt
SortofOverIt
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I sometimes wonder what I would do if my FW died before we were legally divorced. Soon, the divorce will be final so this won’t be in question. And he is young and healthy, so barring a freak tragedy, it was never likely. But I have thought about it. I don’t know what I would do. I’d probably err on the side of making it comfortable for his family and our kids. But the idea of cremating him and mailing the remains to his AP is good fantasy fodder.

MamaMeh
MamaMeh
1 year ago

Big chump hugs. Of course you are honourable, (the way chumps roll), and of course you love her.Just not the same love you would’ve felt if your partnership had been properly reciprocal, and she’d honoured you as you deserved.

BUT. At risk of not being in the CN spirit … she fucked up, once. She colossally fucked up and she most likely knows it. Something in her makeup let her be distracted by the sparkly, and in a way, I feel sorry for her. She wrecked what was her true gold.

But one fuck-up does not an entire character make. There, I’ve said it.

Possibly what’s hard for you is that you wished you were in the story where all you felt was just absolute love and grief. That would be the story where she hadn’t fucked up, lied, betrayed, disrespected you. But in THIS story, your feelings are so mixed and messy … you feel sorry for her too. You love her, but can’t respect her. On top of which she caused so much damage and pain… to you and your sons. Silly, silly woman.

Closure is a made-up word. But, you’ll get out the other side, eventually. You are decent, and good, and honourable, and she is damn lucky to have you.

FYI_
FYI_
1 year ago
Reply to  MamaMeh

RE: “one fuck-up does not an entire character make.”

She cheated on him for months. That is not one fuck-up. She would not re-engage even after she got dumped by the AP, even in marriage counseling. The LW moved 1500 miles away, and she watched him go. This is not a person who wanted to keep her family.

Bluewren
Bluewren
1 year ago
Reply to  FYI_

Yes.
This wouldn’t be a thing if she hadn’t fallen ill.
There would be no consideration for her poor husband and she’d probably still be out there somewhere finding’ herself.
This poor man is of use all of a sudden- yet again.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  MamaMeh

Especially when newly widowed, it was like a knife to my heart whenever I heard another widow say “He loved me to the end”…hell, mine hardly loved me at the beginning and had total contempt for me at the end.

There is a big widow support network on FB and I asked them if they would start an outreach for those of us who had abusive marriages and they refused…apparently they only wanted to help widows who were “loved to the end” gah.

Like MomaMeh said there is decency in doing the right thing even when they didnt give us the same.

ChumpNoMore
ChumpNoMore
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I really think that being chumped and dumped is worse than being widowed. I am not in any way minimising the awfulness of seeing a loved one die or the extent of the grief that ensues. However, just because my exFW is still walking the earth doesn’t diminish the pain of losing him. I grieved that man. Add to this the pain of rejection and abandonment and the grief is suddenly layered with a whole world of pain that widows just don’t experience after the event. Throw in post separation abuse and the joy of co-parenting with a FW. Then there’s how Society reacts to the widow and to the chump. Put it this way, I didn’t get any fucking casseroles when I was sobbing uncontrollably, on my own, in our family home.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  ChumpNoMore

Its true that the chosen abandonment hurt me worse, but please dont say any of this to a new widow/er…they cannot understand, will think you are an assh*le for saying it and it wont accomplish anything.

ChumpNoMore
ChumpNoMore
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I wouldn’t dream of saying that to someone newly widowed. Or even to someone who has been widowed for a decade. I’m saying it here, to the chumped community. I am sorry if I upset you in any way.

DrChump
DrChump
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Uni,
You should start that.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I’ve concluded that the only way to navigate interactions with my ex-wife is to look deep inside and do what I understand to be right. Not what she wants me to do, not what she tells me to do, not what she did to me in the past, and not what I’d like to do to spite her. She has never and will never acknowledge any of the grace I’ve shown her, but I am not doing it for her sake but my own, and this allows me to sleep at night.

This is what we see in OP’s story: a man doing what he feels to be the right thing for his wife, not because of who she is but in spite of who she is.

SortofOverIt
SortofOverIt
1 year ago

“She has never and will never acknowledge any of the grace I’ve shown her, but I am not doing it for her sake but my own, and this allows me to sleep at night.”

THIS is perfect. I said something like it elsewhere but far too wordy and not as clear. You do what makes YOU feel ok. Maybe it’s more than they deserve, but ultimately you have to consider what makes you feel ok.

DrChump
DrChump
1 year ago

Well said.
FW has said to me, in email because I haven’t spoken to her since the day she moved out, “you are always mean to me and I am nothing but nice to you”
I thought nice when you were sleeping with other men while I was sick, nice that your bulemia caused our child to be born 3 lbs and go into respiratory failure, nice when you took him out on a date with you. Nice that you slandered me…….
By the time I get to the 5th thing I think Not even worth it to respond to her

Best Thing
Best Thing
1 year ago

Bravo IG! 

hush
hush
1 year ago

“That we never divorced and she stayed on my insurance is a financial blessing (over $200k in costs in 2.5 months), but all of our lives will be dictated by her care and there will be another 100k out of pocket for me in the next year, at a minimum.”

May this type of “financial blessing” never, ever, ever find me. Divorce: it’s expensive because it is worth it. Sorry you did not dodge a bullet, but hopefully others can learn from your mistake in staying with a cheater.

Leaving a cheater would have been no less “honorable.”

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago

I was thinking about her need for touch. Obviously this should never be in a sexual way, and it doesn’t sound like that’s the case, but touch is a primal need people have, perhaps THE primal need. It’s been shown that babies will not thrive and may even die without touch even if other needs like food are met. We need to feel connected to other humans on a physical level. It was probably easier to satisfy this when we lived in tribes, but now our tiny and often dispersed family groups are very stressed to provide this. Again, this is another aspect of caring for someone who is very sick and dying, it’s a form of being reassured and connected to life and a source of comfort. It must be very difficult for you to provide this and again, you have to get other people involved in this, especially your children. One suggestion I might make if you can afford it, maybe your insurance might cover it, could be massages for her. It might not be a specific loving touch she might crave, but it would be human touch and it might be therapeutic as well – and give you a break. Whatever gives you a break, I’m in favor of. I would encourage your sons (or other involved relatives) to spend what time with Mom that they can and to be physically affectionate or to allow her to be this way. Even if people don’t really feel it because of the circumstances, it is an action to take care of the sick, and a social responsibility people have to share.

new here old chump
new here old chump
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I wanted to say something about touch and all of the above advice is great. There is a book about motherhood that I have not read but read things by the author related to her subject matter because of the title “Touched Out”. This is a thing. Being a caregiver can drain you as many of the comments suggest and make you sick- this happened to me. Do not sacrifice your own well being for hers. Your children need you. Get help, and hire people to help you.. I know expensive. But your health is worth it if you can afford it. All of the chumplady’s responses are so great and I hope you find comfort in them.This “You’re entitled to all the kindness expressed to you now. You ARE being heroic and caregiving. Your children are losing their mother. But you’re also entitled to every complicated weird feeling.” Don’t judge yourself and your mixed feelings. Be kind to yourself. All of the advice about making time for yourself, having fun- love it.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

When she moves into Hospice care, you can even request volunteers who are touchy / feely and are willing to hold her hand, hug, put lotion on her hands feet and satisfy some of her yearning for human contact.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

That’s a great idea! We only had home care (not institutional) and we had assistants and volunteers but I don’t think that was an element we considered and I think it could really make a difference.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago

 “I imagine not everyone in your circle knows about the infidelity, especially where you live now. So they’re naturally going to be sympathetic to your plight. They’ll project their feelings of loss and sadness on to you, and in a weird way that might feel unearned. Like you’re living a lie of the caring husband who is losing the love of his life. 
You’re entitled to all the kindness expressed to you now. You ARE being heroic and caregiving. Your children are losing their mother. But you’re also entitled to every complicated weird feeling.”

Yes, this.

Im the widow of a deceased Cheater. I spoke of his cheating to my closest friends (And did verbally vomit in an ill-advised manner to people) but the worst of it wasn’t known until he was dead so I have had gallons of weirdness to adapt to.

Out in the normal world where I would simply say “I was widowed” or “my first husband died”, I often get a lot of compassion. Every once in a while, I admitted the marriage was hard and I found that people often made an immediate Uturn and seemed to soothe themselves that I wasn’t hurting because my bad spouse was dead – it all took care of itself and all is fine. I think that humans have a natural inclination to minimize disaster because it makes us uncomfortable to consider it. A dead cheater seems a good ending to the story for them.

Yet, for folks like us, there was tragedy in the betrayal and tragedy in the death and they dont cancel each other out (quite the opposite – I was betrayed, abandoned and widowed by the same person, yea me). Watching people do the math in their heads which leads them to give themselves permission to minimize your pain is a weird misery that I suggest you avoid.

I developed a habit of trying to say less (really hard for me as Im a huge extrovert) about details and simply accept their condolences graciously. They would give me a sincere “Im sorry for your pain” and I accepted it. In my head, I would reflect that they are saying it is a shame that my life sucked, It did suck, just not exactly how they assumed it sucked, but they dont need all the details.

I feel a little guilty when I get heaps of compassion in that my peers here who divorce dont get nearly as much kindness from folks. I temper the situation by not telling people stories about how awful it was for me …I dont milk the situation.

Back in the thick of the mess, I had a coworker who was also in a bad marriage. She saw my wreckonsilliation and thought it noble and opted not to leave her marriage. (You could all give me 8000 reasons why we were both misguided and you would be correct.) In sort order, though, her husband got cancer and died. She cared for him and she had her kids were able to face it together and for her, (with the given she had no control over his illness) I know she is glad it worked out. It would have been really traumatic for her kids to be the next of kin and care for him through his death. She has a great life now.

Im sorry that you are in this and you ARE doing the noble thing. I hope you have a long and happy life ahead of you after this sad chapter has ended. I also hope that any future partner you may have takes the time to understand the complexity of what you endured.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

Reading this it’s clear you are a kind, thoughtful, wise and compassionate person, Your cheating first husband was an idiot and didn’t appreciate what he had.

Once again, the conclusion is that infidelity isn’t about our flaws or faults (seems to me like you’re a pretty great person) but theirs.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago

Thank you, IG, you are also very kind

Fern
Fern
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I can’t help but wonder what if the trial works and she lives for many, many years but cannot return to a normal life where she supports herself? What are Mick’s obligations then? Obviously, cross that bridge if you ever get there but there are some many ways a story can progress….. {{Mick}}

Best Thing
Best Thing
1 year ago

Mick – You say you’re “honestly not sure.” And that’s okay. You may never be sure, but stay honest with yourself. In your situation feelings of ambivalence, confusion, anger, compassion, grief, maybe eventually relief and other feelings… all valid. Honesty will lead you to eventually making peace with this situation. Big hugs to you and your sons.

Emma C
Emma C
1 year ago

I’m old enough that I’ve seen this situation twice before. Couple who aren’t ‘couples’, live apart even, but who are still married when a fatal disease interrupts their lives all over again.

There were adult children in both situations I saw. If they never resolved their feelings from the original trauma of cheating, it can come to the fore once again.

Blue Wolf
Blue Wolf
1 year ago

“She’s the mother of my children for whom I know she would do anything.”

That’s gaslighting yourself… if she really would “do anything” for her kids she would have kept her panties on.

With that being said… we’re free to do what is best for ourselves. I stayed in an abusive relationship in a large part because he had a severe heart condition and who would take care of him? I wasn’t the type of person to callously turn their back on them. I even called a Christian music organization that had pastors available to talk with… I felt like such a shit that I would dare to walk away from a human in need. But he made his choices. The last time he was in the hospital and there I was faithfully sitting by his side. He (we) was watching a Jurassic Park movie where the male main character and the female were running away from the dinosaurs. The male went back to help the female when she fell. He screams “keep running”. I looked at him with confusion and went “what?”. This inhuman POS looked me dead in the eye and said “All I have to do is run faster than you” as if that explains everything and is perfectly logical. I quickly asked him “you wouldn’t go back for me or help me?” and he was emphatic that was a hard no… it was imperative for *him* and only him to survive and fuck everybody/anything else. I was floored. I actually believed that despite the tensions and difficulties he had some loyalty and humanity. Oh boy was I completely wrong. I had transferred *my* values onto him.. of which he clearly had none.

And that’s when I started planning my escape in earnest.

In another situation, the father of my kids was another FW I married. When I escaped from that he had been cheating with both males and females. It was a nightmare. Fast forward some 20 years later after no contact during that entire time and barely a dime in child support (he died owing over $75K). He reached out to me to facilitate communication with his children because he was dying of cancer.. had just weeks left. My kids were in college and adults by then. I relayed the information while letting them know I supported whatever *they* decided to do… that was my only job as their mother. For me, it didn’t mean me being by his side to ease his passage from this world. I know that’s a bit different because so much time had passed. But in no way did I think I should have to do that for this person when he abandoned us. It was sad but in reality he wanted some acknowledgement because he was afraid or finally seeing the damage he caused. That was between him and his children and his Higher Power. He did apologize to me and gave me props that I did the only thing I could to save my children and run … small badge/accolade indeed for what we went through in the intervening years.

I know we have to go on to live with ourselves and do what we need to do with these situations without shame or judgment. At the same time… please be careful of subscribing to this idea the cheater would do anything for their kids… they’ve already showed they cannot and won’t. I left (the last one) on a Tuesday.. ironic right? … while he was at work. By that weekend he was literally in bed with the next one… already had her on the sidelines as I had suspected.

As Tracy said, I imagine there will be complicated and conficting emotions in this journey and I hope you have a therapist and solid support system to get through this part of your journey. It just seems like we take so much on sometimes because *we* are good people and that speaks volume about us. Clearly you’re an honorable man and the world does need more of you. Sending healing vibes for all.

NoShitCupcakes
NoShitCupcakes
1 year ago

1. Get hospice in there

2. Tell them she’s touchy-feely. I wouldn’t hold her hand.

3. Spend minimal time/effort on her – she’ll continue to suck you dry because now she’s dying and it’s her ticket to abuse you still further. It’s coming!

4. I wouldn’t want to be there when she dies either.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  NoShitCupcakes

Regular Hospice wont be activated until a doctor certifies that she will likely die in 6 months (although they certified my mom during dementia when she didnt look within 6 months of death). There are often volunteer hospices which dont charge and likely have fewer admission restrictions. They often have great volunteers.

As far as being there when she dies, I hope he feels ok doing whatever is best for him. I wanted to be with my (abusive alcoholic) mom when she died because I knew I would handle it better than my dad or brother.

Don’t underestimate death doulas…they are generally a very good group of souls. One of them was talking my mom out and mom seemed to be relaxing and allowing her body to stop but I started talking (out of shame that a “stranger” would be her last human contact) and hearing my voice she took a huge breath and lived 2 more days.

NoShitCupcakes
NoShitCupcakes
1 year ago
Reply to  unicornomore

“She’s Stage-4 and not curable… undergoing chemo and an upcoming clinical trial at Mayo but prospects are still not good to see Christmas 2025.”

Sounds like all he has to do is ask.

I would spend as little time with the emotional vampire as possible. Fauxpologies, handing out still more blame and trying to make him feel guilty is very likely to be part of her agenda. As evidenced by her demands for physical contact from him now. It’s just more of the same with these FWs.

Mick – contact an estate attorney and maybe a CPA to get as much sorted out as possible. Make certain you aren’t responsible for her debts since separating. Divorcing her may be in your best interests.

Look into green cemeteries and burials too. She can be wrapped in a sheet and deposited in a biodegradable box (or skip the box entirely). I wouldn’t waste a penny on embalming her, plus the chemicals are dangerous to the workers and the environment. See if donating her body to a medical school or to medical research is possible. They’ll give you the ashes later, if the kids want them. That is free, if they’re willing to take her body.

I’m not down with sane-washing the terminally ill when they’ve already shat all over their families.

GayDivorcee
GayDivorcee
1 year ago

I am so sorry you are going through this Mick.

If your wife is anything like my FWxH, you already know that she would not be there for you if the tables were turned. You are, however, free to respond to her need in any way that you wish.

As others have correctly cautioned you – look out for your own well being. You are entitled to set limits and boundaries to preserve your own health (physical, psychological, spiritual, and financial).

I share Chump Lady’s disdain for the concept of closure. Closure may be a myth, and if it is real, it is only real when we confer it upon ourselves. In my experience, closure never comes to us from the outside.

Good luck on your journey. Check in from time to time.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  GayDivorcee

My parents recently died after behaving in a manner where they expected more from me that they would have ever given and acted very irresponsibly to get me and my brother to take responsibility for their stupid actions. I am so angry with them, Im not even bothering to be sad. Very very selfish people.

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 year ago
Reply to  GayDivorcee

My attorney actually said during the intake appointment, “Don’t expect closure.”

It’s a crazy story I’ve told here before, but I did get a closure from my ex’s own attorney though. He turned on his client in a wild flourish that got it settled and sent a message to me through my attorney that he felt sorry for me. Yeah, not quite ethical, but so it was.

Fern
Fern
1 year ago
Reply to  GayDivorcee

Hey GD, thank you. I’ve never been able quite to articulate my opinion about closure. I do think it is a thing but I understand the argument that it is a myth.

“it is only real when we confer it upon ourselves. In my experience, closure never comes to us from the outside.”

That feels right! It is within our control – which is how things like feelings should be.

GoodFriend
GoodFriend
1 year ago

Mick, I’m confused. She essentially ended your marriage in 2015 and would have divorced and remarried if the AP hadn’t ghosted her. You, soon followed by your sons, moved 1500 miles away. She was diagnosed. And then: We shut down everything — her business, her condo — packed everything into storage units and prepared to try and battle the cancer. She’s very needy…the desire for touch (not sexual) is non-stop…all of our lives will be dictated by her care and there will be another 100k out of pocket for me in the next year,

Has she moved to be near you? Is she planning or already moved in with you?

Although I hope I’m not overstepping, and know I may sound harsh. I suggest you consult an attorney and consider finishing what she started 10 years ago and get divorced. You should not be saddled with $100K of her debt. Look at it as $100K that could eventually go to your children. Remember, she chose not to move near them for 10 YEARS because she was pursuing her business. Was there an illness/death clause or insurance that will pay out in this situation? Did she own her condo? Maybe it should be sold now to pay her debts, not after death. I wouldn’t rely on her will to be fair to her children or you. She may have another secret relationship she hasn’t mentioned.

Since she is so needy, she can move into a healthcare facility or possibly a hospice facility. Perhaps she should stay near the community and business she was loathe to leave. Your home has essentially been an escape for you, and perhaps your children. If she invades it, especially now, your home will become a reminder of her. And frankly, if she continues to be as selfish as she’s been for the past decade, she will pile up a lot more unhappy memories with her unreasonable demands. It’s unreasonable to expect the spouse you cheated on and left should now provide you with constant care and support. You and your sons should not be unpaid caregivers for a woman who could not be bothered with you. Had you divorced–as she wanted– I doubt you’d even consider doing this.

She seems incredibly selfish. I’m sure she regretted losing such a caring, supportive man, and it seems she has been manipulating your for the past decade into continuing to give her health insurance and the veneer of marriage. You say neither of you have moved on, but it’s quite possible that she has done so without your knowledge.

I hope you’re not trying to prove that you’re the better man and partner to either yourself or your sons (or to her). Please consider that your ongoing self-sacrifice is setting a poor example for your sons. You set a great example by moving away, then through inertia, guilt or her manipulation, you remained tethered to her for a decade. Now, although she discarded you, she’s demanding that you fill the role of a devoted, dedicated spouse and caregiver through her death and even afterwards.

Would you want your sons to believe they’re obligated to remain with a cheating partner, especially for a decade or more? They may look back at what you’ve done, convince themselves that you had it worse, and decide to put up with whatever their partners do.

On discovery, my cheating ex-spouse pressured me for hugs and other physical affection to make himself feel better. I still feel ill to think about it. She may be expecting the same from your sons, and through your silence and example, you may be making them feel the same discomfort you feel, or worse. Although your sons are adults, you’re still protecting your ex-wife’s image. I think they deserve an explanation for the distance between you. They also may want to address their mother about causing the breakup of their family, something they’ll be unable to do after she dies. Although you wrote, She’s the mother of my children for whom I know she would do anything,  you also wrote, she was willing to give up her marriage and two teenage sons in order to chase her heart.” And she did give them up, because she wanted toget to value” in her business. What if she decides she “needs” them to drop their work, school or social commitments to give her the attention she craves? You’ve already decided for them that, “all of our lives will be dictated by her care …in the next year, at a minimum.” Kids are not obligated to care for a parent, particularly one who chose to abandon them.  

In addition to a lawyer, I suggest a therapist for you and your sons, and a financial expert who can address your liability for her bills. If you take on her medical expenses, you may also be legally saddled with any or all of her other debts.

Mick, you sound like the faithful committed partner we all thought or hoped we married.

Please don’t feel that you’ve put up with this for so long that you have to do even more until and even after she dies. You put distance between you for a reason. Although you didn’t divorce legally or perhaps emotionally, you did choose to end the relationship, and you can choose to maintain that boundary, no matter what she wants or needs. You clearly want to do the honorable thing, but like cheating, it’s not one choice, it’s a whole series of choices that will affect you and your sons forever. Please be kind to them and to yourself.

Leedy
Leedy
1 year ago
Reply to  GoodFriend

“Although your sons are adults, you’re still protecting your ex-wife’s image. I think they deserve an explanation for the distance between you.” This is a hugely important point. Nick is a deeply honorable person, and I think he’s handling this complicated situation with grace and strength, as well as wisdom. But with GoodFriend, I think it may be a mistake to protect his ex’s image. In my experience, the truth (unless there are young children) has always been the healthier option, for the children above all.

Cam
Cam
1 year ago
Reply to  GoodFriend

> You should not be saddled with $100K of her debt. Look at it as $100K that could eventually go to your children.

Or even his own needs! Retirement isn’t cheap, and he needs to put on his own oxygen mask first.

Mr Wonderfuls Ex
Mr Wonderfuls Ex
1 year ago
Reply to  GoodFriend

I agree with this. While still married on paper the relationship was over years ago and Mick is being leaned on for caretaker work. He is doing what he feels is best but PLEASE protect yourself financially. Spend the money on a lawyer.

I have not been through this situation at all but honestly, I grieved the “death” of klootzak who pretended to be a man who never existed. Life is about what he can get. He’s a con artist. Who he actually is is someone I never loved. I loved a fiction. It’s not that the person he “was” died; he never even was that person. Based on his family medical history, he is prone to high blood pressure and stroke. Yet he is taking Viagra. I want this marriage over before he has a stroke and I am responsible for him or expected to be his caretaker. He made his bed. Let one of his many APs come wipe his chin. I would absolutely support our son in his grief but I don’t want to be responsible to clean up after klootzak any more. As I told him before, he fired me from that job.

Eurydice
Eurydice
1 year ago

Mick,

My FW died in July of 2020, after a years-long battle with cancer, when my children were 5, 7, 9, and 11 years old. He spent the last 4 years of his life neck deep in alcohol, gambling, other women, and other forms of aggressive abandonment and emotional abuse. I nursed him through the last weeks of his life in my own home. I did this to demonstrate to my children what it looks like to treat a dying person with dignity, not because of who he was (they hated him) but because of who I am. They avoided him, and when he died, they chose to say no goodbyes.

I had consulted divorce attorneys at various points during this journey, and they all said that it was best to wait him out. They also indicated that the best way to spend my time and energies was to shore up my estate planning. They were right. I made sure that the will was updated, including a trust to avoid probate, and that I knew everything there was to know about the levers and mechanics of post-death issues (SS, life insurance, debts, freezing credit postmortem, etc.). This gave me a place to put all of the “this situation is so gross” energy, and it empowered me in the stages immediately after he died.

My kids and I were prepared. I run this little household by myself, and my kids are thriving. I have found that the phrase “former husband” prevents the awkward expectations around grief, and my kids and I have regular check-ins about if/how this is backing up on them. They do not miss their father. That is the price he paid for his choices.

These next months will be so hard. Prioritize your care, allowing professionals to take charge of her care (hospice!) whenever possible. Covid complicated that for me, but you can use it as much as you need to. Don’t expect closure, but do expect a new opportunity to focus forward. Make this about your kids, yourself, and your future.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  Eurydice

You did awesome. If I remember, “Widowed Head of Household” is the best tax bracket to be in. I claimed it for 2 or 3 years before I remarried and I hardly paid any income tax during that time.

OutWest
OutWest
1 year ago
Reply to  Eurydice

This is the kindest reply to a very difficult situation.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago
Reply to  Eurydice

Excellent advice and insight here especially about financial and legal matters. This can really get lost in the fog of caretaking.

2xchump
2xchump
1 year ago

I am.sorry to utter this, but cheaters at the end are afraid and they seem to gather all the help that need by their ongoing charm”, sadness” neediness, entitlement and simply dying…. and the act continues. They have NO OTHER TOOLS in their tool box and they can keep OW,,OM ..X wives, / X husbanda /caretakers and others, circling in their orbit. HOW can any Chump at any level say No? Not with the end of life magnet firmly set in the chumps heart. ..🧲 I did say no to cheater on calls from the ER after D day, and let others step in…he had dumped me and now it was the magnet of sad sausage. ..he could have died..but I took notes all during the discard and I knew I was just OF USE. We must all do what we must do, but dying on one end does not change the character. Anything you do for your cheater needs to be decided on by..you are doing this for you, not for them. If you didn’t divorce, you are a conscious volunteer. And it is perhaps a legal duty. Keep in mind, plenty of cheaters bow out if a Chump is dying right? Married or not. And plenty of OW and OM take over the comfort of their criminal acts. Hear ye all chumps, do what you need to do but the dying person is still who he/ she is and you are acting out of mercy and consciously. No pity needed by others for your choices. Go with God.

2xchump
2xchump
1 year ago

As an RN, my XHCheater used me, to take care of both his parents end of life needs. As soon as they died, he told me of his double life on D day without remorse. This is the cheaters character. I didn’t do enough FOR HIM!

Orlando
Orlando
1 year ago
Reply to  2xchump

Yeah this is why I don’t support the OP to continue caretaking his ex wife (which she really is) ….he continues to be in chump mode.

FYI_
FYI_
1 year ago

I was very careful never to make her look like she was 100% responsible for what happened to our family. 

Why? I am sympathetic, don’t get me wrong, to this woman’s dying. And to your pain. But she WAS responsible for what happened to your family. Your sons don’t need to be lied to about that. I know “lie” is a strong word, but they have a right to the whole truth about their own lives. It was their family.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago
Reply to  FYI_

I agree with this. I think the children should always be told the whole truth, in an age appropriate way. The cheater should never be protected by lies.

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 year ago
Reply to  FYI_

Good point. My kids knew anyway. Even though I wasn’t explicit about the breakdown of the marriage, they knew. It came out later when they started asking more questions.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 year ago
Reply to  Elsie_

I didnt tell my kids and after the Cheater dies, I would have looked like a butthead for telling his secrets with him not able to defend himself. Tell sooner rather than later

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 year ago

This is so very hard, Mick. You are doing the right thing, but watch yourself. It is appropriate to delegate her care at times. In some metropolitan areas, there are “hospice houses.” A relative of mine went to one when her care became overwhelming. Her husband told me several times how wonderful it was just to go be with her without the worry of caring for her.

My ex had health issues for most of our marriage, and I did wonder at times if I would end up in a situation where I would have to weigh caring for him after he took off. During the first health crises apart, he insisted on handling it himself and then didn’t even tell me about two surgeries and other problems until after they occurred. He has family members who have helped at times, but not in his immediate area. I took that as a message that I was not to be involved.

Later during the divorce, his attorney told mine that his client was in very poor health and that he was concerned about how that might impact the divorce. But the divorce went through, and I assume my ex is still around because I still receive pension payments.

But yes, a genuine possibility for some of us. Mick, you are amazing!

Orlando
Orlando
1 year ago

Why the martyrdom? Seriously. Your sons are grown & this is their role now to support their mother. Not you, you’re only technically married. Maybe you’re here to hear that? So that you can hear it’s okay to let go? That your life not continue to be impacted caretaking & paying medical bills for a woman that cheated & would’ve likely left & married the other guy in a heartbeat? I wouldn’t caretake my ex-husband. Even if I thought it would lessen the burden for my kids. Why? Because I wasn’t enough for him – according to him – so why would I be enough if he was ill???
I say it’s okay to let go. Not cruel, but actually being the right thing to do. Ya’ll are pretending at this family thing anyhow IMO.

sleepyhead
sleepyhead
1 year ago
Reply to  Orlando

“Your sons are grown & this is their role now to support their mother.” Maybe, maybe not. I’m reminded of my own narcissistic mother who treated me like absolute garbage growing up and well into my adulthood (no cheating involved – my parents divorced when I was quite young – but plenty of physical and psychological abuse, as well as spreading falsehoods about me to anyone who would listen). When she became old and incapacitated, and my golden child sister wanted to move away and wouldn’t be available, she and all her flying monkeys started not asking but demanding that I leave the career I’d carved out for myself – with no support, financial or otherwise, from her – and move halfway across the country to take care of her. Amazing how even though she couldn’t have been bothered to show the least bit of caring for me over the years (and even then didn’t think I was owed any kind of apology – which I wouldn’t have accepted anyway), it was now expected that I drop everything and swallow any remaining pride to move in with her and nurse her. Nope. Admittedly, mine is a slightly different scenario, but I had to barf up this story to say that the children don’t owe a narcissistic/uncaring parent anything.

ChumpNoMore
ChumpNoMore
1 year ago
Reply to  sleepyhead

I hope you stood your ground. Sounds like you did. What a shitshow of a FOO.

sleepyhead
sleepyhead
1 year ago
Reply to  ChumpNoMore

I sure did. And what it got me was an exceedingly nasty letter from my sister, tucked inside a birthday card (!). My mother had died a few months previously; I wasn’t told and only found out when I started getting sympathy cards. So a large part of that letter gleefully recounted all the insults that had been directed at me at the funeral (which I wouldn’t have attended anyway…). I later learned that most of it was made up. I truly envy people who are close with their siblings; my dad was the only close relative who was good to me and my mom saw to it that I didn’t see him all that often.

Leedy
Leedy
1 year ago
Reply to  Orlando

“Your sons are grown & this is their role now to support their mother. Not you.” What a great point!

Last edited 1 year ago by Leedy
JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 year ago

Mick,

You may just be the best of us.

Watching somebody wither like that is just plain awful no matter how you slice it. It takes an incredible amount of strength to do what you are doing under the best of circumstances…let alone after what she did to you and your family. I will leave my war with fuckwits at that for the day. Morning I’m having and given your situation? Life’s too short.

I think we’ve all pondered what we’d do in that situation. I don’t know if I could muster nearly that kind of strength you are right now.

Please-I implore you-take care of yourself. You have already made your decision-just please keep yourself strong for your next steps.

We are here for you.

CBN
CBN
1 year ago

I haven’t commented in a long while, but I still read almost every day, and I will probably continue to comment on this one point for the rest of my days because I feel so strongly about reframing this narrative:

“She is the mother of my children for whom I know she would do anything.” No, she wouldn’t. She will only do for them unless/until it interferes with what she wants. She was willing to abandon them, and she blew up their world.

OP is in a horrible spot, and my comment probably won’t help him. I don’t mean to derail the main thread/point of this post or be disrespectful in any way, but I feel compelled to challenge the “cheater as good parent” narrative whenever I see it. It just isn’t true. It’s not possible, IMO. A cheater doesn’t cheat only on his/her spouse, he cheats on the family, the children, too. The cheater negatively affects the children as much (maybe more) as the spouse. Someone who intentionally hurts their children can’t be a good parent. A cheater is someone who intentionally hurts their children. Therefore, a cheater can’t be a good parent.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 year ago
Reply to  CBN

Truth. A lot of chumps don’t want to believe the other parent is a shitty parent. I suspect it might be a mix of nostalgia for the days when it seemed to be a happy family and misplaced guilt about staying with somebody who has proven to be a shitty parent. You’re asking yourself; “How could I breed with this selfish, heartless person?” It’s comforting to believe the FW was, at least in terms of parenting, not selfish and heartless.
The thing is, chumps didn’t know the extent of the selfishness and heartlessness in most cases. We thought that if nothing else, they at least loved their kids, because they seemed to enjoy having family time. How were we to know that the pleasure they got from it was the FW reassuring him/herself that he/she was a good, stable family oriented person? If we give ourselves some grace for believing the act, we no longer need to have illusions about the FW as a parent.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago
Reply to  CBN

I completely agree with you. I don’t believe a cheater can ever be a good parent, and I would also like to absolutely CRUSH this idea. You don’t just cheat on your spouse, you cheat on your FAMILY, and the kids sometimes feel the effects throughout their adult lives. It’s a terrible thing to do to your FAMILY and it puts the kids in an awful bind, psychological, financially, and sometimes logistically, just knowing where they’re going to be, and who is going to take care of them, who is going to be in their parents lives, where their loyalties should lie. It can tear kids apart and it really is a terrible thing to do. NO CHEATER CAN EVER BE A GOOD PARENT!

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 year ago

Wow. I just tried to put myself in your painfully complicated shoes, Mick, and the sensation this brought was nearly unbearable. Your circumstances aren’t unheard of but I imagine they’re unusual enough that it immediately risks feeling isolated and alone due to the fact that few others around you will have gone through anything parallel. And that’s even aside from the fact that the situation sounds overwhelming. There are so many clashing enormous themes in what you’re describing. Honor, forgiveness, moral injury, trauma recovery, mercy, legacy, self identity, role modeling, etc.

It’s enough to drive anyone mad so all power to you for keeping your wits about you, not to mention being able to construct cohesive sentences in describing it. It’s the kind of thing that always makes me reflexively reach for some analogy or other in a desperate effort to wrap my mind around it.

For better or worse (tilting towards “worse” I’m afraid), the very first “analogy” your situation made me think of was an angry projection of how I think I’d feel in the same circumstances and one that’s not particularly sympathetic to your wife’s suffering: Aesop’s “Dog in the Manger” parable about a dog that’s so jealous of how much the horse loves oats that it decides to lay down and die in the oat barrel. As if she hadn’t done enough to you and your kids, now she’s extending the trauma in a different way, keeping centrality and, in particular, delaying your ability to move on from the trauma of betrayal by getting away from the instigator of it, rebuild your life, even find new love, etc.

But even if bits of truth emerge in harsh light, it’s not as if your wife “decided” to get sick to spite you and suspend your ability to disconnect and heal. And the angry analogy doesn’t acknowledge that the “dog” in this case is, in fact, a human being you once loved, the mother of children who still love her and, furthermore, for normal people, the specter of true suffering in any living creature– even ones we can’t bear the sight of– is traumatic and heartbreaking.

So I shook off this comparison and instead thought of the scene from the film version of Angels in America when the ghost of Ethel Rosenberg played by Meryl Streep finally relents from razzing and pricking the conscience of Roy Cohn, her executioner, as he slowly dies from AIDS. In a moment of mercy as his death approaches, she recites the Kaddish, the Jewish prayer for the dead. Then she ends it with “You son of a bitch.” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJhhrFN9E2I

I know– hardly a less harsh analogy than the first. Obviously the scale of it isn’t a perfect match either. Even if cheaters often put the lives of chumps at risk through potential STD exposure or are sometimes so empathy-free and even sadistic in their emotional abuse that they almost seem to be intentionally driving victims to suicidal ideation, it’s not exactly the same as unjustly ordering someone’s death in the electric chair. But there are elements in all forms of betrayal that overlap if simply in terms of the shockingly ugly, chilling, soul-rattling display of of human cruelty and selfishness. Regardless of the scale, seeing this specter is hard to get over. It’s a traumatic reminder that human beings can be heartless and dangerous, makes us feel less safe in the world, etc.

Anyway, even if the film scene isn’t the best analogy, what it crystalized for me was that “mercy” may have nothing to do with forgiving an offense or offender. I thought the character of Rosenberg made this clear by capping off the prayer with “You son of a bitch.” In essence, the scene could be viewed as a standoff over the question of forgiveness and mercy.

I suppose it’s worth mentioning that not all major religions require forgiveness to achieve salvation or to be viewed as good or truly faithful. In traditional Judaism, it’s optional which makes the question of mercy appear to be separate. Is it possible to be merciful without forgiving? And is forgiveness always healthy from a psychological and justice perspective? Is it even possible that the typical perception of what constitutes forgiveness is a bit exaggerated or off and that mercy should really cover it– simply having enough empathy to recognize when a living creature is suffering and not to revel in that suffering, even attempt to remedy it? Could it be that traditional prescriptions for forgiveness were really meant as a correction for those who lack basic empathy?

I think those are largely unanswerable questions though perhaps the film comes down on the side of mercy being possible without what most people believe is forgiveness. Imagining I was Rosenberg (another huge mental stretch since the closest I’ve come to being electrocuted was touching an ungrounded carnival trailer in the rain), I suspect I wouldn’t be able to forgive what Cohn did simply because I wouldn’t wish the same on anyone else if that makes sense.

I can only relate to this according to things I’ve personally been through like being the victim of violent crime or getting horribly chumped in the past. I can’t forgive those things– at least not according to the common interpretation of forgiveness (turning the other cheek, loving my enemy)– precisely because I couldn’t bear the idea of my children or really any innocent person being subjected to them. That in turn reminds me of a line from a poem by Yevtushenko: “The young will not forgive in us what we forgave” which, at least in a political context, I think was meant to say “Don’t minimize the effects of evil and don’t stop hating it if this makes you stand down and fail to prevent the same from happening to the next generation.”

So, again, imagining if I were Rosenberg, I would feel a sort of activist or moral duty to keep just enough of that sense of outrage alive so I’d never drift into minimizing or whitewashing the seriousness of the offense because, in doing so, I might fail to sufficiently empathize and support someone else in the same boat or might not be motivated enough to protect them in the first place if I had the power to do this. So my sense of what the character did was to suspend her very important moral ire over real injustice long enough to let the offender pass out of this world without adding to their already great suffering.

I can’t think of a more enormous moral conflict. At risk of oversimplifying, here are two irreconcilable things, neither of which can be sacrificed for the other. On the one hand we can never lose sight of the fact that really, really bad things are really, really bad because, in a sense, this risks allowing it to happen to others. On the other hand, part of maintaining that moral sense requires not becoming corrupted by practicing cruelty… which can also lead to being so hardened and numb that we stand passively by and allow terrible things to happen to others or fail to show empathy.

Aside from concerns about becoming permanently hardened by practicing cruelty, I think that, if I was in any kind of related real life circumstance, temporarily suspending moral outrage by showing mercy would be partly a matter of future “emotional planning.” Being honorable as you put it and showing mercy to a harmful person could at least allay the risk of later being haunted by regrets and losing my self-identity as “not cruel.” If I imagined that my children still loved the suffering individual, I wouldn’t want to add to my kids’ existential crises by betraying any callousness.

In the end I can’t fully put myself in your shoes and I’m worried my awkward efforts to do so won’t even be helpful. That would feel especially regrettable because I think you’ve done us all a brave service by sharing your experience. At the very least, it forces us all to think about it, almost like preemptive processing just in case any of us ever end up in the same kind of impossible bind. Like sharing tips on how not to drown in a rip tide, it’s a great turn to others since there’s nothing more difficult than having to figure this out for the very first time while in the heat of crisis. So thank you. And again, I really hope that some of the responses you get might buff a few jagged edges off what you and your kids are going through.

Matt in Middletown
Matt in Middletown
1 year ago

My ex lost her father and her mother both to cancer.
Stomach cancer took her father, what showed up on the scan had been the size of a dime.
They go in and find something the size of two dollar bills end to end.
Her mom survived cancer 4 times, number 5 got her.
Honestly don’t know how I’d feel if she had cancer herself.
All the destruction and foolishness, stupid petty games she played throughout our entire relationship.
Sorry about what Mick is going through, don’t wish it on anyone.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 year ago

Mick….you get a lot of advice here, much of it excellent, but in the end, you have to think about how you want to look back on this in the future. If you project yourself into the future after her death, whether 6 months, a year, 2 years (people last longer than you think even with terminal illness) how do you want to regard this period and what you did in it. That would probably be the way I would view this experience, how it reflects me and the person I want to be. I don’t want you to be enthrall to a woman who didn’t value you and treated you and your family badly (and you should tell your children why your marriage broke up) but there are other things that people consider and value at times like this. There are times when you take care of people you don’t even like or who were not nice to you because you feel it reflects your values more. Ultimately when you undertake any responsibility like this, it should be a reflection of your values and what you want to do in the world or for others, rather than any kind of obligation to another person, especially an adult.

Also, consider what your boundaries are in your relationship to your wife and her sickness – what you will do, what you won’t do, what you will listen to, or not, how much you want to pay, how much time you can spend…..just as in an active marriage, which this really isn’t, you have to set boundaries around this process so that you can preserve your own health and independence and sanity, frankly. So do consider what your boundaries are and discuss them with her if she is able to do that, she might not be fully sane at this point. I think often very very sick people or people who are going to die, are not always fully sane or rational through the process, and that is something we have to consider. If there are legal or financial matters to resolve with her, I would do them sooner than later, and you might need an intermediary as well.

Last edited 1 year ago by Mehitable
Leedy
Leedy
1 year ago
Reply to  Mehitable

“Just as in an active marriage, which this really isn’t, you have to set boundaries around this process so that you can preserve your own health and independence and sanity, frankly.” I had the same thought: it’s really important not to let one’s boundaries go by the wayside in the midst of such a time of crisis.

dartanajanna
dartanajanna
1 year ago

Although I do not wish anyone harm, even FW’s and cheaters, I know that karma works and shes a cold hearted and premeditating bitch. The Ex, Narcula, lied in court, did all sorts of financial abuse and then used that money to buy a very, very expensive Harley motorcycle. Hes now in the ICU from being in a wreck on that cycle. The real irony is two fold: My brother did the same to me and my sister when my parents passed and took money that was to be ours and bought a Harley that almost killed him, too. Plus the guy Narcula had come in and testify he never saw him with an AP was the one who swerved on his bike, he was following too close, and nipped the back tire of Narcula’s bike with his front tire. They both went down. They both ended up in the hospital. The Ex is still in there. Narcula will ruin anyone life who stays around him too long. He tried to ruin mine. The final word when I heard about the wreck? Its from a song in “A Chorus Line”…”I felt nothing…” Tuesday is here for me.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 year ago
Reply to  dartanajanna

I hope these catastrophes take the starch out of these assholes if just so they never cause you another moment’s trouble.

I don’t believe in karma but I do believe the “golden rule” has a dark side or boomerang effect in the case of abusive and disordered personalities. Those types often seem to end up doing unto themselves as they’ve done unto others, maybe because self loathing often undergirds all that compensatory self-absorption, one-up-manship and self-aggrandizement. Those who are careless with others may be careless in general. Or perhaps there’s a tendency for aggression to turn inwards when abusers run out of handy victims.

At least this is how I’ve managed to wrap my head around the fact that my past is littered with the corpses or broken husks of bullies past– outcomes I had absolutely no hand in. Not kidding. It gives real meaning to prescription to “leave them (enemies) to God.” Where I grew up was a perfect “karma testing ground” to see how shitheads end up in the long run because I was severely bullied for several years when my family moved from NYC to the burbs.

Maybe it was my accent or the fact I really liked opera at the age of ten– the usual stupid things that get kids targeted. But something about that town was particularly Stephen King-ish. Maybe there were especially high rates of domestic violence related to the infamously corrupt municipal police force that was somehow producing epic creeps like a bully assembly line. Maybe it was the culture? History of Native American genocide? I don’t know but it was Lord of the Flies stuff. Friends from other parts of the country or world are always shocked to hear that boys regularly physically assaulted girls which would be considered shameful in most other places (I mean publicly assaulting girls. The behind-closed-doors stuff exists everywhere).

Anyway, several of those bullies never made it to age 20, several shortly had their lives exploded by excruciating scandals, one ended up in prison, one lost a limb, etc., etc. This was not the hood with all the usual dangers, hazards and pitfalls. These were upper middle class white people. The statistics seem “significant.”

The karma/dark-golden-rule effect didn’t stop in childhood either. I actually cringed and thought “Look out” when a crazy, toxic neighbor a floor below and an equally crazy building handyman started inexplicably harassing me and my kids at one point (repeatedly messing with our water tank, deliberately cutting our power, then smirking when confronted). Both were dead by Christmas that year. In that case I had the sense that both probably long intuited their health was declining from bad habits and so they formed a little bully clique to externalize all the panic, rage and sadness they were feeling by scapegoating whoever seemed like an easy mark. But it’s kind of the same “dark golden rule” principle in a way.

Last edited 1 year ago by Hell of a Chump
Chumpolicious
Chumpolicious
1 year ago

She cheated. She let her kids down and broke up the family. The marriage is over just not legally. She put her cheating before the kids well being. So I dont exactly agree with the statement that she would do anything for her kids. Nor do I pity her. She is going to use you till her last breath. Use the situation and your kind heart to her advantage. Beware she may hold on for a long time. Beware she could be lying about her cancer or the direness of her situation. Did you actually speak to her MD or get a report stating she doesnt have long to live? You just cant give cheaters the benefit of the doubt. You hear all the time about people lying that they are dying and getting money from a go fund me page. Yes it sucks to be so untrusting, but thus is what they do to chumps and to be trusting is to be naive to predators in the world and in our lives.
I agree with others that hospice should step in if she is indeed dying. There is no way you could give that level of care, especially if you are far away. You can still stop by and be a supportive participant if you choose. There is just no reason for her to solely rely on you. Maybe call up her AP let him know she is in hospice so he can visit her and say goodbye. And in hospice you can let it be known that while you are legally her spouse it is in name only and the real marriage died years ago. That way nurses will understand your dynamic and if there are any sweet widows or single nurses you could date.
And honestly you have closure already. You have moved on. Give yourself some credit.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 year ago

This is a gut wrenching situation and I feel terrible for Mick and his children. Mick is truly heroic.

I have a legal question for any of you legal eagles out there; is Mick legally obligated to pay $100,000 in care because they are still married or does the fact that they have been separated for many years mitigate his legal responsibility?
Providing care is one thing, but potentially bankrupting yourself to pay for a cheater’s medical bills is another. So can he refuse to be responsible for her bills and give her care over to the state? Could he file for divorce now in the hope that divorce will be final before the insurance runs out?
Not that I think Mick would do that, I’m just curious.

CL is right that our cheaters would never do the same for us. They’d leave the burden to our children or leave us to die alone and in agony if there are no kids. What Mick is demonstrating is how vastly different chumps are from cheaters. It’s almost as if they are a different species.

Last edited 1 year ago by OHFFS
Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
1 year ago

I was more loyal to my fake husband and my so-called marriage than I was to myself.

I no longer have that problem.

I would not be taking care of him if he were in the same situation. I would be shocked if he asked.

I would never presume to tell someone else what they should do. Everyone has to make their own decision.

That being said, I believe one’s status as a good person or an honorable person is intact whether you help out or refuse. Someone so brutally and intentionally beaten so badly emotionally is under no obligation to care for their perpetrator. As Miss Manners says, you are under no obligation to care for the feelings of anyone who shows no concern for yours.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
1 year ago
Reply to  Velvet Hammer

As for closure?

The lack of respect was the closure.
The lack of amends was the closure.
The lack of accountability was the closure.
The lack of care was the closure.
The lack of honesty was the closure.

The only closure you need is believing you deserve better.

(Trent Shelton?)

Learning
Learning
1 year ago

Mick, it’s your prerogative to decide if you will walk alongside her as she moves from this life to the next, or not.

Your letter sounds as though you are very insightful about your situation. You appreciate all the complexities and nuances. You see who she really is and what she’s done to you and your family, as clearly as the day.
No blind spots, no illusions, no spackle. You see it clearly.

So your decision to do what you’re doing is an informed, considered choice. It’s not based on being gaslit or enraptured by false promises.

There must be such a tangle of mixed feelings and ambivalence and contradiction – because the situation itself is ambivalent and contradictory.

I agree with CL that giving yourself permission to feel all of those emotions is important. You have every right to feel this array of things.

I sense from your letter a mixture of resignation, sadness, dismay that she emerged to be the person that she was, tenderness for who she (and you together) could have been, pity, empathy and an emotional remove. All at the same time.

She really was a person who threw away something precious. She really was someone who elected to abandon you and her family. She really was someone who harmed you. She really was and is a person incapable of reciprocating the sort of tenderness that you’re showing her now.

Her tragedy (and she may never, ever see this) is that she can’t scramble or bargain to get those lost years back. They’ve already gone.

A toxic, harmful fuckwit who then gets a terminal diagnosis, becomes a toxic, harmful fuckwit who’s facing death.

That is to say, a disordered, somewhat empty person who now feels very scared.

You are a very honourable man to be accompanying her on this part of her life’s journey.
You are strong because you’re choosing to do this based on your own particular circumstances and your own understanding of the sort of man you want to be. You are doing this for you in a sense.

Take very good care of yourself, your sons, your legal and financial needs.

Hugs for your own future life journey, which is not hers, although your paths have crossed.

tink60
tink60
1 year ago

I am in a similar situation with my cheating husband. Emotional affair with an ex-girlfriend for half of our marriage. I believe he was planning on leaving me for her but was diagnosed with a rare form of non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma . He subsequently underwent a permanent colostomy and urostomy. We did separate for a few months but he begged forgiveness and I took him back. He literally has no one else. I decided I would care for him not out of any sense of loyalty or love, but a sense that I had to care for a fellow( although vile) human being at the end of his life who was truly alone. I look at my role not as a loyal wife, but basically a caregiver. I practice self care and maintain no emotional connection to him. Is it difficult? Absolutely, but it’s a decision that I personally can live with. Not everyone has to choose to do this, but for me, this is what I can live with. I feel for you but at the end of the day,we have to do what we can live with. I wish you peace!

thumper
thumper
1 year ago

Adult sons are now in their mid-20s and live locally. In addition to home health services, I would ask them for some respite care so you can have some time for yourself. You don’t have to spell out to them that you are providing home care for her but it’s no longer an intimate partnership. I would also ask to come along to her next surgery or oncology appointment. Other commenters have already suggested the possibility that she is overstating her diagnosis, and hearing it from her doctors should clarify that.