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But I Always Come Back to You

bebackIf you ever had any doubts that cheating was about unbridled narcissism, look to the Boomerang Cheaters. They screw around but then assure you, hey, it’s okay — because they would never divorce you.

“I always come back to you!”

My ex used to do this mindfuck and it never failed to infuriate me.

What makes you assume I WANT you to come back? You think you’re doing me some sort of favor?

Is this some sick assurance that I’ve won the pick me dance?

Other than being several sandwiches shy of a picnic, what could compel cheaters to say this?

Moral superiority.

Yeah, I know a claim to the moral high ground is rich coming from a person who’s banging someone else, but I swear part of the “but I would NEVER divorce you!” narrative is smug condescension. I’m a Family Person. I VALUE marriage! Unlike YOU who talk of divorce and who want to harm the children and break up their home! You’re a quitter.

Next they swan into a self pity aria. I’m trying. Can’t you see how much I put up with you? Okay, a Mistake Was Made. How long must I be punished? 

I Always Come Back to You of course is also a flamboyant display of entitlement. They assume there is hearth and home to come back to. It’s also a staggering act of minimalization. Oh, that affair? Yeah, so? But I’m with you now. What’s your issue? Why would you think anything is wrong here?

Cake is Right and Proper! Do not upset the balance of cake!

Of course, to the unschooled chump, they don’t see cake. They see a dramatic love affair gone wrong. The cheater strays, is wayward for awhile, but then is tugged back by the great, powerful love they have for their chump. Oh to be the focus of such a love! Oh to WIN the pick me dance and crush the competition under the heel of your boot!

If a cheater boomerangs? I suggest you not be there to catch them. Let that thing drop.

This column ran previously. Happy July 4th!

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at [email protected]. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • After I busted the asshole AND after a few months of his therpization (never ever EVER trust a covert narc who is in therapy if YOU are their chump) here’s his similar comment: “I’m here.” ” I want to be with YOU.” This is after 18 YEARS of serial cheating combined with a 10Y.E.A.R. fuckfest with a MOW.

    WOW What a fucking honor. The cheater wants cake and his image intact.

    Nope. Just more entitlement. Please don’t fall for their BS. cheaters are depending 100% of the chump’s big heart of forgiveness in order to maintain what they feel entitled to and what they alone destroyed, right under the chump’s nose.

      • You, too, ANC!! Today I celebrate both liberation from Britain, and liberation from a cheating Briton.

    • ANC

      And doing it right under the chumps nose is according to the Limited, part of the thrill. After 41 years he smirked and said it was ALWAYS about the thrill of the chase. He knew what he was all along.

      For those of you on the fence, make your own plan. Do not share information with the cheater as there are three of you. If it doesn’t work out with the OW believe they will use you as plan B until the next time.

      If the slunT wasn’t so disturbed, entitled , and crazy I would pity her. He’s now driving around with OW in her car.

      • Do not share information with the cheater as there are three of you.

        All new Chumps need to read this and engrave it on their eyelids!

        Chumps are trusting souls, but Cheaters are liars. Also Cheaters partner with their APs in a conspiracy against the Chump. Expect everything you say to your Cheater to be relayed to the AP. Everything!

        Keep your thoughts and your plans to yourself, your lawyer, and your therapist until your ducks are lined up.

    • “cheaters are depending 100% of the chump’s big heart of forgiveness in order to maintain what they feel entitled to and what they alone destroyed, right under the chump’s nose”.

      If not sure if it’s *forgiveness* they’re depending on. I think it may be that they are depending on the idea that we value being *married* as much as THEY do.

      They don’t want a *marriage* but they also don’t mind being *married*. It’s like, they may not like their chosen career but they like the benefits. What they don’t like is being ‘unemployed’ (a.k.a. divorced) and losing those benefits, especially since they know their ‘boss’ (US!!!) probably won’t give them a good recommendation…

  • I guess I should be thankful for all the times I DID NOT know about….ignorance is bliss.
    Looking back now, I see it. He would run to our friends and say he just couldn’t do it anymore, I was crazy, I was mean to his mother, I was too hard on our oldest daughter for stealing our of my cash stash….the list goes on. They asked him point blank if there was another woman, he’d reply with his “absolutely not, I’d never cheat on her” bullshit. They bought it….until I finally caught him. Then….the stories came out. So he didn’t keep coming back to me in that sense….because I didn’t know.
    He was setting up his narrative… once the affair was revealed he could justify it because I was sooooo horrible.
    Now that I’m 4 years away from him, still not divorced, I see his mindfuckery. He is quite pathetic. The OW eats it up. She loves the games, the kibble, the pick me dance. She has engaged me several times… I fail at NoContact. I finally described in great detail on New Years Eve when she texted me some crazy “he picked me not you” Meme…I said let me guess…he is asleep on the couch, left hand in his gray sweatpants waistband, glasses on and his cow and heifer magazine on his chest, he is snoring….loudly. It’s midnight on New years Eve….he is sound asleep, you are 30….he is 57. You wish you were partying….but you are realizing you spent time on your knees to get this…..this sleeping old man on the couch….and the woman you “stole” him from….never has to look at that again….

    She thinks she won….she didn’t. If you have to text the wife on New years Eve, clearly you are pathetic.

    Blessed for all the pick message I didn’t know about, blessed for the whore who won him….I got my INDEPENDENCE from him….best gift ever!!

    • Tracy

      Setting up the narrative caused me so much pain. The things he did to discredit me were hateful and untrue. Each year they perfect the tale of woe and the last whore he ended up with told me he supported me and I blew my money on myself as he struggled.

      The truth was that he cheats five months a year when his business slows down each spring. Rather than manage his money throughout the year he spent money on drums, his car, weed, and alcohol. I supported myself since I got married. A month before he chose the whore he wanted me to buy a rental property with him and I said no. He needed my signature in the loan as he’s self emoloyed. The lies are delivered with such ease. My guess is that she is supporting him on her income. He was excited she would pay his way.

    • I wrote a longer post but it got lost in cyberspace, so I’ll just say THANK YOU, Tracy for helping me fit in another piece of the puzzle.

      The Entitled One did the exact same thing — running to his friends and family to complain about me. Behavior that escalated after the final D-Day when we were trying to “work things out.” I couldn’t understand why he’d do that when he was telling me how much he loved me and wanted us to stay together. Of course, you’re right — he was setting up the narrative. And silly me, I was taking his words at face value instead of looking for the ulterior motive — impression management.

    • I should also be thankful for the years I didn’t know, there were signs things were “off” with X.
      There were times I asked if he loved me or if he was with someone. X came back with “you have quite the imagination, maybe you should write novels,” with a chuckle.., “you know me, I’m not that kind of guy,” and the “I’m still here, aren’t I”. I would doubt myself, ignoring the many signs which looking back are glaringly obvious. Then of course, I’m crazy, the familiar “you’re too hard on our son,” when I’d ask our son to take out the garbage four times and he still hadn’t budged, he’d question me with “don’t you think you over reacted?” I was also accused of being mean to his mother, meanwhile telling our neighbors (sometimes with tears in his eyes,) I’m crazy, X was seriously concerned for my mental health, and poor X couldn’t take it anymore.
      it never occurred to me he was setting up his narrative which continued after X moved out.
      Alienated our son from me, I had a fender bender in the high school parking lot one afternoon X told
      everyone I was drunk and that’s why I had the accident. X warned the school oounselors and our sons teacher that I was unstable, “just to leet them know” so the would be prepared. Prepared? Oh, he was only being helpful and a good father.
      These freaks have so many similarities it’s frightening makes me wonder if they’re actually human beings.

    • Awesome response! I know I wouldn’t have the clarity of mind to send something so clever, and cutting. You GO Tracy!

  • Yes this. Mine tried to convince me to leave our home after he gave me the letter of separation, saying that I should go to psychotherapy to work on myself and he would visit every day and hey maybe we’ll reconcile in 6 months maybe we’ll even get re-married (WTF! –we weren’t divorced!). It was all about getting me OUT since he was already with OW snd probably wanted to move her in. When I didn’t leave on my lawyers advise is when the rage really kicked into gear. .. truly evil and continues now,8 months later. I’m sure he’s telling her I stand in the way of the agreement when he is totally uncooperative and is totally silent,after 2 months of hoovering and then stalking and then stealing most of our belongings..these wackjobs are truly dangerous.

  • There are whole cultures based on this abusive-power relationship. Whole societies based on the tradition of the woman smiling while being cheated upon, while the “husband” engages in every kind of infidelity: call girls, prostitution, affairs, masseuse, mistresses — but he did not divorce, so he is upheld as being righteous. These cultures also manifest pollution-filled lands: poisonous rivers, gaseous air, blighted landscapes. There is karma for destroying the marriage bond, and it shows up in a polluted ecology.

    • The link between accepting men cheating and pollution is power and entitlement. When women have less power than men, when they have difficulty gaining financial independence, and when men are treated as ‘better’, there will be all kinds of abuse, including cheating. And when certain people and groups have a lot more power and control over money, some of them will ‘abuse’ the land and poorer people, and future generations as well.

    • The Caribbean culture where I live is as you describe. Women get married expecting that at some point they will be cheated on by their husbands. Men are given the nod for their cheating. Good wives ignore…or pretend. I hated being a wife. It brought me shame not pride.

    • Queenmother, thank you for saying this. I have been thinking so much about the plight of sex-trafficked girls since discovering STBX is an unapologetic entitled consumer of such morally depraved “services” as they provide.

      I can’t tell if this is just a side effect of my shock at discovering his double life or a clarion call for me to take action.

      Regardless, it is soul-crushing to realize the extent of this global sickness and the institutions in place to maintain it.

      • I know, Roaring, that bothers me to. To think your own family will sell young girls for sex is truly evil. They should be protecting these girls.

  • I got this line from a “Switzerland friend” and it was meant to soothe me but it didn’t and I wasn’t sure why. Thanks for the explanation.

    It was clear that he saw himself as so noble for maintaining this long term marriage with such a tedious woman as me…of course he needed outlets for his needs and frustrations – especially when our kids were little and wore me out so I was too tired be a porn queen after tucking them in for the night.

    • Yes, mine, too, must have thought he was noble for maintaining the marriage when I was failing to do everything he asked and succumb to his every need and put him as the center of my universe. I’m NC with him, but in my mind every once in a while, I ask him, “You know what made marriage to you palatable for me?” then I answer my own question, “Nothing.”

    • Please explain the term Switzerland friend to me. I’m Swiss, read about them here and always wonder HOW you all got to know and use this term…. I have REAL Swiss friends, coming from and living in Switzerland. It sounds funny but is anything but… Thanks

      • Switzerland is famous for its neutrality. Switzerland friends are people who feign neutrality about your being cheated on/divorce. Along the lines of We All Brought Issues To the Marriage That Compelled The Cheater to Cheat on You. People who would prefer not to feel awkward or rearrange their social calendars. People who want to socialize with both you and the OW/OM. And wonder out loud why you can’t all be friends… etc.

        I’m sure actual Swiss people are not all Switzerland friends. It’s just a term we use here that I made up, like the pick me dance, kibbles, etc.

      • Several of our most esteemed members here at CN are Swiss (though not always openly), and we love them. I don’t think any of us harbor stereotypes or animosity toward actual Swiss people; it’s purely an historical reference applied to people who refuse to take a side after our betrayal (even when morality dictates it).

  • Independence makes your life a place where no person who is allowed in it thinks badly of you. It is a precious and wonderful thing. Gaining that was worth every financial struggle, lonely feeling, and scary time. So much better to feel afraid with options than to feel hopeless without options. So much better to feel empowered than worthless.

    So much better to know exactly why the money is tight, where and when more will come, and how it will be spent.

    So much better to know I won’t get a sexual disease. I know where I’ve been and how I’ve been there.

    So much better to feel lonely because I was actually alone than when I felt lonely while someone was sitting right next to me. (Also, it passed, faster than I thought it would or could.)

    So much better to wake up in the morning without my first thought being how ugly I probably look and how he’s probably thinking right now how much better it would be to look at the OW. (The cat thinks I’m amazing.) 🙂

    So much better to live this life than it ever was to live that life.

    Happy New Found Independence Day, Chumps! May we all find the pathways and strength to take our lives back as we are able (and lovingly support those who are still getting there).

    • Well said amisfree just beautiful! My dogs think im the bees knees! Happy fourth everyone!

    • This is expressed perfectly for how I now feel. It’s still hard, but so much better. If only I could find away to get him out of my thoughts. I don’t want him there taking up space. He has been there for 28 years, so I imagine it will take time. But, I’m better today and that’s all that matters. Happy Independence Day. Inchumpendence?

      • So very hard. 30 years for me. I wonder how to get him out of my head but im working on it. Might be a long time
        We will get there!

          • A smart counselor once explained that you can’t actually stop thinking about a thing. You have to think about it to know you want to stop thinking about it, and then you’re thinking about it. She had me practice givng myself some time to wallow on a topic, like 15 minutes or so, then redirecting my thoughts to other healthy, productive ones. For me, often meant doing some healthy activity. Can’t sleep? Crosswords, good non-stressful book or movie, listening to a podcast or inspirational lecture… some task that requires focused and positive thought.

            No one thing works for everyone, but it helped me a TON.

            • I agree, much of it is processing the magnificent level of treachery we endured. I’m over 1.5 years out from D-day, and every minute I’m not actively engaged in something else, I think about X’s betrayal and its ripple effects.

              If I find myself getting too obsessive, I do practice “thought stopping”—forcing another thought or image (“Image a PINK ELEPHANT, Tempest”) and it works for a while. What buoys me is that the intensity of the emotions from thinking about X’s betrayal have dulled over time. Eventually he’ll just be an afterthought.

              Time heals as nothing else can.

              • No pink elephants for me! I like to think of all the things I love, and love to do, that he hated. I have gone full tilt into exactly the direction he tried to prevent. It’s as much an FU to him as it is simply my choosing something I already love and find huge joy and reward in anyway. So, ;D a double win.

              • I’d say it was a good two years before I stopped thinking about ex and all the nightmares of Dday and the end of marriage pretty much all of my waking hours. And another year or so before I stopped thinking about it for the majority of my day. I’m now nearly six years past dday, and engaged to be married to a good man. At this point, I rarely think about the whole nightmare, other than I’m angry about the money he owes me and I fear for the emotional damage he does to our son. But I think Marilyn Manson said it best: “Whatever doesn’t kill you is gonna leave a scar.”

              • And I know I’m not completely indifferent yet, because sometimes the Pink Elephant sits on X ; ).

              • L7, what you said exactly. JAMF xhole has his foot on my neck the entire time. Focusing on the things I wasn’t ‘allowed’ to do was incredibly helpful. And the added fu was gravy. 😉

                Happy Liberation, CN.

      • I posted something similar in the comments a few weeks back about how I wanted to get him out of my head. CN came through with some WONDERFUL suggestions. Maybe a post idea, Chump Lady? How to go “no contact” with the cheater in your thoughts.

        In the meantime, for anyone struggling with the headspace issue, take a look at and scroll down to Virago and the “Fuck That” meditation. SureChumpedALot was kind enough to give a detailed post on how he took back his own thoughts that’s helped me a lot. And others chimed in with great tips!

        I’m still working on this. All the advice helped for the first couple of weeks, then I spent time with mutual friends I hadn’t seen in a year and found out more about what he was up to during our marriage. Now stuff is going on with the divorce that’s keeping him way too much in my thoughts. I’m letting myself “go there” for now. I totally get why people say there’s no meh until you’re divorced. Mine should be final in September … I so want this behind me.

        • That meditation is genius. Plus, it never fails to get me laughing. I wish they had “rage yoga” in my local area.

    • Beautiful, Amiisfree! Especially:

      “Independence makes your life a place where no person who is allowed in it thinks badly of you.”


      “So much better to feel lonely because I was actually alone than when I felt lonely while someone was sitting right next to me.”

      Only after I was out of that soul-crushing marriage did I realize how much he resented me (for not being the kind of mirror he wanted) and how lonely I’d been for years with the resentful lump sitting on the sofa next to me. I’m lonely sometimes now, but I’m not unhappy and numb.

      • I think of that quite often, how lonely it is to love someone that doesn’t love or value you, I can say i have not felt lonely since I finally gave up on him and a marriage that didn’t exist, and just accepted and loved me.

    • Your posts are always incredibly thoughtful and spot on. Very encouraging to the folks not quite as far along the path to mental freedom. This morning I woke up with my dog’s head resting patiently and lovingly on my chest and my cat waiting (somewhat less patiently) at the end of the bed. They love me because I meet their needs (food, shelter, affection). I love them too. Good riddance to the STBX who was always looking elsewhere for more, more, more kibbles yet never dreamed of leaving the steady source at home. Boy was he surprised when I said “enough and goodbye.” And I made it very clear up front that I get the pets! 🙂

      • Way to go! I, too, have always found great solace in long relationships with pets. The relationship is so balanced. It’s truly healing.

      • Amiisfree…Thank you from the bottom of my hurting heart! I am forty days in to the divorce process and I needed to read this today. Would have been 25 years in August.

        Multiple affairs from him but I stayed and worked and kept his secrets. In May he left me and kids for the latest slice of cake who dumped him four days later! Gotta love Karma!

        I filed, will be fine, have more peace, kids happier, but the money, the plans, dealing with children visits, etc. ugh!

        Since side chick dumped him, he asks back. I say, “No.”

        He is telling people around town that it just didn’t work out with us, that I didn’t love him, etc. I wish people knew the truth!

        He tells me he is looking for me but more sexual. Oh brother! I may have wanted to have sex with you more if you didn’t have affairs, have an std, roll in after 10:00 every night and passcode all of your technology. Geesh!

        Looking forward to this getting easier, or different as the days go by.

        Thank you all for sharing!!

    • Amiisfree, Yes! A wonderful list of what is T R U E about independence. Thank you for this!

  • I was told “I don’t think that you and I are finished yet” as he was moving out and into the OW’s apartment. “Ummm, wrong! We are so done.”

    • Blech. Yep, The Entitled One thinks we’ll get remarried sometime in the future when he’s done fucking around. He told mutual friends that “if we were really meant to be” then we’ll be together.


      • Yes because you’re good ol’ faithful and will always be there to be used again once his majesty decides he wants to be with you again. Unfrigginbelievable.

      • Same here: she said several times that she believed we’d get back together even after divorce. She said we just need to “take different paths” for awhile. Until I actually carried through with the divorce. Then her path led to the OM’s door and they are engaged. These people are insane.

  • satan texted me bout 3 months after dday…’I would like to come home if you can let this go.’…he kindly included a picture he took of himself…up his nose.

    …I didn’t reply 😀

    Happy 4th ChumpLady and Chump Nation! Thank you for helping me achieve my own Independence!!!!


        • Oh that is too funny! Hehehehe! He probably thinks even his boogies are awesome…hehehehe! I know he is infatuated with his stool! LMAO! I could hardly believe it after all of us listed the annoying things we wouldn’t miss about our lying cheating cowards to find out that POOP is a narc THING! ROFLMAO!!

          Oh shit, we are so lucky to be free of these nasty narcs!

      • Hehehe…he is just soooo special! Just ask him, he will be so happy to tell you all about it and him.

        He had the nerve to continue texting that day…one of the other stupid things he texted was, ‘I don’t know why you are so upset…I came home to you every night!’ …narc much asshole?

        Hehehehe! Happy Independence Day BetterDays!!! We’ve got it made without these disordered assholes!!! 😀

    • Damn, Jeep, I’ll bet you found it hard to resist inviting him back after that picture!?! Satan brings new meaning to “delusional.”

      • Amen Tempest 🙂

        It still amazes me how he can just poo-poo his behavior like ‘eh…what’s the problem?’ Floors me. I used to wonder what his reaction would have been had I been having affairs all our marriage long…but then I just thought ‘eh, who cares?’ 🙂 You and Tracy and this wonderful nation have helped me get my head and heart straight on the truth of the matter. Thank you, thank you, thank you! For the rest of my awesome cowardly cheater free life THANK YOU ALL!

        Dancin here Chumps! And later I’m gonna raise a glass and toast us all on our INDEPENDENCE FROM DISORDERED ASSHOLES! …Beau is gonna get a bit of ice cream to celebrate with me!

        I second the chump’s statement (earlier here in this post) that ‘…it feels almost like someone else’s life…’ Yes! I am getting to that point also. And I am soooo grateful! I have wanted this for sooo long and never thought I could get here. My arrival has been slow but steady and I am happily realizing I can DEBOARD now 🙂

        I love you Tempest <3

        • Yeah, Round 2 is freeing ourselves from what other people think (including Switzerland friends and cheater apologists). Bye, Felicia! We’ve got a whole new set of compassionate, high-integrity friends in each other here at CN. (Love ya back, Jeep! and Beau, too!)

          • Yes Tempest!!!!

            Holidays used to just cripple me! Fractured family celebrations created such awful heartbreak…I declined attending for quite a while due to the painful memories. Now. I am sooo grateful I do not have to be surrounded by the drunken chaos that always ensued shortly upon attendees arrival…ugh! I keep that in mind whenever my heart tries to go south on me and start that coulda, woulda, shoulda shit. Uh uh! I did the only thing I ‘coulda’ done under the circumstances, I saved myself, which I ‘shoulda’ done much, much sooner, and ‘woulda’ had I known the truth of the matter!


  • July 12, 2014 is my Independence Day:) That’s the day I kicked him out and told him I wanted a divorce. It was hard as hell, but 2 years later I’m happily divorced, own my own home and dating a chumpier chump than me. It’s a constant surprise to be in a relationship with someone who gives a shit. Truly y’all, we accepted so little.

    Get out there and find whatever independence means to you!

    Happy Independence Day!

    • Brianna, I like your concept of having your own Independence Day. That is awesome!

    • Briana

      “We accepted so little.” Never again!
      Independence rocks.

  • Four times he came back, four times in five years until he finally left for the OW. I was dancing the whole time thinking what was wrong with me, why did he pick her over me? Today I am home alone and my two cats think I am awesome. I’m not going to lie, it sucks to be home alone on the fourth when I can remember 40 years of fourth with him. We used to love to chase fireworks. But no fireworks for me today, no barbecues; just me trying to catch up with work. But no one is lying to me, no one is cheating on me, no one is making me feel like I am ugly or fat or useless. No more Boomarang because even he understands that the mask has slipped so completely that there is no coming back. I did finally file for divorce because he wouldn’t. And this site has helped me understand what really went on. But it still sucks and it still hurts and I mentioned to some degree it always will.

    • This. “Today I am home alone and my two cats think I am awesome.”

      My self-worth issues magically disappeared when he did. I’m lonely often these days. Weirdly, I wasn’t lonely the first year — I think I was so freaking relieved to be out of that mess, despite my heartbreak. Now that I’m beginning year two, the loneliness for a partner is kicking in. But like you said, at least I’m lonely and at peace.

  • “We just can’t seem to stay away from each other, can we,” he purred at me recently.

    Unfortunately, it was word for word the same thing he’d said in alluring emails to his first wife, long after they’d divorced and she was married to someone else.

    Also unfortunately, this time he said it to me just a few weeks after OW broke up and moved out of the house.

    So no, you’re wrong. We can stay away from each other. Right now, the farther, the better. I don’t care for how long. For all I care, we can stay away from each other until your bones have rotted into dust and blown away.

    Independence Day: you got THAT right.

    • In fact, if I could stuff H and all his lying and fakery into a bottle rocket and shoot it just once and finally over the open sea, I totally would.

      There. Now I feel better. Happy Independence Day, all!

      • I am now imagining every single chump doing the same thing at the same moment … and it would look just like the grand finale they always include at the end of the fireworks show!! Cheaters being exorcised in a blaze of glory!!!

  • Getting to “meh” is an organic process, and is the true independence when the emotional hooks that used to grab you have lost their barbs.

    The tincture of time looms large for me, I am four years out and have rebuilt my own circle of friends and life. Life is a lot quieter and stress-free not being married to a high energy charming self-centered narcissist. I heard through my kids that my ex-wife is with her family on a lake with the OM, news that three years ago would have rattled me for a day or so. What a pleasure to have it just cause a momentary dull thump and an eye roll. Thank goodness for forgetting.

    • When the kids slip and say mom dad is just not happy on the rare occasions they even talk to him. I just shrug and say well he got what he wanted not my circus not my monkeys. And i dont care my children he fired me from that job.

    • Chumpion, You give me hope! Emotional hooks…working on dodging these. ?

      • Believe me, I have gotten pretty delicious schadenfreude doses of news about the ex (not my problem any more) and news of her various triumphs, etc (a moment of pondering the cryptic ways of karma, then moving on)

        MamaBto3, one of the key messages of this forum is that it gets better and it’s true. The path there is the worst thing I have gone through. The ex of my ex’s OM is just emerging from boomeranging with him for the last four years. She has reached out to me, is in an understandably raw place, and I can only listen to her and somehow convince her she will get through this too.

        • You’re good to help your X’s OM’s ex; send her here & we’ll welcome her.

        • This is what has been helping me. Was married 30 years. I am 4 years out from D-day and 2 years out from divorce. Ex narc married coworker immediately. Since, I have been building my own friendships that are with authentic people and getting to know who I am (married narc at 19). This has helped my direction towards “meh” critically. I still feel lonely for a partner at times but holding still, getting to know myself and having a lovely friend base really lets the lonely pass quickly.

          When my brother asked me how life was lately, I said it was good, maybe a little dull at times, but good. He laughed and said that’s probably because your normal with the narc has always been extreme chaos, so real normal must feel a bit slow to you. I took that to heart and when things feel a bit dull, I laugh and think, wow I am experiencing calm, normal life and relax!

          Recently ex narc texted adult daughter happy birthday, she laughed when she told me about it since her birthday was 6 MONTHS AGO but he got the day correct! and he had managed to text her on her real birthday too. I explained he must have mixed his dates because it was his relatives birthday that day. We had a good laugh over it. He seems to be unraveling a bit. What was even better was it didn’t bother me hearing about him. I am getting closer to “meh”…hugs to the newbies…Happy Independence Day everyone!

  • A few months after i caught them, I was treated to a lunch by a BFF of the OW, who said, “You have to understand, she LOVES her husband.” So fucking what? “They aren’t going to leave their spouses!” Oh, well, then it’s all fine. They can LOVE their husbands and wives as much as they want to — which apparently isn’t enough to keep from hurting them for their own ego stroking.

    • It took me awhile to figure out the truth when someone says a cheater loves their spouse. The answer is simply, “No they don’t.”

      • My endless fear was that my nowdeadhusband didnt love me. He said he loved me, he provided some creature comforts that might trick a person into seeing it as “love” but his attitude and anger and overall demeanor never said “love” so I was forever living a contradiction that left me uncertain and uneasy.

        It is almost a relief, after all that fear to simply say “Oh, he didnt love me”. Grab that one Chumps…face it, grieve it and then make good decisions for your life.

        • Unicornnomore facing the fact he never loved me was my way out. I never wanted to face that truth.

          Great Post

        • unicornnomore – Well said. Your post reminded me of earlier days and how crushed I was by the fear that he didn’t love me. (And can I just say — woohoo that I had to be reminded of that pain because I’d FORGOTTEN that I cared.)

          So for new chumps going through that … as CL has said, “It hurts like a motherfucker but the pain is finite.”

          I slowly began to realize that his definition of love was not the same as mine. Not even close.

          Now, like unicornnomore, I look back at his behavior, his attitude, his anger, and realize that wasn’t love at all. No doubt he was deeply attached to me, but that wasn’t love — not the way I define it or want it. He projected his FOO issues onto me and played them out. And now I’m working on why I let someone treat me like shit a lot of the time instead of telling him to take a hike.

          • Great post UNM. I would like to qualify it a tad: he loved me as much as he was able, until he didn’t anymore because sparkles was in the offing.
            The discard was absolutely horrific, WHAT on earth was I doing clinging on to that awful un-love year after year.
            But before then, he was doing his best. I am so glad that I have got to a place where I can feel compassion for a Wounded Child (ACA Big Red Book) – without any of the hooks biting.
            I am able to ask him how he is these days. He told me he was tired, miserable and deeply unhappy. After DDay I took on board my shortcomings, and have spent this time working on me and my relationship with my higher power. He went on to Soulmate2. Oops, she was nuts. Too bad! I did feel sorry for him, vaguely, but on the other hand, am scampering on to a newer and better life. I went back to college, finally overcame my obsessing with a growing sense of self, and built up a little business. Took up a new sport. There is a lot of beauty still in the world. It is still a great place to be.

            • You rock, Patsy! Congrats on your classes, new business, and healthy outlook on life.

              You’re right–they loved us to the extent they were able.

              • Bad news for me is that between his death (when I got nostalgic) and when I found a note he wrote himself “I never loved my wife”…during that time, I got a tattoo on my arm of something he wrote in an anniversary card “I love you” right there on my arm forever. Oddly enough…now that he is in Purgatory/Heaven, he likely does love me.

                Fun fact: Patsy and I have been internet friends for like 10 yrs

              • After i move getting a tattoo on my lower back of a phoenix. I leave asswipe to his fire and ashes.

              • The ironies never stop with these cheaters, do they Unicornnomore? Were you able to get the tattoo removed? And I do think that “they loved us to the extent they were able” is a pretty low bar (kind of like you “love” your new espresso machine).

                How fun that you and Patsy have been internet friends!

  • This exactly! After the divorce was final…he calls me to threaten me into staying quiet about his serial cheating to his new work and Facebook croonies (he really has no true friends) and says, “I never would have left you, I didn’t want the divorce, that was you! You quit on us!” To which I replied, “I had NO choice, you refused to stop cheating and lying…there was nothing to stay for!” But he still went back to that he would not ever
    have left me…big deal..I get to live a celebate life with a serial cheating, sociopathic, pathological liar…yippee for me! Gosh who wouldn’t want that. So very very entitled eh. He thought I should be thrilled to be his wife, the great one!

    • Jenpen…over here, nodding my head. Same story here. Took me nearly 25 years to say No more. This is tough but I know it will be worth it. So many good changes already.

  • I had an experience recently that changed me. I had plans with a family member I hadn’t seen in years to go to a special event. After a lot of chaotic planning, in which I had trouble getting firm decisions about anything, When he showed up two hours before the event, he was drunk. Falling down, crazy-talking, life threateningly drunk. Of course, it marred my enjoyment of the event and our little reunion, although I worked hard to stay in my own space and enjoy the event itself. It was 24 hours of chaos.

    In my head, I knew I did the right thing to leave my XH the alcohol and substance abuser (not a cheater, as far as I know, but a serial flirter when he was drunk, which was always when we went out). My therapist said so. My best friend said so. The mirror says so. I knew, intellectually, that I did the right thing. But until I relived, in one day, the hell of living with a substance abuser, I didn’t see what staying in that relationship for years and what living in a previous relationship with an alcoholic had cost me emotionally and psychologically–what it cost me to live with and enable a drunk. One day of dealing with it left me horrified to feel in my body and heart how I had spent years reasoning with the unreasonable, hoping where there was no hope, loving where the person I loved was preoccupied with his addictions. It’s been nearly 5 years since I walked away from my XH and I guess it took me that long to grow enough to be horrified at the life I lived and the abuse I had tolerated. And, to be fully honest. how I had wounded myself by staying in that situation. Because it wasn’t a “relationship” unless it counts when one person is “relating” and the other is doing his relating elsewhere.

    The truth is, we can never get the time back that we spend waiting for an addicted or disordered person to change, waiting for them to choose us instead of a bottle or a bottle of opiods or the AP. We can’t get that time back to spend it with ourselves in a peaceful house or a relaxed 4th of July picnic with the kids or building something new with a partner who is actually available to love us back.

    We can’t change anyone but ourselves. And I am more and more convinced of the importance of time away from the abuser and the abusive situation. Some of us have lived all our lives with people who are largely indifferent to or hostile to us as separate human beings with needs of our own. Some of us are lifetime codependents. We can’t heal if we cling to our emotional and physical connections to the abuser and the means of our self-wounding. Time can work miracles when we embrace “no contact” and concentrate on building the life we long for. So happy Independence Day. We all deserve one.

    • For some reason, I was able to post the above without being logged in but at least the initials are right…I might have some stub WordPress thing out there…but the above post is indeed mine. 🙂

      • And here I was wondering, “Who is this new insightful, eloquent poster LJ?”

        Two things resonated with me:
        “how I had wounded myself by staying in that situation. Because it wasn’t a “relationship” unless it counts when one person is “relating” and the other is doing his relating elsewhere.”


        “The truth is, we can never get the time back that we spend waiting for an addicted or disordered person to change,”

        The level of self-harm most of us engaged in to save a marriage, keep a family together, or convince ourselves we were doing all we could to help another person, is immeasurable. The ripple effects of the pain and the effort reverberate for years.

        We can’t gain back that time, but I hope it makes us all use our efforts and time more fruitfully than we would have otherwise (similar to procrastinating on a term paper, then having to work extra hard to make a deadline, and the extra adrenaline providing a boost to the quality and intensity of the final paper). Our lives can be more intense (in a positive way), and more productive, and more compassionate because of our new-found knowledge of who we are, what we want to be, and what it means to be in healthy relationships.

        • Do you have the power to fix that, Tempest, along with the Sword of Discipline? Not that it matters. I should just be more careful to check that I’m logged in. Everytime I clean the cookies I go through protracted log-out phase.

          I’m still processing all of this, but I suspect that we may have these epiphanies, if you will, as we get further out from the abusive situation. (Think I am abandoning the word “relationship.”) I was just amazed at the depth of loneliness I felt in just a few hours. My first therapist used to call what happened to me “falling into a hole in time,” in which you are back in that old emotional space. He taught me how to navigate back and process but it has been a long time since I had once of those and none since Jackass discarded me. And oh Hallelujah! Thank God for a cheater who just left and couldn’t handle the mask falling off. Have a great 4th Tempest!

          • Your wish is my command–fixed; you’re back to LovedaJackass (a moniker to which we can relate).

            Happy 4th to you, too, LaJ!

        • Tempest and Loved, great conversation.

          I am in a beautiful new apartment, surrounded by the things I love, and struggling to feel happy. I’ve been beating myself up about it but your words point in the right direction: for years I made myself smaller and smaller in order to cope with alcoholism and betrayal and just general shitty behavior.

          It takes TIME to change those self-destructive behaviors.

          Further, I’ve been beating myself up about all the ways I am a piece of shit – the clever trick of STBX was to point out my shortcomings that have a grain of truth – which is its own form of mindfuckery.

          • Roaring–did you club baby seals? Steal Halloween candy from toddlers (after you knocked them down)? Pull the wings off insects? Take over a country as dictator to commit genocide? No? Then let yourself off the hook. On the grand contiuum of “flaws that people have” I”m pretty sure that yours are heavily tilted to the “minor” side.

            Kudos on your beautiful new apartment!

      • LJ

        “In my head, I knew I did the right thing to leave my XH the alcohol and substance abuser (not a cheater, as far as I know, but a serial flirter when he was drunk, which was always when we went out). My therapist said so. My best friend said so. The mirror says so. I knew, intellectually, that I did the right thing. But until I relived, in one day, the hell of living with a substance abuser, I didn’t see what staying in that relationship for years and what living in a previous relationship with an alcoholic had cost me emotionally and psychologically–what it cost me to live with and enable a drunk. One day of dealing with it left me horrified to feel in my body and heart how I had spent years reasoning with the unreasonable, hoping where there was no hope, loving where the person I loved was preoccupied with his addictions. ”

        Very well said, every last word. I too reasoned with the unreasonable, hoped when there was no hope and loved when there was none. Repeatedly he wound say, ” no one but you has a problem with me.”

        In hindsight I should have trusted that sinking feeling in my gut every time I was with him. It wasn’t until the end that I realized this man, my husband, could not maintain a reciprocal relationship with anyone, not even his children. His addictions masked his calculated actions.

        • ugh–yes, that “sinking feeling in my gut every time I was with him.” Don’t miss that at all.

      • LAJ–wow, your post really resonated with me. It encompassed both my XH and POP. Brilliantly written, thanks.

        Here’s to a peaceful and enjoyable Fourth and future, everyone!

  • I’ve been hearing that the ex says I am the one who left the marriage, I am the one who gave up. You know what? It sure as shit was me who decided to end it. Why? Because he was obsessed with his girlfriend and couldn’t stop thinking about her, even though she did not leave her own husband for him. It’s been 13 months since I moved out, 4 months since the divorce. No contact is working, that life is starting to feel abstract, like it was someone else’s life. Happy Independence Day, MFers!!!!!!

    • Good for you being the one to leave the marriage (even if it was caused by things he did). That is known as EMPOWERMENT, and chumps deserve more of it.

  • The Evil One/EXH#2 never admitted to cheating, always denied it, so I never got that line, The only thing EXH#2 did suggest was that “even if we are serious with other people, I still want to get with you have some fun” —- puke.

    I was advised by a few people when he left to “let him get some strange” and then he’ll be back, NOPE. He did come back alright, but it wasn’t to stay, or be exclusive to me, he just wanted a piece of ass. Felt so good to reject him the way he had rejected me.

    Happy Independence Day, ChumpNation!!!!! This is my first true Independence Day cheater free, and I am enjoying my MEH-DOM!!!!!

  • Oh yes, the never ending ego! I know I’m sooo great, of course she’ll take me back! My refusal to take him back sparked the biggest temper tantrum in history. He honestly could not understand why he wasn’t getting his way. One of the biggest things that pissed him off was when I made the house mine by removing all evidence of him ever having been there. Guess I was supposed to keep a shrine to him. He tells anyone who will listen that I destroyed ALL his dreams. Never thought for a minute about my dreams that were killed. He truly believes he is the victim. At first I was mad when people would feel sorry for him and I would try to defend myself. Now if I hear that I say yes, I did destroy his dream of being able to fuck our best friends wife on my dime. Guess I’m a bitch? He is so pathetic.

    • Bravo! I like how you showed him with your actions about the consequences of his behavior. And I love your comeback answer, lol. There really is no disputing or feeling sorry for him after hearing that. You are mighty and he is truly pathetic.

  • “What makes you assume I WANT you to come back? You think you’re doing me some sort of favor?”

    You’re spot on with this Chumplady! The cheater is so sure we STILL want them, despite their cheating and their shitty behavior. They are so convinced that we’ll take them back no matter what, because in their minds, we desire them so much. I dumped my ex-bf because he confessed to his family friend that he wasn’t attracted to me at all but he was attracted to my lifestyle. And of course he denied ever saying this, but after I dumped him, he was still trying to move in with me while wanting to quit his job and have me take care of him. Imagine, me taking care of a grown ass 41 year old man. And after I dumped him, he was still telling me not to take my birth control pills and we should have a baby. I cut him off cold turkey, blocked him and went complete MIA.

    But just because I was nice to him and treated him with decency during our courtship, he thought I was dying to be with him and I so desired him, even after I dumped him. But it was then I realized how incredibly inflated his sense of self worth was and how much he overestimated my affections for him. He kept telling his family friend how much I loved him, when I was directly telling him and his family friend I DID NOT love him and didn’t want to have anything to do with him. Talk about needing a reality check and being psychotic.

  • Happy independence day! Independence from my cheater saved my life. She was the abandonment type so I can’t comment today.

    I will put in a plug for our Chicago Chump meet up on July 9th. Check out the meet up forum for details.


  • Love how they all think they are such a “prize”. I’ve gotten better prizes from the bottom of a Cracker Jack box.

  • I got the same crappy line,” I was not going to leave you and I choose you.” Directly followed by, “this is all your fault… Blah blah.” He is a clusterB entitled prick. July 3rd is the 26th anniversary. 34 years together on my part and zero on his. I was so hoping that I would get the word that the divorce had gone through and I could get my name back on the exact anniversary date. Being out of that hell is freedom.

    • Informal, “34 years together on my part and zero on his” – great way to frame this abusive situation.

      A great reminder to own what was true for us.

      I’m so sick of defending myself in my own brain.

      • Best way I found to get self-destructive thoughts out of my head was to blast some crazy-beat rock music and dance to it. For some reason, the Ramone’s “I want to be sedated” worked every time ; ).

        • I use rage against the machine at max volume. Works every time.

  • Mine created a narrative of moral superiority in that he told people, “Poor Renee. I tried to go home and let her see how much I regretted hurting her ‘that one time,’ but I hurt her more deeply than she could ever forgive. I really can’t blame her.” –Cheater O’Mine

    When I first figured out this little blame-shifting mind game I thought, “Oh, heck no. I’m going to make HIM file for divorce if he wants his Silicone Sidechick, but my kids were the ones who said, “he’s never going to change.” So–he keeps his narrative and we kept our sanity…actually we found it once we divorced him.

    Oh, and about “that one time”–he’s married to her now and all of Switzerland believes his narrative which matters less and less to me as time goes by because just as I couldn’t convince him to be faithful, I can’t convince them to be smart.

    We’re not divorced–we’re DELIVERED! Happy Independence Day to us ALL!

    • Renee–the “I regretted hurting him/her that eensy, weensy, one little time. He/she is so fragile he/she can’t forgive me. I feel soooooooo badly,” is in the Cheater Handbook, Chapter 5: Winning the Public Narrative, p. 125.

      • Tempest, this is why I left public life–or at least that public. The moment I learn someone is double-dipping on our friendships, they are OUT. He told me I can’t make people choose sides, but I do believe I can and I MUST. No contact means NO. CONTACT. This doesn’t make me an ‘unforgiving bitch’ (his words), it makes me healthy and whole and in the land of meh.

  • When I first discovered the ex’s affair and my gut instinct was to leave, I got what I now refer to as the “dangling rotting carrot” from him. He said, “maybe in a few years we can get back together, who knows.”

    I told him “No if we’re done, then we’re done for good.” That might have been a bit harsh because all of a sudden he wanted to reconcile and I fell for that shit.

    Of course I should’ve been grateful because “he chose me.” I didn’t know it was possible to be chosen when you’ve been married for 23+ years already but hey, I did the dance for the next three years.

    While we were going through the divorce he said “we’ll always be together” and other variations of the same bullshit. This time I played along, told him we’d always be friends, yada yada yada. Told him I’d always be there to help him, blah blah blah. Then we were divorced and in 2 months (the time it took to get everything squared away for the divorce) I went full no contact.

    At one point he told me that “one day I would wake up and realize how much I loved him.” I guess that was his version of “I’ll be sorry for letting him get away.” I’m still waiting for that day.

  • CS

    The grass was always greener and then he came back because I allows him to use me as plan B. He had it good. The last time i filed and followed through.

    After 2 years I’m finally happy with my life.. The earth he scorched was his own. Living the dream proved to be a disaster for him bathing in his own shit.
    I no longer care. I’m making plans for myself and celebrating Independence Day with two amazing chumps and friends. You always inspire me and I thank you for this.

    • I inspire you doingme??? Well back atcha! You have always inspired me as well.

  • I had the old chestnut “how long must I be punished?” And “why can’t I have a Friend?”

    My answer: “You aren’t being punished. I’ve already fired you. Now scram.”

    This was from a ex-boyfriend who would have become a cheating, sponge husband if I’d let him.

    • “Cheating sponge husband”, lol. That’s what I would have had too had I not dumped my ex. Well said.

      • Kellia,
        I knew this BF was a no-go when he was pretty good at getting my “half” of our travel expenses back before each trip. However, when he didn’t have “enough room on his credit card” on the last trip, I never saw a cent of the money back that I fronted.

        He was so easy to kick out…I even laughed at his rear wnd waddling off down my driveway. Soooo glad his f-buddy is still doing the pick me dance instead of me. He has been so persistent in trying to contact me that I had to block him on all social media, change my cell phone number and generally disappear from google for a prolonged period!

        • oh my god, I had to block my ex too from all social media and go MIA, he was relentless as well. They are parasitic bottom feeders. I feel bad for the next host he will latch onto, but he’s no longer my problem! And lol at the imagery of your ex’s sorry ass wadding off down your driveway. Woo!

        • I also want to add that good for you for seeing the signs and kicking him to the curb. I mean he has no qualms about asking for your share, but has no issues when it comes time for him to cough up his share. A lot of women would have made excuses, but good for you for recognizing he was a leech. I love the term sponge husband, lol. I will be borrowing this term for sure! :o)

      • POP (Predatory Opportunistic Parasite) was a cheating spongeing boyfriend. Ungrateful used me for everything bastard!

        • And POP, when I chastised him for his harem hound dogging, responded “well, I always come home, don’t I?”

          Well, yeah dumb ass as a matter of fact you did….you had to return my car, you had NOWHERE ELSE TO GO/STAY (because the harem ho’s were using him as much as he was using them), you have no money…..I was the ONLY thing you had.

          Such a prize. At least I never once did the pick me dance. Not once.

        • LOL @ POP. I like this term of songeing boyfriend or a sponge husband. Yes, me and my friends have that happen to them too, the spongeing phenomenon. I’m so glad you didn’t pick me dance. That’s great! And big friggin deal they always come home, like that’s something monumental or heroic to celebrate. It’s basic to come home and like you said, most of the time, it’s because they have no where else to go. Losers. Sponge losers that is.

  • 2nd time I caught her cybersexing 11-12 18-19 yr old losers( she 32) on my pc,in my home whilst I working to provide $ for all of what there was.No, finding 100’s porno level self action/posing pics & handful short solo 3-4 min. slutty wanking vids. wasn’t enough I read in 1 or 2 of the saved/printed chat logs what an ungrateful,selfish & self centred prick i was for making it all about me & besides she reckoned plenty guys would be rapt that there chicks were practicing being the filthy sluts for them for when they got home & expected them there to f*ck anyways !!!!!
    Aggghhhh the days of boners/dry retching/migranes/screming fits & much much next morning self doubt & forgiveness !!!!! OMG !!! back in bit got a lil’ vid 2 rewatch !!!!! Lol !!

    • Bob – what a nightmare.

      Before this Shit Show, I always wondered about how people found time in their lives to cheat, much less do all this depraved shit.

      Honestly, unless this had happened to me, I would have a hard time believing your story.


    • Omg Bob, that is just awful. And on top of the cheating, she painted you as the ungrateful one. wow. And with the advent of the internet, you’d be amazed at how people can find the time to carry out their dalliances with others. Before it was much harder, because they had to get dressed, drive somewhere, spend money. Now with the internet, they can cheat at the tip of their fingertips. Nothing surprises me anymore. I’m so glad you found out.

  • When I was foolish enough to take back my ex in bogus reconciliation, I paid dearly for my mistake. His emotional abuse slowly but steadily ramped up during those eight awful months. He continually attacked me that it was all MY fault that money was in short supply. He subtly and not-so-subtly warned me that if I didn’t “forgive” him and support his desire to be an actor, he would dump me for someone else.

    Here is a text I received from ex when I finally told him I was going ahead with divorce. It is extremely typical of the dozens of texts and emails he sent me. NOT ONCE did he accept responsibility for anything. It was constant blame of ME.

    “If you don’t correct your ways with me, you will just bring the same things into your next relationship. You are to be blamed for things you did, so why not accept it? U brush it off so lightly by saying you are not perfect and then shove almost all the blame on me… fair? You suspected me of having another relationship going, and bam, u threw in the towel. I am a wonderful man. I am loving, respectful, do anything to help others. I volunteer my time, I look at life very positively. I like bringing joy to the world and making people laugh. I enjoy family time, dinners, gardening, walks, vacations. I love giving gifts and hugs and kisses. I encourage people to be healthy and I am careful to instill good morals in my son.”

    BTW, I am about 99% sure he was still cheating the entire time during that “reconciliation.”

    • I didnt make enough money for asswipe, and since i handed my paycheck over every week and he decided where it was spent, no hair care, nails done or nice clothes for me i had no money to spend on my own but i never got the memos on that stuff you know the stuff i did wrong. Thrown in my face time and time again. Fucker. Suppose i should have had three jobs including mom, and his half business owner. Screw him hes very unhappy GOOD!

      • Me too! Me too!

        He was so resentful of the college loans I took on to pay for my daughter’s education at an Ivy League school (he’s a high school dropout) that I never bought anything new except underpants.


        To be fair, I love thrift stores and finding treasures.

        I splurged on make-up the weekend after D-day (where I learned that my marriage was a sham and that he had been spending $30k to buy a Filipina teenager and whack off to porn. Who pays $600 a night to masturbate? Isn’t that like buying dehydrated water?)

        $500 of primers.
        and liners.
        and brushes.
        and concealers.

        And the bank was not broken.

        • Yes indeed. My independance day is the day the closing on this house happens and i move hours away. I will never spend one more second in his company ever. FRIENDS (barf) ( like him i dont need. Im not real girly my daughter is but then i can have my feminine bedroom and the rest of my house the way i want without all his work shit cluttering the place up. Free free free! While healing from this will still take time i will not ever have to deal with the asswipe, cowardly lying bastard again. Just once i wanted a apology that HE hurt ME. Never gonna happen. Hes not sorry and he never will be. To deliberately hurt someone like this is cowardly. They are all cowards. My new life will be free from him his moaning and groaning and pointing out my faults still tries to correct my behavior. WTF? i have to play nice til closing then game over, ducks lined up, already blocked on social media, everything else to be blocked as well to zero contact. He cared nothing for hurting me why should i care about him. The kids know do not feed him info about me leave it brief and uninformative. My business is no longer his business. Thankfully my kids agree with me. I will never inquire about him to them. They deal with him when they wish and i dont want to know a thing and they will respect that uh, dad im not discussing mom with you. If he tries to get between me and the kids and put them in an uncomfortable position i know where he lives and he will get a scene of bibical proportions dont not screw with this mama bear! But yes he wants to stay close friends and date me, ha! Hahahahaha! What a delusional loser!

      • Ditto Kar marie! I got $20.00 per week from my paycheck…and cut my own hair and did my own nails…yep…bookkeepper for our business, full time job outside the home, mother, housekeeper, cook, and groundskeeper…yep…and I took the trash out – without being asked!

        Happy 4th Kar marie! I’m glad he’s not happy too! I have an inkling satan isn’t either…but I don’t care 🙂

        Jeep and Beau

        • Ah thank you jeeptess. I hope i get to meet you one day. Happy happy fourth! Big hugs!

          Karmarie and her dogs

          • We will get together! 🙂 ALL of us! What a hoot its gonna be!

            …we need a Chump Anthem! And a standard! CHUMP NATION ROCKS!

            • Maybe an alteration to twisted sisters were not gonna take it! I love that song! We will meet one day jeep i just know it.

              • PERFECT! I’m gonna look up the lyrics and see what I can do with your help!!! 😀

                Yes, we will meet and greet and dine and wine and laugh and love our INDEPENDENCE!!!!!

              • I so look forward to that. Dee sniders lyrics are damn near perfect maybe we add to it with some chump lyrics. Dee snider is a very nice standup guy, i saw twisted sister as a bar band several times before they were famous.

              • I am looking forward to it too! And Beau too! I hope it is soon!

                Those lyrics are perfect! …I wonder what the song is about? Is he a chump too?…or is it political? I just love it! The words are perfect!

            • I just looked at twisted sisters lyrics and they dont need a thing changed its perfect! That is my chump athem!

              We’re Not Gonna Take It”

              OH WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT


              OH WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT


              WE’RE RIGHT/YEAH
              WE’RE FREE/YEAH
              WE’LL FIGHT/YEAH
              YOU’LL SEE/YEAH

              OH WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT

              OH WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT
              NO WAY!

              WE’RE RIGHT/YEAH
              WE’RE FREE/YEAH
              WE’LL FIGHT/YEAH
              YOU’LL SEE/YEAH

              WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT

              WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT, NO!
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT

              JUST YOU TRY AND MAKE US
              WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              COME ON
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT
              WE’RE NOT GONNA TAKE IT
              A PLEDGE PIN
              NO, WE AIN’T GONNA TAKE IT
              OH YOU ON YOUR UNIFORM

              Twisted sister

    • OMG, Glad–if that doesn’t beg for a UBT translation, I don’t know what does.

      Here goes:
      “If you don’t correct your ways with me, you will just bring the same things into your next relationship”

      Like your compassion, and your patience, and your big heart. I, on the other hand, will take my same fuckitude into all future relationships (of which there will probably be none, because I am a l.o.s.e.r.)

      “U brush it off so lightly by saying you are not perfect and then shove almost all the blame on me… fair?”

      Aren’t I hip? I write like a 14 year old [“U” = “You” BTW]. U admit you’re not perfect, but you need to admit more you’re not perfect, even in the face of my perfidy (that was on my 7th grade spelling test).

      “I am loving, respectful, do anything to help others. I volunteer my time, I look at life very positively. I like bringing joy to the world and making people laugh… ”

      by posting dancing Yeti videos and convincing people I can write best-selling books about Yetis. Also the people at the Walgreens photo place said I made them laugh with my artistic dick-pix-in-feathers. So, ha! I bring joy to the world and you’re just a downer with your “responsibility” and “honesty” tripe. Sheesh. Killjoy.

      “I enjoy family time …(a), dinners, gardening, walks, vacations …(b) . I love giving gifts and hugs and kisses….(c).”

      Fill in the blanks:
      (a) with other people’s families
      (b) if you pay for the vacations so I don’t have to work a day in my life.
      (c) especially to strangers I’ve met on line or in public bathrooms after tapping my foot.

      • The mind fuckery and narcissism is so obvious now, but I admit, his constant blaming of me for the marriage’s demise, his insistence that it was all because I was too critical, too negative, a “bully” for not accepting him, his subtle threats that he would dump me if I didn’t shape up asap……. that stuff did a number on my head and still does to this day. I still struggle sometimes with thinking I’m a super-critical or negative person, even though I rationally know that I was never that bad to him… in fact, I was far too EASY on him and most of the time, didn’t even have a clue that he was fooling me.

        Still, when you combine some serious FOO dysfunction with low self esteem and lots of anxiety, then add in a 20 year marriage to a blazing narcissist who studied NLP and had his facade of Mr Wonderful honed to perfection, you are likely to end up with some lingering trauma and self doubt.

        • I agree; it takes a long time to overwrite the FOO + married-to-a-critical-narc tapes that run in our heads. Our default is to think, “I’m not _____ enough,” [fill in the blank with whatever mindfuckery you were subject to]. But we are enough.

        • GladIt’sOver, I feel you, girl. That was me, too. He was a total narcissist. Did all the narc things. This one came out when we were separated. From the beginning, I had told him, you will love me with passion and I will be number one. I deserve it. If you can’t do that, I will leave this marriage.” He got all mad and said, “I’m really bothered that you think you just deserve it. That’s entitlement without having to work for something.” Fuck. You. I DO deserve this, we all do. And I’m AMAZING so this is your loss, buddy. In the words of the great Madonna, from the great song “Living for Love,” I DESERVE THE BEST AND IT’S NOT YOU.

    • Gladitsover, he sounds wonderful. He loves giving gifts and hugs and kisses. And he’s looking out for you – pointing out that unless you become someone else, you’re just going to bring more people like him into your life.

      What a fucking idiot. Clueless fucking idiot.

      I am impressed that you recognize the narcissism there – sometimes it’s hard not to take this stuff personally.

      • He was actually diagnosed npd by a therapist. Too bad I didn’t really understand the implications of that at the time.

        But this text is extremely mild compared to others he sent me. And there were so many others…. a barrage of emails and texts blaming me for everything. Never a word about his cheating.

    • Glad, this is probably going to get lost down thread, but that line in your X’s note, “I like bringing joy to the world and making people laugh” is ironic, give the hysterical (and horrified) laughter some of his antics have produced here at CN.

  • @Glad–LOLLOLOLOL. When you start reading his text at “I am a wonderful man” to the end, I SWEAR it could be what guys write on their dating profiles! OMG, this is rather ‘coincidental’…

    I can’t get over how it is the same exact self aggrandizing ‘sales job’ (to a non-believing/highly skeptical audience).

    • LOL, Hesatthecurb, I had the same thought! Bet he copied and pasted that from his dating profile.

      And now I’ve got the Pina Colada song stuck in my head.

  • This is a timely post. I’ve really been struggling to feel my own power.

    STBX is a L O S E R who has made up a whole bag of pretzels with his logic and the ONLY people buying it are the people who

    A. have enabled him his whole life (e.g., his narc father who told daughter, after being fucked by STBX between the ages of six and fourteen, “Men have urges” )

    B. are drunks at the bar he frequents whom I have not met.

    The problem for me isn’t STBX, it’s a problem owning that I am fine and he is disordered. The Universe has made it so easy to see objectively:

    STBX = middle aged, high school drop out, fat, alcoholic, entitled, kinda dumb, sex addict, porn addict, Craigslist hookups addict, cheater, liar, financially irresponsible, boring

    Not sure why I am still, eight months out, still playing ‘pick me’ in my mind.

    It’s the need to defend and justify my life for the last twenty years. I feel violated. Like, I was just being myself and it wasn’t enough so STBX was justified in stepping out.

    Mind fuck. I wish I could just laugh it off.

    • Nonsense, Roaring. You do not need to justify your life; you chose honestly, if unwisely (like all of us). Ninety-five percent of the population would have found you an excellent wife; you chose one who was not “relationship material” (just like the rest of us). You couldn’t morph into a harem, you weren’t willing to give up your identity and life to worship at the foot of a disordered porn addict. THAT’s why he stepped out. He’d have done it to anyone. The mounting evidence is that serial cheating is caused by personality variables and poor impulse control–things a spouse has no control over.

      You do have power; you kicked the jackass to the curb, now time to kick him to the curb mentally, too. Easier said than done, I know, but write down the facts of his suckitude for tangible evidence every time you need it. He sucks; just need to fully convince yourself that he sucks.

      Big hugs!

      • Tempest, THANKS for writing this: “You couldn’t morph into a harem, you weren’t willing to give up your identity and life to worship at the foot of a disordered porn addict. THAT’s why he stepped out. He’d have done it to anyone.”

        That could have been The Entitled One too. Complaining I was never his “number one fan” despite his being a porn addict who’d answered sex ads, hired a hooker, and pursued other women while we were married. Yeah, you’re number 1, baby.

      • Tempest… thank you for your words today. I can remember looking at Mr. Sparkles across a pool at a July 4th party two years ago and thinking to myself, “How does he do it? How does he walk around and talk to people when he KNOWS he is cheating on me and destroying our family?” I just couldn’t reconcile it in my mind. And, now he is off with the OW being “that guy.” And the thing is, the ONLY difference between me and her is that I KNOW and she doesn’t… therefore, she is deigned worthy of his presence. His wife and children can pound sand.

        I don’t want him back (most days)… but I hate that he has someone else and I’m alone. There, I said it. Maybe if I say it more, I’ll believe it less over time.

        Blue day.

        • IcanalmostseetheMeh!, it’s hard but necessary to sit with that pain. Just feel it and feel it. Then it goes away.

          You’re doing great. You’re helping me today.

          I’m a little buzzed and reading and reading Chump Lady. I feel so alone IRL and yet so connected here. Without Chump Nation, I don’t know where I’d be or if I’d be.

          Thank you all so much.

        • You’re not alone–you have all of us here (which I know is not the same as having someone to go to a movie with, but try not reading CL for a week and I guarantee you’ll feel lonely. Even the friend-to-go-to-a-movie-with won’t understand your experiences like everyone here).

          That said, as you feel stronger, get out and have small conversations with people in the checkout line, then build up to attending some kind of group, or inviting someone you already know out for coffee (not necessarily the opposite sex–the end game is FRIENDS). Rebuilding decades of our life takes time, but since you’re now in control (and not the disordered fucktard to whom you were married), your life will be higher quality than before.

          And pay it forward. I went out for lunch with a fellow chump yesterday, and the chump complimented the waitress on her positive energy. This led to a warm discussion and metaphoric group hug that was validating all around. Life is made up of such moments.

          Hugs, ICSTM and BetterDays!

        • You will be fine eventually i know it hurts and will take a long time to heal. For me id rather live single in peace and contentment. I have dogs so im not alone. Ive shed 210 pounds of lying cheating vile asshole. The whore gets a known cheating bastard who cheats on her and lies and he get a clingy whiney ho who spreads herself for a married man both will do it to each other and neither cares who they hurt doing it. It will blow up it has four times so far, nasty bitch keeps trying to convince him that they belong together kismet fate. If you have to convince someone that you belong together its over. Me i move on to a safe distance and will enjoy my life. Eventually you will feel better more often. I still have days where i breakdown in tears i cry and get up and become more indifferent to that asswipe. He hates it and im loving it. My favorite expressions and i use them often, kool, wow, bummer and the famous whatever. Makes him furious! I give him exactly what he gave me. Big big hugs to you roaring wish i was there to give them in person. We are mighty!

        • Hi ICanAlmostSeeTheMeh 🙂

          I used to feel the same way…only not so much because I was alone but just because satan had so many women…(I still hadn’t got to ‘trust they suck’)…anyway… One day one of my new neighbors (I moved far away from satan) came over to sit on my back deck with me and enjoy a glass of sweet tea…he could tell I was terribly upset and asked me why and if he could help. I explained, kinda vaguely, and he said, ‘Jeep, you could do the same thing if you wanted…just go to any bar and start ‘sniffin asses’ and askin ‘ya wanna’? I’m sure you’d have em followin you home by the carloads. …a lot of guys just wanna get their dick wet.’

          …wha? …it took me a bit to interalize what he was sayin…

          …eventually I got it and…wow…

          So…don’t feel bad. Your x asshole will never, ever have a woman of your caliber in his life again, not for any extended period of time anyway. His crappy character will run em right back out the door in a hurry. No one wants to be with a loser, no one has the time to waste on a nowhere relationship. My neighbor said that to me and it made me stop and think about what I was hearing about these ‘women’ satan was runnin… he was discarding them almost as soon as he met em…and whinin at the kids, ‘I miss my wife, I miss my life, I even miss that stupid dog!’ …guess, sometimes, their life choices suck as much as they do 🙂 But! Not our circus! Not our monkey!!! We do not ever have to worry over them and their crappy character ever again 🙂

          Hang in there ICanAlmostSeeTheMeh! You got this! Its soooo much better here, alone, than worryin, wonderin and weepin over lying, cheating, cowardly LOSERS!!!!


          • Jeep you always have wise words. You are a pesca. An italian word for peach. My italian grandmother called me that. She said i was strong and firm like a peach but oh so sweet.

            • Kar marie I love that! Thank you! I’m gonna embroider that on one of the pillows I’m sewin! ‘One Hot Pesca Lives Here’ 🙂 Love it!!!!

              You are a Pesca too! x assholes will miss these Pesca’s! LOL!

          • Jeep, everything you wrote should be Chump gospel. Great perspective.

            • Thank you Roaring 🙂

              It is sad, but the truth. It is a long, hard road to clarity, but well worth the trip.

              We get ourselves back in the journey, trudging through the memories, climbin over the miseries, hacking through the dense undergrowth of lies and prickly deceptions…granted we arrive scraped and bloodied, but we arrive with our dignity intact, proudly wearing our hard won scars 🙂

              We are Mighty all along the road to meh!!!

  • BetterDays, “Yeah, you’re number 1, baby.”

    I think I need that tattooed on my arm.

    That’s it exactly – it is just ridiculous. Thank you for the laugh.

    Laughing is my favorite road to clarity. Think I’ll turn on some Sarah Silverman as it’s a cloudy, overcast day in the Pacific NW and perfect for creating some new holiday traditions (twenty years of niece’s birthday parties and fireworks – some of our most successful times – didn’t realize I’d feel so low again around a holiday. Valentine’s Day went off without a hitch. Triggers are funny.)

    • Roaring – yeah, like that tattoo.

      I must be a little south of you, cuz it’s a gorgeous day here in my part of the PNW for a great outdoor bbq and a super view of the fireworks – from my new deck! And, brave me – 28 ppl coming! woot

      The X – who???

      But then, I’m at meh. (I think)

  • Caught my ex with a secret cell phone and I never saw him again. He wouldn’t even come out of his lawyers office when I went there with my lawyer for a meeting. Forty years together, a son. And then he just disappeared. Hasn’t spoken to me for thirteen months except for one drunk call in January. What does it all mean?

    • LAF, maybe it’s just that he’s a tiny sliver away from being a Ted Bundy-like psychopath. I think you’ve dodged a YUUUUUGEE bullet.


      • That’s what everyone tells me but having a self pity day.

        • I think it’s total GUILT and he couldn’t look you in the eye.
          He couldn’t even go face to face with you with the attorney’s present? – He’s a big Coward too.

          I made mine face me and look me straight in the eye during my 4 minutes RANT I as allowed during meditation.
          The guy looked white and pasty and his eyes were really wide and I somehow got him to look me straight in the eye for those entire 240 seconds.

          I’ve been on a trial before and watched the victims do their angry victim stories when they are about to convict the guy. I thought, wow, after being kidnapped and raped, no wonder you are so angry and I’d never seen angry like that in my life. From women.
          Suddenly, that was me over the meditation table with 4 lawyers and him and I.

          I had no prep for it, and I hate speaking in groups – but did I ever get it out.
          No swearing aloud so I never crossed any rules – and he had to sit there and take it – his eyes getting bulgier and bulgier, like scared to death.
          I think he was totally embarrassed by al the lawyer witnesses listening to me about his deceit.

          This is during the process of negotiating well earned alimony money – so he had reason to be afraid.
          I had never felt so empowered in my life.

          We ended the meeting for a break, and he ran outside.
          My lawyer and I were watching him taking off down the sidewalk – obviously upset and his lawyer was chasing him.
          About 1/2 hr later they came in requesting another meeting before we went into the serious negotiations.

          I must say he took it all like a man. He apologized the ‘perfect’ way about how wrong he was and, I really don’t remember the rest.
          But, it calmed me down and I accepted his apology. That was all I ever wanted, not even his money. lolol – he had a smart lawyer to get him to do that, and I was much more amenable about settling.

          Meeting adjourned and we were officially divorced 3 hrs later.

          So, that’s my story and I kind of like how he became an animal trapped in his cage, just like he described himself when he was having his affair. I think it was his rock-bottom (he was a pretty honest guy up til then and I don’t think he expected my complete and utter rage).

          Oh, and I got a great settlement. His lawyer didn’t seem to want him to go to court.

        • You can’t understand it because you don’t know what your X is thinking. So all of this does’n’t make sense to you. But what if your husband had confided in someone and confessed he no longer wanted to be with you, wanted out of the marriage, I bet you his behavior would make a lot of sense to you if you heard this confession. It’s just that your X did not let you in on his real thoughts about you and your marriage. So you’re left out in the dark, not knowing what happened. But rest assured, if you got in your husband’s brain, you’d see he doesn’t want you and had checked out a long long time ago. He is just too cowardly to tell you what he’s thinking and feeling. Leaving you off kilter and not knowing where you stand.

    • Lostandfound – What a coward your X is. He can’t deal with the consequences and can’t be bothered, so he takes the ostrich- head in the sand approach. Are you sure he was really invested in your relationship during those 40 years together? He could have just been going through motions over the years, where he was with you out of convenience, habit and married for companionship, not really passion. And the drunk call means nothing. It could have been him acting out of habit, but nothing more, where his inhibitions were down and he dialed your number out of habit. But it seems your X had checked out of your marriage a long time ago and never bothered to tell you. Hence the reason it was so easy for him to just go MIA after 40 years.

    • Lostandfound, forget this stuff about “he was checked out and didn’t bother to tell you”. It sounds like this was less out of meanness or disregard than something more like an addiction or mental illness or some personal/professional failure he couldn’t take or face. Whatever it was, it wasn’t about you personally.

      I don’t believe people always leave out of meanness or selfishness. I’ve survived abandonment like this too. I don’t want to guess at or make up your guy’s story, but, I hope you do find out more as time goes on. Enough to set you at rest, at least. I hear you; it sounds like today is really hurting, and (((Hugs))) I hope it gets better for you.

      • * I should clarify: I don’t mean to imply that I’ve survived abandonment after 40 years of marriage. Just that I do know an abrupt unexplained and total disappearance is one of the worst crazy-making things that can happen to the person left behind.

        Have faith that someday you will know more of the truth and facts. In the meantime, trust in you, in the life that still loves and sustains you, and trust in your own counsel. I’m sorry this happened to you. It just was *not* at ALL your fault.

  • I just realized I’m having yet another peaceful holiday, which has been the norm in my new life. Before, The Entitled One got triggered on holidays — meaning he got angry, resentful, moody and threw a big ole wet blanket on everyone else’s fun.

    Instead, today, I’m hanging around the house with my kiddos. I’ve done a little yardwork. One of the kids made a solar oven and we ate smores from it. Later, we’re going to a barbecue at a friend’s.

    Happy Independence, CN!

  • Wow. I’ve been here for well over a year and still gain new insights. A huge part of the gaslighting for me were X’s high and mighty declarations that he would never divorce me, which I translated as he intended, meaning that he would never do anything to cause the need for us to divorce.

    After I moved out he begged me not to file, saying that we could live separately but remain married, like some couple out of a BBC historical drama, while he would nobly continue to support me in the style to which I’d become accustomed.

    When I rejected this offer and filed, suddenly I became the angry, crazy shrew he had to divorce for his own safety and mental health. The image management never ends . . .

    • Other Kat – ‘ A huge part of the gas lighting for me were X’s high and mighty declarations that he would never divorce me, which I translated as he intended, meaning that he would never do anything to cause the need for us to divorce.”

      Wow – this is pretty insightful.
      The last word a ‘happily married’ couple would EVER say is the word – D I V O R C E.
      Especially, when you’re contently married.

      It is a word below the belt and sounds like a HUGE RED FLAG.
      Oh, don’t worry – I won’t divorce YOU.
      Nice security.

      The D word didn’t come up in our marriage once until year 33.
      Cheating year and he was done.

      He was sure playing you and causing all sorts of insecurity.
      Happily married people usually never bring up the D word until everybody is in deep shit and trouble.
      It’s like ‘coloring’ the marriage relationship.
      (I have D over you if you don’t behave – whatever)

      It should be the last word said in a relationship when you are DONE.
      Not as a not-so-subtle Constant threat.

  • “I always come back to you” = “You’ll always be here for me”

    Variations include, “Just give me [x amount of time] and I will come back.” Also, “Maybe in a few years we can work it out again.” Or, “We can be friends. You’ll really like her. You have a lot in common.”

    • Yep heard them all and more. Standard booorrring cheaterspeak. With “friends” like them who need enemies and no thank you asswipe but i dont need to know whore face she and i have nothing in common im a kind human and shes a pod.

      • “I will always come back to you” – what was he emulating?
        The Last of the Mohicans?

  • When X said to me earnestly, “I never stopped loving you” on DDay, I found myself explaining basic human emotions to a man that had been on the planet for a half of a century. I was in the middle of telling him that if you love someone with your heart, there is no way you could possibly betray that person with lie after lie after lie, when I realized that “love” was just a word to him. It’s something he decided to do rather than his emotions compelled him to do. He told himself he loved me, but he never felt it.

    He said divorce never crossed his mind, as if he should just get to take a time out for two years to screw around and then when he was done, resume his life with me. That none of the cheating and lying and gas lighting should effect our lives going forward. He actually BELIEVED that. Talk about magical thinking.

    I cannot imagine being so deluded by your own thought process that the truth and reality never enters into your decision-making. Stunning.

    • If i were a writer i would write a book about pods and how to recognize them. Might save a lot of people grief.

      • Like Invasion of the Body Snatchers? I think you’re onto something. I’ve often felt that these empty, soulless freaks are of the same ilk.

        • Agree. But i think they are born pods. Alien creatures just might have a little more class. 🙂

      • Kar Marie – it’s stunning, isn’t it? They literally don’t have any spectrum of emotion. No depth at all.

        • No uneffing they sure dont. No conscious, no empathy, no remorse, no guilt, no sympathy, no emotion, no nothing. They just dont want to look bad to anyone. Asswipe had the look of like what? All innocent and shit. This happens all the time part of life, nothing lasts forever, blah, effing blah….. no big deal, so what. So i asked him a customer screwed you over, guy he knew forever, asswipe laid out the money, did the job, shelled out thousands to do said job, finished it, called the guy many times, guy hes known for years, one of his ummmm friends. When he finally gets a hold of the guy he says he changed his mind thanks anyway. Asswipe was livid, i mean foaming at the mouth, livid. I said to him, broke the contract? Made you lose thousands of dollars? Lied to you? Promised he would come pay? Yes he screamed. Now you know how i feel, screwed over, guy found someone else and neglected to tell asswipe. He screamed this is diffetent this is money!!!!! Different when it comes to cash, for everything else its cheatercard or podsa. Not human. He even treats the kids like a pod. Pods are so sad. Me and you we are not pods no chump pods. We are mighty!

          • “This is different! This is money!” OMG! That gave me douchebumps. And it completely sums up how these heartless pods go through life. It was eerie to me when I realized X’s emotional repertoire consisted of, say, four emotions: anger, self-pity, disdain, humiliation. They are all self-centered emotions. There was no joy, no happiness. When he laughed it sounded like a scream. They’re very good at imitating feelings though, aren’t they? It was shocking to realize I was married to a man who had the emotional depth of a mud puddle.

            • Emorional depth of a mud puddle. I like that. Asswipes less than that very stoic and close up and many many double standards along with do has i say not as i do. He has emotions, anger, rage, frustration. Loves to point out faults and correct peoples behavior. He was never like that before. When he was with whore juice he was always correcting her and her familys behavior you know to his image but told me her and her family are perfect and flawless. Uhuh! My most standard response to mostly anything he says. He cant and could never control me or the kids we laugh at him! The kids never go to him anymore not even to talk because they know hes not listening he never did but gets mad they come to me they are my kids ive all the time in the world for them no matter how old they get. Pods, just pods, im an awful writer but a good illustrator i really need some one to help me write a guide book on pods. I ramble too much.

  • I’m celebrating my 5th year of Independence from my dirtbag. Any Major Holiday spent with dirtbag revolved around his need for alcohol and drugs. Really hard to have a good time while keeping your eye on the drunken mess of a husband. 4 drunk driving’s but he still knew how to drive better then anyone. One 5 yr stint in Federal Prison for selling his pain meds. {but he does not have a problem} 10 yrs with no work history but considered himself the owner of everything I paid for. Able to open his throat and throw a 12 oz beer down in less then a minute. {makes me wonder how that went for him in prison} You wonder how they can bloat up their self importance with zero to work with. Oh, that’s right, he had me doing everything. Not no more. Now I do for myself only and life has improved 100%. Why carry a bag of dirt around when you don’t need to? Empty that bag and walk right over that dirt.

    Life is good on my Hobby farm. A man in my life who doesn’t have bad habits. My children and friends around the fire pit. A beautiful day in my area. Good food and drink and no babysitting a drunken dirtbag. Life is good. Happy Independence Day Chump Nation.

  • Absolutely great post. I don’t know how to get through to my chump friend. It is incredibly frustrating to watch her (for 2 years now) taking him back time after time. She has no self esteem left. He leaves for the OW. He comes back. She picks him up from the airport!!!! Like a puppy wagging her tail. A month later he leaves again. She’s heartbroken. He comes back. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

    • Can you gentlely lead her here or shes not ready yet? Sounds like she really is in a bad way.

      • She ‘loves’ the bastard. She’ll put up with anything to keep him. I pray she’s just not ready yet and will be one day. She is happy with any crumbs he throws at her.

        • Well she has you thankfully and we are here when she is in need. Sad we have to stand by helplessly when someone we care about is in pain. I hope she gets sick of it soon.

        • Tess – From what you describe, it’s not love, it’s major co-dependency. It seems she waiting for him to love her and waiting for love is not love. And everyone is exactly where they want to be. When she reaches her saturation point, she will come to her senses. Until then, she’s not ready.

  • I got the same from my XW. I can still hear her saying in a syrupy sweet voice the three times I threatened divorce: “But I always come back to you!” And you know what? I was in such a dark, desperate place at the time, I swallowed it like a dying, starving man. For eight months. Until I was more dying than starving. Then I carried through with the divorce. She was enraged. Still is, even as she is engaged to OM. Jesus, I was an idiot.

    • No david you are not an idiot. Just a chump like me. We want to believe so badly and it hurts so much. But you are not an idiot. You got out. Your free. Live well and be happy that will fix her ass. I believe the pods think we can survive without them. We can, we will, we do. Rock on!

    • David, them stating they always “come back” to us, is confession that they were with others, which makes them scum. I never understood why cheaters uttered that line, when it was a pure admission of their cheating. Also, if you “always” come back to me, means that you intend to continue straying, which is another admission. These cheaters are so incredibly dumb. And who cares if she’s enraged, you are the one who should be going nuclear on her ass, since she cheated on you and several times at that. you should laugh in her face next time she rages at you.

    • You’re not an idiot David. I felt like an idiot because I was flat out being told that he didn’t love me anymore and wasn’t coming back but occasionally he’d say things like “remember that trip we took and how we felt about each other?” Or do things like provide every excuse in the book for not filing for the divorce which is what HE said he wanted. Those things gave me stupid, foolish hope that he was coming around and was trying to be the husband I desperately wanted. In the end I felt utterly foolish and naive for thinking everything was going to work out even while having the truth slapped in my face day after day.

  • I would say that the posts anout ENTITLEMENT are the best on this website. Very clear!

  • I got a version of this. It was like “I think we’ll end up together even if we divorce or split up some day I think we’ll get back together”… This is one of the things that stuck with me that pushed me to want to split in spite of the great unicorn act with only a few minor mask slips over the past few years. She still had versions of this even after I told her it was one of the things she said right after getting caught that really bugged the hell out of me.. I think she still thought it would make me feel special. How sweet.. you f your coworkers, and treat me like crap.. but when I catch you, you’ll take me back. What a peach.

    CL really has her pulse on the things that are affecting us all and always seems to time it out perfectly. Like many here, I needed this article right now, as I need many of them as they pop up at the perfect time.

    Right when I start to question myself.. there’s a blog post that’s like “hey Raging, you’re not crazy, you’re in good company. Thanks CL. 🙂

  • I got some version of this. And at first when I discovered the affair and doing the pick me dance, I was hoping XH would come back to me. I think this is one of the reasons that XH started the affair: He didn’t think he was risking much, as he just assumed that I would be waiting/begging for him if his affair didn’t work out, so I was a pretty safe plan B. And he was right before I woke up and found CL (thank God). He even threatened me with divorce multiple times and I think was genuinely shocked when I filed first.

  • That is EXACTLY what I get!!!!! I used to be there for him, now I just don’t care. He comes back into the house on MY terms. He thought that he had won, but no longer. He now knows that I don’t divorce him solely for financial reasons. As to a relationship with him, that’s over. He says he’s trying to change but I know better and I’ve told him so. I’m no longer angry and, for the first time ever, he doesn’t have control over me. He comes into the house, fine, but he’s tolerated only and is well aware that he’s not welcome! He knows that I am very happy to file for divorce.

  • You are so right! Once they discover they can cheat and you don’t end the relationship, they just get bolder and nastier in their cheating. They really do believe they are so damn special that you won’t divorce them. Sorry, suckers, you should have listened when you got the first chance for redemption.

  • Unfortunately, this type of “I Come Back to You” thinking is what makes popular culture go round. Adversity builds love, blah blah blah. Wrong! Not when the adversity is created by one partner being an asshole, which is what it usually comes down to.

    I have a long string of relationships where I thought because the guy liked my looks and body, and the feelings I gave him between his legs, and came back for more, that was love. Wow, how stupid was I? Cheaters still function on that logic, as does the RIC.

  • Almost a year after I filed for divorce, this after 20 years of abuse and 3 DDays, my X decided to start stalking me. One day, right before the divorce was final, he saw me in a local grocer at 10 am, with a guy buying lamb chops. I was just starting to meet with this new guy, but not officially, we went shopping or to happy hour once and awhile. The lamb chop guy didn’t even know where I lived, but that didn’t stop X from confronting us in a crowded grocer, accusing us of adultery, telling the whole place that what he did was bad, but what I was doing was worse, I assume he meant divorcing him. And I assume he thought me meeting a guy to go shopping in broad daylight was much worse than him getting on a plane, flying to Miami, and going on a cruise with his girlfriend. Lamp chops are so risque’.

    The new guy took the whole crazy thing well, even when X followed us back to the parking lot where I had left my car, since I wouldn’t let new guy come to my house to pick me up. Crazy X was screaming and taking photos the whole time I put my groceries in my car, and then sent photos and a crazy text to our kids, my parents and his lawyer, saying I was with my new lover. It was so stupid, I didn’t even have to explain myself. The new guy wanted to know who my new lover was since it wasn’t him, haha. I was so impressed with how lamb chop guy handled himself, we are still together, but now officially.

  • Well my x official as of 3 weeks was living his double life for 8 months and when I caught him I kicked him out and immediately filed. He tells everyone now he was miserable for years and should have left me years ago. News flash coward wasn’t going anywhere. I had to figure it all out and file and he was still lying saying she is just his friend. He has been out of the house for 9 months now and spends every free minute with his “friend” . Our kids see him once week but in his eyes he is a great person and wonderful father. Pathetic!!!!

    • Supermom, it seems like they believe their lies. It’s like a child’s magical thinking, “If I just wish hard enough, maybe it will be true.”

      STBX, it turns out, lies about everything. Not an authentic bone in his body. He’s a master manipulator.

      Adolf Hitler is famously quoted, “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed” and STBX has essentially modeled his life after that principle.

      STBX is a sexual deviant. His personality is malleable – it changes to suit whoever he is with and generally people end up assuming that he understands them and sees things their way.

      I was always amazed that the people in our super-New Agey church never cottoned on to the fact that STBX is a Trump-voting, racist, homophobic conservative.

      Perhaps it’s easier to fool people who tend to see the best in you. I know I thought he was a good person until 8:14 p.m. on Wed., Oct. 14, 2015 (D-day).

      In fact, I thought I “knew” him and that this made our bond special – like we were in a club. Did not realize until after D-day that this is how most people feel about him.

      Yet he has no friends. These fucks really are disordered. I seem to have to realize that anew every single day.

      WTF was wrong with me? I’m mortified now by the terrible choices I made simply to have a “relationship” with him. I think I read on this site that ‘relationship’ isn’t the right word: ‘abusive situation’ instead.

      STBX is who he has always been.

      I’m the one who’s changing. THANK GOD.

      • My MIL, also a cheater, one time backed out of her driveway and hit a car, then drove off when she saw that her car wasn’t damaged, just the other persons car had a dent. My wife saw it happen. The person came over and asked if she saw anything later that day, and they both saw nothing. Eventually the story MIL told was how rude they were to come over and accuse her. I think she believes it, that she didn’t hit the car now.. she’s convinced herself that she wasn’t to blame.

        I’m sure if her car was damaged and she couldn’t pretend she didn’t hit the car, it would have been the parked cars fault for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It probably deserved to be hit..

        A chump would have left a note and paid to fix the persons car.

  • I didn’t get the “I always come back to you” statement it was the “I never meant hurt you” gem. Well, isn’t that so very kind of him? By D-Day number 2 we were separated but divorce wasn’t a conversation we had had which is why I thought we still had a chance and why the second D-Day was so devastating to me. If he was done with the marriage it was a complete shock to me since he was over to the house three and four times a week, spending holidays and taking vacations together. If it was okay for him to have another woman in his bed why did he have to hide it and lie about it when I discovered the evidence?

    I do have some friends that have told me that if a person cheats there is something wrong in the marriage. Really? You think? Maybe what’s wrong is that the spouse doing the cheating has some significant character flaws and self-control issues. Yes, I really wish I could “just get it over it” so that I can move on with my life without the nightmares, panic attacks and feelings of being unwanted and undesirable. If it were that easy, I would have divorced him before D-Day number 2 could even occur. But I’m a chump and unfortunately, I wasn’t able to just turn off my feelings the way he can any time those feelings become inconvenient to him. If he was really done with the marriage he would have divorced me. Period. Instead, he’s left that piece of unpleasant business for me to handle. How very kind of him AGAIN to give me all of the responsibility (and blame). If he really didn’t see me as his wife anymore why did he need all those cheating apps on his phone? Why go through the charade and expense of “hiding it” with an Ashley Madison account if he felt he was entitled to go off and do whatever he pleased? Those aren’t the actions of a rational human being.

    “I never meant to hurt you” translates to “I never expected you to find out and I have no intention of discontinuing the thing that hurts you.” When actions don’t match up to someone’s words, that’s a huge red flag. If you didn’t mean to cause me any pain you wouldn’t have played the hide the pickle with someone else’s fiancée. He wants to stay friends who needs friends like that? He should take is friendship offer and stick it where the sun doesn’t shine. Or perhaps he should just get over it.

  • “I’ll always come back to you.”

    Reminds me of a Big Black song – Bad Penny

    I’m just a bad penny. I’ll always come back to you… I think I fucked your girlfriend once, or maybe twice. I don’t remember. And then I fucked all your friend’s girlfriends – and now they hate you.

    • Housechump, BIG BLACK!?! Good one!

      I also had DEVO “Gut Feeling” on replay for a long while.

      CN has some awesome musical tastes!

  • Its so screwy that so many of the CheaterNation share the mindmeld …are they the borg? are they Vulcans? My cheaterP told me that he was just going to continue his affair (but he was mad about me calling his relationship with a married Schmoop an affair) and eventually “we’d get back together, because he always chose me.” WTF? I wonder if he ever told the Schmoop that he always chose his wife, in the long run….I’m betting not.

  • OMG! This column exactly fits the song Bad Penny, by 80’s punk band Big Black. Here is a link to the song. The lyrics aren’t as vulgar as the album cover, except as they speak to the vulgarity of cheating.

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