The Stupid Things Affair Partners Say
The Friday Challenge is stupid things affair partners say. Do you have a doozie? Share it. You’re probably not alone.
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What stupid thing has an affair partners said to you?
Some chumps have had the misfortune of having direct communication with the Schmoopies. Even more had the nauseating experience of reading the soul mate texts and emails. And some of us have even walked in on the bozos.
But sometimes the pick me dance is direct and in your face.
I’m sorry you don’t fully appreciate Nigel, but she does.
I think this might be the best thing for you. You’ll be happier in the end!
Under different circumstances we could be friends! (Too bad you’re a bitter harridan.)
Have they commented on your parenting? Your looks? Offered advice? Insults?
I mean, they’re f*cking your partner, so it’s almost as if they knew you.
So, CN, lay your stupid sh*t affair partners say on me.
TGIF!
This is the topic of an upcoming podcast. We love your voicemails! Leave one at http://www.speakpipe.com/chumplady
She told me when I met her (the once) “Monogamy is a patriarchal construct” (after an 18 month secret affair with my then husband where I thought I was paranoid). She was very into the book Ethical Slut but didn’t follow its rules at all such as “open” relationships should be honest and there should be discussion about prevention of STIs. Fortunately I didn’t catch any but she apparently thought I was OTT for getting tested for same, completely ignoring science especially latest research on rates for STIs increasing in older population.
Mine used that book too! She had the same fundamental takeaways-completely ignored the parts about consent and communication. I was very relieved when my tests came back clean as well. I was not in the slightest surprised when it was apparently a favorite of Epstein’s.
That’s not merely trying to make the narrative fit- that’s her trying to metaphorically crowbar herself into a size 8 when she’s actually a 12 with buttons and zips busting.
What an idiot.
I’ve gone into this spiel before but maybe it will be interesting to newbies:
The “monogamy is an unnatural construct” view seems to often come along with arguments that we’re more closely related to bonobos than chimps which doesn’t really make sense from a carbon dating or historical perspective (human’s warring history and patriarchal tendencies are an exact match for chimpanzee behavior). It’s also kind of moot since chimpanzees are also nonmonogamous so aligning with bonobos isn’t necessary to argue for “natural nonmonogamy.” But I think “monogamy is unnatural” proponents find the association with bonobos far more flattering since bonobos are groovier, more egalitarian and more peaceful than regular chimps so any argument to “return to nature” sounds more positive if we were “returning” to a “bonobo-like state” rather than a cannibalistic, warring, rapey, infanticidal “chimp-like state.”
It sounds more like PR than science. In any case, the “monogamy is unnatural in humans” view isn’t unchallenged. Evolutionary scientist and Jane Goodall successor Richard Wrangham hypothesized that early humans required an extremely intense motivation to make the very difficult leap to spoken language. He argues that the most likely driver was “keeping tabs” on mates through gossip, especially during times of temporary separation where one party would go off to hunt for extended periods. When they’d come back, they’d want to know if their mates were voluntarily messing around with anyone else which requires a lot more than gestures and grunts to communicate clearly (specificity was probably important to cut down on unnecessary inter-tribal violence and collateral murder).
What it suggests is that humans probably evolved to be at least “hypocritically monogamous,” meaning that, even if some individuals don’t plan to sexually limit themselves to one partner, almost everyone prefers that their primary partners remain faithful.
I think it makes sense because the “seeds” of this kind of sexual possessiveness exist even in the social behavior of regular chimpanzees which are relatively unchanged from our common ape ancestor (because chimps are among the slowest-evolving mammals on earth, unlike humans who are among the fastest evolving). While female chimps tend to be pretty unselective in who they mate with, male chimps typically become agitated watching other males mate, can become extremely aggressive, even lethal, if a particular female that they’re sexually targeting resists or has sex with other males.
Like among humans where sexual jealousy is the most common motive in male-on-male murder, most inter-troop violence and all chimp “war” with outside troops is about sexual competition and control. Males also typically engage in coercive campaigns in order to keep certain females available to them, at least as long as the male is interested in that particular female.
Elsewhere Wrangham discusses how human’s larger brains evolved at the cost of vastly weaker immune systems compared to chimps (who, again, appear to be largely unchanged from our common ape ancestors). In other words, humans’ weakened disease resistance and susceptibility to STDs might have moved our species away from “poly” practices and towards some form of monogamy.
Schmoopie is either a moron and drinking the cool aid or she’s a low level dweller glumming onto this “monogamy is a patriarchal construct” to justify her unethical behaviour. To my understanding, monogamy was socially created to stop the “patriarchy” from ditching their families in search of new snatch. Your ex was literally being patriarchal by banging her, the side piece. Ethical sl**? I’m sure the patriarchy appreciates slu**ery in any way it comes. Whatever gets them their rocks off.
As if people are forced on penalty of death to enter into agreements like marriages because of patriarchal social constructs…
It’s a bad idea to enter into any agreement with those who do not keep or respect them…..
Yeah, I got the let’s be “monogamish” speech from him that I knew came from the whore, along with “ethical non monogamy” but I never spoke to her. EVER.
Schmoopie is either a moron and drinking the cool aid or she’s a low level dweller glumming onto this “monogamy is a patriarchal construct” to justify her unethical behaviour. To my understanding, monogamy was socially created to stop the “patriarchy” from ditching their families in search of new snatch. Your ex was literally exhibiting patriarchal behaviour!
She wasn’t conspiring in your abuse, she was fighting patriarchy. Yeah, that sounds so much more noble.
During the pick me phase, I was continually asking if was having an affair with Howorker, which he denied. When he finally was outed by his own missent text to me and our two children, everything came tumbling out.
In almost the same sentence he basically said, “She’s my soulmate……..I wouldn’t have thought of her if you hadn’t suggested her.” I honestly almost laughed out loud. It really snapped something inside me to realize, she wasn’t special, he wasn’t special, and it could have been any orifice that he wanted to monkey branch me with. That was March 2018 and I have spoken with him since, despite his hoover attempts. I am FREE!
Unfortunately, this wasn’t his first extra-marital rodeo…….but it would be the last! He kicked me to the curb, racing out the door to marry her soon after. He looks like shit, my son barely has a relationship with him, and I am living my best life travelling multiple times with my children all over the world. Time and space made me realize I was an excellent wife appliance for 25 years–doing a job so well, I’m sure my Ex had no idea what value I provided. Indeed, he actually said to me out the door, “You bring me no value”. Another almost laugh out loud moment.
I’m having the last laugh!
“You bring me no value”. Huh. My reply back might have been “and you bring me only skanks & std’s”. Just know that only someone who is surface scum would say that to their wife or husband.
“You bring me no value”. Huh. My reply back might have been “and you bring me only skanks & std’s”. Just know that only someone who is surface scum would say that to you.
It should say “I have NOT spoken with him since” 2018.”
No contact has been my path to peace.
Ugh I wish I could go no contact. We share two kids and the youngest is only 7…
I share your pain. I have two kids with my FW. Eldest (13) wants nothing to do with him but youngest is also 7 and spends every other weekend with him.
Although I too yearn for a zero contact life, I’m as low contact as humanly possible. I only answer messages directly related to him picking her up or dropping her off and only with as few words as possible (usually yes/no/ok). At drop offs/picks ups I don’t even see him. Just open the front door so she can come in or out. He doesn’t deserve a single second of my time or energy.
He cannot stand that I refuse to communicate with him. He thinks I’m being immature and am hurting the children. But for me, it’s the only possible way in order to maintain my mental health.
I’m 8 months post discovery and 95% of the time now I feel good – even daring to be optimistic about an unknown future. But when I am forced to have any contact with him it brings me right down.
Stay strong… In about 10 years, we will be able to go full NC (I know, it sucks – some murderers serve less time).
Thank you for the encouragement ❤️
I try to do the same, gray rocking him as much as I can. He has been starting to complain about money though and then it is hard to give one word answers, but I try to be as neutral as possible. He doesn’t, though. My folder with screenshots of his dumb statements (like telling me the name of his new gf even though we are still legally married and he only moved out 5 weeks ago 🤦🏻♀️) is getting larger by the week 😅
You can- is there anyone else who can drop them and pick them up or answer the door for you?
I didn’t see my first husband at all because I refused to pretend or share space with my abuser.
My parents were my middle men.
Nope, no one unfortunately. My parents both live in other countries and all my good friends don’t live in the same town as me. I don’t have any family here. I have been gray rocking him, though and that does help. Also: he found new supply a few weeks after we started divorce proceedings so he has been focused on that. I am currently discarded and honestly, I hope it stays that way.
It wasn’t the AP, but this absolutely kills me — my cheating spouse said to me, “You are the worst person to have an affair on!”. Like there’s other people that are better to have an affair on???
Half the time, I laugh about it and half the time I think WTF were you thinking when you said that!?
Oh yes, the best person to have an affair on would probably be someone who:
-never asks questions
-believes every lie and pity party
-takes all the blame for everything from not being as “open” as the AP, to adding one shake too many of salt to the steak (or not enough)
-allows cheater to sleep around as much as they want while silently maintaining the household and paying all their bills with no resistance
-allows the cheater to divorce at their leisure and never asks for pesky things like child support or split assets…
-doesn’t ever bother cheater with annoyances like human emotions or needs.
Basically the cheater’s version of a unicorn. Maybe something even more rare. The Chumpicorn.
Apparently you didn’t provide him with an “excuse” to cheat on you.
Her:)
I thought we were friends. I didn’t realize her plan to undermine my marriage. When it all blew up, she told me ‘You won’. I was like, what did I win? I didn’t even know I was in a competition.
His stripper girlfriend (now ex wife #2) called me and scolded me for not making my adult children have a relationship with their dad. I laughed and told her that I wasn’t taking parenting lectures from a woman who lost custody of her own children because of her rampant drug addiction. I didn’t hear from her again until years later when she IM’d me and wanted my support because he was divorcing her and leaving her without any financial resources. I wished her luck but declined to get involved. Not my monkeys, not my circus. #mehismyhappyplace
You handled this well!
I had no custody issues (older kids), but my therapist strongly suggested that I NOT engage with any woman involved at any time with my husband/ex as there could be blowback. She said to say something like, “That’s rough, but we’re all adults here. You’re going to have to figure this out on your own. Have a good day!”
My ex, who had only requested one visit in almost a year, called tween one day and asked him to meet the woman in his life the next day by phone. He said to keep it a secret. Tween, who knew cheater had already been catfished in an online romance scam, asked cheater if he had confirmed in person that this was a real woman. Cheater assured him he had and they were seriously dating.
As planned, the woman got on the call the next day and told tween she’d seen pictures of him, and knew they’d be a wonderful family together. Cheater chimed in and claimed they were going to move into the marital home and kick me out.
That was, I believe, on a Thursday.
That weekend, she dumped cheater.
How stupid and cruel of her to say this to a child. The same, only more so, for him. Up to then, during the nine months of our separation, he’d already introduced three other women to friends as his “life partner.” That was after I discovered he was sending thousands of dollars weekly to a different woman he’d planned to marry (presumably after ending our marriage of over 30 years), and I proved it was an online romance scam.
When tween told me this, and her unique, unusual name I checked cheater’s electronic calendar. He left it on “share” during separation, probably to flaunt all his dates, with their names and the expensive restaurants and resorts where he took them.
He’s been with another “life partner” until about a month before. The first time the exotically-named woman showed up in his calendar was a few days before he called tween, when he took her to the first of four or five nights of expensive dinners. While I don’t know when they first communicated, their in-person romance lasted only a week. He told mutual friends he was devastated by the loss of “the love of his life.”
That was what he also said about the catfisher. In their emails that I discovered, he illegally shared my medical history, and stupidly gave out info about tween. A few times, the catfisher randomly asked how we were. Cheater claimed it was “proof” that she cared about us and was a compassionate woman.
He sounds like a desperate loser. Sorry, not sorry.
I agree he was desperate to find another partner. He told friends that I was unreasonably jealous that he was sending financial advice to an online colleague, but I had 500 pages of his emails plus bank and other receipts proving this was a stranger he met on a dating site.
He’s been emailing a couple who sided with me and cut him off years ago.(They don’t reply.) They were at a community event and saw that he was out with a woman they know. He wrote to chastise them for avoiding him when he’s out her, and told them they should greet him with warmth so things won’t be awkward for everyone!
That’s really low of your ex!
I had very few interfaces with the main OW. She was at my Cheaters retirement ceremony (with a fake date)…she shook my hand when we were introduced and later I called her to tell her to get out of my marriage and I dont remember her saying anything.
Cheater told me that she saw one of her roles as “teaching him to love Unicornomore”. Well there you all go. We all need a howorker to teach our spouses how to love us – how could I have missed that?
OMG, that’s very similar to how my exFW told me that he “went to strippers to get AP out of his mind”. What in the actual hell?
The bs that comes out of cheater’s mouths. So stupid you’ve just got to laugh😂
There were so many. Two:
“You contributed nothing to my life.” We were married 27+ years, had two older kids that I had homeschooled PK-12, and he had a plethora of medical problems that I had walked with him through. I even saved his life several times (former EMT).
“If I cheat during separation, it is completely your fault.” He was the one who packed up and chose to go to another state during the final separation. And trust me, I wouldn’t be the one there to take off his pants. He is a man who can control himself, not an animal.
He got so much free medical care out of you that you should have sent him an invoice along with the divorce
If we had gone to trial, my attorney was going to make all the free medical assistance and homeschooling our kids for free a centerpoint. I basically gave our kids a private school education. They were academic superstars in college. I brought in all kinds of documentation that my attorney added to my file.
But he admitted that the judges in the metropolitan area had gotten stuck in their ways, going 50/50 with no alimony if the spouse could earn 150% of the poverty line. That concerned me. So much money and time involved to go to trial with an uncertain outcome!
So I told him to get it settled with 50/50, and I’d move on. And eventually, we did, but not without a lot of drama.
Mine couldn’t (wouldn’t) control himself either. I initiallly suggested separation and him getting professional help. He was so happy and cried. Three days later he came back and was like: Yea this ain’t gonna work. Let’s just divorce because I can’t abstain for that long. The separation hadn’t even started yet. Boy, I am so glad now that he did this. One more month and our divorce should be final.
Yes, such craziness to think that a human being cannot possibly control themselves around potential affair partners.
I have an adult son who has repeatedly watched this sort of thing going on with his coworkers, and he finds it utterly disgusting. Thankfully, he processed the message from me, not his dad.
Mine didn’t even have an affair partner. It was escorts for a decade. Just at the very very end he met someone from a dating app because that was more cost-efficient 🙃
I am glad to hear that your adult son realizes how horrible this type of behavior is!
Yes, believe me, I’d be so upset if my son picked up that garbage from his dad. That alone would be a reason to put some distance there for me. But for various reasons, they were not very close.
When I went no contact during the divorce process, so did they. So there was a break there. Not that I’m a perfect parent, but I was way more sane about the whole thing than their dad was. Past the first few months, I didn’t badmouth their dad and let things fall as they may. I put them in charge of whether they had a relationship with their dad or not. They were in college, so it wasn’t my call.
You’re a terrible mother. Why don’t you go take a yoga class? This from someone who never raised a child. (And I probably don’t need to say this here, but my kid–a young adult now–turned out to be a wonderful person.)
Schmoopie sent me messages through FB (now forever blocked) because I never answer the phone unless you’re family or friend, and obviously Schmoopie doesn’t qualify as either. She wrote something to the effect of asking me to free my husband so he could “love again”. Barf. And some other stupid sh**. Reminded me of a something a middle school girl would do. My lawyer’s letter to her afterwards was not a teenage girl’s response back so I haven’t heard a peep from her since.
I heard from the AP once. She was mad at him and sent me a message that I have always suspected was sent because she questioned whether I actually KNEW he was cheating.
One of the things she said was “he cheated on me too”.
He insisted that she meant with ME, that by being with his wife, he was cheating on her. Which is RIDICULOUS. But I think she may have meant he cheated on her with another AP. I have no clues or confessions of there being others, but he’s a FW and we were married decades before D-Day. Logic says there likely had been others.
He also liked to say that they were on and off, as if cheating for years is ok as long as you take long breaks. And he’d reference “when we were broken up”. It was always so hard for me to wrap my head around my husband saying he was broken up from his gf. I wanted to scream, “You can’t BREAK UP with a gf, you are married.” Just like I wanted to tell her “No, he didn’t cheat on YOU. I am his wife. He is cheating on ME. “
I’m 8+ years past D-Day and well into meh but still chuckle at the time the OW stepped in after the death of my children’s hamster. On D-Day, OW was a part-time exotic dancer and part-time student studying (you can’t make this up), Marriage, Family and Children’s therapy. Nearly nine years later, FW and OW are still together but neither has access to my minor children. Still, she heard that their hamster perished, as hamsters do, and she had several grief textbooks she no longer needed sent to my house with a note that it’s very important to be present for my kids because any loss is a form of trauma and requires care and sensitivity. I suppose lying about her name when FW hired her as the babysitter, living in our roof, engaging in PDA with their father, and then his leaving the family for her doesn’t quite rise to the level of a hamster crossing the rainbow bridge because the possibility of that leading to trauma never entered her mind. I contemplated returning the books, but I was already well on the way to Tuesday and donated them to Goodwill and took the tax deduction.
So mighty!
The absolute gall of these people!
As we say where I live: “They ain’t right in the head.”
Not Schmoopie, but my ex said, “Lying is an instinct. I want to be with someone for whom honesty isn’t as important.”
Wonder if that gem made it into their wedding vows?
“It was just chatting.”
“It was a game!”
“She IS a good person”
“I was so angry about losing my job, I was really doing it to protect you and the kids.”
“I didn’t enjoy one second of it.”
“I’m not willing to give my wife what she needs to be happy.”
“It was revenge for you making me lose my job.”
And the best one…
“You should have kept control of me and my behavior!”
My XHCs AP lived with him for 5 years, then they got married in Vegas and are in wedded bliss now 20 plus years. For the next 18 years,AP would answer the phone.Helll ow? And I’d say, put on XHC. She’d hand over the phone.
Not one time did I have a conversation with her on those calls. I am unable to speak with simple, cotton candy people who used to call me while i was pregnant and still married and yelll..WHERE IS HE???..but my XHC has done well with that. So I’ve had 18 years of bare minimum contact which has kept my mental health in a steadier place. My #2XHC had wild APs all over. I’m grateful I knew none of them.
Although I never spoke directly to the coworkerwhore, some of the crazy things HE said came directly from her like this: “She said our ‘soul contract’ is over” “She doesn’t want me to stay married” at the same time, “She said she hopes WE get our spark back.” “She’s praying for us” , “She doesn’t want me to talk to you anymore” and I could go on and on. This is how insane he was, to end a 30 yr marriage for someone like that. Their situationship didn’t last long cos she’s violent, prob bipolar and histrionic too, but I’m 100% no contact so I have no idea who he’s now being manipulated by.
I’m sure this is pretty standard but schmoopie said to me “You’re ruining my life”
And complained to my FW that she felt “unsafe”
My FW left me (and our 3 kids, the youngest of whom had just turned 1) for his Schmoopie about 12 years ago. They’re still together, and have been together longer than our relationship lasted. Of course they think that this makes them fated in the stars – but they must realize how shameful the circumstances of their meeting are, because they tell people that they’ve been together for only 10 years. I recently had the misfortune to see the “getting to know you” article where she was profiled in the newsletter for the company where they work. It says that Schmoopie and her “partner met at work and bonded over a love of beer, BBQ, card games, and travel”. Of course, I don’t expect a company newsletter to publish that they bonded over a love of cucking her husband (who she married while already cheating), gaslighting his wife, blowing up two families, and leaving 3 kids fatherless” – but it was amusing nonetheless to see that this is how they view themselves and their Epic Love Story.
That reminds me of back when I was still following FW and AP on social media and someone was asking how they met and likewise they told this sweet story about meeting at work and being inseparable yada yada – completely neglecting the part where both of them were married and living with their respective spouses and children when they met and started “dating”. They painted a cute little fairytale love story and people were responding stuff like “aw, I hope I find a love as real as yours”. I had to sit on my hands SO HARD to keep myself from messaging the guy who had as the question. But we were still in the middle of the divorces, so I restrained myself. At this point I don’t care what all those old acquaintances believe.
I don’t know that I could withstand the temptation to speak a little truth to that situation. Maybe a form letter and a mass mailing to all employees? Anonymously, of course, and sent from out of town. Plan a trip dearie. The best revenge is served cold, obviously performed by you, and completely unproveable. I’ve done that and it was wonderful in restoring my self esteem.
If living well is the best revenge, it must kill him to know that my new husband and I have 2 sons (he always wanted a son to carry on the family name) while he’s shacked up with a woman who makes him go to bed at 7:30.
Not sure if this counts: she dialed my home number at 11:30 at night and hung up when I answered, but not quite fast enough. Her answering machine clicked on and invited me to leave a message! I turned to FW, lying in bed beside me, and asked “Why am I getting hang up calls from Schmoopie?” He looked like a deer in the headlights and replied: “I don’t know!” That was all that was said. I did not mention the answering machine (it was from her office). Withing 48hours we’d had a big fight over it and he exclaimed: “Anyone could have made that call!” thereby revealing he’d been in a discussion with her regarding the call. I’ve never pointed out his mistake to him. FW indeed.
I’ve never had the displeasure of speaking to any of the infidelity cohorts, and I wouldn’t want to.
According to some religions, we are assigned a limited number of breaths at birth. In case that is true, I don’t want to waste any of mine.
Truth is very simple.
“If it’s wrong, don’t do it. If it’s not true, don’t say it.” (Marcus Aurelius)
“Wonderful people don’t screw around with married people. Wonderful married people don’t screw around.” (Dr Frank Pittman)
Anyone who lies and keeps secrets knows what they are doing is wrong. I have zero power to enlighten them. And at the end of the day, because like attracts like, they really are a better match for each other and I am better off being relieved of their malignant presence. Just like I would want dog poop removed from my living room carpet.
I don’t know how long my life is going to be. I do know for certain that I have a lot of control over its quality, and therefore, I hope to associate with the highest quality people who will have me. And may God help me be one myself.
Cheaters and side pieces fancy themselves quality people. Their behavior proves they are not.
♥️
My divorce attorney celebrated his 40th anniversary some months into the divorce process. He took his wife to Europe on a two-week trip that he planned himself. They founded the law firm together, and she was the business manager. For the first few years, they rode to work together and were the whole firm. She answered the phone and did the books, and he did all of his own legal work.
He told me multiple times that he still couldn’t get the affair mindset himself, despite over four decades in family law. In his opinion, either be honest and upfront that you no longer want to be married, or work with your partner to make it work. He and his wife had worked very, very hard on both their marriage and the firm. I only met her once because she was spending a lot of time with his dad, who was in very poor health and then entered hospice during my divorce process.
He gave me so much more than the law. Truly a solid individual.
When I read a text from bitch queen saying she would buy me out of my house (FW told her they would get married) ….effectively making me homeless between them, I called her up told her exactly what I thought of both of them and I would burn my house to the ground before I let them take it from me. Based on my out of character outburst she declared that I was mentally ill and had bi polar disorder. This diagnosis took many forms over the coming months, including psychotic and psychopath. (a) Ive never even suffered depression in my life and (b) anxiety induced anger at FWittery and betrayal is no basis for random diagnoses.
FWIW. I am buying him out and he has gone, never to return.
Wonderful outcome! You did great.
Go you!
I never had an actual conversation with her. But if I had I’m certain that she wouldn’t have pleasant things to say. I wouldn’t be upset though, because the narrative Cheaty McLiarface has put out there about me would cause me to believe that I’m a terrible person. He’s just that good at playing the victim.
I actually got an apology text from the AP. There was nothing entertainingly stupid in it, just the expected kind of disingenuous pap, which, while it was stupid, is too boring to to bother adding to the stupid sh*t APs say list. I don’t even know if I still have it and have not looked at it since the day she sent it. I had insisted FW request the apology of her, playing it up as something I needed in order to heal, but it was really so I could have her admit it on the record in order to have proof to give her husband, proof I certainly did use. Funny how FWs and APs think they’re the only ones who can manipulate and deceive. They get a lot of ego fuel from thinking it’s one sided, that we’re powerless and incapable of using their own tactics against them. They are wrong. I will absolutely manipulate and deceive sh*tty people in the service of doing the right thing and even just to enjoy messing with them, because IMO they deserve to be messed with. What I will not do is manipulate or deceive good-hearted, honest, honorable people.
.
Come sit right next to me LOL! I see no reason to act like a saintly nun when one is dealing with a scheming narcissistic sociopath plotting my demise!
In the limited time I had to “deceive” FW by pretending to still be in the dark about his decades long double life, consult lawyers and forensics accountants and such, I felt physically tense and nauseated. Sickening how many lies it takes every day to do even a fraction of the lying FW did.
That experience triggered a primal fear, realization what a cold-blooded reptile FW was that he could do this for years, in the faces of his loving spouse and children daily, whoa it was excruciating.
That pain and fear mixed with survival instinct pushed me past the pick me dance.
It’s the narcissism. They think they’re smarter than the rest of us.
“Funny how FWs and APs think they’re the only ones who can manipulate and deceive.”
So true. I’ve found that serial con artists are no match for a truly pissed off Pollyanna who’s been pushed past the brink. I was laughing about this with a friend from school after she mopped the floor with some real estate scammers who managed to get this friend’s mother– who had advanced Alzheimer’s– to sign over the beautiful craftsman home which had been in the family for more than a century and, due to recent gentrification, had appreciated astronomically.
This friend is a successful African American touring musician who’s been through all sorts of bracing experiences and is politically savvy so obviously not born yesterday nor sheltered. But she’s also a good Southern Baptist girl in the best sense. She’s not a church type but very spiritual, top grades, never smoked or drank, very demure, soft spoken, generous, distressed by gratuitous cruelty or gossip, sensitive to the point of being almost skinless, volunteers to teach underprivileged kids, etc.
But never get her mad. She set the scammers up to expose themselves in recorded calls, then went to the press and destroyed them and got the house back. This friend knew exactly how to play the put-upon saint for the six o’clock news and stoke public outrage.
The scammers never knew what hit them. After seeing the news interviews she did, I marveled at how she didn’t even seem angry but just “demurely chagrined” and she laughed and called it “performance art” to “do maximum damage.”
Do not f*ck with the falcon. 😉
It is odd to me, but they (at least mine) do think that they are still in control of everything. I remember how flabbergasted my ex was when he told me he had the D all figured out, and I said talk to my lawyer. I am sure he had already bloviated to his whtrollupore and his mother that Susie would do what he said, just as she always did. Pissed him off so bad he threatened me and hung up on me, then he called back about a half hour later and profusely apologized.
I am sure he talked to his sad sack lawyer and was told to apologize.
Yeah, they tend to underestimate us. They’ve been on a power trip so long that it’s inconceivable to them that they are not going to be able to control how the divorce goes.
My dimwit STBX told me the bulldog attorney he’d use to destroy me if we ever divorced. When he found out I’d hired him instead, all the blood drained from his face and he whispered that I’d betrayed him. Snort!
😂
That is awesome! You rock!
That was my ex. He told his $700/hour attorney that I wouldn’t put up a fight and that I was clueless and stupid. Nope, I hired one of the best attorneys in the metropolitan area, someone who completely outmaneuvered and outclassed my ex’s attorney.
Brilliant strategy!
“I had insisted FW request the apology of her, playing it up as something I needed in order to heal, but it was really so I could have her admit it on the record in order to have proof to give her husband, proof I certainly did use.”
Thanks. Unfortunately, the chumped husband didn’t leave her, but I have it on good authority that he did give her quite a rough time for awhile. All we can do is provide the information and hope the chump makes the right decision.
i knew the workplace AP and used to have business dinners with her and her husband was there, too. the last time i saw her, she looked at me and my X, sitting side by side, and said, “you guys look alike” but was looking at me with a clinical/dismissive eye.
i thought it was a weird comment and put it down to her being weird, because she is weird.
i still wish i’d tipped my wine glass over onto her lap, given that she was a) weird; and, b) flirting outrageously with my X.
PS everyone at the table knew they were having an affair except for me and her husband. this continues to bug me, even after 6 years. gah.
I get that. my ex invited his town bicycle to his work Christmas dinner to sit at our table, along with our best couple friends. I am pretty sure they didn’t know, but I am also pretty sure my best friend was getting a vibe, as was I. Funnily enough, I didn’t think it was wh orrrr e, I was suspicious of wh orrr e’s companion, who was the dumb blonde kind of person, but good looking.
Anyway long story, but it still pisses me off. I am going to go out on a limb and say, it is likely there were folks at that party that knew. It was a room full of police officers, what are the odds that none of them knew. Someone knew because a couple weeks later someone dropped and ethics complaint against him, and his house of cards fell like bricks.
The triffid barged into my house like she already owned it and declared we all need to be friends and ‘adults about things’
Lucky for her it wasn’t present day me she encountered.
The Klingon hasn’t dared or had the ovaries to say shit in my hearing but did lie to the police and pretended she was in fear of her life leading to a domestic violence order against me – but apparently because she works in ‘mental health’ she is a great person according to a bubble head ex friend.
It’s a known fact that a fair few who work in the mental health arena like the Power Over dynamic and need a good deal of treatment themselves- prime example right here.
Ha! Looked up triffid. Perfect word.
Shmoopie said I was smart, which was an inconvenience, so she launched a plan at considerable expense to take FW and I to a past-life regression hypnotherapist in California that would present “evidence” to me that she and FW cosmically belonged together. I declined the invite.
Hahahaaaa!
That’s excellent! 😆😆
😂
I think you win. Hey, don’t take her word for it, believe the past-life hypnotherapist!
I was spared having any direct contact with AP after the full-blown affair. My daughter is not so lucky. In attempt to become friends with my daughter (they are similar in age), the AP shared that she takes pride in being a “girls’ girl”. You can’t make this up.
The AP didn’t contact me directly – but she contacted my now husband when he and I had just started dating.
AP and my now husband work at the same company – but it’s a big company (12k+) so they didn’t work together (completely different divisions). She sent him an email at work basically saying (I’m paraphrasing):
Hi! Guess what?!? I figured out that you’re dating my boyfriend’s ex-wife! We should all hang out sometime. Would you both like to come to a holiday cocktail party at my place?
My now husband wanted to tell her exactly what he thinks about APs, but he ended up sending just a short note politely declining the invitation and asking her to keep work emails about work.
She (and my ex) just wanted the centrality. And love the drama. And it is so much less fun for them over there without me in the picture.
I’m so glad I’m out of that (as much as I can be with two kids and “co-parenting”)…
I will never understand the Cluster B instinct to encroach on the people they’ve harmed in the past with faux-friendly overtures.
That’s definitely a Cluster B “thing.” I experienced that kind of “encroachment” several times while working in a psychotically competitive, narc-filled industry. Someone would do something completely outrageous to you or in front of you which was bad enough. But even worse is when they would try to “hoover” you after the fact to force you into “friendly” exchanges as if trying to prove to themselves and any bystanders present that whatever they did couldn’t have been “that bad” if you were still willing to air-kiss and banter with them.
My parents were kind of old-fashioned in that sense and raised me to turn my back on offensive sh*theads. But what always shocked me about these types was how taken aback and surprised they’d be when I’d stare at them in disgust and walk away. What this suggested was that the reason freaks do this is because most people are intimidated into playing along with this icky game.
It’s like when your former workplace bullies try to connect with you on social media, comment on your posts (if you didn’t have the good sense of blocking them), and you’re expected to act all polite, keep it “professional” etc. I’ve experienced that, too.
I should have said I don’t relate to the Cluster B tendency to hoover though I think I actually do understand it, at least “cognitively.” From what I’ve seen, I the dark side of the Golden Rule might be at play there. People conditioned from infancy to keep playing nice to abusers in their family circles (sometimes in order to get money, social access, etc.) naturally expect everyone else to endlessly “let bygones be bygones” and they’re quite shocked at NC types.
Like I’ve mentioned, I kind of made a hobby of dredging up the backstories of various creeps and flying monkeys in order to understand the origins of behavior like that. The only people too cagey to pry information out of turned out to be violent pedophiles but everyone else would spill and the stories were what you’d expect.
I like to use all parts of the buffalo and in hindsight I think my instinct was to turn my experience in that perv-filled industry into a kind of lab study. In the end, I think the deciding factor about bullies and their enablers is not simply that they were abused in childhood but that every single one of them were, as adults, still deeply enmeshed with and dependent on their former abusers. In a few instances, the former abusers of these freaks had died but I’m guessing that, had their former abusers lived, the principle would have been the same.
On D-day the other woman texted me the following: „…at some point I had to make a decision for myself about how to deal with the situation, how to deal with you… and in a quiet way you became part of my life, because you are important to him, and through that you also became important to me.“ I never replied.
🤢 So gross.
Great topic!
I caught my idiot having a secret email account after he ended it because he felt so bad for leading her on and dumping her after fing her once.
I had an absolutely hilarious “conversation”
Chatting with her as him.
Told her she was a mediocre lay and a bottomless pit of need (both things he’d actually told me but perhaps not in quite the same language).
Of course, I also tested some things he’d told me, and validated that they were true.
It was so empowering!
I ended by telling her that she wasn’t half the person “my wife” was…and she AGREED.
Not really stupid things the OW said, but I had to host her TWICE in my home (obviously I didn’t know at the time that she was MORE than an underling on the same work project, visiting my city/country for better medical care). It was all presented as “she and I should be friends.”
What another commenter wrote about praying together made me want to comment. The AP in my case (engaged or married to someone else throughout the affair!) seemed to delight in being a prayer partner together with my Jesus cheater ex.
They literally prayed for our marriage and for the faith of our kids! The AP is Catholic: my ex grew up Baptist. He started crossing himself and doing Catholic prayers for our family, with the AP’s influence.
I was groomed to believe she was my friend, “in my corner” material. She wasn’t. She conspired against me for about 3 years with my then husband.
Oh I shut that down. When the Pick Me Dance started he apparently wanted to be friends. Yeah no. I knew what was going on and didn’t trust him or his intentions. I was happy to do the Chump Two Step but that was not something I was going to do. So much the better as my assessment was correct (though hindsight being 20/20 I should have shown her the door).
“I’m not in love with her, but any woman can seduce me coz God made me a man. Read the Bible”.
“I’m the sperm donor of this kid, but God’s testing you if you’re worthy of entering Heaven whilst raising him as your own”.
OMG does this mean that he wanted you to take in his illegitimate child to raise?!?!? Holy moley
It didn’t work out. IDGAF.
PS – tell him to read the ten commandments. Like, read the Bible.
The one that comes to mind for me (might be the only one!) was not directly said to me. It was relayed through my son. The FW XW and her AP (but mainly the FW XW) excelled at using the children to try and communicate both unimportant things (the majority of the time it was this) and important things to me.
I’ve told this before, but as HOAC said, maybe it’ll help the newbies?
My son, who was an early to mid-teenager at the time (I think somewhere in the 13-16 years old range) came to tell me that his mother’s AP and former boss told him, “Your dad will come around. He’ll understand that it’s better for us all to be friends, and you’ll see, soon we’ll all be good friends.” Or something of similar idiocy.🙄🤬
My son, to his credit, said he laughed loudly at this, and said, “You really don’t know my dad!”🤣😂🤣
Brilliant, Son, brilliant!
Yeah, his sisters and I like him.😁
😆🙌
This is my first time posting although I have followed the blog and website for months. Here is what the high-minded affair partner texted me while I was still doing the pick-me dance and when I confronted her:
Drifted??? Needless to say, she didn’t steer clear and he wasn’t willing to give her up. Concerning the separation that she mentioned to me, he proposed to me that he needed space away from the both of us. In fact, he both used that time and space to continue cheating on me (more intensively even), while I tried to respect his request to find himself.
But reviewing this, wasn’t it so very thoughtful of her to ask to talk with me? I didn’t reply to her.
I am hoping that the divorce will go through in the next few months.
Luckily you found this blog to avoid wasting more of your life in the pick me dance. FW narcopath cried so convincingly that he was moving out to a crappy one bedroom apartment to work himself to death because of the miserable marriage. Needless to say he actually got a 3 bedroom house and continued his entanglement with multiple escorts
You really had a rotter, Archer…😔
This sounds like my situation, except I was the one that suggested now xh find a place to give him some space from both her and I, to try and work out what he wanted/sort out his head. So glad I discovered that she had spent two nights out of the five with him otherwise who knows how long the limbo would have lasted. It was like it FINALLY dawned on me that he was prioritising their relationship over ours. It felt like it was a nail in the coffin. And I couldn’t see any more nails.
I wanted her to see my eyes… to see I was a real person, a woman, hurting, desperately wanting my husband and family back … so I went to their work. She was with him but I didn’t know what she looked like, so I snapped “who are you?”. “I’m *****”, she said politely. And held out her hand. !!! FFS.
“Don’t shake my hand!” I spat, and left.
Was she trying to disarm me with that? Who knows. And yeah, don’t care anymore. Coming up a year to my D- Day anniversary. Separation agreement was signed Christmas Eve.
Oh, there are so many.
The doozie is the “apology” she sent me after they broke up. “I’m sorry for the things I’ve done that hurt you or made your life more difficult. On many occasions I was operating under false pretenses. I’m sure that at times you were confused and hurt. I did not intend harm, but I caused harm nonetheless. And for that I apologize.”
What “false pretenses”? She knew he was married, she knew me, we were all coworkers. She had been to my home multiple times, we gone out with our kids multiple times, out with other friends multiple times where she saw my husband and I sit next to each other, kiss, etc. Her letter is a blueprint for how NOT to take any accountability. Needless to say, I did not reply. It’s not my job to salve her conscience. If she found out he was a sparkly turd, she can’t say I didn’t warn her about his abuse. But she told me I was lying to “smear his good name” so…
The second best was when I read all her letters she had sent my FW over the course of more than *three years*, which I found after he died. I laughed my a$$ off when I read them because they were so over the top ridiculous. I’ve never read anything that screamed “junior highschool” so loudly (FW was 41-45, and AP was 32-36 during their affair). The most amazing one was when she suggested to him that he come clean to me about their relationship SO WE COULD ALL BE A HAPPY FAMILY, because apparently I seemed to be enjoying myself when she had come over to hang out. I guess I’m an Oscar-worthy actress because I was PISSED the whole time she was there. Or maybe it was the one where she told him that she thought he was a fundamentally happy person who was just going through a hard time. HAHAHAHA. He was a fundamentally miserable and angry person who had flashes of “happiness” when external circumstances were favorable, and the happiness never lasted. But he was excellent at playing the victim.
I’m so glad I can laugh about it now 5 years later. I certainly wasn’t laughing back then. I still kinda hate her, but she’s not really worth my time or attention. And though she never meant me well, the affair did set me free from a terrible marriage and gave me the fabulous life I have now. I’m not a quitter and was raised to believe in “til death us do part” so I don’t know if I would have had the courage to leave my FW if it weren’t for the cheating. That was the line in the sand and he crossed it. He left me, and I’m glad he did. And when he wanted to come back, I said no.
I was raised to avoid divorce at almost any cost so while no apologies came my way from the multitude of orifices FW dabbled in, the secret double life with many escorts which exploded into police involvement here made me finally leave the marriage.
I could not see it then but it set me free, as you said, to step into the sunlight of a happier new life.