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Dear Chump Lady, He doesn’t want me, so why hold up the divorce?

Hi Chump Lady,

I caught my husband cheating with his co-worker, who also happens to be his ex-girlfriend, last fall. We had been married 15 years. I confronted him, he said he was sorry and wanted me and the marriage. He didn’t seem to want to do anything to make up for what he did, especially my one request — getting his ho-worker out of that job. She was just too instrumental to the business, you see. She’d only been there nine months but they couldn’t live without her or replace her and I just had to understand that.

A few weeks after D-day, the whore’s roommate sent me a message saying the thing never ended and they were planning a life together. He denied this and I still resolved I wanted to save my marriage (so chumpy and gross, I know). Anyway, right after Christmas I could tell he had one foot out the door. I performed the pick me dance with the fervor of a thousand river dancers and became the marriage police. It was all so demoralizing. He finally left to go stay with his mom about three months ago to “clear his head.” I filed for divorce.

I have been trying to reason with him about a settlement and using a mediator so we don’t have to spend thousands. We have no children so it should be pretty easy. I have more to lose financially in this divorce so I am trying to not piss him off too much.

Since I have filed for divorce, I keep approaching him about discussing this settlement and each time he gets a little teary and says things like “So, this is what it’s come to? I thought we were working it out?” Like this crap situation was all my idea. He cheated, lied and left. Then we get into some dumb conversation about “working it out” where “it” is all my fault. I hear a list of every petty thing I have ever done wrong. Yeah, sure I have flaws but I have supported this man through 12 years of alcoholism (my chump-in-training days), quitting his high paying job to start a business which was always his dream, subsequently running that business into the ground due to his drinking, and almost dying from liver failure. He has been sober for three years now and thinks he is the sparkliest thing this side of Vegas for beating the odds and surviving. He got in amazing shape. So now that he is sober and has a perfect body, I just can’t measure up to his ideal of perfection. I am too sloppy, too fat, not motivated enough to be perfect like him and yesterday he told me I don’t smile enough. Most of these things couldn’t be further from the truth. After each one of those interactions, I feel so beaten down. Then after I go home and cry myself to sleep, I get a text from him saying he is sorry he hurt my feelings.

And his OW is the most unaccomplished piece of trash imaginable. She was a porn star during her last marriage to save her house from foreclosure, has tattoos of cartoon animals having sex (I wish I was making this up), barely made it through high school, brags about how she won’t cook, clean or do yard work. I have to hear about how much I suck and how she is so great and is getting a certificate from a top business school for her job! (I have a master’s degree in a scientific field). And when I was looking at their FB pages (I don’t anymore), they were putting up feel good posts about how everyone makes mistakes but they shouldn’t have to pay for them forever, they are just human after all! Blah, blah, blah.

In our divorce settlement, he is going to be getting a very good deal. He will probably get to keep the beautiful home that we have lived in our entire marriage and worked so hard to make just like we like it. He’ll probably end up moving his whore in there, which pisses me off to no end but I know I need to let that go. So if he is getting everything he wants — the house, getting rid of his mean, sloppy, fat wife, the ability to do what he wants whenever he wants — why does he feel the need to vilify me and turn me into The Worst Wife Ever? Why is he stalling this thing and saying “I thought we were working it out?” every time I try to get this thing moving and get the hell out of this trashy situation he has brought into my life? I keep thinking the answer is cake, but he himself claims he sees absolutely no benefit to him in our being together.

I know now that I have been used to get what he wanted all these years — the house, the toys, the business. Now that he can have that without me, I’m no longer useful to him. Why doesn’t he let me go? Why does he need to be such an ass on the way out?


Dear KitKat,

Why does he need to be such an ass on the way out? Because he was an ass coming in and before, during, and afterwards. That’s who he IS. An ass.

You say he claims there is “no benefit to him in our being together.” Yeah, he SAYS that — but his actions don’t. He isn’t itching to get divorced because he doesn’t want a divorce. He didn’t file — YOU did. He wanted the pick me dance and the kibbles to go on forever. He wanted to keep extracting value from you as long as you’d let him. (HelloOo — you make more money.) He wants you to stick around and take the blame for his shitty, entitled behavior. Can’t expect an OW to do that, cheaters always want a hypotenuse for that job.

But then you stopped letting him crap on you. You filed. You got uppity when he tried to blame you for this. And when blameshifting failed, he tried self-pity and claiming the True Victim Here mantle.

“So, this is what it’s come to? I thought we were working it out?”

He’s punishing you. He knows you want a divorce and he doesn’t want to give you one. It’s not about the divorce, it’s about control. Control over you. Control over the narrative.

You’re dumping him. OMG, people might construe that he’s a bad guy. (You know, like a drunk cheater. Okay dry drunk cheater.) This whole — Did I hurt your feelings?, you don’t smile enough — is impression management. (See! I care!) Your pain is centrality and kibbles to him. So you need to go TOTALLY NO CONTACT on his ass. You don’t have kids.

And forget the mediator, IMO. You can’t nice someone out of an affair and you can’t nice them into a divorce settlement either. Especially someone so keen to not give you one. I’m sorry, but you need a pit bull lawyer to make his life a bit more miserable now. Why the hell should he get the house? Or a pot to piss in for that matter? I hope you have a damn good reason, like you’re keeping your pension. But if I were you, I’d forget the mediator, only speak to him through an attorney, and tell him he takes whatever (fair to YOU) settlement you offer him, or you’re litigating his ass. You have more money, remember? He’s a flunky with his own start up. Start calling the shots. No more nice.

Doesn’t matter that he doesn’t want you to move on — YOU’RE MOVING ON. He doesn’t own you. Decolonize your mind. You aren’t a kibble dispenser. He wants a kind word? He can talk to his lawyer. They bill in 6-minute increments, I hear.

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at Read more about submission guidelines.
  • You don’t smile enough !
    WTF is there to smile about. I love that term a “pit bull lawyer.” Get one fast. Then whenever you come face to face with him just grin! That should do it!

    • Classic mindfuck. They make your life a living hell of intentional miscommunication, lop-sided responsibilities, and blameshifting, and when you react by trying harder and harder and harder they tut-tut about your inability to “enjoy life” and run you down for being such a buzz-kill.

      • Mine did that. Found my day pack up in the attic. Whereas he and OW were going to hike the world, doncha know. Suddenly, he had no more crippling back pain, I guess, and I had responsibilities.

        He looked at it and said, smugly, “Oh, what a shame….”

        Fuck him. He certainly oughtta know what shame is.

      • Oh thank you for this. Another bit of fog has lifted, no mar. Chump Lady, it’s like 400 dollars of daily therapy only it’s free. God bless all of you.

      • God yes, Nomar. I got this as well. And the really awful thing is that it eventually became reality. After a couple decades of being mind fucked, abused, lied to and gaslighted, I really DID lose my ability to enjoy life, be fun and “smile enough.” I’m getting it back, though, now that I’m free.

      • Exactly.

        You’re boring. Rigid. Controlling. Not spontaneous.

        What that really means in cheater speak? You’re too dependable and responsible, you’re making me look bad.

        • “‘You’re boring. Rigid. Controlling. Not spontaneous.’ What that really means in cheater speak? You’re too dependable and responsible, you’re making me look bad.”


          • Ladies I wish I could sit down with all of you in one room and have a cuppa,

            You’re boring. Rigid. Controlling. Not spontaneous.

            What that really means in cheater speak? You’re too dependable and responsible, you’re making me look bad.

            add this to your always negative, you always pick on me, your always glass have empty. why can’t you be happy?

            Guess who is happy now?

            • Sorry! Just have to say, “glass half empty”, that’s what my STBXW used to say about me. She’s a “glass half full” person, don’tcha know! Of course, whenever her (wine) glass got half full, she’d fill it back up again, empty it, fill it up, empty it…

          • Yes, “Your being so depressed because I ruined you financially is really getting me down. So I’m gonna go fuck someone else now. Maybe she’ll have money, I mean, maybe she’ll be happy.”

              • He bankrupted us, ruining my impeccable credit from his stupid business decisions and his drinking. Then he almost died. He views the business as a success because it saved his life and he has a point but he wanted me to just write off every dumb thing he’d ever done when he was drinking because he was drinking. And I had forgiven him for all that and thought things were turning around for us. But I am the devil for weighing 6 pounds more than the day we got married and sometimes I miss a spot when I dust and sometimes I work on the computer paying bills at night instead of paying attention to him, etc., etc. So he just had to screw that porn star. Too bad he couldn’t use the drinking as an excuse for that.

      • I swear, everyday I read this blog I learn something new. I learn how much he mindfucked me. I worked so hard, “because it was all my fault”, to repair our marriage prior to the affair. I beat myself up so many times for not being able to fix me. I spiraled downward into a horrible depression that there was no way I could win and he lied, cheated and left because he deserved to be happy… without his wife and son… with a woman that was once one of my closest friends… Guess what, he still hasn’t filed for divorce (he wanted it, he can do the hard work, waste his time and money). I believe he prefers it this way because he can blame it on me and doesn’t have to “really” commit to her because as soon as the divorce is final, she’ll want to “set a date” to prove to the world that they were right to destroy so many lives… Yes, I know he’s cake eating but the only thing he really gets from me is the ability to not fully commit to her… I believe that this is one of the reasons, however it plays out, that some men drag the divorce thing out… Look, OW, how hard I’m trying to make this happen for us but my wife is causing problems… It’s all her fault, yet again… ugh…

        • I think you’re right. Cheaters love making promises, lying, and using their wives as excuses. They like the appearance of a stable marriage but they like to have extra applause on the side.

          My x was so shocked when he was served with papers. He expected me to take him back. I thank God that I changed the locks. I forced his hand. He couldn’t believe that I was essentially saying, “You want THAT?! You can have IT!”

          In my reality, I want to believe that he told his married whorefriend that I would leave to live with my mother and he would get the house. He always liked this house more than I did. Ha! Ha! Ha! I sure like this house a whole lot better now! It finally feels like home.

          I would never have left him but he gave me the biggest gift. Based on my gut, this wasn’t his first affair but I am so glad that he got sloppy. I’ll still have a few decades of my life to enjoy.

          And I want to believe that nothing turned out as he expected. I no longer have a marriage or a cheating husband but I have everything else.

          • Wow. My h lives for applause, thanks to his mother who had him at 18 and raised him to believe that the room should break into clapping anytime he entered. The first time I told him he was making a ludicrous business decision and I wasn’t on board, he ran to another woman. Oh, and the business decision? It was a disaster. H thinks I’m gloating about this but, uh, what did I win? Id have rather been proven wrong. Cue the ow’s applause.

            • This reminds me of something my therapist said this week. I learned something about the Jackass’s MOW (whom he essentially had known as an adult for about five minutes) that left me asking her, again, “What in the world did he see in this woman?”

              My therapist: “She adored him.”

          • JoyFilled, it’s amazing isn’t it? My husband seems to think only he is deserving of a happy life. He begrudgingly tells me that he’ll give me half his lawsuit settlement just to show “your mother that I’m not a piece of shit.” So, he’d give it to me for that reason, but not because it’s the least he can do since i lost every penny I had thanks to him.

            He honestly seems to think I would be happy and only deserve to continue living with my elderly parents and taking care of them when they get sick. He truly doesn’t think I deserve to have a life. It’s like he thinks I’m too dumb for it!

            • I doubt he even thinks about whether you’re too dumb to have a life, or whether you deserve a life, or anything like that. It’s not about YOU, it’s about HIM. Without his glorious gloriousness in your life, Moving Liquid, you are clearly less than nothing!

              Your ex is disgusting.

        • I never really thought of it this way but yeah – another thing he could be getting from me by stalling is the ability to tell OW that he can’t commit yet because I am holding things up. When I filed, his first concern was if anyone else knew. Haha! He didn’t want her to know! They still have to work together so I can imagine if she knew and didn’t commit to her, that would make for an uncomfortable work day.

      • Thank you nomar and Chump Lady! You just explaind 22years of me not knowing WTF was going on. You have my eternal gratitude.

      • Oh dear god – thank you Nomar. In two precise sentences you have just described the last two decades of my life.

        Me working harder and harder, getting more and more serious, and then thinking there was something wrong with me because I was so boring and conservative. Apparently I was a ball breaker, too. Mostly when I challenged him about his spending.

        It is really sad. I came to believe it all, mainly because that’s what I turned into (except for a ball breaker – I wish I had!). That’s what happens when you’re the only adult in the relationship.

      • ^^^^ nomar, this is why I read this blog on a regular basis. That description is 100% my ex. Reading here reminds me that I am not crazy; he is. Thank you thank you.

      • perfect! My life in a nutshell and divorce still not final (almost 2 years in) It shoulda been simple!

      • I don’t think I smiled in a single picture from 1998 to 2008, years 12 through 22 of a bad marriage to a serial cheat. A few weeks after I separated from my XW, I began feeling these odd sensations in my face. A kind of springy, up-pulling in my cheeks and around outsides of my eyes. It was muscles that move I smile. How weird. How wonderful.

        • My X said I was a “negative person”. I told him that tends to happen when your husband is getting blow-jobs at lunch by strange women. I guess I was “negative” about that. lol

          • Exactly. The mind f*ck is that normal reactions to stress and conflict (anxiety, uncertainty, defensiveness, sometimes anger) are characterized as abnormal.

            If you’re not “negative” about being abused, there’s something wrong with you.

          • OMG! Rumblekitty, I was told that exact same thing! And I hate to admit it, but until this very moment I constantly wondered if he was right. Thank you Rumblekitty and Nomar for making me realize what just happened. Talk about an ah-ha moment.

            • I swear they all do the same shit. The funny thing is that prior to this, he liked that I was so “upbeat and social” and what not. After he was deep into his affair, I ceased to possess the qualities he liked.

              It’s not you, it’s them. They have to turn it all around to make themselves feel better as a way to justify their shitty choices. Don’t let it keep you up at night. 🙂 Fuck ’em.

          • OMG, I got that as well, Rumble! Except in my case, my ex was getting blow jobs in his bank office from other dudes. Yeah, that marriage made me kind of “negative,” I guess.

          • Rumblekitty,
            My X said I was a “negative person”. I told him that tends to happen when your husband is getting blow-jobs at lunch by strange women. I guess I was “negative” about that. lol

            I laughed so hard on this comment I had trouble typing. only difference in my case is you would have to change women to men.
            it is ludicrous that in their fucked up little world their behavior is acceptable but our response to it is not.

            thanks for the laugh.

            • The Jackass has no problem with his lying, cheating, blameshifting, and gaslighting. But I committed a death penalty offense by pointing out that he had opened a FB page to communicate with his MOW. And that he kept that relationship a secret from me. As you put it, “in their fucked up little world their behavior is acceptable but our response to it is not.”

              • It’s so funny. I keep trying to tell my husband that as far as estranged wives go, he’s got it pretty easy. He says, “How? I don’t think so.”

                I said, “I haven’t caused any scenes, I haven’t ratted on you to your friends family, or children. I haven’t stalked you, spied on you, called all the numbers that you text and talk with. So my emails are too long; you can handle that, surely.”

                He still disagreed. Jerk.

        • nomar, I actually haven’t had a photo taken with me in it for the last 15 years. The last photo I saw of myself I realised how sad I was and I looked just awful and I was once a very attractive girl. I had a few photos taken just recently and I might be 15 years older but I look younger now than I did back then and actually happy. Peace of mind will do that for you I suppose.

          • Not far behind peace of mind is happy. One follows the other. Now that you’ve met the one, expect the other.

    • I’ve been divorced five months and just the other day I got – “your emails are too long”….really?!?!

    • There was a link in older posts to a list of the best lawyers there are. Can someone republish, please

  • I think the answer to why he doesn’t let you go may be money. You have supported him financially. His side piece sounds like she has serious financial problems.

    When he was reconciling with you, he was also making plans with the jerk to have a life together. He might have been lying to her, but he might also have been stringing you along while he got in position for the divorce so that he wouldn’t lose too much financially.

    He could be seeing a lawyer while refusing to make an agreement with you or see a mediator.

    It’s impossible to know what’s going through his mind. He could also just be a selfish guy who would like to keep you and have his side piece. I mean rationally, you took care of him for 12 years while he drank, you nursed him through liver failure, and you made it possible for him to set up a business. She’s a divorced woman who does porn and sleeps with her married co-worker. At some level, he must realize that you can do more for him than she can.

    Despite what he says about her, he may be waking up to the idea that he’s going to lose a lot when you go and he has to rely on her.

    If he’s living with his mom and you don’t have kids, why would he get the house?

    Anyhow, you need to see a lawyer. Find out if you will lose as much as you think in a divorce. Find out if mediation really is a good idea for you financially. Maybe he’s seen a lawyer and knows you’d get more than you think.

    Also, are you sure he’s sober? Maybe I’m being paranoid, but the comment about you not smiling enough made me wonder. Could the OW be drinking with him?

    • I’m staying for the time being because of money. I totally think its a huge reason. If I found $300k today, I’d be gone. As it is, I need to play this game very carefully, and I think kitkat’s h and the porn star are doing the same. I’m teaching myself to be a weasel – her h is already well versed.

    • “Also, are you sure he’s sober? Maybe I’m being paranoid, but the comment about you not smiling enough made me wonder. Could the OW be drinking with him?”

      This ^^

      I thought the same thing or is the OW pushing him in that direction to drink and he is back to his drunk alcoholic way of thinking and living. It sounds like he is neglecting his program OR he is using the poor ol me pity fucking party “she is no good to me I lost that connection blah blah blah you are the only one who understands me I mean you were a porn star blah blah blah puke” be thankful you did not have kids with him.

    • Diana is absolutely right. While disordered cheaters do a lot of crazy/abusive stuff just because they enjoy fucking with their prey, very very often, they are concerned about the bottom line which is how much $$$$$ can they squeeze out of you. I’d venture to guess that Kit Kat’s STBX wants to hang on to her for monetary benefits. He needs to be sent packing with the absolute least the law will allow. Let his porn-star, fucking-cartoon-animal-tattooed, lowlife OW take care of him.

      • he’s waiting for trash OW to get her “big-degree”, which she’s probably lying about, so he will probably drag this on endlessly if kk lets him.

      • ‘They enjoy fucking with their prey’
        Wow, yes they do. In fact, there may be nothing quite as enjoyable on this planet, to a deceitful, double-life spouse or even BF/GF!
        I just wish to hell I’d met you people 20 years ago, and started my new life sooner.

    • Call Orkin in the meanwhile, they get rid of Pests or your money back. Did we all get a Jerk from Jerk Central? Or Jerk Central Casting? This is one of the frickin’ eye opening things that comes from this site.

  • An OW with tattoos of cartoon animals having sex? Where’s the spray bottle of mental Clorox when you need it?

    CL is right: get a pit bull lawyer asafrickinp and go as NC as you can while you let the lawyer do the talking. Please do not let this douchebag take your beautiful house. The idea of a woman like that moving into *your* space is sickening. If this is what “sobriety” looks like for your STBX, he’s obviously still drunk. He just doesn’t realize it. Hugs to you, and stay strong.

    • Yeah the tattoos – now there’s a tawdry image that cannot be unimagined.

      Stay classy chumps!

  • Dear KitKat- I met my STBXH in AA – he four years in, me two. We were going to have that blissful, spiritual union we’d never had (both second marriages) – we were redeemed.

    Until the pornography, the flirtatious behaviour with other women, his admission to being a sex addict, his relapse at seven years… At this point I asked him to move out believing a separation would help clear his head!

    Two years later he still wasn’t sober but ever the good codependent (Al-anon) wife I kept on being there because ‘I understood’!

    It took his affair with my co-worker to bring this Chump down and even then I did that dance.

    And then a good friend told me I had to get away if I was to save my sanity and sobriety. Three months from DDay I went No Contact, Five months later I was 300 miles away, eight months later I was filing for Divorce.

    Did he make it easy? No, I got the drunk texts, including how he’d ‘think about’ agreeing to the divorce- even though I went for two year separation rather than adultery! We have no shared assets, no children – so the material side is easy. Of course I didn’t respond.

    He pretended he hadn’t received the papers, then he didn’t know where to return them. They eventually turned up at court a month later. I’m currently awaiting the Decree Nisi.

    Meanwhile he was still seeing my very ex friend and co-worker.

    As Chump Lady says it’s all about control. Being AA, I know where the fault lines are (you can’t kid a kidder) and (some) alcoholic men (dry or sober) are very dangerous because they see us caring, co-dependent chumps coming. We’re (including the OWs) just a distraction from the work they need to do on themselves.

    Dear KitKat I would URGE you to get the hell out of that relationship. Go strict No Contact and fight for everything that is yours. I would also highly recommend books by Melody Beattie who is ace on codependency recovery because you need to fix this in and for yourself to truly heal.

  • I agree with CL, get Gregor Clegane (Game of Thrones reference; Damn did you see last week episode?) as your attorney and fight for what you’ve worked for. Why in the hell should douche-nozzle and this ridiculous OW get the house?

    . . . “tattoos of cartoon animals having sex” . . . I can’t help but laugh at that one. Imagine how sexy and edgy this will look with she’s in her 50’s and up. (snicker).

    • Ugh! Game of Thrones was brutal this week…and I fear heads are going to roll for my favorite little man next week : ( I love my attorney…but Gregor “The Mountain” Clegane would be an AWESOME choice too!

      • I preferred the viper, he had integrity, unfortunately, he had too much arrogance at the end…don’t worry about our favorite little man. Read the books, way better than the series!

  • I absolutely HATE when a cheater pulls this shit! My soon to be XH must be working directly from the “cheaters handbook”! When his affair with a married coworker detonated both marriages I should have kicked him to the curb and run for my life. But no…being the softie that I am I agreed to try reconciliation. After a year of MC, IC and NC (yeah, right!!) with the affair partner I really thought we were going to make it! Then the AP called me at work to set my pretty little head straight…yes, the affair had continued all through our “reconciliation”. I moved out of our home, the AP moved in and I filed for divorce ASAP. Now I get frequent texts from stbxh saying that he has never wanted to be divorced from me and he hopes we can have a “happy ending”. Really?!? You are living with your affair partner in OUR home, she is parking her ass on OUR furniture and f**king you in OUR bed…and you have the balls to say you hope we can have a happy ending? That is some seriously delusional thinking right there! We all have choices to make in this life. Stbxh chose the AP instead of his marriage and I’m choosing to divorce his sorry ass no matter how difficult he makes it!!

    • Mine said this too. He had already moved in with his latest OW for a couple months, and said “I hope we will eventually work out”. I said how is that gonna work? What does your GF think about that? Bet she doesn’t know, LOL.
      But there it was, clear as day. I’m his back-up plan. He wants to string me along in case he may need me at some point, probably in old age. LOL!!! He’s gonna in for a surprise 🙂
      They really are delusional.

    • Delusional is the right term! They want to keep us as a back-up plan, or at least just string along the kibble supply as long as possible, while reminding themselves that THEY have the control, ‘we aren’t the boss of them’. and delusionally thinking there will be no consequences for their choices; they’ll just do what they want, and then later they’ll do whatever the hell else they want, including taking money they didn’t earn, and maybe coming back to us, or maybe not!

      Such babies! It’s really amazing. And some get SO MAD when we make our own choices, and enforce our boundaries!

      Several months after DDay #2 and my kicking his ass out, followed by months of his clearly choosing to be with the OW to the exclusion of everything else (including parenting our kids) the ex said to me ‘this is just temporary, right?’. Really, what planet are they living on?????

      • My STBXH also just said, “if I had thought this was arrangement [over the past 5 months] was permanent, I never would have agreed to it!” referring to our visitation agreement I suppose.. but when I read into it, I think he is referring to our marriage as well LOL. Guess living in the family basement with OW and taking her on vacations to your mom’s instead of spending time with our son on weekends wasn’t all you cracked it up to be!

    • Sounds like living with her isn’t all fun and games. Now that it’s real, he’s not so much in love with her.

      • Yes, diana! Two lying, morally bankrupt cheaters playing house. I think we can all recognize that this isn’t going to end well ; )

      • Lol! My STBX and his fuckbuddy are still sneaking around, referring to each other mysteriously as their ‘friend’ or ‘guest’, even though both I and her husband have kicked their cheating arses out!

        I think now that they’re ‘free’ to be together they don’t really know what to do with themselves. They finally have the blissful happy future they longed for but unfortunately not everyone else is falling into line (duh!). Our children are refusing to go to his place while she’s living there, most of their work colleagues are shunning them and so are most of their family and friends.

        I think they’re still sneaking and covering up because they’re starting to realise that it’s not so much fun when the affair is suddenly not an affair anymore. No secrecy! No thrills! No drama!

        D’oh. Facepalm moment. I guess that’s why he’s been ramping up the I’m sorry emails and can we be friends, interspersed with angry phone calls and passive aggressive digs. He’s missing his drama fix. He needs to get me involved again for things to be thrilling.

        I swear, CL, this place really is like therapy. You do so much good. Thank you.

        • “I guess that’s why he’s been ramping up the I’m sorry emails and can we be friends, interspersed with angry phone calls and passive aggressive digs”

          If you become friends with him, then in HIS eyes, what he did wasn’t so ‘bad’. It’s like, having sex with an abuser right after an abusive episode. The abuser figures that as long as you ‘let them’ have sex with you, you are accepting them…abuse and all…so the abuse really isn’t “that” bad.

          This is why reconciliation needs to be very C-A-R-E-F-U-L-L-Y thought out before making the decision to reconcile. If you take them back TOO SOON, they tend to believe that what they did wasn’t that bad. It eases their guilt.

    • These assholes think they can talk their way into and out of everything.

      Oh KitKat, don’t give him a damn thing and don’t listen to his shit. How dare he mindfuck insult, then apologize (oh, he is scared all right–perhaps she will be really mad with me now and I won’t get any kibbles) and continue his mindfuckery. It’s hard to believe that people are like this, but these cheaters really are. They do not change. My ex does not. Hot and cold and shark under it all. They have no memory, no ability to see how they affect and hurt, or they pretend they don’t because it feels to good (gross).

      He has a “perfect body,” like how, like cheater Dean’s? Yuck.

      I am wondering if your question emerges from the continued belief that we are all human and perhaps he does feel for you since he is dragging his heels on the divorce–perhaps he does value you. Perhaps you are thinking that there may be something to salvage, maybe he really cares. I am not sure if this feeling was in some way motivating your question—Why does he treat me so bad and then want to stay with me?

      My ex does the same exact thing. Hot, cold and shark underneath. Hard to accept. My ex does not either want a divorce and has been dragging his feet (I am making him pay the mediator). I finally figured out that he will say and do absolutely anything to get kibbles (I know CL has been saying this but it’s different to hear and to experience). Your ass will say anything to get what he wants out of you (such as keeping his I-want-only-to-do-right-although-I do-make mistakes-like-we-all-do- image.) he does not get to control the narrative or the consequences of his actions. You do.

      I am so happy you are financially well. Hire a kick ass lawyer and don’t give that horrible excuse for a human being anything anymore. When I do this, my life is so much better, but I have a kid so I can’t go completely no contact–I do wish I could. I think you should take this golden opportunity and drop his sorry ass to the curb.

  • Yeah, fuck that, KitKat. I’m with ChumpLady. Get a strong lawyer, and never talk to him again. He’ll settle fast enough. AND, fuck yeah, don’t roll over on giving him all your shit. Take away those puppet strings. Leave a cheater, gain a life!!

    My ex kinda tried that. He had the affair, he moved out, he filed – but then I wanted to waive the 120 day waiting period, get it done before the new tax season, that kind of took him by surprise…next thing we hear from his lawyer, oh he wants to come to agreement but wants to wait another few months. Both the attorneys were like, WTF? so he backed down on that pretty quick.

    He’s jerking you around because he CAN. Quit letting him. Pretty heady stuff there – so you know what? Let him do that with his future chumps. You are outa there!

    And seriously? “I performed the pick me dance with the fervor of a thousand river dancers” THAT’S funny!!

    • Stand up to a bully, and they often will retreat. When I started just saying “No” to all of the machinations and manipulations and you name it…he turned his attention elsewhere once and for all. And like to say around here – my past is her future 🙂

      But I can’t stress enough how effective it can be to just go through respective attorneys. Let them talk to each other. You stay out of it, except let your attorney do their job on your behalf. The shit that comes through can still be pretty ridiculous, but you are more removed from it and you can start to get perspective on how insane this person really is – and then you can be, I cannot wait until my hearing!

      • Oh I like that Jerseygirl. I am saying no more. There was a great post the other day about not buying into their bull shit and simply stating that.

        Yesterday I got an email from poor me ex saying that he did not ask me about our child’s recital because I have been “unpleasant” to him in prior emails. (you see if he actually addresses what I wrote he will have to address what I actually said–so much easioer to say I am being “unpleasant” I wrote back, “I don’t buy that you were brave enough to write this email, just another passive aggressive act to then say poor me. No surprise there!”

        • Many typos, apologies, rather: “I don’t buy that. You were brave enough to write this email. Just another passive aggressive act to then say ‘poor me’ (not finding out about the recital and thereby not coming). No surprise there.”

    • e!Sometimes there’s no choice on that stuff, and in the end, it’s only stuff, and money – not the essentials of life, although damned unfair and sad.

      But totally worth at least fighting for, if the lawyers honestly think there’s a chance.

  • I posted a while back about my <>lawyers. Really! Total pit-bulls, as in Big Time Bitches (I’m a dog person, so that’s actually a compliment in this context.) As I said before, they were fierce for me, when I could not be fierce for myself.

    Further, both of them were very willing to be paid in installments. As women and family attorneys, and feminist family attorneys who also did a lot of LGBT work, they both understood the need for FAIRNESS and that sometimes when you need it, you’re also broke.(One did my post-nup, and acted as mediator with a no-conflict of interest clause; the other was purely in the ring for moi). I love those ladies, and you need somebody of that caliber, stat.

    In my opinion, tell your former-drunk hubster what is, and what isn’t, and he can like it or lump it. Through an attorney, just as CL says.

  • KitKat – I’m so glad you wrote to CL. It sounds to me like your head clearly knows the answer, the right thing to do, but your poor heart is still yearning for the nightmare not to be true. Your heart wants to continue to believe he’s a good guy that just lost his way for a little bit, he really is the man who has professed to love you all those years. Your heart wants to hold on to this last little sliver of hope, connection to the what you thought your life really was. But, it sounds like your head knows the truth, your head knows that the sliver that you are holding onto is the last strand from the Unicorns mane that you have had your hands dug into, holding onto for dear life. By writing this letter, I think, your head is sending the gentlest possible message to your heart that it is time to open your fingers and let that last strand go.

    I’m so sorry that this is happening to you. I’m sorry that all of us have had this horrific experience at the hands of the one who was supposed to love and care for us most. I do understand that due to how the asset columns add up that you might have to let him have the house, and if so, that you are going to have to suffer the pain of that woman or some other enjoying what YOU built and created. But, CL is right here. Go TOTAL NO CONTACT, and GO get a pit bull attorney. If you must let the house go, I promise that the triggers and pain of someone else living in YOUR home and sitting on YOUR furniture, etc. DO subside. There will be a day when you suddenly tilt your head and realize, “Huh, he hasn’t occurred to me once today!” … and the fastest way to that moment is NO CONTACT.

    Its time to let go of that last strand, Kitkat. It’s OK now to totally puff yourself up and take and protect what is yours to build YOUR future. His is no longer your concern.

    BIG HUGS/Power and Strength to you.

    • I agree, it feels like her heart still yearns for him.
      I’ve been divorced since last July, and just last week at my therapist I was musing about my X, and said-I still love the guy I THOUGHT he was.
      She jumped on that comment, and told me I’m starting to see reality, and my feelings are aligning with the truth. But, it takes a long time, the whole thing is just so crazy. Thank God, it does happen, with enough separation from the gaslighter!

      • Yes, one of the hardest things for me to deal with are my feelings that I still love him. It was easy for him to flip the switch and suddenly feel nothing for me. But even though I know we do not belong together and will be better off, I can’t find that switch.

        • I know what you mean Moving Liquid, I can’t find that “switch” either, but I am working on it.

    • “But, it sounds like your head knows the truth, your head knows that the sliver that you are holding onto is the last strand from the Unicorns mane that you have had your hands dug into, holding onto for dear life. By writing this letter, I think, your head is sending the gentlest possible message to your heart that it is time to open your fingers and let that last strand go.”
      I’m here at this point, is it insane to try and hold on to that last strand??? I know that it is and I hope that my heart will catch up to my head soon cause this last strand is causing me grief I don’t need or want at this point.

      • Deel, for several months post-DDay #2, I clung to that strand, because my heart hadn’t caught up to my head. But I kept ACTING on what my head knew. There was still grief, but there wasn’t the intense on-going suffering of the pick-me dance. And mercifully, grief does pass.

        • Thanks KarenE, I had been doing pretty good for a long while now but recently I just feel a sadness that I can’t shake. It’s like I don’t feel that what I was put through was all that bad but then when I read things like the “on-going suffering of the pick-me dance” I get smacked up side the head with the reality of it all. I guess it really is one step forward and two back for a long while.

  • Well, having an affair is fun! It’s a fantasy! No fights about taking out the trash. It’s so naughty! But wait! Now I’m free to marry YOU? And you are bugging me about it, because you want to be married? You want more accountability and less fantasy? Hey now. I kinda like this inbetween space. I have a wife, who gives me respectablity, but I can’t stay home and listen to her bitchin’. And I have you, who is satisfied with living off our dreams, with no effort from me… why end that delusion???

    • So incredibly true. If I may add, he wants to maintain the status quo. What is that? Unfortunately it’s using and abusing you. He was doing it before when his cheating was secret. Now it’s out in the open. It feels good to treat you like trash and he’s got the nasty ow backing his behavior to make it ok. Don’t be his dump anymore. He’s not interested in interacting with you, only using you. Like I said this dynamic was happening before, you just didn’t know it. (Happened to all of us). YOU are not trash and do not deserve the abuse. He is the trash. Hopefully you will hire someone to take him out. Metaphorically that is.

  • There will be 300 replies to this before it’s done, but you’ve already heard what you need to do: get a pitbull lawyer, go no-contact, and fight for yourself. If you don’t want the house, force a sale. At least the porn star OW won’t be living in it. It’s only money. Get a lawyer. You will spend up front and save big time in the end, especially if you get the house. At worst, you will know you stood up for yourself against a lying, cheating bully. That’s priceless.

    And take very seriously what Mikky and MichaelD said. I think there is a good chance he isn’t sober or has just shifted from drinking to other addictive behaviors. Don’t assume you know everything that is going on with him. Whether he is sober or not–he LIES. He manipulates. He is into control. And get yourself into counseling to address the codependency. You need to stop caring about what he does, what he says, what he thinks, what he needs, what he wants. He showed you what he is when he took up with a skank who became “a porn star during her last marriage to save her house from foreclosure, has tattoos of cartoon animals having sex (I wish I was making this up), barely made it through high school, brags about how she won’t cook, clean or do yard work.” This is who he is, what he wants. Believe him. And I tell you this as a recovering codependent who is in therapy every week. You have been living in a sick world. It will take you a while to get your mind and heart in line with healthy living. Get the help.

    What do you want? What do you need? And what is the path to your awesome life? You’ve got a great education, a good job and a big, loving heart. Stop talking to him! Stop listening to the poison he’s feeding you! Get a lawyer and fight but let him do the talking! And figure out the kind of life you want and go after it. Put your energy into building that. If you want a fresh start, get the house ready to put on the market. Keep a list of the time and money you spend to get that back once it’s sold. Or if you want to keep it, start dreaming of how you want the house to be for YOU. Let the lawyer handle your STBX. You handle you.

    In the end, take a look at your resources and don’t be afraid to spend what you need to spend to fix this problem. If you wrecked a car, you would take a financial hit but you would get another car because transportation is essential. Your life has been wrecked. Don’t be afraid to dip into your resources to fix that life and heal yourself. I just took another $20K from my meager retirement because there is so much maintenance to do on my house, all things the Jackass promised he could do for the cost of materials. But to be free of a man who couldn’t be trusted to go to a funeral home without hooking up with a skank–priceless. Your happiness, your peace, you–priceless.

    • Yes Lovedajackass-thank you for comment. “Stop talking to him!” – YES- I remember being really perplexed by my friend saying this to me-it seemed so unreasonable, even unkind!! But that’s because we’re still invested in saving someone else and not ourselves.

    • All great advice, LAJ. My pitbull lawyer put in the divorce decree that our house had to be sold, but I do wish they had worded it differently. There needs to be a date on there, so Fucktard can’t drag it out forever! I’m just getting it on the market now, and it’s been almost a year! Too dragged out for me, I want this over. They use the house as a way to stay tied to you, and mess with your head.

      • PattyToo – interesting. I’m coming from the opposite side. I kicked him to the curb before he knew what was happening and here I am in the house by myself and loving it. I’m sure he initially thought he had full control of me and wanted to move his skank here. Anyway, beat him to it and now *I* want to drag it out as long as I can. After all, everybody says, after a death or a cheater fucks you over, you shouldn’t make any decisions for a full year. So, even though his D papers came back saying we need to market the house immediately (but no date specified!), I’m fighting to keep it til next spring. So, thanks for that tidbit of forgetting something as important as a DATE. Just another viewpoint but I see your urgent point with some Fucktard dragging it out. Cheaters shouldn’t be allowed to do that – only CHUMPS! Good luck.

        • Heehee
          Enjoy YOUR house!
          I made out quite well, I got away, moved 900 miles west, and love my new life very much!
          Just wish I could get my (tiny) equity out of my house.

    • Hallelujah to house maintenance!

      I repaired a tile in MY shower last week. Two years ago, the fuckhead put white duct tape over it because he couldn’t bother. It wasn’t a priority. I had to replace drywall behind it but the job is done. The fh did not care about me, his family or our home. I had my son take a picture before I started the job. If I had a facebook account, I’d post that picture titled “married to a lying, fucking cheater” and an after picture I’d title “life improves every day” or something snarky.

      MY house looks better now that I’m free. I have a new roof, new gutters. I’ve trimmed the trees, cleaned up the woodpile, and put in a new flower bed. I’ve planted trees where the fh’s boat used to be.

      • Joy-filled,
        I am so inspired by you. Here our legal system is different so I have to wait a year before I can file for divorce and due to my financial situation I am having to hold off on any form of property settlement but it is only for a season and then I am going to fight for my home (the only home my three kids have ever known) STBX has threatened to put the house on the market without my consent. Good luck on that one buddy, try it and I will have you for fraud as well as being a total dick for brains.
        But you reminded me of a funny issue that happened here. Our bathroom is horrid and a year ago we extended our mortgage to cover doing it up. STBX lost his job so he sat on his ass for 2 months as he knew we had money to cover any bills and yes you guessed it the money went and the bathroom is still horrid. in the weeks leading up to D’day he replaced a towel rail it took him three days to install and then Yep recently it fell down. My eldest children laughed their heads off at it. A true indication of his skill and ability.
        I am handy and what I cant do I am happy to get help on but have been advised not to touch the house until settlement. I cant wait to make it mine and see all the plans he encouraged me to dream about how we would fix it up come to pass. I now know that he had no intent of ever doing this house up, 13 years of dreaming all met with PA, gaslighting, mindfuckery. the joke is that he wants to sell the house as he believes that everything should be split 50/50. Yet depending on who you speak to he is also out there professing he dose not want a divorce, and wants to save our marriage.
        thank you to what everyone has shared it put so much into perspective.

      • It feels so good to be competent. We should train all our daughters and granddaughters in home repair, and general auto knowledge

        • And our sons how to cook, invite people to dinner, and rock a baby to sleep! Let’s hear it for competence!!! Nothing inspires self-confidence better.

          • well put KarenE,
            Maybe that is one for Chump Lady, how we can do our best to brake this cycle for our kids.

          • I’m a man who can cook, invite people to dinner and rock a baby to sleep. Also clean house and pick clothes for men, women and children. Home repair and general auto knowledge, though ….

            • ANR,
              this is funny, mine could cook if you like to eat the same thing all the time, He would invite people to dinner but wait till the day before while at work and the house looked like a bomb had gone off before telling me, Rock a baby to sleep mine morned the fact he could not breast feed our kids (BIG RED FLAG). clean house when it suited him and OMG pick clothes could not go past an op shop without having to try one half a dozen items. Home repairs (LOL) “what does that need fixing I didn’t notice” General auto knowledge “what’s that you say the oil that has come out of your engine you think is from your gearbox I don’t think so” Mechanic ” you have ripped a hole in your gearbox I managed to fix it but you should keep an ear out in case you start to hear any funny noises. Me ” Would that be like a metal on metal sound I have been listening to for the last 4 months”
              Being on my own with three kids is going to be a freaking holiday compared to the last 20 years

              • Ha! Well, we all have our forte, One of my least favourite parts of my marriage was the rule that all home repairs were my job because I was a man. It would go like this: we’d decide something needed to be done.
                Me: Let’s call Brian [local handyman]
                Her: That’s so expensive
                Me: Well, I could try to do it
                Her: You’d just fuck it up and it would cost more to have it repaired. And I don’t know how to do it!

                So I’d call people, from work, to get quotes, because that was my job.
                We’d get the quotes. My wife would find then too high.
                Me: They’re all around the same. I don’t think we can get it done for less
                Her: It’s so expensive..Let’s just leave it for a bit

                (six months later)
                Her: WHEN are you going to do something about ….?

              • What do you think wanting to breastfeed babies is big red flag OF, other than being a freak?

      • Joy-filled, yep, indeed. There is nothing like home maintenance to give us a lady boner, as Rumblekitty would say. I had a hard time over mowing the 2 acres last weekend, but friends came to help and now I know I can do it. Getting the outside painted, turning an unused garden shed into a place to consolidate the woodpiles (plural), planting flowers, building a fire pit–making a sanctuary for myself and people I love. And there is nothing better than planting trees!

          • First thing I did when I figured out *I* had control once I kicked him out (gosh, that was so easy) was fixing up everything in the house he wouldn’t/couldn’t be bothered to do. Btw – this is because he was spending all his energy on when he could get a fuck in with his 2-1/2 yr fuckbuddy. (classic red flag of cheating is when they lose interest in the family home.) We began to argue over window cleaning, power-washing expenses, you name it.

            Anyway, 2 months later and here I am. House looks like new. Some I had to hire out but the rest, it was good therapy getting done, including ripping out the planted areas Ho put in. Used CL’s advice to Round-It-All-Up. Never felt so much in control in my life and my house is now ready for….me to live in…until it sells, that is.

        • LAJ, the bit about the yard made me think. In all the years, I was the one who did most of the (95%) of the home responsibilites like mowing the yard, laundry, taking care of the vehicles (I used to work in the auto industry so I could just bring them in for the shop to fix them). I can remember mowing the yard on many a mother’s days while all the neighbors drove past and waved. Here I was busting my ass with my two small children outside with me while dickwad didn’t lift a finger. Recently, I just installed new light fixtures outside and learned how to fix some plumbing issues. It is sad that I used to think he was such a smart great guy that could do all this stuff when in reality, I can do it just as well if not better than him. My house, garden, and property are looking awesome and guess what, it is all on me. 🙂 The sanctuary provides some peace and calmness – keep making it your space.

  • I agree with all others here, stay the course, go NC, and get a kickass lawyer. You will feel so much better, I promise!

    I don’t have children with my STBX either. I went NC immediately, and we were mostly NC for a year (by mostly I mean we had to talk about filing taxes together, medical stuff, etc.). He spared me the mindfuck by not contacting me wanting to get back together.

    I filed for divorce last month so I could time it right with a potential promotion coming up (otherwise I would have done it MUCH sooner). Still no “I want to save our marriage” from him–again I thank him for that.

    But what’s odd is that he is making zero effort to get this divorce expedited quickly. He’s totally dragging his feet, and I don’t think he had any intention of filing for divorce. I stopped the kibble supply early and fast, yet he still doesn’t want to divorce me? He’s the one that left! He’s the one that cheated! It’s a whole lot of WTF!

    Good for you for filing, keep that NC going!! Enduring this bullshit will pay off!

      • Oooh that could be, Diana. I know she would have to divorce her husband too and get child support in order for her three kids in order to make that happen. Ahh, long lost LOVE! LOL! 😉

          • Yes, mine wanted to stay on my health insurance because he developed a medical problem. The divorce happened and he can now be on COBRA indefinitely unless he qualifies for other insurance or marries the OW. Now he is incentivized to avoid remarrying. He also felt so entitled that he wanted 100% of our assets, and didn’t want to divorce and split them fairly 50/50. We are non-persons who never made demands and they don’t want that to change. Too bad!

            • Meg – I thought I could get on Cobra for the rest of my life. WRONG. It’s only temp insurance. That was an eye-opener for me so I am demanding he pay for any med insurance I need for the rest of my life. I have a pre-existing condition so I need to get that in as part of my settlement.

              • Yeah, you can only do COBRA for 3 years so far as I recall and it cost twice as much.

  • You can’t force feed someone filet mignon when they think table scraps slop is the best around.

    You are filet mignon, and don’t ever forget it! Find an attorney who will protect you and your future, which is sure to be better without such a low life.

  • KitKat, The best thing you can do is use a lawyer to communicate with him and stop talking to him at all. It’s just impossible for your ex not tug on your heartstrings and manipulate you like he’s been doing throughout marriage. It takes some time away from the CRAZY to make you see more clearly. Your ex will take advantage of your mixed emotions and confusion to get what he wants.

    I have to admit that my lawyer wasn’t a pit bull. I couldn’t afford a pit bull, so I hired a young lawyer in a pit bull’s firm who charged less. She did step in and stop my ex from talking me into doing a couple of dumb things, like paying “rent” for the house I wasn’t living in. Honestly, I wish she’d have been more aggressive but she took her cues from me and I was scared to death of spending too much money on a lawyer.

    The biggest concession I received from my ex was due to me driving to our old house, standing on our porch and making a speech about why I deserved a decent maintenance agreement after all the years I spent supporting him and his career. My ex actually came back with an acceptable number after that. It made me sick to have to justify my worth to my ex, but it was effective. My lawyer didn’t seem to be getting anywhere at that point so I decided to move the game forward myself.

    It’s all so hard, KitKat. My heart goes out to you. The best thing you can do is stop talking to him at all. You have filed for divorce, you don’t have kids in common. Take a vacation from crazy. You’ll see how much better you feel!

  • KitKat, the first thing you need to remember is this m—–f—– is not your friend. So stop being nice. Mediation is for “nice” divorces. Your husband is not being nice.

    I did the whole “let’s not piss him off, tee-hee” thing because I was in a vulnerable financial situation– Like I was a full-time graduate student with no real source of income at his urging. He walked out and ran off with a hoe-bag who thought she was special.

    I did not confront him about the affair. He was no longer privy to my thoughts and intentions. Any limited interactions we had I stayed quiet and dumb. I am not dumb. He should have known better.

    I also needed a settlement that at minimum was fair and knew he would do anything he could to make my life a living hell. So I stayed quiet. Guess what? He got pissed off anyway.

    He got pissed off because when he wanted to move back into the house to make his fucknest, I refused to accept his paltry offer. He got pissed off because I asked for temporary support. He got pissed off because when he tried to break in I had added a deadbolt– never mind my personal safety living alone in a rural area. He got pissed off because the eleventy other things he was trying to get away with were halted. He got pissed off because he is a fuckface. It is just that simple.

    I never raised my voice. I never begged. I never got angry. I never confronted him. There was absolutely no reason for the hatred. Other than he is a fuckface.

    In the end, despite the fact he had the bitch, was going to get the house, his car(s), his vacations, and most of his money, he still dragged his feet, changing the settlement every time we were about to sign, yanking both attorneys around, etc. The benefit of keeping everyone hanging in the rafters is that a stasis was created– the bitch was still waiting, the wife could not move on, he was moving attorneys around like pawns, and his parents were still kissing his sorry ass.

    This is what your ex is doing. Don’t let him. The one thing I wish I learned earlier was the word, exquisite, simple, and unapologetic was “no.” No, I will not accept the offer. No, he cannot do that. No, I am not going anywhere. No, he doesn’t quite have that right.

    You don’t have to put up the good fight, but you do have to learn “no”. Say “no” to the bullshit. It basically says, “You go on and fuck around. I will just continue to garden and balance my checkbook until you get it together.”

      • I do not understand why anybody would want to drag out expensive attorney fees. My H decided to hire the most expensive attorney in our state – why? Not sure. I’m not a big foe or wanted anything other than 1/2. Meanwhile, I hired a local attorney for a 1/4 the price. Now he is stuck paying his attorney big money (and my attorney, as well) and actually complaining about it. The more he drags this out by not accepting my tough settlement, the more he has to pay up. He’s allergic to attorney fees so I’m hoping this will work in my favor. Yeah, he’s such a smart guy. hoho

  • Right on, Doc!

    Kitkat-this guy is doing all this because keeping it all in limbo puts him center stage. There is no point going out for revenge against a narcissist, the best revenge is “No”. Thank goodness you haven’t bred with this fucktard.

    I am still at the same stage you are, and heeding the advice of Chump nation-cancel your subscription to the crazy!


  • Kit Kat-

    Everything CL said and what everyone else has said! Get the pit-bull lawyer and go NC. Due to the fact that my children are adults I’ve been pretty much NC with my ex; save for a few loose ends for finances. I can’t tell you how healing it is not to have anything to do with him anymore. The farther out you get from that mess, the more clarity you get.

    We’ve all heard the quote “can’t see the forest through the trees”. I swear that quote was especially made for chumps who are married to lying, cheating, manipulative asshats. As chumps, we really can’t see the forest through the trees in that we can’t see how fucked up our lives are with these morons until we’ve extricated ourselves from their tangled webs!

    I haven’t gotten quite to Meh yet (although I hear it’s a Tuesday), but I always feel like it’s within my grasp the longer I go without even having to email the ex. Let your pit-bull do the talking and get busy rebuilding your new, asshat free life!

    Lots of hugs your way!

  • Dear Kit-Kat,

    You are a great writer. I cracked up over several of your lines–“the fervor of a thousand river dancers” is particularly witty.

    I once heard an obese person say that one of the few virtues of being overweight was that she had plenty of time to hone her sense of humor and resilience because there were so many nasty people willing to target her for her size. I think, perhaps, chumps have this same silver-lining of an opportunity. We learn to laugh at and make others laugh about some of the horrible things that have happened because sometimes there is just so little else to do with the pain. Your post makes me want to have coffee with you, and before you left, I’d give you my lawyer’s phone number. And I wouldn’t let you pick up the tab, because I have a sneaking suspicion you’ve been too well trained by your jackass to do that without even thinking about it.

    There is no excuse for anyone to have treated you as you’ve been treated. It is time for you to exert some control. Who cares if the lawyer gets too much of the money. I can think of lots of lovely lawyers who will make better use of it than that jackass you are divorcing will. And it might make you smile more to see him dancing with the gracelessness of a club-footed river dancer in court when he tries to justify himself at a hearing. (I know, most of his behavior won’t “count” in court, but judges still know jackasses when they see them and can be scathing even when they can’t give you the settlement you deserve).

    He’s a shameless jerk, so you have to stop hoping for good, reasonable, or even human behavior from him and treat him the same way you’d treat a nest of wasps or a rattler on your front porch. Venomous critters musts simply be removed–there’s no point in expecting them to be civil.

  • “Doesn’t matter that he doesn’t want you to move on — YOU’RE MOVING ON”

    Really understanding this is key, I think. He doesn’t have superpowers, and he’s no longer your partner, so he no longer has any input into your agenda. I’d stop consulting with him if I were you and get an attorney that will tell you what you are entitled to in a settlement (Abraham Lincoln said something about being your own attorney that might apply in this case), and cutoff all communication because your tone doesn’t seem to be coming from a position of disinterested detachment, and you are going to need somebody who is professional and detached who can’t be manipulated by him to deal with the divorce process most likely.

  • Hi KitKat,
    When my divorce first started, I had every intention of being fair and splitting things down the middle. Even though frankly, he wasn’t entitled to everything we had worked for because he spent his money on guns and sports shit and I spent the rest on fun stuff like mortgages and food. I was still going to do it anyway, being the fair chump that I am.

    But as usual in these divorce situations, the cheater almost immediately will go back on everything you agreed on and SURPRISE! will try to fuck you out of the house, savings accounts, etc. I had to protect myself. When all was said and done, he’s living in a square box in a shit part of town with his new crunchy-haired hole, and I have the dream house in MY name. (Tonight, I’m BBQing chicken!) He can suck butt.

    I’m glad things panned out this way because this fucker deserved exactly what he got from me, NOTHING. Your STBX is probably exhausting to deal with at this point and I understand that, but you don’t have to play nice. Don’t let him drag you down. He’s fucking a woman with cartoons engaged in sex acts for Christ’s sake! Let him have his true lurve and let it the Universe work it’s magic. 🙂

    Get you a bad ass lawyer, stop communicating with him, and if he has anything else to discuss, tell him to go through the lawyers. You don’t need this shit.

    He’s nothing to you now, just another dirt-bag cheater trying to manipulate you so he can drag this shit out another couple of years to benefit himself. They all do the same thing believe me . . .

  • And I need to stop dropping words in my sentences . . .

    He’s fucking a woman with TATTOOS of cartoons engaged in sex acts for Christ’s sake!

      • No its REALLY creepy, and whats really sad she is going to end up with the house, and prob divorce him or throw him out so the pig wins in the end. Yea that makes me wanna puke. She better get a 2 pit bulls & a big ass sledge hammer !

        Hey mom this is X yea she used to get banged in the ass for cash,,,, yup I( lurve) her mom shes a keeper I want to have kids with her,,,what ?? Does she have aids or an STD idk. The tats ?? Oh dont worry its only Bugs Bunny & Jessica Rabbit ,,see she like cartoons shes gonna be a great mommy 🙂

  • Go back and read Chumplady’s most brilliant post ever – Cheaters, You’re Not Entitled to Reconciliation from May 26th. For as predictable as his behavior is now (but honey, I never wanted a divorce) the next stage is fast approachng and goes on and on and frickin on.

    The upcoming stage is what Tracy so eloquently addressed on May 26th and your husband’s behavior now is the customary precursor. You were wrong and he was right – end of story.

    This is why no contact is vital now. It will clear your head but also limit the emotional ammunition that he is stockpiling. Do not communicate with him. Nothing.

    And the bulldog lawyer suggestion. I was lucky enough to know Tracy when I was interviewing attorneys and the advice was seared in my brain. At the end of the divorce process when I was so fatigued I could hardly function, let alone make a series of decisions that would impact the rest of my life, my strong and wise lawyer handled it all. Thank God because had she not, my life would not be filled with the peace and joy it is today.

  • Hi everyone! First I want to thank you all for your support and excellent insight. This site has been amazing to read through over the last few months and has let me know that my STBX dude is not that original after all (except maybe for the porn star part – he gets a gold star for that!)

    Some updates and clarifications on my situation –

    When I wrote this, I was 99.856% sure he was still with Porn Princess but only through circumstantial evidence. Since then, there was a You Tube video posted of them together from an event a few weekends ago. And a few days after that, he texted me saying he didn’t want to accept we’d be apart forever. Barf. She is nearly 50 (about 8 years older than me) so I don’t think they have any plans to reproduce. Since they have been together, I’ve noticed that she wears long pants to cover up all the tats. When I would see her before she got involved with my H, she always had as much of her body exposed as possible since she was so proud of all that ink. I think her new man insists she cover herself up now, which is awesome. In fact, when she started working with him (in a professional setting) he had to tell her to buy some new clothes to look the part because she just couldn’t figure that out on her own.

    The business I helped him start (and worked at for free while also working at my day job) failed after a year. We lost nearly everything we put into it and our credit was shot as a result. He now works back in his original industry at a small firm and hired ho bag a little over a year ago.

    As far as him getting the house, thanks to the stupid, no-fault laws in this state, I may not have a choice but to walk away from it. What he put into the business was all his retirement money, so he has none and I have quite a bit. I have a lawyer and he’s telling me I’d be coming out ahead if I walked with that and he got the house. It still doesn’t seem fair. I wouldn’t be surprised if when designing the financing for the business, he set me up to be at a disadvantage if I ever left.

    He did go through AA right when his health problems surfaced because his doctor’s said he would need to do that if a transplant was required. As soon as he got cleared for not needing a transplant, he stopped going to meetings because “those people are all a bunch of losers that have the same problems, drinking or not.” So yeah – dry drunk for sure. I really don’t think he is drinking again.

    Thanks again – you all have been great and your excellent responses couldn’t have come at a better time. I know what I need to do, I just need to do it!

    • Your lawyer is pulling the old “be afraid to lose your retirement” thing. At least, the lawyer should help you make the argument that he invested his retirement in a business that failed–even though you helped him with that. Everything is about the narrative, the story you tell. The Jackass’s ex-wife beat the shit out of him in court by telling a bald-faced lie about a house she had sold years ago. I would make the argument that he owes you for the failed business and for supporting him through his illness. That sounds like the truth to me. Just a thought.

      • That is, don’t let the lawyer talk you into starting out “reasonable” and giving away the house, your pension, whatever. Ask for what is fair in your mind, based on his contributions, your contributions, and his failed business. In my state, the law is “equitable distribution,” not “equal.” Here, paying off someone’s debts, putting him through school, investing in HIS business is part of the calculation. But only if you make the argument for it. I saw a lawyer who scared me to death about my X (not a cheater) taking my pension. That kept me paralyzed for 6 months. If he had a pension and spent it, if he quit a high paying job to start a business, you should make the argument that yours is off limits. You are both young enough to save for retirement. He is well and healthy now, so he says. If your lawyer won’t fight for you, get a new one.

    • KitKat; I really think you have outdone us all with the PORN QUEEN complete with the BREEDING TATOOS. Seriously, as has been said many times on this site, you couldn’t make this shit up it is so twisted. Man does he have a wake up call ahead.
      Sometimes I think we get stuck because this person we thought we knew so well
      has disappeared and been replaced with a childish, demonic & selfish creep whom you would have NEVER married. It does take a little time to wake up & see this scary scenario for what it is-a nightmare that must be escaped at all costs!! (but keep the costs to you as low as you can!).

  • Jedi hugs Kitkat! I don’t know in a no fault state cos I wasn’t in one. What I do know is that I actually blew thru a lot of money trying to do the divorce “nice”, and no matter what I offered ex, it was never enough. I’m betting you are paying for all the changes in the settlement… So I just brought the hammer down, I filed for abuse, adultery, desertion. Still he “negotiated”, he deserved more you see, hell, he deserved alimony cos he lost his job and couldn’t stop drinking… also he was on my health insurance, finally made a final offer and quit talking, lawyers only, he still put it off until 3 days before our court date. You say he may have set up the business so you get screwed, better find out now if that is true since seems to me that will bear on settlement. Saying all this in response to your remark; “I have more to lose financially in this divorce so I am trying to not piss him off too much.” Believe me he is pissed off, he is talking to a lawyer and he is certain he deserves more of your shit. The tearful crap he is giving you worked before so he’s pulling it. As long as you filed and he has a drop dead date I wouldn’t make any more concessions. I bet he hasn’t answered any of the requirements of the filing, he has no intention of spending the money to actually go to court.

  • ” You need a pit bull lawyer to make his life a bit more miserable now. Why the hell should he get the house? Or a pot to piss in for that matter? I hope you have a damn good reason, like you’re keeping your pension. But if I were you, I’d forget the mediator, only speak to him through an attorney, and tell him he takes whatever (fair to YOU) settlement you offer him, or you’re litigating his ass. You have more money, remember?”

    Best advice you’ll get all day. A good Pit Bull Attorney may cost you a little more up front, but save you thousands and thousands in the long run.

    This man is No. Longer. Your. Friend. –regardless of what kind of bloviating comes out of his mouth. Trust us on this.

  • Even No Fault states have their own quirks in divorce laws.

    My Divorce was in a No-Fault-Community-Property-State. Divorce and property are bi-furcated…i.e. two separate court actions. And there were quirks…separate property could be retained and did not have to be split 50/50, if you could prove adultery, you could waive the 180 day waiting period and get your D in ONE month… and then settle the property at your leisure. This, of course, puts someone with significantly less $ at a disadvantage when litigating property, but that is not the case with you.

    You MUST know all the nuances of the law in your state, and very logically do what will maximize your portion of the settlement. Look at him as a fraudulent business partner who breached contract and is trying to swindle you. Wait a minute….he IS.

  • You know, it truly astounds me when I read Dear Chump Lady letters from Chumps who DON’T realize the fact that THEY, not their cheating ex’s, are holding all the cards.

    I may not be a lawyer and I may be totally ignorant to the divorce process, but I can tell already KitKat that YOU have all the power. You have an education, a great job, and a good income.

    Translation: a) You can afford a high-powered divorce lawyer who can resolve this matter to YOUR satisfaction; b) Whether you get slightly fucked or totally fucked in the settlement, you have the resources to re-build and regain your life, a life COMPLETELY independent of your cheating ex.

    Speaking of doofus, where do you think he’s going to end up? From the way you describe his OW, it sounds like he has a bright, candy-colored future ahead of him, filled with porn DVDs, strip clubs, crystal meth, booze and trashiness. Yeah….he’s going to THRIVE!

    “But wait!” you say! She’s going to business school. Do you mean Harvard Business or one of those 1-800-Diploma-Mill colleges that run commercials during Springer? Boy, she sure sounds like a budding entrepreneur!

    Keeping it real—I do get a sense that you yourself aren’t exactly in a rush to get this settlement signed off on. This is evidenced by your repeated requests for him to “close,” followed by his tears and “What happened?!” sad sausagery. Then he says something hurtful, you cry yourself to sleep, he texts and says sorry, and the cycle repeats itself the next time you try to reach out to him.

    You’re obviously smart enough to know that you’re going to get the same results each time you reach out, no matter how much you try to “nice” him. So why do you keep doing it?

    A part of me thinks you’re in the pained place where you don’t want that fucker or Stripper OW to get ONE cent of your hard-earned money. You don’t want YOUR dollars financing her bullshit, mail-order diploma, and you certainly don’t want your dollars paying for their inevitable trip to the islands.

    And of course you’re smart enough to ask around about pitbull divorce lawyers— but you’re not ready to pull the trigger on that either, are you? It’s okay. We all know EXACTLY what that feels like. But this is where you need to recognize how much power you truly have. You need to steel yourself to the idea that some of your money might end up being placed inside of OW’s pretty pink thong (stripper-style). And most importantly, you need to protect yourself from getting thrown over the barrel once again in a shitty, non-mediated settlement.

    Your husband and his OW sound like low-lives. Remember that every low-life has a price. If your husband is truly how you’ve described him, with his middle-aged head placed firmly up the ass of Spring Breakapalozza and re-capturing his lost youth, then he’s probably not going to put up much of a fight and will take whatever he can get his hands on. He’ll splurge his settlement on Little Miss Stripper Princess, fall even deeper into the bottle, his liver will fail more, OW will split after realizing she’s stuck with an old man with jaundice, and your ex will most likely come back around, once again trying to make his problems your problems.

    This is where you need to take your power back. Find the best divorce lawyer who will get the best settlement for YOU. Your ex is so proud of the fact that he scored himself a brand new Corvette, but we all know that he’s driving a car without brakes. This isn’t Chumpdom. It’s what bookworms call “dramatic irony” (the reader knows more than the characters, e.g. Oedipus Rex). Let him crash and burn and take YOUR life back.

    • Chris – thank you for this awesome post! I’m going to take my power back!!

      I would love to think the two lovebirds’ future will be a trashy paradise. But they are presenting themselves to the world as two star-crossed reformed sinners. He, the ex-alchie business failure and she, the aging ex-porn star (who has quite an impressive filmography on the Internet!) who is working on her two week certificate from a “top business school” (it’s not exactly like she had to beat out thousands of qualified applicants for that spot, the boss just wrote a check). Anyway, reformed fuck-ups or not, they are both current lying, cheating scumbags who destroyed two marriages because no one else understands what it’s like to be them! Waaah!

  • I am living this, daily. He is completely smitten with “his new life” he is riding a mountain bike has quit drinking is going to the gym he refuses to say anything about anything. I get our kids are not about our marriage and I refuse to talk to you about our marriage. I was dancing the remember me dance and got to the point of thinking why am I doing this, I was me all this time. So I mentioned divorce he stalled, he wasn’t sure. Then he mocked me and kept repeating, “do something” about 50 times. There was a drunk conversation, then the next day a very angry husband. Now he was thinking about me but a few days ago said in a snotty voice “no, I don’t think I want you with me” when asked what about our years “that was in the past, I am living for the future” He said that I live in the past, because I have pictures up of our kids, because I remember us which he says “do you have to keep bringing that up”

    I never wanted this to happen, I never thought I would have this happen. I have tried everything under the sun, I think I told everyone on the planet about this, everyone thinks he is crazy expect him the ow and his sister.

    So I typed out a letter with a list of things that were given to us so we can sort our things and he won’t read the entire list, now he says he doesn’t know and is tired, he wants to be left alone, only I can hear fox news in the background.

    He wants to swing his dick out for easy sex and he doesn’t want me but he doesn’t want a divorce even though he has nothing to do with me. I am sure I am a prop wife, he did say I was a good wife, he just doesn’t know why he feels this way. He can’t figure it out, he thinks he can figure it out flirting, fucking and watching the news.

    I just need to shut up and take care of how he looks.

    OMG he even told me to hire a mean lawyer to bring it on, and I think he saved a bunch of money to fight a divorce.

    He doesn’t want me, I don’t understand this. I told him I will find out how he can file and he can and then I can’t stop it, to this, he wanted to go to bed to sleep he was very tired.

    What is all this? He doesn’t want me, and I am now married to a whore. Who wants me to file, but will fight me all the way.

    He also wants me to wait on turning off his phone.

    I am that chump under the slab on the sidewalk who will organize everything for you.

    I finally got to where I can see I will be alone, and he doesn’t want us divorcing. He isn’t with me now, will divorcing be worse? I am really afraid it will be, I didn’t think this would happen, I have really bad luck.

    • Find a family lawyer as soon as possible, beach. He’s mindfucking you.

      Look, he’s abusing you emotionally by flipping back and forth between hot and cold. This keeps you off balance. Some moments you think he really doesn’t care, but at other times you do. You, like so many abused partners, live for the times he cares–even if he cares enough to shit all over you.

      So hire a lawyer and learn your rights. If he out-earns you, then you may be entitled to more. If he is supporting OW in any way, the courts may be friendlier to you. If you both have school-aged children, he will have to pay child support.

      See a financial advisor. Get the documents together, and file.

      Divorce is a process that will take you anywhere from 2 months to a year, depending on your state. The pain is finite. The mindfuck keeps on going.

    • beach, you need to STOP listening to what he says, and watch what he DOES.

      And you need to STOP waiting for him to decide things, and take the initiative.

      It’s not up to him whether you divorce (or when you turn off his cell phone! And why on earth would you be finding out how he can file? Are you his nanny?). It will NOT be worse if you divorce him; max he gets mad for a bit, but then you have PEACE, which you clearly need. He is terribly emotionally abusive; you need a good lawyer to be a protective barrier between you and him.

      But if you need time to figure all this out, your best bet is for sure No Contact. Tell him you won’t be in touch for 3 months. You will be amazed at how much your mind will clear, at how much better you’ll feel. And if he doesn’t respect those three months? It’ll just be one other clear indicator that he has zero respect or consideration for you – which you already know, right?

    • Beach, get out quick. He is absolutely mind-fucking and abusing you. If you can’t trust your judgement right now, then please trust chump nation. His behaviour is sick and cruel. He will keep treating you like this as long as you keep engaging. Stop engaging – you need to be no contact so he can’t mind-fuck you any more. Then you will start to be able to see how dreadful he really is.

  • KitKat – who cares why he doesn’t want a divorce? What do you want? That’s all that really matters. My ex didn’t want a divorce either but I didn’t care at all. In my state, you can get divorced even if the other party doesn’t respond.

    Focus on you and your life without the cheater, and the sooner you get there with a pit bull lawyer, the better. Sending you strength and clarity to finally see that your cheater husband has NO business being in your life, no matter what he thinks.

  • Probably TMI here, but hey, that was yesterday’s post. 😛

    I just came from my lawyer. I called on my wedding anniversary to make an appointment to retain her formally. In fact, I learned that because it’s been a while since our last consultation, I had to do another consultation, and she won’t let me retain her until I have time to look at her fee agreements.

    Why is this relevant?

    It’s relevant because we spent a long time looking at costs. In my marriage, we each have our own financials. We’d be splitting the home equity and the retirement, with a walkaway from anything else. He keeps his etrade account, and I keep the joint savings account. My lawyer said that this was a no-brainer for him to sign. I’m not going after the dissipation of marital assets, nothing extra due to his out-earning me for the majority of the marriage–a really straightforward and very fair settlement. Any lawyer would tell him so.

    Under this scenario–if he’s sane–I’d be able to give the lawyer a nominal retainer fee. Basically, I’d be doing the work and her office would be preparing the documents. We could all sit down in her office for the filing, and we could sign all the settlement papers. In 60 days, we probably wouldn’t have to show up in court. All we’d need to do is agree that we’re all clear. In fact, if we could all play ball together, we could mediate. Cheap divorce!!!

    But if he’s not sane, then mediation won’t work. Then, the traditional divorce would. She’d represent me, and we’d end up going to court. The costs would double, and even triple.

    However, even though he out-earns me by nearly 50%, he’s not put money away. I have. I told the lawyer that 1) if he fights me, I can call up his Schmoopie to tell her that STBX is fighting the divorce, in which case he loses, and 2) if he fights me, I depose Schmoopie to talk about how he supported her, which will make him lose because it’ll be in the public record (and picked up by a background check on both him and Schmoopie), and 3) I have more liquidity saved up. I can outspend him, and he’d still lose out because the law supports me.

    So that’s what I’m telling you. Go with a family law specialist. Go the traditional retainer route. They’ll represent you if you need representation, and if you don’t, they still bill by the hour for what you have them do. Since you have a business, find a pit bull of a lawyer. Ask around.

    Your STBX doesn’t have the right to keep you in the marriage. He can be an asshole about fighting the settlement, but that’s all he can do.

    Dump him and feel better.

  • I think if he’d been the one to initiate the divorce, he would’ve dropped her without looking back…unless she played the pick me dance some more. Then he would’ve basked in how special he was. But she didn’t follow the script and now he’s punishing her for taking back control of her life.
    I also think all the verbal abuse is part of the story he wants to tell when he’s ready to divorce. If she agrees with all the verbal abuse, it confirms his story that she was the screw-up who forced him into the arms of another.
    So ChumpLady is right. Starve him. No contact.

  • I think it is amazing how as you start to say “No” and go NC the cracks start to show in them. In my STBX I have noticed that the cool calm and collected persona he has cultivated over the years no longer exists and that people are actually seeing him for who he is. A nasty, manipulative, self entitled, individual who is willing to use and abuse those he sees as being beneath him. He just has not realized it. And the crap he would pull with me to get me to react to show that I had something mentally wrong with me is loosing its effect. My old church is hoping if they tolerate his crap and show him love and acceptance that he will eventually change. Yes the wife of the man now assigned to assist him in his issues (yet another one, and I am baffled at how he became qualified for the job as he is one of my STBX’s best friends) confided that they are fully aware he has big issues but he needs to recognize these issues for himself (which she also admitted that they recognizes he is nowhere near). So they are willing to travel along with him pretending all is fine while I do my best to avoid him and them. Good Luck! Going NC as much as possible has really helped although when he pops up out of the blue at my new church, it is only a suburb from where I use to go, or I have to speak to him in regards to the kids at pick up and drop off. My anxiety level hits overdrive (i hate shaking involuntarily when I see him but that is where I am at) I am so grateful for the posts, todays have given me food for thought on how to handle situations I am yet to face. Here you have to go through mediation before you can go to court especially if children are involved, he waited till the last minute to respond to letters sent to him in preparation for mediation through a government body as he will not mediate with me privately, he just see’s it as me trying to control him and then has the ordacity to claim victim status. So as a result I now have to go through the whole premeditation parent education seminar crap on how to co-parent. I would rather bang my head on the wall, he does not give a shit about our kids he uses them for kibble. Once in the past when trying to get things into place and he become pissed off at my unwillingness to just give in and let him have what he wanted, he went to my new minister (who is a genuine human being and he and his wife have left the door open to my STXB to enable communication for the sake of our kids but STBX refuses) he has gone to this minister insisting that he make me put my head in or I run the risk of loosing everything if I don’t. Code for she is not doing what she has normally done in the past when I have been able to sway her to think she is wrong and there for has done everything she can to make it up to me. Why does her world no longer revolve around me? You now have control over her make it happen. Sucked in STBX they recognize that I am an independent 42 yr old woman with sound cognitive function allowing me to make my own decisions. Wow isn’t that a novel concept.
    So reading these post shows me I still have a long road ahead of me but there is hope.

  • I really do not get these cheaters…mine said that life with me and the children was “boring”. As soon as he got slapped with child support he now wants 50/50 custody of the kids? Such mindfuckery alright, first I discover the affair and kick him out and rather than show any remorse he is after every penny he can get and now my children….these cheaters are a different type of evil!! I have learned to expect the worse.

  • Just found out my husband of almost 20 years has been cheating on me since before we were married…including right after returning from our honeymoon. I feel like our entire life together has been a lie. He’s confessed to 40+ partners, but there could be more? Now he’s saying he’s in love with the OW, she’s his soul mate and he wants a divorce. That was 4 months ago. He’s still in the house in the guest room and tells me we need to ‘act normal’ so our daughter (or anyone else) doesn’t know what’s going on. He’s unemployed right now and says he can’t move out until he finds a job.

    I’m in shock. I found this website through a Google search. I don’t know what to do.

    • WhatThe…
      Hang in there. Take care of you. Accept all that you feel. Take your time. Just remember that he’s a prick and no matter what he does at this point nothing will ever change. The shock will pass!
      I simply can’t believe 40+ partners! It’s the thrill. Hugs.

    • Why not leave and move in with this soulmate OW? Why doesn’t he want people, including daughter, know about his soulmate/OW?

      • Because it would ruin their relationship and he doesn’t want OW’s reputation tarnished either. I can’t believe I’m even typing this.

        • WhatThe, get your financial info in a safe place asap and watch your finances closely. Get some money out of his reach so you can fight. He obviously wants to stay married and keep the status quo. If you do not want to continue living this lie, then you need a lawyer asap. And for your mental health see a therapist. Jedi Hugs!!

          On the right side of this blog there is a forum you can sign up for and talk about your situation if you like. ChumpLady answers letters too if you want to send her one.

    • He wants a divorce, but he wants to wait until he has a job? You don’t have to agree to that. It would be one thing if he’d been a good husband and this was a friendly thing. He cheated on you. You don’t owe him anything.

      Get a lawyer and find out what your rights are.

  • “I can’t believe I’m even typing this.” Believe it.

    “I feel like our entire life together has been a lie.”

    It HAS been a long, horrible lie.
    Accept that as an absolute truth.

    Read this site from front to back and discover that HE is not a special case… nor are you.

    Use the good advice here to help you bite the bullet and do what you must do.

    Think of him as a cancer which if not treated will be fatal to you. Metaphorically speaking you need to remove the cancer, have the chemo, and get a new “disease free” life. (This process will be just as painful and miserable as treating actual physical cancer.)

    Ask yourself two questions, “Do I want to LIVE?” and “How badly?”

    • I’m actually a cancer survivor, so your metaphor was shockingly familiar. I’m still numb.

      • What’the – I am also a cancer survivor and I sometimes wonder if this turned H to another, ‘healthier’, younger woman to run to. It’s creepy to think of. Sorry for negativity but it is a little piece of this giant puzzle we’re trying to piece together.
        All I know is, by cutting his cancerous piece out of my life, finally and for good (N/C) that my health is much better than it was during those dark earlier days of finding out about his 2 yr affair. You always worry the stress will bring back the cancer, but he may have caused it in the first place! (how’s that for blame, lol) but I sure as hell won’t let him ruin my health enough to allow that cancer to return and do me damage, emotionally or physically. Glad you are well! Keep yourself WELL!

      • Congratulations, WhatThe..!!

        You survived cancer. You can darn near do anything including surviving this toxic human blight on your life.

        Numbness seems to be part of the process initially. Then you get angry and you stand up and start looking out for yourself. The sooner you get a good “righteous and calculated’ MAD going, the sooner you will begin to take care of you.

        Please listen to datdamwuf, and as she recommends, go to the forum, ask questions and learn.

  • I saw a woman in the hospital. that had 2 young boys in a stroller, had low slung pants on where in the lower back “tramp stamp” area it said in huge old English lettering complete with swirls & colors “SEXUAL BEAST!” That will be fun to explain to those boys one day soon. Whatcha wanna bet she is someone’s side piece?.

  • Right on, CL!!! So right on! Kick his ass to the curb, Kit Kat. Sending you Jedi hugs and support from Chump Nation!

  • Hi All, I’m a new member to this awesome group of people. I just wanted to add the my newly(1 week) XH was suppose to keep myself and my daughter(not his) on his health ins. for six years. We did this because he would have to pay me $$$ back that he owes me, so instead we did the ins. deal. There was a clause that if the ins. rules changed (he works for the state) that I would have to get ins. for her. Ok, I get that he had no control over the ins. company’s rules. Well, two days later I just happen to be walking down my driveway to get the mail and saw his car drive by (typical mid life crisis sports car). I got the mail to find a slip for a certified letter. So I chase down the mail-lady, get the letter and it’s from him telling me that my daughter’s ins. has been cut off because she is a stepchild. He knew all along that this was going to happen. This piece of shit drove by to see my reaction to getting this letter! Talk about psycho. Well, now it’s game on.

  • I hear you..I would be divorcing mine like yesterday except that I am a senior who is retired (pension I worked hard for all my adult life)..

    My cheater husband has no pension or savings….He would make out better in our divorce than me, because he has nothing and he would walk away from the divorce with something..1/2 my pension, savings, house…..I didn’t make all of this up, it isn’t my fear talking..I have been to several lawyers (no fault state)…

    They say infidelity has little to no bearing on the settlement..So we are in an in- house separation until I can see a way out to a sustainable life without having to completely un retire… Health issues factored into my decision to retire in the first place..

    I advise people who have had infidelity happen to them while they are in their 40’s or younger to go ahead and divorce to protect themselves…Get pre-nups before new marriage or remarriage, stay financially independent.. Equally as important is to not allow spouse to become a financial dependent of yours..

    If infidelity happens to somebody nearer to my age, I still do advise the injured party to ask the betrayer to put his/her life savings/money where his or her mouth is..If these cheaters don’t, which they probably won’t, shields up, because you have a fight on your hands..

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