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UBT: I’m a Real Silly Bunny

Hello Chump Lady,

I’m hoping you may be able to advise me please?

I feel so guilty for telling his wife as well as betraying his trust.

I spent 18 months falling for the oldest tricks in the book with Mr Cheater, ‘flatmates with the wife’ he said, ‘divorce being sorted’, ‘poor me, the wife is a bitch’, ‘I’ll leave the marital home as soon as the kids understand’, ‘the wife is delaying the divorce’.

We had a great relationship in the beginning, holidays away and I was introduced to his brother (happy to be complicit!) He would stay at my house as his was always ‘a mess’. We both have children so knew each other had other commitments and so it wasn’t a full-on every day type of relationship.

We texted all the time, he told me he loved me and he couldn’t imagine his life without me.

I had fallen deeply in love with him when he started becoming more defensive. He started claiming I was ‘batshit crazy’ because of my demands for more commitment. His vagueness and gas-lighting continued until it felt like I was losing my mind.

On Christmas Day he said he could only text rather than speak on the phone. Well that was the last straw. Two days later I contacted his wife via social media and turns out she was blissfully unaware that they were getting a divorce, let alone that her husband had a girlfriend and a double life. I was so angry that I told her everything and provided photo proof too.

He denied it and told her I was a ‘psycho’. She has now thrown him out of the house and when I contacted him, he told me he hated me for telling her the truth as I had broken his trust, and had ruined their lives and their kids’ lives.

I feel gutted now because I have hurt his wife terribly by revealing their marriage wasn’t what she thought it was. I didn’t need to go into so much detail, but I felt at the time I needed to provide specific proof as he was calling me a liar.

There is no ‘pick me dance’ as he has blocked me and told his wife he wants to reconcile with her. I guess she will forgive him for the sake of their children.

So I am destroyed, I have lost the person I fell in love with and I have broken his trust. He has lied to me, did he ever love me? He will probably never want to speak with me again and I have hurt his wife terribly too. There’s now a huge hole in my life, how can he just abandon me?

I haven’t had contact with either one of them since the New Year. I have started taking anti depressants as I feel so low. My life feels ruined. How could I be so stupid and be the OW and get in this mess?

Please help me see clearly Chump Lady.


Silly Bunny

Dear Silly Bunny,

You’re just lobbing a slow one over the plate, aren’t you?

Hell, I don’t even know if this letter is real. If you Other Women are punking me, you’ve got quite a conspiracy going and a ton of time on your hands. Every day I get a letter just like this. Woe! I’m the Other Woman! OMG, can you believe how he screwed me over? Now that I’ve been thrown under the bus, and backed over a few times, I have a newfound, evangelical understanding that I Must Tell His Wife/Pity His Wife/Announce That I Suffer As Unjustly — No MORE Really! — Than His Wife. #iamtherealchumphere

And yet, Silly Bunny, I cannot deny you. Perhaps you are a zit-faced socially maladjusted 9th grader typing this from your mother’s basement. Perhaps you are REALLY this delusional. I mean, it’s a chump blog. There are a lot of words and they can confuse a person. Maybe you were multi-tasking. Maybe you were sexting pictures of your boobs to randos while trying simultaneously to read a 2,000-word long-form blog post, and you lost your focus. Maybe a butterfly floated by and you chased it. Maybe your mother called. Maybe it’s really hard to be a bunny.

I don’t know. You landed here and asked my advice. So, I reached out to the Universal Bullshit Translator to help.

I feel so guilty for telling his wife as well as betraying his trust.

Yeah, because there’s nothing like the sacred bond between two cheaters.

I spent 18 months falling for the oldest tricks in the book with Mr Cheater, ‘flatmates with the wife’ he said, ‘divorce being sorted’, ‘poor me, the wife is a bitch’, ‘I’ll leave the marital home as soon as the kids understand’, ‘the wife is delaying the divorce’.

How exactly were you tricked? You willingly got involved with a married guy. Was it the word “wife” or “kids”? #wordsaretricky

We had a great relationship in the beginning, holidays away and I was introduced to his brother (happy to be complicit!) He would stay at my house as his was always ‘a mess’. We both have children so knew each other had other commitments and so it wasn’t a full-on every day type of relationship.

Shame he couldn’t invite you over, what with the dishes in the sink and the wife and everything. The important thing is — you got a holiday!

We texted all the time, he told me he loved me and he couldn’t imagine his life without me.

Given the urgency of “other commitments” and not a full-on type of relationship… #failureofimagination

I had fallen deeply in love with him when he started becoming more defensive. He started claiming I was ‘batshit crazy’ because of my demands for more commitment. His vagueness and gaslighting continued until it felt like I was losing my mind.

I can’t stand it when people are vague and leave you guessing with nebulous, unreliable statements like “I have a wife and children” with whom I live.

This is not gaslighting. This is like tying you to a chair and forcing you to watch an 18-month-long PowerPoint presentation entitled: “I Am a Cake-Eating Bastard Who Will Never Leave His Wife.”

On Christmas Day he said he could only text rather than speak on the phone. Well, that was the last straw. Two days later I contacted his wife via social media and turns out she was blissfully unaware that they were getting a divorce, let alone that her husband had a girlfriend and a double life. I was so angry that I told her everything and provided photo proof too.

He denied it and told her I was a ‘psycho’. She has now thrown him out of the house and when I contacted him, he told me he hated me for telling her the truth as I had broken his trust, and had ruined their lives and their kids’ lives.

He ruined their lives by being a sociopathic piece of shit. And you were super happy to go along with it. (Travel adventures! Legitimate brother introductions!) Until he insulted you with less-than-total centrality. On Christmas Day. With his children.

I mean, of course his chump wife and kids must pay. They’re just bit players in the Kibble Wars. #callmeUmotherfucker #sillybunnyorbunnyboiler

The good news here is that she dumped the cheater. Sorry about the whole hating you for telling the truth thing. Sometimes it all blows up like a 20-lb frozen turkey in a 4-quart deep fryer. Truth is pesky that way.

I feel gutted now because I have hurt his wife terribly by revealing their marriage wasn’t what she thought it was. I didn’t need to go into so much detail, but I felt at the time I needed to provide specific proof as he was calling me a liar.

Yeah, you’re gutted because you hurt his wife. Pu-lease. The truth didn’t hurt her — your fucking around with her husband did. The truth FREED her. Sorry you were the conduit for her liberation. God works in mysterious ways.

There is no ‘pick me dance’ as he has blocked me and told his wife he wants to reconcile with her. I guess she will forgive him for the sake of their children.

Not your problem.

And dude, you’ve been doing an 18-month-long pick me dance. You lost it. Which is a shame. You really deserve to win the sparkly turd and all the parting gifts.

So I am destroyed, I have lost the person I fell in love with and I have broken his trust.

Yeah, I’m sure he was really relying on you to answer those occasional texts and show up for hook-up sessions. I can’t believe the way you’ve let him down. Work on that.

He has lied to me, did he ever love me? He will probably never want to speak with me again and I have hurt his wife terribly too. There’s now a huge hole in my life, how can he just abandon me?

The same way he abandoned his wife and kids to hook up with you?

You’re just a huge hole to him. And there are other new and novel holes. But the a-hole left you with a hole. Holes for everyone! (Oprah voice)

I haven’t had contact with either one of them since the New Year. I have started taking anti depressants as I feel so low. My life feels ruined. How could I be so stupid and be the OW and get in this mess?

Please help me see clearly Chump Lady.

I’ve done my best Silly Bunny. Now just hop along all cutesy-like and fall into a thresher. Kisses.

Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at [email protected]. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • Hop on, Silly Bunny!

    You have been blanked out, and will be a blot.

    Lesson 1: Never have cozy holidays with married men.

    Lesson 2: Refer Lesson 1.

    The only thing I really appreciate is you telling the wife.

    • Ah – she’ll be ok if she can actually look at herself for a bit. Not roll into bed with next married man.

        • I tore the hell out of UBT with my letter from Debbie Douchebag.

          But….after this one, I believe it’s time to put the UBT in the shop for a completely, well deserved overhaul including new piston rings and plugs.

    • Silly Bunny,

      You are “batshit crazy.” And… amoral, unscrupulous, unprincipled and unethical.

      Should I go on? Hmmm?

  • Yes hop along silly bunny… and maybe next time when someone tells you they are married tell them to fuck off not hop into their pants.. ???????????????? oh and tell his poor wife Chump Nation has her back… run along now

    • “Now just hop along all cutesy-like and fall into a thresher”. This line had me howling with laughter as well. Nothing like a morning dose of Chump Lady to get your Mighty going, right?

      I’ll be laughing about this post all day. You’re the best, CL!

    • Reminds me of an on line coffee date I had ( not doing that any more – palm to forehead).

      Cute but clueless sitting across from me at a Tim Hortons ( where all such bad coffee dates happen in Canada ), tells me that he is still living at home.

      I ask him if he has a legal separation written up and in place yet ( he told me he was almost divorced – my bad ). No – nothing written up yet….

      So, you are living at home, no legal separation and you are on POF actively looking for a relationship?!?!

      I told him outright that I don’t date married men. He sputtered out a bunch of drivel about how his marriage was ending ( duh – because you are a fucktard ), and I left.

      These guys are a dime a dozen and sadly most wives are unaware that they are getting a divorce.
      #askmehowI know

      • But but but…..

        He’s “made plans” and “he’s already told her it’s over” and he “googled lawyers.” “But the children /finances/ dogs and cats.”……

        She’s “crazy/ neglectful/ awful/ lesbian/ frigid/ not attractive any more/ let herself go / messy.”

        Can’t you see that he can’t sort himself out until he gets access to another vagina to re-charge his superpowers so he can sort his life out? His wife is like kryptonite, donchaknow?

        • Add “she’s so sad, cries all the time because our marriage has ended, refuses to hire a lawyer” to the list.
          (Meanwhile I had the lawyer, had him served and was waiting on a response… *sigh)

        • Bwahaha! I snorted my coffee!

          Can’t you see that he can’t sort himself out until he gets access to another vagina to re-charge his superpowers so he can sort his life out? His wife is like kryptonite, donchaknow?

          • Coffee through nose. Not this early in the morning!!!

            “…fall into the thresher.” OMG.

      • I wonder if it is my ex that you met with? He’s done that! He’s made dating accounts and had a “good friend” cause SHE was the ONLY one he could talk to and SHE would listen… How about talking to your fucking wife… you know the one who works full time, takes care of 3 (not 2) children, the house, the groceries, the bills, the cleaning, the food, the everything, but yet is totally left in the dark, in a place of hatred and resentment and unaware of outside communications or sleeping with other people. Meeting at Tim Horton’s is totally something he would do… I am east of the GTA.

        • I am in the most Southern Part of Ontario – so, no – probably his clone or sad sausage second cousin….

          • Lucky – Too bad their relations are so large.. it’d be nice to eliminate their kind from pro-creating and continuing this trend of behaviours.

      • When I started online dating 6 months after divorce, 2.5 years after d-day separation, those poor guys—it’s amazing what you can find on google. But if I couldn’t find a court record of their divorce decree? Buh-bye.

        Also, having seen an email to my ex sent a few months before our divorce in which this f*ckbuddy says something about him using his wife as an excuse. Umm…darlin’ we hadn’t lived together for 20 months. I’d kicked out his cheating ass long before. But I’m sure he appreciates the BJs in his office that you mentioned. I guess he dragged his heels on the divorce paperwork so that he could use the “but I’m still married” card when he wanted. So how convenient to have it both ways—“we’re practically divorced—psych!” and she couldn’t say that she didn’t know.

        So the moral of this story? Cheaters will say whatever they think will get them laid. Because once that hookup explodes, there’s someone else who will fall for the same lines. Shocking, I know.

        • I have seriously (actually for real, for real) contemplated bringing my divorce decree to first dates. One could even scan it and text it to potential mates in exchange for the same. Beats the hell out of those awkward poorly shot and badly-in-need-of-lighting-wardrobe-and-makeup nudes that are de rigueur these days. ????

          Oh yeah, baby: show me your papers. Rowwrr.

          • I think that’s a brilliant idea. Why not? If you’ve got nothing to hide, that is… You wouldn’t even have to bring the entire thing – just the front page with your names, a time stamp from the court and the words “FINAL DECREE” on it would be sufficient. That’s a whole lot sexier than the other version of “you show me yours, and I’ll show you mine.” 😀 Seriously, for the Chumped or former Chumped, there’s nothing wrong with a little trust but verify, or rather, verify then trust.

          • And an STD test. Maybe a credit rating ( mine was destroyed by x…but getting there ). Much more sexy than a nude shot or two.

            • Maybe not the STD test on the first date but before getting into bed with them? Absolutely!! Having been tested multiple times due to my ex’s unfortunate penchant for fucking strippers and God know what else, I would be happy to reciprocate with my own clean test results. Fair is fair.

              And yeah, since I’m 55 rapidly going on 56 and only want to date men my age, nude shots are definitely not happening from my side and not. sexy. from his. Honestly, I don’t need rock hard abs – I like a man with a bit of fluffy to him – what I really need is a rock solid consciousness of right and wrong. That’s way more sexy than the hottest body.

              • Online only STD tests are common in the Tinder scene to supplement the clinic paperwork that is almost always requested. Frankly though, unless you get somebody tested and then never leave their side between mattress dances you can’t be sure they’re forthcoming with what they’ve got or that they didn’t get something else since last you banged. Best just to wrap it up, be judicious with your juices, and hope for the best.

          • The male therapist shared with my group that the woman who became his second wife asked to read his divorce degree, in front of him. A very uncomfortable twenty minutes but he did it.

            I suspect that he cheated on his first wife after their baby died a few weeks after being born.He turned out to be a blame shifting narc (Sucker Punched, what do you do to make these men so angry at you ?) and his beer gut and ruddy complexion indicated he may have a little drinking problem. But I respected his sharing of this story.

            p.s. I have met men who are technically divorced from wife #1 but forget to mention wife #2

            • OMG, yes. My ex ,mentioned he was divorced, and he was…technically. From ex #1, but not #2. This was in an era before cell-phones, we lived in different cities, I was a grad student, so he always called me so that “it wouldn’t cost me anything for the calls”. How generous! How thoughtful! He even came to see ME so that I wouldn’t miss any classes. What a guy! I sent him letters to a PO Box because of supposed mail theft in his building.
              God, I was so stupid.
              He told me about ex #2, just left out that they weren’t divorced or even separated. Apparently, they DID eventually separate, but, get this, he wasn’t even divorced from her when we got married…and it was in a church with guests. Later, we got married, again, because I bought his story about wanting to give his newly ordained friend the honor of being the first couple he “married”, even though, you know, we were already married. How sweet of us to go through this ceremony for his friend! I guess narc’s divorce came through. Not that I am bitter. I found out all about this after he knowingly gave me an STD, and his sordid history of lies came spewing out. Talk about shocked.

              I was an absolutely unwitting OW.

              You can bet that if there are ever any future men in my life, I will require a boatload of documentation, and will be doing a LOT of online research.
              Oh, and just so you know, like Tracy, I am a serial chump. I am still living with/married to my current cheater. Still weighing my options. I am so grateful for this group, and hoping that, if I kick him out, I will be able to fix my picker…or I may not ever bother being married again, and will look for a roommate.

        • Apparently they don’t even always have to lie. I asked ex what he had told his schmoopies to make them think it was ok to sleep with him. His response was “nothing. Nobody thought it was ok.” It didn’t stop anyone though. Of course he could be lying to me about not having lied to them.

          • Nah, schmoopies don’t care if people are married or not. My cheater XH’s schmoopie knew full well that he was married and it did not matter ONE bit. In fact she went after several married men where we all worked. Mine was the only one who fell for her ‘charms.’ I can say whatever I want about her ugly ass but the reality of it she has someone to sleep with every night and someone to eat dinner with and someone that shovels her driveway in the winter and mows her lawn in the summer. I don’t have any of that. The Karma bus never showed up at their house that’s for sure and they’ve been together for years. From where I’m standing, their life looks great and that bothers me most of all. It’s like cheaters really do prosper and being a good person really doesn’t make a shit bit of difference.

            • Chumptopia, you are wrong my dear fellow chump.

              I had someone to sleep with every night. I had someone to eat dinner with every night. He mowed the lawn and would have shoveled the snow if we every got any.

              I also had someone who slept with his best friend’s fiancé and at least one hooker. I had someone who got a DUI and wrecked MY car with said hooker in it. He beat my son and financially ruined us.

              Who wants that kind of man? You may think they are living a great life but they are both cheaters and looks are quite deceiving.

              While we may now be alone, we at least have a real life. We have the freedom to bring good honest people into our lives or not. The choice is ours.

              I am sorry you are feeling low about all of this today. Just remember that you are worthy of truth and real love. Not that shit your EX and his schmoopie call love, but the good stuff.


            • I feel what you are saying to my core. I continue to work on accepting that looks can be deceiving and maybe things aren’t as good as they seem on the outside for the exhole. But it IS gut-wrenching to see how little concequences there are for cheaters. I wish society could understand the depth of emotional abuse, the psychological damage, that cheaters cause and held them accountable for their actions. But most people don’t care as long as it didn’t happen to them.

              • Looks are deceiving. They are suffering consequences, don’t worry. Your ex will never be truly happy or content. They don’t have the capacity. But you do. And your ex won’t be a better person for the new person. They don’t change. Two cheaters who found each other – two people with no morals or integrity. They will be suspicious of each other and never really trusting – never really happy.
                After my stbx moved with his young coworker, I read texts she sent our daughter – looking for her man. Asking our daughter if she knew where he was because he was not answering her calls/texts.
                Well, well. Now he’s all yours. Now you can be in my shoes wondering where he is and why he isn’t responding to your texts.
                Because he’ll be cheating on her, too.
                My daughter said he was yelling at the girlfriend.
                It doesn’t make me happy to hear that. The whole thing is so sad. My daughter has a poor model for a father. He makes lots of money so he doesn’t think he’s a loser. He thinks he is Mr. Big. Things and money make him. People… not so much. They are objects to him.
                “People don’t care ……” No, people don’t get it unless it happened to them. They can’t believe it. I kept trying to explain to one person and she was so baffled. We have to be careful who we open up to. ‘hugs”
                Gut-wrenching is right.

            • Chumptopia, I want you to know that I recently received a letter from my ex’s OW (whom he married) that said, “He did it to me, too.”
              Bear in mind that my marriage to him was short-lived, and nearly 40 years ago. I was able to move to “meh” fairly quickly because I was young, attractive, we didn’t have kids or anything keeping us in contact, and because I was able to recognize that he and the OW had far more in common (including narcissism) than he and I did. Yes, it bugged me from time to time. But, before long, I had a new circle of friends, dates, and my whole single life before me. Still, it looked like they had everything I wanted.
              Except, apparently, for a faithful spouse. I received her letter about a month ago, apologizing for the pain she had put me through, now that she understood what it was.
              Whatever. I threw it away. “Meh”, indeed.
              Current spouse’s schmoopie, however, I despise. I don’t blame her, BUT her using my husband to “get back” at her spouse for cheating boggles my mind. How could anybody who has experienced the innocent side of the pain of infidelity knowingly do that to somebody else?? For that, I hold her accountable. I don’t hold her accountable for the affair…that blame is solely my husband’s. HE is the one who broke his vows to me, not HER.

        • My mother was kind enough to gift me with this wisdom:

          “A Stiff Prick Has NO Conscience”

          Still very true after all these years.

      • I’ll be generous and accept that the marriage is really over and nobody is being chumped. I still don’t care. I have a hard line that my date must be single. Not “separated”, not “waiting for the ink to dry”, not “it’s complicated”, not “living together to share custody”, not “she wrecked my finances and I can’t afford to leave”, or any other flavor. Single – yes or no?

        Relationships are hard enough as it is. I recognize that every adult has baggage, but there are fools bets out there, wagers you just can’t (or don’t want to) win. Someone who isn’t fully disengaged from his last relationship, especially with custody issues, is not a good bet. Someone who is in severe financial crisis is frankly not a good bet. Someone who doesn’t see peace and stability as worth the effort of getting disentangled from the “horrible” ex is not a good bet. Someone who walks away from marriage and starts seeking a soul-mate before the divorce is filed is not a good bet. Someone who doesn’t take time to process the loss and reflect on what went wrong before looking for 2.0 is not a good bet. Someone who can’t stand on their own feet, that needs someone to nag them to be adults and file their paperwork (or needs to be in a relationship before leaving the last one) is not a good bet.

        Which isn’t to say they are bad people, or might not get their act together someday. I thank those people for their interest and invite them to look me up when they are free. But I am a child of chaos, a codependent mommy-maid fixer of problems and broken people, the sort that has stayed in unhealthy relationships because he might otherwise be homeless, and I just don’t want to do that anymore. I’m tired.

        I am content and happy on my own, and if someone similarly content and happy likes what I’m cooking, maybe we can get together. See if it goes somewhere. But volunteering to step into the shit storm of someone else’s divorce and custody disagreements? Are you crazy?

        • 2ndGen Chump,
          That was grown up poetry. So beautifully written. Thank you.
          Hell to the yes THAT^^^^^^^^^

        • I love what you wrote and I’m going to save it to read again and again. It’s what I believe but couldn’t settle my mind long enough to put the words together so thank you for expressing it all so well.

        • This should be framed! Not yet ventured out into the world of relationships again but yes, single is not a relative term and it does include being emotionally, physically and financially disconnected and moved on from any previous relationships. I want to make sure that this completely applies to me before trying it out but also very much that this is a basic requirement in any potential relationship for me.
          I’d much rather be in my own than get tied up in that crap. Like you, I also have a strong tendency for rescuing which I really need to be aware of avoiding. You have summed it up beautifully

      • Yes! I had a coffee date with a man who had zero idea about the legal process. I mean zero. I gave him 1 hour of time and then said bye-bye.

      • At least you know that these MM didn’t get their order right if they were meeting at Tim Horton’s.

        Small consolation I know, but man that place can’t seem to get even the easiest orders right.

      • My bf was telling me how his Xwife was on POF while they were married. I asked him – “How would you know she was on a dating site?” (Thinking he was on it too?) Apparently some guys at work told him that they saw his wifes profile on POF. How risky is that? She obviously didn’t give a shit about their marriage and that was probably pretty embarrassing for my bf.
        He drew up the divorce papers on Monday and they were divorced on Friday! I wish mine had taken only 5 days rather than 3 years…

  • I struggle to believe how she thought he and his wife were ‘just flat mates’ if she felt the need to drop the bomb so excessively, providing evidence and contacting her Xmas day. She knew the wife didn’t know.

    • Exactly! I’m curious as to what was the communication she first sent to the wife. If she really believed his story her first response upon rejection would not have been yo contact his flatmate wife.

      • Yup! I had the same with my OW. She messaged me with evidence, and anger all at once, despite the fact she claimed she thought he had ‘broken up with me’ before anything happened between them. Then why would she be so angry and assume I was still with him if we had broken up? Hate these OW. The liars truly deserve each other, to always live in paranoia.

        • Yeah, because being part of a’breakup’ sounds so much better than blowing up a family, doesn’t it? What are we, in high school? The otherwomanchild in my life used the same word. I figured it was because she was 24 years younger than asshat and her frontal lobe to her brain wasn’t fully developed yet.

          • I’ve seen the frontal lobe thing used as an excuse for cheaters and affair partners before. I think it is an excuse, and we shouldn’t tolerate it.

            Sure, younger people can be more reckless, risk taking, impulsive etc. But that doesn’t mean they don’t know right from wrong. Or have sufficient impulse control to stop a situation before it crosses a boundary.

            • I completely agree. Yes, the frontal lobes take until 21ish to be fully developed, but they are pretty darn well-developed by 15. A lot of the evidence from Larry Steinberg shows that teens are just as good as adults at reasoning, moral judgments, etc., and even that behavioral inhibition can be just as good as that of adults (except when they are with their friends).

              I work with 18-22 year olds every day; they are very clearly capable of great discipline and moral behavior. Young OWs (like my X’s gradwhore and assorted other students he seduced) do not get off the hook. None of them are semantically challenged enough not to comprehend the meaning of “married.”

              • … and BTW, I’ve heard that otherwomanchild and asshat ‘broke-up’. In their case, ‘breakup’ is the appropriate word. He looked like absolute sh!t the last time I saw him. A guy who always took pride in his appearance. He threw away everything that should have been a priority in his life to be with her. Even ran away from his children, one of whom has had nothing to say to him in years. Hindsight, she did me a favor, as I’m certain that she wasn’t the first and I know she wouldn’t have been his last.

                To the new readers on this site, WELCOME. You’ll find your sanity here. And I promise you, things will get better!!!

              • I was being sarcastic…. I probably should have inserted the eye-roll emoji to make that clear. 😉

          • “I figured it was because she was 24 years younger than asshat and her frontal lobe to her brain wasn’t fully developed yet.”

            Best sentence I have read on here in awhile. So true, so true…

  • I hate how cheaters justify their bad behavior with the delusion they are in love. Be damned anyone else in this sick and twisted little game they play. It’s all about them. Then when that bitch gets what’s coming to her she has to completely destroy the innocent person in this whole cruel and deceitful scenario – the wife. I’m sure Silly Bunny felt superior and believed her thoughtless actions would send that piece of shit man back into her cheating arms. I mean why wouldn’t they spend the rest of their cheating lives together once that annoying wife is out of the picture. They “love” each other, right? Jokes on them. Walk away Silly Stupid Little Bunny. Rather, run don’t walk. You’ve done enough damage.

    • Yeah notice how she said “when I contacted him…” AFTER she told his wife.

      She obviously not only told his wife out of spite, but in hopes he’d come running straight to her.

      OW’s, if you’re reading, maybe 1 in 100 will EVER consider leaving their wives. But of course every OW is speccccialllll so they’ll never listen.

      • Well OW figures he just can’t rip the band-aid off.

        “Clearly he doesn’t love her if he’s with me!”

        Duh lady. Clearly he’s doesn’t love you either if he’s with her.

            • Me 4! Within a matter of weeks our marriage was “I love you’s” and passionate sex to “I want to be alone” and “I want a divorce”… maybe with those odds I should be playing the lottery!

        • You are not alone. Mine was also 1 out of the 100. It just means our exes are of the stupid and naive themselves variety believing that the OWs might actually be better for them so another reason to be glad we are not stuck with them anymore. Ex’s Schmoopie was an experienced woman and a good manipulator. She convinced him that he should feel guilty for betraying her by not discarding me fast enough. He must have told her he loved her after all. How dare he lie to her and betray her trust like that. The poor poor woman, not. He left me to prove his love for her. Well, he is still perpetually dissatisfied with life and now she gets to deal with that. 🙂

        • me 5. they’re married now and my kids now spend 50% time with x and howorker. As far as the two of them are concerned, they deserve each other, but sharing the kids still chaps my ass.

  • Let me see if I’ve got this straight.

    She has children (plural) of her own. It’s Christmas. But she’s ssoooo lonely she HAS to get attention from her married OM on Christmas. And that she HAS to get that attention NOW, even though that means dropping a nuclear bomb on his wife AND his kids. On Christmas. On the family day of family days. She has Children. She should understand that much, ya think?

    Where were HER children? Let me guess. Not with her. They were probably with her ex. I’m presuming she has an ex of some sort, because the only Virgin Birth on record is the one being celebrated on Christmas. Most other kids have two parents, and if they’re not with HER, on Christmas, even for a few hours, it’s probably because she did something not-so-nice that hurt those kids and her baby-daddy.

    So now she’s going to wreck a second marriage. Because if SHE can’t be happy on Christmas, and she can’t enjoy her OWN kids being happy, ain’t nobody else gonna be happy either. Not if she can help it.

    By the way. Silly bunnies ARE good for something in the winter. They’re good for becoming the lining for soft, warm winter gloves. I had a pair of bunny-fur gloves for several years when I lived up North. Nicest gloves I ever owned.

    Is she volunteering?

    • Jeez, even the name ‘SillyBunny’ irritates the hell out of me!

      Silly! As in, “ooopsie! Silly old me! I’m not a bad person without integrity, making morally questionable choices, who devastates families. I’m just a silly sausage! Giggle, giggle”

      And Bunny, as in “Oooooo, look at me, I’m cute, and fluffy, and harmless. Cuddle me! You know you want to!”

      SillyBunny, my arse. My instincts were to be soft with her… But thinking about that stupid name, chosen on purpose…. Jeez, I hope she really is a troll.

      • Yes!
        Any adult who calls themselves by a cutesy name is immature and needy.

        My x’s ow had this ridiculous nickname and would also use it in various ways to make it even MORE cutesy sounding. Ugh. Grow the fuck up already, get your life together, focus on progressing instead of self-absorbed bad decisions that hurt others, ETC ETC ETC.

        I have zero patience for adults who act like kids and think it’s cute.

        • Ha – I’m a fucking silly clown and I have horrible intentions, you silly-assed rodent.

    • There’s a good line from an oldish movie, “…..I will NOT be ignored!!!!!” Cut to bunny boiling in a pot on the stove of cheater’s house.

      This asshat has had her bunny boiling moment. Thank goodness the chump kicked her cheater out =MIGHTY.

      • Bunny, Bunny, Bunny, “you’re concerned that you broke his trust?” why do you care?

        “He has lied to me, did he ever love me? He will probably never want to speak with me again and I have hurt his wife terribly too. There’s now a huge hole in my life, how can he just abandon me?”

        He lied to you, more importantly he lied to his wife and family.

        “He denied it and told her I was a ‘psycho’. She has now thrown him out of the house and when I contacted him, he told me he hated me for telling her the truth as I had broken his trust, and had ruined their lives and their kids’ lives.”

        He’s blaming you for ruining his life, because he chose to have an affair, says you’re a psycho and this is the person you consider “the love of your life”?

        “I feel gutted now because I have hurt his wife terribly by revealing their marriage wasn’t what she thought it was. I didn’t need to go into so much detail, but I felt at the time I needed to provide
        specific proof as he was calling me a liar”.

        You knowingly had a relationship with a married man which ended after 1 1/2 years. You’re feeling gutted not over his wife’s hurt feelings but your own.
        When you revealed her marriage wasn’t what she thought it was and purposely provided detail so the hurt would be more devastating.

        You’re not feeling empathy for his wife, you’re more upset that he’s not speaking to you and your cheater relationship has ended. You knew telling his wife would likely end their marriage and believed this would be the beginning of your happily ever after. Your plan failed miserably.
        Sounds better though doesn’t it, especially to a bunch of Chumps to say you feel gutted that you hurt his wife rather than the truth.
        You feel gutted because he’s trying to reconcile with his wife and doesn’t give a shit about you.

        How could you be so stupid for being the OW, good question.
        Speaking of questions..,
        A better question to ask yourself is is why you feel your life is ruined without him and not feeling glad that he’s out of your life.

        • Brit – you hit the nail on this comment, thank you.
          Not only did I NOT want to hear any details from the stupid cheater since I didn’t care, I certainly wouldn’t have want to hear them from some fuck he had.
          What a horrible thing for this women to do to his wife, besides fucking a married man and bragging about all the details to his wife. THAT IS EVIL! The wife has no stop-gap on her vomit. And, that shit sits in your memory for life.

          This women doesn’t deserve any more of our comments.
          Her voice in her email speaks volumes. Oh – I just happened to spill the beans because I was sad and angry. You said it best, brit. I’m actually spitting a bit of fire on this OW letter…

    • People who wear fur are sociopaths.

      Are YOU volunteering for my fist to knock your teeth down your throat?

      I can dream. You are just as much a subhuman as an OW. Skinning an innocent animal alive for giggles? Lack empathy much?- you fucking asshole.

      • I agree Nanny. I want to cry every time I see anyone wearing fur. Don’t these people realise the agony animals are put through. Totally sickening.

        As for today’s OW. I actually would have welcomed some honesty and evidence from any one of my cheater’s 8 sexting and part-time fun buddies (I think he had them all on a rota). Course they all knew about me and covered for him 100% seeming to revel in the additional pain their head games caused me. Thing is they all knew about me but not each other. Once they did and realised he’d been playing them all everything changed. Weird thing is they mostly took their fury out on me, and not him.

      • Leaving this comment up, but (a) you can make your point without referring to another chump as a “f***ing a**hole” or “subhuman” (many people are not aware of how rabbit skin is obtained, and would be sympathetic if told politely. Information is a good way to recruit people to the animal rights cause), and (b) threatening violence to protest violence against animals seems rather hypocritical.

        • Thank you Tempest. I found these comments frightening especially since many Chumps have been abused and made to feel “subhuman.” They don’t need further abuse when they come here. They may choose not to come here. People don’t get to threaten violence because someone has different views than them.

          • I’m not into the use of such language either, but to be fair many people have used similar on here when referring to cheaters/AP. The comment about rabbit skin was itself pretty chilling and, I suspect Nanny was reacting in heat of the moment.

            • I think the difference is that Nanny was not upset at any implied violent thought (which is what that was an implied thought of violence), Nanny was upset about the wearing of fur. And NO it is not okay to directly threaten to “knock someone’s teeth down their throat” because they have a different belief about wearing fur! I don’t think we can justify this. When people have violent fantasies about cheaters and AP’s it is because they have been directly hurt by these people–crushed. Their lives ruined. Their children’s lives ruined. Many chumps have been actually physically abused and to come to a sight where we are supposed to be safe and get directly verbally abused and threatened with physical abuse is not okay. People have different opinions and beliefs about a LOT of things. I hear opinions expressed here all the time which offend some of my beliefs, political, religious, or social, and I do not threaten physical violence or call people horrible names like “sociopath.” That was uncalled for. Period. Chumps need to be able to come here and express themselves about the hurt of the affairs.

              • Jojobee,
                I’m relatively new to this site, however, reading the comment today re fur and knocking out teeth startled me, because based on my short time member viewpoint, I found this to be a safe place to vent, share, ask for advice-the replies I’ve received have all been very caring, supportive, and very helpful. Maybe that was a “heat of the moment “ reaction-comment.

              • This Rabbit comment has no business being on this site. Go to an animal site and rescue a rabbit.
                Can you just erase it, Tempest?
                It’s distracting from a great convo.

      • Wow. I think this kind of violent language is uncalled for. Furthermore, it sounds like a direct threat which is actionable in harassment or a restraining order. And, doesn’t exactly show yourself as the most “humane” of people either.

      • Your response really troubles me. Not just because you’re totally OTT, but because you’re not seeing the bigger picture. Or picture(s). The first of course being what the topic of discussion is.

        The second is that, while mass-produced fashion-led fur is clearly wrong, that doesn’t encapsulate every incidence of humans wearing fur. Not everyone who wears fur is doing it for fashion reasons, or the fur has originated from some horrendous factory, where the animals are kept inhumanely, and killed inhumanely.

        There are people who need to wear fur. There may also be people who wear fur that has been obtained as a by-product. In other words, they are minimising waste. For hundreds of thousands of years, our species has worn fur to keep warm. They weren’t sociopaths.

        I don’t wear fur, and I wouldn’t. But then, I don’t need it, and any fur that I came across would be of the mass-produced, fashion-led inhumane kind. But I do not agree with your comment. To speak to a stranger like that, when they were making an off-hand joke, is really not acceptable. It offended your sensibilities, we understand. But to speak in such terms is not ok.

      • @ Nanny: SAY WHAT??? WTF makes you think I said anything about skinning a rabbit alive???? I’m not some sadistic sicko, but maybe that’s just the filter you look through.

        I’ll have you know that the bunny fur in my gloves was a by-product of animals humanely raised and then killed to be food.

        And, yes, I also eat meat and wear leather shoes. No one seems to have issues with that.

    • I was going to bring it up at some point.
      This story is histerical. Old fool and his 30 years younger girlfriend with a missing brain!! Hahahaha
      Karma was on speed dial in this case 😉

      • I read this story over the weekend and immediately thought he should date women older than his granddaughters and then he may get one with a grown up brain. Ha !

  • If SillyBunny is old enough to have kids, then she should be old & wise enough to know that being ‘flatmates’ Is a load of bullshit.

    Sure, the recession left a lot of couples that had split too poor for either to move out of the home.

    But if in doubt, seek proof. Or else, avoid getting involved until the divorce is actually happening. But apparently at the point she got involved, the kids didn’t yet ‘understand’. No matter how gullible or naive this woman was, how can you justify getting involved with a married man, when his kids don’t even know there’s been a split?

    I don’t accept that she was that gullible or naive. On some level, she knew exactly what was going on.

    If she really wants to become a better person, she needs to be truly honest with herself.

    She also needs to develop better boundaries for herself, and respect other people’s boundaries.

    • There’s a discussion over at the CL facebook page that I was unduly harsh. (Hey it was the UBT!) This was my response:

      It’s the self pity channel of the mindfuck. However dim you think she is, she went into it knowing he was married and living with his wife and children — for an entire YEAR and a HALF. Never going to his house or being able to call him. She knew she was the mistress. It’s one thing to get a letter asking me if they should tell, or owning one’s selfishness and stupidity — but I absolutely REJECT the idea that OW are victims. Moreover, it is offensive and narcissistic to come to a support site for the people you’ve hurt (i.e. chumps — ACTUAL chumps) and expect support. Not. My. Job. Your letter gets thrown to the UBT.

      • If you meet a man who says he is getting a divorce you are prone to believe him, it is totally plausible, 50% of marriages fail. silly bunny was entangled with a con man who misled her and his wife. He initially hooked silly bunny with the prospect of a future with him, further down the line she must have realized she was being played. I have one thing to say to silly bunny, you should be proud that you let his poor wife know the truth, who cares about “breaking his trust”, he is a liar why are you concerned about what he thinks? I hope you gave her all the evidence she needs to know who she is dealing with. I know you are hurt now, but you need to work on your self worth, you seem fragile. Remember that you are in love with an image of a man that doesn’t exist. It was all a game to him, to feed his ego to engage in a romantic tryst. In your misery you need to acknowledge that you are still lucky to have shed such a toxic individual from your life.

        • gravlax – ok, he said he was getting divorced. But he said that he was still living with his wife – albeit as ‘flatmates’. That alone should have been enough to raise suspicions. But the killer was that his children didn’t yet ‘understand’. Together, those two things should have been enough to tell her to back off until he was more ‘available’ – even if she did believe his lies.

          • Knowing what we know due to our own experience makes it obvious to us what she should and should not have known. Honestly, some of these cheaters are real con artists. I do find it plausible that someone without the experience and hind sight that we have who is somewhat insecure and is being loved bombed by a narcissist in full charm/pity me mode might believe things that we know shouldn’t be believed.

            That being said, I believe now is the time for her eyes to be opened and for her to fully recognize who the real victims are in this situation. She might be a minor victim, but to some extent she as a willing victim, not examining the situation too closely because she was getting kibbles herself. Now she knows better and she should forget her own pain and feel for the wife and kids alone. that would be the way to show that she doesn’t completely suck as a person and that she may actually learn something from all of this.

        • It is definitely good that she told the wife, but it’s not like she told her out of guilt or because she wanted to do the right thing-she only told the wife because she was angry and jealous and hoping to get the man once she blew up the marriage. Sorry, no brownie points for that.

        • Let’s even grant Silly Bunny was duped by a convincing story at first. After a month or so of the secrecy, she should have twigged that the guy was still actively married.

          And let Silly Bunny be a lesson to everyone else who falls for the “my wife/husband doesn’t understand me,” “we have a marriage in name only,” “I’m just waiting for the kids to turn 18 before I divorce him/her,” lines.

          • Its amazing just how gullible some people can be. Maybe that’s why cheaters are drawn to them. I’ve commented on here before about a ‘friend’ of mine whose started both physical and phone/online affairs recently after remaining faithful to her husband for 15 years. I know she’s tried hard to work on her passionless marriage but of course that’s no excuse. The reason I mention her is one of the guys who calls/Facetimes her for phone sex has photos of his beautiful, smiling wife all over Facebook. Yet, she completely believes this guy that they aren’t sleeping together. She knows my feelings on whole sorry business yet looked dumbfounded and shocked when I cynically told her this guy is no doubt a lying snake. Reason she knows he’s telling the truth? He’s downstairs on the sofa in the early hours when he calls her. So he must be telling the truth or he would be asleep in bed next to his wife. Duh!

            I don’t have the contact details of anyone involved and I’m not even on FB, or I’d be so tempted to spill the beans. That said, I couldn’t bear to cause someone the same kind of gut wrenching heartbreak we’ve all suffered.

        • “If you meet a man who says he is getting a divorce you are prone to believe him, it is totally plausible.”

          Maybe. But, if she honestly believed that, why the need to keep it secret from his wife? Why did she react to being ignored on Christmas by telling the wife about the affair, if she honestly thought the wife would be ok with it? How was that supposed to go?

          “Hi, I’m sleeping with your husband.”

          “And this is my problem, why? I don’t have a husband, I have an ex – we’re finalizing a divorce and haven’t been truly “married” in years. Go complain to someone else if he’s a jerk.”

          She chose what to believe based on what justified her actions. That’s not the same thing as legitimately believing something.

        • I’ve met guys like that who are “separated, getting divorced soon”. I told them they could call me when the divorce was final. What’s so hard about that, Silly Bunny???

            • I had an old boyfriend find me where I work (said he found my name on a brochure which could be the truth)….I said ‘Aren’t you married?’ He said ‘Kinda.’ I said, ‘Is that like being kinda pregnant?’ Gawd, lose my number.
              I’ve seen guys on dating sites state they were ‘currently separated.’ I always wonder WTH that means. Jeebus, get a divorce before you start pulling people into your web. Total turnoff.

              • “Currently separated” In my book that means you ain’t available. That means your wife kicked you out, maybe you’re hoping she’ll take you back but in the meantime you’re down to f*ck as many women as you can, single or unhappily married.

                Next !

              • Currently separated = my wife is:

                A.) at work
                B.) mowing the grass
                C.) picking kids up from school
                D.) out of field of vision/hearing

        • Fragile? You’ve got to be kidding. She knew he was married and that he devalued the mother of his children. She was needy and selfish. Sure predators do say whatever it takes to snag a piece of ass. There’s NO excuse for her behavior screwing him for 18 months.

          She felt entitled for the investment she made and gave him an ultimatum. That’s when it fell apart.

          As far as being proud. Yeah, as proud as any cunt can be for jamming it to his wife and children on Christmas. Fuck her she gets no hoorah for playing that card the way she did. It was pure vengeance and a power play.

          She could have waited and given the information in a way that wouldn’t have hurt those children.

          What a sleazy disgusting entitled pig.

      • I do agree with you – on all points.

        My comment is a bit soft, because I am a bit soft, still.

        There absolutely HAS to be a voice like yours, Tracy. If you don’t say these things, which ultimately, are the truth, then who will?

        There has to be balance to the narrative, as we all know. There’s too much in favour of cheaters & affair partners. And there’s an oft repeated narrative out there that the affair partner hasn’t done anything wrong. They didn’t make a vow; they don’t owe the betrayed partner anything. Well, I disagree.

        If SillyBunny was my friend, I would absolutely wrap my arms around her and comfort her. But I wouldn’t lie to her. I would make it clear (probably very gently) that she did wrong. But it would be my hope that SillyBunny would learn from this experience, and become a better person. Develop a sense of responsibility to other people – strangers, even – not to hurt them and cause trauma. Because we are all responsible for what we knowingly do to other people – whether they are a stranger or not.

        SillyBunny – it’s not about you. Please pick yourself up, realise what this man is, learn from this, move on with your life and try to learn how to be a better person.

        • Absolutely, I can feel bad for her, and recognize that she feels awful, but I would gell her that what she did was horrible. She knowingly got involved with a married man with children. What does thatsay about the both of them. She may very well have fallen in love with him,ok, whatever but then when things don’t go your way you try to blow things up in his family. What kind of person does that? WTF did you think would happen next? Give that head a shake.

      • I thought it was great! There is no way she didn’t know that she was the OW. She is trying to justify and claim victimhood. She wants others to feel that she is a Chump, that she has been wrong. Nope, not here, Silly Bunny. Move along.

        • It is true, that SillyBunny is behaving like a victim, isn’t it! I really hope this woman’s eyes have been opened today.

          It is a bit bizarre that she’d write to Chump Lady. Who knows what she was thinking there.

          SillyBunny, you have to change your own narrative. Own what you did. Admit to yourself and your friends that you did wrong and that you are not the victim. It will help you to deal with your guilt, and grow as a person.

          • Silly bunny does have a ton of guilt on her hands. I’m not buying her “I’m a victim” line. She knew he was married. That means she knew he had a wife. Which meant that he was taken. Which meant that she should have kept her hands and vagina off of him.

            Why is that so hard to understand? WTF is wrong with people?

        • I’m sure that’s not the first time in 18 months that she pulled up the wife’s social media accounts. I highly doubt she was completely in the dark like she is trying to make us believe. She probably saw happy Christmas photos posted and 18 months of supressed crazed bunny was unleashed.

          • Oh! Good point! “Hey, if you’re just flat mates, why are you looking so snuggly in her Facebook photos?”

          • That was my first thought, she didn’t just pull up the wife’s FB, etc accounts. I’m all for giving people the benefit of doubt, but not Silly Bunny!! She’s a manipulative, vindictive, woman. The fact that she has children of her own and did this – no empathy or sympathy. She just thought blowing up cheaters family was going to make her the “winner” in her mind, when that didn’t happen, she became the “scorned woman”. What’s the saying – “hell hath no fury than a woman scorned”. IMO, I don’t see a victim with Silly Bunny.

            • Yes, they think they are the ‘winner.’ I dropped off my daughter to them one evening months ago, and OW came strutting out as they were packing up their new big camper to go camping, like “look at me!” Oh my goodness. She can have him.

              My stbx said he liked her because she gets what she wants.

              A 22 y.o. who wants a 48 y.o. for his money? She can have you!

              And I can have peace now. I got what I want. 🙂

      • Absolutely right, CL!! You always tell it like it is. That’s why we love you.

      • Yep. If you call something “the oldest trick in the book”, then you are familiar with the book. That doesn’t happen overnight. Ergo, the innocent act (but I didn’t know!!! Waah!!!) Can only be an act.

        This bunny needs many years of therapy.

      • I agree CL. My exes AP came to my house, f$cked him in MY bed right beside my personal things on my nightstand and the clothes in my closet ( no doors). And that wasn’t enough, they repeated that at our cottage. Just for good measure he brought her and her kid to our house in Florida ( the neighbours didn’t know and were shocked), and did this the week before my sister and I had to go down there and sell everything and get my Florida dream home ready to sell( because of course he wouldn’t do anything except stick his hand out to collect “his share”). Evil Pieces of Shit, both of them .

        • I had a friend who was an OW. I’ve since dropped her. Not because she was the OW although as time passed I looked at her much differently. I dropped her because she kept making crap decision after crap decision and crying over it and expecting sympathy and basically learning nothing. Ahhh just thinking about it makes me tired. It was she who advised me to commit adultery to get at my husband…cause they all do it. Yes… slowly but surely I cut that cord. We had been friends from high school. She had a pretty shit upbringing but had many good qualities. Then like I said one bad shitty decision after the other. Always after unavailable men. Always some drama. My brain hurts thinking about her .
          She ended up having a child for a married man whose wife was pregnant at the same time. He’s still with the wife who has since had another child.
          When the wife found out (after my friend pressured the husband to tell) she confronted my friend. Surprisingly she was livid. Imagine that chumps! This wife was livid. My friend called me after all upset…whining ” and would you believe that she is a Christian and she cursed me!”
          Stupid chumpy me tried to reason that you be fair the wife had just found out that you have a child with her husband. My friend still didn’t think that it warranted the cuss out.
          Go figure. Right around then the crazy was starting to take over.

          • Ugh. I know.

            I’m just glad my friend didn’t end up pregnant with her ‘whatever-the-Hell-he-was'” baby.

            I just couldn’t imagine that.

          • I will not, do not or could not associate with anyone who involved with an adulterous affair. That means the OW, OM or the cheater. To me, their behavior says: I am really fucked up and I have no respect for myself or others.

            • I get that and I respect it.

              I had a hard time when push came to shove and in light of the mental health disorder she was diagnosed with a few short weeks before I felt uncomfortable picking that moment to say adios.

      • Chumps with FB should go chime in and help Tracy.

        I really hate the “everyone is a victim” culture–OW/OM are victims, waa waa; cheaters are victims of horrible marriages (sob)…..No. Sometimes there really is truth to the matter–two people in the triangle were selfish & deceptive and altered the life trajectory of the chump. No matter how unappealing the chump (eats crackers in bed, breeds cockroaches for fun), it does not equal the widespread betrayal being advanced by the cheating spouse & AP.

        Sorry, OWs, stupidity and poor impulse control are not enough for us to pity you, no matter how long a face you pull.

        • Wow, that was an incredibly stupid comment on FB. Her only crime was dimness (I’m paraphrasing)? Um, no. She fucked a married man for 18 months, knowing he was married. She got some great holidays (at his family’s expense), she met his asshole brother (he has to be an asshole if he went along with this shit), and ONLY when she didn’t get the attention she felt she deserved at Christmas did she decide to blow up everyone’s lives. That’s not dim, it’s malicious, mean spirited, aggressive and a number of other flavors of fucked up but it isn’t dim. The only thing she was the slightest bit “dim” about was anticipating the consequences TO HER that her actions would have. Well… I guess it was also a bit DIM to come to a chump blog and expect sympathy. Or maybe that’s just arrogance? I’m going to go with arrogance.

        • My ex’s OW is NOT a victim at all and it maddened me so much when he told me that she was hurt and she was crying… I’m sitting in front of him in our bedroom, in our marital home while our children sleep and I’m supposed to care about her?!? Uh NO, I don’t give a damn about her! She willingly knew that he was going through stuff in his marriage, his own MOTHER let OW come to her home AND MEET MY CHILDREN (3 & 5) and all hid this from me for MONTHS!

          I care about what life path I have been forced to choose, selling my home, relocating my children to live with family, pick up a second job that I actually don’t have time for. BUT I am grateful to get out from under a verbally and emotionally abusive partner and his freaking family. I am grateful I can hopefully show my children the right way for relationships to be and to believe that they are enough and their value alone is enough and that they will not tolerate any of the crap I put up with in the name of “love.”

      • With all the people in my life making excuses for the cheaters and OW (including my mother, a OW fur most of my childhood) you’re almost the only person I can relate to, Tracy. Thank God for you calling bullshit as bullshit. I feel like everyone in my life has lost their mind. These Facebook apologetics can go suck a dick.

        Preferably one attached to a single dude, but probably not since they’re all so eager to make excuses for this OW.

      • I thought you were rather kind, direct and to the point!!

        The SELFISHNESS and self absorption of OWS putting all common sense out the door, needs to be reamed a new one.

      • Affair partners are not victims. Full stop.

        Knowingly engaging in a relationship with a married man or woman is wrong. Full stop.

        No Excuses.

  • Silly,

    Cheater makes you ‘watch an 18-month-long PowerPoint presentation entitled: “I Am a Cake-Eating Bastard Who Will Never Leave His Wife”’ and you STILL don’t get it?

    Either you are a bad student in Life Lessons 101, you skip classes and when you do show up you fiddle around with your smartphone in class posting selfies instead of paying attention to your teachers or …. you are REALLY stupid.

    Don’t feel bad for Mrs Chump. You did her a favor. I wish someone had been so “silly” for me. It would have saved me a lot of sorrow and wasted money and time.

    Hop on into the sunset.

  • Decisions, decisions, should I give him an ultimatum? Yes, the holidays are the perfect time to blow up a family.

    This bunny has elephant balls believing she was special. Best case scenario is when they win the turd after the wife boots them.

    Remorse ? That’s assbackward. It felt good until the roommate bitch with the messy house was gutted. Even if you end up with him there’s always a next. Hoping he slithers back to you. You deserve each other.

  • Well written Chump Lady. Her whole letter was basically “why didn’t he pick me?”

    The self righteous indignation due to the wife possibly deciding to give him another chance. The anti-depressants because her nasty plot to destroy the life of the wife didn’t work. Her disbelief that he hates her guts for not playing the part of the bit on the side.

    I hope the wronged wife kicks him in the nuts as she boots him out the door. Silly bunny, you are selfish, mean, nasty, lack any remorse or insight, and didn’t give a flying fuck about a wife and children who had time, energy, money and love taken from them while having their mental, physical and emotional health put at risk by a nut job philanderer and his side piece. At least the wife now knows to get STD testing and can make an informed decision about her future. As for the reply being mean, I am giving you as much sympathy as you gave to the innocent victims – jack shit.

  • This happened to me with a few differences. OW went out of her way to make sure D-Day was Christmas morning, which was also our planned GENDER REVEAL with our unborn child that we were celebrating with our 3 preschool aged children. (It’s a girl ????!)

    OW claimed to be “The Victim” exactly like this letter writer. The shocking thing is OW has divorced 3 times so far, is 15 years older than us, and by profession is a Divorce Attorney. She’s got to see this kind of crap at work, yet she’s went out of her way to personally harass me. I’m not exaggerating when I say the dozens and dozens of extremely pornographic messages she sent me are deeply disturbing. She has no boundaries. Absolutely none. She had a divorce attorney for herself in MY divorce (where she named herself as a witness) before I even did.

    And my ex abusive husband sucks. But not for him, I never would have been exposed to that lunatic. If I hadn’t lived through the abuse and made it to the other side (with the help of CL and CN), I never would have imagined people actually treat others so poorly. What happened to the golden rule?

    • That OW is beyond disordered. Positively evil. I’m so glad you got free of them both.

    • OMG, StalkedNameChanged: I hate that horrible woman FOR you. And your ex. Both of them can fuck right off.

      I totally get what you are saying about the Golden Rule. Such a basic, common sense concept, isn’t it? And yet …. here we are, facing the reality that some people willfully reject it. Bad people exist far more than I ever realized.

      On the other hand, there are a ton of really good people here, helping each other, supporting each other, and being open to learning and growing along the way. This is our reminder that as bad as our new reality can seem, there is still plenty of light. 🙂

      P.S. Congratulations on the little girl. All three of mine are girls — so I’m a bit partial to daughters. 🙂

      • Hi (((JesssMom)))! I have 3 little girls too and a young son. Thank you for your kind words. You’re right, while there are some really disordered people out there, there are also so many kind, loving, and generous people as well.

    • She’s a psychopath and your ex is a narc but also a stupid ass. They have no rules or moral compass. Not to go off topic but I unfortunately hired a psychopath back in May. I was aware shortly after her hire, when she exhibited backstabbing, bragging and undermining characteristics. Without going into a lot of detail she is definitely a full fledged psychopath. Scary how normal they look/appear. Oh and here is the rub…….the department she is heading has two toxic, pain in the ass employees that have been a nightmare for many other employees. You know the drill they produce but create havoc under the guise of “just trying to do their jobs”. So she was supposed to “fix” the department and bridge the disconnect between her department & others. So no surprise that has not exactly worked out. However, I was very upset a couple a months ago but now I am having fun with it. Plus the fact it just came to my attention her engaging in blatant wrongdoing with our year end audit.

      • Yikes, KB22! That sounds super stressful. I’m glad it sounds like you have a plan on handling it!

        • I was lucky enough to have employees brave enough to come to me & report her antics. So many want to stay under the radar instead of confronting bad apples. A friend of mine also dropped by one day as we had plans for lunch. I introduced them and my friend who is one of the sharpest people I know said at our lunch, whoa this one is going to be a huge problem. I thought she was a little over the top with that comment but come to find out………….
          Anyway we may not even have to fire her as she has one foot out the door since she has realized she can’t run the show.

    • Stalked, I cringe every time you post about your horrendous divorce attorney OW. I’m a former divorce attorney myself and it is just appalling that creature who infected your life still has a license to practice law (yes I mean “infected” like a flesh eating bacteria, not “affected”). There are so many ethics violations in your story it’s almost too many to count. I am so sorry for all you have been through. I am even more sorry that a member of my profession used their position to do you such harm. I hope someone reports her to her local ethics board and has her investigated. She should not be allowed to continue to practice law.

      • Beth, you echo the sentiments of my attorney, who found OW’s behavior “shocking”. My attorney said you see all sorts of horrible behavior and abuse in family law (and OW has been practicing law since I was a middle schooler). To see so many terrible things in Family Law and then behave the way OW had chosen to conduct herself……it’s left everyone speechless.

        I know we’ve discussed on this page the possibility of reporting OW to the State Bar, but I just don’t know if it’s worth pursuing. I just finished litigation with a RTSC for ex breaking nearly every aspect of our divorce agreement that was written in a specific way to protect me and the kids from future abuse. So I’m exhausted with Court. Although OW wanted to sway the GAL (unethically) with the custody order, etc and build my ex’s case to be stronger, I don’t think she succeeded. More likely, if anything, she actually really hurt his case.

        Lastly, I’m working on moving towards Meh, and I have so many fun things I’m looking forward to. I want to enjoy my 4 children while they are young, be there for them, and create a new happier life together. It doesn’t leave much room in my head for potentially dealing more with this disturbed OW and an ethics committee. Someday perhaps justice will find her….I’d say life with my ex-abuser is quite the pound of flesh.

        • Stalked, PLEASE report her to the State Bar, or whoever oversees attorney disciplinary matters in your state. You could even ask for damages because you had to pay your attorney to do extra work to deal with her trash.

          If they believe your complaint has merit they’ll take over and handle it. You’ll have to give testimony, but you won’t have to prosecute the case. Make sure you mention how much extra her meddling cost you.

          Most state bars are quick to jump on cases when an attorney’s unethical and unwanted actions cost the public money.

          • Stalked,
            Your story, gives me chills!! You are one amazing, tough woman!!!
            Yes, please report her to the State Bar where you live. This OW attorney should not be allowed to practice law anywhere.

        • Stalked,

          In the years I practiced divorce law, I saw SO much pain. I viewed my job as trying to get my clients through what could be the most devastating event of their life as easily and quickly as I could. I couldn’t prevent their pain but I sure as hell could try to minimize it. I can not imagine purposefully adding to people’s pain by using one’s professional knowledge to cause harm. It is beyond cruel.

          When I said that I hoped someone reported that POS to the local ethics commission, I did not mean to imply that I thought YOU should do so. Given what you have been through already, it seems too risky. Your safety and that of your children is primary. And really, your attorney, the GAL or someone else involved in the case who knows what happened should do the reporting. In my state, attorneys have an ethical obligation to report misconduct on the part of other attorneys.

          I admire you tremendously for getting through what you’ve been through. You are very, very mighty!

          • Thank you so much, Beth. Your words of strength and encouragement mean so much to me. Xoxo

  • My ex serial cheater told several OW that I was his “roommate” and they ALL believed it. He was a master manipulator and I never found out at the time he was playing his games. Imagine paying all the rent and bills for an underemployed partner and finding out he was looking for thrills and your ultimate replacement while telling OW you were a “roommate”. It still stings!!

    I’m glad Silly Bunny told the wife and was real and graffic as possible. I would have needed that kind of 2/4 to my head and it would have saved me years of expert gaslighting. You know, the “she’s a friend/client/coworker” and I’m “batshit crazy”. Yes he even called me that! Funny, I was never “crazy” before I met the cat.

    I know it was 18 mos for Silly Bunny but I can see someone who has a busy life and kids and for example only time to meet twice a month etc not fully grasping that they are being conned. I hope she learned her lesson as painful as it was. He was no prize to “win”.

    • I don’t have to imagine this.

      I got told by a convenience store clerk that asshole wasn’t a married man. Um… excuse me ~ I sleep next to him every night, we took vows in front of a minister in front of witnesses … then I realized ~ he wasn’t married, I was.

    • Yep. I tell anyone I meet who is dating an “only on paper” married person that married is married, doesn’t matter what the story you’ve been handed says. Married is, assets and money are mixed, custody is unresolved, and life is blended at a MINIMUM. The likelihood that at least some lies (maybe in the form of omissions) are flowing around that mess is extremely high.

      A thing is what it is. It isn’t something else.

      Married is married. People who want to move on get divorced, even if it causes big problems. There’s no extenuating circumstance. You’re the other person in an extramarital affair. If you don’t like that, your only option is to end it until the divorce is final. “Almost final” ain’t “final”.

      • I agree. Completely free and clear or fuck off.

        My church has singles events and you can’t participate if your divorce hasn’t been discharged because if your divorce hasn’t been discharged then YOU AREN’T SINGLE!

  • The one thing that stands out when I read garbage like this:

    When I got divorced 2 years ago….after 21 years of marriage….I discovered an ocean of single people. Everywhere. Available. Looking for a relationship. Longing to give 100% of their attention in return.

    Why do these sick fucks choose married people when there is a Singles Buffet in every aspect of daily life?

    • You have look outside of the box.

      I am a gun toting, steak eating, boots and jeans, country boy who appreciates the finer things in life like college football and classic car shows.

      I am dating an anti-gun, city woman, who is a vegan and enjoys jazz music, the opera, and art museums.

      I am a mechanic and she works for a corporate law firm.

      You have to look outside of your zone.

  • No longer a fan but back when I’d watch his show, Dr. Phil once said this to a woman in a similar situation…”You couldn’t be more stupid if I cut your head off.”

    • He has also said, “If you choose the behavior, you choose the consequences.”

      • Also made an impression, “Cheaters think everyone cheats, and liars think everyone lies.”

        • Luziana I so wish I had woken up to this fact many years ago. I trusted my cheater 100%. I didn’t want to live in a marriage where everything had to be checked up on. Yet Mr Cheater was suspicious of everything I said and did, and everyone around me. Red flag or what? Ms Dumbhead me just thought he was paranoid not reflecting his own deception.

          • Indeed. I am thousands of dollars poorer for this wisdom. They also normalize their dysfunction by saying cheating is not a big deal and everyone does it. I’ve never done it.

  • You can’t make this shit up!

    – In a few years from now his wife will send you a thank you note. She lost a cheater and gained a life. As to yourself : WOW you knew he was married, yet you still had an affair with him? Just think about it for a moment.

  • SillyBunny/OW

    You have the nerve to come to this site for help & understanding??
    Because of your selfish, disgusting behavior with a Married cheater.. we all are suppose to welcome you with open arms?
    In my book you deserve everything you get! Helping to destroy a wife & family? Your nothing but a used up whore.. evil bitch ????

    • Right on Kathleen! Bravo!

      It is a good thing that you told the wife, ( you know, the wife/mother, the one with the sink full of his ” DIRTY” dishes). She deserves to know.
      But, the fact that you told her for your own selfish reasons, will that part sucks! ( makes you not worthy of this site).
      People like you, SillyBunny, are a dime a dozen, hell some cheaters can get you for a nickel!

      I don’t believe you were harsh CL. Truthful, you were truthful, a character trait you own and live up to.

      Just saying.

    • Standing ovation for Kathleen!

      The selfish, childish, fool- grabbed on to a married man. And we are supposed to feel sorry for her?

  • Yes I have been stupid and naive etc. But he was a very convincing liar and manipulator. I trusted him and loved him so why not believe him? (I’m not a complete idiot, I have been to University, although a while ago!)
    Everytime I asked for proof of him seeking a divorce he called me paranoid.
    Just to correct, I contacted his wife on 27th Dec not Christmas Day.
    I am very sorry and have apologised to his wife. I just couldn’t take anymore and exploded.
    Thank you for answering CL. I needed some clarity.

    • Um . . . I don’t think you get it yet.

      Reread tracy’s response and the comments again. And again. Maybe you’ll catch on.

      • I’m beginning to think that “Silly Bunny” is trolling CN and trying to get a rise out of the pain associated with being hurt and betrayed by being chumped and dumped.

        This isn’t your average OW response:

        SillyBunny says

        January 16, 2018 at 7:01 am

        Yes I have been stupid and naive etc. But he was a very convincing liar and manipulator. I trusted him and loved him so why not believe him? (I’m not a complete idiot, I have been to University, although a while ago!)
        Everytime I asked for proof of him seeking a divorce he called me paranoid.
        Just to correct, I contacted his wife on 27th Dec not Christmas Day.
        I am very sorry and have apologised to his wife. I just couldn’t take anymore and exploded.
        Thank you for answering CL. I needed some clarity.

        I would have expected defiance and aggression to the “crazy” wife appliance / soon to be ex / if we didn’t have kids I would leave right now bitch that I am stuck with.

        Just sayin’

        • I dont know. My ex’s OW thanked me, said how wonderful I was, how I shouldn’t be involved in this mess, how I have a beautiful soul and she really ‘Needed some clarity’ and I really helped her with that. She wished me the best for the future, after us discussing that he had ‘lied’ to her about finishing things with me, and continuing to sleep with us both. I had no idea she existed. She knew about me.

          Then she lied she was pregnant with his baby when she realised he didn’t want her as a prize once I kicked him to the curb.

          Some seem to have the gift of the gab to get people on their side!

          • The OW that cane to light 12/27/14 — merry fucking nightmare on Christmas kids! Said she needed to “restore karma” because she was “stupid and should have known X was lying” and he own cheater dad “didn’t raise me to act like this”. Blah blah fuckity blah. She asked me what she could do to restore karma. I told her to leave my husband the fuck alone. She promised. I understand the very next day she contacted Alex and said “we need to talk……” From there on out she did everything in her power to get Max to leave me and the children so that she could start spending his seven-figure salary. She won that sparkly turd! I heard that they’ve already cheated on each other many times and that it’s a complete shit show in their lives fighting 24 seven. Me, I’m having a peaceful happy life with my lovely cheater free boyfriend. Fuck them

            • To MotherChumper99,
              So glad to hear that there is a peaceful existence after DV from Narc. Good for you!! The fact they are together in a hellish shit storm life – karma’s a bitch.

              I’m approaching 60, I don’t know if I will ever be able to not be jaded for their rest of my life to even consider dating.

              Glad to know there is peace at the end 🙂

              Seeing clearly

          • “I had no idea she existed. She knew about me.” THIS.
            This is the essence of the hypocrisy of these whiny OW’s equating Cheater lying “to them too.”
            NO. You *knew* he was married. His *wife* didn’t know he was fucking you for 18 months.
            An uneven playing field, ya think?

    • I got a college degree with the help of a football scholarship.

      Thus, I must be intelligent, too.

      My parents never went to college. Actually, they are more intelligent and wiser than I am.

    • Silly Bunny Its people like you who make my skin crawl.

      Out of all of the single available men that are in the vicinity of (unless you live under a rock) you just HAD to choose to fuck a married man? The first time he told you he was married you should have ran the other way. Its women like you that I HATE. It’s women like you that are the reason we call all the female affair partners around here whores, sluts, bitches, etc. You embody those names with your entitlement and narcissistic personality. Everything is yours for the taking, am I right?
      YOU KNEW HE WAS STILL MARRIED yet you chose to cling to a man’s word (first mistake) that he was telling you the truth about the state of his marriage.

      You make me sick and I have no sympathy for you.

    • If the wife does kick him out permanently then you’ll get him back!! Without a doubt he will sniff back round you with more bollox spilling from his mouth. You will believe every last word because you want to. Then you will have won him. He will do it to you too, there will be some other low hanging fruit willing to open their legs on words spoken. Lie? Truth? doesn’t really matter as long as it means you ‘won’. You’ll be paranoid the rest of that relationship but hey you won.

      You may or may not be academically intelligent but you lack moral fibre, you lack values, you have an overinflated sense of self-importance. You only put yourself first… cracking role model.

      • I completely forgot that she has children of her own. FFS … cracking role model, indeed!

        How How How can people so easily disregard their own kids–their need for stability, their need for decent, mature, and moral role models? I feel so bad for all of the kids in this situation. 🙁

    • Silly Bunny,
      First, Let me begin with I think your letter is fake and is BS from a freak, but if your are really the OW,
      You came to the wrong site to get sympathy. This is not a site to find OW to help ease your pain for fucking another woman’s husband.

      Secondly, a man is either married or not married.
      You spent 18 months with him. Sorry bunny, as soon as you discovered he was married, you should have immediately disconnected yourself!!
      That’s what people with integrity do.

      Lastly, although you did his wife a favor, doing it in the holiday season is malicious and calculating. I don’t give a shit if it was December 25 or 27.
      Because you were unhappy your married piece of shit wasn’t with you, you decided to blow up his wife’s world during the holidays, you did that deliberately, the last straw for you was he wouldn’t speak to you on the telephone on Christmas Day, if that’s your rock bottom, silly bunny, you are as evil as the cheater.

      I’m sure you will continue on with your anti-depressants until you find another cheater to enable you to “get off” on being the OW.

      There’s a word for woman like you – whore.

      Go back into your bunny cage.

      Seeing clearly

      • My D-day was 2 days after Thanksgiving. Baylor vs. TCU was on the television. It was sleeting that day.

        I remember it well. Although it wasn’t on Thanksgiving Day, it was during the Thanksgiving Holiday.

        Glad that Blow Bunny clarified that it wasn’t actually on Christmas Day. Wouldn’t want those innocent kids’ heads to be fucked up for the next few years during the Christmas Holidays.

      • Whore….bimbo…..skank…..slut….. tart……adulteress……. home wrecker…….self centered narcissist= the “other woman.”

        • Skanks like Bunny… not even factor the children into the cheating equation. They act as if the kids are objects. Nothing to really think about.

    • If you’re real … WTF? Seriously. Coming to this site for support makes about as much sense as brushing your teeth with soda.

      Regardless, you knew he was married. “Flatmates with the WIFE” is pretty clear he has a wife. Waiting until the kids understand is pretty clear there has NOT been a divorce. So, you definitely knew. Heck, you can’t even claim you thought they were separated.

      And you got pissed when he blew you off. While I’m glad you told the wife, your motivation was sick and cruel. I say this more for his CHILDREN than even for his wife. Even if you were ridiculous enough to grasp at straws that he really would leave his wife, he explicitly told you his children didn’t understand. So, what did you do — you decided to expedite the situation for his kids (who “didn’t understand yet”) — not because you honestly thought it would benefit the wife or kids … but because you wanted to get back at HIM. That’s shitty human behavior.

      Being lied to sucks (as every one of us!) — but that doesn’t give you some license to be a cruel person to the INNOCENT people already being hurt by what the two of you were doing.

      Please seek a therapist who will be willing to work with you on the fact that you are willing to hurt innocent people to make yourself feel better.

      • To JesssMom,
        The fact that Silly Bunny didn’t for one moment consider the children involved and then corrected that she didn’t inform his wife on Christmas Day, but waited, until December 27, to make herself appear to have a soul, is BS!! She knew EXACTLY what she was doing !!!
        My god, The fact that’s she’s a mother and could willingly hurt innocent kids just because the piece of shit couldn’t talk on the phone, only text her, on Christmas Day, I can’t help but be concerned for her own children.
        Silly bunny needs to stay in her cage!

    • You’d still take him if he came back at you though. Did the part where he said he was married and living with his wife and kids not get you? That you were okay with this says alot. You are naive o life. And clearly a bit too needy.

    • One of my friends became the OW under similar circumstances and it was like trying to whack logic into her and she still didn’t get it.

      I get why.

      She felt really strong feelings for the guy and believes that because they were “so in sync” (whatever) that his “in love” narrative trumped everything else. All of the rest of his “circumstances.” And that if she poured enough time / energy / affection whatever into this creature that he would be so in love with her for sticking by him during the “tough times.” You know, like scraping off his kid and girlfriend that he had committed to back home. That his sad sausage self just “couldn’t go through with hurting them.”

      Then the gf reached out to her on FB and via text, showing her proof that he was still very active in the relationship and trying to gaslight the fuck out of her, albeit pretty ineffectively, because the guy isn’t very fucking bright.

      You know what my friend did? She dumped him for aboit 3.5 minutes. (Ugh.) It caused more of a fucking moral crisis for ME having been her friend during her B.S. then it did for either one of these cheaters!) My friend was even given texts that showed him telling his gf how unattractive he thjnks my friend is! How she was just a hookup and it “didnt mean anything.”

      What did my logic-impaired friend do? She told his gf to back off! He was “happy here with her and he was trying to ruin that.”

      This is what happens with you OW!

      You have every opportunity to not only second-guess yourselves but have 10 million red flags whacking you on the face and YET YOU PERSIST!

      No wonder those married idiots end up telling at you “you knew what this was!”

      It’s like love is a bad drug for you. You’ll keep going for the high even though you know it’s fake, because you believe that “Your love” is the special “against-all-odds-he’ll-see-how-much-i-love-him-and-be-so-grateful” kind of love. IT.DOESNT.WORK.LIKE.THAT.

      At one point he met his wife, made all of the promises he faked to you AND LOOK HOW HE’S TREATING HER NOW! There’s ALL OF THE INFO YOU NEED. He lives with her and his kids and sleeps with you. That’s the top position you could hope for! Him eventually living with you and your kids and sleeping with someone else!

      You life and love life isn’t likely to be the “special exception.” You are million to one more likely to end up being the rule! Live accordingly! If a man has beaten up his last wife and hospitalized her, expect him to be likely to do the same to you if get involved with him! Even if he’s “so nice” in the beginning! They ALL are e they wouldn’t have ended up married in the first place!

      Look for who the guy IS, not just of you have fuzzy feelings with him or what cutesy things he writes to you. WHO HE IS AND HOW HE ACTS!

      He says he’s “in love and can’t love without you.” But yet, he’s LIVING WITH HER! So clearly he is living without you and probably full of shit aboit the other part of that statement too!

      He’s not going to lie to his primary partner whom he has invested a bunch into life with and then tell you the truth because you’re extra-special. You have all of the evidence in front of you that HE LIES IN RELATIONSHIPS. Thats the difference between you and chumps. We DIDN’T get the opportinity before committing to these people to see their betrayal gaslighting crap before we married them. You did, and yet you persisted! On the back of another person!

      So what happened to my friend after she dumped his gf for him and ran off with the prize? He dumped her. Like a week later. And I’m glad because she was such a dumb shit during that time I could barely stand it. Since then she’s turned away involved guys but man I just could not believe it. He wasn’t just a cheater either. He was such an obvious user and total junkie that I just….I just … can’t. I’m practically spackling it was so stupid.

      So now his cheating ass has moved onto a completely naive girl who attends the same religious organization I do where he pretends he’s found morality while sleeping with and doing drugs with someone else I have a passing acquaintance with.

      If I knew his new gf at all personally or in any distant circle even I would let her know exactly what she was dealing with because she thinks she’s going to marry him (apparently). And he’s adamant that he will. In fact my friend was willing to join my religion over it and he said he’s rather marry the other girl who doesn’t know any better. Yay for her. What a prize. Oh yeah, he’s also in a hookup group on FB with one of my other FB friends who asked me “isn’t that your friends bf? He keeps messaging me?” Nope. He dumped her a long time ago. He’s with this other girl he’s going to marry. Because that’s who he is.

      And that’s how much these guys mess around too. I never even knew the jerk before he met my friend through a dating profile he set up while with the gf he had a kid with. NOW after a year I’ve had his original gf contact me about my friend (I told her everything about the time my husband and I met him with my friend before we knew he had a gf. How he committed to my friend in front of both of us etc.). I’ve come to know another acquaintance that is sleeping with him and my other FB friend showing me that pic of him in the hookup group. I don’t even live in the same part of town as the guy and I’ve met four of his previous and potential sex partners! And I bet you he tried the “you’re so special I loooooove you” line on all of them!

      Get it!? If he’s got all of the trappings of a relationship with SOMEONE ELSE and flattering you…… that isn’t extra-special love! That’s playing you because he thinks you’re easy! That’s cake-eating!

      You can’t sit back and eat cake with someone for over a year and then bitch that they made you fat!

    • Sweetheart….married means “married.” NOT available. There is no such thing as “half way” married.

      • Being at university doesnt make you smart bunny if you dont have any common sense to begin with. He was married that should have been a two by four to the skull. Then you come here to this site looking for what….bunny….for what? The ow in my circle of hell knew he was married didnt care and did all she could to break up the marriage sooner to get him. They started cheating on each other…..and….the circle of hell continues. Me im out i escaped his life he didnt. He is a piece of shit pod then now and forever. Go suck an egg bunny before dorothy drops a house on you!

    • SillyBunny/OWHORE

      You really don’t get it! Take your diploma & get the hell off this site!

      We don’t want to hear your excuses..He was MARRIED!!!

    • Own your behavior. You allowed yourself to be played. You called his wife and gave explicit details because you wanted him to pick you. You are not a victim, you got what you signed up for.

    • If you really believed him you wouldn’t have thought you needed to keep it secret from his wife. You wouldn’t think it was “betraying” him to let her know about it. You chose to “believe” him because you wanted to continue the affair. That’s different.

  • I guess my empathy button is broken because I don’t feel bad for this silly bunny at all. She wasn’t duped; she isn’t a chump. She’s just an OW who has a case of the sadz because she didn’t win her sparkly turd. Don’t worry though silly little bunny. If the wife sticks to leaving him, your sparkly turd will come back. Then you guys can hop on down the path together and get all the happiness you deserve!

    Best wishes for a wonderful life!

    • No. Your empathy button is NOT broken. Your “call out the BS” and “character matters” buttons are working fabulously! 🙂

  • You chose the ScreenName “Silly Bunny”?

    This is all SO traumatic that you chose a playful, hoppity-hop, cutesy image?

  • I do believe that she was honestly being duped, I believed far more from my partner for longer. Everyone can be a dummy.

    If you believed him, you have shitty boundaries. You let men make the rules. Make sure you’re part of your partners life. I wouldn’t be ok not meeting a guys kids when I had dated him more than a year. Or his friends. His birthday party? You were ok with being a landing pad instead of a partner. You need to think on that. I also wouldn’t be ok not knowing Christmas plans before the day of. Or being told I can’t talk on the phone on Christmas. I get the indignation but you had let him set pretty messed up secretive rules for nearly 2 years I don’t know why suddenly Christmas was your breaking point. Follow that ‘I am worth life and spending time together’ feeling and forget this douche.

    You didn’t betray his trust, he mangled your idea of loyalty. You state you didn’t know she didn’t know. Or you did, And regardless, congratulations on ruining Christmas for her for forever. But- that’s not the point. You want to be made blameless? Then do better. Know better, do better. Start making sure your friends and family are honest. You be honest. If a man says he’s in a live in relationship with ex, it’s a boundary you aren’t crossing. Go get therapy to figure out why you were ok with half a boyfriend.

    If she takes him back, she doesn’t, whatever. Why would you want someone who treated you like this? You were never a partner you were a pawn. So is she so are his kids so leave this game. Go find a life, and learn from this massacre and be happy you were lucky enough to not be the one who bred with him.

    • My problem is that even IF she completely believed his horseshit — she knew his kids “didn’t understand” and that this was one of his excuses for still staying with the family unit.

      Yet, when she got pissed because he blew her off, she decided to interfere — drop the proverbial bomb — knowing that the kids “didn’t understand.” Her motivation matters enormously. She was willing to hurt the kids and the wife simply to make herself feel better. She was hurt and angry — and lashed out at the innocent people because they were tools to hurt him. That’s really messed up.

      • I think all her actions are horrendous. I am saying my husband fooled me for a decade, I was told lies beyond lies and I swallowed them hook line and sinker. When you think you love someone you trust them and believe them and she also is obviously terrible with decisions and seeing his game for what it was. She’s still responsible for awfulness but if she really wants to be better she needs to focus on that. On being honest with and about herself, and pursuing people who are honest also. Her story is terrible. He lies he manipulated and made her feel devalued and used that to ensure she didn’t use her brain. Yep she should have known better. Yep, she is responsible for her actions. Yep, she should have never dated this man or wised up pretty fast. (Although lots of people who are separated make the choice to date, and I know there are some chumps who share the marital home while separated, like in places like Canada where you have to wait a year and rent is costly…. it happens, I do think she was dumb but I have seen people live this story)… Frankly, all his lies and her naïveté hit close to home. So instead of just calling her a terrible person I am saying- fair enough you were duped, and your actions were terrible but you say you don’t want to be a terrible person- so now work on not being a shitty person and leave the bag of garbage that is your ex behind. Her next steps will define how awful she is, if she was truly as duped as she professes

        • I respectfully disagree. I think you are selling yourself and your fellow Chumps short by comparing our situations with hers. My ex lied to me for over three decades. The difference is, this guy didn’t lie – she knew he was married and she CHOSE not to investigate his status. He may have lied about the divorce, etc. but she KNEW he was married. Turning a blind eye to the truth because it’s not convenient to your romance and being deceived about who the person is that you are in love with are two different things. We Chumps were presented with an alternate reality by our spouses. From the very beginning of the relationship we were being deceived into thinking our partner was someone they were not. Even pick-me dancing and spackling are desperate attempts to hang on to a reality that never really existed. She knew he was married. At any point she could have either asked for proof but she didn’t because the truth wasn’t convenient to her (all those nice holidays). She wasn’t deceived, she deliberately chose not to see the truth because it was easier not to see it. There is no comparison between our situations and hers in my opinion.

          • Totally agree Beth. Her view was that she was tricked. Shevknew he was married from the beginning.

          • When I was young and single and going to school I hooked up briefly with a certain guy. Then he admitted he was married. But, he said, his wife had terminal cancer and it was sssoooo stressful for him because she was too fragile for sex. And if he didn’t have sex to relieve the pressure in his loins they were going to get infected or something. That was partly my fault, you see, because I was So Alluring to him

            I turned Cold Fish in the spot.

            His wife turned out to be perfectly healthy and probably lived longer than their marriage did. I didn’t stick around to find out.

        • I agree with you, CR. Here in Toronto, I have two friends who are splitting from their husbands, who’ve been firmly advised by their counsel to Remain in the Marital Home at All Costs, since it will help them in the settlement. The husbands have been told the same thing. So, both couples are currently, very uncomfortably, sharing their roofs while counting the days until they can split their assets and leave. We, being Chumps, know to look for signs of cheating but someone who is acquainted with couples like those I’ve mentioned might just accept this story at face value without verifying. Stupid? I’d say so. But not out of the realm of possibility.

          • Thanks. Maybe it’s just because real estate in Toronto is so nuts that I am well aware of couples staking out their claim. Or maybe we as Canadians are just even more chumpy than the normal chumps – that I would buy????

    • How exactly was she duped? She knew about the wife and kids, she knew he lived at home with his intact family, she knew he was non-committal to her, she knew she wasn’t allowed into the family home, she knew that contacting the wife would throw a grenade into everything. The only things she was duped by were her own ego and failing moral compass. She thought that her specialness was such a powerful dick magnet that it would draw him away from his family forever, and she turned off her moral compass because it’s alarm bells were inconvenient to her personal objectives of special centrality. Now she’s depressed because her bunny chow ran out. She wasn’t duped, and I have no sympathy.

      • I’m willing to take her story that she truly believed he was getting divorced at face value. I have known couples and seen chumps here talk about sharing marital home while technically separated. And some choose to date. And that has also been talked about on chump lady- choosing to date before your divorce is final is a personal choice based on your feelings needs and requirements, make sure your feelers can handle it, make sure your picker is fixed and boundaries are set and make sure your dates know that you are separated not divorced etc. That’s not a witch hunt I want to engage with. Is it dumb that she believed it for a year and a half without getting any closer to his house kids, more than a brother meet, and tons of quiet home dates? Yep, phenomenally. But I’d wager if I tell people 3 years in I discovered prolific information that my husband was always constantly looking up escorts, or craigslist free for all shared experiences, or Skype live chats, and he said he was just looking and it was the thrill of looking that got him off not actually doing any of that… that I’m an idiot. Because I was. I was dumb as rocks to believe it then, to forget it, to never look at his bills or wonder where he went when he went. Or when he went to a going away party in year 9 or 10 for a co worker and it was a two day thing, and lasted overnight both nights and he didn’t call or text or say boo about it, someone I hadn’t really even heard of from a work perspective… I was pretty dumb, when he just said it was two days so more people could make it. (What really happened : He raw dogged a really pretty gal the first night, loved the tryst so much he told me the party was several days in a row, so I wouldn’t question his absence.)

        I do think she made horrendous choices and had information she didn’t use well. I am not saying at all that her actions are ok. I think the wife telling and Christmas reason was awful. I think she needs some serious help to understand why this man who very obviously treated her like garbage is her concern, her love, her focus, if she really wants to fix her life, she needs to figure out why this was enough of a relationship for her.

        Im ok with everyone hating on her, I just feel like I was just as dumb as she was so if she wants to be better, I’m gonna say ‘ok- go be better.’

        • I get the desire to be empathetic — I’m wired the same way. Interestingly, it took the horrendous implosion of my marriage to realize that not calling out the BS for what it is, trying to be empathetic where none was deserved — is partly why I got caught in the vicious cycle of lying and gaslighting.

          Given my propensity for empathy (even when none is deserved), I’ve had to put a “check” on empathy — a filter, to make sure it is deserved. This is why I think it’s important to weigh the person’s actual actions and motivations, then call them out for what they are.

          For example, in your situation, you had VOWS with him. He didn’t just make half-gestures and half-promises. He went in full steam and gave full, legal promises. You had every reason to give him the benefit of the doubt. To trust. And, your intentions were true and moral. You weren’t interested in hurting anyone. You simply wanted to uphold your commitment and expected him to uphold his. Your actions, your motivations were completely moral. You, CreativeRational, are a good person who got screwed over.

          Such a huge difference between your case and the SillyBunny who wrote the letter. 180 degrees difference.

          • You’re probably right. I am the epitome of chump. I’m bait for people. I know I need to be stronger. I know her message is pretty awful and she made terrible decisions and I don’t think she is like me. I just hope she does better. I really do value all you folks calling me on this though because I know it’s very chumpy of me. I do like being… overly fair. Which is code for too much, too nice, naive, not smart, mistaken and at risk.

            • (((Hugs))) Creativerational. You are a kind soul. It’s a process — learning how to call BS for what it is, to filter our empathy. But it is necessary for our emotional well-being. You’ll get there … heck, WE’LL get there (I’m still working on it too!).

        • If that was really the case that she didn’t know she was being duped, why would it take her almost 18 months to finally get curious enough to look up the wife on social media and only then find out that much more than just “flatmates?”…..not buying it at all.

        • I completely agree with JesssMom. I think you’re projecting your legitimate betrayal onto someone under very different circumstances. You had every reason to trust your spouse and try to save and protect your marriage. You learned about boundaries the hard way through HIS failures. Your default setting of trust was within the agreed structure and commitment of your own marriage. In this case, the OW’s default structure was dating a married man, and she had no reason to fall back onto a default setting of trust and commitment because there was none.

          It’s true that people sometimes date before their divorce is final, and I have no problem with that when it’s done with honesty and transparency. I fell into that category because my divorce took two years to finalize. Luckily we didn’t live together during those years or there’s no way I could have been emotionally available to date.

          The first person I dated post-separation was also separated, and I felt more comfortable going out with someone in a similar circumstance and with similar emotional availability. It was nice to commiserate on the difficulties of divorce and separation with small children, and to not feel judged for being a single mom mid-divorce and not having my shit together. He was staying at a friend’s house and sleeping in the basement of the family home on his custody weekend with his kids. Or so he told me. He may have lied. I hope not, but I don’t know. But the difference is that I was on high alert for any potential sign that he was being dishonest given that I knew he was still married with kids, and the moment something felt off (when he bailed on a date by pretending he didn’t know we had it scheduled) I was out of there and never saw nor spoke to him again. (He howled mightily that I was being unfair and was damaged goods. Didn’t care. He howled to the wind.) That wasn’t just practicing good boundaries, it was also also doing the right thing. Doing the right thing is hard.

          This OW was more interested in the easy and gratifying thing than the right thing, and it bit her in the ass. It’s not about ripping her to shreds, it’s about intellectual honesty.

        • Ok so if we want to take a stab at duped angle let’s look at all the facts. Her married cheater had met her children and spent time with them. She met his brother. Why after all this time if she in fact believed him hadn’t she met his children? It’s because she’s a trolling whore licking her wounds.
          That special vagina of hers needs a New Years cleanse.

  • I think the ow wanted to spend Xmas day with him (pick me dance). Never mind the kids! My ex’s ow phoned him 28 times on Xmas morning, (he said years after, I didn’t answer the phone!). It takes a new low in your life to dump your kids on Xmas day. Incidentially I saw the ow yesterday. Karma serve them well.

    • These OW know the cheater is lying about the spouse he’s fucking CHEATING. And they get pissed when actions don’t match the narrative.

      They want to be the prize. And yes they do not fare well together. Not my problem.

  • I do not feel sorry the bunny. This happened to me. I found out a year ago that my wonderful hubby was sneaking around with my cousin. I found out by accident through helping him get back into his gmail account. He of course played dumb. Nothing was going on. She always sends I love you and I want to be with you messages to all her friends on Facebook. My lovely hubby promised he would stop all contact with the POS. Yup, for a whole 6 weeks. My oh so loyal cousin thought it would be just so kind of her tag my husband on Facebook. Even posted on FB to pray for my father-in-law because he was going through surgery. Fast forward 5 months. I received a call from my cousin’s daughter and she asked me if I was getting a divorce. She continued to tell me that my husband and her Mom have been seeing each other for four years. Told me he went to their house. Went out to eat and played pool. I was devastated. And of course my hubby said the girl was a nut. I suspect mommy put her up to calling me.
    Yes my husband cheated on me. But, my slut of a cousin knew he was married. And she should have told him from the beginning that she was not going to get involved with a married man, especially her cousins husband. She knew exactly what she was doing. When my children and his Mom found out about the affair(he denies having sex) he dropped her like the dirty little secret she was.
    Any women who knowingly screws around with a married man deserves what she gets. So little bunny go hop off a cliff and enjoy the karma you so deserve.

    • I’m so sorry, Was a chump.., the double betrayal is horrific (and family-fuckers are at the bottom of the cheater phylogenetic scale, IMHO).

      • Thank you Tempest. Yes the double betrayal knocked the wind out of me. Not only did he decide to cheat he had to pick my cousin. I suspect she wanted us to get divorced because she is divorced and is struggling financially. And was hoping for the payout. I agree family-fuckers are the bottom of the phylogenic scale. I am sure karma will continue to visit her.

      • Sebhai I was being sarcastic when I wrote wonder husband. Nothing wonderful about the POS thing he did to me and my children.

  • Over the summer she tried to push me over, and called me “a human splinter”, we haven’t lived together for 5 years. She was very angry.

  • Sorry silly bunny…..Karma is a motherfucker.
    I’d of respected you if you contacted the wife the second he started trying to hook up with you.
    Divorce involves a lot of legal wrangling, so I get people who start dating maybe before the papers are signed ( I was one of them, but was single for almost a year) but if I met any guy that still lived with his family it would be a non starter.

  • This letter is just a hodge-podge of self pity, willful ignorance and self justification. It could just as easily have been written by her married boyfriend. Yes, there’s the good old (my wife is psycho – wait now my girlfriend is a psycho!) And he’s mad at her for betraying his trust….but not so mad that he screwed his wife over (that would require him to have self-awareness), but I digress. God this stuff is all the f-ing same – always.

    So judges, we give this letter writer’s attempt: a 5 for demonstrated ignorance, a 2 for attempted justification, a 0 for deserved pity, and as always, a 0 for creativity. The problem is this routine is just so….routine. And the Russian judge is always tough to please anyway. Better luck next time.

  • I have met so many men that use the wife is crazy story. I call them fishermen, they are throwing the bait out (crazy/boring/fat/stupid/mean/neglectful wife) and hoping to get a bite. One man, who was married with 3 children, complained how his wife only paid attention to the iPad and not him. His actual quote was,”Maybe she would show me some attention if I was an iPad” He went on to say how he gave her massages and cleaned the house and she just ignored him. This man eventually was kicked out by the ipad loving wife for having an affair. I think if you fall for this bullshit you are dumb as f___k!! I just laughed at the guy and said maybe the iPad is more fun than you!!

    When my husband had his affair I called the OW’s husband he was grateful to hear the truth. He had suspected something.

    • I went out with a guy I met on a dating site. He really was divorced (I checked) but in a serious bout of oversharing he told me that he divorced his first wife because “she wouldn’t have sex as often as he wanted.” So…how often is not as often as you want and WHY are you telling me this at our first meeting?? Mind you, he volunteered all of this information without my asking him anything about his marriages. Strike One. Then he told me his second wife kicked him out of the house after she moved a woman in with them who he suspected was his wife’s lover. Okay… By that point I’m thinking he must really be bad at sex if his first wife didn’t want to do it at all and his second wife turned to a woman rather than him. Strike Two. Strike Three was when, in answer to his question, I was telling him the cute and funny story of how I ended up with six dogs and he got up and went to the bar for a glass of water and then sat back down and started talking about himself without letting me finish my cute and funny dog story. No one walks away from me talking about my dogs and gets another chance. You’re OUT!! 😀 😀

      I applaud you for telling the OW’s husband. I never got to do that since my serial cheater preferred strippers.

  • MY EYES, MY EYES! The name Silly Bunny says she has a tiny, little girl voice or she just started shaving and goes by the name Brad/Tom/Josh etc. and this is from a troll.

  • Shout out to CL for this line: “You’re just a huge hole to him. And there are other new and novel holes. But the a-hole left you with a hole. Holes for everyone! (Oprah voice)”

    Laughing so hard, I woke up my little one. LOL! 🙂

  • “I haven’t had contact with either of them since the New Year”

    Today is Jan. 16. Presumably, Silly Bunny wrote her letter to Chump Lady a few days ago on Jan. 14-15?).

    ****Two weeks*****

    Silly Bunny, couldn’t make it two weeks without the centrality, kibbles, or with pain of heartbreak. She’s falling apart after two weeks of not getting what she wants. Most Chumps are Olympic caliber when it comes to waiting.

  • What’s with affair partners and the names they identify with?

    Over on an OW forum I get a laugh out of their posting names that includes reference to Princesses, sunsets, jewels, angels, fluffy animals….etc…..

    Overall the great majority of affair partners seem to communicate like teenagers and identify with stuffed toys and shiny things.

    CL….how about a thread on poster names for cheaters and affair partners?

    • I have participated in relationship forum for a lot of years and I’ve seen this too.

      Lots of “angels, princesses, tigress, pretty-that, love forever xoxo.”

      Oh and the number one thing I notice is “We’re SOULMATES.”

      I swear too that every time I see a post about MM (married man) it’s like yes a pattern and not a person at all.

      “MM and I are soulmates. ”

      You know that one just isn’t going to work out.

      I’ve typed to people things like “so what’s his ACTUAL MATE think of that”

      I also swear that MM is just one guy who gets around A LOT. He sounds like exactly the same guy in every damn OW post.

  • From someone who actually was going through a divorce when serial cheater met smoopsie, let me tell you what the inside of our house looked like.

    After I filed and dirtbag was living in my basement. He refused to leave because he was afraid “I” would claim he abandoned the Family Home. Can you say projection? Thanks dirtbag for letting me know what you would do in that situation!
    Anywho, for a short time he was on his best behavior, he actually participated in parenting and was tolerable. That is until he met his smoopsie! That is when our Home turned into a living nightmare! The level of disrespect astounding! Think 40 year old frat boy on viagra! With three children in the home he came and went as he pleased, with no consideration for the people who lived in this house. He told no one where he was going, when he’d be back, disappeared for days (it was all for “work” … hmmm hmmm, right!) He came in at all hours of the night and treated me like the built in childcare. He stopped being a parent entirely and treated the marital home like a hotel. He rescheduled ours sons IEP meeting that I had been battling the school for for 5 years and my son was finally going to get! All so he could spend the night 2 towns over with smoopsie … oops I mean “work out of the office 2 towns over” which he had never done in 18 years at his company, and it just so happened, it was the same town smoopsie lived in. Yep, coincidences abound in the life of the cheater! As we turned the six month corner mark and he still lived here, tension and fighting in the Home were so outrageous my therapist advised me to lock myself in my room when he came home. He started encouraging our youngest child who was still processing the divorce and navigating the toxic environment (that his dad was creating) to talk to his girlfriend on the phone! My child came to me confused saying, “dad is telling me this is okay.” Why exactly do you think he was asking… because he knew it wasn’t okay! Cheater was essentially terrorizing the family by showing us we had no control over the environment in which we lived! Though he was living in the basement he refused to move his things out of our bedroom, and when he was home he would walk in our bedroom in the morning to shower and dress (there is a full bathroom in the basement). My life in my own home became about avoiding him so my children’s exposure to chaos was minimized. All the while he told friends and family we were getting along splendidly and the divorce was a smooth as melted butter!

    Sooooo… when you date a person “going through divorce” but still living with their family… that is the environment you are helping create. One of disrespect, chaos, confusion and pain! But it’s all okay right, because they are getting divorced after all!

    • I agree 100% Got A Brain. I’ve been dating a man now for seven months. We see each other infrequently because of my schedule.

      There is another man I’m attracted to who is in the process of getting a divorce and he has a teenaged daughter. His X dumped him and was cheating. There’s no way I’d want to get involved or even date him.

  • This crap is why every woman needs to learn self-defense and take shooting lessons by a certified, safety instructor.

    When you are minding your own business, you never know when some fucked in the head, violent bunny off her rocker is going to show up at your door, job, children’s school and blow up your world because she got shunned by “your man who is actually hers.”

    It didn’t happen in this case, but it’s in the headlines all the time. It was on 48 Hours two weeks ago.

    • So true. I was so inflamed at my husband for not just the lying, cheating shit but because these wonen are often totally unstable and see you as the object standing between them and twu wuv. Also that you’re “trapping and victimizing” “Her man.”

      • Ahartmann, very true. The day I tossed skankboy out, I told him there will be no one knocking on my door. (referring to the whore) If that happens, I have no problem doing whatever I need to do to defend myself. He even said, “I know that.” (wimp)

    • Very much agree. I know of several Chumps on here who’ve dealt with this — it can get extremely scary. My situation was close (stalker — cut her hair to look like mine and even moved in across the street so she had full view of our apartment).

      Thankfully, the CrazyBunny in my case ended up being physically afraid of me. During the affair, she thought the asshole would protect her (hahahahahahahahahahaha!), which is why she felt emboldened to stalk in the first place (which I blame HIM for — asshole, exposing his family to that kind of danger).

      But as soon as I called them out, he ditched her in the blink of an eye. The look of fear on her face was (admittedly) satisfying. Good thing for her that while I may be capable physically, I would never have risked an assault charge simply because I had two kids in diapers at the time — who obviously needed one decent parent to put them first.

    • I get slammed for being pro-gun.

      I have no problem with laws allowing me to be a gun owner. I own several and legally carry one in my truck….a shotgun that holds 5 rounds.

      I feel no need nor desire to be a warrior wannabe with an aresenal of assault weapons and 100,000 rounds.

      If someone’s personal opinions and values keep you from being a gun owner, I respect that.

      But, I do feel that everyone should learn and invest in some type self defense.

      Never underestimate the protection, love, and loyalty of a family dog, either.

      • No criticism for gun-rights support from me. I do think regardless of one’s desire to be a gun owner (I understand both sides) — it is vital to have some form of self-defense training. Even with a gun, you can’t guarantee it will be on your person or near enough to be able to use in the event of an attack.

        So, empty-hand training is a great idea. Most martial arts are good for this, but Krav Maga (IMHO) has some of the most practical techniques for basic self-defense. It’s not important to know advanced techniques … but it is important to practice the moves over and over so that your body’s muscle memory is activated.

        In the event of an attack, fight or flight kicks in. Our fine motor movements become limited … and our active, top-of-the-mind brain becomes limited. So, having our bodies pre-programmed to “know” what to do in that scenario is very helpful.

        Also, pepper spray is decent defense tool (just make sure you know HOW to use it before you need to use it … and never spray it into the wind … blow back is a real thing).

        • My little sister took a course from a prison defense instructor who volunteered a monthly course to women. He taught a “street attack” type of defense that also involved a glimpse into the mind of an attacker.

          His techniques did, indeed, involve repetition, repetition, repetition of basic techniques.

      • To quote Henry Rollins “I’m gun sensible in a country full of ’em”

    • Haha, SDC, I got shooting lessons for my birthday and plan on buying a gun when my son moves out.

    • How about the OW in Florida who had the wrong woman killed ~ they realized they kidnapped the wrong woman but killed her anyways. I cant imagine what that wife is thinking.

  • I’m so sick of these OW!!! What does it matter what he told her she would have did it anyway!! The OW in my case was one of my closest friends and neighbors and she pursued my H and when they got caught she played the victim role that it was all his fault that he should have told her no because he knew better than she did ???? they are sick and delusional!

  • Yeah this letter reeks of bullshit, the author’s name “silly bunny” is a dead giveaway. The only decent thing silly bunny did was to tell his wife the truth. Anyone who dates a married person is a selfish POS in my book. There are plenty of single fish in the sea to chase, leave the married ones alone, it is not that hard.

  • Married is married! What part of that do these OW’s miss? He or she is entangled financially and emotionally on some level legally to another person and family. You can’t ride two horses with one ass! Just impossible. And the so-called indignity that the OW/OM exhibit when they feel they are being ignored is just ridiculous. They are so far out of the ball park thinking they should be number one in cheaters life. They will always take a back seat because that’s what they signed up for whether they realize it or not. The selfishness they exhibit when they decide they will “out” the cheater to the spouse is nothing more than a revenge tactic designed to test the cheaters loyalty to them and hurt the betrayed spouse. Pure selfishness. I have been on blogs where the OW/OM whine about this kind of crap, but you cannot get them to see that they are the interlopers and they truly believe the cheater loves them, but the nasty old spouse just won’t let go. It’s just sad. If you try to talk common sense to them then you get hammered with their defensive vitriol ( who are YOU to judge them? Only God can do that or they just know, cause the cheater told them, that their home life is just intolerable). It’s like a dog chasing his tail. They spin it to look as if they are the victims! It’s just insane. But it’s even more insane to write to CL and all of CN asking for sympathy. Psychos all of them!

  • For me I think of my ex telling girls the same stuff. Only staying by with me through cancer,etc.

    But what stands out the most is the timeline for silly bunny. You meet him. He is on his best behavior, you are seduced. He lays it on you. Then he says, ‘I’m ‘getting divorced, flat mates with the wife, and the children Don’ Know.’

    Okay, so you let this go on for 2,4,6,12,16,18 months? Not a change in ANYTHING? You let your ‘relationship’ be a fantasy. You did not say within one date, ‘let me know when you move out and we can go out then? Let me see divorce papers?’

    If I have learned anything about my lessons with my ex and other men, it’s that if they cheat, they lie. Most of us were in deep before cracks came to the surface. This was told to you in the BEGINNING. Meaning, you had to suspect on many levels he was full of it. But you wanted what you wanted to be true. So you let his ‘texts and sex’ be enough while he went home to his wife and children for 18 long months.

    Regardless of who you are, at the very least, you never wanted to have an honest conversation or you knew the truth all along and kept thinking you would ‘win him.’

    The world needs better people and parents. So please get help with who you are and let’s this very ‘typical douche bag,’ keep moving on. Who ever put you on the antidepressant- should be available to get you therapy.

  • This needs to stop now. The only person who gets a voice is the betrayed spouse.
    How dare anyone make excuses for the cheater. Cheater is a sex addict. Cheater thought it was victimless to have an affair. Cheater never thought about consequences. Cheater needed kibbles. Fuck that shit! Cheaters are terrible people. Fucking other people when the Chump has not been given a choice is DISGUSTING, CRUEL, DEGRADING, MANIPULATIVE, etc. This needs to stop NOW! CHEATERS.SUCK.
    Any person who engages in an affair (emotional or sexual) with someone who is married and living with his/her spouse must be held accountable for their actions as well. These fuckers along with the cheaters are destroying Chumps.
    The fact that any Chump lives in fear because they have been screwed financially, emotionally, physically, etc. is appalling. How many of us Chumps feel like we are stuck and have no say in the abuse we have endured or continue to endure? Society needs to wake the fuck up.
    A new day is dawning Chumps!!
    I promise you A, R, M, M, T, P, L, T and K, you will be held accountable.

  • Sorry dear….but YOU knew he was married. That should have told you: HANDS OFF! I don’t have any patience or sympathy for women like you. In my book- you got exactly what you deserved.

  • I hope you are happy now. Grabbing at a married man….making a fool of yourself and hurting his wife and children!

    Indeed the cheater is the primary blame- but you dear are a contributor as well as an adulteress. Married means married. There is never a “half way married.”

  • I call bullshit on this whore! She knew damn well he was married! She chose to boink this turd, hoping he would leave his wife for her. Sending the wife tons of proof because she didn’t like being called a liar, BULLSHIT! She was trying to blow up the marriage, thinking he would run to her! She doesn’t feel sad for hurting the wife, she feels sad because he didn’t choose her! F*** HER and the dick she rode on!

    • Yeah great point nomore, her motivation to inform his wife was probably to blow up the marriage. Talk about your all time backfires….no more cake for you.

    • This I believe. AP believes in her own, and his, greatness (cause tru lurv=sneaking around and lying to yourself and others)and wants the fairy tale, wants a commitment, got tired of being a side piece fuck, knew where he was spending his Christmas (that awful wife and…kids), and, gosh, blowing up that fucked up marriage didn’t send Mr. Wonderful into her arms…sob. I hope he changes his mind, that would be karma right there. Two crap people always deserve one another. ????

  • Bunny stated, ‘He has lied to me, did he ever love me? He will probably never want to speak with me again.’ I find this very triggering, first because it reminds me of my meeting and long conversation with the first affair partner of my husband’s that I knew of (nearly a decade into my marriage) and second because it reminds me of what I asked myself about my legitimate long-divorced boyfriend of two years who decided to pursue another woman/other women (including his work subordinate) before he left me and kept telling me that nothing was wrong and that there was nobody else, even getting mad at me for even inquiring. (My ex-boyfriend, who for years before we even started dating I thought was Mr. Nice Guy, in his twenties, was an OM for a woman who was engaged. I wish that I had recognized that his willingness to engage in this type of arrangement warranted investigation on my part when we first started dating, not at the end.) Five months after his discard of me, I feel angry, depressed, and nauseated (PTSD anyone?) throughout the day and still have trouble sleeping and lie awake for hours at night, ruminating about the his dishonesty, devaluation of, and disrespect toward me for years. That’s what ‘bunnies’ indirectly cause.

    Just cannot feel sorry for Bunny. She might not have ‘directly’ blown up her affair partner’s marriage, like a bank robber’s getaway vehicle’s driver did not directly rob the bank, but she’s an accomplice. Has she never heard that criminals often turn on each other? Why would she expect different from her married affair partner.

    Now going to try to rinse my mind of Bunny, my ex-husband, my ex-boyfriend and serial liars in general as I am working hard to ‘get a (productive, peaceful) life.’ I wish that I had been like Bunny’s affair partner’s wife and kicked my jerks to the curb as soon as I saw signs of dishonesty, disrespect, and lack of commitment, instead of waiting to be repeatedly kicked to the curb. I am searching for my self-esteem under the doormat I have become and try not to vomit over the nausea of thinking about the betrayal by my now ex-husband and my now ex-boyfriend.

    I guess that one thing I can be grateful for is I don’t need to experience life as an OW/OM. It was bad enough being treated like My Dirty Little Secret/Mrs. Robinson cheater by my legitimate boyfriend (who I wanted to marry) as he was, unbeknownst to me, trying to ‘win’ my replacement.

    • (((Hugs))) RSW. I know that doormat feeling.

      One of the few things that help me get out of that vortex of pain (it returns every so often) is to focus on and get pissed about the injustice of it all. Even with my many, many flaws, I can honestly say I was well intended. I tried my absolute best. I didn’t deserve to be lied to, gaslighted, abused. (Neither did you …)

      This anger leads me to a desire to succeed, which is helpful because it causes me to focus on what I CAN do — how I can be productive and move forward.

      There is no better middle finger than your success, RSW. 🙂

      • Hi JesssMom,
        Perfect timing and grear advice. (Somebody’s got to be a hero–Might as well be us, right?) On my way to work this morning, I tried to think of a way that I could channel my anger and frustration over being treated like trash. Will focus on and provide best service possible to my homeless clients who demonstrate much more nobility than these liars/abusers, many of whom have wealth, love and support of a devoted partner, we discuss on this site.

  • This really just goes to show you that OW are really not that special of a snowflake. She is either delusional or dumb. Or both with a side of vindictive. Looking to score extra kibbles by coming here for support? She’s no chump. She may have been duped (because she is delusional or dumb), but not chumped as only the innocent party in this is eligible for that title.

  • Look, I spent most of a year dating a “divorced” man whose “ex”-wife lived in a separate residence across town. I was even introduced to her at their son’s birthday party. I fell for him hard, and hoped for a future together. And yet there were *still* enough weird red flags for me to start digging and eventually discover that they were not divorced– not even legally separated. They were BOTH in on the deception.

    I had to dig and dig for my evidence that he was married; you had yours handed to you on a plate, with giant flashing arrows. And you still dated him? Shame on you.

  • My heart goes out to the betrayed wife. Silly Bunny and the cheater can both go pound sand up their immoral asses!

  • “Huge hole.” Damn, Chump Lady; savage af.

    The sentence Boiler Bunny wrote that said: “I feel gutted now because I have hurt his wife terribly by revealing their marriage wasn’t what she thought it was,” makes me actually believe this is an OW.

    She gets off on degradation and pain otherwise why write to Chump Lady? A real Twisted Sister that one.

    • I scrubbed toilets at Albertsons in high school. I actually paid good money to see these guys in Amarillo, TX in 1984. I did some really corny things as a kid.

      Little did I know that 32 years later….”Burn in Hell” would help soothe my anger on long, sleepless nights when I discovered my Minister was screwing my wife. That constant, repetitive hook “You’re gonna burn in hell” actually kept me sane for the next 2 weeks.

      • Oh I am not making fun of Twisted Sister in a mean-spirited manner. I dug those videos. And the androgyny mixed with a big middle finger to the parents was bad ass. “Burn in Hell,” though made me think of a laser-tag trip I took with the Baptists in *my* small Texas town in 1985. We all got dudded up and the minister admonished us to keep our hands to ourselves or surely we’d all be pregnant by the end of the night. (Wish he’d have tutored me in Narc detection.) Then we all sang along to Stryper and marveled at their perms! The power of music to save one’s soul in the far reaches of Texas in the 80s seems to be universal.

        • I actually saw Stryper, too. White Lion opened for them.

          Those were good years….then, that Seattle crap arrived and destroyed it all.

  • You got burned Silly Billy. It sucks. It happens to the best of us.

    Being single is hard. You want to trust but your gut was telling you it wasn’t right. Start listening to your god damn gut.

    In my singledom, I was briefly an OW too. Notice how I say briefly. He said he was divorced. This part was true — but he meant from his first wife. He omitted the part about having a girlfriend and being separated from wife number 2. (I’ve heard many similar stories including close friend who found out the man she was dating was married while boasting to another that finally she’d found a really great guy. The person she was speaking with was bffs with his wife.)

    I found my way to Chump Lady after my dating disaster and it has proven to be part of my healing 2.0. Maybe, just maybe, you’ve found your way here for a reason like understanding that people that cheat are fucktards. If not, you are now a wiser single person.

    On another note, I am confused about why you feel guilty. In my case, OW#2 was the one who came forth with the truth — or some version of the truth — that helped me decide to end my 17 year long marriage. I am grateful for it because neither my XH nor my Switzerland friends had the balls to do it.

  • Silly bunny,
    some of us have inadvertently dated married or otherwise “taken” people. Because you know cheaters lie about everything and not just to their primary chump. But…as soon as we get an inkling that there’s a douche beneath that charming façade we don’t ignore it. And we dump the douche and go NC and possibly send a hey to the douche’s chump.
    If you have an odd looking mole on your neck you don’t cover it with a scarf thinking “if I can’t see it … it’s not really there”

  • Suddenly, I remember that when I was in high school I dated for a while a guy who told me he was 18. It turned out he was 26 and married with a baby. In my defense, he really did look young for his age, and I guess he knew that. I guess he never told me he was single, but he also conveniently failed to mention a wife or baby, and who would even think to ask whether an 18-year-old is single?

    But my point is that the moment the word “wife” was mentioned (by someone who knew him and didn’t know I was dating him), my whole perception of the relationship exploded. I cried and cried… brokenhearted at the end of what I thought was a nice relationship. But I never spoke to him again. I didn’t even show up for our next date that had already been scheduled, and never told him why… just disappeared and never answered anything he sent me again.

    I have some sympathy for the genuinely duped. But in this case… I don’t know why she didn’t run away the minute the word “wife” was spoken. Why even stick around for the excuses?

    But more to the point, I agree with people here who say she DID know that it was a lie that they were getting a divorce. How do I know that? Because she says she regrets “betraying his trust.” This strongly implies that she KNEW she was a secret.

    Otherwise the conversation would go like this:

    Bunny: I spoke to your wife today and she seems unaware that a divorce is in progress.
    Cheater: How could you BETRAY me?
    Bunny: What do you mean?
    Cheater: How could you TELL her?
    Bunny: You told me she already knew. How can I betray her by telling her something she already knows?

    Bunny only betrayed the Cheater’s trust (gag!) if she KNEW she was a secret when she called his wife. She knew the wife didn’t know.

  • Ok Ms. Bunny. I am going to allow for the possibility that you are young, naïve, and inexperienced at life and you really did fall for the lies, you really did think he was all but divorced and you really didn’t recognize that you were playing a role in the destruction of somebody else’s family and how devastating that would be. The real question is, now that you know better, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to learn from this experience? If you never get involved with a married man again in any way no matter how hard he tries to convince you that he is “almost” not married then maybe there is still hope for you. There are a few other things that also need to happen, however.
    1. You need to humble yourself. You need to fully recognize and own the role you played in the destruction of the marriage however unwittingly due to your own stupidity and you need to feel so guilty about it that you never ever want to go there again.
    2. You need to recognize that telling the wife about the affair wasn’t what caused her pain. It was her husband having an affair in the first place that caused the pain. An affair you accommodated because you wanted to believe his lies (you might also want to examine what is causing you to have such a low sense of self-worth that you were willing to accept an iffy at best relationship in the first place).
    3. You need to recognize that the pain you are feeling at being discarded is nothing compared to the pain the wife is feeling right now. You have a few months to get over, she has years and a promise to “love honor and cherish” until death made in front of witnesses. Your pain and sense of betrayal is barely a blip compared to hers. You need to forget your own insignificant pain and feel true compassion for the wife and the complete implosion of her life as she knew it (but don’t try and express your sympathy because she doesn’t want to hear it from you).
    4. You need to recognize that her husband is a shit hole and you have no reason whatsoever to feel any guilt at betraying his trust. He has a lot of nerve even uttering those words. You need to turn your feelings towards that man into hatred for having turned you into a selfish slut of a homewrecker. Don’t seek revenge, however, just use that anger to resolve never to let any man turn you into a person you don’t want to be ever again and then follow through on that.
    5. It is ok to forgive yourself for what you have done as long as you can do so in a way that doesn’t condone what you have done. You will forgive yourself not because it wasn’t a terrible thing to have done but because you know you are never going to do it again and you are going to be a better person from here on out who doesn’t go around destroying other people’s lives. You are going to forgive yourself so that you can recognize that it is worth being a better person and that there is a good reason to stop your destructive behavior. If you don’t then you really can’t be forgiven, but if you do, then maybe there will be opportunities in the future for you to atone for your actions and perhaps prevent others from making the same mistakes that you made.

    Good luck.

    • Well said. I am sceptical and don’t trust anything so I have no clue what to think. As such, I just hope she works to never be part of this again.

  • If SB really had wife’s interest at heart she might have directed her to CN. If this letter was real, I hope that the wife finds here, gets mighty and leaves that cheater and moves on to gain a life.

  • The poor wife and kids had their holidays destroyed by Bunny’s sudden need to become “honest.” A woman who runs around with married men is never “honest.” I think Bunny told the wife deliberately. Yes, the wife deserved to know her husband and his hoe were sneaking around behind her back………but did she have to tell the wife on Christmas? She had 18 fucking months to tell the wife.

  • I’m not going to pile on or call you names, but for fucks sake, you’re a grown woman ass with children. Don’t come here pleading stupity or naïveté. You knew exactly what you where doing, it blew up in your face, and now YOU know what it feels like to be discarded.

    Learn from it. And don’t ever do this to another person again.

  • I agree OW is lying to others and herself. Cheater man wasn’t doing anything magnificent to hide that he has a wife and family. Even though his wife DESERVED to know that cheating was going on I think OW only notified her so she would boot him and she could gather him up for herself- the rebound. If OW really cares about the wife she would buy her a copy of Chump Lady’s book and direct her to this website.

  • The Moron that was dating my husband. The married man lol. Told me he said he was divorced but she never met his children or his family. She followed me on Facebook where it says I’m married to him and had the nerve to tell me she looked thru court filings and couldn’t find a divorce decree BUT she continued to date him and fuck him. Please girl you knew he was married what did you think you would get from Craigslist. Hell what the hell did he think he would get from Craigslist. What a joke. 2 gorgeous kids think this man their father is nothing but a liar and an asshole. He had a great family a women who loved him and kids that adored him. You know what I guess your limp little thingy was more important. We don’t care we are starting over and we will use all of your money to do it. Guess who wins. We don’t have to hear your shit and we are taking your money. I myself will one day not soon I have to fix my picker find a real man. I’m so excited to start the divorce process. I’m over this idiot. Good luck finding someone to put up with your bullshit especially since your almost 50 broke and living with mommy and daddy. Now that is priceless. ????????????

  • The thing I find most remarkable about OW who date a man they know is married, is WHY do they want to marry him? Neither of them have any respect for marriage, obviously. I understand being trusting enough to believe well told lies — some of these guys are accomplished, world class liars. But once the truth is known — what possible excuse can you tell yourself? I remember those hilarious Schmoopee cartoons, “our luv is real” “we are special” etc. They are so sarcastic and crazy — who can believe that schlock?

    The hardest thing for me to admit, to myself, and later to family and friends, was that I had made a terrible mistake when I believed the lies I had been told. I married two men I thought I knew, but they were strangers. I learned a hard lesson, and I will never allow anyone to hurry me along again. Time, and exposure, and commitment, and honesty are necessary for trust. I closely watch actions, and don’t pay much attention to words now. If good fences make good neighbors, then good boundaries lead to good relationships. Patience is my friend, now.

    The bunnies of this world don’t have patience and don’t understand boundaries, or morals. If they act the way this bunny did, and then expect sympathy when they get hurt, they haven’t learned anything about Schmoopee, or themselves.

    • To Portia,
      Yes, actions speak louder than words! Talk is cheap!

      Had to ask myself the same question, how could I have not caught on earlier than I did?

      It’s because we feel, we process emotions in a natural way, we aren’t hiding behind a mask, we want to believe the good in everyone. When we walk down the street, we see people, not pieces of furniture walking down the street. Ive had to learn that a narcissist is drawn to and repulsed by caring, warm. kind, empathic people. Narcissist’s /Cluster B/Sociopath, however you want to describe them, look at people as just a piece of furniture. To them this is their world and we are allowed to occupy a small portion of their world for a brief period of time, then on they move to their next victim. It’s a painful reality to realize you once loved a monster / predator, before you grew to hate them. I’m still working on “meh”, as you can tell. Will get there!

      Seeing clearly

  • I don’t have any high ground to stand on here- I believed my husband’s lies for years and years, and it took 3! Ddays before I finally understood what a charade our marriage was. I was just as stupid as this, if not more so. XH was a magically convincing liar, and charming as all hell when he wanted to be- not to me any more, since there are no more kibbles to be had, but in general people love him.
    BUT as other commenters have said- you are not silly, and you are not a bunny- you are an adult woman who has been involved in a scam by a conman, and you need to accept your responsibility.It’s time to grow up, Stupid Immature Rabbit.

    • This is exactly what I was thinking. I don’t think she was complicit. I think she believed a FRAUD, like so many do — including, and especially, chumps. They are manipulative, cunning, and convincing in their lies — which is why Chumplady writes of their “channels”. Kind of pot calling kettle black when people don’t see that that’s exactly the same thing they did being chumps too.

  • Oh also she thinks she is the only one please the joke is on you. Just ask the trannie. GB. Nicolette some Maritza girl and a bunch of other lowlifes. They all deserve each other. Nice Catholic boy having sex with guys and girls. All while he was married with 2 kids. Piece of garbage. He cries all the time and wants me back. My answer is never ever Thank god I was smart enough to investigate otherwise I would have never know. Thank god I got tested and I’m fine. Thank god I will get half his pensions and thank god I am the sane parent. He did me a favor cheating. I can now live a better life without him. I have not been this happy in a long time. Chumps hang in there. The day will come when you are happy and excited again. It took almost 2 years to realize what I was dealing with but one day you wake up and think what the hell I can’t sacrafice for this idiot anymore. Do I wish my children never had to know yes I do. This man is lucky they don’t know all. I saved him. He owes me. They only know he is a cheater they have no idea he is a sicko degenerate. No only I know the man is a sex fiend. I will keep that a secret for this kids not for him. They think he is a joke as it is.

    • Your post also gave me some hope :
      “Chumps hang in there. The day will come when you are happy and excited again”.

      That day can’t come soon enough!!

      Seeing clearly

  • Silly Bunny,
    Here is a twist:

    I am Legally Separated from my cheater…BECAUSE he is a cheater. He “said” that he wanted to reconcile, but too many lies and too many “incidents” led me to not fall for this again. So I told him that if he could keep himself celibate for 5-7 years…then maybe I’d reconsider if I had nothing better to do after that time. Of course, he is NOT going to tell any woman those facts. AND, he could just as easily go file for divorce if he wanted to…but so far, it has been over two years and he has not. He is may be telling women that “I” wont give him a divorce which is bull because there is NOTHING that can stop that from happening if he wanted it to. Easy Peasy. The Settlement Agreement has long been signed by the Courts, property already divided, we are totally no contact, and there is no financial obligations on either side. A Divorce would not change a thing…except for that he’d then have no excuse for toying with a decent women who would want commitment…because all he really wants is strange, variety, and the forbidden. So I imagine, he is probably considering getting serviced by prostitutes who want no part of being married at this point…which means he will NEVER touch me again even if we did reconcile years later.

    What’s that got to do with you? Well, ANY man who is not totally divorced, whether being legally separated, living in separate rooms of their house, or even just living out on his own while being separated is NOT really available for marriage/commitment. Ya know??? I know that this adds mystery, challenge and drama to your life…but just stop and look at the facts: A man who truly wants a divorce WILL get one, whether or not the kids understand. So will a woman. The kids never really understand anyway…it was not supposed to be this way for them. Plenty of people get divorces…at least half of all marriages.

    Also, if a man says he is stuck living in the house with his bitch wife because of finances…you can bet that YOU will be footing all his creature comforts going forward even if you do manage to get him away from her. If he cannot afford to be in his own place after a divorce, WHY would you think he had anything to offer when he then will pull out the excuse of having to pay support?

    You have been fed lies because you were flattered and enamored by that evil person who turned on you once you outed him. I think some of us get that since we were fed lie after lie also. We have so much more to lose than you did though…that is why many did the “pick me dance” long after we should have kicked them out the door. There are 7 billion people on the planet…plenty of totally unattached men to pick from. Start there. Let married couples have the time and space to sort out how their relationships will end if it is really going in that direction, and become totally divorced before you make a move on someone or get roped in. Do not be part of the tearing down of a family or someone else’s marriage. Chances are, only the cheater knows that his marriage is in trouble…because he is the primary cause.

  • Seeing clearly. Believe me one day you will realize he was never worthy of you to begin with. The cheater is a special kind of person. I wonder how they live with themselves but really I don’t care how he does. I care about the children and myself. This was a painful journey for sure but I always think things happen for a reason. I’m excited to find out what my future holds. I’m moving back to Brookkyn and can’t wait to be around family and friends. Not to say you won’t have sad days but I always Remeber what my Priest Father Frank said. He said when bad things happen you may not see the reason why right now but in time you will see it opened you up for what is about to come. I learned a lot during this time. I’m a better person I think a lot more of others and how my actions will effect them. I know what I want in a man. I know what I want to show my 21 year old son and 19 year old daughter. I know he tried to ruin the good person I am. He was always jealous of the good heart that I have. I’m never going to let that happen. Have faith you will be happy again. I’m just in the throws of this just telling the kids in July so it’s hard but I don’t love him. I could never love a person like that. I have a lot more good days than bad. I only waited to tell the kids because they were in college or starting college and didn’t want to shake up their world. They are grateful that I did. This will
    Change you in ways you won’t believe but it will be for the better. Best of luck

    • Takin backmyname,
      Thank you for your words of wisdom. You made the statement “he was always jealous of the good heart you have”, yes, my Stbx has always been jealous of my ability to care and jealous of my adult children that I had with my late husband.

      My Stbx and I grew up together/went separate paths for years. I was married for 30 yrs, had 3 children, when my late husband suddenly died st the age of 42 yrs. I thought that pain was unbearable and knew the only pain worse than that was to lose one of my children.
      I had just begun moving forward with a new reality with my kids and I without their father, when out of the blue, I’m contacted by Stbx! Thought it was divine intervention, blah, blah.
      I remember early on after my late husband died -what lesson could I possibly learn from this incredible grief.
      It prepared me to survive 17 yrs with STbx. His true freak flag didn’t fly until about 6 yrs ago when I became ill and couldn’t work. I’ve been a nurse over 35 yrs.
      I didn’t come into my 2nd marriage with baggage and didn’t recognize all the red flags until years later. Had it not been for my first marriage to a warm, kind, loving man I would have never survived these last years.
      What I thought was divine intervention and Prince Charming was in reality Prince Harming. I hadn’t been mi d fucked and emotionally abused and didn’t catch on early enough.
      I keep telling myself, I went through this for a reason, something good will come from this and I can pass it forward!
      Joining this site, was the best thing I did several weeks ago. Reading all the horrible stories and all the lives that have been destroyed by these evil soulless, shells of a human being have opened my eyes in more ways than one!
      All the kind, supportive, words of strength and wisdom from complete strangers on this site have made my situation more tolerable and have given me hope.
      Never in a million years would I have thought as I approach 60 yr old, that I could be a victim of a narcissist/sociopath/ they are cunning, charismatic manipulators. Once you unmask them, you are left speechless and wondering wtf just happened.

      To every woman on this site dealing with the aftermath of narc cheaters, while raising your children at the same time, you are the truly brave ones. I’ve been protecting myself and 2 fur children, I can’t fathom going through this with young children. That in itself made me get off the pity pot, change my name to seeing clearly, and realize I do have the strength to endure this and come out a better person afterwards, with my head held high knowing I never sacrificed my moral compass for Stbx.

      Reading the post from Silly Bunny got my blood boiling this morning. That’s a woman without a moral compass. She knew EXACTLY what she was doing and willingly made the decision to destroy another woman and her children ‘s lives because she wasn’t getting the sick attention she desperately needed. Have no empathy nor sympathy for her!!

      Seeing clearly

      • Another correction, I was married for 20 yrs, not 30 yrs when my late husband died. I know I’m getting old, but not quite that old yet:)

  • The thing that I do not understand is HOW can an OW even think she “rates” when “her man” is still going home and sleeping in the same bed with his wife every fricken night?? How can an OW overlook the fact that he and his wife are still having sex, sharing meals, raising kids, sharing jokes, going on outings, watching movies together and sharing conversations on a daily basis? Well, the wife certainly may not know that there is anything wrong…so she will behave like always, giving him the same love, affection and attention that she always has. How can an OW think that she rates anywhere near to that marriage dynamic just because she opens her legs to a married man? Or maybe the wife does sense something is “way off” and becomes suspicious and is not acting her usual loving self because of HIM and his lies/antics/spinning/and blame shifting. Does that make any complaint that a cheater may have against his wife valid to an OW enough for her to become an adulterous with him? Why doesn’t an OW have the balls to fact check with the WIFE before getting involved with her husband?

    What could a man like that be possibly telling the OW to make her put up with this dynamic for so long?? Does he put on the sad sausage act all the while he is fucking with her until he finally gets bored of her…or scared when he is pressured for a commitment? Don’t men like this make it crystal CLEAR to the OW that they will always be a side piece at the very least?

    So Bunny, I think this man was tired of you and slowly withdrew until there was nothing left but scheduled texting and no more talk of your future together…does that sound about right? He probably looked into his wife’s loving/trusting eyes one day and suddenly KNEW that he was about to lose someone wonderful and had serious second thoughts about having you around to mess that up. Then you outed him and blew up his chances to keep his marriage…I hope so anyway…for his wife’s sake. Sorry, but your pain does not hold a candle to his wife’s pain. You will just go on to another man…nothing much will change in your life except the emotional backlash of being totally used for a season because your life was not entangled in any tangible way with his. But his wife and children will have years of grief and will have to start their entire life over from the ground up. His wife will replay every single word you said to her over and over in her mind with all the imaginations that go with it…words that she never deserved to hear regarding the reality of being married to a immoral liar. Still interested in him?

  • My ex wife did this. She and her married OM had been spotted out together and outed to his wife. My ex “confessed” that they’d been meeting up but nothing physical. A week later she “confessed” to me that they’d been fucking and told him to tell his wife ( which he hadn’t). Anyway she keeps texting him to tell his wife and he won’t so the ex goes round to his house and confronts her with him and their child there. I was still in shock at this point.

    When I got my head straight later I realised that this was my ex, knowing that I may well divorce her now (which I did) deliberately trying to blow his marriage up to force his hand and “win” him.

    What a spiteful, selfish bitch she is, utterly repellant. Anyway after that I separated from her to work out the next step but saw over the next few months that despite the OM and his wife “trying to sort out his marriage” that he was a massive cake eater and he and my soon to be ex were constantly in touch. I realised I could never trust her so cut my losses and filed for divorce.

    Long story short, 2 and a half years later the cheaters are no longer together, (broke up and got back together 15 times). I think the OW are fundamentally so self obsessed and warped that they cannot see beyond getting what they want. She won her sparkly turd, but couldn’t make it work.

    On the other hand I got a life.

  • 99% of the time these woman know he’s still married, they just don’t want to look like an a******* by admitting it. I think it’s easier for the wife to be oblivious than the OW, because often (as in my case) the man is always home every night and weekend and always picking up the phone when the wife calls, while the side piece(s) are getting shut out during these prime times. Sure, the man is saying anything he thinks the OW wants to hear to continue the sex and kibbles, but sadly most woman should know by their teenage years that many men will say anything to get easy sex.

    On my stbx’s last (confirmed) affair, the woman lived in another state and it went on about 2 years before she called. They would meet up at work conferences a few times a year, and FaceTime during work hours. She called me crying and blubbering on about how he promised he was getting divorced, when of course he had never mentioned that to me and was happy by all appearances. Of course he made me out to be some awful bitch so he could seek comfort and understanding from her. This woman was in her late 40s, much older than me and certainly old enough to know better. So finally she had enough and sought her revenge and to blow us up. Im glad she told me, but I was also irritated because I had reached out to her 18 months before that when I first saw inappropriate/flirty messages from her and she hung up on me and refused to tell me anything. He was smart enough to keep his replies brief, professional and innocent so it looked one sided. So, she couldn’t really play dumb with me when she decided she had enough. My stbx was wealthy and we had no kids – certainly no reason for him to be stuck in marriage he didn’t want. The OW just can’t connect the dots – she thought she was so amazing she couldn’t believe he hadn’t run off into the sunset with her yet. I know she was also contacting him not long after her reveal, begging for forgiveness. I don’t know if she ever got it and I don’t care. His first affair OW was very similar – these woman are all the same. They know the game they sign up for and then boo-hoo and have a pity party when it doesn’t go their way. 1st OW was actually a LMFT and also quite a bit older – she knew about me from day one and didn’t care until things didn’t go her way. Their knowledge that they are not the only one and their ability to make an informed choice is often a luxury the chump doesn’t have.

  • I dunno CN, I’m torn on this one. While it is certainly foolish a risk to date anyone who is not yet divorced (especially if still living with spouse!! but I’ve known people who had to do that bc it was all they could afford) I don’t think it is by itself unethical or immoral. Some divorces can drag on forever, as soon as there’s a separation I think both parties have the right to date. When I left my abusive husband I dated before the divorce was final (in California it takes a full 6 months after you paperwork is filed, just a mandatory waiting period), and I was honest about it with people (in hindsight I was not ready to date, but informing people who wanted to date me of my status was MY responsibility). Obviously this guy was lying about it, which to me is then on him. Being foolish is to me not the same as dating a man who is 1) married; 2) you know is married with no breakup or separation from his wife; and 3) trying to get him leave said wife and kids. To me the line is crossed when that is known. I love this site but sometimes I think the judgement goes too far to include people who are not OW or OM insofar as they do not know. Yes if you find yourself in this situation you should examine your own mistakes, granted, but I don’t think the burden was on this woman. Sorry.

    • Agree, I also live in CA and things drag out here way past the 6 months due to overburdened courts. I would not blame someone if they were sure the person was separated and living apart. I probably would’nt do it myself because of the potential for drama. When my sister met her husband he was legally separated and living apart from his wife for two years. Sis had to deal with a lot of drama because when he actually filled for divorce about 10 months into the relationship, his ex got really upset and started ignoring custody schedules, trying to manipulate and control everything. I think it reopened the wound for her, though she was dating too she didn’t think he would really end it and also she was not working for years and counting on his continued full financial support. His fault for letting that go on too long, but there was a lot of heartache for my sister but she knew the situation and that it wouldnt be easy for a long time. They eventually got through it. My point is everyone is responsible for knowing what they are getting into. Homewreckers especially. You can’t claim victim if you knew.

  • “I slept with a married man and feel a tiny bit guilty about it. Then I found your site and decided that I could duck these unpleasant feelings by constructing a bullshit narrative that makes me look like the victim. I think I’ve got a good shot at believing my own lies if only you’ll endorse my crap.”

  • This sounds a bit like a witch hunt, to me.
    We all know how much cheaters lie and there IS a whole culturally supported narrative that makes “flatmates with the wife” credible. Especially since he dragged his brother into the play.
    I believe this OW is immature, gullible and very naive, but I don’t see in her story any indication that she wasn’t chumped herself. She definitely bought into the wrong story (the one where married people are legitimately separated), but just as we bought into the many false stories that we were fed by the cheater (the fairytale family being on top of that). It boils down to what you were taught and shown about the world, now she has learned her lesson not to trust anyone in that position. But as soon as she had growing indication that something didn’t add up, she did go to the wife for the truth (to get it, more than to dish it). She feels bad for the wife. Why must we reject this notion? Only because she also feels bad for herself? Christ, she’s human. To me, this particular OW is a chump as well. This would have been a better lesson to OW’s everywhere in “how you simply don’t get involved with a married man”, blame the narrative here. Not everyone is that enlightened, yet. Rage is good and mighty, but it shouldn’t obliterate our comprehension of human nature. It’s not good for all chumps to be mad and lose their ability to find compassion. They’re not mutually exclusive.