Dear Chump Lady,
I am 6 months post d-Day. My husband of 40 years finally has a move out date and I am starting to get a taste of what closure might look like. I’m still in pain, but getting better.
I would like some help parsing the communication I received from the OW. She was one of my best friends. I communicated with her three times after I caught them. The last time I told her I had no space for her and this was her response.
BTW the “trying to cause me harm” paragraph is because when the trauma was killing me, I told some of our mutual friends what was going on. We are/were both leaders in our local Woman’s Club, and she had fall out from it.
One other note – my “separation” was a monogamous where my husband left for three weeks to “think about things and figure things out.” Whatever…
So is this an apology? Am I missing something? Has she taken any responsibility here?
——————–
Thank you for responding. I accept what you are saying as your truth. Again, I acknowledge you and am sorry for your pain.
I too, know my truth. You may not agree that there can be different perspectives, but I believe kindred souls have lessons and connections that are just as valid, and can serve to help us flawed humans evolve and heal. My actions during this one life event, a mere moment in my 54 years as a human, a friend, a sister, a daughter, a wife, a Mom….don’t define, for me anyway, who I am as a person.
Susan, throughout your separation from Mxxx I always advocated for your marriage, and encouraged reconciliation. I feel I protected and encouraged and facilitated growth that needed to take place. That was destined to take place with or without me. Despite all the times throughout the years you told me you no longer wanted to be married, I felt you were meant to ultimately work things out. I am so happy for that.
I have forgiven everybody, including myself, for any pain or grief that has been caused. I have offered you my sincere apology, and it is yours to decide what to do with. I hope someday you can forgive everybody too.
If we were still friends, and I was helping you through this, I would tell you that the ultimate power is to have grace and compassion and forgiveness for our fellow humans. That is the energy that will bring to you the love you are searching for. To treat people with dignity, even though they may have caused you pain, is love in action and the universe will respond in kind.
That is what I would tell you, because I know your soul and I know it rings true there. It’s the best thing you can do for yourself. The clearest path to love. The path you will be most proud to have walked.
I understand you have no space for me. Given your prior behavior socially to try and cause me harm, I understand clearly that we will never have a friendship. Please know I do not hold any grudge for your actions, I’m just acknowledging them, and see it for what it is. I know you are not a hateful, vengeful person. It was actually a gift, and I accepted it, learned from it, and have forgiven.
Moving forward, we will be at social functions together occasionally. I will keep my distance from you. If there is any interaction it will always be polite and respectful. I don’t want you to feel awkward, and I don’t want anybody who happens to be around us to feel awkward either.
It is with love, forgiveness, gratitude and caring in my heart that I now cease all communications with you, and release any soul ties we had in this lifetime. Susan, I truly wish for you everything good, wonderful and sacred as you finish out your journey!
Take care.
——————
Susan
Dear Susan,
You are correct. That is not an apology. It’s some supercilious mindfuckery the young people call “concern trolling.” Or what those in the South call “Bless your heart.” A spoonful of politesse to make the venom go down. She no more “wishes good” for you than I am a frozen popsicle.
But this is the sort of thing the Universal Bullshit Translator eats for breakfast. Washed down with cookies, of course.
Thank you for responding. I accept what you are saying as your truth. Again, I acknowledge you and am sorry for your pain.
Thank you for responding. (Kibbles!) I accept no responsibility for your pain. There is your truth, where I’m a calculating, backstabbing bitch who fucked your husband. And there’s my truth — I am Queen Mab of the Faeries who rules the Women’s Auxillary with benevolence and takes my counsel from mice. They speak to me from the floorboards.
I acknowledge you, Susan. But do you acknowledge my superiority? I am a consort to MICE, Susan! BOW BEFORE ME.
I too, know my truth.
I like my truth better than your truth.
You may not agree that there can be different perspectives, but I believe kindred souls have lessons and connections that are just as valid, and can serve to help us flawed humans evolve and heal. My actions during this one life event, a mere moment in my 54 years as a human, a friend, a sister, a daughter, a wife, a Mom….don’t define, for me anyway, who I am as a person.
I am not defined by my calculated, backstabbing, best-friend-husband-fucking. I am a kindred soul who has evolved and healed from fucking your husband. You say betrayal, I say day at the wellness retreat. There can be different perspectives.
It was a mere moment in an otherwise unblemished reign of awesomeness. The mice do not judge me, Susan.
Susan, throughout your separation from Fuckwit I always advocated for your marriage, and encouraged reconciliation. I feel I protected and encouraged and facilitated growth that needed to take place. That was destined to take place with or without me. Despite all the times throughout the years you told me you no longer wanted to be married, I felt you were meant to ultimately work things out. I am so happy for that.
I protected your marriage by fucking your husband! I facilitated growth!
You groused about your marriage to me in confidence, and I saw an opportunity to fuck your husband and lie to you about it. #sohappyaboutthat
I have forgiven everybody, including myself, for any pain or grief that has been caused. I have offered you my sincere apology, and it is yours to decide what to do with. I hope someday you can forgive everybody too.
I am a better person than you, Susan, because I’ve forgiven you. For my abuse of you. Isn’t that terrific?
I have offered you my sincere apology for pain and grief that were caused. Who caused them? I don’t know! But I’m the bigger person, just out there waving my arms absolving the world of sin. A dropped ice cream cone. The slaughter of Afghans. Your feelings. Pain is what you decide to do with it.
If we were still friends, and I was helping you through this,
Just like I helped you through your marriage by surreptitiously fucking your husband.
I would tell you that the ultimate power is to have grace and compassion and forgiveness for our fellow humans. That is the energy that will bring to you the love you are searching for. To treat people with dignity, even though they may have caused you pain, is love in action and the universe will respond in kind.
Please take a moral life lesson from the woman who fucked your husband.
Grace is the ultimate power. The mice in my floorboards have it on authority from the Universe.
That is what I would tell you, because I know your soul and I know it rings true there. It’s the best thing you can do for yourself. The clearest path to love. The path you will be most proud to have walked.
The clearest path to love is to never breathe of word of this to the Women’s Auxiliary. I know about proud paths as someone who has fucked your husband. I also know your soul.
And the prophecies of mice.
I understand you have no space for me. Given your prior behavior socially to try and cause me harm, I understand clearly that we will never have a friendship. Please know I do not hold any grudge for your actions, I’m just acknowledging them, and see it for what it is. I know you are not a hateful, vengeful person. It was actually a gift, and I accepted it, learned from it, and have forgiven.
DARVO mcDARVOy DARVO nuggets. DARVOdarvoDARVO feliz cumpleaños DARVOooooOOOOoo.
(I’m sorry, the UBT is experiencing a malfunction. I must clear the cognitive dissonance out from the chipper shredder.)
I am the real victim here and you are hateful. How DARE you tell the Women’s Auxiliary about my personal path of evolution and healing!
Moving forward, we will be at social functions together occasionally. I will keep my distance from you. If there is any interaction it will always be polite and respectful. I don’t want you to feel awkward, and I don’t want anybody who happens to be around us to feel awkward either.
The mice, they do not shun me, Susan.
It is with love, forgiveness, gratitude and caring in my heart that I now cease all communications with you, and release any soul ties we had in this lifetime. Susan, I truly wish for you everything good, wonderful and sacred as you finish out your journey!
Take care.
I release my soul ties of you. Be free! Float like a balloon into the ether of my obsolescence in your life.
I truly wish you all good, wonderful, and sacred feelings of betrayal, that I myself would never wish to experience. I just inflict them. #4growth
It is with love, forgiveness and all the other words I strung together from box wine memes, that I cease all communication with you.
#blessed #snipsnipsoulties
chump lady I wish I was on your website years ago
you have helped many people. So much. Thanks
Susan, the fact you aren’t in jail due to ripping this woman’s throat out speaks volumes to your character. The rage I felt reading this post…my god. If my ex-wife’s affair partner sent me some bullshit like that…a temporary insanity defense would be on my horizon.
Seriously! what a lot of new-age glurge! It’s times like this that I’m reminded of one of my favorite cartoons.
https://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2005/10/12
That’s all I could think through this whole hilarious and totally true post. Thank God for CL because you have seriously saved some (all?) of us.
The whole thing is a morass of sanctimonious holier-than-thou bullshit disguised as magnanimity but I find that last sentence particularly chilling. “As you finish out your journey.”
She’s saying that she hopes you get over it before you die.
I wonder how magnanimous OW would be had the roles been reversed? Not so much I think…anyway I really give Susan credit for not bashing OW’s smug face.
Shudder– in other words, “Die, bitch. Die screaming.”
You’ve got to hand it to the otherwise awful character of Atia from the series “Rome” for at least being crassly direct and not bothering to be especially convincing in her hypocrisy. The way she handled blathering passive aggression was hilarious. https://youtu.be/-ciEMMZ_t58
Flowery, passive agressive fakery is the resort of the powerless, like the telltale buzzing of flies or the yapping of nasty tiny dogs. I’m so tempted to be crude in reaction just for the comic effect but no response at all is better.
Spelling– ack.
I would gladly bash that OW’s smug face!!! Ugh!! I can’t even!!!! What the actual hell is WRONG with people??? (Insert face palm emoji here!)
Seriously. What a bitch.
Seriously what a cunt!
The word “cunt” immediately came to my mind, too, as I was reading this. I really hate that word but there’s literally nothing more appropriate to describe this person.
Oh I agree. That word describes that waste of oxygen perfectly! I’d like to know who this word salad bitch is, walk up to her, look her straight in the eye and very politely tell her that she’s a cunt!
If I ever get shit like this from FW’s sparkle pussy ho worker….. I’ll ram it down her throat.
Susan, you’re a super hero to not get yourself arrested after receiving this. Hugs to you ❤️.
“FW’s sparkle pussy ho worker”
Cannot breathe… Awesome sauce! Consider that stolen! lolol
I feel like I have found my people. Yes. Sometimes “cunt” is the only appropriate descriptor!
Susan…I don’t even know what to say…you deserve so much better.
I only whip out the cunt word for special occasions, but this chick is a cunt on turbo. What comes around goes around and this Bitch is at the top of the KARMA list. I too have to complement you on your restraint. She deserves a good old fashion beat down!
Agreed, and I think it’s even worse—colder, more calculating, and more direct—than that: I think the OW hopes Susan dies.
I thought similar. OW doesn’t want Susan around – in the community, in the women’s club or in contact with the ex husband – because Susan’s existence is a reminder of who she is and what she’s done.
OW’s letter is both a power move and a warning – “Mess with me socially and you”ll get it.”
Yep, Susan was a reminder.
My ex and whore I am certain had a plan to seamlessly move her into my spot, and hey folks would adjust and she would be Susie 2.0. he even said to me not long after he left, I assume you will be moving to TX. I said why on earth would I move to TX, this is where my job and my life is. He was just hoping I would I guess, easier to slide her in place with me gone. Lol, the seamless transition never happened, and I was the least of his worries.
Wow, that’s truly awful. DARVO word salad with beeyitch dressing.
Your STBX has got himself a real prize there. Water finds its own level.
I guess the hard part is remembering that you were once friends with this soulless land-shark.
Don’t be too hard on yourself. People can lie for the longest time about who they are.
“I guess the hard part is remembering that you were once friends with this soulless land-shark.”
This haughty sanctimonious holier than thou live-laugh-love bitch is the female version of STBX. Lola, I love your comment because that’s exactly how I feel when people reveal themselves to be terrible humans. Whenever anyone refers to me hating STBX I just say “I don’t hate him. I’m just embarrassed that I believed his shit and married him.” Also embarrassed on his behalf that he lost his marriage and risked his career to bang someone who’s also just like this, and deep as a puddle of piss.
I believe OW often try to get close to the chump. Why, I’m not sure, but I have seen it time and time again. It happened to me, so, yeah, double betrayal.
The OW in my case sent me a terse “apology” with her excuse that “life is complicated”.
Seriously, is there anything more lame?
I was the other girlfriend – we didn’t know each other existed. We sort of became friends while comparing time lines that spanned years. Once she learned all she could about me I was ghosted. Found out not too long after she was back with him.
Once I found out he was a cheater I went NC & was done with him. I had met him 3 years after my 24yr marriage ended due to cheating. Thx to my CN post divorce education I trust that both of these men suck & so does she.
Yep it is a weird thing.
My fw’s whore came to my house to be introduced. Sat her nasty ass on my couch. I don’t know who’s idea that was. Another time she rode with me and a friend to an event. My husband asked if she could. Again not sure who wanted that. But, so weird.
You would think she would want to stay as far from the wife as possible, and that he would want the same. At least until he was ready for the discard.
It’s not so weird given their thrill and power seeking psychology. They get their greatest high off the ability to fuck you over right in front of you. It gives them a delicious buzz, as does the risk of being caught. It’s well worth the risk for them, just like the risk of dying of an overdose is worth it for an opiate addict.
My fw’s whore kept trying to arrange ways to meet me. I never took fw up on any of the suggestions of nights out with “friends from work”
of unspecified gender, which I assumed were the kind of lunkheaded, boozy men he hung around with. If I had gone, he’d have been caught immediately because I knew damn well he did not hang out with women platonically. That’s how he got caught- by being seen with an alleged female friend. I was not buying that for a second so he broke down and admitted he luuuurved her.
I got “these things happen for a reason.” Hmmm…I’m thinking the reason is he is a lying, cheating, hypocritical piece of shit….and she isn’t much better…she is actually a registered clinical counselor…who introduces herself as a marriage counselor. [Insert face palm emoji here too!]
Yes to all of the above. She is a soulless land-shark. I don’t even think she is human. She sounds like a robot spouting self-help book nonsense with a huge helping of blame-shifting. Honestly, reading her letter made my stomach churn. Real evil crap coming from that one. Keep far far away. I am so sorry for your pain. The blessing is two shitholes will no longer be in your life.
Agree. The OW comes off as a bit of a psychopath. I’m sure, like most psychos, she was able to fool Susan (and others) into thinking she was a decent, caring person. They’re really good at deceit but eventually the true self has to emerge. Ha! Good luck to Susan’s idiot chaeting ex.
cheating…
Haha– one of my kids just sent me this. Classic. https://youtu.be/p_NS2H55dxI
‘I have forgiven everybody, including myself, for any pain or grief that has been caused’ or as. CL says ‘I’ve forgiven you. For my abuse of you. Isn’t that terrific?’
Using spiritual concepts to negate and justify her entitlement is stomach turning. So condescending, not only is this not an apology, it’s worse than no apology!
Yup. It is an insult.
Wow this OW is bending over backwards to manage her image. I threw up a little bit in my mouth. Just yuck.
I’d rather have gotten nothing than this gaslighting, ethically challenged self promotion. It was very hard for me to read.
It’s all a reflection on HER, not you, Susan. Remember that.
Long term deceit and betrayal are hallmarks of selfish people with poor character, no matter what they tell themselves.
IF the OW believes her own drivel, she’s remarkably lacking in self awareness. But no matter, her pathology will be revealed to all in time.
She’s an evil nut who you don’t need in your life, and your ex is even worse. Hearing their “insights/justifications” is added pain you should not subject yourself to.
As my son said after D-day,
“GOOD RIDDANCE TO LUNACY.”
“Long term deceit and betrayal are hallmarks of selfish people with poor character, no matter what they tell themselves.”
I agree. My fw and his whore slithered around behind my back and not just my back but his bosses back (his direct report) for years. He even helped her get her job as his direct report. You can bet the brass didn’t know he was fucking her, but she knew it and she took everything she could get out of it.
Then some will have the audacity to simper to you, oh poor ow, she doesn’t owe you anything. She didn’t make any vows. Vows are not required to be a decent human being.
Those people don’t morph from snakes to decent human beings. They just find other targets, most times separately sometimes as a team.
I didn’t make vows to Macy’s and it doesn’t mean I can shoplift and vandalize the store.
Brilliant analogy.
“My fw and his whore slithered around behind my back and not just my back but his bosses back (his direct report) for years. He even helped her get her job as his direct report. You can bet the brass didn’t know he was fucking her, but she knew it and she took everything she could get out of it.”
Mine did exactly the same. He even made sure that she made more money than he!
Same thing – Douchecanoe hired his whore too. And they both were fired the very day after our divorce was final. I found out from a mutual friend that everyone on his team knew about their relationship months before and I told him so. But in court when he was trying to get out of paying child support (which he could if he was laid off instead of fired for cause) his attorney blamed me for calling the company tip line to report them. Good grief! With relaunching a career after 10 years at home and dependent on child support I’d be the last person to try to get him fired. These people suck.
My ex got busted and put back out on the street before our D was even final (we were still legally separated) Trust me this killed him. I worked by his side for years in the community and politically to help him advance. Losing me meh, no biggie, but losing his position, he never saw that coming. I only wish I could have run in to him after it happened so I could say to him “well you are no longer of value to the mayor, so he cut you loose, you of all people should understand that” But, of course in real time I was still broken, so I likely wouldn’t have said anything like that. I only knew because I read it in the paper.
Whore, got quickly moved to another job, which she screwed up royally and got fired a year later. Except for a retail job that she worked for a few months, she never worked again. She was about 37.
I left the state for my job not long after that so I didn’t hear much of anything about them until my son called and told me his dad with whores assistance, had racked up massive gambling debt and they had to file bankruptcy. So yeah they were the masters of their own Karma. I guess that is the way it usually is though. I remember when Dday all went down, my dad said to me “they deserve each other” When it all came back to me, I realized it is not just a saying, they really do deserve each other.
I didn’t make any vows to the other women so I don’t have to keep their secrets about how they wear diapers during sex and sell pictures of their assholes on line.
That’s how I answered that crap the last time a “friend” said it to me. I got a gaping fish face in return. If they owe me nothing I sure as hell don’t owe them anything either. They don’t like it when you point out that works both ways. lol
Great points.
“I didn’t make any vows to the other women so I don’t have to keep their secrets about how they wear diapers during sex and sell pictures of their assholes on line.”
Perfect, because that is the problem with the OW/vow argument. They made no vows/promises to us so they can say and do what ever the hell they want But, we are to show respect to them and never utter a word against them, because they made no promises.
I don’t know why some folks can’t get it that placing the appropriate responsibility on what the ow/om has done does not take away from the blame on the spouse.
I rarely ever spoke of her, or to her, but I will speak freely on these types of forums. Chumps need a place to get it out.
Wow! I sort of got the same BS from my FW. He’s not going to let his actions, past, abuse, mindfuckery define him. He’s a better person! He screwed around, but I wasn’t a good enough friend 10 years ago so…….. lots of deflection here, and compartmentalizations. See it for what it is, a fear of looking bad to others and justifying your “friend’s” actions. Nothing more
I got the same from my FW. He said how he ended the 30 marriage (f*coming a hooker in my home) didn’t define him, and wasn’t “sad” because it’s a “matter of perspective”. He is happy he’s now free and can “remove [his] mask”. Apparently I’m the sore loser because I wallow in pain instead of jumping around from hooker to hooker, living the best life. And why can’t I just shut up instead of telling people what he did? I mean, no one should know he sleeps with hookers, right?
In same exact boat!! They forget that their actions don’t only define them, the effect those around them. I’m the one refusing to let a whoring husband define me. Read article about “shadow women” in England. Dr is researching the forgotten people in the prostitution story. Poor whores, poor: weak, dim witted, void of character, selfish, has to pay for a woman to fake an orgasm because their wife is tired of doing it husbands. What about the one who was cheated on? That story is often ignored.
Eeeewww. That response from the OW was a hard, sanctimonious read, however it’s another good example of why we chumps advocate for blessed, blessed No Contact with the FWs and their affair partners.
Simply put: these people are insane.
I mean, did you read that? It was from Bizarro Land. These are people with no firm footing in reality and no ability to feel empathy. These are people who take any sort of personal contact with the chump and use it to better the chump emotionally while continuing to prop themselves up. I used to feel like crap after every conversation with my FW (text, online, phone, email, whatever) until I finally shut it down. It finally dawned on me: every time I communicated with this person made me feel awful, angry, or depressed. Every time we communicated, FW (or in this case, the OW) prioritized “their truth,” or their reality, over… well, simple facts. Every time they eschewed responsibility or empathy for those they hurt. Every time they managed to somehow insinuate that, in their reality, *they* were the innocent, traumatized party and you, the awful chump, were a horrible person. Every time I was banging my head against a brick wall and the brick wall felt no sympathy for me.
After every communication I would cry or feel nauseous. Then, with the help of an online support group like this, I realized that the only way out was No Contact.
Go No Contact. Blessed, blessed No Contact. No more personal communications with the FW or the OW. It’s business only now. Pass all communications from either of them through a lawyer or a trusted third party friend. You don’t need to respond or know what the next message says ever again. It’s all going to be hurtful, strange, insane nonsense that will never bring peace.
No more contact. I know being only 6 months past D-Day makes that incredibly hard. No judgment here. It took me years to go No Contact and I still have to parallel-parent with my FW and GF#3/wifetress. It’s a learned skill and it takes time to develop. But once you start, you begin to (incredible as it sounds!) feel better.
No more personal contact with either of those people; it’s all insane garbage that will hurt you.
Autocorrect completely changed the meaning of one of my sentences and I didn’t catch it. It should have read “batter the chump emotionally” not “better the chump emotionally.” A FW or the OP has no interest in bettering the emotional health of a chump. In fact, they hope you jump off the deep end in every way possible and lash out at them; then they can be victims.
The high road sucks a lot sometimes but it feels a lot better than getting pulled down to the low road with them.
They deserve each other. And you deserve No Contact. It’s the best gift you can give yourself and it completely de-centers both of them from your life.
Fourleaf, your comment resonated so deeply with me that I didn’t even notice the typo; my brain processed it as “batter the chump.” My experience has been similar to yours. Any interaction with FW leaves me feeling so bad that I quickly descend into the darkest of places. My therapist has been telling me for months, “HE’S TOXIC FOR YOU,” but like a fool, I’ve been persisting in this notion that staying on the high road includes remaining “friends” with him. There are so many voices, some expert, some not, some well-intentioned, some not, that envision a utopian experience between divorced parties where, for the sake of the kids, everyone moves forward in harmony and unity. I suppose it’s possible, in cases where the playing field is level, and the dissolution of the marriage is a mutual decision. But this is never the reality for us chumps. And thank God for Chump Lady and Chump Nation, who keep pushing back with the truth, standing up and calling out adultery for what it is –abusive and evil.
I agree with Hopeful Cynic and Real Love Feels Good that the OW is expressing a wish for Susan’s demise. My own FW and his OW allegedly started their affair on the premise of “what if our respective spouses were dead?” From there it’s only a few short steps to passive aggressive murder.
But rare is the cheater who has the guts to do their deeds in the open light of day. They want us gone, but their execution is cloaked in plausible deniability. Sure, they could off us with a gun, a knife, poison, but then they’d be sure to be caught and go to prison, and everyone would know the awful truth about them. It’s so much better, and more delicious, to murder us slowly. They construct psychological torture chambers, partitioned with a maze of distorting mirrors, into which they lure and chase us, shanking us over and over with thousands of tiny shivs.
I’ve been reading The Lucifer Effect: Understanding How Good People Turn Evil by Philip Zimbardo (he was the creator of the Stanford Prison Experiment). I’ve been agonizing over how my best friend and soul mate FOR FORTY YEARS could suddenly do what he’s done. I know, I know – it’s fruitless to try to untangle the skein of our individual FWs’ fuckupednesses, but this book has been helpful on a conceptual level to give me a framework for evil.
Zimbardo lays out various ways people justify their evil actions, including deindividuation (making oneself anonymous), dehumanization, rationalizing, framing, etc. Susan’s letter from the OW “friend,” is a perfect example of framing – presenting pure evil as the pinnacle of enlightenment.
Zimbardo writes: “It becomes possible for any of us to disengage morally from any sort of destruction or evil conduct when we activate one or more of the following four types of cognitive mechanisms.
“First, we can redefine our harmful behavior as honorable (see Susan’s “friend’s” letter) . . . using euphemistic language that sanitizes the reality of our cruel actions.
“Second, we can minimize our sense of a direct link between our actions and its harmful outcomes by diffusing or displacing personal responsibility. We spare ourselves self-condemnation if we do not perceive ourselves as the agents of crimes against humanity.
“Third. . . we can ignore, distort, minimize, or disbelieve any negative consequences of our conduct.
“Finally, we can reconstruct our perception of victims as deserving their punishment, by blaming them for the consequences, and of course, by dehumanizing them. . .” (pp 310- 311)
I’m still not sure if I completely accept Zimbardo’s thesis that one should avoid the fundamental attribution error of assuming that people’s inner qualities are the main source of their actions; he posits that we must recognize the power of the situation and the behavioral scaffolding provided by the System (p 445). My experience leads me to suspect that situational forces are what test the mettle of our characters. Put into systems or situations where cheating is possible, cheaters will disengage from morality, and chumps will not. The situation reveals the true character.
As I’ve been fighting the deepest darkness, the desire to just end it all to end the pain, I keep coming back to this blog, every day, to be sustained by the validation, to read the truth and cut through the bullshit propaganda. Intellectually I know who and what FW and OW are, and what they’re doing. Emotionally, psychologically, spiritually, relationally – that’s where my neural pathways are so deeply grooved to be bonded to my best and only friend who turned out to be my worst enemy and soul-murderer. God, it’s such a mind-fuck. Here’s to peace, blessed peace.
ActaNonVerba, ❤️To you. I can feel your pain. I too have read so many books trying to somehow suck the pain out of my pores and moveOn. For me it’s been a function of time and hearing what I needed to hear over and over again.
I am reading “healing from a narcissistic relationship’ and it seems like a very light read compared to what you’re reading,!but I find it’s helpful.
Hugs to you, and don’t give up.
You’re obviously very smart – you have a lot to offer the world.
Some people are just selfish, entitled and lacking in empathy ….
And sometimes these traits present themselves early on and sometimes after 40 years of marriage. Some people just don’t give a fuck, it’s not about you. There are people who just grab on to what they think will make them happy regardless of the enormous damage caused to other human beings -human beings they’ve made promises to, human beings who have supported them and shared their life and souls with them. I’m sure they come in all types but the bottom line is they are the other side of selfish.
They are crappy inside and you are not, so go forward with your beautiful self.
Thanks, Zip. People like you make the world better. ????
I will go forward with my beautiful self. ❤️
Dear ActaNonVerba,
Thanks for this reference to Zimbardo, I will have to read it. It takes a lot of grit to study what evil is, actually study where it starts. Your post brings light to a dark place; thank you, especially that you are helping other chumps when you are in such heavy grief and pain!
One of my favorite authors, Terry Prachett, said that evil begins when some one starts treating people as things. The horrible letter printed above, from the OW, reeks of that particular kind of evil. The OW is using everyone for her own personal advancement, which she thinks of as synonymous with spiritual growth.
Cheaters are users. They treat people like things, and after a while it becomes their way of life. But their treatment of us does not in any way sum up who we really are. It only shows how bad they are.
“Cheaters are users. They treat people like things, and after a while it becomes their way of life. ”
This is so profound. In hindsight I knew the ex was treating me like I was not even human. He could not have done and said the things he said to me had he seen me as human and equal to him.
That was many years ago, but one of the things I took away from that is that I went on to make sure I treated everyone with as much respect as I could. I always did as it was how I was raised, but I was even more aware going forward.
Even the whore, I call her that here, and she was/is indeed the very definition of a whore. But, I never approached her or tried to get even, or anything like that. In the beginning because of my pride, but later because it just wasn’t seemly.
But I will be totally blunt on this forum she was a whore of the highest degree, she was nasty, and she wasn’t even attractive inside or out. She was every bit as responsible as he was for what they did. I wasn’t because no one aske me if it was ok to add another woman to my marriage. I didn’t even get the benefit of the sister wife helping me with the housework. Chumps need a forum to let it out. 🙂
But reality is, I would not have treated my worst enemy the way he treated me. I never treated him the way he treated me, either before or after.
Susie Lee, I know what you mean. No matter how strong the anger and pain at the injustice, it would only make it worse to lower oneself to that level by retaliating with harm. I may have regrets, but I don’t want any of them to be for intentionally hurting another person.
Marathon, one of my favorite CL phrases is “wife (or husband) appliance” – it so perfectly captures the objectification. Sure, there’s a period, when we are new and shiny, when they “love” us, but that “love” is akin to what they would feel for the latest model of the iPhone or Tesla. When we cease to be of value, they discard us with as little feeling as they have for trading up any other appliance, device, or vehicle. It’s interesting to ponder on how rampant consumerism exacerbates “man’s inhumanity to man.”
You may not be at the authentic anger stage yet…but fuck them and fuck trying to figure these defects out. They are defects and that is all you need to know, period. Stand tall and just know they are garbage, and you are so much better than these pieces of shit.
KB22, I’ve certainly experienced anger, and it felt authentic. I find that I personally process grief and loss more in a place of sadness than anger, though.
ROTFLMRO!!!!
Awesomeness unleashed, Tracy……I especially love the ‘consort to Mice’!
Unreal how so many can believe that ‘mistakes were made, but NOT by me’!
Give the UBT an extra cookie from me
Continue to ForgeOn! to greatness, fellow ChumpNation Citizens
Wow. When I imagine a homewrecking slut telling me she was actually trying to SAVE my marriage and piously lecturing me about how to be a good person, I imagine the only appropriate response is punching her right in her smug face.
Since that response is not considered appropriate by society and is not legal,
the default choice is no response. Don’t give these ravings any air whatsoever.
Susan, I am furious on your behalf for the manipulations of this twisted individual and I’m sorry you had to endure this. It is most definitely not a genuine apology. It’s a nasty, backhanded slap from a passive-aggressive, psychologically disturbed wingnut. Keep as far away from her as possible.
Box wine memes! ???? Awesome UBT.
Too funny…I said the same thing (above post) about bashing in OW’s smug face. I give Susan credit for holding back.
Totally agree. I don’t think I could have resisted the temptation and I give Susan top marks for her fortitude.
OHFFS, in her ridiculous apology to me, the OW said the same damn thing. She convinced herself that she was actually helping our marriage, you know, by letting the XH fuck her up the ass, which is an act I cannot physically do.
And, as we ALL know, a good marriage is based on butt sex.
Butt sex salvation? Good grief! I can imagine the kind of weirdo who offers herself up as an anal surrogate. How low her self respect must be for her to be willing to take it up the ass to get male attention. But on the bright side, if they’re still together, she knows she has to get sodomized forever or lose the turd. Gee, I sure hope she doesn’t suffer anal prolapse or anything. ????
My fw’s OW suggested he agree to go to marriage counseling with me. Of course she would have wanted all the juicy details to snicker over, reveling in the knowledge that counseling would be useless because of her. Luckily, the jerk refused to go. Aren’t these OW such lovely, magnanimous creatures.
I hate how these lunatics act as though they are giving their blessing. Delusionally smug.
“And, as we ALL know, a good marriage is based on butt sex.”
Lol. That was the one thing my fw asked me that I refused. I guess whore played along.
The undead walk amongst us. Here is a fine example.
‘I know your soul’ … I guess she means that since you were so close she felt entitled to fuck your husband.
She’s a spiritual goddess, she should write a book and give workshops.
Wow what a backstabbing mega-b*tch! She and Susan’s stbx are made for each other.
“Moving forward, we will be at social functions together occasionally. I will keep my distance from you. If there is any interaction it will always be polite and respectful. I don’t want you to feel awkward, and I don’t want anybody who happens to be around us to feel awkward either.”
What she’s really saying is “Don’t tell our group that I was playing hide the sausage with your husband”. Full stop. All she cares about is image management and ending the fallout from the group. Don’t giver her that courtesy…
The skanky cheating slut is concerned that Susan or someone in their company may feel awkward??!! Too rich. This OW is such a piece of work. I’m thinking some of the “social functions” will be family related and I can’t imagine Susan’s children (if she has children) welcoming the OW or even their father at this point.
“ Moving forward, we will be at social functions together occasionally”. Nope!
You can put a hard stop to that too! I had the same issue with a dear friend turned AP and my ex. I shut down all options of sharing space so fast.
Tell everyone from any shared social group the truth, loud and clear. Accept ZERO Switzerland friend who want to be neutral friends with both of you! Even if it means missing a party or two that you know she will be at, so be it. I managed to get the 2 of them off many, many event guest lists.
If there are kids or family involved, keep them separate. His family got him and her at their events and they were both excluded from mine. Functions with my kids I insisted on him only if pushed. Made it a hard line that she was never coming to a graduation, wedding, baby celebration or anywhere near my kids or grandkids EVER.
Good riddance to your former “friend”!!! What a horrible, pathetic woman. Took me years to get passed all the anger and now I just feel sorry for her pathetic life.
She’s saying I will keep the moral high ground and if Susan gets upset then that will be ‘disrespectful’. Interesting, because I can’t think of anything quite as disrespectful as fucking someone else’s spouse behind their backs.
This faux friend is manipulative as fuck! Don’t listen to her words, listen to what she wants from you! She wants you to bend over, take it up the behind, and then sing like a seventies folk band promoting world peace. She wants you to not to expose what a shitty person, a shitty friend she is to all your mutual friends & acquaintances! So she’s trying to use what she knows about you to say it in a way that you’ll fall for it. You almost did too! Until you asked CL to run it through the UBT. If this was me, I would call her out next time ya’ll see each other together. “Hey everyone, remember our good friend blah blah here? Well, she fucked my husband behind my back. What a great friend, amirite?” Save someone else from being victimized by her. Just blow that bitch outta of the water!!
Navigator –
I like your style!
Thank you! 🙂
Ick. A true illustration of how the affair partners are as deluded as the wayward spouse. You have to be in deep denial to think that such gibberish is even worth writing.
My therapist told me early on to live in my own truth and to be wary of anyone who tried to convince me otherwise. A wise older aunt who had been divorced twice in her twenties said the same. Both said to steer clear of anyone making excuses for my ex, whether a relative, friend or affair partner. Don’t engage, they said. You know what happened and don’t need to explain that to anyone that wasn’t there.
The therapist said that I might get a call one day from a partner of his, and she recommended saying something like, “I’m not available to talk about X. Have a good day!” Whatever they had to say, it didn’t concern me. It was a no-win situation.
At this point, it’s been long enough that most people have moved on, and I haven’t heard from him in quite a while. The legal part ended six months ago. Yes, it’s Tuesday.
It’s been a day, months since I’ve been on CL but this takes the cake. (Haha, a pun).
Susan, that ‘best friend’ can take a big fucking leap off a big fucking tall building. Friends don’t get to screw friends’ husbands and then offer up some messed up apology like it’s a potato salad on the buffet line. Fuck both of them.
I’m three years post divorce and can tell you that life will get better. The pain will decrease and you will start to see your life with different eyes. Hang in there and my best to you!
Okay,
1. I love how they are very quick to forgive – especially themselves *eyeroll*
2. It’s funny to get advice on forgiveness from the person who has betrayed you. In business this is called a “conflict of interest” and frankly, i think this is what keeps us stuck. We go to the fuckwits to help us through the chaos they caused. Of course we shouldn’t listen to them on forgiveness or probably anything! They are fuckwits!!
Miraculous! My XH cheater (big wheel in the Knights of Columbus church group) proudly exclaimed, “I confessed my sins before and have been forgiven by God! I don’t have to tell those sins to YOU.”
*His sins was the affairs, methinks. That is not how confession works, pal.
*were*
Yep.
A huge part of confession whether Protestant or Catholic, and likely many faiths is the part everyone wants to forget. “go and sin no more” It is not “go and have fun, I got your back”
Two adulterers marrying and or continuing their relationship are continuing in sin. Likely they don’t care, but it doesn’t change anything.
I love the points your make. She forgives herself! And this is like a murderer telling the victim’s spouse to forgive him/her.
Can’t we look on the bright side of this? If the OW – formerly a close friend of Susan – had admitted wrongdoing and pledged to make amends, Susan would have a perhaps difficult decision to make: whether to forgive and reconcile with this person who wronged her.
There is so little apology here, and such complete willful downplaying of OW’s actions, that Susan doesn’t need to struggle with whether to try to revive this friendship. OW has flat-out told Susan that they’ll never be friends. Surely that’s a relief, right?
IG I respectfully disagree, if “If the OW – formerly a close friend of Susan – had admitted wrongdoing and pledged to make amends, Susan would have a perhaps difficult decision to make: whether to forgive and reconcile with this person who wronged her.”
The decision need not be a struggle at all. One is totally within their rights to not let anyone who has substantially harmed them into back into their life. Can they if they want to, of course; but no one who has been abused and harmed by another is morally obligated to forgive and reconcile.
In subsequent family events though the years, I treated my ex and whore with what I call “stranger respect” The same respect you would show a stranger. Not only would I have never been friends with either of them, I no obligation to.
No one should, any more than they should feel obligated to let a person back in their life who stole their retirement funds and most of their savings; (aka Madoff) because in fact aside from all the emotional, social, verbal abuse; that is exactly what they did, in most cases.
But, I do agree that in this case ow, has made no apology.
I’m not saying Susan *should* struggle with it. I’m just acknowledging that people do receive this message that they ought to forgive and many of us have found it difficult to reject that message when faced with a (nominally) repentant antagonist. I’m hoping that since Susan’s former friend shows so little remorse or empathy, it makes it easier for Susan to avoid that trap.
I think it was Susan who told the OW that they’ll never be friends. Susan created her own relief.
????
The whores and whore mongers can forgive themselves. (if you know what I mean) With friends like that…
This was a great UBT!! So many great lines.
One of the ow told me “I can help you”, denied everything then said “do you think it’s still going on?”
These cheaters are just the absolute worst of human kind. She could help me? By fucking my husband?, helping blow up a family with 3 young kids. That was super helpful. Although one day I do think I’ll be thankful I figured it all out. As much as I loved my husband I was tired of being married to him. The constant mood swings and doing his dance, I was tired, lonely and unhappy. So maybe she did help me after all.
“So maybe she did help me after all.”
That exactly. I owe her for taking over my future. I had no way of knowing in short time that they would be bankrupt due to gambling, he would cheat on her and she would be left with only a small pension, no savings and in debt for a big ass RV for over 80 thousands dollars that she has no mean to pay. That is the future she stole from me. He continued n to do exactly what he wanted to do, and he didn’t care what affect it had on her. He even refused to buy her health insurance because it was too expensive. He had it from his job. So for several years she was without health insurance, that is how much he cared. For that I feel sorry for her, no one deserves to be treated like that.
The only reason I know is, they lived in the small apt attached to my sons house, after they filed bankruptcy. They then proceeded within the next couple years to try to fuck over my son and his family. Luckily my son was smarter than me and never combined any assets with the assholes.
Not every Chump gets to witness their descent into hell, but I believe that with few exceptions a descent into hell is where these selfish snakes will go. By hell I mean hell on earth, I have no idea what their spiritual journey will be, that is between them and God.
You simply can not lie and steal and treat folks like shit and expect for it not to catch up with you.
CL is right “Trust that they suck”
I can see how it would be validating to see their self imposed demise, and for those they don’t see it I 100% believe it happens. They are con artists so we just don’t see it under the carefully crafted persona.
I think that life with a narcissist is always waiting on the other shoe to drop. My family is infested so I grew up with that nagging fear, of what’s next? It’s no wonder I married that same familiar dysfunction.
I’m happy for you that you were just a spectator and your son was spared.
I also think it happen is most all cases. As CL says they don’t get character transplants. They are after what they want, and that mean they will make reckless decisions.
I don’t believe in Karma as much as “you reap what you sow” You make shitty decisions, you will be dealing with one shit pile after another.
Son is ok now, but his dad definitely caused him some pain. He loved his dad of course, but rarely agreed with any of his decisions. He feels no responsibility or connection to schmoops, nor should he. She could have treated my son and his family with respect but she chose not to. People who don’t respect themselves rarely have the ability to even pretend to respect anyone else.
If you did not drive over to her house and burn it down with her barricaded inside (after any animals had been removed) after reading this, you passed with flying colors, gold stars, and straight A+’s.
Cheating and betrayal are proof that one is spiritually sick in a major way. To issue blameshifting mindfucking justification cloaked in spiritual New Agey gobbledygook is the height of spiritual sickness.
Boy does it piss me off.
And yes, what we DO is the clearest and most reliable indicators of who we are.
Beware false prophets. That could be a great new nickname for her.
O.M.G.!! I have no words. ????????????
I received something similar from my ex’s dying-of-cancer OW; a sort of death-bed attempt at redemption.
I didn’t attend his deposition, but when my attorney briefed me about it afterwards, she couldn’t understand why I broke out laughing when she commented that he confessed to multiple infidelities and named all but one by first name only, claiming he couldn’t remember their last names. I told her, “well of course he’d only name one by full name … she’s dead, so we won’t be able to call on her!!” ????????????
Soldier on, Susan, and be grateful she’s (they’re) out of your life!
Definition of betrayal
1: the act of betraying someone or something or the fact of being betrayed : violation of a person’s trust or confidence, of a moral standard, etc
The (former) friend is trying to distance herself from what she did and who she is. Up is down. In is out. Wrong is right.
Her inappropriate contact with a friend’s husband – including conversations about the details of their marriage – is only made worse by the confession that she knew what she was doing and doesn’t regret it.
There’s not enough glitter in the world to save this friendship or her reputation. YUCK.
This reminds me of the FW logic CL has pointed out many times ‘ it’s not what I did, it’s your reaction to it that’s the problem‘
My ex fuckwit used this many times to illustrate that I was some kind of angry woman. Yes, it wasn’t his cheating or overall narcissism that was the problem, it was my reaction at being lied to, gaslighted and blameshifted that causes him to cheat more. ????
I’ve had some lingering concerns over my fw’s relationship with a prior nanny. So I said to him” you know dad running off with the nanny would really fuck up the kids.” He said “yes I know that it will fuck them up about as much as their mom talking about it.”
Which brought me back to the same place with him it’s not what he does it just what I say that is the issue.
So he’s telling you to be a good girl. The worlds greatest mother with super power control of her feelings and emotions during the most heartbreaking of times. But he gets to hurt the kids for his own selfish gain. And your job is to protect the kids from the shit show he will give them. And yes, that will be your job, but the entitlement that he feels to actually tell you that is unbelievable.
And of course he doesn’t really care about the kids, he wants you to help manage his PR.
At first reading his statement sounds a little logical… They just have a way of twisting everything to their own advantage.
Its the subtle twist of words, that only the disordered can do. Sometimes I am still in denial that he is in fact a narcissistic cheater, then I actually listen to his words. In fact after I wrote this I thought, was this a confession of his?
Your UBT is spot on. Which is par for the course with these cheaters, they blow up our lives (children included) and chumps are the clean up crew. I am sick and tired of cleaning up, literally and figuratively.
Yes, we need to be the cleanup crew… well put. On the bright side ???? we will be spotty cleaned / mentally / spiritually etc. they will still smell.
But I know we didn’t ask for this job.
My ex said something similar. That I didn’t care about our son because I wanted to tell him the truth about why we were divorcing. I also got “children don’t need to know about their parents’ sex lives.”
I imagine if it was you cheating your ex would have been more than happy to share with the kids. Its our job for image management when it is their f-up.
Trying to muzzle you for his own benefit.
My ex wasn’t any better. The only thing I had going for me was my son was in the AF in another state. I told him the night he left he needs to call our son and tell him what he has done. And I reiterated you better tell him the truth.
My son called me later to see how I was and I asked him what he told him. He had told him “I am seeing another woman, and I have left your mom” He then mumbled good by and hung up.
So at least he had to do his own dirty business. This was about to blow sky high in or town and I did not want my son getting a call from his cousin or friends with second hand information.
This was a week after New Years and we had just spend Christmas with our son and his wife in AZ. I knew then something was up, but I was trying not to ruin their Christmas. I should have never agreed to that trip. But, hindsight. I was still confused and thinking somehow during that Christmas trip, I would wake up from a nightmare.
OMG, Susan, your ex-friend is a fucking pirhana. (Guess which part of your husband I hope she bites off in her next feeding frenzy?) And not just any piranha, but one that tries to channel the Dalai Lama, but all you can see are razor sharp teeth flashing.
However, she gives you one gift, which is priceless ammo, and that is telling your how much it bothered her that you revealed to the Ladies the truth about Her Enlightened-ness. It’s not Tuesday behavior, and it’s not meh, and undoubtedly Chump Lady’s husband would issue wise legal counsel against it…but I would tell EVERYONE what she did and have them read the letter and tell you what they think she means. Because that letter is a fucking masterpeice of virtue signaling and lack of self-awareness, and she damns herself in it completely. By everyone, I mean the gals at the nail salon, ladies in your church, everyone you know or ever met. Think of it as a community service, because it is.
Piranha in Portuguese is slang for whore…. hehehe
This; if OW truly believes that this ‘one thing’ doesn’t define her character or her relationships, surely OW wouldn’t mind her missive being publicized to everyone who knows both Susan and her?
I hope her comments were written on real paper rather than via email. why? So you can send her a quick note saying thanks for the toilet paper, it came in handy during covid.
????
I swear, the condescension, arrogance, and entitlement lines up perfectly with my own experience with my cheating fuckwit ex and her co-conspiring fuckwit who “befriended” me as they started their affair. My three kids and I trusted him unconditionally, and my ex insisted all along that her co-cheater only wanted the best for our marriage and family. According to her, the fuckwit was even recommending therapists he thought could help us. Meanwhile, I thought I was in the greatest marriage ever which is why I trusted them both without reservation. Biggest mistake of my life.
These lowlife clowns lack any originality…they all garble in the same tone of voice from the same new age script. I don’t know why, but reading this makes me giddy and heals my soul!
I feel this comment all the way to my core.
Stupid did the same, except it was with one of my son’s hockey coaches. My mind still boggles with the pure amount of thoughtlessness still boggles my mind, even years later.
You’re right though, absolutely no original thought what-so-ever. Fucking losers.
This letter reads like an ‘intellectual”, typical of those who have no healthy coping skills of reason,
rationale, empathy or heart. The writer is a cold transactional person who achieves goals strictly for
personal gain. They target the weak and confused (aka cheaters) with full intent to exploit others
for resources. The letter writer is a disordered person humoring herself by drawing you in. Step away.
Hey! I’m a card-carrying intellectual, but I’ve never been cruel, hoity-toity, gaslighting, uh…. and all the other nasty stuff that OW tried to pull off (badly). Being intellectual has nothing to do with character. And I’m not a lying cheat either! There are just as many stupid dillweeds as smarty-pants meanies.
“Thanks for your note! Opposite Day is one of my favorite national holidays!”
????
I believe that we have a situation where an older man has gone after a younger woman. Because he is obviously 70+ this woman is at least 16 or more years younger. He could not very well have gone after a 24-year-old without the entire community throwing up so he settled for second-best. No third best. His wife is first. Some unknown 24-year-old a second, but the 54-year-old has gotten herself a golden ticket because he’s probably not going to live forever and she’s going to have some money without doing more than sneaking around her best friend’s life. See how that works? It happened in my community but before he could actually get the divorce, which was on its way, he died. All of his wife’s friends rejoiced because she got his pretty extensive holdings and the girlfriend got nothing. And instance of Karma if I’ve ever heard of one.
“Some unknown 24-year-old a second, but the 54-year-old has gotten herself a golden ticket because he’s probably not going to live forever and she’s going to have some money without doing more than sneaking around her best friend’s life. ‘
Doesn’t always work out as well as they expect.
My ex gambled away everything he had after they were married, and he got most of the property in our D, so had he not been an irresponsible ass he could have been wealthy in a few years. I am sure his five years younger poverty stricken whore thought she had landed on easy street. (and quite frankly, I thought she did too).
Nope, after they filed bankruptcy due to his gambling, they lived in a small studio apt attached to my son for a few years, blew up that relationship and fled to Florida and bought a run down trailer in a seniors community. He about two years ago bought a 100 thousand dollar big ass RV, and when my son asked him how on earth he would pay for it he said “I don’t care, I will be dead” He died in Jan of this year and she is in debt for it. No insurance, a small pension that was reduced because he retired early is all she got. She does have her own SS, but it is not a lot because she quite working at about age 38 39, and never worked again. What little SS he had was less than hers. He was in a private pension through the PD.
I don’t know what she is doing now, because as soon as my son saw that his dads remains were taken care of, and he gave her all the phone numbers and information she needed to take care of her own business, he left. They are no longer in contact. She has two grown sons nearby, so they can take it from here. Unfortunately for her, they are both pretty much just like her.
So that windfall they are looking for does not always materialize.
Honestly I think most cheaters are only after their own thrills and happiness, hunkering down and preserving money for the whore they are currently with is rarely on the top of their want list.
I would “accidentally” share this particular CL post on the Women’s Group FB page.
0Oooo0OOOpppsie!
Honestly, this OW thinks she’s hot stuff, but she’s only hot when the sidewalk heats up since she’s the dog shit stuck to the gum on the bottom of your shoe.
I know it hurts like crazy, but you are actually well rid of both of them. And any other friends who think her serene highness has a point. I wish you well.
????dog shit stuck to gum…????
Susan, this fuckwit AP wrote to tell you that she forgave herself for abusing you and to convince you that you will only heal if you a) don’t tell anyone else that she fucked your husband behind your back while sipping tea and offering you marriage advice and b) forgive “others” for your nebulous pain that just happened spontaneously and gosh she has no idea how since her truth says she is a dear friend helping you on your journey.
Holy crap on a cracker.
This is not even close to an apology. It’s sanctimonious DARVO dribble. I’m sorry you ever responded to her. No contact is the way to go. I sincerely hope you don’t stop attending any social functions because of this skunk AP. If your state allows adultery as divorce grounds, I’d file for it an list this dingbat as a witness to be deposed. Hell, I’d pay an attorney to depose her just to make her raise her hand and swear to tell “the” truth. Not “your” truth, you hideous cur, but “the” truth about how you banged Susan’s husband behind her back. I’d do it so that “the” truth is in public record so if anyone says that is not what AP said really happened, you can direct them to her deposition on file at the courthouse. It’s pretty simple. Was he married? Yes. And you knew it because you were friends with his wife, right? Yes. Did you have sex with him? Yes.
Case. Closed.
AP can dance all around it in this crap message all she wants. There are plenty of people in this country in denial about objective facts. I’m sure AP’s mice minions may still have their heads in the sand, but don’t for a minute buy this “your truth” and “AP’s truth” drivel. She took action to hurt you. It was no accident. Accidents can be forgiven. Your husband wasn’t out hiking and tripped and fell into the AP’s vagina. I can’t get over the audacity this AP had to write this, but this… THIS is what these people are like. This is why we go no contact. On some level, AP might actually believe this BS. She thinks she deserves to take what she wants and be underhanded and 10 hail Marys later she is forgiven and off the hook. Good riddance to her and your FW ex.
This ????????????????????????????????????????????????
Besides gleefully anticipating CL’s snark, while reading this backstabber’s narcissistic piece of crap I kept thinking what a waste of resources this creature is.
If she dried up and blew away planet Earth would sigh in relief: no more water and clean air wasted flushing her poop, growing her food, bringing her light and internet to write and send off her masterpiece.
????love that perspective!
OldDogNewTricks:
My post refers to disordered persons of whom “intellectual” is the only coping skill they use.
When a void exists where reason, rationale, empathy and heart are missing; intellectualism can
still be a very effective relational skill.
No doubt you are a fortunate intellectual who has many other relational skills that make you a quality person. Disordered people do not. They are deficient and dangerous.
That’s some serious sanctimonious BS of the finest vintage. BLECH.
First of all, I think all betrayal is bad, but betrayal by so called friends is the worst. It made me re-evaluate all my criteria for making friends. I only have a few friends, many acquaintances, and since I do not have or want a husband, I suppose I don’t have to worry about this particular issue any more.
When someone presents as Mother Theresa, I am always doubtful. I just don’t believe saints walk among us at the grocery store, or in public gatherings. Saints are busy doing hard, nasty work that no one else wants to do, and they don’t spend time seeking fame or a high social profile. My EX, father of my children, always asks me “Why can’t we just be friends? That’s all in the past!” He does not seem to grasp that he is not friend material, and I do not want or need him to be a friend. Any woman who puts up with him for long has no sense of self worth, and is planning to live an inauthentic life as far as I am concerned. I never accepted his evaluation of my abilities or worth, and that is why we did not get along. I had children with this man, and that was hard, but I am glad I have my children. I will never be more than distant and polite with him again, and then I do it for my children’s sake.
The bottom line here is it does not matter to you what these FW’s think or want. You are building your own life, and you don’t have time for the pain these folks carry with them. Imagine them as “Pigpen” (from Charlie Brown cartoons) type characters, traveling through life with a cloud of sordid intentions floating about them at every move. They are easy to spot, and easy to avoid. After all, you don’t want to breathe in any of that vile cloud which surrounds them. Wear a mask and social distance. It may save your life!
I never was contacted by one of his whores, but he triangulated me with her by telling me she was “praying” for me and she hoped we’d get the spark back in our marriage (which by the way I didn’t know was extinguished) and she was a spiritual woman and I’d like her a lot, too. I told him she was a hypocrite and needed to check out the 10 commandments before spouting off that BS. He opened a private window into our marriage with a coworker and I had no idea I was being betrayed. When I found out, I immediately filed for divorce. HE could have written that UBT letter himself, one of his favorite BS lines was “I’m sorry if you were hurt. That wasn’t my intention.”
Susan,
Cheaters always turn it back on you – it’s a you problem and you should just shut up and forgive. Fuck that. Tell anyone that asks what transpired because that bitch will be spinning her own story to save face.
A real supporter of women isn’t she?
She describes her betrayal and destruction as a “mere moment” in her life that doesn’t define her as a person. I wonder what, exactly, she thinks DOES define people. What a smug asshat.
“Fiddle-dee-dee, I won’t think about that now.”
The cheater X chose this moon bat and will now reap the consequence of that. That is punishment.
This bitch just said cheating did not define her as a wife. This delusional asshole is pathetic. Out her ass and keep it moving! Like someone else said, share this letter everywhere. Then we will see what “defines her”.
And to be fair to her it was just a moment, because it wasn’t her destruction. At least not yet.
It is certainly more than a moment for the victims.
Self-righteous.. the only word that comes to mind. These days 4.5 yrs out, I think about what I missed and why I didn’t escape earlier -affair or no affair. I see the affair as a mean cruel act of a small entitled cowardly man. He was that way always and I put up with it. The OW was just looking out for herself-a single poverty stricken Mom looking for a sugar daddy. If the OW had been a “friend” I would have been doubly devastated. Literally salt in An open bleeding wound. Makes me so sad for you!! No amount of invective can explain or clean up this word vomit. I hope the women’s club are stand up people who won’t tolerate her BS. If not then find a new women’s club. Hugs and great empathy for your pain. I hope you FWs dick rots and falls off.
I hate that phrase “my truth”.
“Journey” is getting on my nerves these days too. Someone at an Al Anon meeting characterized his cheating and betrayal as “his journey”. ????
How about we stick with FACTS? There is no perspective involved or necessary.
When my daughter was in first grade s
they did an assignment where they had to decide if a sentence was a FACT or OPINION. It was an enormous Aha! moment for me. It’s an extremely useful tool for staying non-reactive when talking with others
Of course my OPINION is going to differ with a cheater’s.
But the FACTS are indefensible and not up for debate. Also not up for debate are MY FEELINGS.
that’s some serious southern lady shame talk going on in that letter. “bless you, you’re weak so i stepped in and fucked your H. you’d best forgive me or go to hell for the sin of not forgiving.”
fuck that nonsense. Susan is an asshole.
and why the hell do people have to be graceful/not angry/not falling apart/not frozen in shock after being chumped?
recently, i had some friends for dinner, the first time i’ve seen them post-split, and they sat at my table and expressed their shock over our split. “now, you just have to get this separation agreement finished,” said Irene, blinking vigourously. i explain i need some outside consultations with pension and financial specialists, etc.etc. i’ve got things to learn. “just get it done,” she insisted. and i thought fuck you, Irene, you don’t know squat. my X is angry and starting to make trouble, the finances are not yet split and i’ll be damned if i sign a contract without fully understanding each and every point.
i kinda teared up and Irene said, “you’ve got to toughen up” and i said, “that’s southern lady talk for ‘bless your heart, you’re an emotional person’ and we all know that means ‘FFS pull yourself together, woman’. her husband Gerry looked embarrassed.
Irene is an asshole.
assholes are everywhere.
oops. i misread the letter and thought Susan was the OW. i’m sorry!
gah.
“and why the hell do people have to be graceful/not angry/not falling apart/not frozen in shock after being chumped?”
Anger, frustration, falling apart, frozen in shock and more are all perfectly normal and even healthy reactions to extreme trauma of personal and financial betrayal.
Every time I read the sentence ‘Irene is an asshole.” It just makes me laugh.
Because lord yes, she surely is.
“I acknowledge you and am sorry for your pain.” Note she doesn’t take responsibility for causing the pain, just that she’s “sorry for your pain,” like she would be sorry a tree fell on your car.
“My actions during this one life event, a mere moment in my 54 years as a human…don’t define, for me anyway, who I am as a person.” –Betraying you, my friend, and cheating with your husband, are a “mere moment” to me, although it blew up your life forever. But it’s a meaningless “life event” to me.
I didn’t have to go any further than this to know that this woman is a manipulator who drives a dump truck full of garbage through the lives of other people and blames them because she’s spreading stink.
Makes me wonder what her back story is as well. No way did she get to age 54 without spraying sewage at lots of folks which might include kids and a former spouse. I am sure we would find proof of Trust They Suck in her origin story.
But hey, she will ponder What Really Matters and spout her haughty wis-dumb and look down her nose at anyone less enlightened than she. Sounds like the wandering dick fuckwit is going to get what he deserves by sticking it in this brand of self-deluded crazy.
I was wondering about her background as well. This is not her first rodeo and clearly she hates to be called out on her vile behavior so she turns the tables but quick.
That’s mindfuckery at the tippity top Mt. Everest rung. For fws and their soulless slugs…,,,,,,,,business as usual.
It does validate with triple highlighters that she and your morally void ex, are just two peas in a pod, harvesters and spreaders of drama, chaos and destruction. Their hands are locked together in unity as they skip through a beautiful, sunshine kissed field of flowers, ever so gently lobbing live grenades over their shoulders as they gaze into each other’s eyes.
How can another loving sentient being want anything but goodness, grace and love for all, they wonder? How can you stay so unevolved Susan? You’re like one of the mice under the Queen of goodness’s floorboards. Can’t you see the goodness buried in the cow piles of delusion we are so desperate to show you?
It’s scary how they are all convinced they are victims. All they really want is to live a truthful, loving life.
So, let’s please, just miraculously forget the part I fucked your husband right out from under you. That’s so in the past. Why can’t you see we deserve to be happy at the expense of all others on this earth?
Don’t look behind any curtain for truth, the only thing for sale is her own narrative and she’s repeated it to herself so often that she might actually even buy it now. I get to steal my good friend’s husband without a stitch of guilt, shame or consequences, what a relief that is!
No response to that letter is the best response. That level of delusion is beyond any earthly repair from any of our known toolboxes.
What a load of crap. Apology…I don’t think so. They can both fuck off; your soon to be ex and the slag he rode in on.
I’m sorry you are hurting.
Susan,
She’s asking you to be a nice person by not being mad at her. And if you’re not, she’s saying that you’re just not as nice of a person as you purport yourself to be! She’s a bitch of the first order because she’s manipulating you based on your own belief system. As stated many times by CL, it’s not what she did, it’s your reaction to what she did. And she messes further with your head because she has no ‘grudge against your actions’. See! She’s a better person than you are!! She even forgives you for still holding a grudge! As with my fuckwit’s skank, she’s going to keep her distance from you because she’s fucking afraid of you. But she can’t admit it, so she says she’s doing it out of caring for you. Bullshit! My ex’s fuckwit was just as deranged as this sicko. And she also had me believing that she cared for me. (Read my UBT https://www.chumplady.com/2015/11/ubt-ow-i-just-want-to-reach-out-and-help-you/). I recommend that you do NOT have any more conversations with this psycho because she’ll only mess with your head more and more. And if you see her, make sure you give her the cut direct and if someone says why are you avoiding her, say, “She fucked around with my husband behind my back.” Don’t mince words. Don’t continue the conversation, but don’t avoid the truth.
We all have different truths. What you call pain, I call joy. What you call summer I call winter. What you call up I call down. What you call murder I call liberation from suffering. When you say 2+2=4 I say it equals 5. The beautiful thing is everybody is right since we all have our own truth. Right fuckwits?
Lol ???? ????
haha
I hope you can keep the pressure on her in the women’s group. She needs to find somewhere else to go retail her bitchy, self-justifying bullshit. Get a one or two line response ready for when someone in the group asks why you will not countenance being on a committee with her or hosting an event with her–something along the line of ‘After she engaged in an affair with my husband, she wrote me a note explaining that I should treat her with “grace,” “compassion,” and “dignity” because my marriage was “destined” to break up, and she had already “forgiven herself” for her behavior. I hope you can understand, that someone who, to put it bluntly, pretends to be my friend, fucks my husband and then demands my respect, is not someone I will work with. I hope you won’t either, but that is your decision.”
The arrogance of “forgiving herself” is stunning. Maybe we need to learn to forgive ourselves of wrongs we’ve committed after we’ve had time to make reparations or to grow through years of practice, but to “forgive” herself while you are still moving your husband out of the house, negotiating a divorce, and building a new life is a real head-turner.
Apologies ask for forgiveness, they don’t claim it as an already accomplished goal, But you don’t owe her one in response to any note she might write.
That “apology” letter belongs in the rubbish. If it doesn’t bother you too much, it might be worth responding with a “K”, just to test how much more word vomit that horrible woman can spew out. I do enjoy envisioning her in all her self-righteousness sitting there for hours composing that waste of paper or digital storage.
Oh, yes! You definitely don’t want to poke the sanctimonious narcissistic bear, but it is fun to imagine. What would be the most irritating reply, knowing you would definitely NOT read the reply?
I’m thinking: “whatever, whore”
That reply is pretty perfect. To make the tone just a little more flippant, I have a slight preference for “whatevs, whore”. Could also be “uh huh” or “you do you”. I also really like “come again?”
Wow, I have read a lot of stupid shit on here over the years, but this OW letter is quite a dandy! YOUR truth, vs HER truth, (does truth really come in flavors?!) she’s so easily forgiven herself, and all that “advise.” What a load of narcissistic crap! This seriously riled me up without even knowing Susan.
Right. The old “I know my own truth by nobody else needs to know” drivel. This is the opposite of an apology if I have ever seen one, and yes, I have.
I love no contact, mainly because I don’t have to swallow all this rank bagged lettuce any more.
CL: genius as always.
Another way to parse this letter is to string together all of the manipulative tactics in it. (See https://abusewarrior.com/toxic-relationships/narcissistic-abuse/harmful-manipulation-tactics/ for some definitions. Plus lots and lots of DARVO.)
Susan, blameshift. Invalidation. False apology.
DARVO. Doublethink. Minimizing.
Covert-Aggression x 3. DARVO/blameshift.
Covert-Aggression x 2. DARVO.
Covert-Aggression x 3.
Shaming. Guilt trip.
DARVO x 6.
Covert-Aggression x 3. Guilt trip.
Covert-Aggression x 2.
Take care, OW
Spot on, LezChump. This is how it’s done ????
If ever a letter left me feeling all slappy this one is it. Susan, I wish I could slap the hypocrisy out of this whore. But it isn’t possible. I’d just hurt my hand. Out her to her precious club, tell everyone, AFTER you are safely divorced. In the meantime send this shit song to your lawyer. Depose her and get her hypocrisy on public record. Get this letter admitted as exhibit A, A for adultery.
You will get the last laugh here. This whore will always be a sanctimonious whore and you will be free.
That you didn’t get in your car and go slap her silly is proof you are the better woman.
Right on all counts. This psycho should be outed and has stupidly provided Susan with all the evidence she needs. They underestimate chumps.
It was my unempathetic, narc MIL who doled out words like this to me, all wrapped up in a religious bow.
In her mind, I don’t have God’s grace or something like that. Otherwise, I’d rise above and FORGIVE. I’m not evolved.
She can pound sand. I went NC with her, too. Bitch!
Gosh, what utter drivel.
I think the same thing when I am at a nice restaurant and there are out of control children behaving horribly and ruining the experience for all within earshot. Hmmm, as bad as this is for me, at least those parents have to take those untrained, uncared for, feral, children home with them. I am free to escape the situation. As is Susan but her used to be so called friend now has to take FW home with her. Karma bebe!
I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that this OW is spreading lies about Susan at the women’s club meetings.
I’d get ahead of that, Susan. Spill the truth.
Already happened but I took care of it. She’s out.
Wow-the support is magnificent. Thank you everyone. I received that text in March and never responded. Full no contact with her. As part of my journey I read through a bunch of stuff a week ago-and came across it again. I wasn’t able to process it at the time because I was in trauma. I knew the Chump Lady could help and boy did she deliver – along with all of your comments! I’m still healing.
The Woman’s Club quietly removed her from the Board and she can’t show her face there-or really in the town at all. However, she recently displayed her true colors because she was on the local Town Council with my husband. He was President. (In fact we were prominent community members often referred to as the President and First Lady). Once the community found out about the affair he was ousted in a very poor fashion. She REMAINS ON THE BOARD. She did not support him, or resign in consort with other board members to protest the action. He was/is “in love” with her. She crawled under a rock and left him hanging.
And now he’s now the victim. He blames me for being ousted from the Town Council “Susan, why did you destroy my life.” He blames me for not having had a couple more months with the OW. (yes people – he said that to me). He blames me for turning our 3 adult children against him.
I look forward to building my new life, but as an eternal optimist who tries to find the best in people, it was earth shattering to be betrayed by two people who supposedly loved you.
Yes Susan, it is DEVASTATING!! But you will heal and someday, you will know, without any doubt in your mind, that he did you the biggest favor (and so did she.) I don’t recommend that you outright tell them how grateful you are (in the distant future), but you will be grateful. Now take your time getting to know you and loving yourself warts and all. Trust us, it hurts now. Worse than having a tooth pulled without Novocaine, but you will be happy again and more content than you’ve been in years. You done good!!!
Hug,
Also got double chumped.
Its traumatic. Im glad that Karma fucked your ex up in the end.
LOL he’s lost his status and she became ostracized from her social groups. Hilarious they couldn’t make it work since they have so much in common now.
That they think they can retain their status shocks me–a demonstration of entitlement and delusion.
When they’re having their trysts and planning their futures together, they must convince each other that the world will embrace their union. Perhaps this is the case for some, but Susan’s ex and that OW were blindsided by consequences. So were my ex and his OW. ???? #myfault
It’s almost comical how stupid they are. A mutual friend told me that my ex thought that he could just substitute the OW for me and nothing in his life would change. Nope! He’s been disgraced. Now he’s left holding the bag, wondering what the hell happened (at least that’s what I imagine. NC and all that prevents me from really knowing, which I know is just as well).
These cheaters can be such clueless idiots.
“”These cheaters can be such clueless idiots.”
Yep, I am absolutely sure that my ex was gob smacked when he got busted, and put back out on patrol. I mean the idiot had to know when the brass found out about his lies and his fucking his employee, it was not going to go well for him.
But, honestly he was such a controller, that I am also sure he convinced him self that he would manipulate the mayor just as he had me for years. Then he and whore would walk in the sunshine and the community would shower their admiration on his new wife.
Yeah, didn’t happen.
Thank you for the update. Love that karma kicked in. Be well.
Susan, from one 40-year veteran to another, I just want to say that I’m so glad to hear that you’re healing, and that the universe is bestowing your FW with all the happiness he deserves. ???? And, “as you finish out your journey,” I sincerely hope that every day is a joy-filled reward!
I’m 3 months post DDay. My stbxh’s OW has clearly been too cowardly to reply to the few times I reached out to her. Instead she got my husband to come after me as I’m told to stop “harassing” his coworker. He has never been able to say her name to me since l discovered he had started cheating, it’s always his “coworker.” Anyone can see that is a mental block. He will deny until his dying day that they were cheating. I guess you move into OW’s house a few weeks later for fun when I didn’t even kick him out.
He on the other hand has gone through a great production of blame shifting and false apologies. A few weeks ago he sent a sad sack email bemoaning money (we haven’t filed yet but have lawyers negotiating.) He tells me he is sorry I feel the way I do and he hopes someday I can move on from this…When I didn’t agree with the new offer he suggested in this sad sack email, it turned back into, “Why are you still so angry and hateful, I expressed my sorryment!” Yes, SORRYMENT, lol?? He’s actually and intelligent guy, but has clearly lost it…
I’d recommend that you don’t reach out at all to the ‘coworker’. You could be charged with harassment. It’s not worth your piece of mind especially as you wouldn’t be able to trust anything she says anyway. I’m glad you’re not backing down.
That is very wise advice Amazon Chump and you are absolutely right, thank you. I only reached out two times. An email and a voicemail in the first few weeks after DDay. Nothing threatening in the slightest, just a broken wife pleading how happy and in love I thought my husband and I had been. I knew her a little as I had done contract work a few times for their employer. Weeks later when my husband told me she will be calling the cops (her father is a cop) if I ever contacted her again, I knew they meant business. But wow, how that hurt to hear my husband defending the OW from his own wife. My own MIL told her son to stop stuff like that, “she wouldn’t hurt a fly.” I hope I can stay close to my MIL after all this…I know Cheaters just don’t want to be reminded of what they’ve done, it ruins their fantasy.
“I knew they meant business. But wow, how that hurt to hear my husband defending the OW from his own wife. ”
I am so sorry. That is so painful. It has been years for me, and I am fine now; but if I think of when he tried to “defend” her, it still gives a twang.
He went on to treat her even worse than he did me, (only because she was there and I wasn’t) but still it hurts because at the time he held her above the woman who adored him, bore and raised his son, and was with him when he was penniless and had helped him climb to the top.
It really doesn’t help much to say, you will get so much better, but I hope you can hang on to that idea. I believe you will, and once you start getting better it will likely happen exponentially.
Susie Lee,
Thank you, it really does help to hear words of wisdom from those who have walked the same paths before us. This is a scenario that no one can truly understand until they themselves have gone through it. I am slowly learning he has changed, not for the better, and that I have to accept the man I loved is gone. It really is mourning a death with the added betrayal factor, almost too much to take.
I agree that you can’t even begin to understand this until you have been through it. Even then it is hard to understand.
Unfortunately by the time many of us find out what is going on the fw has had years of devaluing and replacing us. It is why they can seemingly just up and walk away overnight with no regard for us.
We have to remember when it hits us that this is new to us, they have been working on the discard for some time.
In some cases they have become a different person, in other cases (I suspect in my case) he never was who I thought he was.
It is like climbing Mt. Everest to get to relief.
You want an explanation of the why and how he cheated. You’ll never and I mean never, get the truth from your stbx or his skank co-worker. It’s simple really, two assholes got together and only thought of themselves. Stand your ground on the settlement and go no contact.
Thank you KB22, I really do need someone to beat that into my head. I am major chump, still reaching out to him maybe once a week. He moved on with OW a few days after discovery and hasn’t looked back. I am just not at the point where I can accept he does not care if he never sees or speaks to me again in our lifetime. I would not take him back after the awful things he has done, but to me this just cements that I didn’t mean anything to him, if you can just walk away like that.
KS,
It’s a tough pill to swallow. But it’s true that he doesn’t care. I’m sorry. I struggled with this, too. People who love and care for you don’t do what cheaters do. It’s just so hard to turn that the feeling that he does care. We’ve spent years trusting that person and thinking that he acted in our best interest. But that’s not the reality.
I suggest you write this on a piece of paper and put it on your fridge, mirror, or wherever you’ll see:
DON’T TRUST HIM
DON’T ENGAGE.
HE’S THE ENEMY.
KEEP YOUR EYES ON THE PRIZE (a settlement that you deserve)
GET TO MEH!
Oh, and make a list of the shitty things he’s done and said. Refer to it when you get wobbly. You’re not alone. We’ve all been there. Stay strong.
*It’s just so hard to turn off that feeling that he does care.
Thank you for the pep talk, [email protected]! It’s so hard to wrestle with that cognitive dissonance, especially when I only saw him about 5 times after DDay, so all my memories are mostly the loving caring man I knew him as. I wonder, does anyone else struggle with the list of shitty things their spouse has done? I honest to God have none pre DDay. Yes, now I know he was cheating shortly before DDay (exit affair style I believe.) But other than that, no complaints…I feel this is holding me back. He was a wonderful guy in every way before this and it causes me to still circle back to wondering if I am mostly to blame, somehow driving away this great man I loved.
Sorry for what you’re going through KS. It is hard and we’ve all been through it. It takes a while to see through the fog. I don’t know your spouse of course, but no great guy walks out on his wife and moves out with affair partner out of the blue. It’s just evidence of a really shitty character. Pay attention to what they do, not what they say.
It’ll take a little time, but take good care of yourself and you can get through it. Sorry for your loss.
You may start to remember things he did (red flags) after a bit.
In my case my ex was treating me like shit in the last year, mostly the last few months. Screaming at me constantly over stupid shit. (I ran out of salt as one example there are many examples) The last few weeks, he would visibly recoil if I came too close. He called me clingy and said I was suffocating him.
At his work Christmas party/award ceremony, he sat the whore and her best whore friend at our table. (I was not aware she was his whore, but by then I knew something was up).
When he looked at me his eyes looked like the proverbial shark eyes. His eyes were normally big and blue, but they turned in to dark slits.
Maybe yours didn’t do these things, but as I said as you gain more distance; you might start to remember these things.
I never told anyone in real time what I went through that last year, I should have. And if there are things he did to disrespect you, I would encourage you to find someone you can trust and spill.
I should have told my preacher who was also the police chaplain. He was pissed beyond belief anyway, because my ex had conned him too. But, I held it in for many years. I finally spilled to my brother a year or so ago.
I spilled to my son late last year and early this year, because he started talking to me (his dad was dying) about some stuff and we both just let loose. I had been so busy and living life with my sweet husband that I hadn’t really thought of them only in passing.
Of course I told my husband about it all before we married. I figured he should know he might be getting ahold of a wing nut. But he thought I was worth it, and we have been together now for almost 27 years.
But, my point is; I held in that anger and it burst forward when the fw and whore a couple years ago blew up my sons life. (that is when I found CN) Son is fine now, but his dad caused him a lot of grief.
So find someone and talk and talk, and make sure at least a couple key folks know what shit stuff he has done. Be honest, but be blunt.
You know ladies, I think I might xerox that letter and tuck it under the windshield wipers of every vehicle at the next womens’ club meeting, slip it into the mailboxes of every member of her church, maybe go so far as to nail it to utility poles on the street where she lives. I’d share her “generous forgiveness” with her entire world. Do not go quietly into the night sisters. Rear up and bite those cheaters right in the seat of their frequently dropped pants.
I think that’s a great idea. Everyone in her community should be aware of what a generously forgiving person she is. She could be a model for others. /sarcasm
LOL, love this…in theory. Though I’d stick with CL’s husband’s advice that if it feels too good, you probably shouldn’t do it.
Man, did I ever want to publicly blast my ex, Mr. Perfect, during our divorce! I actually started compiling his worst and meanest texts and emails and drafted an email that I daydreamed about sending to everyone he knows, including his employer, enlightening them about what a “great guy” he was. Alas, and thankfully, I didn’t send it. But, I did use those emails and texts to secure a decent settlement because his fear of them being made public as attachments to my divorce filings was enough of a threat to his image management that he, finally, signed the papers.
Indeed, the letter writer might consider including this letter in one of her divorce filings as evidence of…well, anything really. Just an excuse to threaten to get it on the record and perhaps get her ex to come to a better settlement.
My god, the only blessing in this whole shitfest is finally seeing what a deluded m, sanctimonious pos your former ‘best friend’ is. The level of self deceit is epic. No one can write that with a straight face and not be a narc. So sorry you have to go through this but good on you fir telling. These types get off on the secrecy and the only thing that truly hurts them is any damage their own bad behaviour does their reputation. Take care
Gutter trash, just plain gutter trash. Sing your story loud and clear. Especially to the biggest social gossip in your group. Lol, let her reap what she sowed
Your former “friend” is a malignant narcissist and gaslighter. It’s so convenient when trash takes itself out. So glad that monster is out of your life!
Fucks her friend’s husband and thinks you’re still going to be “friends” with her?! Fucks her friend’s husband, then has the gall to send this sanctimonious blameshifting drivel. Wants you and the group to not feel awkward? But fucks your husband. Yep, I’d be sure to leak this entertaining garbage letter to the women’s club, and keep talking to them about her “one little mistake that *she’s* forgiven”.
She acknowledges her “truth”. There is only “the truth” not “her truth”. Gaslighting throughout. What a horrible human being. So glad she is out of your life.
First of all, ChumpLady is awesome. How is UBT alive after that huge pile of bullshit?
Second, Susan if you give me her address I will go and punch her in the face on your behalf. That letter made me feel enraged. What an absolute piece of crap to write a letter like that. Oh my god how sanctimonious can you be? The only good thing here is that she revealed her true self-someone you never, ever need to be around or hear from again. No contact to both of them. You are the lovely one who can hold her head up high. As someone who had a very embarrassing public break up because my husband was fucking a young woman from our business – I know how it feels when things like this are known by everyone. It’s great gossip fodder. But, whenever I confided to the team at work how humiliating it was they would say, “Why? Both of them are the ones who humiliated themselves. They look like assholes for what they did to you.” They told me to hold my head high and so I do (in public).
Fuck her for treating you like that. Please go no contact and don’t give them any kibbles. They love the triangulation. The OW in my case tried that shit and I was having none of it! In my case, she and my ex were so concerned about me they wanted to send me to an inpatient mental hospital to get the “help” I needed. These people are sick- fuck them and take care of you. Close ranks and get them out. Treat them like toxic waste because they are.
You are mighty!
During a 3 week separation, SCHMOOPIE was Johnny on the spot to facilitate growth, advocate for Susan’s marriage (remember Shania Twain’s bestie doing same?), protect and ENCOURAGE RECONCILIATION! If anyone believes this load of BS, I’ve got some ocean front property in Arizona for sale. Lying, plotting, scheming, whoring bestie needs to read every woman’s handbook that fucking your besties husband does NOT encourage reconciliation. She wanted to drive a nail in the coffin of this marriage and wasted no time in doing so. She is a low as low gets.
Susan, I am so glad you’ve written this whore off. She will be onto someone else’s husband (if she isn’t already) and next time you will the one seeing her written off by another woman. Schmoopie is delusional and you are better off now that the trash took itself out. Hugs.
But she was just trying to *help*!! With her vagina. Full of grace and dignity.
“My actions during this one life event, a mere moment in my 54 years as a human, a friend, a sister, a daughter, a wife, a Mom….don’t define, for me anyway, who I am as a person.” LOL, well, many many others will define you by them, so tough shit. At 54 years of age, it is quite appropriate to define someone by something so terrible. This is not some immature, errant teenager. Sheesh lady.
What’s so hard about writing “I’m so very sorry for the shitty thing I did to you. It’s made me look real hard at why and how I’m clearly a much shittier person than I previously thought. I’m working on that but that’s neither here nor there and is not your problem. I promise that I will never bother you again.”
A subtext I read in that poison letter is “I could have taken your husband if I wanted to, only he wasn’t good enough for me Me ME.”
“ If we were still friends, and I was helping you through this, I would tell you that the ultimate power is to have grace and compassion and forgiveness for our fellow humans. That is the energy that will bring to you the love you are searching for. To treat people with dignity, even though they may have caused you pain, is love in action and the universe will respond in kind.
That is what I would tell you, because I know your soul and I know it rings true there. It’s the best thing you can do for yourself. The clearest path to love. The path you will be most proud to have walked.”
Sounds like somebody took David Brooks editorial to heart.
This pissed me off (for Susan): “the love you have been searching for” — what, now that OBestie helped herself to the love Susan rightfully thought she had, this depraved schemer is going to lecture her on what Susan’s feelings on love are now? After this? Wow she is a next level gas lighter! What’s next? Dating advice?
Particularly odious is the OWhore’s lecturing of her (a thinly veiled threat in my view) regarding treating someone with dignity. I’ll just fuck your husband but hey you need to be dignified Susan!
The blatant hypocrisy and smug self congratulatory tone of this entire bagged word salad is nauseating.
Wow…..the cluster B is strong with this one. “A mere moment” in my life of perfect perfection!!!!!!! You know what a mere moment is? Yes, murderers could say the same. It was all great and I was perfect untilllll……..I pulled that trigger. But hey, I was a great person FOREVES!!!! Shouldn’t that count for something????? No, you just killed someone, but anyways….MOVING ON!!!!! On a side note…..there was not ONE single apologetic statement in that whole message. Typical cluster B, she actually thinks you are at fault. Yes, that’s what you’re dealing with…..do not engage the OP….they feed on it.
Stab you in the back then diss you for not thanking them for it
I really feel for the UBT. I only made it about a fourth of the way through that tripe. These moronic, assinine cheaters TRULY deserve each other.
My feeling is that my ex and his OW harbour the same attitudes as this OW…that theirs is a destined love that began in “unfortunate” circumstances. They are enlightened enough in their understanding of human nature that we all “make mistakes” but can rise above it and learn to be better people for it (of course together, not apart). Moral absolutes about the ethics of what they did is just negative and judgmental, and they seek to be free of such toxicity.
Blah, blah, blah.
Luckily, my ex hasn’t really tried to plug me with this too much. He knows better.
Oh what a sanctemonious, condescending, hypocritical, passive aggressive bitch.
“I am not a bad person, I just *acted* like a bad person!”
“I have forgiven myself, why cant you?!”
“Here, let me tell you how I think you should react to my betrayal. Let me be your spiritual guide through this pain that I myself have inflicted upon you. Maybe one day you can be as precious as me!”
“It is your own fault that nobody loves you. If only you were more dignified! Like me! The epitome of dignity of course being having an affair with your friend’s husband.”
“I forgive you for being cheated upon. I forgive you for my sins. Go in peace my child!”
Spot on!
What did I just read? I had to put on my reading glasses to make sure I just read a buch of verbal diarreah.
OMG this womans lack of self awareness and accountability really wasted a few of my precious brain cells trying to decifer this nonsense.
Calling out this specific type of smoke and mirrors is a public service the world needs more of. The amount of people who get away with straight-up callous and/or abusive nonsense by cloaking it in “forgiveness” and “fellow humans” and “grace and compassion” is absolutely staggering. Like, a mass-scale public mental health crisis in the making IMO. Especially when it gets into “manifestation,” oh boy.
“If you had enough love and grace and universal awareness you wouldn’t have suffered but if you then you’ll manifest a poolboy and a lambo, so get to it bitch!! If you stay in pain and don’t get a lambo it’s YOUR fault for being impure, remember that.”
Good Lord.
Damn, my formatting screwed it up. I put words in little brackets to denote it was some kind of translated thing. After “suffered” I had added “horrible life changing event” and after “but if you” I added “indulge in increasingly dangerous wishful thinking designed to sever you from a meaningful cause-and-effect relationship to natural reality”.
I fell down the manifestation rabbit hole a little bit myself (who doesn’t want a magic lambo?) and I’m increasingly convinced it’s a sneaky mass-scale pool of rhetoric absolutely designed to sift out people who can be convinced to believe irrational nonsense, and then further target them for scams and manipulation. Like:
“Ayo girl I text you at 4:44 PM so you know the universe want you on my dick,” all the way up to pre-prepping people to join cults. It’s pretty alarming imo.