Is Homewrecker Kink a Thing?
Women with a cheating fetish — aka homewrecker kink — is it a real thing? Are some people just turned on by infidelity? And if so, should we accept it as a fetish and not kink shame?
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Dear Chump Lady,
I have recently come across a disturbing trend where some people, mostly young women, who are mistresses, refer to being the Other Woman as a kink and dismiss any criticism of it as “kink shaming.”
Apparently kink shaming is far worse in society than cheating is.
What the actual?! I find this perspective deeply troubling. It’s so disturbing and disrespectful to those who have been harmed by infidelity. As a chump, I’m unsure if my triggers are making this more than it is, but I can’t shake it.
I want to be clear — this isn’t about a cuckold fetish — this is flat out dirty dog cheating as us chumps know it– and that is being labeled as a kink.
So, I’ve tried to put this out of my mind, but I haven’t been able to, so I wanted to reach out to get your (and Chump Nation’s) opinion.
What are your thoughts on labeling cheating as a kink?
How do you challenge those who cry kink shaming when you point out that people are harmed by infidelity?
Cheating as a kink first came to my attention before Christmas when I was out at a work function and I eavesdropped on (sorry, not my proudest moment, but it was a very long, very boring function) a conversation between two women. One woman, S, openly discussed her ongoing affair with a married man. Another woman, E, disapproved and stated that infidelity is not something to be glorified or celebrated.
S, in response, accused E of kink shaming her as a homewrecker.
She claimed that she should not be judged for her choices as she was not the married one.
The argument quickly escalated. S insisted that her affair was simply an empowering sexual preference and not something to be criticized.
I was stunned. So, I removed myself from that dumpster fire and moved and Googled if cheating is considered a kink. To my surprise there were articles. Not many, but enough to make me mad, labeling cheating as an acceptable kink. There were also links to socials like TikTok and reddit where other women openly talk about their cheating kink.
Anyway, I found this to be deeply hurtful and shocking. Have you heard this rubbish before? I can’t even with this.
You’ve heard it all when it comes to infidelity. What does Chump Nation think? Personally, I’m pissed that making Schmoopies feel bad would be considered kink shaming. Somehow that’s a bigger social crime than the cheating.
Warm regards,
Eavesdropping B
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Dear Eavesdropping B,
I think dressing up shit sandwiches as sophistication is as old as misogyny itself.
This I’m An Enlightened Sidedish! schtick is unique to straight women embroiled in the pick me dance over a straight man.
As I’ve said before, Other Women suck the dick of the patriarchy. There’s nothing empowering or feminist about being a mistress. It’s completely retrograde. Throw it on the slag heap along with sister wives and Stand By Your Man.
Beyond acting like a cheater is a prize to be fought over (a delusion that afflicts many chumps in the early days after discovery), Schmoopies choose side dish status. They accept the wandering dick power structure as willing conspirators in the abuse of another woman. And their own cuckolded partners (if they have them). They are Team Vichy.
Calling a penchant for mate poaching (which is a hallmark of dark triad personality disorders, according to research) a kink is just a subterfuge. It’s disguising the unethical behavior at the heart of cheating — a lack of consent.
People get fuzzy on judging sex, because of a long, cruel history of marginalizing people over the sorts of sex they have. LBGTQ+ people, women in their entirety(hysteria, hello? Our current present political moment in the U.S. on women’s bodily autonomy?) So there is a natural reticence to judge anyone about what they do in bed, how they do it, and with whom.
Enter common sense.
Being slow to judgement, however, does not mean an abdication of morals altogether. Adding -kink to the end of something doesn’t absolve it from ethical inspection.
Necrophilia is a kink. So is screwing goats, or minor children. We recognize those things as wrong. We make hard moral judgements about those acts. Because corpses, goats, and minor children cannot consent.
And neither do chumps.
Just because something turns someone on, doesn’t trump basic ethics.
You still have an obligation to do no harm. That is, if you’re a decent person, and not a fuckwit.
But this raises an interesting question — why do some people put such a huge emphasis on sexual entitlement over the rights of others? Or, as I call it, The Almighty Right to Jizz. Why do we punish women for getting pregnant, for example, but not men for irresponsible ejaculation?
Or, coming back to homewrecker kink — why do we accept a Schmoopie’s claim to self-actualization by cheating with a married man OVER the well-being of that man’s chumped wife? Does Schmoopie’s kink outweigh the STD she just gave her rival? Or the diverted monies spent to conduct the affair? Or any other tangible harm to the unknowing chump?
And it’s not just willful obliviousness — getting over on the wife is part of thrill.
According to this Vice article “The Women With a Cheating Fetish” by Abby Moss from 2019:
But for some women, the taboo of somebody else’s partner cheating is a turn on. These women get off on being a so-called temptress, luring men away from their partners. Through hook-up apps and websites, they meet men in serious relationships and invite them to meet for dates and sex, asking them to deceive their partners and keep the rendezvous secret. The fetish is known as homewrecker kink – and, according to those I spoke to, seems to mainly apply to straight women looking for heterosexual men in monogamous relationships.
Who judges their worth by being a salt-lick to randos? Excuse me, an alluring temptress. Someone who’s bought into sexist bullshit, that’s who. Beginning with the insulting notion that men will just give leave of their senses for a wily seductress. They can’t help themselves! Tradwife better lock her man down! Back off Jolene!
The theft is the turn-on.
Writes Moss:
I first discovered homewrecker kink when a woman propositioned my partner of seven years through Feeld. She explained to him in a direct message exactly what she was looking for: she wanted guys in committed relationships who would meet her at a hotel for sex. It was vital that their partners didn’t know about the rendezvous, she explained. She also wanted to make videos to send to her husband, who enjoys being a voyeur of her kink.
This sounds like an excellent way to be robbed by the Russian mafia. Uh huh. Sure, she’s just a sexy stranger who wants free no-strings-attached sex. Come hither into this hotel room… for blackmail videos we won’t tell anyone! Sshhh!
I wonder how many idiots fall for this scam?
Melissa has met several women who are into homewrecker kink and, though it’s not something she’d do herself, she understands the motivation. “It’s taboo, it’s forbidden, and so the appeal isn’t so much from the cheating itself, it’s the thrill of possibly getting caught. It’s like a form of rebellion.”
Please spare me your relationship anarchy. Other Women aren’t rebels, they are CONFORMISTS. Validate me, Married Man! Tell me I’m the most SPECIAL of them all! Pick MEeee!
You know who doesn’t need a big scary parent to catch them in the act? Or a triangle to have an orgasm? GROWN UPS. People secure in their attachments and their worth. A bad case of oppositional defiant disorder isn’t a turn on.
Unless you’re a freak. And not the sexy kind.
Ah yes very progressive. Here in Tasmania, Australia a couple were recently charged with committing a sex act on a live trout. The mind boggles.
Oh Lord save us! Just when you think you’ve heard it all! I hope they get shamed big time! Poor fish!
I’m progressive. I don’t like the term hijacked by fuckwits.
Same here. A friend of mine and I have been talking a lot, though, about how progressivism seems to be increasingly used as an excuse for immature and selfish behavior. As you said, “don’t judge meeeee” being used as an excuse to totally ignore social responsibility. I think it’s a trend that would be interesting to examine more broadly!
Since when did engaging in sociopathic behaviour and facilitating the abuse of the Chump by the Cheater become a kink? The only conclusion that I can draw is that there are some really f*cked up people out there.
LFTT
Imagine if we tried applying this ludicrous bullshit to literally anything else…
“But I love robbing banks!”
“But I get off on pyromania and arson! Don’t kink shame!”
I think cheaters and poachers are equally fucked up but I came to understand something about the added social prohibitions against mate poachers. It’s funny but what sort of put the lie to the idea that condemnation of mate poachers is rooted in misogyny was the extra wave of nausea I experienced when I realized I was married to a combo cheater/mate poacher. He even met the husband and kids of the first soggy office Jesus cheater he targeted.
That just seemed all the more shocking and nauseating for some reason, especially when this turned out to be a pattern. FW apparently batted out with the first and second Jesus cheater and scored with the third who, though she quickly broke up with her pothead church surfer fiance (whom she expressed tingly excitement over cheating on), at least had a trad dad FW could imagine would be “enraged” that his pushing-thirty daughter was a side piece! After D-day, FW even went into a head-clutching operatic rant about how trad dad came from a military background and would track FW down and kill him!
I admit I enjoyed pointing out that Schmoopie’s dad was a chubby leprechaun with tiny hands, no military service record and no criminal history beyond an old DUI, FW actually seemed deflated. Oh, he wasn’t stealing something that was in demand?? Nope, and even the ex-fiance had replaced Schmoops within a week according to social media profile. More disappointment that the ex-fiance wasn’t actually clinging to the AP’s window ledge vowing revenge. It wounded FW even more to learn Schmoops had previously banged another married office douche who’d quit to escape her. I pretended I learned all this from office whistleblowers but it was actually part of the PIs background check to see if the AP or anyone associated with her were dangerous.
Both FW and the AP obviously got their rocks off at the idea of betrayal collateral, violating consent and “winning” a one-sided death match even if they had to invent imaginary opponents and victims. From this I’m guessing the extra dash of public disgust at poachers is this perception of pervertedly rivalrous glee with a dash of kleptomania which, in effect, seems to be mostly the case.
My FW husband hooked up with a full time mate poacher, too. He told me she even told him what she was about, that she had other married men that would give her money and take her to lunch, buy her stuff. Etc. She not only got off on taking money she wasn’t entitled to, she also got off on ruining lives. Abhorrent behavior!
Back to my FW giving her money. He claims he only gave her $60 dollar cash ( he had a part time job that got him cash tips, that he didn’t bring home for 5 months, so I’m positive it was way more than $60 bucks.) But he also got a credit card behind my back (dumbass seemed to have been so enamored that he forgot I pay the bills and I would eventually notice “what is this payment to an America Express card I didn’t know we had?”. and She within 1 day, had it maxed out (small credit limit of only 1k, but still, quick work!). He claimed that since she had this card over his head then, that he still HAD to keep talking to her or she would blackmail him.
All of this behavior from him and her, is outright ABUSE. Emotional, financial, sexual (but he was still having sex with me and not telling me he was cheating, gross), and in my case, physical because he strangled me when I picked up his phone and saw all the texts that outed his little “affair fun”.
So no, they don’t get to say “don’t judge me or call me that stuff”, like the pot calling the kettle black or the boy who cried wolf. Doesn’t work that way when you are the ACTUAL abuser! Or 1/2 the abuse team!
Mine was also a poacher. He tried everything he could to get OW to leave her husband. He met and hung out with her kids as well, though he was careful to avoid the husband, who he feared. I suppose he was thinking he was going to be step-daddy someday, which IMO, could have had worse consequences than breaking up two families. You see, OW had two adolescent girls. For all I know that was a big part of his attraction to OW. I have no evidence he’s ever gone after underage girls, but he’s a pervert of diverse, abuseosexual interests, so he’s probably into that too. Thankfully, worrying about his creepiness is not my problem anymore.
Mine was a mate poacher, too. Never really thought of that as being part of the OW’s appeal, but there it is. I’m sure he got off on having sex with another man’s wife.
Just adds to my disgust.
Shudder. Not your circus, not your infectious, fly-ridden piles elephant shit.
Omg, yes, so good that he and that sort of creepiness is no longer your problem!
Since selfish idiots decided to co-opt terms they know nothing about.
They like the term “kink shame” but seem to have left out the rule of “safe, sane, CONSENSUAL.”
My understanding is that the rule of any kink is that it needs to be safe, it needs to be sane and reasonable, and everyone needs to be consenting. Cheating inherently cannot be a kink and disapproval of it cannot be kink shaming because it’s missing the element of full consent by everyone.
KtB,
I suspect that Cheaters are trying to co-opt the term because they don’t like being criticised for their choices or because they are trying to legitimise their dirty little habit.
But perhaps I would say that, wouldn’t I?
LFTT
Chump or not, you are spot on! They like to do their dirty deeds in secret for a reason, and then don’t judge or criticize me. Sheesh. Arrested development!! These people couldn’t be any more immature and awful.
When a term starts to be misappropriated to justify the unjustifiable, that’s when you know it has really achieved wide acceptance.
It shows up very frequently in pop psychology: “boundaries”, “abuse”, “triggers” and “shaming” are thrown around in contexts far from where they started.
Since I’m a scientist, I particularly notice that a- or antiscientific practices (auras, crystals etc.) use the language of science (fields, energies etc.) to justify themselves.
Since I’m from a liberal area, XW accuses me of taking away her “right to choose” when I say no to her requests for a favor. (In fact, when she has conflicts I always offer to look after the kids so she *can* choose between work and family, but since I decline to let her have both – obliging to her actually choose one or the other – she pulls out the most charged terminology adjacent to the issue at hand and tells me I am taking away her right to choose)
I don’t know if term hijacking to make an ugly practice seem morally acceptable means the behavior has reached wide acceptance but it certainly means it’s practitioners are heavily campaigning for wide acceptance. Kind of like the Man/Boy Love Association.
I would say that, too!
LOL, the idea that calling it a kink resolves you of blame is HILARIOUS and shows that they don’t know much about kink. Kink requires CONSENT. That’s why some kinks are harmless (because all parties are consenting) and others (like CL said, bestiality, pedophilia, etc) are NOT.
I had a friend who was dating a man who kept cheating on her. After one discovery she said well why don’t we just be in an open relationship? He rejected that idea. He didn’t want her consent to sleep around, he didn’t want to have open conversations and boundaries about their lives. He wanted to cheat. Maybe it’s a “kink.” Who cares? It’s about entitlement and sneaking and LACK of consent. She said hit the road.
Kink requires consent from all parties, even the ones not involved in the act but affected by it. This is why exhibitionists, for example, should properly be having sex in front of other people at a sex club, not on a public street. Even the people watching can consent. And kinks which preclude consent are not okay.
You’d think that only involving consenting participants in your scene would be common sense!
This is just one of the many reasons that I never want to date ever again. What the actual fuck?
I hear you on the dating thing, the thought terrifies me! If your own mate can be so terrible…
What part of Safe, Sane and Consensual is so hard for these knuckleheads to understand???
The part that requires them to be a decent human being.
The test for the “homewrecker’s” comfort is the same as the FW’s: Is the behavior a secret or not? Is the drunken boast/confession or the intercepted email something they would share with their partner? With their employer? With their mother?
I think it is a variation of promiscuity fueled by poor sense of self. But it is not a victimless behavior and should be called out.
Everything cheaters do boils down to bullshit.
haha exactly
My kink is kink-shaming, specifically kink that violates the innocent or harms small nocturnal mammals. My porn is post-prosecution perp walk videos.
Seconded.
I guess my kink is monogamy, I enjoy one-on-one relationships and getting to know a person.
My kink is mutual respect.
To paraphrase Queen Gertrude, Hamlet’s cheater mother, ‘the ladies doth protest too much, methinks.’
You know what MY kink is? Telling the chump. This reminds me of how FWs suddenly pretend they are poly and want an open marriage to their monogamous partner who had no say in it. Your not poly, that requires consent and boundaries. You’re a FW using words to disguise your character or in this case an AP using “kink” to disguise their horrible ethics.
Ah yes, “a form of rebellion.” Just a stone’s throw from “defiant acts of exuberance.”
Ah, yes, I remember hearing similar excuses from ex/FW at some point (I know it was after I moved in). Although he told me he liked being in all sides of the situation (which was bullshit, considering how jealous he got). I immediately told him I do not consent, which he seemingly accepted.
People in my private circle mockingly and insultingly call him a “cuck” from time to time. As in the cuckolding kink, not as an attack on his masculinity.
So here is a weird one for my friends here at CN…
My sister, who has always had mental health issues, started searching for a guy she hadn’t seen in over 40 years after her last loser of a boyfriend (who cheated on her and gave her an STD) and after finding him and more importantly finding out that he was married, started having an affair with him. His wife, she found out, was sick and dying, but that took 3 years. (more back story, my sister has had a history of trying to look up old boyfriends, something that I have always seen as stalking, basically)
In the mean time, I found out that my FW was cheating about a year after she started her disgusting behavior. So listening to her talk about this guy and the crap she was doing with him (although I never approved, but hey, she is an adult with her own choices, bad as they may be) was very triggering to me, so I told her I didn’t want to hear about her visits with him, his name…just nothing. I was setting a boundary. And she fired back, “I have a boundary too, and that is not to be judged about what we are doing.” So this his very akin to what this “kink shaming” is, I think.
To round out just how horrible of a person she is and how sick, she went to the funeral of the wife she helped abused and wait for it…took pictures! She took pictures of this poor woman she helped abuse in her casket! Like the penultimate, “I won the pick me dance, I wont the turd prize!” Judging by the pictures of him and his wife next to her casket, of their wedding and even their vow renewals where they were first married, I would say none of her family knew about the cheating.
What do you guys think? Disgusting behavior that needs to be judged? I think so. And I haven’t talked to my sister in many months until recently, when our crappy father almost died and needed to be put into a home. But guess what, she instantly crossed my boundary of not talking about her POS partner, who btw, had not proposed marriage or come running to live with her, etc. HAHA! My sister is terminally ill (just like his late wife) and I am sure only with her to get at her home and money, etc.
This is the crazy world I have had to live in the last few years, surrounded by FW’s and their abhorrent infidelity behavior!
I’ve said it before…these cheating FW’s that harm chumps need to be held accountable by law, with jail time and huge fines, then it wouldn’t be so much fun, would it?!!!
I don’t think it’s legislatable to criminalize cheating directly but it could be made far more uncomfortable. For instance, the coercive control behaviors that cheaters typically use to facilitate cheating is being criminalized in some places. Personally I’d like to see embezzling marital assets treated like a crime and wouldn’t mind it if side pieces and even sex workers were held liable for receiving stolen property if they take cash or amenities off married FWs without spousal consent.
I’ve written this before but I know it’s not unique to me – if FW and I had owned a business together and he broke our business contract by embezzling hundreds of thousands of dollars and spending it on s#x workers, I could sue him. He could be convicted of a crime and serve time.
But because the contract between us was marital when he stole hundreds of thousands of dollars and spent it on hookups, s#x workers, and a sugar baby for 4 years, I can only lobby for half of it back — and then only if I can account for every cent spent. And, naturally, most of us can’t do that because FWs were living a secret basement life and smart enough to set up secret accounts and credit cards.
Yes, agreed that something should be done, even if it is just the financial. Starting somewhere is a good start. But do look up the laws I mentioned in a few of our states about suing for the loss of happiness or alienation of affection, or something like that. Can’t remember what the term exactly was. You would think it would give these people pause, consider what it might cost them, at least financially, but without laws, it won’t.
And she fired back, “I have a boundary too, and that is not to be judged about what we are doing.”
A boundary is something you set for yourself. It’s not about controlling other people. Your sister can set a boundary that she doesn’t want to listen to anything about her and her POS boyfriend, but she doesn’t get to set a boundary of “you are not allowed to judge me”. The inside of your head is not within her boundary!
But besides that…. you want the law to hold her accountable, but what are you doing to hold them accountable?
“A boundary is something you set for yourself. It’s not about controlling other people. Your sister can set a boundary that she doesn’t want to listen to anything about her and her POS boyfriend, but she doesn’t get to set a boundary of “you are not allowed to judge me”. The inside of your head is not within her boundary!”
Exactly!
But there are social norms and laws, etc., that we have that allows us to have peace and harmony (generally speaking) to live with one another. It is people like FW’s that interrupt this, or people like BTK killer, or Bernie Madoff, that go outside the social norms and feel entitled to harm others for their gain. These are the people there need to be laws for and that actual police and judges, need to deal with. People that have affairs do real HARM, but people just choose to look the other way on these behaviors. Something needs to change on that. I am not sure what or how that can happen, but being held accountable in some way needs to start happening. We have I think 6 states in the Unites States, that allows you to sue your cheater and affair partner for “loss of joy or happiness” or something like that. I wonder how the affair and divorce rates are there? I feel all 50 states (seeing as how we are called “united” should have that law. Maybe it would curb some of this abusive behavior? Maybe not. Who know? But it is abuse that causes real and lasting damage to the chumps, and we as a decent group of people need to stop looking the other way
It isn’t my job to police their behavior, good or bad, each person is responsible for their own behavior, however, by way of my boundaries of saying I didn’t want to hear of their disgusting affair, and that after she kept stepping over that boundary, I sent a very clear message that I wasn’t having it, by going no contact. And I even had the decency to call her and tell her why I was going no contact, I didn’t just ignore her or ghost her.
Any other questions, Aipdae Chump? Happy to answer…
Oh FFS. If she didn’t like being judged, all she had to do is STFU about it, but of course she didn’t. She just had to brag.
So you are inheriting from your sister?
No, she wants to leave her house to her affair partner. Which is fine by me. I don’t need or want anything from her. Well, decent treatment would be nice, but I gave up on that a long time ago. I am comfortable with my new found boundaries and even having to enforce them. She has given me control of the relationship in a round about way, with me using and enforcing boundaries! Freedom!
Oh, and when I say I have “had” to live in the last few years…
I will be putting the boundary back up here soon, as Dad is just now placed and we are almost done dealing with that, and if she doesn’t abide, then back to no contact.
For my FW, I am almost in the financial position to leave, just need to make sure I am stable with my new job and money saved, etc., as I have a disabled adult son and daughter that need to be taken care of be me now on just my income, so I am doing this very strategically on purpose.
It is a choice to stay at the moment, but one I was forced into by my cheating FW and his homewrecker affair partner!
” “I have a boundary too, and that is not to be judged about what we are doing.” ”
That is a boundary setting that is not hers to set. Others judge us on their own values, we just do, as others judge us. She can be upset that she is judged, she can walk away from folks she perceives as judging her; but she can not set another persons standards for only hers. And in my judgement she has weak standards for herself.
I love the way you word this. We make judgements every day. Whether or not what we eat is good for us. Whether or not we want to buy something – is it worth the money? Whether or not a song is worth listening to, clothing is worth wearing, a hobby is worth the time investment. Whether or not a person is good for us, or worth our time or energy. And others do the same. They may reach different conclusions. I don’t understand the obsession with LV (or Gucci, or Channel) branded things, but others think they’re worth the price.
But it is well in our right to make judgements.
Even in the bible there is a clear distinction between judgement and discernment. Discernment is basically judging folks on whether they are good for us and others or not. If we did not make reasonable judgments (discernment) every day, none of us would live long.
You’re really being put through the mill, but it sounds like you’re a very strong person, and you will come out on top. Your kids are blessed to have a strong sane parent in their mother!
Sending ye all the very best from Ireland!
Thank you shadow. Trying to be mighty in terrible circumstances!
I’ve not been interested in more-than-two-people stuff, but I’m totally for other people liking other things. My internal rules for “you do you” vs “nope” have always been these:
This totally breaks rule 2. And with STIs, could break 3.
Well I’ll “kink-shame” them into next week, because as far as I’m concerned, they bloody well SHOULD be ashamed of themselves, because what they do IS shameful! Shame, shame , shame on them!
If a thing is not shameful, you can’t be shamed for it! Sometimes I get slagged off for being a Catholic, called all sorts of idiot and even vile things, but I have never called it “shaming” because I can’t be shamed for it, because it’s just not shameful! End of!
Mate poaching is malevolent, wicked and evil, just like cheating is, because it does harm and TBH, it’s dirty- physically, emotionally and spiritually! They really do need to be shamed, and shamed over and over again, until the shame becomes unbearable and they stop! As Dr. George Simon has found out in his practise, this is often the only thing that brings about even the desire to become less of a monster in character disordered people!
Well, guess I’m still on a very steep learning curve from my baseline of “conventionalism”.
Seems like these homewrecker women are claiming kink, but in reality they are attempting a “power-over” control situation, that they claim is empowering. This is the same “power-over” control mindset that the married men cheaters have when they seek to get power over their spouse by cheating. Pathetic that the homewrecker tries to claim empowerment but she (in this case) is simply attempting the same bid for power and control as the cheating husband. It’s all the opposite of love, it is selfishness and powerplays and hate towards others. Both the married cheater and the homewrecker AP want power and social-psychological domination over others. They want to hurt others. Kink as excuse: complete nonsense. They use sex as a weapon of war.
I just think it’s knee-slappingly hilarious that they’re calling themselves homewreckers and preventing the term from being retired as most poachers and apologists would prefer.
All about perceived power, no self esteem and deep down thinking that sloppy seconds is all they’re worth.
Shells of humans.
I don’t think it’s “they’re claiming kink, but it’s actually about power”. It’s more “they’re claiming kink, and it’s about the power”. That is, the power aspect isn’t some hidden aspect or unforeseen side effect: it’s a key feature.
Welcome to these enlightened times where you can justify any behaviour if you want to badly enough.
People hide behind kink all the time to make excuses for behaving like the lowest of the low- because no behaviour is inherently wrong – that’s like, just your opinion, man!
Either that or it’s the old ‘it’s not their fault, they have * insert convenient mental health label here* or their childhood was less than a Brady Bunch style deal.
This ‘kink’ is just another showcase of how desperately people try to defend the indefensible and have no respect for themselves or anyone else.
“Just because something turns someone on, doesn’t trump basic ethics.
You still have an obligation to do no harm.”
This should be emblazoned on tee shirts.
Kind of fits with “your rights end where mine begin.”
The most active of the affair partners left when I did because it wasn’t fun for her if she wasn’t destroying lives. She has done the same to cheater ex’s previous partners before me. And she has had next to no interest in cheater ex over the decades otherwise unless there is someone who she can destroy. And of course cheater ex got off on it all too. It is definitely a fetish. For predators.
Calling pathological destructive behavior a “kink” is as insane as they are. It is just a rebrand of the same old tired thing. Esther Perel tries it, but when comes down to it whatever you call it a turd is a turd.
It’s pure DARVO.
I doubt this is gender specific. It seems some cheating men and probably women get a thrill out of sex in the marital bed.
I think APs especially. I never knew whether or not any errant affair bonking took place in my home. I just tossed the mattress and bedding on D-day and figured I’d get the truth when the AP was subpoenaed as my lawyer planned (a prospect he was practically rubbing his hands together over). Eventually FW spilled so much dirt that I had more proof than I needed and then didn’t care enough to make it worth the expense of nailing down that marital bed detail. And the more I knew, the more the thought of ever crossing paths with the AP gave me the creeps (is it possible to catch psychic syphilis?) But I did dig up a series of emails in which the AP was lobbying to get into our house on any pretext. Oh, she’d clean it while I was out of town! She wanted to see where he lived! Oh c’mon, lemme come over!
I would guess the compulsion to encroach has something to do with peeing all around a rival’s domain to mark territory, maybe pilfer a bit of jewelry and also getting the FW to commit such an intense act of desecration against their family that there’s really no going back from it. Behaviorism 101: one can only passionately hate another person after doing something really terrible to the latter.
Yep, like pissing on a fire hydrant or leaving their spoor to mark their conquered territory. Leaving that behind a cutting contact is like a breathe of fresh air.
This is one that I hadn’t heard of before. This “thing” is a mess though.
I think I’ll just enjoy my life with adult kids, my friends, work, and dog. Having a peaceful, low-drama life is my “thing.”
Sounds like more “normalizing terrible behaviors” to me. The keys remain “do no harm” and “consent”. Of course, people lacking empathy tend to fall short in those domains, so here we are. When it’s two(or more, who am I to judge) consenting adults it’s a kink. When consent stops and harm begins, it’s abuse, pure and simple.
CL said it best: “the theft is the turn on”. You can’t rebrand ‘theft’ just because you like to do it. Still affects the victim/s of the theft.
Seems the side pieces have now all got the memo they are regarded largely if not entirely as the lowlifes they are so now they PR this into “empowerment” and spin snaring married peeps as their preferred kink. No, you do not get the moral high ground. No hall pass.
These people are just like any other abuser who gets off off someone / something else’s harm. It’s not empowerment if it is ‘power over’. That is the literal key term for abuse dynamics.
There is seemingly literally no end to the oily justifications of the morally bankrupt.
I didn’t even read the whole blog before thinking “but, CONSENT!” Luckily CL and CN have that thoroughly covered.
So instead I’ll consider how blatantly hypocritical this is. They can hurt whoever they want, with potentially actual physical harm? But we can’t hurt their feelings, with disapproving words? What the what??
Maybe MY kink is shaming Schmoopies and pick-me girls (or boys, who knows). And apparently according to them, I don’t need their consent to do it! Who cares who it hurts, it makes me happy!
Right? Your last para reminds me of when we as chumps are admonished to treat the whore with respect, as they made no vows to us. So because they never made any vows to respect us, they can do/say whatever they want against us; but whoa not the chump we must respect the whore.
Yeah, no.
Here is my take on this…from what I have learned, and I do not think he was unique or special in any way, my FW would attempt to to bait women (maybe men, too, not sure) on a regular basis. Most didn’t take the bait, walked away, laughed him off or ignored him. I recall seeing that in real time. Those who did were “high mileage” women, a number with criminal histories, who had a regular practice of having encounters/transactions with married men. Typically, but not always, their time had a price tag to it. “If you want my time, you have to do X, pay Y, take me to Z.”
As a therapist pointed out to me, women who do these things with married men are by definition women unable to attract the attention of high value/intelligent/attractive/sucessful/single men. They are low value (not inherently, of course, but due to their history of a destructive lifestyle, sex with many partners, unhealthy habits, drug/alcohol abuse, criminal behavior, and a host of other poor choices) are receptive and accustomed to engaging in sordid behaviors with all sorts of people. Smart, successful, confident and attractive women have no need and no time for this. I never saw it as some sort of kink or fetish. That makes no sense to me at all.
I agree, it makes no sense that a woman who places value on herself by making good decisions would need to resort to this behavior. I suppose a handful who are deeply troubled, but not in general.
For what it’s worth, from an inebriated clubhouse post game conversation with two odious, men in their upper middle age, who belong to the same golf club as myself, and with whom, recently I had the displeasure of being paired for a foursome, I realized there most assuredly is an equally repulsive male counterpart to the female AP who gloats over screwing your husband. The gist of the conversation was the proposition that all men cheat or wish they had the opportunity to do so, and secondly that the real pleasure derives from fucking another man’s wife when the betrayed husband is a friend, work colleague.or subordinate..I shot them down on both counts.. to which they began to regale my golf buddy and myself with.lurid and pornographic details of recent conquests which included one of the abusive pair related in disgusting detail.how he detected an emotional vulnerability in the wife of a long time friend and proceeded to create an environment in which she felt.appreciated, listened to and validated after sharing what should have been details of their private life together..
It sounded to me like a very abusive and reprehensible act of sexual predation and power assertion over another masquerading as some kind of sexual sport, but a kink? Hardly IMHO…..Rather a dangerous game whose objective is to humiliated as much as dominate.
I know from my own experience that when my wife’s AP visited our house, although I had at the time no clear indication that he was both my wife’s AP and the father of the child she successfully passed off as having come from my loins, I now feel a rage fifty years on, A burning desire to hurt the arrogant Patrician POS, stymied as I am, by the fact that the bastard had the gall to die of an aggressive prostate cancer at the early age of 67 . I can’t even piss on his grave, as his wife had him cremated by the Neptune Society with his ashes dispersed on the foamy brine.
I don’t know about other countries but unfortunately the US is a HIGHLY competitive society, a trait I have always detested, and I think that’s reflected in our sexual practices – whether it’s the female trash CL is talking about here, or the piggish men that poster Waitedfartoolong cites in his great post here. These people view sex, and probably all human interactions, as transactional and they want to get….the biggest bang for the buck. There’s a great triangle they live by, of money, power and sex and all three things support each other. Whenever I hear about empowerment through sex it enrages me because SEX SHOULD NOT BE ABOUT POWER. That is abuse of sex. Sex should be about love, caring, making children – fun – but not about power. That is viscerally disgusting and the abuse of another person. These young women are not only abusing sex, but they have turned themselves into whores who probably will never be able to have relationships of depth or longevity. The competition with other women is absolutely vile and degrading. And this is true of men like WFTL writes of as well. Sex should NEVER be about competition or power or money – that dehumanizes something that should be closer to a spiritual experience. It makes me sad to see how far our society has sunk and what will it take to elevate us?
I love your comment and agree 100%.
Start with definitions.
“Kink”: sharp twist or curve in something that is otherwise straight.
“Fetish”: a form of sexual desire in which gratification is strongly linked to a particular object or activity or a part of the body other than the sexual organs.
“Dark Triad”: refers to a trio of negative personality traits – narcissism, Machiavellianism and psychopathy.
Being a homewrecker is not a simple kink in an otherwise straight and normal line. Being a homewrecker isn’t a fetish unless the homewrecker is actually sexually attracted to a man’s wedding ring and what it means.
Being a homewrecker by choice is Dark Triad through and through. It takes the sort of dedication and manipulation that goes beyond anything merely sexual. Any sexual rush they get out of it has more in common with the psycho-sexual rush of a serial killer.
For every homewrecker out there gushing on reddit about how her relationship with a married man is better than sex than any other kind, there is a serial killer nodding and saying, “Yeah! I know, right? Whenever I cut someone’s throat I have sex with the body and it’s mind-blowing!”
And both the Homewrecker and Serial Killer have one more thing in common: hurting and destroying innocent victims is required.
You nailed it, Hunny Badger. A lot of people mentioned the lack of consent and they are correct. But for all the reasons you state, it simply is NOT a kink.
I sometimes did wonder if the AP in my situation was JUST into the idea of ruining a marriage. According to FW, they were on and off again, and frequently they were “off” because she didn’t want to be “that kind of person”. The kind that is involved with a married man. (The fact that they were on and off for SIX years tells me it couldn’t have been THAT hard on her conscience)
It was such a bizarre situation. Long distance, opposite sides of country, met online. According to him, he never slept with her. I’m SURE that is a lie, but to be fair, it couldn’t have been many times as he was not away much. (He did travel for work, legit work trips, where he could have flown her in and seen her, but again, those were 3 times a year at most) They thought they were soul mates. But at one point she had moved in with a guy and kept it secret from him until she had to come clean. I don’t really judge her for finding a 2nd,single, bf. After all, her soulmate was married with a kid on the other side of the country. When my FW found out she had a new live in bf, they broke up for awhile. But they did get back together. I just never understood what the draw was for HER. She was a decade younger than him, conventionally pretty and obviously could find herself a single guy willing to commit and move in. My FW is attractive and can be charming, especially if you lived far away and never had to deal with his moods. But still, it’s not like he is George Clooney.
Sometimes I wonder if she was just messing with him for fun.
Men do this too. My ex-wife’s affair partner, who was married with three children, only dated women that were also married or in long term committed relationships. He felt that this strategy reduced the risk that they would out him to his wife when things inevitably went bad. He could back out if they got demanding of a real relationship and know they had a plan B for support. A Plan B they would not want to put at risk by exposing him.