Other Man Wants Monogamous Relationship with Married Woman

other man married woman

He’s the Other Man, having an affair with a married woman and hopes it will be more. But she won’t leave her husband. And he wants sympathy from Chump Lady….

***

Dear Chump Lady,

I reconnected with a high school classmate on Facebook.

Only one conversation was flirty and invested (it was 2 hours long). Other than that, it was short messages to each other. When it was her birthday, I would send a message like, “Happy Birthday to my wife in my next lifetime” – because, she was married. This is kind of my personality as a single, never married, 46 year old. It’s meaningless banter, not to be taken seriously, but I was attracted to her.

So we meet when she’s in my town. She lives 3 hours away from me. In my mind and heart, it was to reconnect as FB friends/old classmates and nothing more. But when we met, there was a ton of chemistry.

I still saw her as single in my mind, but I knew she was married.  

Now, I made my mistake right here. I do have values (I’ve never before been with a married woman, despite opportunities).

She told me that her marriage has had problems for years. That she and her husband were separated, living in separate bedrooms, no intimate contact.

She expressed her feelings and a very deep, emotional, relationship began (long distance).  She has two teenage kids.  We talked and texted every day, all day.

For me, I was in love with her and if you read the 20,000 texts and chats, you would feel that she is too. I’m lost in love, best way to describe it.

Last spring it turned sexual. (In her parents’ house with parents sleeping upstairs above her. She snuck me in.)

Once sex was involved, I wanted to define the relationship.  

I was clear that I was in love and wanted a loving, exclusive, monogamous relationship. And, according to her words, she did too.

I have issues equating sex with love. I told her about this and she said all the right things, about how I could trust her.

So, again I wanted clarity from her — and she said that she cannot just pick up and leave a marriage of 21 years, that it’s going to take time. She wants me to understand that she’s “doing all she can” to give the appearance of saving her marriage so she doesn’t look like the bad guy to her children. So, I “understand” as a sign of support.

More months go by and it’s the same story — it takes time to leave, etc.

Finally, I confront her (I think she’s still sleeping with her husband) and yeah, she confesses she’s been with him the entire time! She tells me she’s never been separated, but she wants a relationship with me.

Now for the bad part…  Her husband finds out because he discovered a love letter. She tells me, okay, NOW they’re really separated. I caught her in more lies, but (mistake) I was still hooking up with her.

Then, I don’t know if I did the right thing, but I wrote a letter to the husband.

I felt betrayed and lied to.

I still believed in her “love” and that she was stuck. So, I wanted it all out on the table. She had told me that he knew everything about our relationship after he found the letter.

Well, what I received was the most painful, hateful letter from her that she does not love me, will never love me, can’t believe that she thought she did, does not have one ounce of respect or love for me, will never forgive me, don’t ever contact her again, I destroyed her family because she “fell into” a life of self-destruction and evil.

Oh, and when I sent the letter — the husband called the police on me for stalking.

Our relationship went from 100,000 I love you’s, wedding and family planning, to nothing. It’s been no contact for 19 days. I go from missing her, to feeling deceived and wanting revenge.

I’m working through your articles, I know I’m not blameless. The love train I was on made everything real and valid, I just don’t know what she felt. She made me feel like I was the love of her life because she told me I was.

I’ve heard nothing from her.

Some of my friends are telling me not to be a victim and send ALL of the texts, FB chats, the one semi-nude photo she sent, her cards, two pairs of her underwear to the husband. Then others say, walk away. And others say it’s my fault because I knew she wasn’t divorced.

My heart is still holding onto the dream and my head says: It’s a lie, stop it, she lies and cheats.”

Thanks for taking the time to read and respond. I’m scared of you now. Haha. But, I hope you can help me figure out what to do.

Signed,

The Other Man

****

Dear Other Man,

Okay, your first clue that you weren’t going to get the committed, exclusive relationship you wanted was because she’s a married woman and you’re the Other Man.

You wrote: “The love train I was on made everything real and valid.”

Ye-ah. No it didn’t.

You need some serious help about what actual love looks like. Healthy love. Because this ain’t it. Not from her and not from you.

Look, you aren’t alone. Many folks need life kicks in the teeth to learn this, but real love isn’t based on lies and illicit hook ups. It’s not about deceiving other people to get our rocks off. (I’m talking to you, Mr. I Knew She Had a Husband). It’s not about fantasy, long-distance, high school romance.

What should you do?

Leave them alone.

The kindest thing you can do to that chump husband is GO AWAY. Do NOT send him the technicolor, multimedia presentation of what a skanky whore his wife is. He knows she cheated. If he wants further details, he knows where to reach you — and be grateful he’s contacting you via the police instead of going all vigilante.

It’s no surprise she threw you under the bus. It’s straight out of the cheater play book. If THAT wasn’t a clear sign that she’s a cake eating, craven, asshole for you, I don’t know what else will convince you.

Eat the shit sandwich you were dealt. You ordered it. There it is on the plate. Don’t complain.

You are not the victim.

You were a willing participant in an affair. Seriously, every time you want to indulge in self pity about screwing a married woman and mother of two (I don’t care what she promised or said to you), every time you feel bad for YOU? Hit yourself with a hammer. Hard. You don’t feel one iota of the pain that husband does, who gave 20+ years and two kids to that wretched woman.

You believed her cliche bullshit that they lived separate, and didn’t have sex? That he Didn’t Understand Her? Whatever crap reason she gave to betray him and their kids?

She’s a liar. You need a victim in this story? He is it. Not you. Those kids are it. Not you. Sorry.

At the moment you realized she lied, you should’ve dumped her instead of insisting upon continuing your Valid Love.

This wasn’t love. You were in fantasy land.

People who love you don’t sneak you into their parents’ house to screw you. You know what kind of guy that makes you? The kind of guy you don’t take home to Mother. Did you smoke dope behind the bleachers afterward? Sane, middle-aged people don’t behave this way. You’re 46, not 16.

Get yourself into some serious therapy. You are attracted to unavailable people. You’ve never married and yet some fantasy, disaster hook-up sounded like a good idea to you. This is a sign you need BIG, PROFESSIONAL HELP. I’m not being snarky or flippant. You don’t know what intimacy should look and feel like. When you get right in the head, sparkly, deceitful cheaters will hold no appeal to you. The whole fact that you wandered down this rabbit hole as far as you did, tells me you’ve got some serious problems. Work on it.

But you need to totally detach from this woman. No contact. Ever.

Oh, and your friends? The ones who said this is your fault for screwing a married woman? Hold them close. These are real friends with real values. The others who want to wage some Jihad on the husband and send him the sexts? Dump those sociopathic motherfuckers.

Don’t waste another moment mourning Miss Cake. She dumped you. That’s how deep her love was.

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Jenn Pitts
Jenn Pitts
11 years ago

I really hope this guy does get therapy. It can be life changing and maybe he is in the valley just before he gets to see the good stuff that is ahead. The only way is up!

Arnold
Arnold
11 years ago

Unfortunately, someone as moronic as this guy, by age 46, is way too stupid to derive any benefit from therapy. What a simpering, pathetic guy.
I think he should get his testosterone level checked, STAT.

Karen
Karen
10 years ago

Best. Response. Ever.

2xchump
2xchump
2 months ago
Reply to  Karen

My xh cheater got his testosterone level checked. It was super high. The Brain dead doctor told my then husband that he should get samples of my cheaters blood and give it to all the low level guys! Adding to my XHC entitlement. He used his high levels to tell me why he could NOT HELP HIMSELF jumping on any woman who would lay still..not a solution..I’m just saying

CharacterMatters
CharacterMatters
9 years ago

Affair partners hand out just as many invitations to their pity party as cheaters do, so I’m glad you didn’t accept the invitation. At no point did this man consider the feelings of the husband he was helping to betray. It was all about me, me, me and my feelings, and my betrayal. Hopefully he takes your advice about therapy rather than simply find someone else to join his pity party.

Bill
Bill
9 years ago

I have been there. Had an affair with a married woman, who i loved. She said she loved me not her husband, yet failed to leave him and used her child as an excuse for having me as a bit on the side and staying married.
I ended it 7 months ago after 2 years and 5 months. The pain, hate and betrayal have poisioned my heart and soul. Thanks to her i will never get married, have children and spend the rest of my life alone.
Thanks to another person, my life is over.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

I know this is from long ago but those were Bill’s choices. Your choice, Bill, to FAFO with a married woman, you know what you were getting, and your choice never to find a real spouse because….you really DON’T want the commitment and this was your excuse. GROW UP.

OHFFS
OHFFS
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

100%. This whiny guy just went and did it again with some other married woman if anyone would have him, guaranteed.

Adelante
Adelante
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

Apparently you haven’t noticed that this site is for Chumps, not willing accomplices. Read CL’s response again, because YOU are not the victim here. And if you “will never get married, have children, and [will] spent the rest of [your] life alone,” if your “life is over,” that’s on you. It’s called “just desserts.”

GrandmaChump
GrandmaChump
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

Bill, you’re just another bitter bit on the side who got his just desserts, and I hope you’ve realized that by now. Instead of self-pity, better to wise up, man up, and resolve to make better decisions in the future. A life is a terrible thing to waste.

LovelySpider
LovelySpider
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

Nah, that’s on you getting involved with a married person, Bill. Did you ever get therapy?

Luziana
Luziana
9 years ago
Reply to  Bill

Wait-What? Thanks to another person? Nope, nope, nope, YOU chose to get involved, you chose to participate in adultery. Take responsibility, hitch up your Big Boy Britches and get on with life, And never make someone a priority who makes you a flavor of the week. If all the chumps here can rebuild from something they didn’t destroy, certainly you can pick up all the pieces and fill up your own Lego Bucket.

Lisa
Lisa
8 years ago

So many men date married women because it’s glorified in society. Men are allowed to date whomever they want, which includes married, engaged, or committed women whose husbands, boyfriends, or grown sons will beat them up or kill them, while women can’t do the same since men are still the superior gender.

Mobster
Mobster
8 years ago
Reply to  Lisa

That is a completely moronic statement on so many levels.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

People don’t change. For a guy like OM…..it’s still always Somebody Else’s Fault.

hush
hush
2 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

I also see a sad sausage cheater OM named Bill tried throwing himself a pity party in your comments downthread from 9 years ago. 😂

Chumpcat
Chumpcat
2 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Still relevant as ever, highlighting the power of massive self delusion that cheaters and their APs possess.

MehnopolizeLife
MehnopolizeLife
2 months ago

I’m just going to come out and say what needs to be said.

This guy was trolling Facebook looking for female high school acquaintances (from 30 years ago!). We’re not talking a first love, not ‘the one that got away’, or even his frickin prom date. This sounds creepy as fuck from the get go.

But, but, but…he wuvs her and she “said” she wasn’t happy in her marriage. As Dr. Phil once said to an AP who believed the husband she was screwing would eventually leave his wife…”You couldn’t get more stupid if I cut your head off.”

I’ll place my 2×4 down for now and leave a few words of wisdom. You’re 46 years old. Grow up and stop having sex in the grandparents house of your nasty floozies innocent children. Do you get off on soiling Charlie Brown or Strawberry Shortcake twin sheets.

No pity…you just nasty.

Stalking is illegal. Go far far away.

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago

Well, it truly is possible that if you wish, hope, and wait long enough, the husband will eventually leave his wife and marry the AP, except in my case I had to divorce the dick. He would have been content to stay married and keep his skank hanging to eternity.

cheaterssuck
cheaterssuck
2 months ago

It’s worse actually. He’s 57 now. This post originated 11 years ago.

kim2003
kim2003
2 months ago

I’ve had a few nasty guys troll me like that on FB. It’s a lazy person’s way of looking for easy hookups.

Said guys are all blocked.

Mr Wonderfuls Ex
Mr Wonderfuls Ex
2 months ago

He absolutely was trolling FB, going back to the well of names from high school, looking for an easy lay. This is EXACTLY what klootzak does. Schmoopie my PI caught him with? She went to college with him. The one he was going to leave me for several years before? A married AP he went to high school with. It’s so obvious and gross.

His “wife in (his) next lifetime?” WHO SAYS THAT? A creep. That’s who.

FuckWitFree
FuckWitFree
2 months ago

Yep, asshat did same with his rotating list of HS, college, and work female acquaintances. Constantly trolling and stalking once iPhones got into his life. Some of them started contacting ME saying, “what the hell?” They are disordered, mentally unstable, dangerous. He’s 60 and still doing it! Creepy old man syndrome.

FYI_
FYI_
2 months ago

“I still saw her as single in my mind, but I knew she was married.”
Well, if you abracadabra’d her into being single, in your mind, then of course it’s okay. WTF?

Adelante
Adelante
2 months ago
Reply to  FYI_

Yes. If he could abracadabra her into being single then he can abracadabra her out of being single and back into being married.

Orlando
Orlando
2 months ago

Other Man thought it a good idea to write to Chump Lady to gain sympathy for cuckolding another man? Bahaha. He clearly isn’t too wise for his 46 years. I’ve had old boyfriends try to connect with me on Facebook (upon hearing about my divorce). One even asked me to move back to my hometown “so we could continue our young romance”. Seriously?! I’ll just give up my career, my income, my friends, being with my kids for a pimply teenage guy from 25 some years ago?! Yeah no. The delusion is high with some people.

Stepbystep
Stepbystep
2 months ago

EVERY affair contains pieces of this same thinking.

This is worth re-posting if only to remind us they suck.

GrandmaChump
GrandmaChump
2 months ago

I’d add to the advice to not send a letter, much less that “multimedia presentation,” to say he should delete every tawdry bit of it. Affair partners tend to keep little ego-stroking mementos of their sexploits (I’ll bet he still has all her letters and her 2 pairs of panties.) after all these years.)

He probably still rereads the eternal love parts of their communications. Probably has continued to “flirt with” unavailable women. Probably sees all relationships with women as meaningless flirting that sometimes gets out of hand, rationalizing that he doesn’t dare/is unable to give his heart because it was eternally given/broken by the affair partner “twu love.”

Cheaters don’t change, and this guy cheated on himself by betraying his own (stated) values.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

What is with this old folks and their high school hook ups? It seems to be epidemic.

Aint That A Shame
Aint That A Shame
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

Probably a combination of laziness, cheapness and low hanging fruit.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

The very last thing I want to see is anyone I went to school with. That would be like another circle of hell. Life got so much better once I became an adult and independent.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I have kept in touch with a couple. One of them I knew in HS but we didn’t really become good friends until after HS and we were neighbors.

I was pretty shy, and she thought I was stuck up in HS, as I only went there my last two years, she didn’t know anything about me. I was painfully shy.

I did have a couple sweet boy friends, but I never looked them up.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

Going back and reliving their past which for some people unfortunately the best part of their lives seems to be the HS/College years before they started working and having responsibilities like family, etc. That’s their Eden. They’re looking for Adam or Eve, LOL.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I think you may have nailed it. I do think my ex wanted so bad to be who he was pretending to be, and he pulled off the appearance of propriety for a good run. At least long enough to get what he wanted out of it.

Conchobara
Conchobara
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

My STBX FW (49) HATED high school and college — he was pimply and gangly and never dated anyone (I was his first girlfriend when we met and we were 27 (me) and 28). He had (has) no friends and women never gave him a second look. I put so much work into helping him, from getting decent haircuts and glasses to dressing like an adult.

I think in his f’ed up, delusional mind he was getting a do-over on those years through his cheating. He exclusively pays for/dates/f*cks girls in their early 20s (I use the word girls intentionally as they don’t even have full frontal lobe development). The child mistress (the AP he still sees but who I am sure is not the ONLY f-buddy) was 18 when he found her on a site for married men to buy their sluts sugar babies. He was proud to tell me this. As though he got her or any woman through his own specialness. HAHAHAHAHA! He paid every one of them that I’ve found. There may have been rando hookups too but IDGAF at this point.

Bluewren
Bluewren
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

They think people have remained the same – or hope they have and think they themselves haven’t changed either.
It’s not a realistic foundation for anything, really.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

I don’t know. Almost makes me glad I did an online high-school back in the day and even then, was honestly a NEET (I wasn’t very good at motivating myself – I ended up having to complete four years of school in a year and a half to graduate) even then. Sure, I missed out on having any high-school friends, but from what my significant other tells me, that’s actually kind of a blessing. I had my first friend group in my 20’s, and I’m honestly really okay with that. Skipped out on all this drama.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago

If you’re an introvert (I’m one myself) High School IS the 8th Circle of Hell. I went to college as an adult later on. I would never want to see any of those people again outside of circus performances. I remember HS as being locked in the cafeteria being forced to cheer for some terrible football team I didn’t give a shit about. The girls were snotty and the boys were muscleheads. Like you, my friend groups started in my 20s and it’s so much better to be able to have a range of choices. But for some people, this is the apex of their lives, which is sad.

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

In high school, I was literally from the other side of the tracks. I was not welcome in the cliques, and I felt excluded and unwanted. So many growing-up experiences made me susceptible to jerks taking advantage of me because I was desperate to be included. But I have gone back to HS reunions and have found that some of those classmates were just as awkward as I was and turned out to be good, decent, honest people. Many did not grow up and are still trying to recapture their youth. That’s sad but don’t throw the baby outwith the bath wate. r

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I found my very short stint in community college to be much better than I expected. I had to deal with some BS, but that was limited to one awful class. When I feel I can handle it better, I’d lke to give it another shot and maybe get some sort of certification or degree!

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago

Go back! It took me 16.5 years to graduate from college. I was 34 with 3 children. It was such an accomplishment because it proved to me that I could do something that even I had doubts I could do. It is never too late if that’s what you want to do. It may be too late to become a gymnast or an astronaut, but it’s not too late to prove yourself as a person that’s worthy of love, even if it’s selflove.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  Amazon Chump

Ha! Luckily, there’s no age limit on my interests. Although, I would say that college isn’t necessary to be worthy of love! But that’s so awesome, that you went back and finished your degree. And while you had kids, too? Super mighty!

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
2 months ago

I didn’t date in high school either-not for a lack of trying(there wasn’t such thing as online school back then or I would have gladly done that.) I get wistful at times but I think that’s strictly regressive-sounds like it was a shit show to date in high school. (I enjoy your use of “NEET”, btw).

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

I mostly had a few weird online romance “relationships,” but from what I experienced, dating in high-school is shallow at best and toxic at worst. You didn’t miss much.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
2 months ago

(had a couple of internet sweethearts myself-fun for what they were.) Like I said-wistful but I realize the size of that particular bullet that I dodged. Felt a little under prepared when I started dating though. No idea how I’m going to start dating again when the time comes, but hey.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

I like NEET too. CDC, are you an anime fan?

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Big ol’ anime fan, although I haven’t kept up with any recent releases – and I was a NEET, proper. Had a lot of mental health issues that I wasn’t handling well at the time (being, well, a teenager), and it made me a wreck who wouldn’t do anything but hide away on my laptop. It’s taken a long time to work on undoing the effects of that, but one of the bonuses was not dealing with high-school drama at the time. I doubt I would have coped well with it.

Some adults, though, never seem to get past the high-school drama…

Last edited 2 months ago by Chump-Domain Cleric
JeffWashington
JeffWashington
2 months ago

We need to start Chump Anime Club.

I agree that some adults never really get past high school emotionally. Some just peak early.

Circling back to anime, I heard something interesting…I think it was from a vlogger about the “make a memory in high school” theme that shows up a lot. Culturally, it seems most of us westerners(or at least the weebs among us) can’t wait to get out of high school and start life. The hypothesis was that in Japan(hence the theme) that is the last chance some of them have to have a lot of fun and make friends and things.

Would be curious to see their perspective on the whole “cheating” thing, netorare not withstanding.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

Oh, I’ve heard of that attitude. Supposedly, for those in Japan, they really feel like the high-school were the best years of their life. It has to deal with the particular stressors from their culture as adults. And think about how much time they spend at their schools – sometimes having dinners at school!

I don’t know if that would effect their views on cheating. While I’ve mentioned I give a lot more leeway to those without fully developed frontal lobes, I would imagine much of their idolization of their high-school years mainly acknowledges the good parts, or is about overcoming the bad. Not about how much more immature everyone is. But I don’t know much about the greater Japanese culture’s views on cheating, so I have no clue. It is an interesting point. I also doubt NTR is any more of a reflection of cultural attitude than siscon is. Doesn’t mean we can’t be a bit weirded out by it, but we have our own versions of the same fetishes here.

Last edited 2 months ago by Chump-Domain Cleric
susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Oh when FB came into being, I eventually got an account (after I retired) and looked up some folks I knew in HS, but I never even thought of contacting them. I still do talk to a couple HS friends, but only the ones I kept in contact with through the years.

It is just this big romantic connection with someone from HS is weird to me. It appears to be happy hunting grounds for cheaters though.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

Oh, I don’t mind that people are still in contact with their high-school friends. But wanting to “rekindle” anything romantic is what’s strange to me. High-school seems to be full of drama, I wouldn’t want to “rekindle” that sort of romance.

…well, that WOULD explain why cheaters seem to be attracted to it.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Yep that is what I meant, not the catching up with old friends, but the destroying their lives for a romp deal, just weird.

2xchump
2xchump
2 months ago

Tract! If you had a PHD it would ruin you! Your snark and smack on the head with a hammer is exactly what this coward needed . Sadly maturity is about 16 so there is years and years of taking out the trash needed. But as a Chump I NEED TO KNOW how cheaters work the back room. Play as long as they can,use you and then throw you under the bus Bam!! The Chump husband will join the.RIC ask for closure, beg like I did, not understanding the intent behind the deception.ive been cheated on x2 and each husband wore an adult mask buy they were stuck on 16 and entitlement. It’s a crying shame I wasted so much of my adult life with covert teenagers. I’ll be in therapy the rest of my life. Thank YOU CL and CN for uncovering the creeps that roam, sneak, lie, steal and damage families. You are 🐍

2xchump
2xchump
2 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

That’s Tracy not tract!! My apologies to a great woman who has BS glasses on and sniffs out the lies.

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
2 months ago

“It turned sexual.” You gotta love the passive voice! It was no one’s fault, really – IT just happened. “There we were, unclothed in bed, unbeknownst to either of us, with the Fates goading us into sex. Our ‘relationship’ is its own character in the story, with volition and intentionality, doing things behind our backs without us even knowing it. What a scamp!”

None of these people – NONE – will say something like “then we decided to have sex.” There were thousands and thousand of text messages, nude photos, and underwear, but SOMEHOW they found themselves having sex. IT just sorta … happened.

Last edited 2 months ago by ChumpDchump
Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

You forgot about how Cupid shoots his potion coated arrows into their hearts and this FORCES them to have sex without any understanding or memory of how it happened. It’s magick!

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Cognitive dissonance is an amazing thing. The lengths our brains go to protect us from facts about our actions that do violence to our innate sense of being a “good person.” Therefore, “I made this choice” turns into a story about unstoppable outside forces, like fate, or Cupid, or DESTINY! After all, if I made a choice to do a bad thing, that must make me a … bad person?! NO!

This does two things: 1) it removes their culpability from the act (because you are powerless against destiny), and 2) it validates the result (our love was meant to be – it would be wrong to stay with a person who was not ordained by DESTINY).

My theory is that 10% of cheaters are total sociopaths, and 90% are idiots who are criminally unaccountable.

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

I still have some cognitive dissonance in the sense that, even though it has been 9 years since my divorce, and I know intellectually that I was not the cause of his cheating, my ingrained insecurities from youth still surface and make me doubt myself. I still have a difficult time looking at myself in the mirror believing that my inner beauty is good enough. The inner beauty does not get the guy. I’m quite plump, getting old, and I’m wrinkly. So it’s not just cheaters that deal with cognitive dissonance, it’s chumps who still have self doubts. I’m still working on it.

Chumpcat
Chumpcat
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

They do that with everything regarding their cheating. The unfaithful are never responsible for anything. I didn’t mean for it to happen, it was your fault etc.

Bluewren
Bluewren
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

It’s so very easy to trip and fall onto someone’s penis or into someone’s vagina though…. There’s absolutely no intent there at all…🙄

ApidaeChump
ApidaeChump
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Exactly. That passivity is everywhere in the letter. The “conversation” was flirty, not the LW flirted.

I keep going back to this Captain Awkward response to a cheater where she calmly dismantles all of the denial and passive language he uses to distance himself from his choices and actions. She talks about the common thread in all the “I cheated, what do” letters she gets:

That common thread is describing your life with an incredible passivity, like you were a bystander or a passenger during everything that happened, and not as someone who made a series of choices, including the choice to lie to somebody about what are actually giant, important things.

Chumpcat
Chumpcat
2 months ago
Reply to  ApidaeChump

That is succinct and awesome.

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
2 months ago
Reply to  ApidaeChump

Awesome. Captain Awkward is a great site.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Right? Any human with average intelligence knows that the way to get closer to someone is to spend time with them. Except for those high on drugs/alcohol instant sex rarely happens, it is a process. Even those using prostitutes have a process and decisions to make and how to pay for it etc.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Lol, love your narrative and the idea that a “relationship” is a third party with its own volition. Yes, they were transvected by magical forces out of their skivvies!

Those are some magical forces, huh? And with such a finely calibrated magical remote control console that never, in the course of puppeteering the cheaty emo-puppets, drops one on their heads or squashes bodies together in the wrong position like a toe up the ass or a knee in the eye socket.

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
2 months ago

Haha, ew. I’m picturing The Fly: “I accidentally walked into the transporter while a fly was in there and look what happened!”

LookingForwardsToTuesday
LookingForwardsToTuesday
2 months ago

This man is a bunny boiler; if he can’t have his married AP to himself, then he wants to burn everything down.

LFTT

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
2 months ago

That’s how I feel. He doesn’t want to tell the truth because it’s the right thing to do – he wants to go scorched Earth.

Chumpasaurus45
Chumpasaurus45
2 months ago

The “ other man” writer here needs to write 100 times on the blackboard, “ married women are not dating material!!”
And then at 46, move the hell on from high school dude and try to develop some moral integrity, if that is even an option for you.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago
Reply to  Chumpasaurus45

Seriously, I think some folks just don’t get past the age of 17.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Cheaters are cheaters and this guy is as much a cheater as the married woman. Biblically and morally.

The only pass I give the ow/om is if they didn’t know and then when they did know, dropped the married person. That rarely happens with todays media options.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

There are a lot of people who would say no to conspiring in betrayal. I know it doesn’t seem that way because FW’s don’t tend brag about all the people they tried hitting on who got grossed out upon learning the FW was hitched. Narcs generally don’t brag about failure. But I just told a story earlier about meeting dudes from the poly community and my impression is that it takes all kinds. In one case, the guy was total faux-poly and didn’t care that I didn’t have an open marriage, therefore he was a full-out poacher and also a cheater who lived with a woman who had no clue what her partner was doing. Ew, barf. In another case, the poly dude was very apologetic for presuming I was in a poly arrangement and said he’d never chump some innocent guy.

Chumpasaurus45
Chumpasaurus45
2 months ago

“Narcs generally don’t brag about failure.”
Yeah, I think that is mostly really true, but it did bring to the surface of my memory another “ tell” incident with my own FW.

During one of the three times I had hacked his Fort Knox level security on his phone, I came across multiple ppl he was messages at the same time.
One was a married colleague that I had met on a few work functions and she was just lovely.
His text to her that I read that day was complimenting her for how exceptionally beautiful her hair looked that day and did she want to go out to lunch with him.
Of course, he was trolling the bays, but she picked up on it and actually read him the riot act. Of how he was a married man and he should be deeply ashamed of himself for acting in such a way. His behavior deeply disappointed her, she imagined him being a good family man with high integrity. “ Shame on you!” is what he told me she said to him.

For him to actually tell me that, I know on some level in his mostly consciousless brain folds, he felt embarrassed by that and genuinely shamed.
Sandra was my super hero that day!
She was a secretary at the Fortune 500 company they worked at together and he the President/ CEO at that time. That took great character to call out a slime bucket like that!! Way to go Sandra!👏

I’m just shocked at how few ppl actually do turn them down, but some absolutely do. And the fact that the FW recalled it to me, was very surprising.
I know it had an impact on him, but not enough to leave the dark side of the street behind, he remained a diseased rat in the final sorting out.

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Oh I know a lot of folks turn them down. I did. But rejection rarely stops a cheater in their quest.

Bluewren
Bluewren
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

Yes… plenty do know- they just hope they’ll get away with it.

oldDogNewTricks
oldDogNewTricks
2 months ago

Ew. and also: ha ha! Gross. This guy wants honesty from a married woman who sneaks him in to her parents’ house for clandestine sex? Hollywood could not make this up. LW is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. CL, you were very kind to him.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago

They’re both too cheap for a motel.

BackToReality
BackToReality
2 months ago

I must admit that I still occasionally find myself thinking about my replacement and wondering what type of person can behave like he did.

He’s 25 years younger than me and has hitched himself to my now ex-wife, who is 17 years older than him. He’s very good-looking, Italian and, quite frankly, could easily find himself someone more in his age group.

I just wonder what sort of person would knowingly have sex with an older woman with children who has been married for 18 years.

I guess it’s a person who is very much cut from the same cloth as the man in this post.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

You can read the studies on mate poachers and “dark triad” traits, especially psychopathy. But regardless of whether the poacher in your situation is a man-ho looking for a free ride or some weirdo with mommy issues, the fact that your ex would do what she did and this OM willingly and knowingly conspired with it defines them as scary trash.

Interestingly, in some spooky convergence of events, I was hit on by some strapping Italian artist who was 15 years younger than me and who obviously knew I was married at the time with three kids because he taught my kids. The spooky bit was that this happened literally at the very moment that, unbeknownst to me, FW in my situation had begun trawling a series of drunken married office doorknobs trying to find someone– anyone– to have an affair with him.

So maybe my experience might provide a few useful insights, My reaction to being hit up was to laugh nervously and tell the Italian guy “no dice.” In my late thirties, it hadn’t even occurred to me that maybe I shouldn’t have joked around with, talked to or “given the wrong signals” to a twenty three year old teacher because there were no signals. I don’t shit where I eat for one and it was simply beyond my comprehension that someone that age would even think of someone my age “that way,” Furthermore, I thought the latter looked like an unformed widget. Even if I’d been single I don’t do “age gap,” am not attracted to laugh-line-less men who don’t have the same life experience. Plus just the idea of how embarrassing it would be for a near middle aged mom with a c-section scar to be cavorting with a boytoy. Shriek, ick. What would my kids feel or think?? The horror. Then, above all, the fact that I was married made it totally out of the question anyway. Plus the irony of the types of people who hit on monogamous married people is that poachers are disgusting and untouchable.

Being the perfect chump, I told FW about how I’d resolved the situation. Hypocrite that he was, he advised me to be less friendly, maybe stop wearing jewelry or makeup if I didn’t want the attention. I thought he was mad at me for even bringing it up. But because I was clueless about FW’s cheating, I honestly wasn’t trying to stick it in his face that “other men want me!” I just would have felt bad and dishonest if I hadn’t mentioned it. On discovering later that FW had been cheating since the day I was hit on, I could imagine some betrayed partners might have kicked themselves for not “going for it.” But instead I’m glad it happened if only because it so clearly differentiated my character from FWs as well as his creepy, shady AP. My not cheating had nothing to do with lack of opportunity. I’m really and truly just nothing like those freaks and that was a consolation.

As far as the Italian boytoy himself, he also wasn’t quite the same as FW’s shady AP. On learning that my marriage was not open, he exploded in mea culpas and said he shouldn’t have assumed that everyone in the art world was polyamorous and he would never, ever conspire to betray another man and hated people who used poly as an excuse to do that. That took some of the tension out of the situation which was fortunate because he taught at my kids’ conservatory and I couldn’t fully avoid him. Had he been the type to knowingly poach and conspire against a chump (regardless of whether that chump in question turned out to be a cheater), I would have deemed him too dangerous to be around children and might have pulled my kids from the conservatory. But that wasn’t quite the case so we remained cautiously “friendly” at least. I also later saw what the deal was with this guy regarding his thing for older women. He wasn’t so much a hustling man-ho, just a guy with mommy issues. He ended up living with a single mom 14 or 15 years older than him and apparently is working very hard to help support her son. He might have issues but doesn’t appear to be a mega creep or “dark triad.”

Anyway, one of the morals of the story is obviously that not all middle aged married mums are like your ex and not just for lack of so-called “temptation.” It’s all on her. And I think it’s clear that the OM in your circumstances– regardless of whether his thing is “mommy replacement” or he’s just a user and gigolo– is a psycho with subzero integrity. That’s not an “immaturity” thing he might “grow out of” since I dealt with a cruising dude of equivalent age and background who, at 23, knew better than to fuck over unwitting chumps. That’s a character thing, the key to which was the fact that your FW’s AP would willingly conspire against you, ergo your ex is probably going to get reamed. In the meantime, stand back from the eventual blast, avert your eyes and shield yourself and your children from flying body parts.

BackToReality
BackToReality
2 months ago

Wow. Thanks for the very long and well thought our response. I’m very grateful.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

He’s probably cheating on her, btw. And if he hasn’t yet…….he will.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

Two words beginning with “M”…..Mommy and Money.

hush
hush
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

French PM Emmanuel Macron, 46, and his wife, Brigitte, 70 are also these type of Europeans.

FYI_
FYI_
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

I wish CL would do a post on something I have seen repeated so. many. times. —
“Well, AP didn’t make any vows, so AP did nothing wrong.”

It’s such a bizarre defense of those who knowingly have sex with married people. I hear even bystanders say this about an affair. The AP is not to be held accountable in any way, because the AP broke no vows. It’s mind-bending and so wrong to hear otherwise normal people say this.

Conchobara
Conchobara
2 months ago
Reply to  FYI_

This is a HUGE pet peeve of mine, too. Did she know he was married? Did she know he had a child/children? Then she is just as culpable. It’s not that hard to understand. If you conspired to cheat on someone, you are responsible. I don’t care if you were the f’er or the f’ee.

Chumpasaurus45
Chumpasaurus45
2 months ago
Reply to  Conchobara

I did reply to you, but in the wrong spot. Just wanted to say it’s a huge pet peeve of mine too.
They are just as culpable as the cheater, whether they are married or not themselves. They conspired to abuse another person.
If you are driving the getaway car, you are guilty of robbing the bank.

Last edited 2 months ago by Chumpasaurus45
Aint That A Shame
Aint That A Shame
2 months ago
Reply to  FYI_

It’s deflective spin. Someone doesn’t need to take vows to realize that abusing people is wrong and the “they didn’t owe you anything” folks usually aren’t so nonchalant when their lives and boundaries are transgressed.

SortofOverIt
SortofOverIt
2 months ago
Reply to  FYI_

Don’t even get me started. I see it online all the time.

I will acknowledge that there is some nuance here.

Historically, this has been very gendered, side piece chicks getting with married men USED to get what seemed like ALL the blame. She’d be seen as a seductress homewrecker that stole him. (If a married woman cheated with a man, the woman, again got a disproportionate amount of blame)

I think these days, the actual cheaters are getting more blame regardless of gender. But there is a large, vocal group of people that seem to entirely dismiss APs from all wrong doing. And I don’t mean in cases where the AP didn’t know. In cases where the AP knew, and completely signed on to sneak around with the FW, a lot of people simply shrug and say “the AP didn’t take vows with you and doesn’t owe you anything, it is all on the FW.”

They aren’t wrong, Schmoopie from the office that you never even met doesn’t “owe” you anything. But I think they still wronged you in a big, big way. And at the very least, what they did is gross. My kids lives are changed, permanently, and she helped make that happen. Sure, if not her, he would have found someone else. But that doesn’t absolve her.

In my case, I try not to focus on the AP. Not because I think she is somehow innocent. But I have a big enough shit sandwich on my plate without adding a side of shit fries. My FW has presented enough challenges for me to deal with daily. I don’t also have to focus on some stranger who is obviously a garbage person. But when Ido think of her, I definitely feel entitled to dislike her.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
2 months ago
Reply to  FYI_

There’s a weird corollary that pops up in “should I tell the spouse?” discussions, you often hear “Don’t tell. It’s not your marriage, so not your responsibility”. Which I happen to disagree with, but if it wasn’t your responsibility to not sleep with the spouse, then it’s also not your responsibility to preserve that marriage by not telling. Tell if you want to tell, or don’t; blow up the marriage or don’t: we just agreed that you’re not responsible for that marriage, so you can do whatever you feel like. How does the admonition “you shouldn’t tell” follow from “it’s not your responsibility”?

Chumpcat
Chumpcat
2 months ago
Reply to  BackToReality

Some people are just human shaped piles of crap. I have learned to accept they exist, and recognize thier smell when I am around them. That asshat is an example.

Bluewren
Bluewren
2 months ago

Same old story
They always believe their …er…’ love ‘ is different and special- not like those other cheaters out there- this is fate and destiny and they will live happily ever after in their fantasy Disney castle.
Until they get righteously smacked with the reality stick.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
2 months ago

I really hoped this guy stayed away and re-evaluated his life decisions and found real happiness.

I read this and I seethe. Is this what Schmoopies go through? They sign on for a more transparent lie?

No sympathy here. None.

That being said, if Schmoopie ever sent me ANY kind of letter, let alone the PowerPoint and tangible evidence…yeah. It would be bad. Very bad. Like Netflix Docuseries bad.

Like, I’m well aware that my FW was responsible for what happened. She made a decision(an abusive, destructive, destroying decision.) Schmoopie was well aware that I existed and who I was and proceeded anyway(and apparently “didn’t want to come between us.”-insert excessively violent imagery here involving the word ‘between’ here.)

I understand the impulse toward revenge…all too well. If it feels good…don’t do it! No contact is the way. We can’t cheapen ourselves by going down to their petty bullshit level. The universe has a way of sorting itself out.

We need more case studies like this(am genuinely surprised that there are not more, though I would suspect that there are more than a few lurking around)-if nothing else to illustrate what can and does go wrong when you fuck around(as you are very likely to “find out.”) I very much doubt the potential FWs of the world see “picking up a charge” on the list of consequences. Let alone blunt force trauma.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

I hope he did send the letters. Not only for revenge, which I generally support as long as it’s not physical, protracted or illegal, but because she probably is every bit as good a liar to husband as she was to OM. It’s better that husband see exactly what he’s dealing with because she probably told him a whole lot of BS about this relationship and this guy, and this guy is probably just one in a conga line. Better for husband to know what his wife is REALLY all about because I’m sure she had him snowed too.

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I must agree with you only because the chump (like me) did not know the extent of the deceit. I needed full disclosure (as in the skank’s letter to me) to help me see just how ugly the FW was. When my second Dday came, I knew that I did everything that I could to save my marriage to include staying with such a liar and cheater. I had no doubts the second time around.

hush
hush
2 months ago

“Get yourself into some serious therapy. You are attracted to unavailable people… When you get right in the head, sparkly, deceitful cheaters will hold no appeal to you.”

💯 Anyone who isn’t a cheater, and can relate to any of this in whole or in part, might benefit from watching Crappy Childhood Fairy’s limerence videos on YouTube. This is how untreated Childhood PTSD often shows up.

ThreeTimesAChump
ThreeTimesAChump
2 months ago

Cry me a river Mr. “Valid Values”. You know what says DIVORCED and available to date?

1) Valid DIVORCE Records available for you to see online on the county court lookup.
2) NOT sneaking around.
3) NOT “separated”.

You *are* valueless and an idiot. And be glad that you’re not the one paying her bills while she cheats on you. And use all the extra time that you have now to get some therapy, read some books, and figure out how you are going to grow the f*ck up.

OHFFS
OHFFS
2 months ago

Truth.

weWillNeverBeFriends
weWillNeverBeFriends
2 months ago

This was fair advice – he should probably read the book lol that woman said and did all the classic cheater things…..high school classmate sounds like he was carrying the torch in some way – this is his chance to move on

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago

Wow. This guy is a 46 year old never married, single person who probably should – hopefully by now – figure out WHY he is a 46 year old never married, single person. Fear of commitment? The perfect answer for that is SOMEONE WHO IS MARRIED. Complete lack of sympathy for this guy, it’s called Fuck Around and Find Out. Well, he did. People who cheat on their spouses generally are no good and they lie to YOU as well as spouse. I hope he DID send all that material to the husband, as I certainly would have (and kept copies for my protection as well) and then figured out why he was 46 and never married in the first place.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
2 months ago

To be fair, it is not impossible to “have a monogamous relationship with a married woman”. This is what happened in my marriage in the end stages. XW cut off all physical contact (sex, obviously, but also kissing, hand-holding, hugging, a sympathetic hand on a shoulder – basically anything that would be inappropriate with a stranger) because she had transferred her loyalty to the AP and needed to be monogamously faithful to him. AP did the same with his wife at the same time, so they effectively kicked off their future marriage while they were still married to, and living with, other people. Honestly, it was really confusing at the time because I didn’t know about the affair, so her “we cannot provide each other de minimus physical support in this most difficult chapter of our lives” seemed so arbitrary and needlessly self-punishing.

The original letter-writer obviously chose the wrong target and got burned, but I’ll bet that if he kept at it (and I’m pretty confident that he did) he eventually located someone willing to 100% monkey-branch to him. Whether that’s a positive trait in your new life partner is another question, but it can happen.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
2 months ago

Involuntary Georgian, I love and appreciate you. I have trouble with this. It sounds too much like how cheaters and side pieces define monogamy and justify their behavior.

“Monogamous” as I have been taught, is defined as “one mate”, one person at a time, not being involved with multiple people simultaneously, and not about what is or isn’t going on physically.

❤️

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago
Reply to  Velvet Hammer

Yep my husband said that he stopped saying “I love you” to me the last couple months, which I did notice. But, in his effed up brain, that made what he was doing ok.

But I mentioned before that he said so many stupid things rapid firing statements, and I doubt he even remembered what he said in the last sentence.

He had wrapped him self around the office auger and he was being crushed.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
2 months ago
Reply to  Velvet Hammer

My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek. Believe me, I don’t give XW any credit for her behavior. There was a long period (years?) of garden-variety adultery before this happened and I have a strong suspicion that the last AP wasn’t the first .

Perhaps a better way to say it would have been: someone who is non-monogamous in practice can still proclaim himself monogamous in principle. This self-contradiction can result in unusual behaviors such as expecting your partner in adultery to be more loyal to you than to that person’s spouse. This causes black-is-white ethical inversions where affection towards a spouse becomes a betrayal of the affair partner, and behavior that would ordinarily be worthy of condemnation (depriving your spouse of attention, affection and support) becomes somehow morally praiseworthy.

I realize I am in the minority here because my spouse and her affair partner committed to, and successfully executed, the simultaneous destruction of their respective marriages followed closely by an improbable marriage to each other. I can only say that she is a highly intelligent and decisive woman who – not being burdened by ethics or empathy – is very good at getting what she wants.

Last edited 2 months ago by Involuntary Georgian
Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago

I know exactly what you mean. At the end of my marriage, I realized the fact that the reason the FW wasn’t being intimate at all with me is because by doing so, he was being unfaithful to his skank. Too bad he didn’t let me know. And then when I insisted on a divorce, he still wanted to stay married but live separately. If that’s not fucked up and the definition of a sociopath, what is?

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Possible, but she still may not have been monogamous with him, or him with her. That is the thing with cheaters, we only know what they were with us, who knows what else or who else they did.

That’s the “beauty” of two cheaters marrying, now they will never know.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
2 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

Yes, IG may be perfectly correct in his own situation but it might be inaccurate for another chump (or an AP for that matter) to assume FW’s withdrawal of all love and the merest affection from the chump means “fidelity” to the AP. My impression is that chumps become the repository of all blame for the FW’s behavior and that lot of the withdrawal is about rage and punishment and projective demonization, maybe sometimes masked dependency where, because the FW projected “mommy/daddy” onto the primary partner and developed what is to them a shameful degree of dependency, the withdrawal is like a demented adult version of toddler individuation. The second the chump pulls themselves out of the mess, the FW will automatically transfer that shameful dependency to the next primary partner and then the cycle begins again .

FW in my case became cold and unapproachable but was also trawling other office doorknobs while he was cheating with the AP. He was not “faithful” to the AP at all.

Amazon Chump
Amazon Chump
2 months ago

Ha! Perfect karma on the skank if you’re correct!

susie lee
susie lee
2 months ago

Yep, there is little chance that my fw was loyal to his o-whore. Before and after they married. She even cough “left” him a couple times. But, she wasn’t really going anywhere, she would have to go back to work. He knew she wouldn’t leave, so he did what he pleased and he added compulsive gambling to the mix.

They were even hurting for money and she tried to get my daughter in law to give them money. Daughter in law told her there is no reason you can’t get a job. My daughter in law was in delicate health; but still working to help pay for her daughters college.

Mehitable
Mehitable
2 months ago

Why would you troll old classmates on FB – if they had been real friends you would still have some contact or knowledge….only one answer for that and we all know he wasn’t looking for cake recipes. Or….maybe he was.

PrincipledLife
PrincipledLife
2 months ago

OMG you’d have to have a heart of stone and the stoic stone-faced demeanor of a master poker tournament player to not laugh your ass off at the angst of these elderly high-school narcissists. They hilariously deserve each other and their antics…pushing 50 and having sneaky hook-ups in your parent’s house (!) Ha ha ha ha ha

This post was totally heart-warming, and cheered me immensely. It is Exhibit A on having nothing to work with and the blindness of APs. Made my day to see these two scumbags take turns throwing each other under the bus. Fellow Chumps: the problem is not us.

I hope the faithful husband in this story has divorced and is remarried to a worthy woman who loves him back. He deserves that.

OHFFS
OHFFS
2 months ago

“I would send a message like, “Happy Birthday to my wife in my next lifetime” – because, she was married. This is kind of my personality as a single, never married, 46 year old.”

Which handily explains why he was still single at 46. Who thinks sending a married mother or two that message is cute? Fuckwits do. Nobody normal does.

The stuff about sex in her parents house is 🤢. Grow up, FFS.

Last edited 2 months ago by OHFFS
Chumpolicious
Chumpolicious
2 months ago

Wow. How can people be so cliche? He fell for the oldest trick in the book. Im married but unhappy, separated, getting a divorce. I love you but need more time. Im staying for the kids. We have a sexless marriage.

I just dont understand how people believe it!

Hahahahaha laughable!

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
2 months ago
Reply to  Chumpolicious

Self fulfulling prophecy-it DID become loveless and led to separation!

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
2 months ago

Holy cow. I’d get the red pen out to circle all the examples of disordered thinking and dysfunction, but I can’t improve on Chump Lady’s proofreading.

I am not surprised that he is 46 and never been married. Good news is that it seems he didn’t reproduce.

I find it extremely helpful to hear how cheaters and side pieces think. This is a good one to bookmark and review. Every time you feel agitated or doubtful about who they are, who you are, who owns the problem, read this to snap your perspective back into its proper place. This is typical cheater/side piece thinking, and a great reality check.

I don’t know how much I know about love anymore, but I do believe that what’s going on here is not it.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
2 months ago

Anyone else laugh at the bit where the OP’s friend referred to the woman as “not divorced”? Is “not divorced” the new Perel-era term for, ya know, MARRIED?

It was interesting reading this eleven year old post. Swap genders and it could have been written by the AP in my situation. But my appeasement at how brutally FW dumped the AP after D-Day was short lived. Sure the latter was an asshole and I didn’t give a fig about her “suffering.” But would you really trust someone who, say, broke into prisons so they could batter felons with a tire iron? Is the shark who eats other sharks not just a shark in the final analysis?

HunnyBadger
HunnyBadger
2 months ago

I can’t handle the bizarro concept of “I couldn’t help myself!”

Yes, biological instincts and drives are real. That big ol’ dopamine rush at the beginning of falling in love is akin to a hit of pure heroin — but like any junkie on the street, if you keep going back for more it’s truly your own fault. Beyond that, every functioning adult knows when they’ve crossed a line, whether in text, PM, phone, or meeting for coffee. We all know when we’re telling a lie. We all know when someone’s going to get hurt.

I don’t know whether I feel incredulity or ordinary disdain for people who cross those lines then cry over their ‘heartbreak.’

The chumped spouse has legitimate heartbreak, the sort that is soul crushing, traumatic and undeserved; it’s the heartbreak of having your world involuntarily turned upside down and watching your children have their childhoods decimated. This is the legitimate heartbreak of finding you will now second guess yourself for the remainder of your life because you trusted and loved someone you had the right to trust and love. The grief of a Chump is horrible, and for the most part it makes people uncomfortable to talk about so the Chump has to carry it around alone, an emotional grenade detonated in their chest and a cold wind howling around the bloody heart.

The cheating FW and their twu-love have the kind of heartbreak that a child feels when they’re told they can’t go back for a fifth helping of stolen chocolate ice cream; “Waaaaa! We thought the ice cream was forever and now we’ve been cheated of it.”

Call me nuts, but I cannot summon any sort of sympathy for an OW or OM. They are 100% victimizing an innocent spouse (or two) and all the children involved.

As for this writer’s inability to “separate sex from love”, I offer two perfectly valid suggestions:

  1. Seek intense psychiatric help to work on whatever it is that hasn’t allowed him to mature more than a 14 year old.
  2. Become a eunuch. It’s a real option. If that doesn’t help with the ability to separate sex from love, at least it will keep Mr. Twu-Wuv from having two indistinguishable choices in the future.
Chumpasaurus45
Chumpasaurus45
2 months ago

“Then she is just as culpable. It’s not that hard to understand. If you conspired to cheat on someone, you are responsible. I don’t care if you were the f’er or the f’ee.”

1000% agree with this and love the terms f’er and f’ee to describe them!
All those f’s are culpable that are void of any moral integrity.
FW’s don’t cheat in a vacuum.

Mighty Warrior
Mighty Warrior
2 months ago

I was the victim of the ‘rekindling’ of the now very firmly ex-husband’s teenage relationship with a girl he was at school with. They had an attempt to be together for a couple of years while at school and again for a couple of years in their early twenties. They had never lived together. She got engaged suspiciously quickly after their second split, married the man, moved to Canada, became a life coach, had children. The ex and I were together for 26 years, married for 18, no children. I supported the ex through thick and thin, financially and emotionally. When I was dumped after a highly abusive discard, he vehemently denied an affair. I discovered emails from the woman, including a love sick poem written a couple of days before my dad’s funeral. He responded, describing his ‘yearning’ how ‘teary’ she’d made him blah blah. He was then 53 (now 58), she was 52 and I was 59. That’s the context. You will all know and understand my devastation, and I won’t spell it out again here.

I’m noticing a romanticisation in the media of the ‘Sliding Doors’ story: what would have happened if I had taken a different path when it was thrown my way. I guess all of us chumps have asked ourselves that question many times. The film ‘Past Lives’, we have ‘Alice and Jack’ in the UK, and I noticed another one (Italian) being reviewed in the Guardian this morning ‘Un Amore’. The existing, usually long, marriages and kids, and houses, pets, and mortgages are always portrayed as obstacles to be overcome by the star-crossed lovers – think Julia and Charles in Brideshead Revisited, a story in which the ex was always heavily invested. I ask this question: why does no one focus on the dishonesty of these people, including the woman referenced by the original letter writer in this piece? They go into relationships with unknowing others, mislead them for decades, all the time pining to themselves about some rubbish ‘lost love’ with whom IT DID NOT WORK IN THE PAST. How stupid do you have to be to think this is an adult way of behaving. And when will someone, anyone, give a thought to the victims of these particularly duplicitous cheats? We are not obstacles to these toerags’ happiness but human beings with feelings who loved them in trust and faith! I am nauseated by these ‘star-crossed lovers’ stories where the existing relationships are viewed as entirely disposable. I find these stories, tracking down ‘failed past loves’ via social media- Linked In in my case – sickening. And yes, the ex also had sex with her in his parents’ house while they were away. Our wedding photos were on the walls! It’s a territorial thing: mummy and daddy, you’re not the boss of me. These people are beneath contempt. The ex and his ex are, reportedly, ‘miserable’. And I want to shout ‘of course they are, they always were, that’s why their childish relationship failed twice before’!

Apologies for the length of this rant – I’ve just about had enough of this romanticised rubbish.