Permission to Hate the Holidays

permission to hate the holidays

If you’re looking for permission to hate the holidays, this post is for you. Not everyone enjoys the season of expected family bonhomie, flagrant consumerism, and performative religion.

***

I don’t often pull out my Chump Lady magic wand — only in cases where someone wants to leave a shitty relationship and I must give them agency — but this Christmas Eve I’m making an exception.

With the power vested in me as a middle-aged blogger with a keyboard…

I hereby grant you permission to hate the holidays.

You’re welcome. Feel absolved. Throw another log on your guilt and let it burn.

I don’t know what you’re on about, Tracy. I love the holidays! Sipping peppermint cocoa with my well-behaved children in our matching polar bear pajamas… (photo op!) Watching Elf for the six-hundredth time… Christmas Eve services and second-degree candle wax burns as we croon “Silent Night…”

Bah humbug.

Take a pass if you need one, this year or permanently. Here are some reasons some of us might be less than jolly at Christmas.

Expected family bonhomie

Just like Valentine’s Day reminds people of exactly how single they are, the entire month of December can feel isolating. WHAT? YOU DON’T HAVE AN UNBROKEN LEGACY OF INTACT FAMILY TOGETHERNESS? No. And they’re not in matching snowflake sweaters either. Maybe you have an estranged family member. Maybe you are the estranged family member. This could be the first year you’re doing the holiday hostage drop-off of children with your ex. Perhaps you’d like to throw a brick at the Hallmark Channel. I get it.

Redefine family. Reconsider “intact.” If you’re sane parenting on your own, you’re enough.

We don’t have to begrudge others their unbroken legacies of intact family togetherness — yay love! But we should be kind to ourselves. Shared DNA is often overrated. I prefer shared values and spending time with people who reciprocate and show up in my life. Not just at Christmas, but throughout the year.

Flagrant consumerism

I’m probably not telling you anything you don’t already know, but a lot of folks can’t afford Christmas. The pressure to have gifts, the Right Kinds of Gifts, and not being able to deliver (or receive) is its own kind of suffering. So, if you’re doing well, try to check your privilege. And if you’re struggling, you’re not alone. There’s no shame in it.

You’re not less of a parent or a partner because of material gift giving. Presence over presents. Your time is a gift. Your labor is a gift.

Performative religion

Obviously, not everyone celebrates the birth of Jesus, or should be expected to. Isn’t it weird to have hymns like “Oh Come All Ye Faithful” piped over public speakers? Oh sure, we make a nod to Hanukkah, but imagine being a Muslim, Hindu, or Zoroastrian this time of year? Or a religious minority, or simply not religious at all. All this CHRIST IS KING business does seem a tad oppressive, and I’m saying that as a lapsed Methodist.

Also, a lot of chumps are recovering from Jesus cheaters. They may have broken up with their faith communities or their faith, period. Christmas celebrations can be part of a bigger loss of identity and it takes time to form a new identity.

I don’t know the answer to this one, but I will say Chinese food and movies are a pretty stellar way to spend any holiday.

So, to anyone who needs it, (((hugs))). January is coming. Hang in there.

Subscribe
Notify of

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

78 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
walkbymyself
walkbymyself
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Merry Everything. Serenity Now.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Merry everything and thanks for all you do. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RuSrH4Vddn8 🙂

Looking in the Rearview
Looking in the Rearview
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Have a wonderful holiday! Thank you for all your wisdom!

New Beginnings
New Beginnings
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

I love it! I’m going to start looking for pinecone elves…

Looking in the Rearview
Looking in the Rearview
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

😂

ChumpOnIt
ChumpOnIt
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Perfect representation of the season!

ChumpOnIt
ChumpOnIt
9 months ago

Even years = Christmas without the kiddo. I am thankful it’s a whole season and we have our own Christmas morning before or after (depending on how the day falls) with my family. There is a part of me that remains detesting this time of year and all of the grief and loss I feel stacked up next to the peace and calm that used to come with it. Along with losing half of my weekends to a man who knowingly brought a child into an unstable life, these days that are supposed to be a reprieve are now, at times, quite a struggle. Thank you, Tracy and everyone, for your continued understanding and support. Have as happy a holiday as you’re able. XO

Last edited 9 months ago by ChumpOnIt
2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  ChumpOnIt

Chump on it..my #1 cheater wanted a baby knowing full well he was deep into OW and their 3 year affair, unknown to me. But she could not have children..I had this little girl for her. But this baby is now 35 and she has 3 little ones…and even though my 35 year old daughter, prefers her cheater dad and fancy OW now wifetress..I still get visits to her home in California and get to see the children. They have brought endless joy regardless of the sadness. Every year I am still grateful for my children from cheater…My life would not have the sparkle it does. It gets better and know we all get you here. Sending hugs your way.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

I’m glad she is in your life, but I’m really sorry that she prefers her dad and OW.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Disfor…exactly. sane parenting does have its pitfalls, but my daughter has gotten my values. She only knows my cheater as a doting daddy who treats her like a princess. ..It’s OK and I have no control on her perception. But Im.still here for her with my own peace and sanity..an influencer for good.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

Yes, absolutely. Your story was another thing that reminded me of my aunt’s history (posted further down here), at least with husband no.1. She was the sane one there – and suffered. Like you. He was the “fun dad” (ugh). (My aunt and husband no.2 was an entirely different story.)
“An influencer for good” sounds… good. 🙂 I’m glad you are at peace.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Disfor…you reminded me also. ..I had 2 grandmas, material & paternal. My maternal grandma left my mom a baby with her violent abusive husband. She returned home to her parents in Puerto Rico. I met her once for a few hours but my mother never asked her why she left her. I believe my grandfather put her on a boat back to her home and she was forced to leave. I’ll never know for sure. My paternal grandfather cheated repeatedly and that grandmother was said to have lost her mind due to the death of 4 babies under 2 years old, over a 6 year span. I never met her. So my dad was abusive but did not cheat, my mother waa able to endure chronic verbal abuse and demeaning for over 50 years. My legacy for my daughtee and grandchildren is that affairs and chronic abuse are not where a woman should Stat, and you can leave such harm behind. My grandchildren know me and so I hope to have changed this family ghost of pain into the reality of self worth and self value and dignity. Thank you for reminding me that though I was terribly hurt by every man I ever loved. I was also mighty in the ending of family abuse. I’m holding my head up against all those who do not get it. Including my own children.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

I think it’s awesome that you have broken that “absent/ill grandma” curse and have given your daughter a great example!

laurafshack
laurafshack
9 months ago

Hugs to you Tracy! Whatever we would we all do without you!! 💖

BattleDancingUnicorn
BattleDancingUnicorn
9 months ago

It’s not fair that I have to be without my kiddo for a week over Christmas. I’m sitting with this injustice this year.

We made some magical memories before he left, having established a few holiday traditions that are just ours, post divorce. We even got to spend a snow day off of school together, which was a nice bonus. Still, when I think about the fact that someone else’s idiot choices mean I’m missing out on a Christmas morning with my baby, I still see red.

I do have a little warmth in my heart again when it comes to this season and, as a country gal that moved to the city, maybe I’ll get my Hallmark moment when I visit my parents’ farm without my kiddo this season. Maybe my 5th grade crush is rebuilding his life after his wife’s untimely death or something and we will meet cute at the tree farm. Lol.

Elsie_
Elsie_
9 months ago

I worked in retail during my mess. There was a TV in the breakroom, and usually they had a talk show or game show on. But oh, when the holidays approached it was always on the Halmark channel. Always!

I would turn my back to it. Yes, I could have gone elsewhere in the mall for my breaks and lunch, but I loved my coworkers and enjoyed every minute away from work. It was all good.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago

You ever know..but alone is better than long term illnesses from.STDs and emotional breakdowns not knowing what is going on…at least for me.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

That too

BattleDancingUnicorn
BattleDancingUnicorn
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

Tis true! And we can have a misunderstanding that he is cheating with someone else. I’ll storm off, furiously packing my bags to return to the big city. Then we’ll reconcile! So romance!! No trauma at all!

BattleDancingUnicorn
BattleDancingUnicorn
9 months ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

You are so right! I’ll throw that master’s degree in the trash right now for true love that I met less than 48 hours ago!!

I’ll gladly pop out 17 more kids in a state with no healthcare rights for women!

Leedy
Leedy
9 months ago

Oh dear, you are making me laugh!

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
9 months ago

You guys are killing me. 😀

unicornomore
unicornomore
9 months ago

For a person whose inner self is rather dedicated to an orthodox version of Christianity, I dislike American Christmas more than you might guess.

My dislike started with my BPD mother’s obsession with it and all the rules and rituals she created in our home growing up that were more tedious than comforting. She was so showy about Christmas, she forgot what we really needed as kids and every year I got stuck with ugly crappy )but showy) clothes that didnt fit (and she refused to return) while I went wanting for actual wardrobe staples like pants, underwear and shoes.

Marriage to Cheater was at the same time as a career in nursing (working holidays) while he was deployed far away. When he was home, the holidays left him Dr Jeckyl/Mr Hyde mode. I didnt know at any given moment if he would make some grand gesture of decency or be a monster from Hell.

I hate the Santa ritual and never did it with my kids…Im really a terrible liar and there is no way I could spend YEARS telling them to “be good or else” … ask Santa for stufff…sleigh..chimney…oooh look what Santa brought. Nope, not me.

I also hate secular Christmas music…if I never heard that Rudolph stupid shit song ever again, I would be thrilled.

I used to be able to find solace at Church but it has been mostly taken over by Far Right extremists and I dont want my presence in the pew to infer acquiescence with their agenda.

My subsequent husband likes all the rituals and I try to go along with his traditions without coming across as a Grinch.

Love and peace to all the Chumps…it really does get better.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
9 months ago
Reply to  unicornomore

I’m with you about the bad commercial Christmas music. I prefer the good stuff because I sang with the symphony kiddy choir from age 7 and there were always yearly Christmas concerts with religious music, some at symphony hall and some in churches. Even though I was raised agnostic, I still loved performing in churches most of all, especially Catholic churches because it was like swimming in a pool of art. I may not have related to the religious aspect but I still found it beautiful that so many people were inspired by faith to create gorgeous music, poetry, paintings, sculptures, stained glass, etc.

Bruno
Bruno
9 months ago
Reply to  unicornomore

“I dont want my presence in the pew to infer acquiescence with their agenda.”
Thank you!

Looking in the Rearview
Looking in the Rearview
9 months ago

I’m done with religious holidays. Done. I’ve told my now all adult kids and while they’re not happy about it, I actually feel relief. It’s been a never ending tug of war with Fuckwit, Schmoopie & Fuckwit’s family always trying to out do me & monopolize my kid’s time. I was basically down to a “lunch” while my kids spend Christmas Eve, Christmas morning & dinner with the other side of the family. They have all the toys & larger family around that I can’t offer so I’m given token time. I’m taking my mom to a resort for a few days & we are splurging on spa time. It’s taken me awhile to get to this point and I’m happy that I finally pulled the plug! My kids are shocked but I honestly don’t care anymore. I didn’t care for how they marginalized me either. So I’m taking myself out of the whole damn holiday equation. I never understood why a divorced friend used to vacation in Mexico every Christmas away from his kids, but I get it now, I really do.

BastilleDDay
BastilleDDay
9 months ago

Great plan!

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago

I’m remembering packing up my 6 month old and 6 year old to spend the holidays with their German full on Christmas dad, as well as former inlaws who moved from NYC To mid America to support their cheater son and OW helping with the grandchildren. So I’m alone in a new state, only acquaintances and a new job working 3-11. I think working saved me as I signed up for holiday duty…but my glass door remained smeared with the tears of that holiday goodbye to my two babies. Off to a real Christmas tree, cheater dad OW and supporting grandparents. All I can say is..IT GETS BETTER..hold on to your sanity and your courage and do every day with mightiest love for your children’s sake. Love to you all new or old chumps. Celebrate all the things you never could before. Thank you CL,Mr CL. Mini Chump son and all the critters and elves at your house
Thank you for encouraging words and the truth. Where would I be without you all?

Elsie_
Elsie_
9 months ago

I get that the holidays can be horrid. The first three after my ex left were hard in different ways. But the divorce was final at year’s end after the third Christmas apart, and I was free-free-free. Everything felt so much better then even though he was utterly nasty and horrid via email during closeout. After his attorney died, he went pro se and slowed things down, but ultimately we prevailed. When my attorney said we should close the file, he gave me three scripts on what to say if my ex ramped it up again via email. And indeed, I used one of those. Then nothing.

A friend of mine is a retired therapist and is familiar with the constellation of my ex’s issues, and he believes that’s probably it. I’m no longer of use to my ex, so that part of life has been shelved where he doesn’t have to deal with it. If he’s still paired up, all the focus and disordered thinking has been shifted to her. If they broke up, same thing. She’s the big offender after that, not me.

It does get better.

Last edited 9 months ago by Elsie_
Elizabeth Lee
Elizabeth Lee
9 months ago

I hate Christmas more than you know. After 25 years of marriage/5 kids with a fuckwit I already hated it. Near the end, his parents moved and his mother instituted opening presents in her marital bedroom. YUCK! So incredibly uncomfortable! It was an hour-long ritual and presents were expected to have a poem to match. God, I hated it.

It was such a relief to never have to do THAT again.

But then three years ago I arrived at my parents’ house on Christmas Eve to find my dad lying on the floor because he had fallen and he and Mom had no plan to get him up. It was the worst Christmas of my life. I eventually made two 911 calls, there was a trip to the ER, several days in the hospital and then we brought Dad home on hospice. He died on January 6th. He was 90 years old, so I can’t say he died too soon, but you never expect your beloved father to die. On top of that, my only sibling died this year and Mom has dementia and I am caring for her. So, yes, I hate Christmas and I’m really struggling this year.

Dudette
Dudette
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Elizabeth, I am so sorry for all that you’ve had to deal with.

Two years ago, when it was just me and my elderly mom who had dementia (my kids weren’t with me, thanks to trickery by my ex), I was dreading Christmas dinner. I pulled up nostalgic song after song on YouTube, on my iPad. Not just Christmas carols but songs from my childhood: the Carpenters, Helen Reddy, etc. I made sure the lyrics were showing with closed captioning. It was a pleasure for us to just sing and for me to not have to create one-sided conversations.

I sincerely hope this might help. Take good care of yourself.

susie lee
susie lee
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Good grief. Opening gifts in her bedroom. I wouldn’t even want my family to have to do that if I were bed bound. Sounds like she make Christmas a command performance of sorts.

I am so sorry for the loss of your sibling, that is a rough one.

I wish you comfort and peace. Your mom is so blessed to have you.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Unwrapping presents in her bedroom?! Poems to match?! JFC on a cracker who could blame you for hating Christmas?! Good God! I hate Christmas now just reading this!

Sending a big hug…..and my sincere sympathies for the struggle you are in.

❤️

OHFFS
OHFFS
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Sweetie, that is a lot to deal with. My deepest condolences. ❤️

Eirene
Eirene
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

Oh, Elizabeth, I am so very sorry. You’ve been through such trauma, and I hope you can find a few moments of peace. You deserve better, and I’ll be thinking of you and wishing you well.

I trust he sucks
I trust he sucks
9 months ago

Thank you, Tracy! I’m not sure if it’s said often enough… But you provide so much relief to those of us going through the torture of trying to leave our cheater. I am forever thankful for your pearls (daggers) of wisdom.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago

I like that..pearls of daggers. Tracy still feel the pain and expresses my unsaid words I love her indignation at every cheat as if she gets what so many people fluff over. It is a huge validation for me to have someone else besides me screaming..HE DID WHAT TO YOU…WHY THAT %$^%##&&^$$SO and so…I know someone in this world gets it and all of you too!!! It feels so good to be understood and loved. Thank you VL and CN. You all give me hope for 2025 too. Happy New Year!!!

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

CL

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
9 months ago

I reserve the right to celebrate (or not) any and all holidays as desired. I learned I have permission to participate/celebrate however I want in grief-specific counseling I did years ago after my father died. This year I am wishing myself and others a cozy Christmas.

This is the seventh post DDay Christmas. I never know how I am going to feel on any given year. I feel really sad this year. I also feel lots of gratitude.

Two of my favorite Christmas movies are Lost Christmas (with Eddie Izzard, and not a comedy) and Angels Sing with Harry Connick Jr.

I loved Christmas and the shit sandwich wet blanket distributor I was to married has slimed it for me. Reclaiming the joy I used to feel an about it is a goal and I accept that it’s a process and I accept where I am in the process.

The love-peace-unity-harmony-magic-wonderful-happyhappy-joyjoy propaganda is in your face and overwhelming during the holiday season. IMHO, the most important thing is to respect how you feel and what you want to do, and extend that grace to others.

Last edited 9 months ago by Velvet Hammer
susie lee
susie lee
9 months ago
Reply to  Velvet Hammer

I love the cozy Christmas wish. For me, that has always been the best ones.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
9 months ago
Last edited 9 months ago by Velvet Hammer
susie lee
susie lee
9 months ago

I loved the fun of Santa, but I never mixed it with my faith. It was two separate things when I was growing up, and I did the same with my son. I don’t even know what performative religion is.

I wish all a peaceful contented holiday.

Elizabeth Lee
Elizabeth Lee
9 months ago
Reply to  susie lee

I’m so happy for you that you don’t know what performative religion is. I live in a southern state, and fake religious people are everywhere. They have totally turned me away from organized religion.

susie lee
susie lee
9 months ago
Reply to  Elizabeth Lee

That is hard to deal with.

I live in the deep south, (transplanted from the north due to job transfer) and have been so fortunate to be around some great folks. I am sure there are some that are faking it, but I don’t really consider that a real faith.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago

I would really love to do a huge Christmas etc., would love to be hostess with someone, but since I am familyless (my parents told me they didn’t like my disability, “good that we have the others”) have never had the chance. Ironically enough with FW I thought I would have that. Little did I know that the man is a psychopath, that he was engaged, that absurdly his fiancée knew about me (?! I will never understand that part), that he was sleeping with other women, some of whom I was introduced to, who got someone from his circle addicted to a drug purely to blackmail her husband (!!!!) etc.
It’s been… a year. Or really: it’s been … years.

ChumpNoMore
ChumpNoMore
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Oh my dear. You deserved none of that. I am so so sorry. I wish you nothing but the best going forward. A new and loving family of choice and all the healing you need. Much love to you.

SDC
SDC
9 months ago

I spent my first “Alone Christmas” at a retirement home playing dominoes with three widowed cuties who had no family visits. Greatest memory ever. Although I now have a snuggle buddy, I still plan on spending one day sitting on my butt eating a ribeye watching the Texas Longhorns. Although my sweetie is a vegan, I won’t feel guilty due to the fact her mouth will be salivating while fantasizing about Matthew McConaughey on the sidelines. Sometimes her naughty thoughts actually leak out of her mouth.

New Beginnings
New Beginnings
9 months ago

I hate the holidays.

Thank you, Tracy, for articulating this for me – and for giving me permission to just hate the holidays!

Dudette
Dudette
9 months ago

I read a comment of Elsie’s, about watching (or avoiding) the Hallmark channel while she was working retail. This reminds me of the Christmas standard, “It’s A Wonderful Life”.

When Clarence the angel takes George Bailey (Jimmy Stewart) to see what would happen to his loved ones if he killed himself, George realizes that his uncle would have been institutionalized, his brother would have drowned, and troops on a ship would have been killed. George asks to see what would happen to his wife Mary (Donna Reed) – and similar to the absolute tragedy of death – Mary would have become an OLD MAID. Horror of all horrors!

I used to believe that as a society and a world, we would build upon history and create an upward trajectory for all segments of humanity. I’ve come to realize that it’s not quite that simple and at best it’s two steps forward, one step back.

Thank you Tracy, for being the fearless leader of the two-steps-forward party of the narrative.

Stepbystep
Stepbystep
9 months ago

I am managing on my 6th Christmas “alone”. No parents, no children. Siblings, nieces and nephews lives mile away. FW and (probably) OW are in my marital home with my ornaments.

My local community is loving and active with lots of gatherings – just not on Christmas Day. And there’s no escaping which day that is because TV and radio programming is non-stop.

I find myself increasing grateful for the relationships nurtured year-round and for the ability to create my own cozy celebration. By the way, if you shop for yourself earlier in the year you really are surprised when you open the boxes on Dec. 25th !

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Stepbystep

Great idea!!!!! Haaaa!!! I made my own solo Christmas dinner. It has all the fixings. I cook great for me and no one to impress here.

susie lee
susie lee
9 months ago
Reply to  Stepbystep

Have a great. I get the surprise openings. I am 75 now, and I swear sometimes I can’t even remember what I did yesterday. At least not like I used to. Just me and H today. I love when I see the kids, but I also love just quiet days.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago

I’m inspired by just having read the “Did anyone get pregnant post”, but will post it here due to the Christmas angle. Let me preface this with “my aunt wasn’t the best at learning lessons”. This was a woman who openly said things like “I didn’t care that he [husband no.2] was mean to my kids – once they turn 18 I’ll spent all my time with him and none of my time with them and I have to put myself first.” HOWEVER, husband no.1 still did her dirty. (Husband no.2 never cheated on her to anyone’s knowledge, but stole money. Longterm partner in between did her dirty as well and in that case and with husband no.1 to my knowledge she was 100% innocent.) Back to husband no.1. He had an affair first with his way too young intern in the record studio that was 100% funded by my aunt and then with his podiatrist who had his baby. Aunt threw him out. (She funded the lifestyle of all her husbands and partners with one exception – and that guy was a police officer and the worst of all of them. Story for another day. Aunt not with us anymore btw, so no, she won’t read this.) She did not tell the kids (my three cousins) about the child with the OW. Ever. She told him that she would leave that topic to him (which I initially thought was fair! Plus she was scared of any “parental alienation” BS in lawsuits) Well, you can probably see how that worked out – he never did. BTW: my mom knew and I knew. We both tried intervening with uncle/hubby no.1 several times to convince him to tell his kids. In the end, after like 5 years, she did try telling them – and the worst came true: he accused her of lying and my cousins believed him (at this point there was an acrimonious divorce ongoing. For reference: my mom’s took 7 years. You read that correctly!) Now how did my three cousins find out? My cousins went to his parents, their paternal grandparents one Christmas… and that random 9 year old had not been picked up yet… Yup, one hell of a Christmas. They did not speak with their dad for many years and later due to husband no.2 not with their mother either for several years.
Ironically I keep thinking of my aunt and mom cause I didn’t want to end up like them (and expressly decided against children because of that) – and yet was also victim of a Very Sparkly Man. Makes me melancholic.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Disfor- there’s no vaccine for sparkly, acting men who know how to victimize others

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

I actually think that there is some kind of “vaccine” or antidote for some of us (again: very important: only some of us! Please don’t deem this applicable to the vast majority of chumps!). There is a way for some of us (again: some of us!) to prevent sparkly people becoming our life partners, but this may mean accepting not having one (like for me) and for others that may mean undoing brainwashing. Our entire culture brainwashes us from girlhood to find things that are associated with narcissistic personality disorder, attractive in partners – we are basically gaslit all of our life: a certain type of quick charm, certain confidence, certain outgoing men in well-paid leadership positions, strong career aspirations, high salaries – all of those things are actually associated with narcissistic personality disorder, lower empathy (than e.g. middle management) and thus also with cheating cause kibbles.

I didn’t even understand the concepts of narcissistic personality disorder before this year – and you need to understand it to exclude it/reject it. I’ve encountered it many, many times in my life, but I simply didn’t understand it and knew zilch about it. I still can’t fathom some of it – I get it rationally, but not emotionally, cause it’s like someone who is not human (the “skein” part, I guess).

I didn’t understand for the longest time why with my particular disability, I was purely attracting sparkly abusers. It’s not that my picker was off, because I simply accepted anyone who was interested in me and the others were not interested in me. I now understand how that works and understand that that will not change, meaning the option for me to be in a straight relationship that is healthy is extremely low.

You can also take the example of my aunt again. She met husband no.1, father of my three cousins, while they were both students. He dropped out. She graduated and became very successful in her career, in the field of patriarchal religious pedagogy ironically, in which she came to hold a leadership position. My uncle was never successful in any career, and he had an unsuccessful recording studio, which she funded 100% and de facto, which suited her very well, became a stay at home dad. Prior to their divorce, he ironically (given her profession and teachings!) took care of all household labor, all cooking and all childcare. She came from a wealthy background, grew up with cooks and nannies and couldn’t even boil an egg. She was never the maternal type (see also the quote I posted earlier), yet having no kids would have been egregious in her line of work. If she had looked at the studies and what they say, which is that on average the wife’s salary percentage of overall household income that made men the most satisfied with the relationship was 40%. Keeping that in mind, if she had looked at that rationally and we are talking of a much older generation here, she would have understood that the good-looking (my mom’s view) confident extremely charming success-less musician, who is happy to do all the childcare and all the household chores… was likely to turn out a mirage. As he did- screwing around left, right and center, mostly with younger women.

Similarly if I had looked at my own situation with my last FW as an outsider, detached, and it wasn’t me living it, I would have been able to deduct this to likely be an abusive situation in which the man is abusing a disabled woman (just like without the trauma bonds and gaslighting as outsiders we can see much more). Because the only thing that had changed from my previous situation in which I was alone involuntarily, was that I had become older, which decreases a straight woman’s attractiveness to men unfortunately, and I had suddenly more money due to a severance package.

And here are the parallels between me and my aunt: I was so relieved, because I just wanted to be safe and finally (!) not alone and not have to face the world without a family, as a disabled woman, in the same way my aunt was relieved, because she wasn’t interested in housework or childcare, but felt the need to have kids to advance in her career. She could have also deducted what would happen. After the divorce, he started being the purely fun dad and only saw his kids infrequently and not overnight. She paid him alimony. Husband no.2 was the same guy but less good-looking. Same non-career (musician with no success and yes, you guessed it, she funded him a recording studio!), also did all cooking and household labor, except for some childcare, which she now did, but resented. The fact that husband no.1 had been the SAHD and that they had been closer to their dad also played a part in why my cousins believed him and not her until that fateful Christmas.

hush
hush
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Yes, societal brainwashing of women and girls has failed to teach us that most cishet men definitely do marry for their own convenience. Even the ones who “love” you won’t pick you if they don’t find you either financially helpful (or at least not a huge hindrance to their leisure time) and/or fuckable and somewhat malleable. Reasonably attractive plus Willing to relocate for them. Willing to be a Stepmom Appliance. Willing to be a Hospice Wife. They’ll pick you… while dreaming of the girl who got away. A discerning “Follow the money/ cui bono?” analysis will usually reveal the truth about why a woman got picked. Women breadwinners are the most cheated on cohort in all of society – good for you for learning from your aunt’s foolish choices.

Cohabitation is a labor contract for women. The intentionally underearning leech man type of FW can mask as a SAHD who simply has time all day to be a cheater while the wife works – they can be hard to spot because we live in a society that wants to throw a parade for a father who acts bare minimum involved in his children’s lives. It’s wild to me how few people can discern this stuff. Anyway, glad you are learning about spotting narcs. Check out some of the Justin Baldoni is a covert narc predator content (specifically his disturbing proposal video and wedding vows to his Chump wife.) If ya’ll think I’m wrong or exaggerating about the prevalence of any of the foregoing, go watch CeciliaRegina videos on TikTok – before the app is banned.

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  hush

Couldn’t agree more with everything you’ve said!
I just watched the Justin Baldoni video – I actually think he may be a grandiose narc rather. Why do you believe he is a covert narc? That was the most disturbing thing I’ve seen in a while! And the comments from women underneath who don’t get it … are really sad. As you wrote: “wild”. I also found CeciliaRegina, but not any Baldoni tiktoks by her. She has good stuff overall. Very helpful.

hush
hush
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

“I just watched the Justin Baldoni video – I actually think he may be a grandiose narc rather. Why do you believe he is a covert narc?”

You might be right! So for me, Baldoni seems of the covert type bc he is sneaky and cries those fake “male feminist” (🚩!!) tears over his own vaunted toxic masculinity sadz/struggles pretty routinely, gets lots of women to simp for him, and acts passive-aggressive — i.e. controlling people and hiding his misogynistic attacks behind a PR firm’s bot army. Mega duper’s delight with that whole plot. Nick Viall (a former “Bachelor,” of all people) has a TT video about how Baldoni used yoga to toy with Viall’s podcast team, and that behavior tipped Viall off early about Baldoni being a weirdly controlling FW.

To me, Baldoni’s “nice guy” pattern is pretty straight out of the Debbie Mirza book “The Covert Passive-Agressive Narcissist.” Versus, say, how a famous mean, orange grandiose narc we all know of might simply tweet about “what a NASTY WOMAN” (all caps) so-and-so is, in direct bullying language. Spotting disordered people by their patterned behaviors is something I try to teach my kids to do, and it’s not an exact science. Point: if we ever have to ask ourselves “Who Does That??” regarding their behavior, I’ve learned it’s a pretty strong indicator of some type of disorder. And now we find that shit ::unacceptable:: and try to quietly line up our ducks and get away ASAP.

Last edited 9 months ago by hush
Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  hush

I understood grandiose/covert a bit differently, but maybe I’m wrong: I thought that a grandiose narc will very literally say insane sentences about himself (“I am the best”/”best looking”/”exceptional”) and a covert narc will be more sneaky in that regard. My FW pretended to be a feminist, but secretly hates women. But he also (like the orange one) would constantly verbally underline how special and amazing he was.
Your “who does that?!” hint is very smart!

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

A family story well told. Deep sadness for lessons learned after painful experiences…both my Xs were underperformers and insecure. I was happy and secure, gentle, too kind, too forgiving, overlooked the biggest flags and looking only at what I thought was love..it was just, I was of use and I supported them by working hard at a career I was happy doing. Who needed equal money? I could live with much less..generous..too trusting..all the things selfish people look for. Once I aged past my prettiest years and had cared for his aging parents, till they died, and his kids till they grew up..well he needed more than that, he wantee young…what I could never give. Never enough…now older and useless except for now he made more. Not all narcissistic people are wealthy or that charming…they just look for the low hanging Helpful giving folks who forgive over and over. Accept poor behavior and come back for more. It’s a well thought through plan of attack…as I fell into that trap. You are so right and family history is important..but now my lessons are learned and at my age I am exhausted from being used. There is no loneliness, only lessons learned. Have a beautiful rest of Christmas or any other celebration…I’m so happy to be alone and alive

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

I’m very sorry for what he did to you! But I’m glad that yes, you are alive and I wish you great holidays and a great 2025.
Yes, the “replaced by a younger prettier model” is all around me as well. I think about that a lot and what it means about men and bonding or lack thereof.
Re: too trusting and too giving – I know that feeling. I cringe at myself so hard in hindsight. All of the things betrayal blindness made me not see. But I have also detached from humans as a whole after everything that happened. Just any kind of trust or even interest in humanity is gone. Wiped.
Yes, you are right: narcs choose low hanging fruit. And my narc and my aunt’s narcs weren’t wealthy (actually, my aunt was rather self-involved as well, as you can imagine. She never learned any lesson whatsoever from all that happened and until her last day refused to see the theft from hubby no.2 or any of his lies- none of them related to cheating, he was ironically faithful- but he invented credentials, lied about everything else you can imagine and she also never acknowledged how hubby 2 mistreated her kids. She lost allies and good will because she always valued being married/not alone more than anything else and enabled jerks who were abusive in different ways to my cousins (again: fully ackowledging that if she hadn’t worked for a patriarchal religion, she would have never had kids in the first place as this did not interest her personally in the least. So societal pressures also to blame). My last and worst narc was charming, but in a serial killer way. Initially showing surprisingly high levels of empathy, far higher than is usual for straight men. I had not yet read the studies that logical levels for empathy is higher in psychopaths/narcs and emotional levels of empathy is non-existant for them. (Actually for anyone interested: almost opposite for autism. Emotional empathy higher than for neurotypical people, logical empathy exists, but works differently and lesser than neurotypicals.) I just didn’t know what I was looking at yet. There were many situations, like daily, in which part of my brain was like “what was that?!” though.

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Disfor

Disfor, do you remember the Rorschach tests, those weird pictures that appeared to some to be animals or faces or objects but to another viewer it would look.likr something completely different?Then if the shapes are pointed out you can then see what the other person saw or maybe not. To me, that is how my cheaters looked ..first like one thing but it was really another. Also, as I’ve said before on this site..my cheaters had progression of their tactics. From innocent seeming at first, then into porn, slowly brains changed into arrogance, entitlement, self focus, detaching from me and family Until the final break and D days. I feel so sorry for you , me and all of us here. But hopeful. Your aunt your extended family, you and me. I.fwelnthe worst for my children who had no choice in this dance of their innocence destroyed. But did I? Did you? I’ve read books on therapists, PHDs, psychologists, lawyers, every walk of life, fooled by these preditors of good faith and trust. If trained people

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

Part 2. The ads took me out…but no worries….lets stsrt over…IF even .trained people get fooled,how could I escape? To.all of us and especially to the holiday chumps and to you Disfor, may we learn to cut our losses and move forward with courage and might. Becoming better more discerning people to help each other through this valley of tears. I also want to stay kind and loving so that my two cheaters do not define my life ever again. Happy holidays to.all of us, happy 2025..and it will get better!

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
9 months ago

Ehh, I work in community mental health(doubling right now as a matter of fact-thanks, labor shortage!) The holidays were vanquished for me long ago(and the idiot that betrayed me never kept them special to begin with.) I’d love to…well…love this time of year again but perhaps that is part of finding Tuesday.

All the same, it was never a good time of year for me anyway. I just try to make it special for other people. That goes for all of you, too!

Let’s get through this!

Brizzler
Brizzler
9 months ago

Season’s greetings to you Tracy and Chump Nation. Since I discovered you seven years ago and you have literally kept me sane, helped me understand chumpdom and been a constant beacon of hope, especially this year when I’ve decided to divorce the FW. I’m excited at what 2025 brings, with CN by my side. Thanks for everything you do. Peer support is pure magic. xxx

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  Brizzler

It takes a village

Matt in Middletown
Matt in Middletown
9 months ago

Holidays were just an excuse for her and her family to take turns ritually insulting me.
She never backed me up, and actually had the nerve to scream when I decided not to defend her when she decided to try insulting my father.
I asked her, “did you ever stick up for me? No? Oh well.”

But holidays especially were the worst.
I eventually ended up hating Christmas music.
Would want to puke violently every time I heard “sleeeeigh bells ring, are ya listening?” and especially wanted to be somewhere else when stores started to play it.
Because holidays only signified more disrespect, more insults, more hurt I don’t need.
I haven’t really celebrated Christmas since 2021.
Our last Christmas together as a couple where she insulted everything I got her, nothing was good enough or right, she wasn’t grateful for any of it, and never told me what she wanted for Christmas.
“If you really loved me you’d KNOW what I want!”
Yeah.
Holidays?
Pass.

PeaceAtLast
PeaceAtLast
9 months ago

Any day without FW is a good day, including Christmas and New Years Eve. I will celebrate this year, my third Xmas since DDay with Chinese food and champagne. So happy to be almost divorced. Thanks for the blog CL and Mr CL, without which I might have wobbled. PS I hate how the stores play Xmas music. So tiresome.

Learning
Learning
9 months ago

Dear, darling fellow chumps,

I hope we all find the cocooned pocket of sense of safety and calm that we all need and absolutely deserve during this season. Whether we derive that from Christmas celebrations or a private vow we give to ourselves.

We have all walked through trauma and here we all are. Loving, deep thinking and connected (right here on this blog).

Thank you to this wonderful community and to Tracey.

💕💕💕

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago

Sending love to Those who are…

• GRIEVING A LOSS DURING THE HOLIDAYS

• HOMESICK FOR FAMILY & FRIENDS

• MENTALLY & PHYSICALLY DRAINED

• TRYING TO HOLD IT ALL TOGETHER

• STRUGGLING TO MAKE MAGIC FOR THEIR KIDS

• WORRIED ABOUT WHAT THE FUTU
URE HOLDS

Disfor
Disfor
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

Thank you so much! I’m in the “mentally and physically drained”, “trying to hold it all together” and especially “worried about what the future holds” boat. Merry Christmas to you too!

2xchump
2xchump
9 months ago
Reply to  2xchump

Sending the above to all of you in CN

Bluewren
Bluewren
9 months ago

It’s not a good time for me but first and foremost I’d like to give thanks to you all for keeping me upright this year.

I got engaged to my kid’s cheating ball bag father at Christmas.

Also was reunited after 20 years with Dickhead McCluggage at Christmas – that was a joke present if there ever was one!

This year I’ve just returned from what was my home country where I attended court to get final orders- I flew back to family on Christmas Eve and spent the day with my freshly minted grandson.

Best present ever.

Morgan
Morgan
8 months ago

I don’t like the holidays (Thanksgiving and Xmas) for two reasons. The first is the struggle to pay bills and buy presents. The second reason is because FW would routinely become a jerk. He’d keep this up until it was time to go to a family get together or something so when he would mention he’s not really into the get together and wanted to go see his long time buddy and his family, I was more than willing to support it. Sometimes he’d say he’s going to go hang our with his dad and keep him company which I would never have any issue with.

I won’t give him any credit for actually visiting his school buddy or dad because it wasn’t the whole story. Acting secretive, starting fights, glued to his phone. After I discovered his cheating along with his location history it wasn’t hard to put together. The deception, abuse, and taking advantage of when I was distracted having a good time with family? Jeez…and it’s not like it was just me. The kids couldn’t have enjoyed the fights around the holidays either, but FW don’t care and now he can not care somewhere else.