She Discovered Her Boyfriend Has a Double Life
She just discovered her boyfriend of 13 years has a double life. When she confronted the Other Woman with piles of evidence, she didn’t believe her.
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Dear Chump Lady
I have read your blog for many years after my marriage ended in divorce due to his infidelity. I was fortunate enough to find a nice man after my divorce; I was very excited about him.
Good community standing, was highly educated, and from all angles, looked like a good human. I felt adored by him, he was doting and made me feel good about myself. He was aware of how my marriage ended, and provided a lot of support through that healing.
Fast forward 13 years later to yesterday, I was gobsmacked to find out he has been living a double life for 10 years.
I was not the only object of his affection. Yesterday I came face to face with the other woman and I don’t know what I expected to happen but it certainly was not him denying TO MY FACE that he has had a relationship with me.
I assume to preserve his good image with her and make me out to be “crazy”. My jaw was on the ground as he doubled down after I had told this woman about our relationship. He said I was cruel for disclosing details to her.
I simply have no words! It was the biggest mindfuck of my life and I’m still reeling today. Right away I blocked him on all social media sites, deleted our texts and all pictures of him, and blocked his number. I never want to see this man again, much less speak to him.
I don’t know that I have a question here other than WTF?!?
He looked me in the face and just completely denied 13 years together.
I had all the evidence. The OW just smirked at me and told me I was disgusting and a man like him would never want a woman like me — even after seeing all our pictures, texts, and evidence of a relationship.
I don’t understand the cruelty of it all, and then of course, the blameshifting by calling ME cruel when I was simply standing up for myself.
Have you ever seen such a thing?
Your insight is most appreciated.
Sincerely,
Disgusted, Not Disgusting
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Disgusted, Not Disgusting,
Have I ever seen such a thing? Girlfriend, I have an entire blog devoted to this fuckwit phenomenon.
How your ex-boyfriend reacted to you confronting him about his double life is pretty text book.
- Gaslighting — I have no idea who you are!
- Blameshifting — How could you be SO CRUEL?
- DARVO — he and the Other Woman are victims of your insanity.
Welcome to the Chump Club. (Someone please pass DND the potato chips.)
What you’re really asking is where did this freak get the audacity? He plucked it from the withered cavity of his empty soul. It’s shocking to realize that someone could fake a 13 year long commitment. But such creatures walk among us.
You were of use to him. Until you weren’t.
From his perspective, it’s a shame you had to discover his girlfriend(s). Makes it much harder to extract value from you. He’s transactional, which should be some comfort to you. Schmoopie isn’t special either. She was just the catalyst for your liberation.
He was aware of how my marriage ended, and provided a lot of support through that healing.
Enh. This stood out. This is why I tell newly minted chumps, don’t self-medicate with other people. Healing is YOUR job. Don’t rely on new love interests for support. It’s not fair to them and it signals that you’re not available for a relationship. You’re still in the wobbly stages.
I’m not saying live like a monk, I’m saying do that work in a therapist’s office, or on the damp shoulder of a trusted friend, or on this support site.
But, you know who loves the vulnerability of a big, broken heart? Fuckwits.
All the better to exploit you. You’ll spackle! You’ll get hooked on their validation of you. NO. YOU validate you. Freaks love you broken. They want to be the final say on your worth.
I was not the only object of his affection.
He has no affection. Because he has no depth or real connection. But yes on the “object.”
Yesterday I came face to face with the other woman and I don’t know what I expected to happen but it certainly was not him denying TO MY FACE that he has had a relationship with me.
Of course he’s going to deny his double life.
Best defense is a good offense. At this moment, he has to make a choice — who can he best bullshit? Honesty is not on the table. You are not a good bet, because you just discovered his duplicity. But Schmoopie is still in thrall to him. So he’ll put his energies there. I DO NOT KNOW HER!
I assume to preserve his good image with her and make me out to be “crazy”. My jaw was on the ground as he doubled down after I had told this woman about our relationship. He said I was cruel for disclosing details to her.
Never stick your head in the mindfuck blender. But how can you be cruel sharing intimate details about an intimacy he denies that exists? Answer: you’re crazy.
Cheaters do this faux concern for the affair partner after D-Day.
Poor Schmoopie! However will she endure the sorrow of your vengeful, bitter truth telling? Her feelings are the real feelings that matter! He is an errant knight concerned about Schmoopie’s well-being.
It’s bullshit.
He uses her and he uses you. And this “concern” is a bid for you both to pick me dance. You, to win back the centrality of his care (you may be still deluded that he cares), and her to combat your villainy. He defends her against your lies!
He looked me in the face and just completely denied 13 years together.
Liars lie. And Schmoopie would rather believe you, her competitor, is the liar, than the man she invested a decade of her life in.
I had all the evidence.
You made it up. It’s an AI creation. Evil badgers in Siberian troll farms planted those hotel receipts.
She doesn’t WANT to believe the evidence. She disagrees that her boyfriend is a FW. Warning her was still the right thing to do. I’m sorry it sucks.
You’re not disgusting or cruel.
The OW just smirked at me and told me I was disgusting and a man like him would never want a woman like me — even after seeing all our pictures, texts, and evidence of a relationship.
Shame on her. This isn’t going to end well. From her perspective, you’re the Schmoopie, her competitor, the unreliable narrator.
Believing you means a wall of pain for her. Telling her was still the right thing to do, regardless of how that truth was received. Instead, you could’ve severed contact with an email to them both. But you confronted them in person — a dangerous and emotionally perilous thing to do.
That took guts.
And it also took guts to open your heart again after one betrayal. Now it’s two. I’m sorry. But please know that YOU are the courageous person here. Truth telling isn’t disgusting or cruel. It’s hard and very often not well received.
Stick with the no contact. Freaks love to circle back. ((Hugs))
My deepest condolences for your pain, Disgusted. So, I am picturing you confronting the two of them together, is that it? And he stood there and basically said, “I don’t know her,” is that it? 🤮
Truly, truly, truly — their lives are punishment enough. Both of them. (Her too, because of her insults to you.) Stick with the winners like us; we value integrity.
Amen!
“She doesn’t want to believe the evidence.” Truer words were never spoken.
When I heard my ex was involved with a woman I knew (not the ex-student with whom he “explored his gender identity”), I contacted her to let her know he was a fetish cross-dresser who in the last six years of our 35 year marriage had escalated to the delusional belief he was “a woman in a man’s body.” I provided evidence and offered more specific evidence should she want to see it. I did this because I would want to have this information, and I thought she needed the truth he was unlikely to have disclosed to her, as he’d kept it from me for thirty-two years of our marriage.
Her response was to question my motives and defend him.
Chump Lady used the word “freaks”. I use a different word. Sick.
That is the beginning and end of the analysis and discussion.
People capable of creating the sort of crazy scenario the letter writer describes is not normal. They are what current society describes as sick.
There is no understanding or anything to work with. The behavior and mindset is something we cannot even begin to comprehend. And it isn’t necessary to comprehend. Read all of Chump Lady’s posts about taking your head out of the mindfuck blender.
It may be the hardest thing you have ever done to simply accept that walking away and not ruminating is your only option. I’ve always said it was like very slowly crawling thru hot coals and sharp glass. The process feels like it may kill you but I promise it won’t. Do the hard work and focus your attention only on yourself.
I found DBT (Dialectical Behavioral Therapy) to be hugely helpful. One tenant is radical acceptance. And there are techniques to stop rumination (for example, you can’t analyze a cheater’s behavior while holding an ice cube).
It is SO hard. But accept you are not them, you will never be like them and you will never understand.
I respectfully disagree that they are all sick. That speaks to part of th equation, but not all. These people are not just sick but malevolent. All of us here are not just collateral damage from someone who was crazy and delusional and thought they were hunting elephants in Africa when they shot us through the heart. No, these are people who deemed us unworthy of basic human rights, who intentionaly lined their scopes up with our heart, and took pleasure in doing so.
I had to address this becase for a long time I thought my husband was sick. And you don’t abandon sick people who are trying to get well, you stick by them and support their healing. Or at least, in my case, you do that until you finally see the malevolence and evil for what it is. And once you do that, you are free of the helping handcuffs.
Yes!!! My X was diagnosed bipolar and on lithium. I blamed his being inappropriate with me, with my daughter, with other woman, EAs, outside woman for massages. I blamed EVERYTHING on bipolar behavior. After D day and finding out HR was reviewing his behavior of having sex at work in empty rooms… I said to him..but Cheater, please talk to your psychiatrist!!! Please, he can help you with your DISEASE!!! My Cheater turned to me with his reptilian stare and said, This has NOTHING to do with my disease so STOP bringing that up!!! That’s when the ice water hit my face and the truth started to seep in..I waa a chump and had been excusing unacceptible behavior due to am illness when his very nature was deeply disturbed and evil. I could never blame an illness again for me staying. It was intentional harm
What you write reminds me of what Holocaust survivor and historian Elie Wiesel said about Madoff after his charitable foundation was robbed: “‘Sociopath,’ ‘psychopath’– it means there is a sickness, a pathology. This man knew what he was doing. I wold simply call him thief, scoundrel, criminal.”
Chumplady’s answer was brilliant! Please take it all to heart. Hugs.
Disgusted, I’m so sorry he tried to negate you and thirteen years of your life in that way.
Is there any way you can reverse your deletion of your texts and photos with him? I’m asking because if he told this woman that you were crazy and never had a relationship, both he and she may run to tell the same false story to others in their social and business circles, and that may impact you.
My ex ran to get ahead of the narrative by claiming I became irrational and violent after discovering he gave advice to an online work colleague. He advised almost everyone we knew to avoid me because, he alleged, I was waving a gun around. Fortunately, I had saved and printed his emails to his online AP/catfisher, and once I learned what he was doing, I offered to show them to people to prove that he was giving thousands of dollars a day to an online scammer while asking her for revealing photos (such as her hand in her crotch), which she emailed back. A few people wanted to verify the truth and read their emails. Having hard evidence made a lot of difference.
Disgusted, it was brazen of him to deny 13 years together. You wrote that he had “good community standing” when you met. Did you see that for yourself, or was it based on what he told you about himself? Was your relationship public, through meeting and sharing social circles, or did he keep your relationship private? Your cheater managed to hide TWO relationships for at least a decade. There may be more.
There are men and women who want to be seen as “White Knights” or “rescuers” and rush to care for needy people, including chumps. They get a hefty dose of kibbles from that person in need, and also from their social/work circle. I suspect when they’re no longer as needed, or they need to burnish their image again, they seek someone else to “rescue.”
OW may have smugly denied that he would cheat on her with you, but she can’t unsee the texts and photos you showed her.
And BTW, when he claimed you were cruel for showing her the evidence, that was a tacit admission that your evidence was valid.
30 years and when I found emails ( he had printed and saved in and briefcase) he had an affair as far back as 10 years and confronted him he said, “I dont believe what your telling me” I said, “ the timeline or the that the emails are real” he said, both. When I asked him if I should send them to him, he said, “NO”
They live in their own delusion. Their own rewritten story. Compartmentalization at it’s finest and they do not want that shaken by the truth. It’s mind boggling to the sane to the point it makes you feel a little u hinged and insane. Which in of itself is enough to know you are dealing with someone very unhealthy. I also shared some information with my now XH affair partner he married and she could care less. The money and life is enough. Or so she thinks for now.
Congratulations on blocking, deleting!! Most of us it takes a while to stop trying to save and fix. Just know they are both their own karma.
“They live in their own delusion. Their own rewritten story. Compartmentalization at it’s finest and they do not want that shaken by the truth. It’s mind boggling to the sane to the point it makes you feel a little u hinged and insane. Which in of itself is enough to know you are dealing with someone very unhealthy.”
That is the stone truth. Whenever we meet somebody who can compartmentalize to that degree, we should run.
I think something that can help chumps dispense with any lingering pining or false regrets for leaving a cheater is to point out that the advanced level of compartmentalization you’re describing is also a feature of– yikes– serial killers.
One incarcerated serial killer even coined a term to describe it: “cubing.” https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/shadow-boxing/202201/the-serial-killer-btk-and-the-concept-of-cubing
At least the idea can be helpful and clarifying for chumps but it also has the benefit of driving cheating apologists berserk which is always entertaining. Apologists can’t bear cheating or any of the behaviors or traits that typically come in tow with it or facilitate it (gaslighting, DARVO, rape by deception, financial abuse, selective memory and empathy, the ability to distort or rewrite events, etc.) even being positioned on the lighter end of the same spectrum with violent criminality. But I think it’s completely absurd and irresponsible not to err on the side of caution and point out overlaps and correlations between cheating and other forms of abuse or risk if this saves even one person from experiencing trauma or worse.
For instance, if coupled with certain rationalization tactics like “neutralization” (also associated with serial killers among other serial offenders: https://www.mdpi.com/2075-4698/9/2/46), I think anyone who displays these tendencies is sort of like someone who goes shopping with a magnetic security tag remover in their pocket. Basically no one would carry this tool around if they didn’t have the intention to shoplift since tag removers perform a very specific function. By the same token, no normal or safe person would ever develop such an elaborate, practiced and polished ability to rationalize away the harm they do unless they intend to commit that harm.
Compartmentalization alone isn’t always a red flag for criminal tendencies since it also apparently exists in people forced by circumstances to do unbearable tasks or hostages and victims entrapped in abuse. But if it comes along with a well developed tendency to rationalize, it’s bad juju and squarely on the spectrum of the worst types of criminality.
CL and the gang all make great points. The above is what I want to focus on.
Good decent people simply do not do the sorts of things that Cheaters and knowing APs do.
It is truly shocking to have a person we love inflict cruelty onto us yet it is a weird gift to learn that they are THAT selfish and willing to hurt you.
This year is the 20th anniversary of the discovery and blow-up of his affair with Susan of Seattle but 10 years ago (right before my wedding to a decent person) I learned that he had likely cheated all along. I once noted that CL said in a column that she had come to see Serial Cheaters as the norm. I suspect she is right and if there is some cohort of “one off” cheaters, their partners dont generally make their way here.
I share the depth of my time in this to say that in the end, I am less upset by whatever he did with his dick and care little of his co conspirators, what has stuck with me is the cruelty. While I was a very steady partner (and he pretended to be one) our marriage went through horrible episodes where he was grossly mean/cruel for no explainable reason.
Im so very sorry that you got such a damaging reaction from him. My confrontations to my Cheater never had his co-cheater present. I am certain he would have defended Susan to my face and accused me of being mean to her. I still look for her in crowded airports when I travel (not that that is a good thing nor do I have a plan for what I would say). Im proud of you for cutting all ties and not pick-me dancing.
Decent people cant understand cruelty and you are a decent person – be glad you dont understand.
Unicornomore: “I share the depth of my time in this to say that in the end, I am less upset by whatever he did with his dick and care little of his co conspirators, what has stuck with me is the cruelty. While I was a very steady partner (and he pretended to be one) our marriage went through horrible episodes where he was grossly mean/cruel for no explainable reason.
Decent people cant understand cruelty and you are a decent person – be glad you dont understand.’
What Unicorn said…these are words of wisdom. It is the cruelty in the end that undoes you, and then frees you. The worst thing my husband ever did, the cruelest, was to smirk at me in silent pleasure when I was crying and telling him of my mother’s terminal cancer diagnosis. He enjoyed it. Immensely. There is no going back after that. What he did with his limp little penis is relatively speaking of no consequence.
You can’t understand why Jeffrey Dahmer enjoyed kidnapping, torturing, raping, killing and eating his victims? Be glad you can’t.
Yes PL… and his smirk was truly cruel.
I believe that my Cheater intentionally used cruelty to distract me so that I wouldn’t notice what he was up to and it normally worked.
On our way to a work function of his, he screamed and raged (yelling that he did not know the directions to the event – as if that were my fault) and rage-drove the car until I was scared I would die. By the time we got there, my soul and emotional self was so beaten and battered that I could not speak and barely noticed what was going on in the room. It was much later when I realized that (just as we arrived) he very oddly saw a senior female officer and he said “there she is”. That isnt something he would normally say.
I realized much later that he gave me strange, cryptic hints to his secret life
I totally agree cruelty is also a tool to obfuscate and batter you into numbness and psychologoical retreat. I’m sorry you had to go through that.
It’s the deliberate cruelty that lingers in my mind too. Coming home daily to nitpick and devalue me when I was a hardworking good spouse by all accounts! Mindfuck me so much I thought I better get tested for early onset dementia even. Stealing so much money from us to lavish on literal whores while screaming at me for a $14 gadget. Late to multiple kids events due to the double life and posing as a poor overworked sad sausage for excuses. MONSTER
My Cheater was active duty military so had a zillion excuses and opportunities to just say “gotta work” and I had no way to question him, so he lived with a lot of freedom. The flip side of that coin was that he was gone so much I had to handle the money and he could not get more than $50 out of our funds without me knowing. My part time job needed to balance the budget was SO freaking hard, if I had found out that he embezzled any family funds to pay a prostitute, I cannot even describe the rage that would have overtaken me. I have respect for anyone who got served that shit sandwich and didnt end up in prison.
I would tell the adult children so they would understand my ongoing anger.
Are we all married to the same FW? The money lies are intense. But maintaining a hooker fetish is expensive. That sad sausage has taken 1/2 my retirement funds to start over. What bothers me most is my young adult daughters telling me I gave them “money issues” by constantly saying we couldn’t afford things.
The household funds were drained by their father’s hidden excesses. Yesterday one said to me “Dad never says anything but kind things about you.” I had to bite my tongue to not retort “Because I didn’t cheat and embezzle over the past 34 years?”
I agree with the others that you shouldn’t bite your tongue with the adult kids. This FW may say “nice” things about you now but, as you describe it, his lies still led to your kids’ negative impression that you were a tightwad for no reason.
Basically FW gave them a misleading math and economic lesson and you’re simply correcting an accounting error over the real cost of prostitutes. You would be justified in showing them the evidence of his hooker habit if any of it exists in self defense because you’ve been “smeared by omission.”
I agree with Archer. I would tell her the truth. She is old enough to know and to understand. Don’t let FW paint you as the bad guy by keeping quiet. How manipulative of him to say “kind” things about you, no doubt hoping it means you will keep his dirty secrets.
Why are you even biting your tongue? I’m honest with my children that our financial struggles are due to FW thefts, divorce, discard of the family. Why should I cover for the NPD liar and thief?
“Have you ever seen such a thing?”– oh, Disgusted. Read these archives. Florida Chump, just a couple of days ago, described a similar scenario of presenting reams of evidence to someone who refused to see or hear it. Keep being mighty!
Fuck.
I am so sorry.
From one fuckwit to another? Is there no safety?
This one hit me.
I can only imagine the pain of having him deny YOUR HAPPINESS to your face.
They were wrong, though. You know it. It’s hard to hear right now, but you are very strong and very brave. You’ve already been through this-you beat it before when it was worse and you are going to beat it again. And I am sorry for that.
This is not your fault. I know where you are you are not ready to hear this-so I hope you come back to it later when the smog clears and the STRONG, POWERFUL person you are reigns. But again-this is not your fault. You did not earn any of that. After already being chumped you deserve so, SO much better than that. He is wrong and the other woman is in for a VERY RUDE awakening coming up (if it has not happened already.) They will both get theirs, mark my words.
Now is a time for healing. We are here for you!
Same story but with me it was 34+ years of marriage and prostitutes & work shmoopies. I did not contact eX’s dozens of fuckbuddies upon my discovery, but he did respond to me in the exact ways: gaslighting, blameshifting, DARVO (plus guilt tripping and lovebombing!). I told the truth to every one of my friends and family. Some punished me for daring to speak what he did to me, and some genuinely supported me.
I hope you have pruned the flying monkeys from your circle, painful as it may be to do so. True colors and all that
When my best friend’s husband hit on me via Instant Message the moment my exFW moved out, she refused to believe it. We had been friends for 17 years and, even when presented with proof (screenshots of the disgusting things he said to me) she refused to believe me. Then she quickly DARVO’d and asked what I did to make him think that was ok??? (The evidence I had clearly showed that I did not encourage him in any way shape or form. I gray rocked him 100%. Never replied to his IM’s. But she even twisted that! Saying that if I had told him to stop then he would have.) She blocked me and cut me off abruptly after nearly two decades of friendship. So am I shocked when I hear that a schmoopie refuses to believe Disgusted’s version of truthful events? Not at all. The lengths that some will go to to keep their lives intact is mind boggling, even when it’s clear that their partner is a piece of shit. Hang in there Disgusted. You’re better off without him.
Molly in about 5 years your ex bestie is going to call you, crying about her divorce, and seeking your forgiveness. She’s a shit friend, but I have a certain empathy for her, because I too spackled for years and did not see what was right in front of me.
So basically she was saying; “He didn’t do it, but if he did, it was your fault!” It hurts to lose a friend, but you obviously didn’t lose a genuine one there.
Molly I’m sorry to hear your experience. My frenemy betrayed me and kids after initially supporting the divorce. Her husband is an abusive husband and likely a cheater himself. She probably has a thing for my ex too but is too fat and old for his tastes.
Women like that are part of the problem of FW epidemic.
Your former best friend would rather live in denial and hang onto a POS. YOUR brave actions scare and shame her. Deep down she knows she’s a sniveling groveling orifice praying to not be discarded.
“Your former best friend would rather live in denial and hang onto a POS. YOUR brave actions scare and shame her. Deep down she knows she’s a sniveling groveling orifice praying to not be discarded.”
So well put. Exactly. It must suck to be that pathetic.
When everything came out in the open with my exFW I really leaned on this friend for support. The first thing she said to me upon learning of my husban’ds infidelity was “You’re living my worst nightmare” so I understand that she was terrified of finding out her husband was a cheater. I even understand her standing by him. (Many of us do that at first, I sure did.) What I do not understand, and never will, was how she tried to blame me. How she so quickly asked me what I had done to make him think it was ok for him to talk to me like that. It’s victim blaming 101 and it’s sickening. One of the last things she said to me before her husband sent me those gross IM’s was asking me if “maybe I wasn’t enough” for FW. I was shocked. But in hindsight, I see that she feels she’s not enough for her FW and she lives in fear that he’ll leave her. He certainly showed he’s capable of it by jumping so quickly to hit on me. I actually feel sorry for her.
DOD
Your alias initials are an apt acronym for “Department of Defense” because I think you’ll need to be in defense mode regarding this twisted character for awhile. Tracy is right that these sickos tend to circle back around and keep showing up like bad pennies. You’ll be lucky if he doesn’t but even so it’s going to take time to process and to nix the illusion that this individual was only abusive and coercively deceptive to you but will otherwise be a wonderful partner to someone else. In fact I think that’s the very thing that needs to be “defended” against because that illusion can be dangerous if it tempts you to reach out for comfort and reassurance from the very person who injured you.
And I mean literally dangerous. Forgive me if I put a really fine point on the following argument but the overall takeaway is that you do not deserve the disorienting hell of living even with implied danger.
So one thing I think can help in ditching that false “FOMO” impression, coming to grips with this kind of trauma and managing some of emotional fallout such as anxiety and panic or the flattened, exhausted pessimism from adrenal burnout following catastrophe is to recognize that emotional abusers like this can be dangerous in all sorts of unthinkable ways.
I think we all sense this on a gut level. In other words, consider that some of what survivors of abuse– even if the abuse never progresses to overt violence– feel following betrayal and separation is not merely a sense of “loss” or fear of never finding love again but the shattering “near miss” shock of, say, almost walking into an empty elevator shaft on the fifteenth floor.
I think the analogy fits because any human being without the capacity for love and affective empathy– which this FW just clearly demonstrated about himself– is nothing more than a scary ape and potentially capable of any manner of ill deed or even savagery to anyone they’re close to. Consequently, I think it’s a safer bet not to put anything past individuals like this. But, again, I think that’s precisely why it’s so explosively traumatic when someone close to us is unmasked and reveals themselves to be without compassion or ethics: because some part of our ancient unconscious lizard brain recognizes this dangerous capacity in our own species.
Though, these days, a lot of crappy advice columnists and RIC mavens like to suggest that the problem in cheating is that victims weren’t “lovable enough,” like to argue that “everyone” is capable of cheating and would call it hyperbole and hysterical “catastrophizing” to suggest that cheating might be a red flag that an individual is intractably abusive and potentially dangerous, one look at human history, evolution or crime statistics makes a different argument.
What the facts say is that the statistical risk of ending up with a dangerous partner is so high that any red flag that someone isn’t exactly kosher (like cheating, which most people don’t do) should be taken very seriously, not dismissed as hyperbole. Though humans are uniquely capable of free will and, through careful societal organization, we can sometimes sustain relatively peaceful societies, we’re still in a very small club of mammals (wolves, lions, spotted hyenas, chimps, humans) that commit the highest rates of inter-species murder in terms of adults killing other adults (as opposed to infanticide which is depressingly common in really cute species like meercats and lemurs).
So the question is what warning signs and traits do we look for when trying to distinguish whether another member of our own species is conditioned to be civilized or has had those civilized layers stripped away to reveal a creepy ape underneath? I think most people would say that it’s consistent empathy or the lack of it.
But since another unique human trait is the ability to elaborately and sustainedly dissemble (chimps do this a bit but not elaborately or sustainedly) and disguise negative character traits, it can take time and observing people in many different circumstances to catch a glimpse of what lies behind a mask. Then if we do catch a clue that someone lacks ethics and is capable of switching their empathy “off” when it suits them, the next question is how do we factor the relative risk?
I would say that the wisest thing to do is to broadly err on the side of caution. Just look at the awful statistics for domestic violence and domestic murder not to mention rates of the even more common coercive control. Consider that the financial abuse that occurs in 99% of abusive relationships is officially viewed as a form of violence due to its sometimes life-threatening effects. Consider that infidelity is the leading cause of new HIV diagnoses among women around the world and a leading cause of congenital STD infections.
Then consider how all the people harmed in these ways either never saw it coming or found it was too late to easily escape or else they would have taken measures to protect themselves. For instance, Australian studies have found that, in a whopping 40% of domestic murders, there had been no previous reports of violence though all perpetrators showed signs of coercive control.
So consider what might be some of the commonly minimized early warning signs that a partner may be so empathy impaired that they’re capable of any of the above and ask yourself how many “bullets” have to be in the chamber of a gun for you to factor that the risk of playing Russian roulette with someone is too high. 5 bullets? 3? 1? Or “zero”… because simply having a gun waved at your head is intolerable enough even if the gun turns out to be unloaded or made of licorice.
In any case, I think you just had a proverbial gun waved at your head and, even if shock and media spin that insists that infidelity is not a form of abuse is making it hard to consciously recognize it, your gut instincts will still register the risk and will go haywire.
One way or another, you just dodged a bullet whether real or merely suggested and no safe or normal individual would ever instill that kind of “near miss” trauma in another person much less a partner.
How on God’s green earth did this FW manage to keep a 13 year relationship secret? While keeping a decade long one with OW? Boggles the mind that disgusting OW! I’m sorry she was such a heinous b’:&ch to you but her punishment is coming because she’s with a FW.
Were you long distance? Did he travel a lot? I figured my FW was able to get away with it because his many OW were literal escorts and such. Any normal GF would be asking questions. Genuinely curious!
It’s definitely curious how someone can get away with a double life for a decade without at least one of the deceived parties figuring it out. I can understand how a primary partner might be fooled for that long but only when the third wheel is in cahoots and participating in the subterfuge. But both being equally deceived? I think you’re right that special circumstances have to be at play there. Either the FW travels for a living and especially skilled at juggling or else the schmoopie is particularly dumb, married herself, in it for the money so doesn’t give a rat’s ass what he does with his spare time or else is deeply detached from reality for some other reason like addiction or obsessive workaholism.
I’m a year out from D-D and separation. Divorce was final in January. I have two young kids, 3 & 7. I work full time from home. I have no family in town and they don’t call often or really want to hear about my struggles. I share 50/50 custody. This month FW is traveling for “work” 3 out of 4 weeks so I have my kids more. I’m exhausted. One just developed Croup and can’t go to school for a few days or to the sitter FW had scheduled. When I’m feeling so depleted of energy my mind goes into a dark place of loneliness and overwhelming depression. I don’t want to do anything but I have to push through. I wish for someone to comfort me. To give me a hug and tell me yes it is very hard and I’m not too sensitive. I also get really depressed about people like these in the story and my FW who like to use people. Who take advantage of any vulnerability you have. There are always things that are hard in life. How do you find people you can trust that aren’t there just on the good days? How do you know if someone really has your back or only when it benefits them or when things are easy? I wish I hadn’t lost my hope in humanity. That’s what infidelity has done.
I noticed the implication not all his work trips are really that, some probably jaunts with the OW? Mine continues with these lies even post divorce.
Push back on taking the kids extra time. He’s continuing to take advantage of you.
The ones that you can trust don’t continue any friendship with your FW and help you in bed. Ask for help. Frenemy stabbed me in the back but others showed up to help me when I asked.
My condolences to you dear letter writer
Oops I meant help you in NEED
((hugs)) to you Sunshine Day. It is very hard, even with a good husband/father, raising small children is a heavy lift. You’ve got extra weight with the FW, the betrayal, the divorce and a very early-days recovery going on all at once. Plus a full time job. I remember when my kids were that young (I was also far from family and had zero help) I was so overwhelmed I couldn’t remember what day it was or my street address when I was on the phone with someone who needed my info. Give it time, things will be alright eventually. That’s not much help I know – you need things to be alright now. But most of us on this site hear you, we have been there and made it out of the chaos, or are still in the process, making progress. Like your little one with croup, it will get better. Time. And anything that you can do to care for yourself is better than nothing that you can do. ((hugs)) again.
Going through a divorce now, so I’m right there with you in terms of despair and lost faith in humanity. People you can trust? Look for the people that when you recount joys and successes,their eyes crinkle up in happiness, and they ask a lot of genuinely curious questions so they can prolong and share in your happy news and bragging. The people who don’t immediately start talking about their joys and sadnesses.
I wish we were neighbors, I’d come over with a hug and cookies for the kids. But I have virual hugs and cookies. A wise woman once said “There are always things that are hard in life.” And now you know you can face those things head on and with courage. That is the mark of a strong woman who will generate much love and good in the world. I am rooting for you.
Dear Sunshine Day:
First off, I’ve been there raising small children on a strict budget without help and the best advice I can give regarding that is shore up your health to get through it. I would strongly recommend ditching sugar and processed foods (not easy when, at the end of every impossible day, you only have enough energy to nuke a Trader Joe’s frozen enchilada and eat it over the sink), drinking tons of filtered water and taking extra D3, magnesium, a probiotic and good multivitamin. If your kids don’t have serious health or behavior issues that require extreme nighttime vigilance, try taking natural valerian capsules and wearing earplugs and a mask at night to ensure sufficient sleep.
It does get easier with time but I remember periods when I wasn’t sure if I was going to make it to age thirty-five much less forty.
Also you wrote, “How do you find people you can trust that aren’t there just on the good days? How do you know if someone really has your back or only when it benefits them or when things are easy?”
I think the most helpful thing I did in this regard was to get politically involved in causes that addressed the things I’ve always been passionate about like environmental concerns and domestic violence survivors’ advocacy. That’s also not easy when you’re overwhelmed and there aren’t enough hours in the day but I’ve found that following deep interests and passion seems to boost energy just enough to find the space and time for a bit of involvement.
Though even movements for important humanitarian causes can attract wolves in sheep’s clothing (since predators love to play hero in public), the good news is that, while activism tends to attract the best and the worst, it’s still mostly the best.
And even if the worst types tend to be the loudest and most driven to dominate others and try to run everything, good and sincere people exist and you can often find more of them if you follow your passions and “be the change you want to see in the world.” For instance, if you get involved with local organizations trying to raise awareness and legislate against coercive control, you can simultaneously contribute to a good cause while also finding like minds who can eventually become great friends.
It does tend to make you lose hope, but it’s usually temporary from what I’ve heard reading chump stories. You’re recently divorced and you have young kids, which makes it extra stressful. It gets better in time.
The question of how you know which people have your back and which don’t is one I can’t answer. You don’t know for sure, not until they have been tested. For example, I thought my family would have my back, but some of them actually took the cheater’s side. Now I know which ones I can and can’t trust, which is valuable knowledge.
I hope you will accept a virtual hug 🤗. You are not too sensitive and being sensitive is not a bad thing anyway. You are brave and strong.
This is a terrible story, but the good news is that the OW is going to get what she deserves after treating the OP so cruelly. The FW will do it to her too. Just thinking about her bewilderment makes me smile. “What?! Does this mean I wasn’t special enough to tether his wandering whang?” The FW is going to get what he deserves because he has to inhabit the cold, loveless void that is his soul for the rest of his life.
I noticed this:
“He was aware of how my marriage ended, and provided a lot of support through that healing.”
Years ago my trusted and beloved therapist (who did workshops with Dr Frank Pittman, author of Private Lies) advised me to do one relationship at a time. To not get into another relationship until I have fully processed the one I was in. That dating while separated before a divorce is final is not a good idea. It’s too confusing. Getting into another relationship too soon is risky because I am too vulnerable, not seeing as clearly as I need to, and potentially using another person as pain medication. I need to be on my own and not distracted by a new relationship, to allow myself time to heal, time to learn, time to figure out who the heck I am, after the end of a relationship. Etc.
DDay 2017
Divorce final 2021.
I have not dated.
I have not yet sufficiently processed that relationship.
Every day I wake up, I am extremely glad I am doing this. I can be impatient but haven’t been on this and the rewards have been priceless beyond measure.
Some FW’s display their red flags. Some have red flags that are neatly folded, hidden away in a trunk in the attic. I also, like most people, have some blind spots, places where I am color-blind.
Some people are so good at lying that they fly under the radar. (Please read Dangerous Instincts by veteran FBI profiler Mary Ellen O’Toole. This invaluable book was referred to me by my PI, who is a retired FBI Special Agent and a former colleague of hers.)
Unfortunately, there is no way to affair-proof a relationship, so I need to be healed sufficiently, bedrock solid on my own, BEFORE getting involved with anyone.
Fixing my picker as best I can is essential. Fixing my LEAVER is even more essential. The more healed I am, the better chance I have to make a better choice, and the more capable I am of leaving if I see a STOP sign, or if I realize I have more healing to do which requires being on my own and not in a relationship.
Recognizing and accepting that it can happen again is a terrifying reality. I cannot, and will not take that risk unless I am sure I am 100% OK without a relationship and sufficiently healed from my MIRAGE. (I did not have a marriage. I had a MIRAGE. I was not a wife. I was a hostage.)
I remember a psychotherapist saying, “I wish I had a nickel for every person who married their affair partner and found they recreated what they had in their marriage.”
If your legs are broken, make sure your legs are healed before you start running again.
Give yourself the gift of time to heal sufficiently before you run the marathon.
You can’t always see the wolf under the sheep’s clothing and it sounds like our writer’s wolf had a very good disguise. My best, and only, defense is to make sure I am in the best shape possible to get away as quickly as I can if I see a wolf.
❤️
DND, I am very sorry. Big hug to you and I’m glad you are here.
I was Bernie Madoffed. 27 years with Mr Nice Guy. The Nice Guys/Gals who have secret double lives are the ones that scare me the most. The ones that f**k with your sanity and ability to trust yourself the most. The mindf**k is off the charts.
I did notice this:
“He was aware of how my marriage ended, and provided a lot of support through that healing.”
So, not healed before engaging, is that correct?
Years ago my trusted and beloved therapist (who did workshops with Dr Frank Pittman, author of Private Lies) advised me to do one relationship at a time. To not get into another relationship until I have fully processed the one I was in. That dating while separated before a divorce is final is not a good idea. It’s too confusing. Getting into another relationship too soon is risky because I am too vulnerable, not seeing as clearly as I need to yet, and potentially using another person as pain medication. I need to be on my own and not distracted by a new relationship, to allow myself time to heal, time to learn, time to figure out who the heck I am, after the end of a relationship. Etc.
DDay 2017
Divorce final 2021.
I have not yet dated.
I have not yet sufficiently processed the relationship.
Every day I wake up, I am extremely glad I am doing this. I can be impatient but haven’t been on this and the rewards have been priceless beyond measure.
Some FW’s display their red flags. Some have red flags that are neatly folded, hidden away in a trunk in the attic. I also, like most people, have some blind spots, places where I am color-blind.
Some people are so good at lying that they fly under the radar. (Please read Dangerous Instincts by veteran FBI profiler Mary Ellen O’Toole. This invaluable book was referred to me by my PI, who is a retired FBI Special Agent and a former colleague of hers.)
Unfortunately, there is no way to affair-proof a relationship, so I need to be healed sufficiently, bedrock solid on my own, before getting involved with anyone. I’m not there yet. I don’t have any idea when I will be.
Fixing my picker as best I can is essential. Fixing my LEAVER is even more essential. The more healed I am, the better chance I have to make a better choice, and the more capable I am of leaving if I see a STOP sign, or if I realize I have more healing to do which requires being on my own and not in a relationship.
And STILL, all the footwork and due diligence and precautions and time and healing and research and background checks and therapy will not 100% guarantee that I will never have this experience ever again. Control of another person will never be possible. Nor will people ever have trailers like movies so I can preview what I am getting into.
I want to think there is something I can do to prevent it, but there will always be risk. I can minimize it but it not eliminate it. So I need to be strong enough on my own to assume it.
Recognizing and accepting that it can happen again is a terrifying reality. I cannot, and will not take that risk unless I am sure I am 100% OK without a relationship and sufficiently healed from my MIRAGE. (I did not have a marriage. I had a MIRAGE. I was not a wife. I was a hostage.)
I have to be as strong by myself as possible.
If your legs are broken, make sure your legs are healed before you start running again.
Give yourself the gift of time to heal sufficiently before you run the marathon.
You can’t always see the wolf under the sheep’s clothing and it sounds like DND’s wolf had a bespoke sheep suit from Savile Row. The best I can do is to make sure I am in the best shape possible to get away as quickly as I can if I see a wolf.
“Nor will people ever have trailers like movies so I can preview what I am getting into.”
If only!! 🎥