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Dear Chump Lady, I’m the OW and I’m terrified he will cheat on me

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Dear Chump Lady,

I am probably the biggest chump of all, but here goes…  I was married for 21 years and had an affair (the only one) with a married man I work with, who had been married for 17 years. 

He said I’m number 8 for him. He told me about all of them — even about sleeping with his wife’s best friend (who also happens to be his best friend’s wife and neighbor). My naiveté made me believe that it was a one time thing. He told me it went on for 15 years! I can’t even begin to wrap my head around that, but I am still with him. 

He also told me he went to a strip club when he was away for work for a month and picked up a stripper — also that she stayed with him the entire time he was there. We both divorced our spouses and are living together, but as you can probably guess it’s not good. I obviously don’t trust him and a lot of times can’t stop thinking about his past. It makes me want to vomit. I am terrified he will cheat on me — he said he won’t of course. AM I THE BIGGEST CHUMP OF ALL?

DB

Dear DB,

No. You’re not a chump at all. You’re the victor in the fuckwit Thunderdome. You’ve beat out the competition and won the sparkly turd, DB. No tag backs. He’s all yours.

If Chump Nation wonders why I run these OW letters (which invariably devolve into troll fests) consider them a public service announcement — this is what winning the Pick Me Dance looks like.

The obvious but nauseating realization that you’re not special? Check.

Twitchy, mind-bending hypervigilance? Check.

Living together (presumably between strippers), clinging to the facade of your shitty relationship, to prove that annihilating two families was worth it? Check.

DB, I’m sorry. You competed for this Dreamboat with the full knowledge of who he is. Regretting your decision doesn’t make you a chump.

Perhaps you think being a chump means making stupid relationship decisions. Or having the kind of piss poor self-esteem that allows a person to tolerate fuckwits. Let’s be clear on the concept. Chumps are UNKNOWING. They are duped, lied to, humiliated, used, conspired against, conned. You are none of those things. You knew exactly what you were getting — a cheater. You’re a cheater. He’s a cheater. You aren’t us. Chumps are acted UPON, they are not the actors. Chumps do not consent to be chumps. You, on the other hand, signed up for this shit.

Ergo — you are not the victim here. You’re Number 8. One idiot in a long line of idiots.

So now you’re terrified that he’ll do to you what you were complicit in doing to another? And you want MY sympathy? Who the fuck do you think you are?

Look, I’m an actual chump, so part of me feels bad ripping you to shreds for reaching out to me. You has a sadz and maybe I can help. But then I bitchslap myself, because post-infidelity Tracy has zero tolerance for your kind of malignant entitlement.

Entitlement? Yeah, the kind of chutzpah that writes “I had an affair (the only one)…” You want a bitch cookie? Tell it to the guy who lost 21 years of his life to a cheater (YOU). You’re scared shitless that Mr. Wonderful MIGHT do to you what you actually DID to your ex-husband. Meditate on that.

Or how about the entitlement that led you to fuck a married co-worker? Did you consider his chump wife? Let me guess — she didn’t Sufficiently Appreciate Him. Compelled him to fuck those strippers and her best friend, huh? She must’ve deserved it. Unlike YOU there Sparkletwat. Best of luck with all your super specialness. Hope it serves as a magic barrier against STDs.

DB, it takes some gobsmacking gall to come on a support site for chumps when you’re the OW. I’m sorry that merely thinking of being betrayed makes you “want to vomit.” (Actually betraying chumps, however, must be just tickety boo.) How hard it is to be you.

I’d hate for your visit to Chump Nation to be for naught, as you wanted advice and all, so here’s some:

Regular pap smears.

Good luck.

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Ask Chump Lady

Got a question for the Chump Lady? Or a submission for the Universal Bullshit Translator? Write to me at info@chumplady.com. Read more about submission guidelines.
  • The good news here is that mature grown ups don’t have to stay in relationships when we don’t want to. Part of me hopes you cheat on this new guy, he deserves it. Then again he probably won’t care too much because cheaters don’t seem to get too attached to those around them. Good luck with that.

    • I don’t know. This one seems pretty attached. Or maybe she is just sensing that she might be losing her douchebag winner crown to a new rival.

      • Maybe she thought this was true love. It’s ok to lie and cheat for love, right? Now she has her sparkly turd.

        • Has no one else done the math? He started cheating on his wife after just TWO YEARS OF MARRIAGE. That’s when everything is still supposed to be sunshine and roses. You really think he’s going to be faithful with the devastation of two households imploding?

          • mine cheated on me before our 1st anniversary….before he even let me buy him a wedding ring….I’m sure that SPARKLETWAT HATED seeing that ring on him….who am I kidding he took it off. {forehead smack}

            • Mine started cheating on me a year before we got married and continued the affair for 6 years until I found out. They’re still together.

              • Ohhhh I hope they are together. She has 5 kids and he was ready to be done w kids. Let us only hope karma gets him

      • She’s not attached to him, she’s attached to the idea of being special. Suddenly she might not be so special after all! The horror! She’lol fling herself after the next man who makes her feel special and blame it all on her cheating ex for treating her so badly. Pity party at 9:00. Stay tuned:

    • I don’t know how she does it- she nails it every time. This is just the most spot-on response.

      Tracy, you’re awesome. Thank you.

    • I REALLY needed to read this response today from chump lady! I am in tears of laughter!! “sparkle twat”. OMG!
      But this person asking the questions is seriously asking for it with that letter on this site 😉

    • The funny thing is that final OW is a yoga instructor and on her 5 or so yoga FB pahes she aaaaaalways posts things like corny sayings and pics about karma…

      Doesnt she get that if karma would be real it would NOT be a good thing for her?? Like this letter shows how they might really be oblivious about what their actions inflict.

      • OMG! My ex’s Skank Ho posted all about KARMA! WTF? She didn’t get it? She fancied herself SO full of Karma Co existence crap. So wise—– Yuk

        • hehe yes same thing!!!! she calls herself spiritual and a yogi and lots of stupid yoga peace whatthefuckever talk… i still hate her but in a way i can kinda sorta laugh about how fucking stupid she is, so i guess thats progress…

          hey they are kina like jesus cheaters!!! same thing, sooo spiritual, enlighted and above all of us LOL

      • My X actually named his new cat Karma. I feel sorry for it though. He never really liked cats, and apparently treats this one pretty badly.

        • May your cheater’s cat Karma be related to my cat.
          This of you here long enough to have read about my cat know that’s pretty much a threat to your cheater.

        • Thankful If your x treats the poor cat badly, report him to animal rescue or find it a better Home.

          Cheater doesn’t deserve a wonderful loving pet

          F—k him!

      • My cheater X had a best friend whose wife was cheating on him. It was so F’d up: My cheater X was giving his best friend advice on how to handle his cheating wife. Cheater X even had the audacity to ask ME if I would speak to the cheating wife, you know, to try and figure out what was going on with her. I told Cheater X, “why don’t YOU talk with her, you’re the one cheating, you of all people should understand what’s going on with her”. It’s absolutely mind blowing how detached and unaware these narcs are. They each think of themselves as having unique and exceptional circumstances… they’re not cheaters… they’re special.

        • So my husband had this work friend who he would occasionally hang out with. He had a pretty wife and three small children. Pretty wife was an ex addicted and ended up spiraling down into pills really bad. She wrecked their finances, totaled their car, got arrested and sent to rehab out of state where she cheated on work friend with a number of junkies.

          My husband would come home and tell me all the gossip, play by play how their relationship was crumbling because work friend’s wife was a cheater, was a junky, work friend deserved better and he’s broke and falling apart and….

          The entire time he was calling friend’s wife a junkie whore, my husband had a pill addiction and was in a long term affair with a different little work friend.

        • Oh yeah so true. My liar in chief listened to everyone elses sad marriage probs . Taking time to recant every detail so it would sound like he was some sort of guru for counseling. .. unfortunately for me he was already planning his escape from our “bad” marriage. ..but didnt think to tell me …. i think this is their opportunity to get the script.

  • Dear Tracey SLAM DUNK !!! Reading your response makes me feel elated thank you for speaking up for us true chumps 😘😘😘

    • Fuckwit thunderdome..loving it! Your colorful use of my favorite cuss words make me think you are from my block back home for real..thank you so much..made my day

  • “Malignant entitlement” oh, ChumpLady, you stellar wordsmith, you!
    And, thanks, DB, but this is neither your tribe nor your safe zone. You are persona non grata, here, where actual honest people are lifted out of and away from your cooterstench. Reap on! Don’t let the screendoor hit ya where the good lord split ya.

    • Cooterstench!!! Help! My belly is hurting!

      Love it, Diva!

      Too bad I hadn’t met you in my pre-D-Day days, when chumpy me actually noted to cheater that his breath smelled different and joked scientifically about its origin, that he had received a transplant of some foreign vaginal microbiota.
      Cheater was really miffed about that joke, he pouted around the whole day.

      So it’s really called cooterstench HA!

      My word! The terms I learn here at Chump Nation. Malignant entitlement. Cooterstench.

      And thinking scientifically, since this DB creature is number 8 she probably has LOTS of microbial mixing going on that does make for a pretty good stench.

      Regular Pap smears are indeed in order. Very kind of Chump Lady, DB, take her good advice for the good of Public Health.

      • There was a thread not long ago when so many checked in about the cheater smell changing dramatically while cheating. I experienced this myself when my cheater’s nreath smelled like ammonia or acetone…it made me sick to mu stomach! Worst in bed at night. I think it’s promal warning systems, personally.
        Cooterstench just came to me as I read DB8’s letter. CN is an inspiring environment!

        • Mine completely smelled different! His truck smelled like her also! (His excuse was his buddy wears too much cologne) I could smell Her disgusting whore perfume smell a mile away. His clothes made my clothes smell like her if I washed them together. My son’s clothes smelled like her Skank smell when I washed them together. EWW YUCK—– So now with time having passed, when my son brings his stuff back from staying with Dad, even though Dad does not live with her, I still know the smell and it is still there— but I am over it. It just is what it is. It might be certain cleaners she introduced him too, her doing his laundry, lotions she infects his space with from rubbing off on things—stuff like that brought into the mix because I can’t imagine just perfume permeating things like that.

  • This is all about character isn’t it.
    DB thinks it’s alright to cheat because she did, so she knows her current man ( a serial cheater ) will do it again. She knows you can’t trust what cheaters say because they lie ( she did to her husband too ) so she knows her cheater man is lying.
    Tough shit as they say. Karma. Consequences. Perfect.

    • Yeah, but their cheating was all different and special and stuff because reasons and what not.

      She deserves every second of this emotional hell, which she brought upon herself.

      • “Yeah, but their cheating was all different and special and stuff because reasons and what not.”

        BAHAHA You made my day, Nanki Poo!

  • Standing ovation to you CL! My advice to DB? Enjoy that bed you made of lies and deceit and destruction of family and friends because you’ve earned the disrespect of CN that comes with it. My 32 years of marriage was blown apart by someone who was an employee who serviced the father of my children while attending family functions at my house . She just smiled while they skimmed off money for their double life. DB, you go live like chumps do: get tested for STDs, sit in the dark so you can pay electricity, comfort your children about the loss of their family unit , put on a happy face for your grandchildren when they ask why gramma had to move , endure the pain and exhaustion of grief work. Yup, good times curtesy of OW. Go pound sand .

    • Hey, that OW sounds awfully familiar. They “skimmed off” thousands upon thousands together: house, furniture, antiques, art, private chef, wine collection, you name it. But if I bought clothes for the kiddos or supplies for their team parties? Why, it was all, “Cashmere is so irresponsible with money.” Yup. That spending on the actual family sure does interfere with the double life. Once, I took some of my own paltry bit of money and popped it into DS’s checking so he could have a little extra spending money in college. Got an *immediate* complaint call from the fuckwit. After that, I sent the kid cash. Sheesh, yeah. Begrudge the college kid pizza and gas, but go crazy with those dinners prepared by a private chef. Sigh.

      So glad to be living a life free of that disorder. #blessed.

  • In a similar vein, a Switzerland poseur, a medical professional I have had to see regularly this summer is creeping me out. When I shared about my very recent separation & the reason, his comment was. “Well, you know us men…” trailing back off into the nothingness from which such drivel comes. Red flag! That was 2 or 3 visits ago. Now I think he’s trying to hit on me, and even scheduled extra appointments that don’t seem necessary now. Really???!! Ugh! Why in God’s name would I ever switch roles to become the skank I despise? It appears he’s JAFC (Just Another Fucking Cheater) who thinks he can take advantage of a chump. So glad I don’t think like them!
    Tracy, you provide so much to us of CN:
    ~ sane, salty guidance that empowers us
    ~ safe haven from a culture that no longer rejects narc perpetrators and often even blames Chumps for cheaters’ cheating
    ~ clear, consistent boundaries & how to create/maintain/defend our own!
    ~ excellent education & references about cheater/narc habits, justifications, tells, patterns to help us spot the signs
    ~ a great example of post-chump devastation & recovery in reclaiming list selves/places/experiences with joy!
    ~ courage to call abuse and torure by their actual names, thereby validating our pain, opening the way to
    ~ fuckwits, fucktards, so many f bomb delights!

    Thank you, Tracy. You’ve saved my chumpy life!

    • What BS. Only cheaters cheat. Not all men are douchebags, just those who rationalize their magic members’ naughty habits.

      • Yep. This. I know women outnumber men on this site, but the statistics show that men and women cheat at about the same rate, with men nudging a bit ahead of the women.

        There loads of non-cheating men (and women!) out there. Once we’ve lost our cheater and start gaining our lives, we just need to fix our pickers so we don’t become attracted to the same people we just ditched.

        I, for one, will never forget meeting one of my neighbors, a 92-year-old man who walks 2 miles each day when the weather permits (i.e. not slippery). He’s lost a lot of his hearing, but he told me that he’s been married to his wife for 72 years (yep, she’s alive), saying, “We suit each other!”

        What a great reminder that love and marriage can stand up to time!

    • Can you see a different medical professional or are you stuck with this one due to availability and/or insurance/other? If he is creeping you out it might be time to avoid him if at all possible.

    • YIKES LongingforMeh-Ca!!! It sounds like my STBX might be your doctor! (Do you live in NV — be careful…). 😉

    • Tell that “well you know us men” to all the men who have been cheated on by their whore wives—- For every cheating man there is a either cheating woman or a woman who knows she is with a cheater. I have a non cheating Dad who has been married to my Mom for 72 years, and four non-cheating brothers (one who was cheated on by his first wife). All non-cheating nephews as well (so far—-time will tell, I probably shouldn’t be too confident on the 100% track record 🙂

  • OMG, love the troll vomiting up a rainbow!

    As has been said here before: “the best gift you can give a cheater is another cheater.” This letter is such a great illustration of why chumps shouldn’t fret over how “wonderful” Mr. and Mrs. Cheater McCheaterson’s new lives are (according to Facebook of course). This is what they live with every day and really who could ask for Karma more sweet than that?

    I found out my ex married the OW after we divorced. This was after a 3 year attempt at wreckconciliation which in retrospect makes that attempt even more wrecked. Anyway the news of their blessed nuptials had an odd effect on me. A sense of calm and serenity washed over me as I began to imagine what it would be like to be discarded after my ex decided to “work things out” with me and then have him run back when I told him I wanted a divorce. My ex was never thrilled that she went back to her husband during our wreckconciliation because I guess he thought she should hang around, pine over him and remain celibate until he threw her another crumb. Cue a lifetime of pick me dancing.

    Romantic isn’t it? I guess my advice to all OW/OM is good luck with that!

    • Cheaterssuck

      I won’t have to worry about my STBX coming back because not only did I write the OW a letter letting her know what she has, but I decided to include her parents and let them know what she is shacking up with. He is narcissit that mindfucked me for five years. When will this pain go away??? The OW is posting pictures on Facebook.

      • He was so pissed that I wrote the letter to her parents that he texted me and said, it is over. Then he said, he was done with me as well. I’m not going to be second best.

        • Now the XMW who is now the OW can live with the pictures in her mind when my STBX was having sex with me and the OW, not to mention constantly worrying if he will cheat again. But hey let’s just say the asshole will never respect or love you because he is a narcissit

  • My deadcheaters OW thought herself a Chump too, from what I gathered. Her boyfriend/fiance cheated on her then she took up with my husband who was supposedly “fair game” since our marriage was “already over”.

    Funny how one would still have to sneak around and lie to hide a relationship if a marriage were “already over”. Oh yea, we still LIVED TOGETHER AS A FAMILY….husband/wife in same bed, 3 kids with lunch boxes and stuff, family dog and minivan…you know the stuff of suburban marriage and family.

    But somehow I deserved for them to lie to me to extend business trips so that they could fuck in hotel rooms paid for my the US Government and her employer while I drove his son named after his father to hockey.

    She was no Chump, she was a selfish shrew liar.

    • Oh, yes, the “They weren’t REALLY married, they just acted like they were.” How well I know that bullshit, because that was OW’s mantra to all who would listen, and many did. It sure was news to me all those times we were laying in bed sharing our dreams for the future, raising kids, cooking, laughing, crying, burying loved ones, watching our lives unfold together, you know, like married people do.

      “My” OW was also married and this letter could have been written by her (except my X wasn’t as gross as this guy). What she doesn’t want to admit is that she chumped herself! She is where she is because of the decisions she has made. She is not the victim, but instead, went into this with her “eyes wide shut.” She saw precisely what she wanted to see because it enabled her to fuck over the people who loved her. After all, doesn’t true love prevail?

      I do have some advice for her, though. Run, run as fast as you can. Leave this guy immediately! Your misery is only beginning. Fuck with you, fuck on you. Stem the blood flow now. Admit that you have hurt many, many innocent people. Apologize, but do not expect that anyone will believe a word you say. Look inside yourself to see why you are so damaged that you think it is morally permissible to intentionally hurt other people to satisfy your own selfish whims. Know better, do better.

      Do I expect this LW to follow my advice? No, because it has been my experience that people like her are unable to admit that they bear any responsibility for the damage they have caused. Lacking insight into how their own conduct has contributed to their situation, such people constantly look for someone else to blame. This lack of insight will keep this woman, and others like her, locked in a cycle of deflection, denial and victimization. The keys to unlock the door of her self-imposed anxiety are in her hands. She is the only one who can use them. But if she thinks for one second that the cheater she has thrown all away for will ever change, she is delusional.

    • Ex’s Schmoopie was cheated on by her ex husband. I guess he told me that so I would have sympathy for her. It actually just made me hate her more. She knew exactly how much pain she was putting me through. She also knew I still loved him and wanted to reconcile, but she still went out of her way to “win” him because she decided she was special and deserved love more than I did. I can only hope she someday gets the kind of Karma this woman is getting. I don’t know if he will cheat on her or not (right now he is still starry eyed over her), but he still isn’t going to be happy and she will still have to deal with living with a man who is perpetually dissatisfied with life, even if he isn’t blaming her for it. That tends to bring you down after a while. Also, he still has just enough feelings for me that it will drive her crazy even if he has clearly chosen her and there is no chance of us getting back together again. It will be a constant reminder of what she destroyed and she will always have to fret over whether or not she was really worth it and if he might regret it someday.

      I would also settle for her cheating on and leaving ex so that he gets hit with the Karma bus. Then maybe he can find some new woman (after a few months of IC) who I might actually like and with whom I can be friends. That’s my fantasy.

      • I feel the same way. I can’t fathom even saying hello to the affair partner turned husband. He represents everything my ex and I (I thought) were trying to raise our 3 boys to reject in their lives. I secretly hope the day comes where their quicksand fake lives collapse under it’s own weight and she has to do the work of finding a legitimate partner who isn’t made of glitter covered diarrhea. I might shake that guys hand. Until then I’ll just keep explaining to my boys that no, their soul mate will never be someone else’s spouse.

        • I love this version of a sparkly turd – glitter-covered diarrhoea! No need to be friendly with that man, and I feel the pain of having him in your boys’ life. At least mine rarely have to see their former music teacher / now stepmother. They have zero respect for her and consider her an idiot.

      • Yes, Nowdeadcheater one time REALLY tried to drive home the idea that I should have compassion for the OW because “She was CHEATED ON!!” completely ignoring the cheating-on which he did to create the cluster-fuck we were in.

        What I really wish I would have done is to have waited just until OW was married and pregnant then (acting like I had no idea of OWs circumstances) tell NDC that I really tried at our wreckonciliation but I just couldnt make a go of it and he was free to go do whatever.

    • According to my STBX’s spin our marriage had been over for years. My son called STBX a liar and faker, so now he’s rationalized faking happiness during our “marital troubles” so that the kids, family, and friends wouldn’t know what was going on. He’s conveniently forgotten that he didn’t let me in on our troubles!

      We’re still married. No paperwork in progress. He’s shacking up with his “friend”. Totally upset about being shunned by his children, and just cannot fathom why they aren’t happy with him. The tales he’s spinning of what he’d like the history books to read just aren’t working for them.

      I suspect that he’ll stay with her until she’s figured out how much of a dud he really is.

    • unicorn-
      My stbxh loved that phrase to, “all ready separated.” He would try to justify the hidden relationships that intermingled with his attempts to gain me back and “reconcile our family.”
      No. No. No. No.
      You don’t hide things (or relationships) that you are proud of.

  • DB

    You believe it’s eight? Try double or triple that number. Imagine the devience it takes to have a fifteen year affair on an unsuspecting loyal spouse.

    Your remorse (karma) isn’t for the families the two of you blew up. It’s the realization you earned what you’re stuck with. And I wonder if you were the one that took part in the fifteen year affair. My chunky feelers think ‘yes’.

    A number. That’s what you are feeling right now. Your math needs a touch up. Keep him close. You earne every last ounce of pairing up with a serial cheater.

    • “A hole is a hole is a hole” to quote Patti Stanger, a real classy broad.

      You’re one of many

  • Hey #8, he cheated on his wife with his best friend’s wife for FIFTEEN YEARS and you wonder whether he’s cheating on you? Eighth in a line of fuck buddies? Hahahaha. You really are a special kind of stupid, aren’t you? I hope that if you’re collecting any spousal support from your ex (AKA actual Chump) he can get the order terminated on the grounds that you are cohabiting with your partner in crime. Now that would be some Karma!

  • I thought maybe db’s letter would give some insight into stbx’s whore but instead it made me realize there is nothing worthwhile there. DB doesn’t mention any regret over the cheating and discard of her x. The only concern is her and keeping her sparkly turd.

    After whore’s deposition, I thought why would Stbx make her go through that and why would she put up with that? All he would have to do is say: yes I had an affair and there would have been no need for that. Yes, they partner’s in crime and looking out only for themselves.

    She is his sparkly turd too. Inevitably, the sparkle will probably wear off of one or both and then it will be time to go after a new one. In the meantime, they can revel in a shallow relationship full of new and fresh sex (until it isn’t)

    • He put her through that for the same reason he is putting you through a high conflict divorce. People have no real value to him.

      • “People have no real value to him.” Simple but profound. Thanks for that!

        It also shows his power over her and that she will do anything for him. You can be sure there is no reciprocity there>

    • Feelingit,

      Why would he make her go through the deposition you ask ?? DRAMA and lots of it is like sweet sweet candy to a Narc. His new schmoopie is having to fight for her love of him–how wonderful is that ?? Also seeing her testimony causing you pain is sweet for him because you deserve to suffer because of all the things that you did to him..he can’t say exact what “things” but “things” and you made him unhappy (actual statement by my ex during the divorce).

      • He can’t say exactly what things you did to make him unhappy but you did things. The same bs I got LGator!

        I wonder if current ho-wife’s suddenly frequent travels and night-time absences (as reported by my kids) are making him unhappy now. 😉

  • It seems like cheaters think in their brain that they are a victim of something. I guess it helps them to rationalize their cheating. My cheater wife has proclaimed over and over “Yeah I cheated but I’m not a bad person !” Originally I thought she was trying to convince ME, now I think she is trying to convince HERSELF.

    • I know. NiceGuy now wears a tan shirt, proclaims the BoyScout oath infront of many. See??? He’s not a BadGuy nor a Hypocrite even though he continues with his strippers, escorts, porn and new targets!

    • It’s funny you say that, my stbx and his ow both constantly say they aren’t bad people, who are you trying to convince the general public or yourselves?? We all know you both suck, no matter how many times you try to dress a llama as a bunny that llama is still a llama( they are bad people no matter how many times they say they aren’t) cant reason with the disordered and in denials.

    • @Zell said It seems like cheaters think in their brain that they are a victim of something.

      When I retained my lawyer, she told me that 1) a year after the divorce, I’d be so much better off than I was at that time, and 2) that no matter that CheaterX was the one who blew up the marriage with his cheating, he’d see himself as the victim.

      Both statements turned out to be true.

      • See my entry from a few days ago about KK’s narrative that was posted with her lingerie pics. It’s all “I’m the victim of a bad situation, but I’m overcoming it and flourishing as a result — and here are my escort service pics to prove it.”

        It’s part and parcel of their high placement on the narcissism scale. Everything, EVERYTHING, is about them.

    • Yup, my X’s last written line to me was , one year after the divorce, was “I’m not as bad a person as you think I am.”

      He’s actually worse than I thought at the time as the full story of his perfidy is now know.

      • My ex did the same thing! I told him he was a liar and his response was, “That is your opinion and not the truth”. He really thinks that he is at no fault!!

        • Mine said “I can’t believe you think I’m that kind of guy!”

          Umm. . .I can’t believe you DON’T think you’re ‘that kind of guy'”. This is what scares me the most. If he can spackle over his own behavior, what else is he capable of?

          Truly chilling. Does anyone else feel this way? By all outward accounts he seems harmless. Kind, even. But last year when his dad died, he changed.

          Before CN I would have called it grief. Now I see the crazy goes way beyond the temporary irrationally that comes with grieving.

          He was the same guy all along. When his dad died his mask slipped and I got a glimpse of his true self. And I am afraid. I am not afraid for my immediate safety so I am lining up my ducks very carefully. Also I have the beginnings of a safety plan.

          Anyhow, even though I do not have evidence of him cheating, I feel this little germ of fear, and it grows every day. Thanks to CL I recognized the emotional abuse and gaslighting. I learned about spackling and stopped doing it for the most part. Boy, the truth hurts.

          Anyway, I have not told any mutual friends or family that I am afraid of him. I sound like a crazy person because I don’t have proof of anything he has done. I believe in my gut (thank you CN) but my family sure won’t.

          All I know is, once I file I need to take the kids to an undisclosed location.

          Has anyone been through this? How do you know when it is safe to go back?

          • It may never be safe to go back to where he can find you and the kids. If he’s acting scary enough or your gut is telling you he is dangerous enough for you to ask that question, I think you have your answer. There ARE sick freaks out there who will harm their own flesh and blood just to make you pay for crossing them. Please be careful!

      • I am so sorry you had to go through that, nomar. There are few things in this world more disgusting than someone using religion as a perfect cover for their image management.

        I usually don’t judge another’s spiritual state but I sure will in this case!

        I have felt spiritual conviction in my life and believe me, it takes you low, low, low. If he is not showing real sorrow toward you ( as in being grateful to lick the gravel upon which you tread) I am VERY suspicious of his devout Christianity.

        Jackassery, all of it. Appallingly Disgusting.

  • Whoops… submitted before I was done!

    #8, you won’t get sympathy here. They only hope for redemption youve got now, is to get right with Jesus. Leave the Grand Prize of Sparkle Turd, pick up the pieces of your life, embrace a life of celibacy, and buy a plant. If you can keep it alive for 3 years, maybe you can get a cat.

    You need to turn your pathetic excuse for a life, to a different direction that does not include any human being who might depend on you too much. You’ve got you, babe, so work on that.

    • Golden. “Buy a plant and if alive in 3 yrs get a cat”. Love this. Chumpland, so funny. CL so nice to just have a good ole belly laugh at some of these retorts, you go fellow chumps. I wish I could be creative but I can only say what I say to my STBX.” you are an idiot and I am so glad I am not you.” I mean the level of stupidity that one has to do these things to their families is not something we chumps can understand. So thanks #8 for giving us clear vision into this other worldly thinking. in this case, forgiveness for STBX behavior will have to come from God cuz I got nothing right now but resentment and it is not eating me up it is driving me to fight for my rights. Power on fellow chumps!

  • Put two SparkleTurds in a blender and what do you get? This.

    Lest we Chumps ever doubt what’s really at the end of a SparkleTurd’s rainbow. It’s this lovely pot of Sparkleturd Smoothie right here.

  • Hi 8.
    You probably have nothing to worry about. After all those years of his serial cheating, you and your
    “Magic Vagina” have surely put him on the straight and narrow.

    What comes around, goes around, and a lot of it grows
    on those stripper poles. Good luck to you, you surely won the prize.

  • ok, gotta be honest here, I kinda get a sadistic kick out of the OW/OM trolls that come here. I do enjoy the absolute stupidity of these special, entitled beings trying to pass themselves off as chumps. Explaining how they are special and how they hurt oh so very much.

    Watching CN rip them a new one is actually quite satisfying. It’s like getting the chance to tell your ex and his special whore off without breaking no contact/ gray rock. Their special brand of stupidity in coming here is really quite amusing when you think about it. So like our exes justifying their behavior, they have no clue about boundaries or what real humans would do.

    Rock on CN, keep evisterating the trolls and then go have a good laugh at their stupidity and entitlement. They are nothing to us.

  • I don’t like to pile on, but I’m so glad Chump Lady went int the direction she did with this one. For a second I thought it was going to end with tea and sympathy. You can be stupid, but being stupid and arrogant is an unforgivable combination. The arrogance comes in the “exception” belief. All along she was convinced she was the exception. That’s some grade A arrogance.

  • Dear DB,

    I represent your ex-husband because he is “My People.” He and I should have coffee sometime and exchange war stories about our shitty, cheating ex-wives.

    Just wanted to let you know that while you are knee deep in your constant worries about Dick Tracy, your ex is slowly putting his life together watching his black eyes heal every day.

    Do you know how exciting it is to meet a wonderful woman who loves your every ounce of positive and negative qualities? The fireworks, sweet text messages, dry meatloaf, messy morning hair….everything that is the greatest feeling of being in a true, loving relationship.

    Well, I do….and so will your ex-husband. He just doesn’t know it yet. And when he does, he will be thankful you were a piece of dogshit and left. You gave him the Golden Ticket to heaven on earth. He just doesn’t know it yet.

    Thank you very much for being a Douchebag. You put a wonderful man back on the market for all the wonderful women in the world.

      • My Brother…keep going. That tick may have sucked all the blood from you, but YOU get to control YOU now! The future is YOURS….go take it! Go bundgy jump this weekend…skydive…serve a meal at a shelter…college football game….take some snacks to a fire department at midnight….whatever. Start doing stuff, just stuff.

        • My NewFaithfulHusband was dumped by his first wife because GreenerGrassoverthere. Mr GreenGrass eventually got a restraining order against her. Much later she remarried to a guy who seems a decent fellow but he has to deal with SheWhoRulesWithIronFist.

          We see them very seldom, but NFH looks at this guy with sincere pity.

      • Me too. 🙁 I’m embarrassed and feel so stupid for falling for all his lies and manipulation. 🙁 Over and over again he made me doubt my intuition or even things I uncovered. And at the end, he blamed me for everything and it took Chump Lady and Chump Nation to tell me it was him and not me!

          • Thanks, Doingme. I just wish I could go back in time and slap Young Martha and tell her to “Wake up! Trust you gut! Run!!” But I can’t and now I have to live with all that I put up with. How I abandoned myself and didn’t take care of myself by leaving a man like this. It sure would be nice to have a Do Over with all the knowledge we have now. 🙂

        • Take heart, Martha. They are sicker than we are smart.
          They are also VERY good at what they do.
          My well-respected college professor encouraged me to marry my narc. This prof worked on Capitol Hill for 20 years. He has an excellent BS detector. But my narc fooled him!
          When I think of it like that, I don’t feel embarrassed anymore.

          • BTL, they sure are good at what they do (lying and cheating)! I’ve have read over and over again that they can even fool therapists, etc. My ex has so many people fooled and they believe whatever stories he’s been pedaling for I don’t know how many years. I honestly don’t know how he can look at himself in a mirror, but I’ve read they don’t have a conscience, so I guess that means he doesn’t feel bad about anything. Pretty scary that there are so many people out their like them.

    • SuperDuperChump

      I will take this and change the he for she!! I needed to read this! Thank you stbx for placing me back on the market!! I look forward to the dry meatloaf and messy morning hair with a man worthy enough to be with me!😁

      • The burnt pork chops weren’t my fault….Texas Tech went into overtime and I forgot about them until the smoke detector went off…..but, she just laughed it off while we were eating at Sonic.

        Damn those Red Raiders!!! It was their fault!!!

      • My Dear….no number needed. He will appear when you least expect it.

        Before long, you will get to be “that bitch who got ‘Just Because’ flowers at work today.”

        • Lordy I hope so, thanks for reminding me that the sparkly ones are shit and the good ones will come quietly….and permanently…

    • Boom! Preach, homie! I told my ex that even though my new love is superior in nearly every way, I would never have traded in my vows or family for the upgrade. I thanked her for doing it for me. Sometimes nice guys do finish first…

    • yes, this is what happened to me, he left and tried to destroy me but I slowly bounced back and am continuing to gain momentum, the cheaters, they just have complicated lives and strained relationships, i got my freedom and the opportunity to experience actual love

  • After my ex ran off with the Skank she was with him (for the money I suspect) for 3 years before she cheated on him. I heard from a friend many years later that she had to leave him because “she was afraid he would kill her as he was violent”! Ha, bloody ha. If only you had cared to ask before you started fucking my husband I could have showed you the domestic violence conviction I have against him! I also know for a fact that despite his earning eight times what she did, he was forever asking to borrow money because he was “just a little short this month”! Who’s laughing now Skank?

  • Thank u for posting this. I do relate to a lot of this woman’s anxiety about the situation. I knew my cheater had problems in the past, I had gut intuitions on how he treated women, bounced from relationship to relationship. But he was in AA and I assumed that when he settled with me and said he loved me that that somehow he had worked on himself and was prepared to have a relationship. Bc he told me he didn’t love those women. He LOVED ME. Needless to say my anxiety of his past would come up now and again. I would question how he treated me, disrespected me around women, disappeared at times. But it always got turned around on MY defects MY flaws and my relationship ridiculousness. It was always a fight and I would apologize. But the truth is his double life continued. The blatant lies to my face. The letting me think I was crazy. Allowing me to go on medication. Being mad at me and frustrated when questioned. Disrespecting me to everyone and isolating me. Letting me think that we loved each other and trash talking me to people. Checking out of the relationship long before I knew…
    This is a person incapable of true intimacy, who will live in a loneliness hell, who wants to do image and damage control so people won’t see he’s rotten on the inside. He’s so fucking charming, funny, popular, friendly, helpful. But that is his candy coating. He is a rotting pile of bile refuse shit and decayed pig flesh underneath. I just need to keep reminding myself of that

    • Wow I just read my post and I sound like I’m backing her up. I’m not. I’m happy to hear these fuckers who blow up lives get what they deserve. The winner of the pick me dance. I just can relate to the amount of spackle that I applied to red flags. But like every victim of narc abuse- you get clumped and get told a million sadz stories on how bad their life was before you and how great it is now. I should of trusted my gut on those red flags

      • It doesn’t sound that way at all. You are describing the classic cheater tactic of gas lighting. It begins to make you feel as if you are the crazy one, that everything is your fault. It is something most of us have experienced. I know I did and frankly, it still angers me when I remember how skillfully X employed it. All the created conflicts to throw me off track, all the blame I accepted for my supposed paranoia, all the times I thought I was the one causing unnecessary problems in our marriage. No, it is yet another tactic in the cheater handbook and your comment describes in accurate detail.

        • I too need medication because “I am too sensitive”, “I overthink everything”, I remember everything wrong because “That never happened”.
          My life is a shattered mess and I am barely hanging on. Most days I would prefer to stop hanging on.
          My special Golden Dick spouse will not let me go. He has me so trapped that I can’t even think clearly. I am damned if I do and fucked if I don’t.

          • ChumpLena – hang in there. It WILL get better I promise. Reach out where you can trust people. Don’t give up. The best way to get to him is to live a happy life. It may seem far off in the distance right now but I promise you it will come. Sending you big hugs from France.

      • Crushedfifif, No it doesn’t sound like you are taking the OW’s side. I can relate to so much you said. My ex did and said a lot of the same things yours did. And I went on meds too, because I got depressed after we got married (he withdrew from me and withheld sex just after our honeymoon — I felt like I was being a bad wife — no, I just married a disordered fuckwit!). I sure would love to hear all the sad sausage (lies) stories he told about me to his OW’s and the flying monkeys. Maybe God will be good to me and let me see them when I die. I’m just curious as to how long he’s been talking bad about me behind my back, all the while telling me what a wonderful wife and mom I was. And I was or at least I tried my best!

        • Martha, ditto to the letter! I can’t wrap my head around the occasionally very loving way X was with me while he was trashing me to others/APs at the exact same time. It’s a major mind fuck.

          • MotherChumper99, that’s just what cheaters do! They talk bad about us behind our back to get sympathy or whatever from the AP’s or the Flying Monkeys. It’s not based on reality at all! Don’t let it fuck with your mind. I know I was a great wife. Not perfect, because no one is perfect. I tried hard, because I didn’t know what I did wrong for the other times he devalued me or cheated on me, so I walked on egg shells (didn’t even realize I was doing it!) and Picked Me Dance (didn’t know I was doing that too!) for close to 24 years.

            And today I had another A-Ha(!) moment. At least four years ago, the X and I were at our sons school, waiting in a group of people to get inside of the auditorium for our sons concert. X and I were holding hands as we usually did. Everything was fine and dandy between us. X saw a newly divorced woman that he works with and what did he do? He immediately dropped my hand and stood against the concrete wall like we weren’t together. I knew about her divorce, because he told me about it and some of the details. At the time I was very suspicious about his behavior that night, but I didn’t say anything, because it would lead to another fight/discussion about his women “friends.” Fast forward a few years and just about two weeks after D-day, we ran into the same woman at Target and her face was a look of total confusion. You see, X and I were holding hands again and laughing. She looked in shock and all she said was, “Where are your kids?” X’s face turned completely red and when I asked him about his red face all he said was, “Don’t you get embarrassed to see your coworkers outside of work?” Ugh, no. I realized a few months later that he was already talking to this coworker (lies about me I’m sure based on the look of shock on her face) and then my today’s A-Ha moment was remembering back a few years back how he dropped my hand that day. I have no doubt in my mind that he was feeding her bs lines about our marriage even back then. I have no doubt he was grooming her to be a future AP. These cheaters are all the same and they’ll say anything they need to say in order to get what they want or to protect their image. THEY SUCK and WE DON’T!

            • Martha, wow, your ex is bonkers! That line about embarrassment is really over the top. Damn. The grooming they do of future AP’s is shameless. Kudos to you for figuring it out and extricating yourself from a very thick fog of manipulation and weirdness. I’m impressed by your mightiness!

              • Thank you, Jo. 🙂 It took A LOT of thinking/remembering and A LOT of help from Chump Lady and Chump Nation. When you are not a cheater or disordered person, it doesn’t come naturally to see the red flags and *off* behavior. I felt like I was going crazy after the discard, because nothing made sense! Coming here almost every day and reading just about everything helped me to figure it all out. Plus family, friends and counseling of course. I don’t feel mighty, but I can look back on the last three years and I’ve done some pretty mighty stuff. 🙂 It makes me happy that I’m learning to stick up for myself and create boundaries for the first time in my life. Have a great weekend! 🙂

              • I know my ex had been living a double life for years. Years of lies to me and about me. Question…. Have any of your ex’s ever when forced to have a photo taken with you ,looked mad, or sad in them ? Mine could be laughing one minute but God forbid look happy on a social media pic with me a minute later.

              • Yup. And at the time I never noticed that he never really posted any pictures of us or me on social media. Like it wasn’t an issue. “Oh he’s a man and he doesn’t use Facebook much! He doesn’t Want everyone in his business!” Well Beans, motherfucker was Mark Zuckerbetg when he wanted to use Facebook messenger to cheat on you, so…..

                After DDay I promptly told my mother in law there would be no more “faaaaamily” portraits done with me in them. That felt nice. ☺️

    • Way to go crushedfifi,
      You have seen threw his “candy coating”
      You are angry!
      You are gonna be ok!
      Keep that Mighty Crown in place.
      It fits perfectly!

    • I could have written this post.
      Addiction problems that I helped him through only to get sober and start cheating, emotional abuse and blame shifting all the way. Like I should be ok with being his emotional vomit bucket because you know its my fault and if its not I should do spend my energy trying to fix him.
      I will not date a man who has had substance abuse issues when Im ready to date, too hard.
      Hand me a nice strong homely chump who does yoga and I’m set.

      • Lady B – having a cheater with an addiction problem just adds the toppings and condiments to the shit sandwich that the chumps get served! Cheaters lie and gaslight. Addicts seem to find a whole different level to mindfuck you with and bring in even more dangers to the family.
        I am 100% with you on your statement of….”I will not date a man who has had substance abuse issues when Im ready to date, too hard.Hand me a nice strong homely chump who does yoga and I’m set.” Well said and thank you! I’m putting that boundary in place and I don’t care what sob story I get….it’s still gonna be “fuck off” and if I’m alone forever then at least I know my own truth and not some BS version of it.

  • Back when I was waiting on the Karma Bus, I would hope that my XW experienced the similar fears that this woman does. My XW was also an OW and a cheater, and now she has a baby girl with her OM.

    Then I realized it won’t work that way. When gets to that point, she’ll just find some other married loser and branch-swing to him. Because although she tells herself otherwise, it’s not about the man; it’s about not being alone.

    So, DB should get her vine ready, and branch-swing to the next classy dude willing to destroy his marriage for her. And then the next. And then next. The caliber of these men won’t increase over time, of course, but at least she won’t be alone.

    And that’s what she’s really scared of—being alone. Otherwise, she’d act on her alleged fears and leave this guy today. Either that…or all of her fear is just an bunch of bullshit to get a rise out of us. Either way, she’s screwed (and not in a good way).

    • Ex couldn’t be alone either. From my perspective, if I was worth leaving I was worth leaving before he strayed but I don’t think he would have been capable of that. He needed somebody new to latch onto. He might be stuck with her for a long time, however, because he has discovered that making the switch is painful too and he probably won’t want to go through that again.

      Last winter I suggested that maybe he just needed to be on his own and be celibate for a while to clear his head and get through the divorce and then maybe find somebody new in a year or two. His response was “That’s what got me into this mess in the first place”. I took exception to that because he was not, in fact, celibate. I know. I was there. We were intimate on a regular basis, but he still considered himself celibate? What a shitty thing to have said to me.

    • yeah the “alone” part rings in my ears. My therapist tells me my Borderline Personality Disorder cheater wife just sees me as ‘useful’ not necessarily able to love me in a normal way. And definitely not able to be faithful. They fear being alone/abandoned yet they do everything to want their partner to flee- including cheat. Very weird. Your term “branch swinging” is a perfect term. I understand her previous relationships from a different perspective now. My therapist told me to prepare myself for how quickly my wife will find her next man once the divorce papers start rolling.

      • Funny, my Stbx is accusing me of being BPD. He had me believing it but now that I am out of the craziness and read the criteria from my new perspective, I think differently.

        Acting out sexually. Me no, him yes.
        Drinking excessively. Me no, him yes.
        Excessive spending. Me no, him yes.
        Afraid of being alone. Me no, him yes.
        Unstable personal relationships ranging from idealizing to devaluing. Me no, him yes.
        Inappropriate anger. Me no, him yes.

        A lot are internal so I wouldn’t know but you get the idea.

        Projection is real.

        • I used to wonder if Ex might be mildly BPD. His dad was diagnosed as such. Ex’s mood swings weren’t extreme, but it was almost as if he had PMS as it seemed to be a monthly cycle of being tense and discontented and then being mostly content until it morphed into being discontented some of the time and down right depressed and angry the rest of the time.

          Ex nails every item on the above list except for “Drinking excessively”. I am lucky on that account. Otherwise the “Inappropriate anger” might have been violent instead of just annoying at best emotionally hurtful at worst.

          I think that is the real reason he doesn’t want to see a counselor. I think he knows BPD is a possibility and doesn’t want to find out.

          • Wow, does this ever bring up memories. I too thought the ex had monthly cycles, as well as seasonal ones. Is it autumn? Cue the annual rage, dissatisfaction, complaining, and acting out. Pick up a new girlfriend on the sly to help make life more exciting. Don’t know if he’s BPD or full-on narc, I’m just glad to get out of the crazy.

            P.S. This is no reflection on those with seasonal affective disorder or depression. His mood swings and rages and blaming went on for thirty years, even while on antidepressants and he could be the nicest of nice guys to any and all women at work during the same time. He had no time or inclination to have a relationship with any of his relatives, only howorkers. He never had a single male friend in 30 years.

            • Finding bliss, Your P.S. My Stbx would accuse me of those things too. I can’t count how many times he said “you need to get some sun on your cranium” as if I had s.a.d. rather than just needing some support from him. One time I had enough of him accusing me of being depressed and did “rage” at him. I said “I am not depressed. I get up, shower, dress, homeschool and take care of the kids, make dinner, clean, and then have sex with you. Clinically DEPRESSED people don’t do that!!!” That shut him up for a moment.

              I really just wanted a partner.

              • Amen! Mine did similarly abusive shit. Accused me (behind my back to our friends) of having postpartum depression because I got irritated at him for not putting ice remover on our front steps when I had an 8-day old infant in the middle of winter, and the ice caused our oldest child to fall and hurt himself. Then he raged at me while holding our infant from me, and would not give the baby back to me to nurse.

                “I really just wanted a partner.” Yes!!!

          • Yep. I think my STBX has BPD. I think he refuses seeing a counselor because of this. He has all the traits: rage, quits jobs because he gets bored easy, love me/hate me mentality, and he excessively drank, and he cheated. I think he definitely has a fear of abandonment.

    • Ding ding ding. I was thinking the same thing. This is the official start of her discard of him. Of course it started the day they met, but so it begins in earnest. Its your classic borderline meets narc story. So beautiful really.

      • “This is the official start of her discard of him…..Its your classic borderline meets narc story. ”
        YES! This! EXACTLY!

    • So so so familiar!! I love the concept of branch swinging — never thought about it, but the scared to be alone thing nails my own STBX to a T. He’s always had OW “backups” waiting in the wings, or booze, or ANYTHING to distract himself from being alone. I never did understand his weird need to have every TV blaring and turn on every light in the house whenever he was home (even if for only 15 minutes). I used to think he was scared of the dark. Now I think he just can’t stand quiet time alone because in his own head, there’s nobody of substance home, and it’s too boring.

      • “I never did understand his weird need to have every TV blaring and turn on every light in the house whenever he was home (even if for only 15 minutes). I used to think he was scared of the dark. Now I think he just can’t stand quiet time alone because in his own head, there’s nobody of substance home, and it’s too boring.”

        OMG, Chickynot! You just turned on a lightbulb for me! This! This exactly! Every damn light! TV turned up to unbearable (for me and the kids) levels! Even when he was “working” out in the garage he had a TV or the stereo blaring – usually to music he’d heard over and over and over, or TV reruns. Wow…

        • Yep, I’ll second all of that. Couldn’t be alone either. A total drunk, who had to have music/TVs ANYTHING blaring all the time, even if he wasn’t in the room. Crikey, they really are all the same aren’t they!

  • Ok, gotta admit that I get a sadistic thrill when these trolls come here. To me, the sheer chutzpah of these entitled assholes is astonishing. And we then get a chance to unload all we wish we could say to our exes and their special twats without breaking no contact/ gray rock. How fun is that?

    In the end, they are just sad empty shells passing as real humans who get what they so richly deserve, the disdain of CN, the karma of being absolute pricks and the specialness (not) of being with another cheater. We, on the other hand, get to unload a ton of our justifiable anger onto these twats and then skip merrily away to better lives.

    Rock on CN, laugh at the stupidity of these idiots and then have an awesome day. You no longer have to deal with their specialness and sparkly. You get to be REAL. Something they will never, ever be.

  • DB-
    I’m not religious. I have known people like you to hide behind their Faith. Go reread the tenets of your faith. For thousands of years people like you are known to suck. Your behavior and choices to harm others has zero to do with being modern, open minded or whatever Gywneth/Ester want to spout.

    You made your bed, go lie in it you ridiculous twat.

  • So harsh and unfeeling! We’re not even considering all the things that DROVE her to cheat on her husband of 21 years. He didn’t tell her she was pretty! He’d take the whole family out to dinner instead of just her! He paid for the kids’ activities and she had to control her spending at scrapbook/kitchenware/makeup parties! He got depressed at one point and started leaf-blowing the yard too often… so she filled her time and herself with Sparkly Cheater Dick. And we KNOW her husband never really loved her because she only had ONE affair and decided the marriage was over; if he really loved her and those 21 years were so great, he would have FOUGHT for her. It’s *his* fault, not hers!

    ::puking emoji::

    Scamper away, WhoreTroll.

  • Awww CL opened the door and threw in a hunk of raw meet for CN. Thank you. Happy stories for the cheaters always brings a smile to my face. Sure that’s not the path to meh to wait for the explosion of my ex and his young schmoopie 2.0 with a bucket of popcorn and a soda pop, so thanks for the early viewing with these fuckwits.

    • Twiceachump, happy stories of the cheaters always bring a smile on my face too. And since I brought myself and my two kids through post cheater hell and I am finally at a point where I am fine with not ever forgiving my ex for what he did, I’d say: bring in the popcorn and soda! Meh will come eventually.

      • Ooh, you’re right. My boys loved that show, too, and were sad about it ending. It was one of those shows I didn’t really watch with them, now that they’re older. They’d watch it, while I cooked or did laundry, etc. Unlike Max & Ruby, which all episodes are burned into my brain, as I had to watch with them when they were younger and couldn’t be left in the room alone.

  • Great post! The troll vomiting rainbows made me spit my coffee! DB? dumb bunny is worried this cheater will cheat on her?! Thats a given. Three words for you db. Karma karma karma!

  • Chump Lady,
    Your words,
    PRICELESS!
    ” Regular Pap Smears”
    (And full STD testing)

    Just stay in the stirrups DB,
    Much safer there!

  • I might extend my sympathies to someone who has majorly screwed up other people’s lives and is truly, utterly repentant, wants to know how to make amends, etc.
    It would be different if this person was afraid that her current partner, ex-cheater, might cheat on her.
    But this dude cheated WITH you. You’re part of the problem you fear, DB.

    Want to fix that? Get yourself out of that situation and work on becoming a human person!
    What you have now is an announced disaster, and you’re here because you know it’s only a matter of time. Actually, about that stripper? I think your D-Day has already come, but it may have flown over your big, entitled head.

  • Tracy, I am sorry, this sounds so contrived and improbable. Who on earth writes I am number 8? Go and gloat somewhere else with your number 2.

      • I can hardly believe the gall of these OW. I mean, why are they writing to you, ChumpLady? What do they expect from you, or from CN?! Sympathy?? Understanding?? I don’t get their special kind of stupid, inviting an ass-kicking like that. Morons.

        On the upside…their idiocy provides more entertainment for us! 😂

        • Yes, they do expect sympathy. Because they are HURTING! Can you not feel their pain?

          “If you prick us, do we not bleed?”

          And where better to go fishing for sympathy kibbles than people brimming over with empathy. (pssst,but, DB, not for you. Sorry.)

      • Seriously, Tracy, these women write you all the time? What the actual fuck? The self-centeredness of these people shocks me over and over. And do they believe they are going to get sympathy? Holy Entitled Asshole, Batman!

  • DB:

    We are NOT your tribe. We didn’t cheat on our spouses/partners… we were abused, lied to and cheated on by the likes of YOU.

    Here is some advice for you:

    1. Go apologize to your X for being a whore and blowing up his life. I don’t care how fucking unhappy you were in that marriage… YOU CHEATED. Own up to it.

    2. Look in the mirror. You’re not special. Nope. Not even close. You have no character. Want to change that reflection – leave the douchebag and work on you and making amends to all the people you harmed.

    3. Stop thinking you’re a chump. You’re a whore who WON the man who told you from day one that he was a liar and a cheater… but for some reason, you thought your magic twat would keep him from cheating on you? That just illustrates how delusional you are.

    4. Like CL… get regular Pap Smears… enjoy winning the pick me dance while laying back in the stirrups.

    5. You may want to grow a pair and leave him, just saying. Many people have to rebuild their lives after a divorce. Again, you’re not special.

    • As for #2, she won’t.
      She’s a cheater too, and now she’s saying “hey,wait a sec., now that I’m the wife…”
      It’s not her ah-ha moment…..it’s karma.
      She’s a cheater like him, plain and simple. IF she were a decent human being and IF this was truly the love of a lifetime she would of said “go home and handle your marriage one way or another…”
      but she didn’t.
      If he’s still living with his wife and kids, it ain’t over ….js.
      What goes around, comes around.

      • I agree Paintwidow. She’s just as much as a deadbeat as the cheater. Then she expects for him to treat her right. Ha ha ha, joke is so on her!

  • Ohhhh, the OWs when they reach out. It’s hilarious when they come down from the high of bamboozling and feel so bamboozled.

    The Sluterus was so invisible during my marriage. This was an intentional thing. When I called her number not knowing who the fuck would text my husband thousands of times while he was on vacation with us, she was vewy silent and smol. When my stepdaughter was ripped from the room she’d slept in for years on D-Day and never allowed to see it again, she had no comment. On social media, she preemptively blocked me so I had no idea she existed till I saw that phone bill. Till then she had been presented as a married coworker with whose HUSBAND he hoped to be friends.

    There was no husband. Should have known, beacause he never had a friend over for fun in all the years I knew him.

    OWs get awful cheeky when they think they’ve won the shitball Sweepstakes. It took years for the Sluterus to grow the balls to stalk my Facebook and send me PMs.

    She signed them The Future Mrs Shitball. Well, she used the name he goes by, which I dumped when he left.

    I told her I couldn’t think of a better fate for her than Mrs. Shitball. I congratulated her told her they’d surely have all the happiness they deserve ( none, bitch) and the 3 Lady Cavalry of Former Mrs. Shitballs might all chip in on a classy set of paper plates for the Shitball Nuptials.

    You seem bitter, she said. Oh god no, I said. I laugh about this murder of my family all the time. I’m glad she won.

    I hope you are both so happy that someday, when you are most happy and proud and in love you open a phone bill, and find your King Shitball has met someone EXACTLY like YOU. But don’t be bitter.

    • I like how SHE’S the one PMing you in the first place, but when you don’t respond how she wants YOU’RE the one who’s obviously bitter. What was the subject of the PMs in the first place?

      • Apparently at some point she unblocked me from FB and was monitoring my page.

        Fuck all knows why. I never contacted her once after D-Day and rarely mentioned the divorce there.

        Friends were giggling over a meme where celebrities give their kids stupid names and then dumb civilians use them for their kids.

        I mentioned in the comments The Howorker had done this with her Adultery Baby and named her kid after cheese.

        After three years This Bitch felt the need to reach out and correct me in a comment buried in a several months old post.

        She was summarily dispatched, and then she blocked me again.

        I have not looked at her Facebook page since friends sent me screenshots in 2014.

        I stand corrected. She didn’t name her Seabiscuit after cheese or an actress. She named her kid after those tar pits where the Wooly Mammoths got swallowed up. J/K who the fuck cares. I told her she had all the freedom in the world to enjoy her accomplishment of breeding with a man who sheds families like the crud in a loofah.

        If she really were happy and carefree why am I even a concern? I hadn’t spoken to Skin Tab Turtle Dick in over a year.

        • And the thing that pisses me off the most? It’s not enough that you went on your merry way and you can tell your kid whatever the fuck you want about her conception and that two girls’ lives were ripped apart. Nobody fucking cares what Throne of Lies you sit on. Have your Free Love Bonobo Monkey Circus across town. But I’ll be damned if you attempt to whitewash what you did to the daughters and me. On my social media. That’s not your narrative to control.

        • She named her kid LaBrea?! Like the tar pits?

          At least you get the satisfaction of knowing she’s a paranoid insecure mess three years later, lmao!

        • “Skin Tab Turtle Dick”
          Hahahahhahaaaa!!!! The Evil One has skin tabs all up along with his inner thighs leading up to his nub, bwahahahaaa

          I have yet to hear from his OWife, nor have I yet to be introduced to her.

          Yes, being a winner in the sparkly turd contest must be exhilarating
          Sluterus must be so proud.

  • Only the ONE infidelity on her part … innumerable on his. So, what did her “only one” infidelity add up to?

    — Two destroyed marriages.
    — Two screwed over Chumps (her exH and his exW)
    — A combined 38 years of the Chumps’ lives stolen
    — and, I must wonder how many children’s lives were shaken to the core

    She fails to mention the kids. I think it’s a good assumption that either of the marriages (probably both) also had children. Yet she doesn’t mention them … maybe because mentioning little, innocent victims might rain on her SADZ parade?

    Fuck her. Fuck him. Both of them suck endlessly.

    CL — your response couldn’t have been better. Keep rockin’!

  • This is a FANTASTIC response!! I avidly read and hung onto to every single word. It delivers at every turn and the best advice is to get pap smears. Lolol!!! Tracy, you hit this one out of the park, as you always do!!!

  • That. was. epic! Thank you Tracy!!

    Character is built and maintained with integrity. It’s not magic. You don’t get it b/c you found your “schmoochie pie soulmate.” He’ll do it again b/c he’s done it for 15 years. There’s no loyalty in cheaters except to themselves. You DB will do it again too b/c you’re just like him.

  • I ❤️ u CL!!!! I so needed this today as I was having doubts just early this morning that OW and Narcs married life was greener. Thanks for the reminder of sweet reality!

  • You know that fog that everyone talks about? Well, this it. This woman talked herself into believing that a sociopath has a heart. She talked herself into believing that finding her twu wuv is more important that integrity, and certainly more important than two Chumpy spouses. Aaaaannnnndddd look how that turned out. I think Chump Nation ought to get stopwatches out to time how long it takes before The Sociopath whips it out for the next one.

  • Thanks Tracy – needed this today.

    In a couple of hours I’m off for “collaborative law” session #3 with Princess YogaPants.

    Meeting #1 she just sat there with the sadz until I mentioned that the guy she ran off with had more money than us and she didn’t need a settlement. She got very angry and stormed off. It also seems that she had lied to her lawyer and said that they only dated “after” she left rather than for a year before. She’s on at least lawyer #4 so far.

    Meeting #2 she had the rage channel going – and still none of her forms done and glared at me while her lawyer pounded at me demanding forever spousal support. I did notice that her lawyer never looked at her client and seemed to still be in the dark about a lot of things. I didn’t mention her guy but just said “no” a lot. It’s not my responsibility to provide disclosure to her lawyer. Mine of course has everything all carefully documented. We can’t really use it to our advantage though in this process because “no fault”.

    We’ll see how it goes today. It’s now been over 2 years since she started dating this guy (a widower) and 5 months since she finally started the divorce process. I must say that they have stamina because everything is still a deep dark secret – except to like “everyone” because after I stopped dancing I had no problem telling people why I was alone.

    This reassured that that yes she does suck as does the guy and that no amount of sadz can be allowed to affect me. I’ll still get hosed financially but as Tracy once wrote to another guy (you may want to re-run that one – it helped me) – it’s worth the price to be free.

    I sometimes wonder if this was her first but suspect it isn’t. I also know that it doesn’t matter.

    Speaking of STDs and pap smears, I still remember clearly in one of the very few times that we actually talked and staring her in the eye telling her about what it took for me to get tested for STDs and saying that I “wondered what sort of crack whore the lab tech thought I was sleeping with”. No clue if she’s been tested herself. Not my problem.

    Wish me luck CN.

    BT

    • Good luck, BowTie. It sucks that you have to give Princess Yoga Pants any money at all (all states need to get rid of No Fault divorces!)

    • You got this BowTie! You’ve got CN behind you. All PYP’s got is her skanky self and a bunch of lawyer bills from her miscellaneous lawyers.

    • BT – Don’t lose hope. I’m in a no-fault state too. Judges still have a lot of leeway in their decisions and they definitely don’t like cheating gold-diggers. Hang in there.

    • BowTie–I hope you come through settlement with as big an advantage as you can. Even in a no-fault state, adultery can be taken into account for the financials (so use the information).

      I just helped a friend through a divorce where he got taken (badly) to the cleaners short term, but won the long game (kept all of his retirement). Play the long game.

      As for the STD testing, I told the technician, my OB/Gyn, my primary care physician why I was having tests. Not my shame to own, and it turns out that most people are very sympathetic once they hear our Jerry Springer-style stories.

      • Thanks everyone. Thanks to CN I got through it and got a deal. Not a great deal, but a deal nonetheless.

        In no small part I owe it to Tracy and this post:
        https://www.chumplady.com/2017/04/pay-her-when-she-cheated/

        It helped me to know that there is indeed no justice. But there can be closure.

        One phrase that I like to use is “You don’t know you are living under a cloud until you are walking in sunshine”.

        Currently I’ve just polished off a bottle of nice Spanish wine and half an apple pie plus used up the better part of a box of tissues.

        I’ll get there. But for now – time for bed. The world is waiting.

      • I did the same. Told my physician who is also his doc. Asked him to not discuss anything with him since I started the divorce process. I tell people right and left. Not my fault that he cheated. Took me a few months of “intravenous CL wisdom injections” every morning to finally get that. Not my fault.

    • BT,

      Good luck, you are probably done with the great meeting. It made me remember that right before having my x deposed, I went to the hair salon and showed up with super cute hair and clothes. My x told his lawyer I wasn’t supposed to be there. I sat there, all made up, straight face as my lawyer caught him in lie after lie and his lawyer just looked uncomfortable. It’s worth being free! Rock the Bow Tie!

  • This chick can’t be real. I know OWs are stupid, but are they really stupid enough to write to Chump Lady looking for advice and sympathy?

    Still, it is fun to pretend that she really is who she thinks she is so we chumps can have the satisfaction of believing that at least one OW out there is getting her comeuppance and maybe our cheater’s Schmoopies will too. 🙂

  • I was married 20 years when I found out about my EX and co worker. My friend/neighbor/fellow church member was there for me and listen to me for hours at first but she was all for staying with him and working in out in our Reconciliation (7 months of hell) Her thing was that I needed to lose weight and look better for him. She is very slim and that was how you keep your man. Well I was divorced 11 months after BD. It has been hard financially but me and my two sons are NC and happy 3 years later.

    Well 2 months after my BD, she found out her husband was having a 7 year affair. She was shocked, devistated and afraid. So we are each others rock for about 5 months and then I find my EX is still seeing OW so I am done with him and she does not approve. I then find out that 22 years ago she was the OW. She is staying with her cheater and was very hateful to me because I divorced. She had built up such resentment because of all the horrible things I said about woman who sleep with married men (I did not know at the time she was one) that the friendship ended.

    The thing is she will not leave him because he still offers her the lifestyle that the “stole” him for. She feels like this is just what she deserves so she stays. But she also feels superior to me because she kept her man (maybe) as long as she excuses his behavior. She told me I was too hard headed to compromise. She could not understand that it is not hard headed but morals and self respect.

    On a side note her 19 year old daughter is a mess, does not know what to think. She was with her mother when they found out. The other woman called them and then left the line open so they could her him and my friends husband talking. Because dad was traveling when they answered his phone, the daughter put it on speaker and was also listening as they put the pieces together on what was happening. She really needed to see her Mom leave him, empowered. Now she hates him but Mom is telling her to be nice…. confusing.

    • Wow BestMe. This must have been quite the mindfuck for you during the period when you were relying on this “friend” for support before knowing her full story as an OW. Imagine that, a mercenary characterless shell doling out “advice” and acting like a decent church member friend while trying to indoctrinate you into her shallow belief system. In essence, you were just another type of object for her – her “husband” was object 1 and you were object 2. You were being used, at a time of great pain and confusion for you, simply as a means to buttress her preferred view of herself. None of it was for you. She saw a weakened target to manipulate and went to work. If you could be convinced to mirror her take on things then her disordered view is affirmed. And now she’s onto object 3, her daughter. All in the service of her fundamental definition of human reality: all relationship is empty usage for self. You threatened that by your premise that meaningful connection not only exists, it is the only acceptable standard. You threaten everything she has based her empty form of life on. If she ever truly grasps that fact, she will have an existential crisis to make any DDay look minor. Not to worry…that can’t happen. The insight for this would require the presence of a normal human psyche (emotional skills, secure attachment foundation, ego-equivalence) existing alongside her disordered one. She’d need to have had a split personality since infancy. How many of us receive self serving “help” like this which is nothing more than third party abuse from additional character flawed people around us.

      • What a horrible “friend”!! First off telling you that you should lose weight “in order to keep your man.” Ugh. Think of all the beautiful, thin and talented models and actresses that get cheated on by their sparkly turds and that right there blows that advice all apart!

        And then she’s a church friend. There’s more abuse in the form of spiritual. As a Christian, it was very hard for me to hear the advice and words from the lying now ex-pastor. And the ex-pastors wife to “trust the men of the church” and “they know what is best” and “they know what they are doing.” Getting bad advice from church people who don’t have your best interest in mind is devastating and soul breaking!

        And then you find out was that she was the OW after all her bad advice. Wow. She’s not a wife. She’s prosti-wife. He gives her the lifestyle that she wants — if he wasn’t providing that lifestyle for her, I guess she’d jump ship? Just like a prostitute that goes away when she stops getting paid. Your story is another sad example how really dark people are hiding out in churches and sadly they are giving advice. My holy, Christian, weekly church-going ex-H gave out advice too. He told his co-worker (an adulterer herself that blew-up two marriages) that marriage counseling “was a waste of time.” Of course it’s a waste of time when you are a pathological liar, serial cheater, serial adulterer who never had any intention at all of saving his marriage. MC to him was the start of “saving face” at church and to also start his lying narrative about our marriage and me. I cannot wait to see what happens to all the lying cheaters in eternity.

        • Rowan Atkinson had a comedy sketch about souls arriving in hell. He played the part of the devil sorting the damned and had the adulterers line up in front of the small guillotine (although that really only takes care of the men).

          • Except he dumped his wife for a younger woman. I just read about all the BBC middle aged reporters who have dumped their wives after many years of marriage. If you put someone in front of a camera their egos swell up to gargantuan proportions.

  • “I am probably the biggest chump of all, but here goes…”

    They’re always the victim, aren’t they? Delusional fools. I’d feel sorry for their lack of awareness if I didn’t think they brought it on themselves. Karma’s a bitch.

    • Not just a victim Tempest, but the BIGGEST victim. Look at ME, ME, ME, ME, ME, ME. I out chumped all you pathetic chumps. I’m the chumpiest of chumps, the biggest of all. Delusions of grandeur much #8?

      • Absolutely. That subtle one upmanship thing. And she thinks she’s so special that she’s allowed to command kibbles and empathy from the very group of people she and her fellow cheater helped victimize. Doesn’t matter one little bit that someone here might be triggered and hurt by reading her post. Entitled arrogance…. The little people must bind her wounds!

        Ah, the pain….the anguish! No one can touch her amount of suffering. When it’s something she has done to others, it’s no big deal. When it happens to her, why, the drama never ends. The world must take notice and soothe her pain.

        Excuse me, I am on the verge of making myself boot.

  • Your a sad desperate bitch! With an evil streak 10 miles wide. Wow people get their rocks off being a bitch, liar.
    Lol the troll

    • She believes in unicorns and twu wuv… lol… I did send her here and she found this site unsupportive lol.. saying that there are no blogs supporting women like her.. she’s different you see.. she loves him and he loves her.. he keeps cheating and she forgives him doormat style. No, it’s a lost cause.. they are happy you see..

      • Lol, you prove my point. Creatures like you are laughable and not worth a centila of time or effort.

        You are so desperate to show that the wife is pathetic when, in reality, you are the pathetic one.

        Coming here, really? You want the validation that you are superior to the cheated upon. What you’ve actually proven is that you are small and insignificant. And you know that about yourself, don’t you? Which is why you come here to spout your “evolved” lifestyle.

        Do yourself a favor and crawl back into the primordial ooze from which you’ve come.

        We will be here laughing about your patheticness.

      • Hey LOL… I think Harvey Weinstein is looking for someone with your absence of character and lack of self-esteem… you know, someone who only feels alive when she is fucking someone who is cheating on their spouse or partner. Save your false bravado for the next person you snare. You can lol all day, but you know in your self-loathing brain that you are truly the fuck up. YOU. KNOW. IT.

        • Lol has a special vagina. Everybody wants to get a piece of the pitiful

          Go suck on a a train of diseased, lice infected, dicks.

      • Yes. It seems he is happy. He has her and you. Cake. Enjoy being his dessert. You deserve each other. His wife will figure it out. I pray she lives in a state where she can sue you for everything you have.

      • Hey Lol,

        I know that you’re probably trolling trying to get a rise out of us but if you aren’t;

        IF you live in Hawaii, Illinois, New Mexico, North Carolina, Mississippi, South Dakota, or Utah you better pray the wife doesn’t get a lawyer and file an Alienation of Affection lawsuit against you.

        You wouldn’t be “lol’ing” if she took your ass to the cleaners !! I personally wish they made these suits legal in the other states. People would think twice about having affairs with a married person if they could end up sued. My ex’s current husband (and OM) would so be paying me right now if they lived in one of those states !!

        • Adultery is a class 1 felony in my state. It’s punishable with up to a $10,000 fine and three years in jail, for both partners even if one isn’t married.

          Alas, I didn’t file a complaint. It would have been bad for the kids (all eight between them).

      • So LOL, you are a disgruntled OW, what you are is really pissed that he has not left his wife for you!!! LMAO

  • I hear so much typical Cheater victimization talk in here – their locust of control being outside themselves. It just happened, I’m the victim of their influence, I had no control over my own choices, my feelings compelled me forward, blah, blah, blah!

    Here’s who doesn’t have a choice about cheating…

    1. The person led to believe FROM THE BEGINING that their Significant other is committed to monogamy.

    2. The person being cheated on; led to believe everything is fine, told their intuition is off, while someone else orchestrates the destruction of their lives. (reference point #1)

    3. The person who tends to the grass on their side of the fence, while the cheater steals the fertilizer and spreads it on the neighbors lawn. (reference point #1)

    4. The person who’s commitment is actual commitment, not an elaborate show of smoke and mirrors, bate and switch, or chump and dump! (reference point #1)

    5. The person who does NOT know the truth from which to make assessments and decisions for their own lives because the cheater changed the contract without a chumps knowledge (reference point #1)

    People who cheat to be with a known cheater meet none of these criteria.

    So while my empathy allows me to understand that feeling of panic, the anxiety of wondering will they do it again, are we okay, am I being naïve; the worry, the pick me dancing, all of the things that go along with being chumped; my new found attitude about hypocrisy and victim blaming tells me fuck empathy for someone who did this to their own spouse! Sorry, there are consequences to behavior, and they are your consequences to live with.

    From one chump to a “special circumstances case” (read entitled), I have one nugget of learned wisdom (see I’m not totally heartless)… that feeling of anxiety you have… yeah, listen to that! You’re probably experiencing the same fate that your ex chump ultimately had the unfortunate reality of experiencing – being cheated on. Good luck! And as the RIC says, maybe this will help you grow as a person!

    • Got-a-brain: You win the Phrase of the Day award for “Locust of Control” applied to cheaters. Love, love, love it.

      • Oops, I meant to say locus… apparently my phone didn’t like that 😂

        Locust works too! They are similar to locusts, leaving carnage in their wake!

  • I simply can’t wrap my head around the fact that men will try to convince a woman to have an affair with them by telling them all about the times they’ve ALREADY cheated on their wife. So they’re telling them up front that they’re not special, irresistible, worth risking everything over….just one in a line of random sluts. But as I see here it seems to work, so can’t argue with results I guess.

    • Yeah, I’m really shocked that after all she knew, she still wanted him and even married him! All of us Chumps that found out after D-day, that they were even cheating in some capacity before getting married (that’s me) and when we asked them about xyz, they lied again — I think we all wished they would have told us the truth about who they truly were and what they were doing! At least then we could have had the full picture and would have been able to make a life long serious decision (marriage and vows made to God) with all the truth spread before us. I can honestly say if I knew what he was up to behind my back before we even got engaged, I would have fun for the hills. But this woman chose to stay. I don’t get it.

    • Oh, you don’t know my cheater then, Beans. After making me doubt my intuition for years by pretending to be a man with integrity, and then lying and gaslighting and making me doubt even the facts I discovered on several DDays, he eventually decided to confess to all and more. I thought there was an EA which started when I left with my son to live in another country because of the political mess in his. It was a temporary solution and I was reluctant but followed the man’s rule. Well, everybody around me was “warning me” that this man is in high demand, how can you leave him live by himself for such a long time. It was entirely his decision and he insisted on it and created obstacles to our return. 6 years after this arrangement (seeing each other 3 times a year) I discovered what I thought at the time was an EA. It turns out the shmoopie was his ex gf from another country who he continued to shack up with during “business trips” all throughout our marriage even in the first years we were together and supposedly a happy unit. He gave me painful details and I listened because he complimented me on my listening skills and my openness. I was starved for such intimacy as I only heard from him how boring, black and white and family-oriented (bad thing) I was. I was trying to “domesticate him and he resisted it and now he was so happy to find the real me behind the layers” all this crap peppered with new age-y vocabulary. So I listened and absorbed all that pain and details I did not ask for. Well…I did ask, but he experienced a perverted sadistic pleasure in presenting those details so they would crush my soul. All his emotions were directed at her, The Shmoopie Half soul of his. He told me that he absolutely had to experience this with her and if he had to go through it again he would. This is supposedly when we were wreckonciling and his warmth and love was supposed to be refocused on me. Then more details came but in a “oopsie” way as if he just slipped something and then I had to press for more. The main shmoopie half soul was not the only one. You see, there are half souls but then there are passionate lovers, other ex ‘s that want sex and he is generous enough to give it to them. He actually said it: oh, that was just a charity sex, she was without a man for such a long time. That his wife was with no sex for most of the 6 years did not bother him much. No charity was needed here.

      Anyway, this particular type of malignant narcs enjoy giving you details and then basking in the glow of your tear-filled eyes. The narcs love to view their expression in the water and what better water than tears in the eyes of their loyal chump partners.

      Argghhh….no more.

      • Oh and the most important part…he thought that revealing details of his sexual encounters made him more enticing in my eyes, more desirable. He thought I should fight for him, the king of his jungle so much wanted. And he was right in a way. I did the whole pickmedancing as much as I hated it because I had to save my family. Until I realized I did not have a family and hence there was nothing to save.

        • Damn!! That’s some first rate mindfuckery!!! I’m so sorry you had to go through that.

          I kinda speak from experience on the subject, because after DDay #2 with the second Ms. GoodPussy she emailed me everything and blew his ass up. Oh the righteous anger of the whore that is okay with fucking your husband until she realizes he’s playing her too!!

          Anyway, she told me everything that went on between them and at the end added, “have you ever heard of coworker X? Because he told me they used to date and have sex too.” Now I HAD heard of his “friend” coworker X. But never, ever ever got him to admit anything regarding her. At the time, in my mental gymnastics, I was thinking “why the hell would he tell Ms. GoodPussy he used to cheat with that girl too? That makes zero sense. That couldn’t have been true.” Welp.

          As a side note, Ms. GoodPussy told zero lies about what happened between them otherwise. She even backed it up with evidence.

          • What kind of evidence did she supply to you. Was your X pissed that you had the evidence? My STBX is fuming mad because I confronted the OW and her parents with evidence and a letter.

            • She had screenshots of text conversations and emails between them, and the dates she said they had sex lined up with when I was out of town. She didn’t have any evidence for anything that happened with coworker X but I had heard rumors from talking to his coworkers so I believed it.

              He had a bad pill problem at the time, but didn’t seem really mad that she blew him up. He had gone out and gotten my name tattooed on his arm (drugs, ammirite?) and when she saw it she lost her shit obviously. He was telling her he loved her, he was going to move out if state with her, then tattoos his wife’s name on his forearm. I lost my shit laughing at her. He had no intention of leaving his comfy home for a barmaid. I was actually pretty gracious to her and thanked her for the info, but couldn’t resist adding “as an older woman, let me give you some advice…as you’ve seen here…they almost never leave their wives for cocktail waitresses with a couple if baby daddies.” I never heard back lmao.

              NOT to say this was all her fault, he’s the real piece if shit, but fuck this skank too.

              • Beans

                Do you think I was wrong to send a letter to the OW parents. I mean now they will know what kind of person there daughter is not to mention what kind of narcissit my STBX is.

              • No!!!! A million times no. Your spouse is gonna tell you that though, that you’re wrong because it’s all about image control to them. Especially in front if family. You do what you need to do. Plus if you don’t get in front of the story they damn well will. My husband was telling these skanks I was cheating already, we were just together because we couldn’t get divorced…

                I told EVERYONE. His parents, people at the bank, neighbors, his friends and coworkers, anyone I felt like. Lots of people said I was wrong but NO. He didn’t get to keep that nice guy narrative anymore. I’m not the one who should be ashamed.

  • Hey DB, you should totally cheat on him before he cheats on you. Yes, that will show him. More scratch for your cooter-itch, that’ll do it.

    And fuck you.

    I have no problem piling on.

  • I got a similar “whoa is me” speech from my ex’s live-in stripper gf. She was not the stripper gf who was banging my ex at dday #2 so I have no particular angst about her – hey, if she wants to spend the rest of her life dealing with his lack of equipment and staying power in exchange for what money he has left, more power to her. But I thought it was both amusing and audacious that she called ME to complain that he was cheating on her with strippers. I guess stripper strange isn’t so strange when it’s sleeping in your bed every night so you have to go out and get yourself a new (but definitely not fresh) supply. Sadly for her, I wasn’t very sympathetic. I told her if she didn’t like him cheating she should leave and then I blocked her number so I didn’t have to listen to any more whining.

    • Are you kidding? Oh that’s rich!

      If my STBX’s smoopsie called me to complain about him cheating I would literally laugh. Though he claims she knows he cheated, I’m sure he hasn’t shared the extent of his sex worker fucking history. She supposedly divorced a Cheater ex for my STBX. I swear cheaters target the ones that think a cheaters past behavior isn’t an indication of who they are in their relationship. I disagree, but I respect their right to be stupid 😂

      There is a part of me that feels sorry for her, because she has no idea she’s dating a guy who has profiles on every adult dating/hook-up site there is, and screws hookers on out of town trips; but then the other part of me is like.. you knew he was a cheater, so my sympathy is about as deep as his character. 🤷‍♀️. Not my monkeys, not my circus!

      • Well, see, that’s why I don’t have to feel sorry for the stripper gf. She met him while she was stripping! She saw him banging her fellow strippers (maybe literally saw them, I’m not sure how that works exactly) so she knew exactly what she was signing on for. Plus, it was clearly a ploy to get me to drop my guard (just a couple of girl friends bonding over being cheated on) since right after she mentioned the cheating she asked me if I was seeing anyone because I “was such a nice person, I deserved to be happy.” I’m a lot smarter than she looks so I knew right away that she was fishing for a way to end my spousal support and increase her own “take home pay.” Sorry honey. You keep the tiny dick, I keep the money. That’s they way it works. 😉

    • A stripper called you up to tell you that the man who cheated with her is now cheating with a stripper? These people are seriously messed up! lol

  • This DB creature’s post and Tracy’s answer (monstrous, brilliant nailing of Malignant Entitlement) reminds me of the news last year about these two Australian women who went walking on a beach in Cairns at night in spite of tons of warning signs to NOT do so because of danger of being captured by the salt water crocodiles (which are huge animals).

    Well, a croc got (and killed) one of the ladies and her distraught friend protested against the municipal authorities who “let this happen”. I loved the Aussie sheriff’s reply: “Human stupidity has no limits and nothing can be done about that” (quoted from memory).

    The best we can hope for is that DB gets her regular Pap smears for the good of Pubic Health (as my grandfather used to call Public Health in these cases).

  • “L” is for the look when you realize the “cheater” is now YOUR full time honey..
    “O” is for the slight slack in your mouth when you figure out about the money.
    “V” goes with the “D” you will deserve to get. AND
    “E” is for entitlement — you’ve had when yoo00oooOOOoou first met.

    Put them all toooOOOoogether,
    {Trust me, friend, it won’t get better -}
    Take that secret love accord-
    put in a house you can’t afford.

    SAY IT L./O./V./EeeeeEEEEEeeeeeeeee…!!!!!!!
    {until the next time, Sweetz!}

  • I loved every word of this. My wife told me yesturday she wasn’t happy and I needed therapy because I have problems that drive her to fuck an illegal alien car detailer who lives with his parents and his two younger sibilings (her students, yes, she’s a teacher and met her AP when she was a faculty mentor to his younger siblings) I wonder how bad is it going to end for her? Will she cheat, will he, he already abandoned his wife and child in El Salvatore and busted up my family. Does he just want her money or a green card? I hope she lives the rest of her life happily ever after because if she ever is faced with the realization that she lost her life for a cheap thrill that burned out or burned up after a year or so she’ll be devasted. Funnier still, my ex brother in law who cheated on my sister and is a divorce attorney why said it will take a few years for my wife’s midlife craziness to go away and then she’ll come back accept all blame and beg for forgiveness, (just like he did) he said that and is married to his first AP. That’s some cold hard truth

    • My cheater wife (age 46) decided to destroy our 17 year marriage and family for a 24 year old massage therapist (his picture though he literally looks like he’s 15). She’s a school counselor and apparently decided to have a teenager fantasy with naked cell phone pictures and all- PATHETIC. He lives with his mommy and daddy also. She swears he never went to her school, but who the heck knows with these wack jobs.

      • to ‘Betrayed’ if you just recently discovered what she did…. … I’m 5 months in from my discovery day. I demanded a divorce the night I finally got her to confess. But I got sucked in by her tears and tales of how I need to stay and go to couples therapy “for our daughter”. Don’t go down my torturous road- lawyer up immediately- nothing but emotional warfare and unearthing more gut wrenching disgusting lies has befallen me. Don’t take my path. It only gets worse. Lawyer up !

        • I’m almost a year in, after four months filed for divorce. She has never shown remorse every time in talk about my feelings she says I’m making it all about me and I have a problem. The closest to an apology was “I should not have done what I did it was not a good decision” or if asked if she was sorry she’d answer yes. She also said it was a mistake. No real sign that she even what’s to consider how I feel it’s all about what I did that made her go and do this. She said she wished she had developed a drinking or pill popping problem instead (thanks god she just decided to fuck someone behind my back instead,lol)

    • Betrayed & Confused–I’m very sorry for your wife’s deception and blameshifting, and the pain you’re in the midst of.

      After you’re divorced and free from the mindfuckery, come back to his post and read your account, and the comic gold of your phrasing, “My wife told me yesterday she wasn’t happy and I needed therapy because I have problems that drive her to fuck an illegal alien car detailer who lives with his parents and his two younger siblings (her students…,”

      I have a very vivid imagination, and every day on CL I shake my head at a new story. You can’t make this shit up.

      • Ahh, the creativity of the human creatures. Always Special (to them) but soooo ordinary. Just another edition of the same Cheater’s Manual.

    • Don’t let her come back, Betrayed!!! They ALWAYS cheat again or they never stop cheating, even when they say how sorry they are and they’ll “spend the rest of their life making it up to you” yada yada. Don’t fall for it. It’s a trap!

      • Martha,

        You are so right about your point. Never let them back in because the mind fuckery will start all over again. That is one thing in my recent healing I don’t miss, not to mention all the lies. Once a cheat always a cheat. Thanks for sharing your story. You are truly mighty. I am new to CN and everyone here is so mighty and nice with everything they have dealt with from the DISORDERED NARCISSITIC FUCKS!!! You all help me deal with one day at a time.

  • DB:

    Aww poor you, you finally woke up and realize that you have to face your reality and that there is trouble in your “paradise”… and who’s to blame for This? Not him, your ex, his ex, the children, the man next door, NOPE take a long hard look in the mirror cause ITS YOU!

    No one forced you into an affair, and no one should feel sorry for you either. You get what you get! You wanted him so badly whelp you won!! You got your twu luwv and you now see its defective well boo fucking hoo! You should be proud he left his family all for you, arent you special, hey be grateful! The wife and kids now live with knowing you were sooooo worth it for him to leave, you have their husband and father and that you won the glorious pick me dance! What else do you want? A piece of mind? Sorry you knew that wasn’t going to come with the deal and who’s fault was it that you failed to read the fine print! So now you have your sparkly turd, you realize it’s a turd and the sparkles are wearing off… its non refundable, and you have no warranties so suck it up and live with the fact that you both are liars and cheaters and as long as your with him, this lifestyle comes with the territory!

    Geeze people like you can never be happy huh? You’d be mad if he stayed with his wife now your bitching cause he’s with you and your afraid he will do to you what hes done all these years?!! Lol honey, we all know where this is headed.. he is set in his ways, he is who he is and more than likely he will not change, not even for you. Live with the fact that you will never be able to fully trust him, that you freed up your mistress slot for another participant in your shit show of a relationship and shut the fuck up about It! No one cares that your afraid that it will happen to you we all already know it will happen to you if it hasn’t already. As the saying goes the way you get them is the way you lose them, what goes around comes around, you reap what you sow.. and I can go on.. I don’t understand the narc ow who cries victim and wants to push the blame solely on the man.. umm you knew what you were getting yourself into when you left your husband to be with a disloyal dishonest male whore.

    There is not one ounce of “twu luwv” that could convince me to drop my current life to run off with a disordered man unless I’m equally disordered myself and 9 times out of 10 these ow are just as narcs/ personality disordered as the men so I say to hell with them both they deserve eachother.. People like these two should stay together as it keeps us normal and empathetic chumps away from them and gives us a chance to find real people as partners!!!

  • Boy, do I have a cartoon of a sadz troll beneath a bridge just waiting for the “trip trop” of the next high heeled cloven hooved OW to strut across….

  • I’m going to comment first and then go back read everyone’s comments. Oh, this shall be a good day of reading at Chump Nation!!!

    If you’ve never sent an email to Chump Lady and had her post a blog about your letter. This is what happens: She sends you an email to tell that she chose to use your letter for her blog and she might even send you the link to her response (I can’t remember). I remember being so in shock that she responded to my letter and I was soooooo happy the day I read it and also reading all the comments from Chump Nation! I have gone back to that post many times and reread everything to shore myself up again. 🙂

    So my first thought was DB being excited to see that Chump Lady responded to her letter and then actually reading the response!!! LOL. How could she have not known CL would rip her a new one?! Oh, that’s right. She’s a cheater and they are always the victims. Unbelievable. Okay, onward and upward to read everyone’s comments. Have a great day, Chumps! 🙂

    • I still think it is bored frat boys who want to watch the carnage as we tear into “DB”. It doesn’t really matter, however, if it gives us a way to get out our frustrations at our own cheater’s Schmoopies by laying into “DB” whether she’s for real or not.

      • Yeah, it’s hard to believe this letter is real, because I cannot imagine a woman still wanting a man who already told her how horrible he is. But you never know! There really are women and men out there who have no standards and sparkly turds look really good to them at the moment. I can only imagine how many letters Chump Lady reads each week and then she has to decide which one’s are bs fake letters or which one’s to publish.

        • As I posted above, there is no limit for stupidity. I’ll add here: Nor is there any remedy.

          And as fellow chumps have noted today, look at who we were married to. These people do exist. To write to CL is a matter of malignant entitlement.

        • No standards. That’s Dr. Crazy’s latest. She got loads of truth from his ex-fiancé who shared both our experiences. The latest revealed that he’d smashed her iPad and given her bruises and a black eye. And yet she stays. Her reason: she gave him $40k to remodel his kitchen (a man who earns close to a million a year) and she’s not about to walk away from that. That and his red Ferrari. No standards indeed.

  • Ha ha! I can’t wait until Crapweasel’s zillionaire cheater GF (whom he lives with…swanky!) begins to get these feelings of, um, unease. Heh. He’s a cheater with a slow burn, and he’s still feeding her pablum like “the Incomparable [cheaterbitch with money]” . But eventually her disease will lead to a discard, and off he’ll flounce to a new victim. Except he’s inching closer to aging out, by every minute. Ain’t it grand?

    I’m fine, doing EMDR (highly recommended!). My kid loves me–she’s ditched the cheater-dad. I rescue big fluffy dogs. What more is there? Life is getting better.

  • You really are f___up. Talk about desperate and pathetic. You really should get some serious help and some self esteem. Whores that sleep with married men are a pathetic and laughable bunch. Your day of reckoning will come.

  • Dear DB
    Thank you for writing and sharing your story with us. Words cannot express the pleasure I feel in learning of your plight.
    “I obviously don’t trust him And a lot of times can’t stop thinking about his past. It makes me want to vomit.”
    Here’s my advice: keep a barf bag handy.

  • Is she really for real? Seriously. Sometimes I have a hard time believing people like this ridiculous actually exist, but then I remember who I was married to.

    My only advice to this woman: when (not if) this guy dumps you, please don’t go back to your ex-husband. He’s had enough of your BS, let him live in peace. Also try to focus on relationships with unmarried men going forward – it will be better for you and better for them. You need to try and keep the number of marriages you have destroyed down to two.

    Thanks.

  • I’m with the person who said to start your timer on these unholy alliances! I told my cheater that I gave him and Schmoopie 6 months at best. They had a two year affair going prior to our divorce and actually moving in together. The so-called relationship was over in four short months once they had to live full time together and they were “free to feel alive and love each other!” Apparently they didn’t trust each other and it wasn’t fun and dangerous enough anymore. All they did was fight. This OW who wrote to CL is a total idiot. I have zero sympathy for her. She obviously pursued this guy and she “won”. Now she gets to come full circle and experience the ramifications of cheater “relationships”. A well deserved lesson and she can face the fact that she was just another easy twat in a long line of convenient, easy twats! She was even forwarned by the guy and decided to stay!! Stupid just runs in her blood and this guy knows she’s desperate so she can now eat those jumbo sized shit sandwiches! She deserves it!

  • I find post like these difficult. My Dad is one of the rare ones who is still with the OW he left my mum for. They have been together for 16 years now. I think this is mostly because my Dad didn’t suffer any consequences for his serial adultery. They were the type that stayed friends because my mum said it was just easier. It makes it all the more difficult to navigate my situation. It also makes me think that maybe my ex and young schmoopie will be happy and I’ll be seen as the bitter ex wife who can’t be friendly for the sake of the children.

    • Pregnant Chump, first who gives a flying Fuck what anybody else says/thinks? The whole point of this blog is to determine what is acceptable to YOU. Let them think you are bitter. You know that you were stabbed, repeatedly, in the back and that is NOT something you should be forced to accept.

      Your mom, dad and his Owifetress, are part of that ” conscious uncoupling” crap. Is being friends with your ex acceptable to you? You say yourself that the way your parents handled their relationship post divorce was confusing to you. Is that what YOU want to model for your kids?

      YOU get to decide what is in your best interest, the best interest of your children and how best to conduct YOUR LIFE moving forward. Nobody else gets a vote or a voice in that. It’s up to you. It’s your only life and you get to live it according to your integrity and values.

      Sending you big ((hugs)). You’ve got this!

      • Thank you for the 2×4 I just sometimes forget that he sucks and I do not. I’m much better off being no contact except for kids stuff and the only people I need to explain that decision to are my children when they are old enough.

    • Owife probably just hasn’t sucked him dry yet. My dad was with his Schmoopie for 20 years until he got sick then she dropped his ass. She is back on the booze…..as for Mom, she was sole sane parent just as you and I are.

      Keep walking.

      • My dad has no money so she is not with him for that. I think I know why they are with each other and I see the relationship for what it is. Thank you my mum did the solo parenting even before he left so it wasn’t much different. My dad is a much better grandad than he was a dad. I don’t know if it’s for image management or if he is actually trying to make up for when we were children. I only control me so I will keep on waking from ex for mine and the children’s sake.

        • “My Dad is one of the rare ones who is still with the OW he left my mum for. They have been together for 16 years now. I think this is mostly because my Dad didn’t suffer any consequences for his serial adultery.”

          And he does not wish to suffer ANY consequences going forward so he stays put for now. That and/or the OW is still a good source of narcissistic supply and/or he does not have the next supply person lined up yet, and/or his own idea of image management demands he not be multiple-divorced.

          “They were the type that stayed friends because my mum said it was just easier.”

          Another way of looking at this might be that your mom was correct about the benefits of strategically making nice with a disordered person to avoid being attacked. You note one downside to this though, it seems you did not get the truth about your FOO and now it is “all the more difficult to navigate my situation. It also makes me think that maybe my ex and young schmoopie will be happy and I’ll be seen as the bitter ex wife who can’t be friendly for the sake of the children.” I totally get that concern. Please trust that they suck. Please trust that any happiness is illusory. Disordered folks are never authentically happy. And your own childhood tells you loud and clear that “friendly for the sake of the children” can also be affirmatively bad for children if it leads to them becoming exploited as adults and doubting themselves and their reality.

          I’ve had a lot of therapy and most of it has had to do with figuring out my subtly dysfunctional FOO, and why being with an unbeknownst-to-me-covert-narc for 15 years ever felt normal to me, why I spackled, etc. But the truth is I was happy more often than not, until the Discard which lastest 2 weeks, which was mercifully quick.

          To the outside world, I am ridiculously amicable. To my children privately, I protect their future mental health by being truthful but kind and not disparaging. It’s a fine line, but I really think kids needs to be sure they are not to blame and know when mom is just making nice but has legit reasons for feeling differently about the unjustness of the situation in her heart!

    • My serial-cheating dad was with his third wife (all but my mom were OWs) … for more than two decades. But, he cheated on her throughout the marriage. And, yes, he eventually left her too … for a much younger model … someone I graduated high school with. Gross. So gross.

      My dad almost didn’t leave his last wife for the latest OW. Why was he torn? Because “I love MY house and it will cost a lot of money.” There was ZERO consideration for the women he was involved with.

      My point: really, they don’t change their spots. Not at all. They get older, more comfortable with their lifestyles, better at hiding their cheating … but serial cheaters do not change. Every single OW in my dad’s cheating world eventually got their karma bus. Dad … him too. He’s very ill, lost most of his money in the divorce, has a young wife to “entertain,” and is now the step-dad to three kids younger than all but one of his grandkids. (He hated being a dad to his OWN kids …. .)

      • I think my dad did say to my mum that he is too old now to find anyone else so he will stay with OW. OW couldn’t have any children so she was much more available to him than my mum was. My dad and my ex gave similar reasons for cheating. They both couldn’t handle their wives giving their own children attention. I think I worry because I see my ex’s leaving after his only (as far as I know) affair as something negative about me. I know deep down that this would only have been true if he had left me before he cheated. I guess I just find it hard to acknowledge that he probably never loved me and was not invested in our family like I was.

        • Pregnant Chump, IT’S NOT YOU. It’s HIM and YOUR DAD!! That is not normal for a man to act this way when his kids are born. I think I told you this already as I can relate a lot to your story, but my now ex-husband was soooo jealous of our son when he was born. He never came out and said it, but he exhibited some really bizarre behavior at times and also just seemed angry at me for absolutely no reason and would make snide comments to me about my parenting or things related to our son. And then when I was pregnant with our second born, I’m now 100% convinced he had an affair during my pregnancy and after she was born. What your cheater is doing to you has nothing to do with you. It’s him!! There is something wrong with him!! This is NOT normal behavior for a new dad or any decent husband or father. I have wrestled with the fact the my ex never loved me. I don’t think he’s capable of truly loving and bonding with another person. I do believe he thought he loved me, but I think he just loved how I made him feel at the moment. He loved how I took good care of him — even though now he said I never took good care of him — rewriting history. I know I loved him, but the person I loved never truly existed. It very hard to wrap your mind and heart around it all, I know and I’m very sorry. It sucks and so do they.

        • One thing that helped me a LOT with my self-doubt he fostered in me …

          Getting a 1,000-yard perspective. How would I look at some stranger who acted as my STBX did? He cheated; he shirked responsibility; he refused accountability; he blamed the victim; he cared more about the sad sausage between his legs than he did his own children. What would I think about a guy like that? That he’s a shitty, pathetic, overgrown infant in a man’s body.

          Now, why on earth would I give my STBX credit for being better than the above description when that description is precisely who he is? Why was I not holding him to the same standard I would hold ANYONE else to? Why would I not condemn him wholly for this behavior when I know I could never live with myself if I acted the same way?

          Sadly, I had to learn how to hold the jackass accountable. From there, my self-doubt dissipated pretty quickly.

          Keep fighting the good fight. You will get to the other side of this.

        • Standard complaint. Mine said I gave the kids too much of my attention as well. Those kids that he wanted at least as much or more than I did. He talked me into number 3 (no regrets there) and is upset I never let him talk me into number 4. He also wanted them to be model children which also requires time and attention. Total idiots the lot of them. It definitely isn’t us.

          There is nothing wrong with giving your toddler and newborn the attention they need. If he wanted your attention he should have spent time with you helping with the kids. Then it could have been an activity you both shared together. Instead he chose to be a selfish twat.

    • Pregnant Chump, everybody’s situation is different (affairs are always bad, just not always in the same way) and what worked for your Mom isn’t going to work for you. In your case your cheater will make things worse for you if you try to remain friends. That might not have been true for your Mom.

      I will admit that I also remain mostly friendly (on the surface) towards ex because it is “just easier” in my case. This is because my ex has been financially fair and is reasonable about coordinating kids and parenting and I don’t want to give him a reason stop. In your case, Being friends with your cheater may not make any difference in how he treats you and your children and the bottom line is that it would make you feel worse. Your kids are also young enough that they don’t already have a relationship with their Dad or a history of having a “family unit” that includes their Dad so they aren’t really going to feel the loss of that if you aren’t friends with him going forward. You are under no obligation to be friends with the person who hurt you.

      In my case I do encourage our kids (who are older) to continue to have a relationship with their Dad because he has been around long enough to be their Dad and I don’t want them to feel discarded the way I do. The tricky part is maintaining this general amicability with ex while still making it clear to my kids that I am justifiably angry at what he did and it isn’t ok. I have told daughter that her life will be easier if she can at least learn to tolerate Schmoopie and I will never hold it against her if she chooses to like her, but that I retain the right to not like her myself (do as I say, not as I do). It is a very fine line to walk between “being friends” and still sticking up for myself and maintaining my dignity. Sometimes I am not sure if I am doing the right thing, but I think my kids are old enough and smart enough that they get it. Dad screwed up and Mom is doing the best she can to manage the situation to our benefit.

      We all have to do what is best for us and nobody should judge that. You do what works for you.

      • PS. And really, what are the odds that two people in your life (Dad and ex) will both beat the odds and have a long term relationship with the OW? And as others have said, even if they do stay together, they will probably be miserable and just too lazy to “swing to the next branch”. It sounds like your Dad was perhaps older than your ex so is probably just too worn out to swing again. Your cheater is probably younger and likely will swing again if Schmoopie doesn’t do it first.

        Still, I understand your anxiety in that regard because I have it too.

      • My mum actually said what my ex did to me was far worse than what my dad did to her. My dad also continued and even continues to this day to support my mum financially. Ex just gives me the minimum child support required by law which doesn’t even cover half the rent. It’s also true that my dad was nearly 20 years older than my ex when he left my Mum. I see both of them for what they are but they are my available childcare. Owife couldn’t have children but she is good with the kids and my dad is a much better grandad than he was dad.

        • Exactly, your situation requires a different response than your mom’s. Not that it was ok for your Dad to cheat on your Mom and leave for O-wife, but it may have been ok for your Mom to remain friends and ok for you not to.

  • OMG!!!! Thank you Chump Lady- I needed the laugh this morning!!!! Your answer is perfect!!!!! These OW and cheaters are all severely disordered!!!!!

  • Yes, DB has the sadz. Maybe a song will cheer her up. Here’s a little something you can hum too (it goes along to the tune of “Henry the 8th I am” done by Hermans’ Hermits.

    I’m Sparkletwat the 8th I am,
    Sparkletwat the 8th I am, I am.
    I fucked the guy in the office next door,
    He’s been fucking 7 others before.
    And all of them were Sparkletwats,
    Sparkly Sparkletwats is what they were.
    I’m his 8th old vagina I’m Sparkletwat,
    Sparkletwat the 8th I am, I am ,
    Sparkletwat the 8th I am!
    (Second verse, same as the first)

  • I’m assuming a troll wrote this. If not, then it is proof that the OM/OW are very dim. This of course is a pre-requisite for fuck fests (aka as affairs) as per Chump Lady.
    I am so happy that this affair partner won this prize from his former wife. His former wife was married to a whorefucking fucker.
    Eh…..buckle up baby…….all you’re hopes and dreams are based upon a very slippery foundation of deceit, pain, and a wandering penis that apparently falls into lots of whore holes.
    Please marry him!!!!!!

  • This letter just really makes me sad. Not even a little bit mad.

    It really proves to me that cheaters do not care. They will never care. Cheaters are about themselves and themselves only.

    Cheaters don’t understand Chumps and they don’t feel anything that Chumps feel. To equate being the OW to being a Chump is pure delusion.

    The one thing I’ve gotten from this letter is that I really do trust that Cheaters suck. 100%

  • If this doesn’t show that cheating ISN’T about love and connection, that it is about bad character, zero empathy, shallowness, selfishness, cruelty and lack of attachment, then I am not a chump.

    What do they say the qualities needed to be an OW?

    1. to be stupid.
    2. to be available.

    The end.

  • LOL
    So, to be clear, you service married men who salivate at the thought of your magnificent vagina. I mean, being a cum dumpster doesn’t make you special.
    Every woman (to my knowledge) has a vagina. So that’s a lot of vaginas in the world. Some vaginas are easier to penetrate than others. Yours just happens to be one of them. That doesn’t mean very much when you consider ALL the vaginas in the world.
    You know?? Some men like vaginas that have easy access. They like the owners of those vaginas to drop and spread whenever they want.
    You are just a cum dumpster easy access kinda gal. Lots of you out there. Spotlighting your “special ability to capture married men” isn’t that special in reality.
    If you read here then you are well aware of the wisdom and wit of chumps. Honey, we are far from stupid. We simply don’t understand the ability to be walking, talking cumdumpsters. We be too busy with work, our children, our homes, etc. I mean, I don’t think our #1 goal for any given day is to fuck married men (or otherwise)
    I’m not trying to insult you, or direct your thinking to your inapparent self worth that does, incidentally, in fact, scream sociopath. I don’t believe a word you say. Sociopaths don’t advertise their deceit. You are just a sad walking, talking, cumdumpster.
    Don’t come here to get beat up on. It’s stupid. We don’t care about who you share your vagina with. We are well aware that people like you exist. We dont need to know how you conduct your life, nor do we care.
    Like I said, being an easy lay is not special. If you chose to conduct your vagina like that, that is your business. Advertising your free vagina on this site won’t snag too many men looking for your type of lady.
    I think our man chumps have more class.
    I hope you don’t get pregnant and have a baby. You would be a horrible mother.
    Peace out LOL.

  • The OP sounds like the OW in my second chumping. She writes continuously on her blog about having to stay hypervigilant because she knows how it all started with cheating. I warned her! I even begged her not to send him back. Then she went and had three kids in 2.5 years with him. I call that good n’ stuck with a fuckwit. Until he decides to push the boat out again. Hahahahaha.

    • Your exes OW writes a blog about being the OW? Seriously? Has she no shame? Unbelievable! That must be a bit of joy to read. lol

      • I can’t name her of course, but she is a “mommy blogger” who spends a lot of time publishing quasi-tabloid attention seeking articles, poorly written, and usually about either 1. How much of a dumbass ex-cheater is as a father, 2. All the reasons why she thinks her 3 year old son is gay, and 3. her latest consumer complaints aka. her constant attempts to get stuff for free or obtain refunds for things she has purchased. She publishes a V-log about their boring family life, just pathetic. And finally, she and ex appeared on the British version of Jerry Springer claiming to be having ‘bedroom issues’ because she was getting too fat.

        Every month or so, she finds a new physical or emotional diagnosis to match her symptoms, has had herself declared disabled so she gets benefits, and cheater stays home and collects benefits for being her carer. Despite this, they manage to take cruises with their three brats in tow and travel all over Britain enjoying free nights in trailer parks she reviews on her blogs. And oddly, she regularly writes about making £1500 a month from her blog ads.

        No, you can’t make this stuff up. It actually happens.

        I was totally appalled that I could have ever had a friendship let alone a relationship with that guy.

        • Marci I’m guessing your talking about Jeremy Kyle? It’s so embarrassing that our stories are the kind that would appear on these programs. I used to watch it all the time when I was younger but I know it would make me angry to watch it now.

          • Well, at least it wasn’t my story that appeared on JK, but it was cheater and the OW, about two years together, who decided to rent themselves out as a spectacle. Likely one of their crazy money-making schemes. Very little of the stuff on JK is real life, it’s really just a manufactured circus.

            It just really is an example of how cheaters have no fundamental self respect. Their self hatred is so strong that they will resort to anything for attention and reassurance that someone, anyone, will pay attention to them. Then they conveniently forget their foolish behaviour and expect folks to take them seriously.

            I actually get a big laugh out of the comments she gets on her blog. Mostly sympathetic other airhead bloggers who have nothing better to do than message each other.

  • High fives all around.
    I was reading that letter thinking she is getting ready to get ripped a new one in correction of thought. 🙂
    Chump Lady you did not disappoint.
    Thank you.
    I might just print this one off.
    The entitlement in her letter is what we lived with and what we got away from. When the hopium and/or thoughts that I caused the cheating starts to tickle my thoughts Im going to be ready with this letter and your response to bring me back to reality.

  • Wow, lol.

    What happened in your life, that you need to take revenge? That wife has done nothing to you, but you get a kick out of helping hurting her. What is it about her that fires your contempt?

    That is a bit inhumane and sad. Please please, don’t have any children. Just keep having fun on your own terms.

    • Yes, so much good Lewis Carroll-esque cheater vocab invention going on here, but CL definitely had me laughing at Sparkletwat, LOL.

  • As much as I hate to quote myself, Schmoopie, “If you are looking for sympathy here you shall find it in a dictionary between shit and syphilis.”

    You sowed, so reap.

    Mehphista

  • You forgot to say “na na na na boo boo, I got yer man…”

    People like you suffer from having to live as themselves, unless they’re sociopaths. In that case, you’re only nominally human anyway, so it
    Would make as much sense to be offended that a cat kills mice. Either way, you’re not really triggering anyone here

  • Okay, let me get this straight. Dumb Bunny chose to trash her 21 year marriage for a glorious future with a jerk who bragged about cheating with no fewer than 8 women during his 17 year marriage. And after choosing that confessed and unrepentant serial cheater, she is concerned that she might have an unrepentant serial cheater on her hands?

    Sweetheart, he read the label out loud to you to be sure that you knew what you were buying. DB, indeed.

  • DB,
    Let me get this straight . . . you’re with a man who you cheated with who was married for 17 years, and admits to you that you’re #8? You’re with a man who admits to fucking his wife’s best friend for 15 YEARS? You’re with a man who admits that this was HIS best friend’s wife? Isn’t there a part of your brain that says you can’t trust someone who does this to his best friend and wife?

    And explain to me how your “naiveté” made you believe that it was a one time thing when it lasted for 15 fucking years? HOW IN THE EVER LOVING FUCK IS THAT A ONE TIME THING? Just that alone blows my mind, not to mention the stripper etc.:

    You’re not a chump. You thought you were special enough to turn him and surprise, you’re not. Now you’re destined to be one of the nameless rabble of “victims” of this serial fuck-stick and you deserve it. You bought and paid for the sleepless nights, the quiet nagging eventuality that he’ll do it to you.

    I’d wager he’s cheating on you already and always has been. But that may be the best thing for you. Maybe you’ll learn something and won’t do this to someone else again.

  • I just want to say thank you CL and CN. This is one of the best days ever in the blog. So many funny responses! We are a witty bunch. I’ve laughed so much and so hard today that I’m getting concerned that the other people in my office are going to think I’ve lost it. “Say, is that Beth guffawing back there in her office or is she having some sort of attack? Maybe we should check on her?”

    P.S. Tracy, since you get so many of these letters, maybe this can be a monthly (or weekly?) thing. It is so cathartic to be able to say all the shit we don’t get to say to our cheaters or their APs while we’re in the midst of the hell they created for us.

  • This post has made my week.

    I’ve been going through another round of hell, as my 12 year old son recently expressed that he’s been having suicidal thoughts and was briefly hospitalized. Exhole thinks it’s due to some bullying he experienced last year in school (which has since stopped and he has a great group of friends). I’m like, really, asshat? you don’t think this has anything to do with the fact that you remarried less than two years after we separated, and son knows that you were fucking his wonderful new step mommy for 2 years before mom and dad split up? You don’t think maybe it’s because this sweet boy, who adores and idolizes his dad, is having a really hard time reconciling his love for you with your deplorable behavior? 7th grade is fucking hard enough without having your entire life turned upside down. This is ex’s chickens coming home to roost, and our children are suffering the consequences.

    • Damn CIT, I hate how badly they hurt the kids. I hope your son feels better soon. That father/son idealization dynamic is hard to shake, especially when they’re at a vulnerable age. My son still has trouble with it and he was older when DDay #2 happened and we split up. Big hugs to you and your boy.

      • Thank you – he’s doing much better. It came as such a shock – he really seemed to be doing fine, seemed happy, doing well in school, etc. But as his therapist said, he’s really invested in being “the good kid,” happy, well adjusted and rolling with the punches, not wanting to deal with being angry or sad. I’m so grateful he said something before he hurt himself and was brave enough to reach out to me, but it kills me to know he’s been hurting so much.
        I hope your son has gotten/continues to get the help he needs to cope with all of this.

        • This scares me a bit. My daughter has had plenty to say on this matter and is therefore processing her emotions. The boys, however are silent and that worries me. I know they love their Dad and don’t quite know how to process his behavior.

          • Boys are tough when it comes to communication. The only advice I can give is to be hyper vigilant about changes in behavior and be very clear that they can talk to you about anything. It’s okay and understandable for them to feel angry and hurt by their parents, but they need to talk about it and not stuff it down or else it will come out in other harmful ways. Hugs!

    • Oh my! I’m so sorry.

      This is my son as well (falling completely apart, but not suicidal) – only he’s 14. He idolized his father at his father’s insistence, and now his father says the boy shouldn’t have put him on a pedestal and just needs to realize that he’s only human!

      I love that this cheater wrote in because it reminds me AGAIN (and I do need to be reminded periodocally) that they really do think they’re special.

      They’d have us believe that they aren’t the BAD people because they were in unhappy unions. They are really GOOD people who just had to sneak around, hide communications, lie to their families, and break their vows, but oh wait they didn’t really break our vows because they never had sex until after they were separated…and if you believe all that then you’re either the mother of one of them or a cheater yourself!

      • I’m sorry your son is having such a hard time. And I love the way these people work “Sorry you were disappointed that I care more about my selfish needs to be “happy” and “fulfilled” than I do about your emotional wellbeing, son. I’m only human!”
        barf.

    • I’m so sorry to hear about your son, ChumpinTraining. It’s good he shared with you how he was feeling and you were able to get him help. I hope and pray that he gets the help he needs, whether it be meds and talk therapy or both. Oh, these stupid, selfish cheaters get me so angry when I hear how they hurt their kids! The just don’t care, because life is all about themselves and their “happiness.”

      My kids were 100% blindsided by my ex-cheater wanting a divorce. They thought their parents had a great marriage (I thought it was pretty good too even though I did a lot of spackling over the years) and I remember my son crying and said, “But you and mom never fight and seem so happy.” 🙁 Seeing my kids sob and being depressed was heartbreaking will never forgive him for what he did to them. My ex-cheater even laughed and did the narc smirk and said, “I guess I just gave the kids the Father Wound.” Only a narc would laugh and smirk about hurting his own children. My daughter hasn’t been the same since. She always made the Honor Roll, but hasn’t made it once since the day her dad said he was leaving me. He made up this bs story to the kids that we “both” wanted the divorce and I was MIGHTY and set the record straight that it was HIM that wanted the divorce and then four months later I set the record even straighter and told the kids about the whore and what their dad did. He denied, denied that he was leaving me for the whore, but he was dating her within a very short time after we moved out (he wouldn’t move out). Anyhoo, our daughter hasn’t been the same since. I keep watching her for signs of deep depression. I can tell she’s not the happy, careful girl she used to be and I worry about her. Just a FYI if you don’t know this already (I just learned this in nursing school) — if your son all of a sudden gets really happy — that could be a red flag that he might harm himself. I don’t want to scare you, but I know not everyone knows the signs of suicide. (((HUGS))) to you and your son. I hope you both heal and get better very soon.

      • “My ex-cheater even laughed and did the narc smirk and said, “I guess I just gave the kids the Father Wound.”
        Unfuckingbelievable. to his credit, exhole is not at all callous or cavalier when it comes to our son’s pain, but he has a giant howorker shaped blind spot when trying to identify some of the causes of it.
        I’m sorry your kids are suffering. I know all of us here would take it all on ourselves if we could.

        • That’s good your cheater isn’t calloused, but I’m not one bit surprised that he cannot see he is the cause of your sons suffering. On more than one occasion, my ex was robotic-like, cold and callous to our kids sobbing uncontrollably. I’ll never forget the pain he caused them. There is something very disordered about a person who can act this way with their own children. He did not care one bit that they were suffering. But then he was all sad sausage about himself and his victimhood. I hope one day he suffers as much as he has made me and his family suffer.

          • Debating since this is sort of off the topic today but these posts are relevant.

            I am fuming because I just got an email from the kid’s therapist who is supposed to try and reconcile kids with dad because dad wants it.

            Here is the line that sums up the e mail which asks me to meet with therapist and Stbx: The discussion will center on how to support each other’s relationship with the children ( mom’s relationship with the children; dad’s relationship with the children) while also simultaneously unifying the support for each other as parents. Can this appointment time work for you?

            I replied that I did not want to meet with Stbx and said therapist could call me if he wants to discuss further.

            I would really appreciate all your levelheaded chump advice on how to tell the therapist that I would sooner go into a cage with a grizzly bear than try to have a discussion with Stbx. He lies and he wants to hurt me. I am not going to ignore my intuition on this one. I was having a hard enough time with the therapist going in with the kids as their protection. He would not be there to protect me but as a neutral party.

            STBX had his chance and that ship has sailed. I think Stbx is attempting to triangulate with the therapist. It is not happening for me.

            All wisdom appreciated. I have to appear sane for the court case.

            • Trust your gut, FeelingIt. I was in MC with my ex-cheater and he charmed and gaslit our pastor for three months. And then he charmed the kids counselor and kids attorney. I sat in once with the kids counselor (thankfully they didn’t want to go anymore). Just being in the room with that fucking cheater and liar made my skin crawl. I’d do anything for my kids, but there is no way I’d be in the same room someone like him ever again! Why can’t you go see the therapist with just you and your kids? And he could go by himself. You could just tell the therapist you don’t feel safe in the same room with your STBX . Good luck.

              • Martha,

                You know exactly how I feel!

                I learned on this site, you have to trust your gut.

                That is why we are here, we didn’t and we spackled!

                Best to you!

            • Feelingit–Was this “reconciliation” court-ordered? How old are you kids? Did the therapist suggest the recon with dad? How do the children feel? All these things play a role in what strategy you should adopt (and it DOES NOT entail getting into a room with your emotional abuser).

              • It wasn’t court ordered. Stbx asked for it after I stopped being his communication bridge with the children as I figured out it’s not my job any more. I volunteered to have the children go. My lawyer said a judge would probably wonder why the kids weren’t in counseling as it seems to be expected these days. He said a judge would grant a request for counseling so I would be ahead of the game. The two kids in counseling are 13 and 15.

                I thought the therapist understood I would have nothing to do with Stbx but obviously I am wrong. He knows that stbx blames everything on me no exaggeration. I need to be firm and let him know in no uncertain terms that I will not be in the room with him. Stbx is a controlling narc who is the pinnacle of self centeredness.

                Today is middle son’s birthday and once again he received the standard $15 fast food gift card in the mail for his birthday (other children get the same gift). STBX is extremely well off so in my opinion it is the equivalent of leaving a waiter who gives you poor service a very low tip. It says Ii didn’t forget, you just aren’t worth much.

                All you chumps get it but courts and therapists don’t seem to.

            • No truer statement >>>”That is why we are here, we didn’t and we spackled!” This is one of the biggest lessons I’ve learned — trust my gut and I trust it now all the time! And it’s a beautiful thing to trust yourself. 🙂

              FeelingIt, Happy Birthday to your son! I hope you were able to make it a good day for him. Geesh, his dad sucks even being a dad! $15.00 gift card for a birthday present for your own child?!! The fricken Tooth Fairy gives some kids better gifts than that. All the best to you and I know you will look like the sane parent in court, because you are the sane parent!! 🙂

              • Feelingit,
                Just reading your posts. I am so sorry about your ex’s treatment of your Son on his birthday.
                The nerve, when he could afford to give something special, something remarkable to his son, but he gives him a 15 dollar fast food gift card, indicating he did not forget his birthday, but felt that was all he was worth. How heartless.
                One day, your son will forget his dad because HE just isn’t worth it. HE isn’t even worth a burger, small fries and a small drink. Nowadays 15 dollars barely covers a combo meal at a fast food restaurant.
                Too bad your ex doesn’t see it how we see it. HE is the one not worth a 15 dollar gift card.
                Hold your head high, Feelingit, YOU are the sane, present, loving parent! ( the child birthday celebration maker)
                You and your son are mighty.
                I love you both and I wish I could have baked your precious Son a cake.

                Love,
                Peacekeeper

                (Your ex makes me livid, treating a child this way).

            • FeelingIt, the trouble with therapists is that they are brought up on this whole Rogerian thing of client centred therapy, when they really do need to study personality disorders a bit more.

              There ARE people out there who do not want to meet half way. There ARE people out there who do not hesitate to lie, manipulate, deceive and play dirty in order to get what they want. There ARE people out there who see other people as objects to be used as required and discarded when not required, for self gratification. There ARE people out there who make up the rules and play to them without disclosing those internal rules, in order to gain an advantage.

              Therapists need to wise up.

              It is what the children want, that counts.

    • CIT, I’m saving very similar issues with my 13 year old boy, a sweet funny wierd (in a good – no, fantastic – way) lad who is so stressed and pressurized at the moment that he gets out of school by leaving the house before the school bus arrives – he hid from me under a bed yesterday, a boy taller than me.

      I know he’d have had issues with school anyway because he’s such an original free-thinker but our looong car crash breakup MUST have had an impact on him that his Dad seems to be failing or refusing to recognize. Last night his Dad had a long chat with him and he’s at school today. Was it attention from his Dad that he needed? Because I doubt he or our other two kids have felt they’ve got much of Dad’s attention for most of our family life. I’m glad it helped him to get back to school but it does upset me a little that it looks like his Dad solved a problem that I couldn’t.

  • DB (OW),
    Just wanted to let you know- getting married to your AP does not legitimize you.
    You will always be OW. Why? Because marriage means nothing to you. And to him. Have fun policing!

  • It just makes my day knowing how miserable these cheaters actually are once they “win” the object of their demented affection. It warms my heart to know they are now the marriage or relationship police with their twu luv soul mates! I occasionally read blogs that OW’s write in to for advice and I thoroughly enjoy reading about their angst and anger when the relationship flounders. They are so indignant when they find out they weren’t really all that special. And if the cheater pants returns to the spouse and leaves the OW/OM you should read the bitter comments then, SPECTACULAR! I have actually tried to explain to these brainless twats that they have not a leg to stand on because what they did was adultery and it’s wrong, but then they attack me with their venomous comments. I’ve been accused of being a bitter ex wife, loser, religious zealot for suggesting that they probably should not have slept with a married person, you name it! They have been wronged by cheaterpants and they want sympathy damn it, not common sense and me being all judgy! It’s a crackup actually. These bitches be crazy!

  • These aren’t the brightest women Roberta. However, to bash the loyal spouse or expect empathy from any one of us is pure entitlement.

    She had ‘only one’ affair after all. She’s doing the comparative analysis with a serial cheating sociopath. See, in her eyes she’s not so bad; a chump, mind you!

    That’s one special fucknut right there. And she vomited! Haha.

  • I have *zero* sympathy for this OW. As Ann Landers said, “If you marry a man who cheats on his wife, you marry a man who cheats on his wife.”

    Karma’s a bitch. Enjoy the ride.

  • CL,
    The next time a cheater or AP contact you, I would keep answers super short, to avoid giving too much attention to their pity party. For example, for this question, I would’ve simply answered:

    The definition of a chump is someone who was unwittingly duped. Since you wittingly duped your husband and helped this man dupe another, you’re not a chump. The chumps are the man you duped and the woman you helped get duped. Bye.

  • I hope he does cheat on you, so you can experience firsthand what a horrible thing you did to your previous husband. It would be karma.

  • A lifetime ago, I was left by my then husband with a note on our bedroom door. After a four year marriage (and no children, thankfully!), he informed me through said note that he no longer wanted to be married anymore, and he wanted to concentrate on his career. I never spoke to or saw him again. I found out shortly after his note that he was having an affair. The woman that he left me for was almost six years older than us, with three different children from two different men. Her first child was born when she was fifteen. Understandably, I was shocked and devastated. I am ashamed to admit that even after I found out about the affair, I wanted him back. I thought he would “come to his senses”. My very old school grandmother told me in no uncertain terms that women with self respect don’t allow their husbands to behave as he had and still stay with them. Everyone… and I mean everyone.. told me that it would not last. I hoped and prayed they were right. I spent years hoping for karma and revenge. I got neither, and eventually, I was able to move on and recover from the trauma. They are still married to each other, and they had two children together, bringing her total to 5 children from three different men. I have no idea as to the state of their marriage, or any details of their relationship. It has been 29 years since my D Day, and I honestly don’t care. With time, came clarity. Though I DO NOT condone cheating, I realized years later that he obviously must not have loved me. A hard pill to swallow, but the truth. About six years ago, an acquaintance of mine through my children younger years went through a divorce. Very cliche, her husband met his now wife through his gym. She was a personal trainer, and he was a client. I ran into her at the grocery store, and she was telling me all the details in the produce section. It brought up lots of old memories, and of course, I felt terrible for her. But one detail stuck with me. She said something to the effect of “The two of them blew up two happy fifteen year marriages, and devastated three children.” But the thing is, they didn’t. What they did was lie and cheat. Justify what you will, people in happy marriages do not cheat. They don’t disrespect their spouses. They simply don’t. I’m sure she was happy, but I can guarantee you that he was not. Her now ex husband has been remarried since their divorce was finalized, and they are still married. I am thankful that I did not have any children with my now ex husband. The trauma I went through I would not wish on anyone, and yes, very, very early on, I wished that he would come home. But trauma has a funny way of imparting wisdom. I realize now that if it had not been her then, it would have been someone else later. For reasons that will remain forever unknown to me, he could not stay in our marriage. But would I have preferred that he stayed and played along as a happy husband, even though I know now that he was not? Absolutely not. I have no idea what he told his now wife when they were together during our marriage, but it is irrelevant. I would hesitate to default to labeling someone as stupid, or idiotic because they believe a confirmed liar when he says that this time he is telling the truth. By and large, with or without emotional disorders, most of these men are lying, cheating, opportunistic manipulators, and they are damn good at it. This explains how so many of us have experienced multiple D Days before finally catching on and leaving. People are no less intelligent for believing them even when they are not married to them.

    • People in unhappy marriages share that. Say I’m unhappy, I need this or that or I’m done. Scum cheat. I had a dream that my wife was having an affair. This dream was after she met him who knows if the physical affair had started, don’t know if I can believe her timeline. I woke in a panic, sweating. For the first time ever I told her about a dream. She said she’d never cheat. I said if she was ever unhappy, just leave me, it would hurt but not nearly as much as cheating. She said things were fine and she wouldn’t cheat. DDay was less than six months away. She says she doesn’t remember this but doesn’t deny it. I will never know if it was coincidence or intuition. If my wife was unhappy, I opened the door and told her to walk through it if she must but don’t cheat. She cheated. I also when I caught a text from
      Him, about four months before DDay, she says before anything was going on, I said OK do what you want but remember I get half (this was her catch phrase she said to me whenever I talked about a girl) well that’s coming true too.

      • Betrayed and Confused, do not dimish your dream. That’s your subconscience telling you what’s going on before you know. For a good two years I woke up around 1:30 multiple times a week with a horrible dream that I was all alone in the world and my heart would be racing and my chest would be covered in sweat.

        About two years later, I woke up the same way about midnight, but this time was different. My now X was on a “business dinner” with bankers from NYC and my gut instinct told me something was immediately wrong. My first thought is that they went to Canada to see strippers (X had a problem with strippers 14 yrs before). Well, it was worse. He was on a date with a newly divorced whore. And now we are divorced and the whore is his girlfriend.

        The cheaters timeline is never the truth. Trust your dreams and your gut! And go for the kill. She doesn’t deserve half.

    • “Justify what you will, people in happy marriages do not cheat.”

      The data do not fully support your claim. Shirley Glass, who launched the first real research into infidelity, found that about 54% of men and 33% of women who cheated reported being perfectly happy in their marriages. Yes, some people are more tempted to cheat because they are not content in their relationships. But a significant number of others cheat because they can. Because they like the thrill of the conquest. Because they like novel sex. My X was a serial cheater across two marriages (yes, my stupid for being the second). But I have evidence he cheated 3 months after the wedding, when we were still blissful, 3 months after I said, “I Do” so strongly that many of the wedding guests commented on it. But he liked his one-night stands at conferences and seducing adoring students, and he wasn’t going to give that up for anyone.

      My story is not unique. Some cheaters may indeed by tempted out of unhappiness, but many of them have impulse control issues and like the excitement of sex with strangers, or the power in pulling off deception to an unsuspecting spouse..

      Being unhappy in a marriage is not a sufficient condition for cheating; it requires a character deficiency.

      • Tempest, let me give you the full reply I got to my first anguished cry of “WHY??????”

        – “Because she was a new c**t and a new pair of t**s”

        Not a word of a lie.

        Then later, ‘because she liked me and said nice things to me’

        It is hard to articulate exactly why that is so devastating in terms of its message of misogyny, detachment, hostility and entitlement. That is the connection, attachment and value after 15 years of a marriage ‘I thought’ was quite happy with really wonderful children.

        • It occurs to me that the truest reactions I got from my cheating wife were the ones I got in the very immediate aftermath of being caught. Like what your husband said, they were raw and unprocessed (unsanitized, if you like). And very revealing!

    • I’m sorry but I totally disagree with this. People who are in happy marriages DO cheat. Some people are bottomless pits in need of affection and attention; they don’t cheat because they’re unhappy, they cheat because they’re greedy and want more affirmation than one human can possibly provide them, but no matter how much they get they will look for more. It’s a mental sickness.

      Look, CL uses the cake analogy and it’s great here. Most of us like a slice of cake, it makes us happy. But we know that if we eat too much cake, we’ll get fat and sick. We are wired healthily and if someone puts another slice infront of us after we’ve had our fill, we’ll push it aside and go “oh no, I possibly couldn’t”. Many cheaters aren’t wired like that. They know they’re happy & contented but they can’t stop there. They have to have the next slice, & even if it makes them sick they can’t stop eating. What i’m describing is addiction, and I think you could replace Cake with Alcohol or any other addiction and it still works. Most people know how to get to a happy state and then stop. Cheaters don’t have that control. It’s nothing to do with how happy they were.

      My STBX was not unhappy, until she got caught, of course. Up until that point she was writing me love notes, telling me she was so lucky to have me, I filled her heart with joy, she loved me so much, etc.6 weeks before she told me she’d go anywhere in the world just as long as she got to be with me. There was a brief period after being caught where she was willing to admit “There was just no real reason” & “I really fucked up”, then she flipped into 100% self preservation mode and claimed to friends and family she was always unhappy. Which is presumably why she’d been so keen on marrying me the year before, after 5 previous years together.

      All her complaints about how unhappy she was are demonstrably false; “he was pressuring me to have children” – err, no, I told her that I wasn’t sure about it, but that I knew that we’d have a great life together whatever we decided, SHE wrote me the card saying that I’d be a great Dad & she hoped we’d have a kid together. “He never let me go out and just enjoy myself on my own” – what about all those ‘nights out with friends/colleagues’ that she used as cover for an affair? Apparently me saying “OK Baby, just let me know roughly when you’ll be home” so I wouldn’t worry was ‘controlling’? And so on and so forth.

      The “unhappy defence” is rolled out to make cheaters look more justified because even a 1st time cheater learns very quickly that saying “I was actually really happy, i’m just a shitstain of a human being” gets them ostracised. It’s easier to lie to people, because people will nod and say “well, she may have really hurt him, but she couldn’t be expected to stay in an unhappy marriage”. As chumps, we must not buy into their narrative.

    • I also believe that people in happy marriages don’t cheat crap to start with. This was from when my ex-MIL said he was just so unhappy. This may have been true, but I have realised that any unhappiness he felt had nothing to do with what I did or didn’t do. We were not in an unhappy marriage. I was in a marriage with a selfish entitled idiot. This idiot planned a child with me and then decided to begin an affair less than 2 months after DD’s conception. This in my opinion is what disordered people. There was plenty of opportunity to say I’m not happy maybe we shouldn’t have this baby. He chose instead to lie and do all the other abusive things cheaters do and then he chose to leave me to continue my pregnancy alone and to be a single mum to a toddler and a newborn. The truth of the matter is that disordered people choose to disrespect their spouse. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the marriage just about one of the people in it.

  • I am saving this one, Tracy.

    I am saving it so when Mrs. Dumbass contacts me about the Evil One, I will give her this post.

    Bravo!
    Standing ovation!!!

    Memo
    To: DB
    From: Unsinkable Molly

    RE: you’re a damn idiot

    DB,

    You, like your sparkling turd you won, may go to the ends of the earth through space and time, and still be absolute shit-bags.
    Enjoy the life you’ve created for yourselves.

    Molly

  • Chump Lady – I fucking love you and your logic! Preach Queen Preach! I happen to love these OW posts – these stupid bitches need a smack down. Once a whore always a whore – I only did it once . . . boo hoo – doing it once still makes you a paranoid whore who won the ultimate STD prize, congrats now get the fuck out of Chump land. This sewer rat needs to go seek relationship advice from the loser who was married when she fucked him and decided it would be a good idea to live with, who is currently banging strippers on the side and telling her about it – bitch should be paranoid she’s no better then the stripper. Lol!!! I just loved this article so so much – I think you just made my freakin year!!!!

  • Well said CL, your a Champion!
    For years I have had to tolerate the OW (was a friend & business receptionist that I employed!!!) at all our family functions. I had to for the sake of my kids otherwise she was trying to take my kids too! I also had to rely on her for sons asthma meds when he stayed over with his Dad & OW…Dad’s a self absorbed alcoholic & OW suffers from agrophobia etc…but, doesn’t drink due to her meds!
    Finally her Karma arrived & he received a small inheritance so, moved away (she cannot leave where she is due to her problem). He didn’t want her staking a claim so, he moved away from her knowing full well that she was unable to go. OW lives in a bungalow behind her mothers house & he visits her for ‘supply’. Karma is not a bitch, Karma is the bastard she is still stuck with! I am free finally & get to observe them both self destruct! Bless you CL & Chumpnation…

  • I will answer on the slight chance that DB is a real person instead of a silly troll with no life except for messing around on the internet.

    He has prepped you on his cheater history. They don’t do that for nothing. He told you who he is and who he has been for decades in no uncertain terms.

    When you catch him cheating on you, he will turn this around and claim you gave your tacit approval by keeping on and not dumping him. Look up “blame shifting” and “gaslighting.”

    Now you are contemplating joining the Marriage Police. Unless you are with him 24-7-365, he will find a way to cheat on you.

    Watching him 24-7-365 is impossible unless you two have an operation to become conjoined twins. Enjoy the anxiety of agonizing over what he might be doing every second he’s out of your sight.

    You are not a chump. True OW and OM chumps are those the cheater duped by fooling them into thinking s/he was single. You knew he was married.

    On top of that, you were also cheating on your spouse and abandoned your own family to be with him.

    I notice you had the chutzpah to not even express remorse for the pain you and he rained down on his real family. No empathy whatsoever.

    Being naive didn’t get you into this.

    A narcissistic Cluster B personality disorder and an entitled attitude got you into this.

    Since you are living together now, it appears he needed to get a new person to keep the home fires burning and free up his time by doing errands, chores, housework, cooking, laundry, correspondence and as much “adulting” as possible so he has maximum free time to cheat on you.

    That’s what he did to his ex-wife. He made her into a “wife appliance,” and the more responsibilities she took on gave him more freedom to cheat.

    What cheater wouldn’t want that?

    Of course he moved in with you. If he lived alone, he’d have to take care of this himself with no one to shunt the work onto. He’d have to wash his own dirty undies. Now he’s got you set up to do it and free up his as much as possible time to cheat.

    In conclusion:

    He will cheat on you. There’s no doubt there.

    The only way to ensure that he does not cheat on you is to leave him.

    Chump Nation is not the place for you.

    Try the cheater’s forum on Reddit. Maybe they have tactics for you about being the affair partner and getting cheated on.

    Have a full STD panel every six months if you value your health.

    • This is the truth >>>”Since you are living together now, it appears he needed to get a new person to keep the home fires burning and free up his time by doing errands, chores, housework, cooking, laundry, correspondence and as much “adulting” as possible so he has maximum free time to cheat on you.

      That’s what he did to his ex-wife. He made her into a “wife appliance,” and the more responsibilities she took on gave him more freedom to cheat.

      What cheater wouldn’t want that?”

      I was 100% the wife appliance, but I didn’t know it! My ex always had “so much work to do” and was “so overwhelmed” by all the work he had to do. In my chumpy mind, I thought if I took on the majority of EVERYTHING plus even “guy” work, he’d have time to spend with me and the kids. But it didn’t work out that way. I just freed up more “at work” time to go on secret coffee dates, lunch dates, walking around all day at work and chatting it up with all the women (someone told me that’s what he did at work), go get lap dances from strippers and whatever else he did when he was supposed to be “at work working.” And then he’d come home from work, have dinner with the family and then work until close to 11:00 each night. And work every single Saturday our entire marriage. And 15 years worth of Sundays. I still cannot believe how stupid I was, but in my mind I was supporting his career and how could I argue with a man that was doing something so noble like “working hard for his family”? Yeah, he was working hard alright. Working hard at fucking around behind my back for over 20 years.

      • Martha, I had never thought of it that way. I felt used and took for granted sure, but the way you worded it was spot on. I was an appliance too. I took so much off his shoulders. And he kept adding more. Freed him up so he could screw everything that would let him. So glad I threw him out like the garbage he was.

        • Good for you for throwing him out, Kim!! That’s one of my biggest regrets is not throwing him out the night I caught him out on a date with a newly divorced whore (she is now is girlfriend whore du jour).

          The big kicker was my X said to me after he starting rewriting history to everyone and himself — “You never took good care of me!” I was like, “What?” And he said, “No.” It’s all a bunch of bs, because that’s what these disordered cheaters need to do in order to justify their actions. But he put a little doubt in my mind and I spent time of course trying to figure out what more I could have done to “take care of him.” Absolutely nothing was my conclusion! My best to you, Kim.

          • We want to believe that we are the problem, because then we can fix the problem, and life will be what we thought it would be. It didn’t help when my MIL asked “wasn’t there something that you could have done to be a better wife?” She didn’t mean it exactly as it came out but the message was clear. There had to be a reason for his unhappiness and it must have been me. I read so many books, and other than The Pilot’s Wife, the only once that helped was Leave a Cheater…. It took coming here to CL for the realization that he was the problem to take root and flourish. Thank you all for your stories – I see bits and pieces of mine in so many that I’ve read here. The common denominator – they suck.

            • Yes, FooledMeTwice, you are so right. I really felt like something was something wrong with me. Or I wasn’t doing something right or not enough. In the past 10+ years, I cannot tell you how many Self Help books I read to improve myself! The first time he devalued me, it came on overnight. He went from happy, loving boyfriend to cold, mean and distant boyfriend. The first blindside, but now I know it’s how he acts when he has his eye on another woman. A normal human man would have broken up with me, but he didn’t. I just tried harder to be a better girlfriend and wife — The Pick Me Dance for 24 years. And the Pick Me Dance is the fixing of the problem that doesn’t exist. The real problem is the cheater that feels entitled to EVERYTHING! I was a great source of supply to the narc for 24 years. He wanted me, the wife appliance, and whores on the side. The perfect life for a Perfect and Special Disordered Fxckwit.

              And that’s all too common for people to question the faithful spouse as to what we did wrong or not enough. And we take it on, because we are used to feeling like we are the problem. My ex-pastor, the first time I met with him after D-day, asked me right away how often we had sex. Really? And the pastor asked my ex the same question in his private meeting. He failed to ask my X questions related to his crappy, cheating, lying character and I’m sure he no way asked him how well he was loving me (not very well). But us chumps take on the challenge to try harder to be a better spouse and we could be 100% perfect. Sex kitten that wears sexy lingerie and spices up with bedroom with toys. Best cook and baker in the world. Immaculate house. Great job that contributes to the family. Takes pretty much care of the kids on our own. Do all the extra jobs related to running a family. Do some “guy” work. Try to be upbeat and positive most of the time. Go out of your way to do nice things for our husbands. And guess what? They would still cheat and they would still say we didn’t do enough. You cannot win with a disordered cheater!

  • Ovations for CL!
    OMG, I love this lady!
    “Bitchslap”, “Who the fuck do you think you are”, “pap tests”. Flawless!

    This letter reinforces my believe that these POS cheaters are delusional. They imagine that they can twist logic to the point they actually believe it is true themselves, and push it onto others, demanding that everyone else agrees.
    Well, this one got run over by CL’s truck! I’ll save my comments while I imagine the scene 🙂

  • Martha, thank you. And it was a pleasure throwing him out. He came home and everything he owned was in trash bags on the porch. I saw the look on his face and it was priceless. He treated me like garbage so long, I felt it was only appropriate. But, I hate that I did the pick me dance. Three years ago I found out he had a three year affair. I loved him and I wanted him. Piece of garbage would remind me of that when we got into an argument. You wanted me, you got me. I guess he thought I would never get tired of the lies, the texts to other women, the cheating, sleeping alone while he was on dating sites, the porn, the flirting with women in front of me, yelling at me, treating me like a doormat, me begging for his time, attention, sex. Pisses me off at myself for tolerating it. But, I have my peace back, I am working out again, dating, involved in community activities, loving life. I heard he lost it after I kicked him out. Don’t care, sure he had two or three to console him. Like the old saying goes, I wouldn’t piss on him if he was on fire. I’m happy. He’s sick and twisted. I hope you are happy, and if not yet, I hope you fine your happiness. It really is the best revenge.

    • Yes, very appropriate to put the Piece of Trash out like trash with all this stuff, especially after treating you like garbage!! It sounds like you are doing great!!! You go girl! 🙂

  • “Okay, let me get this straight. Dumb Bunny chose to trash her 21 year marriage for a glorious future with a jerk who bragged about cheating with no fewer than 8 women during his 17 year marriage. And after choosing that confessed and unrepentant serial cheater, she is concerned that she might have an unrepentant serial cheater on her hands?

    Sweetheart, he read the label out loud to you to be sure that you knew what you were buying. ”

    Ha ha ha ha ha!

  • This letter is twisted in so many ways. She is the drama queen performing with: “here goes,” how over-the-top terrified she is when she is a cheater, and all the caps about being a chump. How in the world can a cheater pretend she is not the person who has harmed in the same way she fears being harmed?

    This letter is a perfect example of the “good cheater” “bad cheater” representation. The good cheaters only cheat once for their soul mates; bad cheaters take strippers home and cheat with many. No.

    All cheating is a form of theft and abuse. Cheater must own it, not project onto CL.