Throwing Parties and Other Pick Me Dances

pick me dance party

Today’s Friday Challenge is pick me dances, particularly the unfortunate situation of throwing a party for your cheating FW as an unknowing chump. A letter from one poor two-stepper who finally hung up his pick me boots.

****

Dear Chump Lady,

I listened to your podcast the other day featuring Shani Silver, and you were talking about pick-me dancing and the topic of two-stepping came up.

This brought up a horrible memory from my marriage where I was doing a literal pick-me dance.

My ex-FW and I were married for 15 years. I learned of her cheating in two waves. The first was halfway through our marriage in 2013 when she panicked and confessed to years of infidelity after she tested positive for an STD (that I luckily avoided). I was a true chump, agreed to work things out at her request, and went to a couples’ therapist who wanted me to “meet her halfway,” etc. The second wave was in 2019, when I discovered that she was having a workplace affair. I asked for a divorce immediately upon discovery. We have two little kids.

I can look back at all sorts of pick-me dances, but the one that sticks out was in 2012. She had returned from a year abroad in Europe during her PhD program and had many suspicious nights out to dance clubs with her new friends. I was roundly scolded by her and accused of being jealous and paranoid when I questioned all her activities, when a year later in 2013 she would confirm that all my suspicions were justified when she confessed.

Anyway, while I was home alone for a year (2011-2012), working and holding down the house, she was off in Europe having a grand old time. I was depressed and lonely that year, but when she returned, she kept going on and on about how she was “mourning” (she literally used the word “mourning”) her time in Europe, and how she had such mixed feelings about coming home.

(Later, when I read your book, and you talked about how cheaters need to “mourn” their affair, I was taken aback. I thought my FW was the only one who had the gall to expect me to support them emotionally through the loss of their affair. Just … wow.)

When her birthday came around, I organized a party with all her friends at a dance hall to go two-stepping.

Now, some context – while my exFW looooves dancing, I really don’t. I’m an introvert and I don’t like big crowds or loud music, and I hate being the center of attention. Dancing in front of other people is enough to give me an anxiety attack. In addition to not liking country music, going out two-stepping is a major turnoff for me, but I was doing this because of how much she was “missing” the nightlife of Europe, and because of how inadequate and boring she always made me feel.

At the party, she proceeded to get falling-down drunk. At one point in the night, I lost track of where she was. I finally found her outside the dancehall on the front curb, chatting up a few guys she had just met, and smoking a cigarette she had bummed off of one of them – her classic flirt move. She was giving big belly laughs, and touching one on the arm, etc.

On the way out, I made eye-contact with the guy she was flirting with. He gave me a smirk that is burned into my memory to this day. I organized the party, invited the friends, paid for the drinks and food, and white-knuckled it through one of my top 3 anxieties, and ultimately, she couldn’t even get through the night without making me feel completely inadequate.

Anyway, that was my pick-me two-step!

Some people try to lose weight or buy sexy lingerie – I forced myself to go dancing.

Regards,

Two-Stepping Chump

****

Dear Two-Stepping Chump,

Thank God you hung up your pick-me dance boots and divorced this freak. As for your FW, I hope she boot-scoots herself backwards into a pile of cow flop. What a narcissistic glutton for attention she is. I’m sorry to say this is a common story.

A giant show of hands, CN:

Who threw their FW a pick me dance party?

Oh, is that all of us?

Do weddings count? I had a pick me dance party at my own wedding. Yep, I paid one of the OW’s bar tabs. She was a guest. So Two-Step, come over and join me on the giant chump sofa.

(Passes the chip and dip…)

Please don’t beat yourself up. You did what a loving partner does — you were caring and attentive. Being of use to FWs is why they keep us around (oh, excuse me, tethered to the cruel, cruel forces of monogamy.)

Take heart, Two-Step. On the dance floor of life, there are so many folks who would cherish being swung around by a faithful partner. Awkwardly or gracefully, it doesn’t matter.

So, CN, your Friday Challenge is to share stories of your pick me dance party (or parties).

TGIF!

Subscribe
Notify of

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

149 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Welshchump
Welshchump
1 month ago

Two-stepping chump, I feel your pain. It sucks. As an introvert as well, I’m not a fan of parties but in the midst of a pick me panic, before he admitted cheating but had handed me the old ILYBINILWY BS, I threw him a birthday party complete with band, food and bar tab. The OW was there, of course, he insisted when he found out about the party. He told me that as she was one of his closest friends he didn’t even want a party if she wasn’t going to be there. And I was a controlling, paranoid and generally unsupportive wife for not initially including her. I believed him, reached out to her to include her and their circle of work friends. The following year for his birthday, I arranged a mountain bike weekend away for him with friends. Years earlier I booked a weekend away and studio time for him and friends to record an album. He was shit on my birthdays. Late back from work, probably because he was with her. It still makes me feel upset and angry thinking about it all. They suck.

MichelleShocked
MichelleShocked
1 month ago

FWs do love the centrality of a pick me dance, don’t they? In my case, FW set AP up to throw the pick me dance party. One month before DDay, on a Friday after work, FW messaged me that his coworker was inviting everyone from work to come by and have a bbq. He told me to please bring son and come and meet him there. I responded “should I bring a bottle of wine or something? I have book club and can’t stay long.” No response from FW. About 30 minutes later, I messaged again. Finally he said “sure.” So I showed up with our 9 year old son and a bottle of wine. And was greeted at the door by AP (I didn’t know this yet of course) who screeched “I didn’t know YOU were coming!” Needless to say, those words haunted me all evening and even at my book club later that night. And it turned out the “BBQ for coworkers” was just FW sitting at a picnic table on the deck in back with a couple of neighbors. No one else from work. Meanwhile AP was flitting around sweaty and nervous at the grill. And it was a guise to get our son together with her boys to prove that it’ll be great when FW leaves me. Still, she had no idea she’d be entertaining me too. And FW was reveling in the pick me dance — feeling like he had 2 women fawning all over him. Blechhhh

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago

Oh heavens. This is really awful, I’m so sorry. My ex/FW did something similar on our work lunch breaks – when he wouldn’t just invite his ex/OW out to his car, leaving me alone in the break room with a few pitying looks from coworkers who had their own speculations. (Luckily, they were on my side, although no one had the confirmation of the cheating until I did… that I know of. I look back on a few conversations with coworkers and have strange feelings about them, now.)

But this? The BBQ? The involvement of the kids? I’m so, so sorry. That’s disgusting. Fuck him. Infinite hugs from me.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago

They were hooking up in his car at the same workplace as you? 😱

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

Yep. Ironically, a coworker of mine once let me sit in his car while I was waiting for ex/FW’s shift to end. Ex/FW sheepishly admitted that he didn’t like me being in other men’s cars later that night. That coworker was nothing but a friend (and a true friend, at that – long after I quit, when he found out ex/FW was back at it, he reached out to me with evidence and everything!) but apparently that made him feel very jealous. Double irony, I was confiding about my suspicions of ex/FW possibly cheating to said coworker.

Extra dose of irony: he knew I was equally attracted to any gender. But, I guess, he only really saw men as a threat.

MichelleShocked
MichelleShocked
1 month ago

Chump-Domain Cleric, Mehitable, FYI, Welshchump, Kat and of course, Tracy…Thank you all for the lovely support. You’ll find I repeat this BBQ incident a lot on this blog because not only is it icky as shit, but it was the loudest alarm in my head. Meeting the AP at her door and having her say “I didn’t know YOU were coming” was so fucked up that it sat with me. It creeped me out. What coworker would say that to another coworker’s spouse?? She was also acting so strangely … at HER OWN HOUSE. And FW was sitting there COMFORTABLY like he was there all the time.

A few weeks later, a friend called me crying on the phone that she thought her husband was cheating on her…. and the bells went off in my head. Mostly this incident was the clarity I needed as all the pieces and red flags finally came together and I realized FW was a cheater with this idiot AP. So I’m thankful FW played this game. It’s what liars do. They become so sure of themselves that they actually believe they are all powerful. And they start to play with fire and become more blatant as they fuck with you — and end up telling on themselves.

And knowing that FW made HER do the pick me dance to cook for and entertain ME (although I did waste a bottle of good wine — sad) it makes me positively joyful. Imagine how much he fucks with her now. How off-balance he keeps her. LOL She’s so fucked

Shadow
Shadow
1 month ago

Oooh that was twisted! What a warped mind he’s got, but it’s her problem now!

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago

Oh, it’s really fucked. I think it would be a long time before I got over that. Really creepy – but you’re positively right, she’s probably constantly on edge, never a moment of rest. She knows everything he’s capable of.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago

“Imagine how much he fucks with her now. How off-balance he keeps her. LOL She’s so fucked”

😃 I love it!

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

Michelle, this is a great story because people don’t really think about what cheating actually entails. They hear that someone is cheating or they can kind of see it but they don’t hear the ACTUAL STORIES OF WHAT THEY DO. That’s one reason this blog is so incredibly useful, you can actually read the REAL stories of REAL people and go WHAT THE FUCK!!!! Because the kinds of things FWs and their APs do are just…so over the top frequently and so nasty and vicious and underhanded and hurtful….when you read the actual stories, you understand. People have to SEE the mechanics of what cheating actually involves, the kind of low down, scheming, conniving, CRUEL things they can do. Otherwise they think it’s just about canoodling in the corner and it’s much worse than that, The behaviors they do just to GET to sex are horrible.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

And people wonder why ax murders happen.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Generally because anything else is too quick in these cases I’d suspect.

FYI_
FYI_
1 month ago

This is beyond effed up. Christ on a cracker, what a jackhole. Please tell me they both went down in flames.

Welshchump
Welshchump
1 month ago

What is wrong with these people?

kat
kat
1 month ago
Reply to  Tracy Schorn

x1000

Deeply Chumpy
Deeply Chumpy
1 month ago

Dr Ex FW was no longer able to use his current consulting rooms. So I suggested we change our lives to convert together first floor of our home for him to see patients…..you can see where this is going. So we went through his patient list until we got to a female, let’s call her Coralie, to schedule an appointment.

I saw the smirk on his face but had no idea what it meant. Oh Coralie knew our address they had been f*ing in my home for months! She subsequently filed a complaint and he was disqualified from practicing medicine for four years. So I threw Dr Ex FW not just a home but workplace for him to abuse a patient…hence the name Deeply Chumpy

LookingForwardsToTuesday
LookingForwardsToTuesday
1 month ago

I have mentioned this before, but it’s worth trotting out here. Ex-Mrs LFTT was very keen that I get promoted at work (she wanted the money and the status) and pushed me to go “Balls Out” whilst also saying that I wasn’t good enough to get promoted ….. which required me to take on all sorts of extra responsibilities and work ridiculous hours. However, in parallel, she would constantly complain about me never being at home and how she had no time to herself because so much of the child care fell to her (no sh*t Sherlock … I was at work trying to get promoted). This came to a head when she joined a local choir; I bent myself severely out of shape to balance work and getting home in time for her to attend choir practises on a Thursday evening and performances on Sundays. Well what loving husband wouldn’t want to try and accommodate his wife’s new hobby and to enable her to make new friends, regardless of the impact that it had on me.

Anyway, while I was literally making myself ill to meet her twin demands of “get promoted” and “be here when I’m doing choir stuff,” it turns out that she seldom, if ever, attended either a practise or a performance …. because that was time that she used to date her AP.
Even now I can’t believe how stupid I was; I knew that she couldn’t sing for sh*t but never though to ask her what was going on or question why the kids and I were never invited to a performance.

On the upside, I got the promotion at work just after our divorce was finalised and, because I got a clean break, she didn’t see a penny of it.

LFTT

Josh McDowell
Josh McDowell
1 month ago

Same here, constantly complained about my work and getting promoted when I made good money and worked at great company that treated us well. Then she complained I didn’t spend enough time with her when I had to work OT to support us and her spending habit. It’s never enough with them.

LookingForwardsToTuesday
LookingForwardsToTuesday
1 month ago
Reply to  Josh McDowell

Josh,

It’s funny, but Ex-Mrs LFTT never complained about me not spending time with her; rather the complaint was that I was never available to look after the children when she wanted to disappear off …. I now know that she wanted me to be looking after the children so that she could be with her AP.

LFTT

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 month ago

My ex was so controlling that he didn’t want me to do any evening activities because he was somehow convinced that they were a cover for affairs. Earlier in our marriage, he was OK with church, but later he said I couldn’t even go to prayer meeting without him.

For some reason though, he was OK with me taking a quilting class and joining a quitting circle in the waning years of our marriage. I mentioned that to the owner of the quilting shop where I took classes, and she noted that it was probably because quitting is largely a female interest. Ah, yes! But of course like the choir, I could have worked that.

Of course, he was projecting though.

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
1 month ago

I feel like your FW and my FW were made the same model year from the same FW factory, right down to the damn choir.

LookingForwardsToTuesday
LookingForwardsToTuesday
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Well no one ever accused Cheaters of being in any way original when it came to the excuses and covers for their shenanigans, did they?

LFTT

Welshchump
Welshchump
1 month ago

Hahaha silver linings.

ChumpDownunder
ChumpDownunder
1 month ago

I thought I was the only one! I threw a 50th pirate themed birthday party for my FW only to find out 8 years later that I’d invited his climbing buddy that he’d been having a year long affair with.
Why do they want us in the same room together. This happened several times with one or other of his affair partners.
Felt such a fool when I eventually found out.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDownunder

I did the same thing, threw a 50th birthday party for him! He still is hiding what he’s been doing since he left, but I went back and looked t the pictures from that day, and the photos of he and me together, we are not touching, and the in photos of him and his best friend, who flew down from Toronto the day before to “help get ready” with his girlfriend, they are draped all over each other and kissing each other on the cheeks!

Chump World, is there anyone out there who also has this situation on their hands: it’s been three years and I still don’t know anything at all about my FWs personal life — what he is doing now, whether he left for a woman or a man, whether he was a serial cheater — he moved far away. Has successfully hidden everything about his circumstances for almost three years. Anyone else in the same boat?? All I have to go on is induction, based on the things I know to be true: he suddenly became very angry and started drinking when he never had before, he moved away. Noone who is in contact with him will talk to me, thanks to his accusing me of terrible things (I also don’t know what he told them I did!) I am just operating on the assumption there’s an affair, because that’s the most likely. But after almost three years, no proof. His lawyer has never submitted bank statements that would tell the story, can’t ask anyone who might know because they won’t talk to me… he comes to see his two kids once every six months or so and after hours-long visits somehow they also don’t know any details about his current life…

Bluewren
Bluewren
1 month ago
Reply to  Chumpty Dumpty

Yes, unfortunately.
Mine ghosted me while I was working overseas and told on himself 7 months later when he posted a horrendous pic of himself and some other woman as his new profile picture- classy as ever.

The truth is- we don’t need to know what they’re doing. They fired us from giving a shit and deserve no more of our energy.
Even if we did find out, how would we know it was the truth?
Whatever it is, it’ll be a lot less glamorous or satisfying for them than they make out.
They’re lying liars who lie and not to be trusted in any capacity.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago
Reply to  Bluewren

Thanks for telling me this! Coming up on three years soon and mine still has successfully suppressed any info. Really, the most important reality is that, wherever he is, he’s not HERE, being a dad and contributing to the household. But there are practical reasons for knowing what his current circumstances and lifestyle are, for instance in regard to interactions with the kids and also divorce decisions. If he’s a coke addict, for instance, that’s going to affect my decisions around what I settle for in the divorce. Or if he has another child. Or if he is hiding another source of income.. his personality changed so extremely that I would not discount the wildest scenarios. I’ve decided to just go with the most likely explanation (is that Occam’s Razor?) and operate from that premise, just to be able to move forward.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago
Reply to  Chumpty Dumpty

(and he has successfully forced me to drain my finances through litigation abuse and because I’ve been paying household expenses since he left, so I don’t have money for a PI. I am not even sure where he lives now, apparently he has no legal obligation to tell me. Last known address was in Miami. And it appears he has a new job at an ABC News affiliate based in Atlanta, though he tried to hide where he worked fro me, too.)

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDownunder

Mine tried to get me in the same room with OW multiple times. I never went, thankfully. It’s just the typical triangulation crap they do. They feel tingles of naughtiness over it. You weren’t a fool. Who knew these kind of sick individuals even existed?

I must say that the pirate theme turned out to be the right one. He was getting plenty of booty. Climbing buddy, huh? More like a climbing on top of her buddy.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDownunder

This happens a lot apparently and I think they enjoy the risk – it probably is a sexual thrill for them later on – and it’s a way for them to humiliate the spouse, which I think they also enjoy. It’s the ultimate “you’re not the boss of me” I’m gonna do it right here practically in front of you. Also, I think some people, esp guys, have harem ideas and maybe they think “oh, see, if only she were more broad minded, I COULD have the Double Mint Twins!”.

vetbod8472
vetbod8472
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDownunder

“Why do they want us in the same room?”

My fuckwit introduced me to “a co-worker and his wife” that she had ME set up a double date for. While we were out at dinner, they (my fuckwit and her married AP who was sitting across the table with his chump wife) were texting back and forth all of the dirty shit they had done to each other RIGHT BEFORE SHOWING UP! (“Work had an emergency meeting last minute so we’ll be late. We can just meet you two there.” “It would have been dumb to drive two cars. You can just drive me over to pick mine up afterwards. It’s on the way home anyway.” Yeah. And we bought it, didn’t we?) And, what do you think the odds are that both fuckwits would want to have sex that night so they could describe to each other how “delicious” it made them feel that we (the AP and I, and her and AP’s wife) were unknowingly exchanging fluids using them as proxies? Hint: that would be 100%…

They are sick, evil, abusive fuckwits. They’re narcissists. Most importantly, they suck. That’s why…

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  vetbod8472

Good grief! Evil is right!

Mine tried to set me up on a double date with OW and her husband too. Neither her husband nor I wanted to go. That must have been a huge disappointment for them. Plus the other times I wouldn’t go to the events he invited me to, which I now know was because she would be there. Once upon a time, the thought of how deflated they undoubtedly were by those misfires made me smile. Now I DGAF.

ChumpDchump
ChumpDchump
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDownunder

“Why do they want us in the same room together.” As much as I try to follow the advice of not untangling the skein, I get caught up because 1) it’s a marvel to behold such assholery, and 2) when you have to co-parent with these people, it’s helpful to know how they work so that you can navigate, set boundaries, etc. Unbeknownst to me at the time, my exFW had one of her APs give swim lessons to our kids and help move boxes to her new office from our house. I shook the guy’s hand (puke). They are narcissists. They literally can’t comprehend your feelings, and they can’t understand any feelings that aren’t their own. My exFW said of one of her APs (before I knew) that “I think you’d like [AP], I think you guys have a lot in common.” (double puke) The answer is – they like the AP, and your feelings don’t exist, so why wouldn’t you like the things they like? At the end, I asked my FW whether she understood at all how these things would make me feel jealous and insignificant, and the blank, confused look she returned – it was as if I’d asked her to consider how all this had made our goldfish feel.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Mine even thought my daughter would like her, FFS. He tried to get her to meet the filthy ho. DD wouldn’t go to meet his “friend from work.”

Conchobara
Conchobara
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Yep, FW texted me these lengthy texts to convince me of how much I would like the child mistress and how much we had in common shortly after DDay. She’s so kind and thoughtful! If you could just get over yourself, you’d see how great she is! She’s going to be in our daughter’s life so you may as well get used to the idea. She cares about you! She wants me to be extra helpful to you right now because she knows this is hard for you.

The child mistress is literally half my age. B*tch doesn’t know me, my life or anything about me that hasn’t been manufactured by FW. And she knows this is hard for me? The 24yo who still lives with her parents, dropped out of college and has never had a job other than banging older men for money knows how I – a 48yo high achieving (supposedly) married mother with a steady job and freelance work on the side and decades of life experience — knows what it’s like to have your entire life blown up? To find out that the husband who promised to love, honor and cherish you was doing nothing of the sort for almost a decade? F off.

The only thing we had in common is that we both thought FW was monogamous with each of us–joke on both of us, he’s not capable of that.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  Conchobara

The great thing about these little whores is that they get older and THEY FIND OUT. F around and Find out….it’s real. The great circle of life even embraces child mistresses eventually.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

Someone like that can never genuinely love anyone else because they can’t empathize. They’re defective. I don’t even see how they can parent adequately – another reason they should get NO CUSTODY AT ALL.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
1 month ago
Reply to  ChumpDchump

I can’t agree more with your statement “they like the AP, and your feelings don’t exist, so why wouldn’t you like the things they like?”

In my case, this attitude extended right up to the divorce (“why can’t you see this as an opportunity?”) and included the kids (“why don’t they want to come help me make decorating choices for the new house I’m moving into when I leave you?”). It also included professional situations (“X disagrees with me about this very technical decision which cannot be objectively evaluated because it has literally never been tested, ever: X must be mentally ill – I think bipolar”) so in XW’s case it was certainly a personality trait that fed into the affair rather than a product of affair limerence or anything like that.

The one and only time I told her how the post-ILYBINILWY confusion and discard made me feel (in response to her question), XW accused me of “emotional blackmail” and walked away. Since she was enjoying it so much, she couldn’t comprehend that I would be hurt by her having an affair and nuking her marriage, ergo I was faking it in order to manipulate her.

This can’t be stressed enough: it’s not about you. It’s about them. To the point where they cannot even acknowledge that you could have a perspective that is different from theirs.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

Aside from their sheer emotional lacking….I think that part was left out by the factory – if they acknowledged the feelings of their discarded spouse it might make THEM feel bad, God forbid. Or you might have some “control” over them because they tend to view all relationships in transactional terms and power. Their bad feelings might give YOU power over them and they can’t have that. They don’t do love – they do transactions and power.

almostbluegirl
almostbluegirl
1 month ago

Ah, yes. My ex’s favorite “hunting grounds” were these woo-woo New Age retreats we used to go on. Well, mostly that he used to go on, and that’s where he met all the half dozen or so “loves of his life”. Early on after I discovered his behavior, I unfortunately focused too much on the OWs and tried to befriend them, thinking surely if they knew me or knew of me, they’d leave our family alone. To some of their credits, they were like “what he’s married” and vanished. But that’s okay. There were always others he could pick up. The problem was him.

I remember throwing dinner parties with his guest lists and AGONIZING over everyone’s bizarro diets — vegan AND gluten free AND don’t eat “nightshades” (peppers and tomatoes and eggplants) which honestly leaves VERY LITTLE — only to find out that the women with these insanely specific diets were the new loves of his life.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago
Reply to  almostbluegirl

“loves” plural? oh my

Shadow
Shadow
1 month ago
Reply to  almostbluegirl

I suspect that those women with the very specific diets probably weren’t doing it for genuine reasons at all, but more likely for attention, or they were just plain, old-fashioned FUSSY eaters. There’s sometimes an element of the spoilt child in those sorts of people I think and definitely in the sorts of people who knowingly carry on with married men or women!

FYI_
FYI_
1 month ago
Reply to  almostbluegirl

It’s unethical to eat meat, but they have no problem bonking your husband.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  FYI_

Eating him is fine. It’s organic.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Isn’t he pork?

Celene
Celene
1 month ago

Back in 2021 my cheater ex had us host “friendsgiving,” a party for him and “our” friends a couple days after Thanksgiving. Only his COW and her husband came by for it. I had no idea they were cheating at the time. He overcleaned the house to impress her setting off my allergies so I couldn’t be in the main rooms (or my bedroom) without coughing my head off for a week. He refused to stop cleaning/using what I was allergic to despite the multiple times I’d asked him to stop – with him outright telling me “You won’t be allergic to this!” He saw no problem with his obsessive cleaning and attempted to keep it up through real Thanksgiving with my parents. He tried to keep up the cleaning when my parents arrived for real Thanksgiving. My ex ran off to hide in a bedroom when the meal portion of real Thanksgiving started and messaged his COW the entire time. He only came out when the holiday was over and my parents were leaving.

My ex put so a lot of pressure on me to impress his COW with my cooking and kept acting like nothing I made was good enough. He kept saying how “wonderful” his COW’s husband’s cooking was – putting down everything I made. He even hoarded the leftovers from his COW’s husband after Friendsgiving and didn’t let me have any of it. It honestly felt like HE was doing a ton of Pick Me dancing for his Married COW, and trying to get me to be his backup dancer.

He later told me when the affair was in the open that his daydream/wish was to have both me and COW -sitting together on the couches I made- smiling adoringly at him. He basically wanted us to be loving props/sister wives.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

Ewwww ew ew ew ew. Ew. I have a particular aversion to harem fantasies – they squick me out. But admitting to your real-life monogamous spouse that you want that, after cheating on them? And treating them so cruely.

And he made YOU suffer extra because he wanted to impress the person he was betraying you with! Messing with your allergies, insulting your cooking, not spending the holidays with you and your family… Ugh. Hugs to you, if you would like them.

Celene
Celene
1 month ago

Hugs are welcome! I couldn’t believe the audacity of my ex at that admission either. I’d told him during false reconciliation that the fantasy he had was “f*ed up” and asked what was he expecting for his COW’s husband to do during all of that. He gave me a blank stare and said “I hadn’t thought about it.” Totally grossed me out that he didn’t care about making someone else suffer so he could have his fantasy.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

“I didn’t think of that.”

Ah, the clueless FW. Did he also tell you he didn’t know why he cheated? Or what he thought the fallout would be? You’re completely correct – it is fucked up. And yep, as always, cheaters never seem to really care who they hurt. Unless, of course, it effects themselves.

Celene
Celene
1 month ago

His primary reason was that she “spoke his love language” and was “easy to talk to.” When I pointed out that I’ve been trying to “learn his love language” and “talk to him” about things he liked for the past decade of him stonewalling me in our marriage his response was, “yeah, it would have been too much work for me to help you learn my love language.”

In one moment of honest clarity he said there was nothing I could have said or done differently that would have made him not cheat on me.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

I got told that “love languages” shit too during D-Day. The look on her face when I told her that I had actually read the literature on that(before I met her actually) and said “yes, our love languages ARE actually compatible” was PRICELESS. Mine stonewalled me too in favor of schmoopie over the last…18 months before she got tired of me doing most of the housework and paying most of the bills, really-me and “having emotional needs” and all of that. That’s pretty much how that specific part of D-Day and the clean-up went for me as well.

We need like a mandatory class for people on cheating. And a big bulleted point of “logic doesn’t work with these cretins” needs to be pretty high up on the syllabus.

Celene
Celene
1 month ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

Oh yes, the emotional needs! When I told my ex I wanted to spend more time with him I was the bad guy because I “made him feel guilt” and like “he wasn’t doing enough.” Isn’t it amazing how they stonewall us and then wonder why we can’t read their minds? Agreed on the “logic doesn’t work.” I feel so stupid in hindsight, because I honestly believed he would get it and stop cheating if I showed my ex how he was hurting me or showed him logically how he was obsessing over something that wasn’t real. It took him reading “not just friends” and his arguing with me on why the text wasn’t relevant to what he’s doing (among other excuses) that I mentally knew he was not reconcile material.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

My dad(also a chump) used to use the phrase “Sadder but wiser” a lot. I think about that a lot. Love makes us stupid. I took mine at her word that they were just friends as well. Because well…you’re supposed to love and trust them, right? I lived off of stable scraps living that lie. No amount of logic on D-Day was saving anything. Mine was so convinced that we could still be friends after that due to all of those lovely thinking errors. She still does not grasp that the enormity of the abuse, hurt, and betrayal has so magnificently inverted what friendship really is.

It turns out that neither you nor I were stupid(though it still feels like that late at night…) We did what we were supposed to do. They didn’t. Sure gets cold up here on the moral high ground, but to hell with them.

Stay mighty!

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

In order to have a love language, the guy would have to be capable of love to begin with which simply isn’t possible when it comes to an abuser, which he clearly was. Plus from the moment an abuser plans to abuse a victim or full out abuses, in a psychological sense they *have* to devalue and disparage the victim as well as “erasing” any of the victim’s positive qualities, otherwise the abuser has to accept that they are a bad person and basically loveless and unlovable, which no abuser will voluntarily do. Behaviorism 101: people only really and truly hate/condemn/devalue others *after* they’ve done something bad to them. And psych 101: because of intolerance to cognitive dissonance, no one is ever a bad person no matter what evil they do. In fact, abusers arguably employ several specific intense strategies against recognizing their own guilt and responsibility.

There are some interesting theories about why abusers/perpetrators project so much negativity onto their own victims to the point that the abusers/perpetrators end up genuinely believing false things about their own victims. For domestic abusers, who all have personality disorders, partners theoretically become the repositories for all the negative traits of the abusers’ own childhood abusers/parental figures as well as repositories for all the abusers’ own negative traits. The worse the traits of role models and the worse the abusers personal traits, the harsher the accusations against victims will be.

Personally I think cheaters also tend to project all of their affair partners’ negative traits onto chumps/victims as part of the attempt to exaggeratedly idealize their APs. Consequently, the more disgusting and vile the AP’s character, the crueler the cheater will be to the chump. Apparently it has something to do with “splitting” in various personality disorders– dividing other people up into extremes of good and evil– as well as “projective identification”– which can be applied to projecting/externalizing one’s own evil onto a victim.

Abusive personalities arguably learn this mechanism in childhood where, in their dysfunctional FOO dynamics, there always had to be a scapegoat/repository-for-guilt so that everyone else could “cleanse” their consciences of their own misdeeds. Another mechanism by which to do this is called “neutralization,” aka “reduction of self punishment.” It’s sort of an intense inner mantra that perpetrators develop whereby they convince themselves that the victim was not harmed or “deserved” the crime against them, therefore the perpetrator has done nothing wrong in their own minds.

Criminal psychologists hypothesize that neutralization may be such a good explanation for how serial perpetrators quell conscience and selectively quell empathy that the controversial concept of “born psychopath” may be moot. In other words, one can be born with a normal brain and still entirely subdue empathy because the learned mechanism of neutralization is so effective. But since the thinking pattern is arguably passed from one generation to another and people arguably learn to do this in childhood from role models, by the time they’re adults the mechanism may be so rote and automatic that it’s not even conscious, making it harder to study.

Whatever the origins, the guilt-reduction strategies are arguably employed not only because guilt and shame are painful and burdensome but also for more pragmatic reasons: guilt and shame alter demeanor and conduct, make people appear furtive and “weird” and this may set off the “danger” or “ick” radars of others. Just like predatory animals, human predators have various strategies to avoid setting off the defensive responses of potential prey. It’s similar to how jaguars– who are infamous for being able to sneak up to within a foot of you before you know anything’s up– can hold their breath and have giant paws to help in weight distribution so that they can stalk prey in total silence. By the same token, to the extent that empathy and guilt may be liabilities to human predators, what human predators theoretically do is shed their sense of stigma/guilt so that they can appear “innocent,” “normal,” “safe” or even “charming” to both victims and bystanders. It helps them evade detection before and after crimes, arguably enabling them to strike again and again.

Neutralization and projection are hypothetically how Ted Bundy was able to convince even police and criminal psychologists that he was a “good egg” and couldn’t possibly be a killer for so long. But to “cleanse his vibe,” first he had to convince himself of his own relative innocence by convincing himself that his victims had it coming and were bad people, therefore no real crimes had been committed. Too few of his victims survived to attest to whether Bundy’s externalization was spellbinding and effective in transferring a sense of shame but one can imagine that, during his crimes, his demeanor towards his victims was one of righteously hateful condemnation and they likely died in a state of horrific confusion, asking “Could I have done something to deserve this?”

The effect of projective identification is described as spellbinding/mesmerizing to victims because of the degree to which the abuser invests in and really, really, deeply, truly believes their own invented fallacies. It’s the reason that clinicians believe rape victims universally feel shame in the aftermath of the crimes against them even though they haven’t done anything wrong: because victims “contracted” the shame of their own perpetrators to the extent that perps refuse to own and then externalize their own shame and guilt for committing the crimes. I’m not sure anyone knows why this effect is so mesmerizing to victims but I suppose the fact that perpetrator so commitedly acted as judge, jury and executioner towards a victim– going so far as to punish the victim for a crime they didn’t commit by raping them– it does something to our ancient basal ganglia or lizard brains or whatever– that being punished for something makes us feel as if we must actually be guilty.

So to hell with this asshole’s commentary on you or anything about you. Abusers are walking lies and their lies are designed to be infectious. Because of this, I think survivors should question whether every negative thing they feel or assume/suspect about themselves in the wake of abuse aren’t simply the feelings and views of the abuser that have been “transferred” to them. I think this would also include depression and suicidal impulses which may simply have been transferred from the abusers’ own suicidality/depression/self-loathing. Depression and suicidal ideation, like guilt, may be infectiously “communicable” through the spellbinding process of abusers’ projective identification and neutralization. In short I think it’s probably helpful to view even subviolent emotional abusers as being on the same basic spectrum as serial rapists and serial killers and, by the same token, to wonder if the effects on victims aren’t on the same spectrum as victims of serial rapists.

weedfree
weedfree
1 month ago

Sam Vaknin discusses further how brainwashing occurs in his videos about entraining. In one at least he refers to a study where members of a band’s brain waves synced, and then likens this to the rhythmic verbal abuse dished out by abusers – the abuser and target’s brain eventually sync.
In another video he discusses how the multiplicity of strategies used by an abuser puts the target into a trance like state, so it is easy enough to then implant thoughts/project etc.
Certainly it is hard to make heads or tails of what’s real or not when in a state of cognitive dissonance for decades on end, which is then reinforced by people around the target who have also been duped by the abuser.
I don’t know how much of this is true, but certainly after exiting an abusive relationship one should be sceptical of one’s owns thoughts, and seek counsel from a trusted friend or therapist. Or just get on this forum.

Last edited 1 month ago by weedfree
Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  weedfree

Not sure about Vaknin’s arguments but I agree brainwashing is the core of chronic abuse from the most petty forms to the most gruesome. One DV expert called the process “perspecticide.”
And I think the key ingredient in committing perspecticide against victims the better to take power over them is fear.

Auschwitz survivor and historian Primo Levi summed it up when he wrote about how moral compasses stutter the closer one gets to the “North Pole” of terror and horror. He also described how those most likely to survive the camps tended to be political prisoners who arrived with enough “political and philosophical armature” not to be driven into total confusion and despair by the Nazis’ campaign to drive victims into what Levi dubbed the “gray zone” of total demoralization and despair. Being able to recognize the tactics obviously didn’t stop bullets but apparently helped with psychic resistance.

Not to flout Godwin’s law but you learn a lot studying worst cases and logical extremes. I’ve become very interested in exactly how even petty domestic abusers manage to blind and bind their victims with psychological fear because I suspect fearmongering is the real trigger of learned helplessness which could also be called “learned hopelessness.” Focusing only on the “reward” aspect of operant conditioning tends to paint victims as pathetically needy weaklings whose fears are all a bit silly and garden variety. It’s a view that helps blamey bystanders pretend to themselves they’d never be that susceptible or stupid. It’s also an easy mistake to make in cases of abuse that haven’t (yet) become overtly violent, especially if the victims themselves aren’t totally clear on how the state of terror was induced. This is why I’m glad that the coercive control legislation movement is starting to get much more surgical in identifying methods of inducing psychological terror, which most survivors see as the most debilitating aspect of abuse even beyond assault. That movement might end up identifying the master list of tactics.

Like the “gray zone,” I think fear-mongering in abuse is partly about brainwashing in order to impart cynicism: whittling away at victims’ faith that human decency exists (even in themselves) to the point that victims gradually start to feel unsafe in the world, leaving the abuser as the only hope for future support or for any future at all. This protection racket dynamic is arguably what sets people up for irrational hopium huffing. The drug analogy is apt because people who aren’t already in pain and suffering chronic anxiety aren’t going to be that attracted to “narcotizing” things.

weedfree
weedfree
1 month ago
Reply to  weedfree

I should say a trusted friend who has not been conned by the abuser, so likely someone who has never met the husband/wife

Celene
Celene
1 month ago

This hits too close to home. My ex stopped treating me as his equal partner during our first year of marriage and told me he was reacting to me as if I was “his abusive father.” He constantly accused me of being angry. During the discard he kept telling everyone that he was messed up because I was abusive to him. Thing is, he said me having commonplace boundaries was “a punishment” to him and abusive. I’m just glad I’m not his chaos janitor anymore.

weedfree
weedfree
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

Beware the FW who has “seen the light” and can now pinpoint why they abused you/lied/cheated on you for years, decades etc.
I feel like screaming “run” on the other infidelity site when posters encourage chumps to stay with idiots who have epiphanies in the aftermath of exposure.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

An abuser is an abuser is an abuser. They all fall on the same continuum, from the ones who never have to take their hands out of their pockets to wreck lives to the ones who kill. I think you’ll immediately recognize a pattern if you read this paper. Click download for a free read. https://www.mdpi.com/2075-4698/9/2/46

God, it’s amazing how these assholes project in such a psychotic, deluded way and yet might still manage to basically function in life and even convince most people that they’re not nutjobs. I think it’s because the syndrome isn’t really so much mental illness as “criminally disordered.” There’s a big difference. Actually mentally ill people don’t have the wherewithal to manipulate on the level that abusers do nor engage in such elaborate ruses to shift blame and avoid consequences. The latter defines criminality. It reminds me of what one DV expert wrote: “Not all criminals are batterers but all batterers are criminals.”

I think your ex *needed* to cast you as his abusive dad in order to justify what he did to you all along. In an article about mother-enmeshed men (aka, victims of emotional incest), there was an argument about how these types always try to turn every partner into their mothers even if, in choosing their partners, they initially tried to steer clear of the “toxic mommy model.” The takeaway is that abusers have some kind of deep, creepy need to project their own childhood abusers onto their victims, like creating an effigy just so they can set it on fire over and over again. But though these people are originally forged by trauma, they’re not actually “survivors”– more like zombies or poltergeists who haunt the living by endlessly reenacting what was originally done to them to make them so fucked up.

What can be incredibly bamboozling about this type of person is that they may genuinely appear sympathetic at first on a level that would fool an FBI profiler, not only regular Joes and Janes. If they even admit to their requisite former traumas (many don’t. Some lie in order to cover up for the former abuser whom they emulate or to avoid waving red flags in front of potential prey), they may appear to have learned greater empathy from the experience, as if they could never abuse because they know what it’s like to be victimized. But their inner “victim self” is a bit like the light from a long dead star reaching earth after a million years. It seems “real” to the extent that it once was real. But that part of them is just a husk or a figment– it doesn’t really exist anymore and doesn’t mean they’re capable of actual empathy, at least not when it doesn’t serve them.

Something else that tends to fool people is that abusive personalities will trot out this husk of their former “victim selves” a bit like how a violent gang of thieves will throw a child into the middle of a darkened highway so that drivers will stop their cars. But the point is the same: simply to use a pity trap the better to blindside.

It’s very easy to get sucked in by this type but hell to get out. You should be as kind to yourself as someone who was a victim of violence even if this walking abortion you were partnered with never lifted a finger because most battered women cite the psychological torture and coercion aspects of battering as more devastating than the violence itself.

And none of it’s your fault. Contrary to all the usual codependency nonsense (please read Susan Faludi’s Backlash. Oldie but goodie), you didn’t “manifest” abuse nor draw it to yourself on dysfunctional voodoo tractor beams any more than people “manifest” covid to infect their cells because they “secretly wanted to be sick.” Sure there are things we can do to lower or raise risk but, let’s be honest, it’s an effing virus and it specializes in destroying its host.

If you still feel haunted by the idea that you were singled out as a target or are taking a lot of time to heal because of some personal flaw, bear in mind that DV expert Lenore Walker observed that most abused women had higher than average pre-abuse self esteem (which is then of course lowered by abuse) suggesting that many abusers actually seek out “big game” or “challenging prey.” Like vampires, they may simply be drawn to the healthiest necks. No one knows whether it’s about bagging a shinier trophy for the bragging rights or because batterers dementedly think a healthy person might make them healthy through osmosis or “inspire” them to be better people. Maybe it’s all the above.

In other words, it may be in your nature to shine but, on a gut level, you may now be afraid to because you were targeted for it– a bit like a Porsche driver who experienced a carjacking might end up driving an old Dodge to avoid trouble. Just consider how every country needs a department of defense, especially if that country is rich in resources and constantly being invaded for oil and minerals. The more you polish up your defense mechanisms– whether it’s studying psych to identify red flags and dangerous traits or taking a self defense course, gathering strong allies and friends who understand all of the above and will have your back if you’re ever in trouble– the safer you will feel and the more you’ll be able to reclaim yourself again.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago

i think it is all three of shinier trophy, osmosing the goodness, and, not inspiring exactly, but finding someone good at modeling non-antisocial behavior. Everything you wrote in these two entries is illuminating, thank you!

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Chumpty Dumpty

I heard a psychologist arguing that, contrary to the usual view that DV victims go from relationship to relationship, it’s actually batterers who do this. And that, every time, these abusers tell themselves that the next target will never “provoke” or “make” the abuser abuse like the last ones did. I think it’s a natural result of abusers’ victim-blaming “neutralization” tendencies where they convince themselves that they were only abusive because the victims were bad people.

It’s like every abuser assumes the next target is Cindy Lou-Who who will inspire the expansion of their shrunken Grinchy hearts.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

“You don’t speak my love language and I find you too difficult to work with, but I want you around still in my harem.”

The fucking gall of this FW. The NERVE. Disgusting.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

Harem fantasies are so DEGRADING. I’m watching a great anime right now called The Apothecary’s Diaries (which I highly recommend) about a young female apothecary and her experiences in the concubine quarters of the Chinese emperor. They had all kinds of luxuries but the way of life is absolutely horrifying, sad and degrading that they are all just playthings and breeding stock for one guy. I’m so appalled when I see women (or men for that matter but it’s usually women) buy into this crap. Sister wives is so pathetic.

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Yeah, I can’t stand harem anime. Won’t watch it, like… ever. Which sucks, because I love romantic comedy anime. Have you watched Ore Monogatari!!/My Love Story!? It’s a great little show. I even got my mom invested in it!

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago

Will have to check that one out. Harem shows feel great at face value…until you get your heart broken and you stop seeing winners and start seeing a whole hell of lot more damage.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

The sister wife harem fantasy just enrages me. I can’t imagine how people can actually think this shit, it’s so utterly regressive and primitive. Like we should go back to living in caves and hunting mammoths with him dragging the little woman home by the hair. Just disgusting.

Celene
Celene
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

The worst part of the whole thing was the ex being totally unable (or unwilling?) to see why I was upset at him demanding to be allowed to have his married COW while staying married to me. I have a snowflake’s chance in hell of getting a real apology or empathy from the ex for everything he’s put me through.

OutButNotDown
OutButNotDown
1 month ago
Reply to  Celene

So sick! I’m sorry, Celene.

Involuntary Georgian
Involuntary Georgian
1 month ago

Hijacking this because I need to vent:

Today’s NYT has an interview with sex educator Emily Nagasaki (who wrote the best-seller “Come As You Are”). The interview (and comments) mainly brings up the usual themes: to maintain a healthy sex life in marriage in the face of the usual stresses of modern life (work, chores, kids, time management, sleep) you need to know yourself and your relationship and have frank and open discussions with your partner. It also gives concrete suggestions such as scheduling sex, even though that seems unsexy.

I found myself nodding along and thinking “yes, that seems reasonable; sure; that sounds like a good idea” … and then remembering that I tried to do a lot of those things in my marriage and they resoundingly failed. I particularly recall how my then-wife looked appalled and disgusted when I suggested scheduling time for sex. She made me feel like a pervert for broaching an idea that is now (a decade later) very widely accepted.

The article – understandable – omits the other way to address all these problems: find a new person and have sex with that person in new ways – with no kids, bills or chores (because those are being handled by your respective spouses back home). Do it during conferences on the company dime (no money troubles!), in a different hotel every time (novelty!) while hoping your colleagues don’t catch you sneaking between rooms (risk!).

The obvious flaw in the second approach is that it’s a temporary solution that only works once per affair partner (though obviously you can repeat as necessary: see serial adultery) but it certainly avoids the hard work and introspection required by the first approach. That is, it’s not a good long-term plan but one can certainly appreciate its efficiency as a short-term one. In my opinion there is also a certain moral distinction between the two approaches, but I’ve noticed that people who are drawn to the second one don’t seem too fussed about that.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

The irony here is that so many FWs HAVE to schedule their sexy time with their APs so they don’t object to the scheduling time and place, etc….they just want to do it with….someone else.

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 month ago

Yes, the contrast there is interesting.

When I was married, I tried the suggestion to schedule sex multiple times, and my ex was horrified and overruled. It’s a practical solution for busy couples and certainly allows for anticipation and preparation. Nope, wrong-wrong-wrong he said.

Then, he went full-bore on his porn “hobby” (he was retired), I remember the devastation of realizing that I was no longer enough for him and that his appetite was without boundaries. He wanted all sex, not just married sex. We separated, and he had his male hormones and blue pills with him. I connected the dots.

I agree that it’s a temporary solution when they take the second approach. It’s a soul-sucking way to live, but the positives outweigh the negatives to them. My ex’s attorney blabbed to mine about the serial adultery because he didn’t want a messy trial involving that when my side was clean. They had investigated and come up with nothing, but as I told my attorney when that came up, I am very much a one-man woman. I never was a “fling” type person. My ex however…

Dontfeellikedancin
Dontfeellikedancin
1 month ago

FW invited his ex girlfriend and her husband to our wedding. I did ask him about it, but of course I wasn’t going to ban her from coming. She knew his family and everything, and they did attend.

It was a weird way to reconnect with a former SO, like why do I have to meet her in the middle of my wedding day? I don’t think anything ever happened between them and the worst I can think of it today is that he wanted to show off to her.

But still, I should have known when he couldn’t understand why it made me uncomfortable. It would be 11 years before he admitted he had “a problem with empathy.”

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago

I’m so, so sorry to hear that, Two-Stepping. Flirting in front of you – that sounds so painful! Ex/FW did something similar, being quite close to ex/OW in front of me after I found about the affair, giving her hugs and comfort after I supposedly “won”. But your experience sounds so egregious, so beyond that. I’m so sorry that memory is burned into your head. At least, maybe, you can use it to remind yourself how awful she is – you can trust that she sucks!

Ex/FW hated social events, so he would have never asked me to throw a party. Rather, he often seemed dedicated to ruining any celebration we went to. I pick-me danced in other ways, of course, but don’t have much to add to this challenge. Other people did witness my pick-me dancing, though. We worked together for short while, the three of us! It’s how I met him.

Two-Stepping, I hope you stepped on you FW’s feet while dancing!

Last edited 1 month ago by Chump-Domain Cleric
OutButNotDown
OutButNotDown
1 month ago

I didn’t host or plan a party per se but I was talked into hosting the OW overnight not once, but twice! She lived long distance but came to our city for special medical care. (Which my ex was soooo concerned about helping her with, when he couldn’t be bothered with bringing me to appointments or helping me when I had health issues).

She was my ex’s “right hand person” at work, an underling. When she stepped in the door she said “I was so nervous to meet you!”. I scratched my head at that – why would an employee under my then h be nervous to meet me?

So, twice I cooked dinner which the 3 of us ate together in our dining room (my ex feeling great delight, I am sure), and twice I prepared a guest room for her and laundered the guest linens. Once, we treated her to lunch out.

The first overnight was my first clue that they were more than just co-workers. I honestly felt like a third wheel in my own home around them. Not sure why agreed to a second time, although I didn’t have much of a voice in my marriage. I had to go along with whatever my ex wanted almost all the time or incur his wrath.

I had no idea I was being forced to do the pick-me dance when I agreed to host her. The gall!

Pass the popcorn on the big chump couch, please!

Doingme1
Doingme1
1 month ago

After getting divorced almost ten years ago I passed the pick me dance baton to the OW with a simple statement. Enjoy it while you believe you’re special. The pick me dance involved adult children, having them host parties, and her buying expensive gifts the Limited would never purchase. I refused to attend and was called ridiculous. One by one her attacks on adult children dissolved her relationships.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
1 month ago

I have to read this blog in bed lying down when I wake up in the morning because what I read here would knock me over.

That such thoughtful caring actions are spent on selfish cruel ungrateful people is extremely heartbreaking.

I can report that he said, “You never did anything for my birthday” after finding out he was the highly credentialed expert manager of a secret sexual double life, with the added effed up layer of a Nice Guy mask.

I guess my birthday plans of Elton John in Las Vegas or the Ahwahnee in Yosemite don’t count.

After DDay, we went through with our plans (which I planned) for Christmas in Lanikai in a beautiful house we had spent many vacations in. The first shit show Christmas of my life. I don’t know how to say that in Hawaiian. For a few years after he left, I did not know what to do with the very expensive Hawaiian bracelet he got me that Christmas. I realized three years after he left that all he did was hand me our joint debit card to pay for it. I picked it out, I chose the engraving (Hawaiian healing prayer). I had it engraved. And I convinced myself that it was a gift he got me. I’m glad I realized I actually got it for myself. It now reminds me of very happy memories of being there with my daughter.

I hope this cockroach was kicked to the curb where you found her, which is clearly her natural habitat.

Velvet Hammer
Velvet Hammer
1 month ago
Reply to  Velvet Hammer

‘Ino loa Kalikimaka

Stepbystep
Stepbystep
1 month ago

We had already put in for a pair of one-week vacations when D-Day #1 happened. I used my first week of vacation to visit out-of-state family by myself. He insisted on driving me to the train station, seeing me off and keeping the family car.

Later that summer, I planned a wreckonciliation for the second week. Airbnbs with private pools, destinations for HIS interests. In spite of that, he kept picking fights.

We were still on that trip when I found the deleted photos. Seems he had used our car to take OW to our anniversary destination.

Rensselaer
Rensselaer
1 month ago

Socially awkward me set up an epic 50th B-Day party for Cheaty McLiarface. When mine rolled around on a Friday, silence. I waited thinking that he would surprise me with something on Saturday. I wasn’t expecting epic, just a dinner out. Silence. So I asked if he had plans. Him: “Oh, I thought the dinner celebrating a friend’s B-Day last weekend was for you too.” I cried. He hugged me and I apologized for overreacting. At that time I didn’t realize he was beginning another discard and still under the impression that he’d never do anything to hurt me on purpose. I learned that I was incorrect about many of my truths.
Happy Friday CN!

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Rensselaer

Ugh! What an absolute pig.

Mine had a habit of taking OW out to lunch on my birthday and spending more on her than he did on my birthday dinner later, which I think was the point of it.
His excuse, when I found out after Dday by looking through the credit card history, was that her birthday was close to mine. There was a week’s difference, but somehow he had to pick that day? Yeah, bullshit.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

He should have got her a hot dog. Or a vienna sausage. In memoriam.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

😄 More like a cocktail weinee.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 month ago
Reply to  Rensselaer

For my 40th birthday, Cheater did nothing but when I begged for SOMETHING, he took me and kids to a restaurant which is now a bad used car lot office.

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 month ago
Reply to  unicornomore

My last birthday with the ex was memorable. He asked me what I wanted for my birthday. I said to pack up all his pills and dispose of them at Walgreens, which we did.

But he was of course horrid the rest of the day to me. I was under no illusions that we had taken them ALL because I knew he had hiding places, but it was a statement of how fed up I was with his addiction.

We separated twice after that, and the second one “stuck.”

Spinach@35
Spinach@35
1 month ago
Reply to  Elsie_

My final birthday we “celebrated” together rolled around two months after his retirement and two months before D-day. When he seemed really reluctant to go to a relatively expensive restaurant (nothing crazy), I remember thinking it odd because that’s what we often did. At the time, I just chalked it up to a money concerns post retirement.

But there was something really “off” about it all. He was just going through the motions. Looking back, I know he wanted to be elsewhere. Being with someone like that is lonelier than being alone. The pain of being discarded is awful. Only those who’ve experience this can truly understand.

Elsie_
Elsie_
1 month ago
Reply to  Spinach@35

So very true. These people have a common script, don’t they?

For me, it was year-after-year of disregard culminating in the “Walgreens birthday,” as my adult kids now call it. He had been retired for just a few weeks. As horrid as he was to me the rest of that day, I had sorta made a point. I had drawn a line that I was sick and tired of his addiction. Sure, I had begged and pleaded before, but a demand like that for a birthday “present” was an act of desperation on my part. The kids saw and digested it all and still talk about that birthday of mine.

My most recent birthday was glorious. I actually had two parties with friends, and then went out with my adult kids for dinner who suggested a local place that my ex coincidently always strongly refused for bogus reasons. It was a bit gourmet, but I thought he liked that sort of thing. Now I wonder if he had a meetup there at some point with “someone.”

Anyway, it was a glorious meal with wine, fancy-plated food, and lovely desserts with my grown kids. We plan to do it again soon.

thrive
thrive
1 month ago

I don’t know if I was pick me dancing. I sure as hell spent my whole marriage catering to his whims, spent a fortune on toys. I was the primary wage earner, his money was used on not sure what..Bought him a special truck (36k) so he could be comfortable working his 40k job and drive his second muscle truck on weekends. Bought him a Les Paul guitar (the Cadillac of guitars) so he could play with his band at bars on weekends. That is where he met his OW ABD HIS CURRENT squeeze so I guess that was pick me dancing even though I was blind to it. The amount of money I spent on that man is staggering. I was such a sucker…oh well…he is gone and I learned a lot about boundaries.

Conchobara
Conchobara
1 month ago
Reply to  thrive

I don’t know if I pick me danced unknowingly during our 21 years together (17 married), but I definitely turned myself inside out and upside down to make him happy. Special evenings out, new places to go, adventures that always catered to his interests because he straight up wouldn’t go if it was about my interests. He was great when we dated, lived together and even when we first got married but then things gradually shifted. I guess I lived my life as though I was still married to early-him despite all the evidence to the contrary. Stubborn Chump!

Then everything was about him. I gave up running a knitting group with a friend because it took up too much of my time. I gave up book club because I couldn’t be away one night a week for a few hours after our daughter was born. Gradually I gave up all my friends and outside activities until I did nothing but wait around the house to find out if he was going to have some time for me or our daughter that week or weekend.

I look back now at my facebook memories and realize that it almost looks like I was already a single parent — except for my fawning posts on anniversaries, his birthday or when he made the slightest effort to do anything at all. Then I posted happy family posts. I never realized how lonely and sad I was till after DDay.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Conchobara

“I never realized how lonely and sad I was till after DDay.”

Yes, the difference is startling. To some extent you just get used to being disregarded.

Chumped in KC
Chumped in KC
1 month ago

Oh yes, all of chumps have lived through this! Jumping through hoops to make our narcissistic FW’s happy is very common, probably almost 100% really.
My last memory of doing this before D-day, was on the 4th of July 2021. I had not wanted to do the traditional party he usually bugs me for, and I said no like a dozen times, but he just kept hammering me and hammering me, until the only way to shut him up was to give in, of course. The same pattern as always in our almost 30 year marriage. I was to give to him and to do whatever he wanted and if I said no, there would be hell to pay in some way – sulking, stonewalling, being passive aggressive, etc. You all know the drill. But anyways, this time was different because he was different. Now, at the time I didn’t KNOW that he was cheating, but the way he was acting at this party solidified my intuition that he was. I suspected months before that, but he was looking at his phone constantly (always away from me where I couldn’t see of course) was just generally avoiding me, being distant. It was only 6 weeks later that I picked up his phone and saw the evidence of what I suspected. In my case, he attacked me and almost strangled me to death over the phone he was so desperate to keep my from seeing it (but I already had), so be careful when you confront cheaters, because they can be dangerous. However, most are not and just start with the confabulations, lies, gaslighting, excuses, etc., even when you have proof right in front of you! It is truly unbelievable behavior! But yeah, the parties are a constant demand of “make me feel special”. And they do this even when they don’t reciprocate and are actively cheating on you, like they are entitled to treat you like crap, but you…you have to treat them like a king or queen. Seriously disordered people that just suck the life out of good people!

marissachump
marissachump
1 month ago

I’m so glad to say I did not host any cheater parties that I can remember. But I refused to go to all the cheater parties with friends who literally just sat around and told rape jokes and used racial slurs constantly. Cheater liked to punish me for refusing to attend by cheating on me as retaliation. Go to the party and be traumatized versus avoid the party and be abused. I’m so glad I have cut ties from them all.

Spinach@35
Spinach@35
1 month ago

I guess, unbeknownst to me, I did host the AP in my own home while I was out. I was the invisible, unwitting host of a woman who slept in my bed, ate in my kitchen (eating food that I’m sure I purchased), cooked, had sex, and otherwise made herself at home. She was like Goldilocks but with an invitation from papa bear.

The memory of this still makes me angry and upset.

p.s. Two-step, I feel for you. She sucks!

Last edited 1 month ago by Spinach@35
OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Spinach@35

It’s such a violation. That would be tough to get over even if you are over the FW himself.

Spinach@35
Spinach@35
1 month ago

I didn’t knowingly host the AP, but it looks she came to my home frequently while I was out; she ate my food, sat on my sofa, and had sex in my bed. A veritable Goldilocks except that papa bear invited her in. Grrr.

Spinach@35
Spinach@35
1 month ago
Reply to  Spinach@35

Oof. Repeat post. Technical difficulties…

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

How about a ROPE party???????

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

This is such a devastatingly sad story of a cruel, abusive woman who treated her husband like dirt. Obviously it works the other way too. No one should accept this abuse or reconcile with it. Anyone who would treat you like this doesn’t love you, probably never did, and is probably incapable of love anyway. What this letter describes is heartless. Personally I never had the opportunity to do a pick me dance with my first cheater – he just took off, literally, and I never saw him again, so there was no closure. Maybe in a way that’s best. When I caught my husband many years ago on online dating sites (he never met them or physically cheated and I am convinced of that) I gave him such hell that I know he hasn’t done it since (I checked on and off for years). I would have left if it were not for financial and health problems, but I do love him, I believe he loves me, and this has not recurred. But it did leave its mark on our relationship, I will never fully trust him again and I don’t feel the kind of love for him I did before. There’s always a “what if” in the back of my mind. That’s inevitable, I think. But I’m old, and health problems and money, etc, and we do basically get along, but I’ve never tried to win him over with dancing. If anything, he tries with me.

If you can leave right at the start, leave. It really is the best thing. But not everyone can in practical terms – just be aware of what you’ve got. Sometimes you have to keep the thing with the flaw in it.

Viktoria
Viktoria
1 month ago

Around 10ish years ago, eX was turning 50. That was when I thought we were a “we” and that we had each others’ back, getting through the hard stuff in life together, getting these kids raised and dreaming of retirement blah blah blah. That was all in my pretty little head; he was thinking of which “escort” on Adult Friend Finder to call up next!

Did I know this at the time? Not a damn clue. Life had brought him some hard knocks so I thought I’d be an amaaaaaaaaazing, loving and fun wife and throw him a 50th birthday party to remember! And I did– private dinner, drinks, cake, tons of people, memory lane stuff, all his friends. And I paid for it of course. That was years before I finally discovered that I threw that party for a lying, cheating, entitled, pretender!

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago
Reply to  Viktoria

same! Beware the fiftieth birthday party!

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago

My FW just reached out(like literally 30 minutes ago-so I am a touch triggered at the moment(usually pop on here for some dosage of sanity when I am). I am choosing not to respond to her-just a little flooded emotionally right now. So I will do what she liked to accuse me of when I caught her in lies and make this as much about me as I can while attempting to remain on topic.

Mine was notoriously asocial until toward the very end when all of the sudden she had “protests” and “breath therapy” and “yoga” to go to. It was hard to get her out of the house(she worked from home, social anxiety, etc) traditionally. She was already “busy” due to wrapping up her master’s program(which she was on the verge of failing out of when she left, but hey.)

During the pick-me dance year (last year of our relationship before D-Day and her rapid, some would say too convenient) departure we had to schedule date nights. Toward the end she would “forget” those as well. I tried. I really did. I wanted to go to her protests with her and try out some of these things, schedule more activities that she mysteriously could not bring me to or have intelligent answers about when I asked about her day.

I got the standard amount of gaslighting about being paranoid about schmoopie (her “good friend”) and her other dealings(it is becoming more evident to me that there was probably more than one but I think I am happier not knowing). I spackled and lived off of table scraps with “the best of them.” Funny looking back on it as friends and coworkers are still finding out-how often I have to use the phrase “actually, it turned out the bitch was cheating after all.”

Starting a little before things got weird and the pick-me dance officially began, she was INSISTANT that I NEEDED to make friends with Schmoopie. He had answers to all of my problems! Insultingly so, actually. She actually doubled down on that when the day after a life changing medical diagnosis came in for me that she wanted an open relationship(and denied vehemently that he was already in one with the bastard.) I was at least smart enough to get not get stuck in that particular web of insanity.

Stupid as and flagrant as she was about cheating, she was at least wise enough not to bring him into our home(that I was ever aware of)-I imagine I would be posting this from whatever little tablet they rent to you in prison if she did.

I think the simple beauty of this community is we find out when get chumped and look at our FWs and see a super villain at first. Then we come here and find out they were really a lot closer to the thugs with knives that Batman beats the shit out of while saying one liners.

I will have better days. And if you are reading this, so will you. Have a mighty weekend(and stay warm!)

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

I’m so sorry, Jeff. That sounds absolutely awful.

Also, ew, a text. If you legally don’t have to respond, I say ignore her. Deny her your kibbles. Starve her. You’re too busy having a mug of tea and watching TV under a comfy blanket. Maybe a cool history documentary, like your name suggests! Or working, as many of us are, and therefore you don’t have the time OR energy for it. Screw her. She can entertain herself.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago

Thank you for your kind words. It was definitely an “irresponsible self care” kind of night.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

Ignore her if you can, she doesn’t deserve another minute of your time or energy.

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

Or most of the minutes of time or energy that she got previously for that matter. Thank you for this!

Marco
Marco
1 month ago
Reply to  JeffWashington

Ignore her. It’s not written anywhere you have to respond. She wants you to be her emotional tampon..

JeffWashington
JeffWashington
1 month ago
Reply to  Marco

Hilariously enough-I used to have a (thankfully non-Chumping) ex girlfriend in my phone contacts for years as “Yearly Emotional Tampax.”

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Marco

Wow, emotional tampon haha, perfecto. It’s just as funny or even funnier when used in reference to a male FW.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Marco

Emotional tampon. I like that one.

Orchid chump
Orchid chump
1 month ago

I got sick, my crotch was on fire on the Monday Nov 9th, 2020. I called my doctor and set up a virtual appointment to talk to her.. My stbx was standing next to me when I took the zoom call. My doc asked me if my husband was cheating. I laughed and stated, “No, I’m amazing.” I turned to my stbx and asked him if he was cheating. He just laughed in my face. I told my doctor to just do all the tests anyway. She sent me a lab requisition for STD’s.

Wednesday I had his bday dinner party with 8 of our friends at an Italian Restaurant. I picked up the bill $2k. My crotch was still on fire for the whole meal. My stbx was a sad sausage at the dinner. One of our friends at the table asked me if Bill and I were okay. I joked and stated, “Yeah, we can’t get divorced in Vancouver, housing is too expensive.”

That Saturday, my stbx went to the doctor at a walk in Clinic in Canada (paid privately for the appointment, he didn’t use his MSP) and then went to the pharmacy across the street and used his credit card.

The following Monday he sat me down and told me the reason I was sick was because he was sleeping with prostitutes unprotected and then slept with me.

We had a big 50 person part scheduled for the following Friday night with caterers. I paid another $500 in food plus alcohol for the guests. I think I was still in shock.

All I can say is thank god I got the STD. I would never have thought he was cheating on me and I wouldn’t have left the marriage. I’m so happy I have found this blog and for everyone’s stories and support.

My life is soooooo much better!!!!!!

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Orchid chump

He paid privately in order to hide it, then went and admitted it anyway? Maybe he realized he goofed by putting the RX on the credit card.
I’m so sorry. Hooker fuckers are the worst of a terrible lot.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

He probably knew he’d have to tell her eventually because the doc would anyway – you can’t hide burning crotch STDS and no one gets that off toilet seats. Maybe he figured if he got to it first, he’d get the advantage. If they were ever going to have sex again, she’d have to get treatment anyway. I think it’s a case where necessity drove. I’m always amazed how many of them have unprotected sex. They really are like 14 year olds.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

I have a darker view of the unprotected sex. I think in many cases it’s out of a subconscious desire to harm the chump. Or it may be conscious in cases where the FW is a true psychopath.
I know it terrified me that FW could be that callous about my safety. Even if it wasn’t about doing me harm it’s still scary as hell. To me it’s a hop skip and a jump from that level of callous indifference to murder. SOB gave me HPV, which could still kill me. I’ve already had to have a (thankfully) benign growth removed because of it. At a bare minimum, if it does end up killing me, it will be equivalent to involuntary manslaughter as far as I’m concerned. Refusing to make any effort to protect a partner from the diseases the FW’s secret lifestyle exposes us to should be a crime.

unicornomore
unicornomore
1 month ago

I got the “Im divorcing you because you are a terrible wife, but there is no one else” speech just before he retired from a 20 yr military career. Per custom, he planned an event (retirement ceremony/party) but arranged to have it 3000 miles away. He forgot to figure our kids into the logistics (hello, school…flights) but he DID manage to have it in a place handy for his coworker Susan of Seattle.

As he had already told me of his intent to divorce, me he suggested I not attend but I knew he would say to everyone “my wife didnt even come to my retirement, she is a terrible wife” so I went and bought the cake.

I wish the gal I was then had 1/10th of the sass I now have as a Survivor Chump, but back them I was Pick-Me Dancing both vertically and horizontally.

He was a hostile, cruel asshole at the event and his “friend” he had been talking about so much shook my hand and brought a fake date. What I didnt realize at the time was that there was another gal, “Dee” who was SUCH A GOOD FRIEND that she just HAD to be there for him. She lived in Boston where he had worked 5 days out of 7 for months and months.

Just before the ceremony, he saw that I was defcon 5 level upset an the didnt want me to embarrass him at the event, so he said “we will get through this, we will get back together!” which lasted about 3 hours.

So I flew 3000 miles, stood next to him at the event, accepted the flowers as a symbol of honor and greeted at least 2 of his OWs. There was no actual dinging at the event but I think I danced enough for everyone.

If I were ever to run into either Dee or Susan in an airport somewhere, I would say “Just before he died, he told me that you were the love of his life” (insert knife, twist, sprinkle salt on her wound). I think there were many more but these are the only ones Im sure of.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago

Yikes, we all do the same things! But I can’t regret the epic double birthday bash with live music that I threw for FW and one of his relatives about six months into the secret affair. Even if things got really bad a few months later, in retrospect I honestly couldn’t have staged a better prank or act of table-turning sabotage even if I’d known what was going on. One of the best parts was that there was a lot of video from the party and my lawyer thought the optics looked great for me and terrible for FW which may even have made FW less contentious in the end. It didn’t help FW’s blameshifting campaign in any case. Plus the kids and I really had a wonderful time and it firmed up the support network we’d created during FW’s frequent emotional and physical absences. That came in handy after D-day.

At the time, FW hadn’t yet gone into the open discard/DARVO stage so I don’t remember being very “pickme” about organizing the surprise, just genuinely worried for FW because he’d been acting clinically depressed and “dangerously” overworked. Since he’s always been a bit of a snobby culture vulture, I thought hiring an original Latin jazz ensemble would reboot his circuits. Because FW kept the creepy little barfly cabal he formed in that stage a secret, I assumed he was socially isolated and that expanding our social lives would be healthy. The musicians were all lovely people I’d met in the period when FW was always off “working late” and I’d taken the kids– all serious music students– to see the group play several times at a little nearby venue. I had no idea that, from the time the kids and I first heard them, the ensemble had suddenly become quite famous in a particular circuit. I just knew them as groovy locals we’d run into here and there. So when I asked the group to play at a party, they kindly offered a cut rate and joked they were coming for the food.

Imagine if you were a FW who, to justify a boozy affair with a tacky peabrain, were going around telling your stoned flying monkeys what a mean, crazy social misfit you were married to and the sad life you’re a prisoner of. But then you walk into a surprise party that’s like something out of 1920s Paris but without the coke or bathroom orgies. There’s your “misfit” wife laughing it up with some hot underground quintet while your kids are off with their friends painting a giant mural in the dining room as a gift under the instruction of an emerging political artist who happens to be your wife’s museum buddy. You don’t know half the mob at the party because, while you were out drunkenly bonking in cheesy hotels and thinking you were Joe Jetset, your wife and kids became part of some transnational bohemian scene. Worse still, no one other than you is drinking much or at all so you can’t even accuse your chump of leading a dissolute party life and exposing your kids to corruption and vice. Worst of all, everyone greets you with warm affection simply because of the social leper you’re married to. Oh, and if you wanted to make some last ditch case that your chump was a decadent spendthrift, the party was pot luck and thrown on the shoestring budget you allowed your family while blowing communal assets and wracking up credit debt.

After D-Day, I learned that the party had completely freaked FW out and caused some hysterical conflict with the AP when she snooped social media. At the time I’d thought FW looked so stunned in group pix because he was having an emotional reaction due to how depressed and cut off he’d been in his lonely toil. Little did I know how the event foiled every one of his justifications for cheating and highlighted how trollish and trashy the affair was. Considering all the shiny, friendly folks around, I suppose he could have shifted his alibi to paint *me* as a cheater except I don’t think his ego could tolerate how this would make him look like the “loser” in the equation who was jealously repressive of the “supportive, joyful, socially vibrant, devoted mother of his happy, creative children” who appear in the party footage.

And what a heart-stopping soundtrack. The music was incredible. Even if my life was crumbling, I didn’t really know it then and I’m so glad that an event like that will color the kids’ childhood memories. At one point after the party, FW hissed on the phone that I’d thrown the party for myself, not him. At the time I was completely baffled but thought it was his depression talking. In hindsight I should have said, “Yes, it was all for me and the kids! And I’d do it again!”

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago

I hired a mariachi band! ha ha it was an awesome party

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Chumpty Dumpty

Lol, it must piss FWs off no end if their chumps ever enjoyed anything.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Chumpty Dumpty

I hope they played La Cucaracha.

Shadow
Shadow
1 month ago

Ah he was eaten alive with envy that ye ( yourself and the children) had enjoyed yerselves so much, and seething that everyone would see you weren’t at all what he was trying to make out you were! Right job for him, lol!

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  Shadow

If FW was jealous he hid it well, mostly expressing sourness over the fact he didn’t know half the guests at the party. But his second cousin whose birthday was also being celebrated kept asking me where I’d “found” this or that guy (not the women, curiously) as if I’d picked them up in bars or something.

At the time I was chilled and taken aback by the implication but, in retrospect, it’s hilarious. FW’s cousin is like a psychological clone of FW but just a bit dumber and not as good at masking MO and feigning woke feminist ally bs. It’s like he was expressing FW’s secret hypocrisy. Never mind that I’d innocently and chumpily been trying to collect “couple friends” and the whole point was to invite and bring together spouses and kids, some of those invitees were hot tickets. And if they radiated being wholesome, healthy, faithful partners, devoted dads and made warm overtures of friendship towards FW, it would have made it even worse.

Turned out FW himself had smiled in the face of the husband and children of the first in his series of married office bimbo targets, some doughy-faced Jesus cheater who didn’t follow through on her drunken flirting even though she’d reportedly blown half the partners and a few guys from IT. As a married “mate poacher” himself, FW got to burn in the hell of his own projections.

Shadow
Shadow
1 month ago

Oooh, I’d like to have been there! It’s a pity you haven’t any photos of him glowering. Did anyone ask him what was up with him, being such a misery-guts at his own party?

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago

Now that’s killing him with kindness. Love it!

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago

So, uh… can I hire you for your amazing party-planning services?

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago

Lol, not sure if I could hit the mark enough to make a career of it. My “inspiration” in this case was probably mainly social starvation. When I threw the party, we had just moved to a new city where we barely knew anyone. Prior to that, we’d spent several years in the most stuffy, spooky burb on the planet with a genuinely creepy schools system (not kidding. The school ended up in headlines for harboring child molesters on staff).

Once we escaped to the big city, I was running around hunting friends like a cartoon caveman bonking brontosauri on the head and dragging them back to my lair. The kids were also starved of cultural and social experiences so I went a little crazy enrolling them in everything in the hopes they’d meet children with the same interests.

It really paid off. Maybe it’s true that location is everything because moving to a new place made a huge difference. Suddenly all the social approaches that were a disaster in one geographical location were a big hit in another. I remember when I was announcing the move and my hopes that it would improve the lives of the kids how various people warned that “we take our problems with us wherever we go.” But once we moved, I realized that not all problems are “our” problems. Sometimes we’re just living in shitty places with a bunch of brain-dead, materialist social Calvinists who suck and rape their teenage babysitters. Other factors affecting social fabric are local politics, regional values, cultural differences, economics, the health of local labor and civil rights activism, cultural vitality, etc., etc., etc. It can take a bit of study to find the right place to land,

So the only event planning wisdom I can offer is that if you (general “you”) are basically a decent, empathic person and you’re alienated and unhappy where you’re living, consider doing some geographical research, pulling up stakes and trying a little global migration. It really can be different in different places.

FYI_
FYI_
1 month ago

several years in the most stuffy, spooky burb on the planet 

Dying to know where this is.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  FYI_

Southern hemisphere. 😀

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago

I mean we went south to forge a new life.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  FYI_

Stephen King might suggest New England. Hint, hint…

Chump-Domain Cleric
Chump-Domain Cleric
1 month ago

This is genuinely super sweet to hear. I love that it worked out for you so well! And I don’t know – it sounds like you’re great at hosting get-togethers! I bet everyome who attended still looks back on that day fondly.

(Except maybe FW. But that’s okay, who cares.)

Last edited 1 month ago by Chump-Domain Cleric
Waitedfartoolong
Waitedfartoolong
1 month ago

There has to be some level of sick gratification derived from the cruel abuse which comes with creating a situation which places the AP and the oblivious chump in the same room, heightened by engineering some form of social interaction especially if if there is humiliation involved. My fuckwit wife’s first affair occurred in the bygone pre digital era, in an analog world, pre internet when there was no social media, smart phones or personal computers and the sexual connection she made with her AP was formed at work. My stbex as was an Emergency Room RN at a teaching hospital who responded eagerly to the sexual advances of a senior surgical Resident with a taste for bonking nurses, X-Ray techs, Lab techs, Admitting clerks and just about any female who was willing and easy, and especially married co-workers. I can’t believe how incredibly naive I was to not see that the extra hours she put in after her 3-11 shift were spent drinking hard liquor in the on call room bed of Dr Sparklledick, and the weekends she volunteered ” to make extra money for our next vacation” were nothing but a pretext to screw him some more. The acute embarrassment and humiliation I now feel fifty plus after her confession, originate from the realization that the random times I was invited to join her for drinks and socializing with the doctors I was being ridiculed and shown the highest level of disrespect as they had been screwing just before I arrived. And then later that year My wife asked me to throw a Halloween party In honor of her AP’s birthday. I found it strange how they seemed to lock eyes and both were sporting a bizarre smirk….So don’t feel you are alone in dealing with this trauma Twostepper…

Marco
Marco
1 month ago

But she only loved you, right 😂🤣

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago

I sometimes follow Dr. Ramani’s Youtube videos and she recently mentioned a new peer-reviewed study in which researchers concluded that most narcissists tend to exhibit sadism on top of the usual “dark triad” traits of “narcissism, Machiavellianism and psychopathy.” The argument in the paper was apparently to shift to the usual “dark triad” view of antisocial behavior to a “dark tetrad” that includes sadism or the enjoyment of causing suffering.

Chumpty Dumpty
Chumpty Dumpty
1 month ago

yes, being selfish and cold and enjoying causing suffering are two different things.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago

Sorry, meant to write “the argument in the paper was apparently to shift *from* the usual dark triad view of antisocial behavior to the dark tetrad…”

luckychump
luckychump
1 month ago

Parties and Dancing. Almost sounds fun. Let’s be honest, “Pick me dancing” is cruel, and especially twisted on the part of the FW. From my perspective, it most certainly is sadistic. Cruelty and sadism are important considerations when thinking about FW behavior who is orchestrating a “Pickme dance” especially if a clueless chump doesn’t realize they are being cheated on, as the vast majority of us have experienced, repeatedly. The manipulations I’m speaking about are the ones to encourage the chump to attempt to rectify some sort of unintended or imagined offence on the part chump. This goes back to the idea of “walking on eggshells” around our FWs. If you have ever felt this way, there were definitely elements of cruelty in your relationship.
I found pictures and detailed emails after my FW died detailing a horrible BDSM secret life. He was eager to dominate anyone, male or female with a sadistic streak that knew no bounds. I had no idea, but only in retrospect do the fragments of red flags start to coalesce. 36 years of that shit, completely hidden.
I think anyone who wants to manipulate and control another person has strong probably subjugated elements of sadism in their personality.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  luckychump

I think doing nice things for cheaters in the stage before chumps have any inkling of cheating doesn’t really count as pickme dancing even if, in light of learning what had actually been going on, we look like complete idiots and dupes.

So many of these FWs play the sad sausage “catastrophically depressed” card in early stages of betrayal that it’s likely not uncommon for chumps to trip over themselves trying to “help.” I suspect the spirit of trying to help probably colors the motives of most chumps even if they’d begun to suspect some degree of fuckery was going on at the time they staged some loving, supportive gesture. In the end I can’t help feeling that it’s better to be a wholesome, deluded fool rather than some icky, creepy schemer.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago

The smirk seems to be a common factor. Several people have mentioned it so far. I had it happen to me recently over a parking space we’d been waiting for – this orifice zoomed in before us and then smirked when he got out. I wanted to rip him a new one….because I’m like that….but my husband said we should just move on. I still regret not giving him a piece of my mind. The smirk did it – it’s so hostile and aggressive and such an FU. These people have such contempt – I guess OPEN contempt – for their spouses. It must make them feel so superior. When you have to build yourself up by ripping down other people…you ain’t much.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  Mehitable

OMG, the smirk! In every picture FW had of his whore, she had a repulsive smirk on her homely face.

Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

Who but a loser filled with insecurity and self doubt thinks *smirking* in the face of some innocent person’s loss and suffering makes them seem hot/sexy/cool or in any way attractive? What an embarrassingly juvenile, ugly, stupid, dysfunctional sentiment to express. My mother memorably called this type a “walking abortion.” It’s probably more accurate than we know. Only someone who was never loved in childhood could act like this. We should probably pity them but it’s probably safer to run screaming and burn every bridge.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago

Walking abortion! 😆☠
I love your mom.
When I contemplate smirking FWs, I can’t help but think it’s a shame there’s no such thing as retroactive abortion.

Last edited 1 month ago by OHFFS
Hell of a Chump
Hell of a Chump
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

My mother was a gas. She had to fight so much sexism to have a career in commercial art that she didn’t end up starting a family until after forty. She found her niche as a courtroom illustrator and working with FBI profilers as an undercover sketch artist on serial killer, domestic terrorism and mafia investigations. She’d heard and seen everything yet still came off as the most happily naive person you ever met.

I once heard an interview with a journalist who described himself as a “sunny, macabre realist.” That was mom. Even if she was thoroughly agnostic, I think that state of mind might come close to something like spiritual transcendence because the time she did her bucket list trip with an artist friend to see the relics at the Potala, a bunch of elderly monks ran up to her laughing to touch her face.

No one could believe the story until they saw the photos but my mother was retirement age at the time so I guess it fell under the monastic code exemption of asexual contact. I imagine it happened because she was bustling up the mountain and around the palace beaming with glee at everything like a fascinated toddler. But I like to think it’s also because monks of that generation may have been part of various historic uprisings and recognized a fellow rebel. There was another uprising not long after this trip in which monks shed robes and fought.

Mehitable
Mehitable
1 month ago
Reply to  OHFFS

To me, the smirk means “I pulled one over on you, you dummy”. It really does add insult to injury.

2xchump
2xchump
1 month ago

Oh yeah this horrific topic! My XHCHEATER invited his work Friend to his 40th birthday party. He had been talking incessantly about this woman who was swearing off of sex due to ” being hurt by men.” From his chatter I surmised cheater husband and other guys at work spent time ” counseling her” to go back to love( isn’t sex love?) I listened to this and tried to get past it and not over react. Until this girl came over to me at the party ( gorgeous, )and shared how my XHCHEATER had told her all about me. She proceeded to share some marital secrets and said I must be an amazing wife. When the party was over i went ballistic and confronted my XHC that this girl knew everything except my panty size!!!!. My XHC was cool as a cuke and said I had a real problem and to get off his case. Later he told me she told him to leave her alone and went off with others. I was relieved but then got to experience other emotional affairs which I had no idea how to deal with. None. He was already doing phone sex and porn but hid it better….and he had promised to stop ✋️
.So many steps in infidelity and it takes years to learn how to lie, hide, keep affairs of the mind or.real one’s going. Our marriage lasted 20 more years from that party but I’ll never forget how blamed and helpless I felt, questioning myself and blaming myself. I call this Forgiveness grooming. Each time you let things like emotional affairs, porn phone sex go by and FORGIVE them, they are prepping you to see how much more they can get away with and the gaslighting works right?? and you stay and stay and stay. They have less than zero respect for you and get away with more abuse. It was always a pick me dance or a “YOU BETTER FORGIVE ME dance, until the final D day. And once I knew it was a horrible habit of disregard and he was hating me and damaging me, that was it. This boiled frog did climb out of the boiling water. Almost Too Late.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  2xchump

Forgiveness grooming is a great term for it.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago

TSC didn’t find out until 2013 and the party was in 2012. So does it count as a PMD if you did it prior to Dday and didn’t know you were being cheated on? If it does, I certainly did my share of dancing.
I was actually inadvertently dancing on Dday. I had arranged a romantic day trip for the two of us and was planning on sex when we got home. I got the news before that happened. I’m surprised FW didn’t say; “Does this mean we won’t be having sex tonight?” I guess even he isn’t that stupid.

Orlando
Orlando
1 month ago

I honestly never threw a party for the FW because he didn’t for me either. I pretty much gave him the energy he gave me which was very little. Occasionally I did more, but not for long. The OW pick me dances for him wayyyy more than I ever did. That’s why FW threw her into my face, to try & make me feel inadequate for not doing things I likely would have with a more loving husband. I stayed with him for the kid’s sake more than anything that had to do with him. D-day still stung & it’s nice to work out feelings here, but I’m 100% way better off than being with him.

chump changed
chump changed
1 month ago

The last and only confessed mistress lived in halfway across the country and was kept completely apart from me, other than random mentions of her that sent off blaring alarm bells. However, there were HIGHLY suspected affairs at other times during our 23 years together, and in these cases there were a few pick me dance occasions that I wonder about now.

There was the time he brought home another woman from his graduate school on my birthday, but not to hang out with me. He gave me flowers, introduced the woman, and after a minute or two they went upstairs to his office to hang out. Time went by. My husband and I had plans to go out to dinner, but dinner time came and went so I made my own meal. Finally the woman leaves, and I mention our missed dinner plans to my husband, who says “I didn’t know we were going to dinner; you should have come up and reminded me.”

I mean, who does this? And how embarrassing to have to go upstairs on my own birthday and remind my husband that he’s supposed to be hanging out with his wife, and not this random woman? At the time I didn’t want to make a big deal of it and be one of “those” wives who wouldn’t let her husband hang out with other women (I had plenty of male friends myself), but it always stuck with me. Even if he’d brought over a man it would have been rude… but it wasn’t a man.

This woman became one of his closest colleagues for well over a decade. They shared a private office at the university together. Went to conferences together. He knew way too much about her husband and their relationship, which he disapproved of. And he NEVER had her over to get to know me. I saw her only a handful of times over the decade they worked together.

On one of those rare occasions that she was at an event that I was also invited to, I sat with her and we started talking and laughing. My husband walks by as we’re laughing and his face was clearly freaked out… worried… even scared. In that moment a voice in my head suddenly said, “maybe they did have an affair.” I mean why else would he look so freaked out to see me getting along with one of his closest colleagues?

In any case, there are other stories I could tell… the countless mentions of other women who admired him or who sent him gifts, his very obvious glances at attractive women (including teenagers) whenever we were out and about, the walking ahead of me and never with me towards the end, on and on. I had no idea though, naive and trusting as I was, that I was involved in a dance off. Once I did, I was out.

OHFFS
OHFFS
1 month ago
Reply to  chump changed

Wow! That’s ballsy, bringing her in the house and going off to be alone with her. There’s almost no chance she was not an AP.