Your Best No Contact Strategies
Today’s fun Friday challenge to all you clever chumps out there is to tell CN your best no contact strategies. Oh, I know it’s simple to delete a phone number or unfriend someone on social media — I’m talking about the mental discipline that keeps your itchy trigger finger from hitting “send” on that 14-page, single-spaced diatribe on their narcissism you’ve written.
How did you talk yourself down off the cliff of “Maybe she still cares?” What insulting do name do you call her on your contact list? Ring-tone? Who’s your dial-a-friend when you get wobbly?
For those of us chumps who bred with a fuckwit, I know pure no contact is not possible yet, so how do you minimize interactions? What’s your best no contact strategy for “do I really need to deal with your shit?”
Help all the newbies out who might be struggling with the no contact basics. We can always use a primer on that grey rock thing. Or some spray…
I ask myself repeatedly- is it worth the aggravation? How will this help the situation? Why do I want this (these) toxic people in my life? Then I pull out a glass pour some wine and celebrate a victory. I have successfully had no contact that didn’t involve a simple pay this bill in 1 glorious year.
A full year is worthy of celebration itself.
That right there is living in the peace and the light!
When it comes to No Contact, even at nearly two years out I am still driven by anger, only now it’s habit.
First, I blocked all of her calls/texts in my phone. I told her I would reply to nothing but emails and snail mail (Document, document…)
Then I changed her contact photo to some evil clown. Then to a photo of dried, crumbling concrete.
Those first few months of the divorce, whenever she sent me reminders of our relationship via snail mail (like old love letters she had sent to me years earlier), I threw them out without reading them.
I avoided the street where she lives (my old marital home).
As time went by, I gave up on mutual “friends” who “didn’t want to pick sides.”
Each step gave her less of an excuse to be I touch.
A while ago a friend of mine was talking about a friend of his who was divorced (due to adultery) and he also mentioned that he was cordial to both his friend and his friend’s spouse. I asked him “Why” and his reply was, “I didn’t live their lives. I don’t take sides.” At the time I was dumbfounded and didn’t know what to say so I didn’t say anything. My ex-hole cheated on me for years making me doubt myself. I was really F***ed up in the head. I’ve gone no-contact for two years now and I’m happy to say that I’m much, much better! We have children together and so I must keep his phone number in my cell phone but his picture is an image of “The Picture of Dorian Gray”. Anyway, my brother and I were recently talking and he casually mentioned that if he ever saw my ex that he’d be ‘chatty’ with him. I had since had the chance to reflect on the before-mentioned friend who wouldn’t ‘take sides’, and my brother ended up getting it with both barrels. I got on his case and said, “Oh ain’t that just F***ing noble of you!!! You don’t take sides!! What you’re essentially telling my ex when you remain friends with him is, ‘It’s okay, D***, you can screw my sister over for years and it’s okay. Why you could do it again and again and I’ll still be okay with it.'” I was pissed! I told my brother that to remain friends with the ex-hole was to condone his behavior! And to remain friends with the ex-hole was telling me that he thinks it was fine with him to have his sister F***ed over, that betrayal was just fine! I don’t think my brother ever thought about it until his sister made him blatantly see, with outrage and profanity, that not only was I betrayed by my ex-dick, but that he would be betraying me as well. Sometimes you have to spell it out, and if necessary, spell it out loudly.
I did that as well. It was very freeing.
JC, can you elaborate on the mutual friends bit, please?
Hi MJo. Over time, I realized that I can’t be friends with people who want to put on blinders and pretend my ex-wife was/is a different person than her actions conveyed. Initially, they all heard lies from her about “what happened” in our marriage, so they “didn’t pick sides” because they thought I was lying (or heavily exaggerating) about her cheating.
But, after I left my cheating wife and filed for divorce, she stayed with her AP…while he got engaged…and got married…to his girlfriend of 10 years and mother of his child…who quit her job and sold her house and moved across the country to be with him after the wedding. And EW stayed with her AP through that marriage and helped to destroy it. Eventually, EW realized she needed a way to “legitimize” her two-year hidden relationship with her AP. So, she “came clean” to her friends and family, admitted to portions of what I had insisted was true years earlier, etc. (As FreeVixen notes, EW didn’t come clean to me, or to FV, so this was another self-serving move, not genuine repentance.) A year later…while the AP’s divorce was still proceeding, they purposefully got pregnant, and now they have a baby.
I’m a chump, even now. But given the above paragraph, there is NO WAY that any mutual friend can honestly claim that my wife “was unhappy in her marriage to JC, so she made a mistake.” No. All of her major life decisions since she first starting cheating on me were selfish and destructive, showing no integrity or underlying quality of character. Those friends are not mutual anymore — I stopped replying to their emails and texts, and soon enough they stopped writing them (because it’s easier for them his way, too).
I’ve rarely been put in a position in which I had to so directly and explicitly judge the value systems of friends. But my EW put me in that position, and those friends didn’t pass muster.
“No integrity or underlying of character”
Love, love, love this- so true for me as well!
I concur with the others; you are mighty! I’ve gone through a pretty similar thing, and really I just had to apply the best-friend test: if this was happening to my best friend, would I make excuses for it? Would I defend the aggressor? Of course I couldn’t, and wouldn’t. Anybody who normalizes or minimizes my ex’s behavior, ESPECIALLY the drunk driving with my kid in the vehicle (which continues) and the embezzling money from me, but even if it was just deciding to give me an STD while pregnant, is not a human being who I consider to be remotely safe.
exactly – I do not know to what level some would actually suck up to ex fuctards behaviour in order to exclaim – ‘well he seems happier’ – of course he seems happier – he dumped his financial and family obligations and is entertaining new meat in order to feel better about himself and his disasterous mistakes. It seems like everyone has an opinion of the relationship breakdown as to whether the one leaving the party is happier and more fulfilled. Great!! nothing about loyalty, morals or fairness.
Is there any way you can document/prove the drunk driving, and refuse visitation to protect your child?
JC, so with you on dumping the Switzerland-folk immediately. They are just as toxic as the Exes. My STBX told everyone that I had decided to leave him, and that he was “heartbroken over her decision.” This was after he went batshit-psycho-crazy on me, kicked a door almost in, and raged at me to “get out of my house” so I had to call the police.
Stayed at my office until I finally told a good friend and stayed at her house until I could get temp support and an apartment. Two weeks later he had a woman moved into my house, which was found out when I brought friends to help me pack my things and get them out. He deliberately left clear evidence to show me what he had been doing in my house and in my bed. I’m guessing that this had been going on for a while prior to his meltdown.
I told a few mutual friends about this and his years of narcissistic abuse; most of those discarded him immediately. One, even after hearing about what had happened, decided to continue contact with STBX, and I told him in no uncertain terms why I would not be speaking with him ever again. There were also many people in a meetup group whom I just didn’t even pursue because I knew how STBX probably slanted things and they just weren’t worth it to me.
The harder part was facing the enabling that STBX’s father and stepmother did and will likely continue until the divorce goes through. Over time I had realized that their family pattern is to enable the (numerous) narcissists and walk on eggshells so as not to “disturb” them. I guess it should have been no surprise when they defended him and his abuse as I filed for a fault divorce. However, it was a double betrayal because I *had* told them about several huge issues (drug & porn addictions/verbal & emotional abuse/financial abuse) over the recent years while they made supportive and sympathetic noises to me as I was making secret plans to try and get out.
IMHO, these people who stand back, defend, deflect, blameshift, or refuse to acknowledge abusive behavior are sick, dangerous, and no different from those who stood back and did nothing while Hitler came into power. There is no longer room in my life for even one iota of dysfunction in any area and I have no trouble cutting people out to keep my life safe and work back toward health. No contact, no contact, no contact.
I find you incredibly brave. I don’t have the self-respect (yet, I guess) to do that. My ex-husband moved only a few blocks away unfortunately, the kids are still teenagers and it’s suburbia small-town…
Yes, everyone’s situation is different. My wife and I didn’t have kids, and we lived in a large city. Even though she was only a mile away (I’ve since moved), I had the option of not seeing her and making new friends.
You will figure out who in your life is worthy of keeping, and who you have to let go. It took me 2 years to figure out that aspect. I wish you the best!
I wish I could reply to each of you to say thank you but for some reason there is no “reply box”after each and every comment (not sure why)….wow, I am listening and am in awe with everyone’s wisdom and time you took to respond and help me. I read all the messages over and over and it’s giving me strength. I certainly don’t feel alone in this now. It’s comforting to be surrounded by others who’ve been so fucking (sorry) hurt by this like me. What I don’t want to do is stay bitter. I want to forgive one day to move on for my sake and I hope to find the perfect middle between all those feelings that race inside me. You guys are the best..I hope you can all see this response. <3
MJo, people see your reply. (((((MJo))))
It shakes itself out eventually. You will drift away from the people who don’t want to choose sides simply because, by not doing so, they are actively Not Choosing You. Stick with the people who choose you. All of CN chooses you. We get you.
Thanks Loiuflower…your replies actually really hit a nerve. I am paralyses by all this still. My case isn’t like the others tho. It’s not like he cheated and I kicked him out (which I see a lot on NC). Mine was unhappy for many years, did nothing to make it better, I got angry, he blamed our failures on my anger, he stopped talking…found a friend then lover st the gym and a year later asked for a divorce. Said there was no affair and stayed in our house for four more months (while I withered away) while his house down the street was ready. And surprise, surprise, started “dating” coincidentally the woman from the gym. He’s convinced people he left because the marriage was bad. Which I know sounds weird, but it feels like it’s all my fault as in I should have tried harder. I know, I am very messed up.
MJo –
What you went through sounds like the classic Cluster B relationship cycle (Idealize, devalue discard), it is one of the most painful, destabilizing and cruel dynamic there is with a lover/spouse.
You tried your best, but you were played in a game where the rules were changed without you being aware of that.
Many at CN have been right where you are, myself included. This is why No Contact and individual therapy is so important, both will help you detach and recover your own sense of identity, including reinterpreting your story from your own perspective, not what your X wants you to believe.
There are great resources out there to start your recovery here at CN, CL’s book is a gem to get started with. I also found Lundy Bancroft’s work and book “why does he do that” super helpful.
Also, this radio segment on why he is already with someone else was super helpful to me – https://www.blogtalkradio.com/relational-harm-reduction/2014/10/24/after-a-pathological-love-relationship-hes-moved-on-and-is-with-someone-new
Start with small steps, take good care of the basics (nutritious food, exercise, as much sleep as you can), and educate yourself about cluster Bs and their relationship cycles.
It is a long road to Meh, you got this, and we are here for you every step of the way…
(((MJo)))
He could have been an adult. He could have worked on it or left. So many of us have heard “but I was so unhappy.” Other people’s happiness is their job – not yours. He was awful and you did not deserve to be treated that way. You are in no way responsible for his cheating. Stick around. You will find your strength and your momentum.
None of his cheating is your fault!! None!!
In my marriage, I wasn’t perfect. Near the end (web before the affair), our intimacy had waned. And I should have done something to address that.
But while that could have contributed to my wife’s alleged unhappiness (which she only claimed post-D-Day), that didn’t make her cheat.
Unhappiness doesn’t make people cheat. Shitty character and lack of integrity make people cheat.
You don’t control your spouse or his actions. Those are ALL on him
You’re describing the classic cheater narrative and standard chump response. So no, your story is neither different nor unusual insofar as you got blamed for things for which your ex needed to take personal responsibility. Anger is a *normal* response to living with a cold, brooding, miserable spouse who both refuses your attempts to help and refuses to seek a solution. My ex loves to blame his affair on my anger with him, but refuses to acknowledge that I was angry because he was cheating, or that cheating is something worth being mad about. Don’t believe that shit. HE chose to be miserable and not involve you in getting better. HE chose to lie to you and withhold partnership. HE chose to cheat. HE chose to blame it on you because you’ve probably been so good at carrying his burdens for so long already, and guilt is a very inconvenient feeling. Stop believing what he’s trying to tell you about who you are and how you should value yourself. He is full of shit, friend.
MJo, he’s a cheater! If he was unhappy in your marriage, he didn’t need to cheat and lie and craft a hidden life to unveil–voila!–when you separated or divorced.
It’s not your fault. He’s a cheater and a liar. You aren’t. If you can, find a good therapist and do some work on getting past blaming yourself. That will help you build your new life on a solid foundation.
You are not messed. Your feelings are real. Many of us have felt this way. I am rooting for you!
MJo
Well you are messed up in one way but not another. You are messed up because you have been lied to and gaslighted by a total creep. YOU however are not messed up in yourself. As soon as you become stronger as you crawl out from underneath all the crap he had dumped on you, you will find that your essential loving, trusting self was there all along. He messed you up.
And none of us make a lovely job of exiting from our relationships with these fuckwits. It’s messy and painful and we all mess up multiple times but we keep coming back here for some plain talking and sense and finally we get out.
Dealing with fuckwit is one huge thing in itself, dealing with other assholes in your life takes more time still. Be like Johnny Cash. Make a list, get to each one when you are ready.
Nothing about this can be rushed. The head and heart are not synchronised for a long time which is unnerving. Just keep taking care of yourself and incrementally strengthening your boundaries and you will get there. It’s not a race, this is the rest of your life.
Hang in there. We are all here!
And in a year or more you will take all you have learned and will plough it all back into the new newbies at chump lady.
MJo – I don’t think you are messed up. I think you are struggling with the very same things we all have been. We struggle with the new narrative that is written about our lives by our X’s. If he tells people that he left because the marriage was bad, and this doesn’t seem like the reality you have experienced, it’s super upsetting. Very very upsetting! You are wondering why he left out the part about the lies. You are upset because your brother was friendly to someone who has hurt you terribly. Of course you are upset!
The tough part is figuring out how to move forward, but keep reading here and things will get clearer for you.
MJo, I think your case is actually really similar to a lot of ours. My ex told everyone that he was “just unhappy”. He told me he “lost us”. And we had only been married for three years! Meanwhile he was actually going behind my back and dating multiple women while lying to me and making me believe everything was perfectly fine. It’s minimizing what happened and it’s a form of manipulating us who feel responsible for another’s happiness. But you said it yourself he wouldn’t do anything to make himself happier. That’s on him!
For me, getting rid of the friends and family that were still talking to him and also minimizing what he did helped SO much. The fact that they were still talking to him made me constantly question whether he was really as bad as I thought he was. And if I was wrong about that then maybe I was the one who was so awful that he just had to leave me. Why else would they all be on his side? It’s all a bunch of tricks your mind is playing on you though. You did everything you could and the sooner you can cut out the triggers that are still making you feel like crap the better you’ll feel.
And you are not messed up I’m pretty sure every single person here felt like you at some point!
JC, you are mighty! Your successful efforts to get and keep her out of your life are smart and necessary. She is toxic.
“We don’t want to take sides.”
My ex kicked thru front door…left kids in car on a hot summer day and picked up child neglect charges…got me 60k into debt.”
If they weren’t standing AGAINST that behavior, they were allowed no contact with me and kids.
Otherwise you live in the land of apologist let it go bs.
That is such a clear line to draw in the sand. I appealed on many levels of crappy behaviour that I could not believe the Switzerland lot would let go by. but they did; the 2 years of planning to leave and the financial ravaging he organised so me and the kids would be left with nothing?!! Stealing the kids savings accounts then insisting – it was or them anyway to pay school fees….and now letting the mortgage lapse so the house could foreclose… yep those friends are just enjoying the show and cannot bring themselves to make a moral decision – they are still invested in the image.
I have a long time neighbor and their family who we have been close to for over 20 years. She said to me ” Gaslighter ran over you with a fully loaded semi truck, backed over you again and left you in the ditch”. Then she got mad when Gaslighter ignored her at an event (he is scared of her, and was with Schmoopie) so neighbor went over and said hi to him and went in for a hug! He didn’t hug her, just pattet her on the arm and got out of there fast. Then she made small talk at the grocery store.. I asked her why she would give him the time of day? He lived in their guest house for 8 months after I kicked him out, never offered a dime or help with utilities, or took them for dinner in thanks. When they were making rumblings about charging him rent, he schmoozed his way back to our guest House (don’t get me started down that path…) She says she loves my sons and he is their Dad and she will be civil. Her husband has had a few beers with him and had him over for a game once. Now she is livid with me because I called her a Switzerland friend. I asked her husband and her to choose, and she thinks its not fair. We barely speak now. She knows all the horrific details of what he has done. Its mind blowing. Its weird, because she doesnt like that Gaslighter is wary of her. She is doing her own ” pick me dance!”
Bingo! “She is doing her own ” pick me dance!”
She’s either a pleaser or an idiot. Can you imagine the chats she has with him? She probably approves of him too. This is a person without a spine.
I think your x is the one who acts normal in the situation.
You’re so much better off without those people. They’re more like your ex than you. They are probably cheaters themselves – in more ways than one. Time to clean house!
That is so true! The only friends or relatives that are ok being around the ex/cheater are cheaters themselves even if you don’t know it yet!!
I understand what you’re saying, especially surrounding your case. I would not have any difficulty choosing sides. However, what if it’s only about the cheating? The lying? it bothers me to no avail to see friends (who know the circumstances) and even a few relatives on my side of the family, engage in small talk with him. Maybe I’m being petty or vindictive or controlling.
Wow I was worried there was something wrong with me. You know I’m angry, I’m bitter blah blah blah.relieved here to lean that I am actually enforcing boundaries. Woo hoo good on me. Switzerland friends weren’t shining nearly so bright for me anymore so I picked. I want people in my life that share the same values and moral I have for myself.
If you want to be friends with a Cheater and stay at our family cabin with Stbx and his latest fling when our kids didn’t even know skank would be there then I am not willing to give you the time of day. I settled for 23 years, I don’t anymore.
I have relatives like that: my mother and she is a hell of a narc.
Over the years I figured it’s not about whomever she befriends. It’s about what she can squeeze against me. I don’t care anymore what she says or thinks. Cold shoulder/No contact is the cure. These days I don’t give her the power to upset me: I don’t give her my info, my time or my attention.
You aren’t.
My mom and her husband attend the same church as my ex and his affair partner.
I heard one day when my mom was a greeter that she said hello to him.
I about lost my shit.
He abandoned the wife who loved him and broke the kids who trusted him. Anybody from my camp that has ANYTHING to do with that is out of my world….no discussion.
I talked to my mom and she now understands what the deal is.
If that’s messed up to anybody, so be it. It’s my policy, end of story.
Paintwindow, I understand where your mom is coming from. If I were your mom and saw your ex, I would at least be civil to him. Why? Because maybe if I snubbed him then he might get angry and take it out on you and the kids.He might accuse you of badmouthing him and make things harder on you. Why not keep the peace. Its not like shes inviting him for coffee.
denvergirl2 I like the way you think!
How about this for a greeting? ” Welcome, adulterous sinner, have you come to repent?
I do understand what you are saying.
What he does is not that.
He parades his affair partner and the replacement kids in front of my mother just to stir it up, sure that she will tell me.
It’s not like he sees my mother and says ” please tell paintwidow I’m sorry everyday for what I did to her and the kids.”
It’s more that he has to make sure that it gets back to me and our kids that he’s so happy with the new family.
As for my mom, she said she didn’t know what to do in that situation.
I told her to ignore him and tell anybody that asked that you were uncomfortable because he cheated on your daughter with the other member of the congregation.
I’m sure they would understand.
Yo, you’re assuming that being reasonable and polite will keep the cheater from doing those nasty things. That is an incorrect assumption. Most cheaters will make accusations of badmouthing, even when you don’t say a word about them or speak only the dry facts. Most will get angry even when you are always civil (they don’t like consequences). Most will take that anger out on you, and will disregard the children’s well-being, no matter what you do.
You can’t nice them into being nice, you can’t reasonable them into being reasonable. And you CAN’T keep tip-toeing around and bending over backwards to try to manage their behaviour. It doesn’t work, and it makes us ill and unhappy.
I like your policy paintwindow. I follow the same one! It is not ok to talk to him and it never will be.
“only about the cheating” – stop minimizing this. Then it becomes very clear why you have a problem with relatives chatting. They have picked his side. Tsk tsk they don’t approve of his behavior, but why should we all be uncomfortable? Chatting with them is making them feel better – at your expense. Felt invisible before? Now you can feel like you don’t matter all over again. This is an EASY ONE. The divorce with sides. EASY. You are the good guy. The honest guy. The unshakable values guy. You don’t hang out with blurry edges people. That’s who those relatives are. No courage of their convictions. They aren’t like you. The cheater is “petty or vindictive or controlling” – and the cheater needs to face those consequences. Stupid relatives.
i must be royally messed up then. My ex-husband took our boys for an after-hockey burger after their game. Apparently my brother and his son went as well. (Both my brother and ex coach the team). I was so upset that my brother chose to go. I was told to swallow it, that he did it for his son, probably, who wanted to be in the company of my kids (they are 15 and 16). No other adults but my ex and brother were there. I felt betrayed all over again. Would you feel that way too?
Thanks Traffic_Spiral. I do see your point and here lies my frustration. ge is after all, the father of my children. If I put myself in my kids shoes, while they are not happy and proud of what he did to our family, he is still their dad. I wouldn’t like everyone shunning my father despite what he did. I would feel badly for him. And how long do you do this? The rest of his life? It’s bloody hard for the person cheated on/left but what I feel I have to do is accept (as hard as it is) that I can’t control everyone’s actions. If neighbors and friends stop talking to him, then I drop them too? It would make for a lonely and bitter world for me.
I think your situation is a bit different. If your son wants to hang out with his cousin, is your brother just supposed to refuse to let them hang out together because of what your ex did? Is your brother supposed to abdicate supervising his son in your ex’s presence?
I’d say that so long as your brother’s interaction with your ex is limited to being around the kids, that’s acceptable. If they’re getting beers together, that’s different.
I found out my brother talks with X after I specifically asked him not to.
While X and I were married they barely talked to each other.
I will never speak with him again, I couldn’t imagine befriending someone who tried to destroy him.
My brother is just as much a narc/sociopath as X.
Oh hell yes, that would definitely upset me. Listen, this is where you learn to draw and enforce boundaries. YOU decide what feels like betrayal. YOU decide what hurts. YOU decide what you’re not OK with. You don’t need anyone’s permission to decide that someone’s behavior toward you was unacceptable. Please, start trusting your own judgment. I didn’t trust my own judgment after d-day, either. Having your feelings and needs minimized for years pounds you into a pulp. I remember reading comments here and wishing I could be like these confident, self-assured people who take no shit. Turns out that’s a learned behavior, and the more I hung around with Chump Nation, the more I learned it. I’m pretty good at it after all.
I have confidence in you to know deep down what is not OK with you. Start there, and then keep going.
Oh yes, I would be upset with your brother. Yes he did it for his child and in the moment didn’t have the courage to say no. Let him know you do not approve and why.
I stopped seeing my sister for two years because she continued to us his service.
After not being invited to Thanksgiving dinner or going to her house on christmas she asked me why and I told her.
She’s my sister and after what he did to me I don’t do Switzerland.
I would cold shoulder any sibling of mine who willingly went out to eat with my X. Nuh-uh. It’s one thing if they are civil to him at some family function (e.g., a graduation), but to socialize with him? That’s a betrayal.
If the kids wanted to spend time together, your brother didn’t have to join. He could have picked his son up later after he burgers 🙂
Not wanting to make a choice IS making a choice . He is your borther and should have your back.
My parents are still in contact with X-hole, my dad actually will call him! They invited him to where they live so he could help them hang some pictures, which luckily didn’t happen. My parents don’t realize he is using them to get info on me. Plus, the new guy in my life, my mom doesn’t like him. She doesn’t really have a good reason, like he isn’t abusive or cheat or lie to me, whatever. Never had a good relationship with them anyway. My brother warned them that their behavior will hurt their relationship with me, shows you what kind of people my parents are.
That would be hard. If you felt hurt, you were hurt.
“When a person tells you that you hurt them you don’t get to say that they didn’t.” Louis CK
Acknowledging and expressing feelings is healthy. You can tell your brother that you swallowed it for long enough in your marriage. Maybe he will hear that…
I have relatives who do things with my cheater. One is a cheater himself. Either you’re for me or against me. My relatives who betray me get the cold shoulder.
His contact photo is a pile of dog shit.
Very early on I had to say, via e-mail, any discussion will be through attorneys.
My response motto to anything he says via text or e-mail is “CRICKETS” — meaning nothing (and I’m not even tempted to engage with him) — the reasons being he’s a life suck to the nth degree.
I was a slow learner, a major Chump. But, once I “got it.” By God, I got it. No Contact really is the path to the truth and light (thank you AOOK and, of course, CL). It is so key to allowing all the toxicity to seep from your brain so that you can see, with clarity, how things really are. And the reality is that these are some amazingly twisted, disordered, fucked up reptiles posing as nice, normal human beings that have the power to bring you to your knees if you do not disengage from them. Yea, they’re that bad.
Good for you Nikki Lynn!!!!!
Left him, there are about 7.5 billion people on this planet and over 7 billion have never heard of you or your cheater. Go ahead and make some new friends so you stop caring what the old ones think…..of anything.
Niki
Lol !!! Pile of dog shit !
His contact name….BFF….Big Fat Fucker….
lol! Thanks for the laugh. 🙂
“His contact photo is a pile of dog shit”, I laughed my ass off! Thank you for that Nikki Lynn, I needed a good laugh. I wish I could make mine appear as a pile a dog shit in my phone too, but my kids will see it and I can’t think up a good enough reason to tell them why their dad’s pic is now a steaming pile of dog turd. Can’t even put the poo emoji, they’ll wonder why ??
Oh, glad I could provide you with that, LHATA! Btw, I enjoyed reading your story the other day. Best I can remember you are one might chump for how you went about devising your plan and patiently waiting still you, well … LHATA! Well done, sister.
Hey Nikki Lynn, thank you! I was afraid my story would paint me as one cold, calculated b*tch (the Chump in me, I guess, is worried what people might think of me), because it’s actually not in my nature to be like that. I had a lot of internal, moral conflict going on when I was in the midst of it, as it was WAY out of character for me to be so “devious” (my counsellor prefers to call it “survival tactics”). But after D-day, I really had to grow a pair quickly and be smart about how to leave him. Other things were at stake, among them the constant threat from him that if I ever left him he would take the kids and place them in his elderly mother’s care in his home country, and I would never see them again. You threatened the wrong b*tch, mother***ker. So, yeah…I had to put serious plans in place. Hence the very sneaky “just going on my regular holiday” departure when I left him at the airport. I know it might make me look like a devious person. I really am not. It was WAY out of character for me. I was like a mother hen – don’t you dare touch my chicks, I will peck your eyes out!! I went into survival mode for 4months. It was necessary. I’m still so chumpy, haha, listen to me here justifying why I did what I did. Oh, chumpy me just won’t go away, will you chumpy ?
Girl, you don’t have to justify anything with me. I understand completely. While I don’t have kids myself I can certainly imagine that Momma bear attitude that you had to have. I agree with what your counselor said “survival tactic.” With no kids and having a job I didn’t have to handle as many factors as so many women have to deal with like yourself. I have all the admiration in the world for those of you who strategically devise a plan (as sneaky as need be!!!!) to GTFO!!!!! Props to you.
Every time I am in Walmart and see that “pile of shit” emoticon throw pillow, I am tempted to get it as a instant reminder of what a piece of shit my ex was. It just seems like a good idea! ?
Hmmm, DancesWithMeh, my thought is that would be an excellent house warming gift for my stbxpos! Thanks for bringing it to my attention!
My contact picture of him was removed over time and he has been re-named many times (a#&hole, creep, douche are a few of my favorites). Currently his name (no picture) is “Drop it – Leave it – Let it go”. He doesn’t text often anymore (whew – sick of all those “Good Morning – I will always love you” BS texts) but when he does, it takes me a second or two to realize its him! Then I delete it and go on with my day.
Happy Friday everyone!
Yeah….when he leaves the family for the much younger affair partner it makes no contact easy and not getting “I miss u” texts a certainty.
The AP wouldnt even let him get anything from my house without her. Lol
I love that I haven’t seen him in person in a year and a half, but I also have to laugh at her insecurity. Guess she realizes if he will do it with her, he will do it to her.
OMG – I changed mine to lying cheating asshole – & I actually got a text from him one time saying my alimony check would be late . I had to stop and think who it was then I burst out laughing then I call my lawyer . I received my alimony check the next day
For those unfortunates like me who have a cheater who (a) refuses to leave the home and (b) tries to force verbal interaction at every opportunity, I have a very simple method of enduring long rants of rage, self-pity, and minimalization.
Whenever there is a stop to take a breath, simply say: “Are you finished?” and go back to whatever you were doing.
(In one encounter, I said it 6 times to KK before she finally gave up and walked away.)
The verbal abuse can definitely get ratcheted up as they get frustrated at their lack of success, but it WILL wear them out eventually — much like dealing with spoiled infants, which of course they are.
Heres a potentially satisfying specialized bonus — if in their ranting they demand that you acknowledge them, simply say “OK, here you go” and raise your middle finger.
And this is why Ux is the king of inspiration for those of us who had to live with our cheaters for months on end after D-Day and finding.
Classic, UXworld! Love it.
One of my favorite memories is when the lawyer told us that the divorce couldn’t continue until he moved out of the house. His face was priceless! I’d been trying to get him out for months.
As a bonus, he went NC with me because I insisted he honor the terms of our divorce settlement. I had to start sending things registered mail. Then I emailed him at work one time (he’s currently works with Child Protective Services which is hysterical according to our kids) and he sent me a snippy email saying that I shouldn’t email him there because if he is subpoenaed his email becomes part of the court records. I immediately said that I understood but if he took longer than I thought necessary to reply to an email or text, I WOULD use his work email. He immediately contacted me to let me know he had unblocked my number in his phone and unblocked my email.
Actually, it really steamed me that he would go NC when all of the problems arose from his behavior. But he and his twu wuv are “happily” married and busy doing damage control to her career (they were both pastors).
Jesus Cheaters…low form of life…universally hated here.
My deadcheater’s OW was fired from a job for her affair with him (she was a vendor and he was a government purchaser) he got her a new job and I was ready to email her at work possibly putting that job at risk. Giving him credit, some sociopaths would have just beat me up/threatened me not to do it, but he had 3 decent molecules in his body and realized that if I wanted to contact her, I would. He then gave me her private email address.
Watching his face when he was deciding about giving his wife his girlfriends email address was priceless.
Oh, they got found out, UNM? How did they get found out. Was he fired as well?
UX, I have all the respect in the world for all of you who have to continue to have contact moving through the process. You, no doubt, are building mental toughness that is off the charts! Best to you.
Hey UX – thanks for the laugh….excuse me while I go get a towel to wipe up the coffee I spewed!
Clearing out all of x’s stuff, every last bit is both cathartic and rids your space of unconscious reminders. When ever I get the urge to call Mr Sour, I go through my support list and either bith about him are talk about gardening, travel, even politics. I talk less about Mr Sour these days.
Recently I’ve began self examination and acceptance that his tactics hurt and it wasn’t cool, or fair or just. But I also remind myself of my blessings, my maintenence and this life from now own is up to me cheater free.
Hope for a better life keeps me going one step at a time.
This is super helpful, thanks. I took down all the photos (am in the early process of filing) but I just feel like there are reminders everywhere I look.
One of the first things I did was reprint my room, get a new bed, new sheets, towels, etc. so I could have a sanctuary that was free of Narkles the Clown, a place I wanted to wake up, a place where I could smile freely without unconscious Narkles theClown everywhere. Slowly I redid the rest of the house too and removed any pics of him, signs of him, things he owned or gave me. I didn’t want to jar the kids with a clean sweep but it had to be done.
Me too. The gifts I had received over the course of my marriage were very few. And he doesn’t have very good taste, so that part was easy!
Sorry for the typos.
I realized he couldn’t hear me while we were still married. Why waste my time and effort on someone who can’t/won’t listen to me?
I added a photo of a flying monkey to his name on my contact list. So if he calls, all I see is a flying monkey. Nobody wants to talk to that!
Great observation. I think you’re right they don’t hear us…..until we get mighty and find a lawyer to do a little of the talking.
Sure, then they want to talk.
Another beautiful moment to have No Contact, the path to the truth and the light. It’s a really big way of saying, no, you had your chance.
Wow ” couldn’t hear me while we were still married ” what a profound statement
I never thought of it that way
Yeah – this. Stbx hasn’t listened to me for years. Became apparent after literally seeing the surprise on his face that the renos on our house was to set us up for retirement and so he could finish work sooner as he said he wanted. Yes, I was listening! And yes, talked about this ad naseum. I thought. After he asked for separation and at this point had successfully chumped me, the fuck. Meanwhile, while I’m here working 7 days a week on our house, and him working away in another state, he was romancing, falling in love and setting up their lovely future. He did this for over a year. His betrayal was profound. I since found out about the usual – 15-20 years of prostitutes, hook ups, flirty fun dates, and untold number of affair partners. After 20 years of being ‘out there’ my husband finally found someone to settle down with. Nice.
CN its so good to not have to explain how these discoveries felt.
He just stopped paying attention. He decided not to hear me. Of course, he no longer loved me. Just waiting to find the love of his life to save him from the horror of his marriage. Sad sausage.
The flying monkey is a great choice.
^This. I wasted my breath and time for so many years trying to get the lightbulb to go on in his head over his shitty behavior. I have finally accepted the fact that there is not a good core in him that I can somehow reach with the right words or actions. Why waste another minute of my time?
Maybe dealing with the mounds of documentation that I have compiled and hopefully paying more than he wants in support once the divorce is finalized will get through;-)
Yes, this. He stopped paying attention or really caring about anything I said years ago. I believe fucking other people allows you to easily disregard what your spouse is saying.
Or the only opinion they really care about is their own, selfish flying monkey!
I had the funeral march as his ring tone as this made me laugh. I then went completely no contact by slamming the car door on my phone, this wiped its memory (if only mine could be wiped so easily) and I did not have his number any more nor did I reinstate it.
Good for you!
My ex refuses to text. Says his phone cannot do it when I know he has an iPhone 6. Anyway, the ringer on my phone for his contact is set to “The Asshole Song” by Jimmy Buffett. I do not answer the phone, he can leave a message.
I have to go out of my way to avoid him when we are at mutual events for the kids. It is awkward to say the least. I have to leave either before or after he does to avoid a confrontation in the parking lot because of his craziness. You don’t know what personality you will get, fakey, fakey gooey nice or pissed off argumentative jerk.
If it is important paperwork, I send him a certified letter, that way I have a paper trail.
It is sad it is like this, it has been going on eight years and because of his personality disorder, I don’t foresee it getting any better.
I feel terrible for the kids, they are stuck in the middle of his craziness.
I started a letter to X on my computer at work and cut/pasted all the snarky tidbits I’d read here — CN says it so much better than I could! The letter grew and grew. Finally divorced last January, I printed off the letter and addressed it to X & Twu Luv and carried it around with me for months. This past fall, I discovered an old friend was going through the same problem and over the course of a dinner, she asked me for coping techniques. Remembering the letter, I gave it to her to read and then to keep. She’s cut out snippets and pasted them on her fridge for days when she’s overcome. I always thought I’d mail that thing, but this was a much better use for it and has given her solace and laughs. Of course, I also directed her to this website!
Mom9193, awwwwh that is so beautiful. I love this story!! You carried the letter around all that time, and it ended up helping somebody else in need. Love it!! This is something truly lovely. I too wrote a LONG letter to drop on him outlining the hell he put me through. But after reading CL and CN a lot, I realise it’s not going to help him understand what he did. Because he’ll never get it. And I don’t wanna give him any power, or give him the satisfaction of thinking he’s ruined my life. So for now, the letter sits saved on my phone. I love what you did with your letter. Just perfect. Well done! ?
I wrote a letter (long) about the many many betrayals and abuse. This was just 4 months after Dday. I worked on that letter for four more months. I was like a possessed author/writer…it was my go to when I felt overwhelmed. I never sent it to him. I am returning to therapy after a year and a half break and I gave it to my new therapist for “background!” I do regret now that I did not journal (it was simply too painful to put it on paper then), but that letter could receive awards!!
I have an entire file folder on my computer with notes I have written and never sent. The words just keep spinning in my head because I want to say them but know it won’t help. After I type them up and save them, it stops the merry-go round in my head (or at least slows it or interrupts it for while) so I can focus on the other million things that need my attention (like my job, my kids, my pets, my house, my car, etc)
GetMeFree, this one helped so much! Lots of responses to his idiocy, said every single thing I wanted to say, but never sent to him.
‘Cause what would be the point? It’s not like I ever got through to him over 14 ys together – why would that change now?
Definitely a lesson learned. If you keep repeating yourself over and over with another adult and they don’t adjust anything, then it is not that they don’t hear you, it is that they don’t care.
I love this, am going to try it…
Awesome!
Would have loved to see a copy of the letter!
I try to follow the BIFF principle when contact must happen with narcissist ex as we do have young kids together. Keep my emails (that’s the only way we communicate) Brief, Informative, Factual and Friendly….it is hard when he attacks your parenting, when the tone is demeaning, when HE (the cheater) is angry, when he is the perfect parent etc…..I try to read the emails looking for “is there a question or fact about kids”. If the answer is no, I don’t respond.
I married the same guy. Unfortunately I don’t have the wisdom you have to not engage bad got myself in a lot of back and forth with him that could have been avoided if I kept it factual. Lesson learned (but my crushed heart so eagerly wants to tell him off).
I will still vent to my closest friends and at times write my “fantasy email” where I really tell him off….but NEVER send it. Engaging with a narcissist is a useless battle. It just feeds their ego. I found the book “Narc Decoder” very helpful as it’s full of examples from an ex and how she responds to them if response is needed. I only email when ABSOLUTELY necessary and only regarding the children. It’s been almost five years and it’s still a struggle at times.
My cheater has the same first name as my beloved father. The latter is from Pittsburgh. I didn’t delete cheater’s number from my phone, as I want to make sure I can identify him if he calls or texts. So to prevent any mistakes, I changed his name to “Jagoff” (a frequently slung insult in PGH) in my phone.
As a Pittsburgh, I think “Jagoff” is perfect. 🙂
*Pittsburgher….sorry
Blocking him only encouraged him more to reach out. Finally, I texted him and said, I really can’t be in touch with you — it’s not you, it’s me. I have nightmares every time we are in touch. It was true. I had to start believing that my sleep was more important than anything he might have to say to me. And believe it or not, this worked!!!! 🙂
I like to confuse him when I have the time (for example, the “42 is the answer” text) but my favorite is using GIFs to respond. No words, just pictures (seriously-themed ones are my favorite). Both methods make him go away frustrated, leaves me alone for a few days, and I feel better for having a bit of a laugh at his nonsense.
I’d to see an example of what he would ask, and a GIF that you would respond with….
I was a bit slow on the learning curve. When I moved first moved out I was trying to keep the peace so as not to upset the settlement apple cart. He’d call me three or four times a week at work. All because he wasn’t finished using me: a conclusion I could only reach once I implemented no contact.
When (during one of his phone calls) he asked me out for our officially defunct anniversary, I finally snapped and told him the “favor train” was permanently leaving chump station. (this only after my mediator informed me that barring fraud or us getting back together, since we had been to court and signed the papers the settlement was final.)
It took some practice after that. I still got tangled in a few text and email wars. When I would falter I would start over and then keep track of my days without contact like companies keep track of days without an accident. It worked! When he sent me a Happy Birthday text I had gone about 4 or 5 months with no contact and I realized what a manipulative piece of shit he actually was. That birthday wish was nothing more than image management.
I had recently learned that with an iphone you could block a person from your phone without having to block them from your account. (Both kids are on my account) so I did that. His email address was relegated to “junk mail” in 2 of my 3 accounts, leaving only one for him to use regarding the kids. He’s only used it once.
Our children are adults and contact is not necessary at all. It’s been almost 3 years since I’ve had anything to do with him and I can’t tell you how much clarity I got when I stepped away from that crazy! All out of Kibble is so right. No contact truly is the path to truth and light. It’s like any other habit though. It takes time to establish. You just have to stick with it, get right back on the horse when you falter and eventually it is as easy as breathing. I highly recommend it!
Way to go!
If crossing paths (ie, kid’s school or sporting event) is unavoidable, I blow right by him and don’t even make eye contact. Sometimes he lowers his head and mutters hi. He’s pathetic.
The longer I maintained NC, the more I began to heal, and the strong desire to text him started to dissipate and finally went away. Now, I don’t want to contact him at all anymore. It took about 6 months for the intense feeling for a connection with him to fade. Seeing him with the other woman on the final DDay helped me to detach, but we had built a life together and I was true to our vows so it was still hard.
“The longer I maintained NC, the more I began to heal”
Bravo!
Strategy 1: I carried around text and email exchanges from the X (or at that time, STBX) that illustrated his profound mastery of mindfuckery and evidence of his not-giving-a-shit about me. Cleared up any temptation I had to contact him.
Strategy 2, when he kept circling back wanting contact via email: Wrote a VERY snarky email, and signed it “Toodles, Tempest” so that he decided HE didn’t want to contact me because I had become nasty and vile and he no longer recognized me. Arrivederci, jerk.
I do strategy #1. I also have a document titled “Disordered Statements” detailing the most extreme and messed up statements he has made over the past year. Anytime I start questioning if he and the situation is really as bad as I think it it, I just do a quick read.
Tempest, if I can ever get legally untangled from this pos, I may have to employ your #2. Otherwise, it’s looking like I’m going to get the period circling back mindfuck via the lame ass texting indefinitely (never mind the e-mail, that’s waaaaaay to much effort and thought for mine to put into it) — Fuckwit does not need anymore than a few words that can easily be texted, “Ms you” “Sorry” “I dream about you every night”, and my favorite . . . “Good Morning” — WTAF?!!!
Sadly, most of these narcs will continue to circle back even if you’re rude to them. My snarky email worked because (a) my X is an arrogant ass, and so would never deign to pretend he wanted contact (he always had plausible excuses for contacting me post-divorce); and (b) he is SO power-oriented, that he needed to turn the tables on me. I had informed him 3 times I did not want any contact with him and would never forgive him; having to discuss who claimed oldest daughter on our taxes gave him a way to say he didn’t want contact. It was the old, “You can’t fire me, I quit.”
That is straight from Mr Fab’s playbook, “I broke up with you, so, there.” Verbatim.
I think my most effective mantra is the one I referenced yesterday — it won’t do any good to communicate with him because he isn’t who he appears to be. He doesn’t actually care and hurting me deeply isn’t a motivator for him. When he acts sad about losing me, he’s easy about what he is losing that makes his life easier.
So, I would remind myself those things, then look through the proof of his lies and multitudinous bisexual affairs (nothing against bisexuality – it’s his dishonesty that’s the problem, not who he was with while dishonest) to remind myself of the depth of deception and potential harm he put me through.
That’s the stuff that strengthened my resolve. (This was all before mobile phones – that immediacy would have made it harder.)
1) Block on all social networks.
2) Delete number. If you need to keep the number saved (kids involved et cetera), you replace the name with this: “- – – – – – – – -“.
3) Get rid of friends ‘on the fence’. (“If you can’t choose, I’ll choose for you.”) Sadly, these friends can be dangerous to your recovery process: becoming an informant et cetera.
4) Block in real life. “Hello” (for cordiality)… move on. What you do in person reinforces (or weakens) what you do in cyberspace.
Lol, naming my ex wasteman on my phone had repercussions when the kids saw it. Oh well, it’s back to his name now
I put Dorian Gray. My son saw when he called and asked him who is Dorian Gray? I had to change it to his initial.
When I first discovered his cheating I found his then-whores Facebook page with pictures of the two of them. I copied lots of it for evidence for later, but I kept one of the pics in my phone photo album. Whenever I’m tempted to contact him or feel sorry for him I just look at that picture of their smug, smiling faces and remind myself of who he really is. Bring on the righteous anger!
Yup, I did that too. Never forget
Haha – Yep I did that too
I forward emails. To my sisters and bff if it is “really good” (i.e. whiny, rude, demanding or otherwise manipulative). I usually add a few lines to the forwarded email. That satisfies the initial urge to reply. They give me funny and critical feedback as they are able.
Texts, I respond to minimally and factually, if at all.
For those of you new to this, practice makes perfect. The above is what I do now. I used to engage, argue, debate, etc.
Then I progressed to writing but not sending (!!) replies.
Now I forward as needed.
And it gets easier! I promise!
The other day, 2/3 kids did not want to go with their dad during “his time.” (Divorce in process and I have the backing of each of their individual therapists that “forcing them” to go is harmful to them.) He is still pissed off that I will no longer let him visit at my house (it has been 2 months since I shut that shit show down). He texted that I was “blocking access to the kids” because only one wanted to go. For a nanosecond I thought about replying, but the urge was over before my fingers touched the key pad, and I set the phone down and kept doing what I had been doing. It was only later that I realized it was a Mighty Moment! Then I did a little dance. The Gray Rock Shake.
Practice! Forgive yourself when you screw up! Try other strategies! Celebrate when you get it right!
❤
Good for you flower!
Awesome :)!!
//s.imgur.com/min/embed.js
I love the dance of the grey rock shake! I have a koozie that says ” I didn’t say it was your fault. I said that I was going to blame you “. I always keep it in sight ??. Small things are fantastic. I take photos of quotes on my phone to remind myself that he never cared for anyone. My divorce is waiting for the paperwork to be discussed and signed. I am basically free. I have found a small cabin in the mountains and am close to town, but not too close. ??❤️?
I changed his contact name to Horny Goat Shallow Hal. His ringtone sounds like a tiptoeing rat.
I finally stopped emailing him when I realized that he Just.Did.Not.GAF about anything but himself.
And when I realized that yes, people are capable of destroying a marriage, and moving on without even a backwards glance. Let alone any type of “sorry I blindsided you and never mentioned I was unhappy”.
These fuckers don’t deserve the head space.
YES. DivineLife, you just said it so beautifully. I always take a bit of truth away from comments like yours. I flippin’ love the name you chose. My son is learning to read, so I put mine in the phone as FAA (Family Abandoning Asshat). When he Skypes our children (cuz he only GAF about himself and moved to the opposite coast for his stripper affair partner) I see FAA and laugh. Or cringe. Or throw up a little in my mouth. One of those reactions.
My ex gets the better of me but not for the reasons that most chumps list on this forum. He would never say an unkind word or raise his voice. He’s so syrupy and false it makes me physically sick. It’s enraging and ridiculous. I just want to say, ‘Look, man, You shivved your family in the back and dropped us in the gutter, maybe just give the good guy schtick a damn REST.’
But he’s pathologically committed to looking like the good guy, And I’m pathologically committed to trying to call him out on it. It’s not good. I think maybe it’s because it was all smiles and supposed happy marriage until he took a packed bag and walked out on me with 2 babies in diapers. I never got my say, he just ghosted us. So I’m always trying to spray him with my sarcasm skunk, and he’s always ducking the stinkbomb and acting the victim.
Sadly, since we share 2 young children, NC is not an option for me. So my method for dealing with the insane unfairness of it all is walk away from the text and blog instead. I write an anonymous blog (just click my name above to read) and it’s been incredibly cathartic and healing for me. I can say whatever I want, often written out as if it’s to him. My blog is my proxy; a stand-in for his clueless face. I can make fun of the neck-tattoo he got of schmoopies name. I can mock her insane hypocrisy for hating cheaters and yet being the biggest home wrecker on earth. And, I can look back to 2014 when I started writing and see that, yes, there has been healing and growth. And if it helps others who can relate to this particular agony, I can at least feel that our pain has a purpose.
Best to you!!
Awesome, DivineLife. And, I’m trying to imagine what a tiptoeing rat sounds like! Lol.
Yup, nodding in agreement here.
For a long time no contact was something I had to white knuckle my way through.Because of the callous way he discarded me, I think I had PTSD and was trauma bonded to him.I would do NC for weeks,or a couple of months and then be overwhelmed by a desire to lash out via text or email.It was akin to battling an addiction.
I educated myself about narcissism and sociopathy and began to realise that these personality disordered types want you to stay enmeshed and engaged with them,even if it is angry , negative attention.The thing they hate most of all is your indifference and detachment/ disengagement.They hate the idea that they can no longer evoke any emotion in you.It took me so long to get to that place though and the internal battle was the worst.
He has had many names in my phone….but now he’s Arseface and the only reason he’s listed at all is so I can block him.
No contact is the greatest healing tool IMO.
I’ll jump in here because XH never reached out to me. I used to feel sad about that, but after reading all the nightmares of people who have to co-manage kids or share a home or somehow remain in any sort of contact with this cretins, I’ve changed my tune and am grateful to have gotten away with (as CL says) “a light sentence.”
Nevertheless, I wanted to write to him. Many many many many times. I had so much to say, so many questions to ask. — So I did. I wrote to him. But I never ever sent any of those missives and many of them are still saved on this computer somewhere. I’m hoping someday (maybe even soon) I may go back and read them and realize how much better off I am (I already do, but it’s never a bad idea to have more evidence of my own pain and heartbreak). — So, my key to NC was to go ahead and write the nastygrams, just don’t send them.
I have done that too, NWBiblio. I’ve posted many letters to him in the ‘dead letter’ section of my blog. It’s the idea of being able to say it that matters; their response is almost irrelevant. Because not only would nothing we say change their thinking, it would likely produce a response that we’d over-analyze or be hurt by. All that does is put them in the power position when what we really need to do is see them for what they truly are: something foul stuck to the bottom of our shoe.
Oh, NWBiblio, you did better than I did. I wrote and sent a couple of them. Cringeworthy but at the time, in the middle of being mysteriously discarded, I had things to say. So I said them and sent them. We did have some business to resolve but I also used that business to “reach out,” hoping Jackass had seen the light…what I got back was cruel, and nasty. That cured me for good. No contact became my guiding star. But in the early days of the unexplained slow-motion discard, I finally couldn’t stand the absence of texts and phone calls (when there used to be many every day). So I started out with “Do Not Call or Text” as his contact name so that if I wanted to call, I got a reminder not to. A few weeks after D-Day, I blocked his number and deleted all the old texts. I still have the FB messages I suppose–I used that after D-Day because that FB page is where I caught him.
I went through a stage where I wrote about what happened a lot but just for myself. I even sent myself a Mother’s Day letter (always tough for me, with a deceased narcissist mother and no kids myself). I needed a lot of bucking up in those days. But I just tossed a bunch of sad poems I wrote in the trash. Kept the good ones, though.
For me, it just helped to let it pour out into a letter. Got it out of me, somehow, to write it down. (Also a good tip for To-Do lists, as long as I don’t lose the list, because now it’s no longer in my head — that’s why I wrote it down. I digress.)
I did have to exchange a few emails with XH in early days, and I had the same reaction as you. As a veterinarian, I sometimes have to reach into a cage or carrier to retrieve a cat or dog hunkered down in the corner. Mostly, they’re just fearful but sometimes they’re downright nasty. With XH, I felt like I reached into that cage and heard a nasty guttural growl and hiss, and slowly withdrew my hand, “Oh, okay, now we’re being nasty, are we?” Let’s have no more of that nonsense, then, shall we? No contact, coming right up.
deedee, yes! I have had, and still do occasionally have that overwhelming desire to tear her down via text. Actually, the desire is still pretty much constant, but it’s NOT overwhelming like it used to be. I know it’s no good, mostly because she DGAF about me, and just gets off on my misery. So fuck that, NC for me. I have conquered those impulses.
Good for you Oaktree ,but trust me I know how difficult that battle is.
Now I couldn’t care less what he’s doing,where he is or who he’s doing.We all get there in the end.Time and no contact,or grey rock if you have to interact.
Once the financial settlement was signed 6 months after D day I immediately went NC. At first when I wanted to tear him a new one I loudly said ‘no contact tell the cat” and duly told the cat. After a while it wasn’t out loud and now almost 18m in I don’t wish to say anything to him.
I deleted him number at beginning of NC and changed his contact name to cheating cunt which then updated all emails ever sent to the same so as soon as I noticed changed it to just his name. He didn’t like NC and let his OW call the police on my son and I citing death threats and malicious emails (haven’t done a thing) denied it to the police and while police were in my lounge I told them about his embezzling that I had been informed about. He’s a police officer!!
He also then sent a solicitors letter saying because of my malicious acts he wasn’t going to honour our financial agreement. Luckily the agreement had staged lump sums so they now pay what he owes each month. He did that a week before the next lump sum was due. What a div – he must have thought I would still pay it. Lol.
It was challenging when he disowned our son and when he ignored him entirely for hours one day. When he didn’t wish him happy Xmas or happy 21st this month. I want to send a vile text or email and the cat has now died of old age but I’m in the habit now. It’s been 11.5 months since I communicated with him bar the solicitors letter reply. I no longer think that way.
Guarantee you that cat was a better companion than he ever was.
I’m sorry your little fur friend has passed on.
Way to be. Might with the No Contact.
Sorry for your loss (The cat)
Yes–sorry to hear of the cat’s passing.
Here is the list of questions and reminded I go through when STBX and family try to draw me into responding.
1. Is what they are saying/doing an attempt to instigate a reaction? If yes, do I want to hand them the power by responding? (Side note, ex’s brother is constantly belittling my teen girls on social media when they post anything about women’s equality (shocking, not really). I have chosen not to block this person so I can monitor, document and talk to my girls about it.
2. Will my reaction change their view point? (Rarely in history has anyone ever changed someone’s mind by telling them they are wrong)
3. Does what they think matter?
4. If someone thinks being Switzerland is the morally superior approach to horrendous behavior, our views on morality are mismatched and they are someone to keep at arms length.
Finally, I am the one who holds the power over my reactions, I will not give that power away to halfwits whom would live nothing more than to suck the joy out of me. My energy is more well spent on focusing on my life, instead of trying to understand the morally twisted minds of those who are not in my corner.
Got-a-brain
I love this. And number 2 has made me realise this when I didn’t before. Thank you. ?
Your daughters can hide their posts from the uncle without unfriending him. Go to the privacy function and start to “block”–a prompt will come up that suggests not allowing him to see posts rather than “block” or unfriend a relative. I would suggest taking that step as it is abusive for an adult to belittle young people in public or on social media. And he will see that he is still a “friend” but the girls will have none of the drawbacks of either allowing him access to their posts or unfriending or blocking him.
Not clear to me why they wouldn’t want to unfriend wacky-uncle, though. Berating them for believing in women’s rights on Facebook? That’s abusive from an adult. Sorry, Bubba, you just lost access to my soccer game pictures, too.
This….
2. Will my reaction change their view point? (Rarely in history has anyone ever changed someone’s mind by telling them they are wrong)
3. Does what they think matter?
Wooden spoon between the teeth, big shot of whiskey. Bite down hard and wait for the pain to go away! 🙂
Whatever it takes @oaktree !
Keep it up!
Lol very practical tips!
That’s awesome, Oaktree! (though I’d substitute gin)
The Wild West technique. I like it! 🙂
A few things: (1) 24 hour response rule to all emails and text messages – fucktard’s emergency is NOT my emergency; (2) when I get REALLY worked up, I draft the response I want to send fucktard but then send it to my best friend with the comment “This is what I really want to send but I’m not. See how nice I am?”; (3) I’ve also gotten to the point where I don’t even read his emails until the following morning (I hate getting worked up at night and kid is with me 90% of the time so I know there is no kid-related emergency); and (4) I don’t ever look at him or respond to him in any way during kid exchanges. Ever. He is NOT worth my time.
Yes, yes to this. I pull around a certain spot so my car is perpendicular and my kids just jump out and walk behind into his and then they drive right off. I never even see him. Whew. That reduced a lot of stress and triggering for me. Now, I think it’s funny that if I would ever accidentally catch a glimpse of him, it would only be in my rear view mirror. That seems perfect to me.
NO exchanges at the house. EVER. Shut that down. I could not handle him at what was now MY house.
Right on, blondebarrister. I’m lucky that I don’t have to even see her during kid exchanges, my son just walks out the door and gets in her car.
I got sucked back in to text contact when he was left off a sports team email list and was pissed at DD. So I had him added as I’m on the board. I then forwarded schedules etc. I should have stopped there….but found myself texting asking if he wanted to handle one of 3 all day events that require our child to miss school. When he asked if our child would be spending the night (the events happen on my custody days) I replied no. And politely said I was just giving him the opportunity to attend and volunteer. After several back and forth texts he replies he may attend all three but since they are my custody days I’m responsible for volunteering. My last text was great, let me know as if he did decide to attend he needs to volunteer and that DD would enjoy having him there.
In the middle I was so pissed I contacted my friend who is a divorce lawyer and she said ‘why are you being his secretary?’ I was being a chump and trying to play nice. Never again. In the future she advised me that as an adult he can contact sports teams etc for schedules.
I had been no contact except for the custody calendar for a year. Chumpy habits of ‘playing nice’ are hard to break. Even a couple of years out. Moving forward I’m just sending one line texts regarding info that needs to be shared.
Thanks for this article today. I needed it.
During the divorce when I still had to talk to him I made the decision to treat him like a coworker I don’t like. We didn’t use lawyers so I couldn’t just go through them (we’re young, both have jobs and didn’t have that many assets or kids to fight about and he wanted to get rid of me as painlessly as possible so he could get rid of the reminder of how bad a person he is so this worked for us). All communication was through email and when I did have to talk to him I awkward laughed and was sickeningly sweet.
I also had a go to person to talk to whenever I felt like I would otherwise have gone to XH for support. For me it was my mom but it could be a good friend or sibling. My mom also went through a similar situation so she lets me babble forever. Not everyone will do that so find that person!
Once the divorce was over I blocked every single person that could lead me back to him on social media. I had my sister passcode getting to Instagram since both him and his AP have public Instagram accounts and they’re still together. Once you see those pictures you can’t unsee them! I also told every single one of my friends that can still see his stuff (they don’t talk to him) that I don’t want to know anything about him or his family.
I agree with your plan. I checked out the AP on Facebook and the first time I saw her face it tore me up. It didn’t help that she was pretty and super fit. Over the course of the next months I looked her up again probably about ten times. One day, I was going to open her page again and I got a sick feeling in my stomach. At that moment, I asked myself, didn’t he hurt you enough? Why are you hurting yourself now? So I stopped and never looked her up again.
In my H case, the OW is ugly. Like really bad ugly. I feel so completely embarrassed that he was attracted to it, because it is his howorker so our friends and family know what it looks like. It has completely disgusted me and has helped to see what trash he really is.
My XH just took off one late Nov day while I was at work after 26 years of history, never glancing back at the life we built. Now looking back, I realize as traumatic as it was, I was lucky. Once I had the signed divorce agreement in hand, I knew I had to enforce NC if I was to ever move forward as I couldn’t seem to get out from under my sadness. Every contact leading up to it – texts, FB postings, etc – set me back for days. I changed his profile pic/name to the “Cowardly Lion”, blocked him on social media, and when the urge to reach out hit, I channeled it through my journal and re-reading a list I put on my phone of every horrible thing he had done over our years together. This would stop me in my tracks from hitting ‘send’.
It also helped that I was surrounded by an incredible outpouring of love and support from family and friends. XH side of the family knew what an a-hole he was as well but I’ve had to carefully navigate those relationships…you quickly learn blood is still thicker than water.
I use the same techniques as Louisville Flower. Write and write emails to X and don’t send them. I address them to me in case somehow I inadvertently hit send. The writing is cathartic. I don’t want to send it as it would simply add to his narrative how I can’t move on and I am a bitter ex wife. My draft mailbox has about 50 unsent emails. It’s kind of empowering to go back and read earlier ones to see how far I have come.
When he writes me one of his charming smarmy emails I put it through my own UBT. I space it out and put my snarky comments in a deep dark red in a much bigger font. (Thank you CL for teaching me the joys of the UBT) The pleasure this gives me is indescribable. I also forward lots of things to my sister so we can laugh together. (FYI, I am 3 years out from DDay so I can laugh a bit – did not laugh that first year.)
I encourage all new chumps to write! It’s hard to find people who really get it if they haven’t been through it. When you speak your story over and over through writing to yourself something really profound happens. You can validate yourself because you will never get validation from your cheaters.
My unsent writing (to Fucktard, to DiscoCuntOW, and to WretchedSwitzerlandFriend totals 650 pages. And yes, it’s truly therapeutic.
Chchchchump – Hahahaha you have inspired me to start therapeutically writing my WretchedSwitzerlandFriends tonight!
Won’t send it but great way to let out some well deserved anger. And I do love the word wretched.
Yes, I write to her as “Wretchen” which is close to her real name.
Wow! 650 pages. That is super impressive!
Ah gray rock. True story of a recent incident… waiting at court for final divorce judgement and Mr. Sparkles and his attorney are a no show. Judge calls them both and orders them to appear pronto. Attorney arrives first and proceeds to bad mouth her client to my attorney in my presence. Mr. Sparkles finally comes strutting along and his attorney asks me not to repeat what I’ve heard. I tell her, no worries, I’m gray rock with regard to him. You didn’t say anything I didn’t already know. She looked puzzled. I told her to read up on Narcissists before she represents one again.
Gray rock is my mental safe space. It is that realm where I have super powers and only my brain is allowed to engage. My heart and all emotions and sentimentality do not exist there. When I’m dealing with Mr. Sparkles it is the place I must choose to operate from or I will need to scrub myself down with a wire brush (think Meryl Streep in Silkwood) to get his narc napalm off of myself after interacting.
Gray rock is mostly yes and no answers. Yes, I will go to the Monday theater performance so you and OW can go on Tuesday. No, it is not acceptable that delay my child support payment. No, I do not want to meet your new girlfriend. Yes, you need to get your shit out of my house or I’ll put it to the curb.
To Mr. Sparkles, gray rock is my Bitch mode. So be it. I know I am loving and caring and generous, just not to him. He lost that when he cheated and walked out. He doesn’t get it back.
We are raising an 11yo son together. I will not call it co-parenting, but rather parallel parenting. I do not try to control what he does when he has our son. I stay in contact directly with my son through a cell phone. As long as Mr. Sparkles feeds my son and keeps him safe from harm, I let it go.
It isn’t always easy, but being married to a pathological lying cheater was fathoms harder.
Amazing!
STBX’s lawyer hates him too. He has told that to my attorney on several occasions. STBX has no clue.
I cheates. Not my husband is cheating. I admitted, confessed, changed. I am a unicorn. He won’t admit, blames me for his “friend” – says Inpushed him into it. He left for 4 months and came back. Intold him not to return unless he wanted to work on the marriage. He has done nothing bu fuck up our daughters’ heads. Wtf am I supposed to do?
I cheated. Now my husband is cheating. I admitted, confessed, changed. I am a unicorn. He won’t admit, blames me for his “friend” – says Inpushed him into it. He left for 4 months and came back. Intold him not to return unless he wanted to work on the marriage. He has done nothing bu fuck up our daughters’ heads. Wtf am I supposed to do?
I had a long discussion with my IC about this SBW. And that is, cheating is SO ANNHIALATING that if you cheat and decide it is a really bad idea and stop, you should keep your guilt to yourself and not tell.
When people cheat they are thinking about themselves and not anyone else. If you are not personality disordered and pull yourself back, then that guilt is yours to bear for the rest of your days. This is not something to offload on anyone else because the hurt is too huge and the damage too great.
Learning of my betrayal was absolutely the worst pain of my life. Had he suffered remorse and reconnected with me as a valued person, I would rather not have known. Being personality disordered that was never an option and I caught him.
Your marriage died when you told him. You don’t sound like a bad person, your sharing your guilt was your downfall. Now he is in a revenge affair and probably throttled up the selfishness that made you look for affirmation in the first place. Nothing you can do SBW, its over.
I think the lying is worse even than the cheating. If I do something wrong to someone I care about, I think the right thing to do is to tell them, apologize, and honour their right to know what is going on in their life, and make their own choices about how to go forward.
I think keeping it a secret forever is immoral, and saying it is to ‘protect’ the chump is a cop-out, where the main goal is to avoid consequences for the cheater.
Sounds like your marriage is a sham, but judging for you for cheating is not what this is about.
People can make mistakes, and feel remorse then do the work to fix and change the situation. That is what normal people do. They take responsibility and do the work.
Your husband is blaming you. That is what messed up selfish people do.
So now what? We have to amazing kids that he just mindfucked by coming home. I am so lost and so hurt. I don’t know what to do. If I wait for him maybe he will love me again? He tears me apart 1 minute then hugs me and still shares the bed the next. I can’t make heads or tails of the mixed messages. I don’t want to lose him and I don’t want our family destroyed.
Dear SBW, you texted with another man? Shared personal details of yourself and your marriage? That is an emotional affair. Your husband retaliated by having a physical affair. Sorry, but the marriage is over and done.
Please find a good therapist to help you understand what you were lacking in your marriage and why you engaged in an emotional affair. Fix yourself. We all need help with that occasionally. Get your girls into counseling, as well.
What your husband is doing now is manipulative and hurtful. And, I suspect, the way it’s always been in your marriage. Be the grownup and put an end to it by filing for divorce.
Hugs to you
Thank you for taking the time to reply.
What was lacking was within me, not my marriage. Now that I understand that, I want a life and a future with my husband. We have been together since 13 and 15 (albeit on and of), and have never been able to be apart for very long. I feel a divorce will be a huge mistake and we will cause hurt and pain…and just end up together.
I have talen responsibility and done the work. I don’t want to quit my family.
Dear SBW,
By having the actual physical affair, your husband has checked out of the marriage. You say you have been together since you were teenagers. That’s part of the problem. Neither of you have learned how to deal with each other in a mature, healthy way.
It sounds like you both need to step away from the marriage and each other. Do the work, individually, with a therapist to learn what a healthy relationship looks and feels like. Right now, neither of you are providing a stable, emotionally safe environment for your girls.
Ask yourself if this is the kind of relationship you want them to have in their futures; Off/on again, no trust, honesty or true commitment. That should give you your answer on what you need to do.
Hugs to you
what does his actions say? my x-hole kept telling me he loved me with all his heart, but screwed other women the whole time. I finally set up a mantra in my head “he doesn’t love me, his actions speak louder than his words.” it’s hard work, but worth it in the end. you are torturing yourself for someone that doesn’t care. get you and you kids into a healthier environment. My only regret is that I didn’t divorce him sooner.
You divorce him… something you should have done before you decided to fuck your affair partner. Give your sham vows a death certificate.
I didn’t have sex with anyone. I was texting. Not sexting. I came clean and apologized and really worked on me. I never ever blamed him. He is blaming me fkr frcing him to behave this way. Yes, I was wrong and I made a mistake. But I learned my lesson.
You can’t make someone else want to work on the marriage. What you had was an Emotional Affair, which can be just as damaging as a physical affair to the betrayed partner. I’m sorry, but your husband has checked out already. Best to move along yourself, and put a fork in the official marriage by divorcing. Limbo does children no good at all.
I can’t let go. I am totally pathetic. There are couples that recover from this. I am just not ready to give up.
“Staying with a cheater is giving up.”
ABSOLUTELY!
It’s giving up on YOU. You deserve so much more.
keep coming back to CL & CN & learn to love yourself.
Keep coming back and reading the columns… like addicts, you just haven’t hit your bottom yet.
And, for what it is worth, knowing your own self worth and setting appropriate boundaries to protect yourself and your kids isn’t giving up… it is the most courageous thing you can do. Staying with a cheater is giving up.
I’ve been completely NC with my whore-fucking ex husband for nearly two years now, so I think I’m pretty much in the clear. Every now and then the urge to say something to him screams at me. I write it in the memo app in my phone. It doesn’t get sent anywhere, but at least I type it out of my brain.
In the early days, when (when I broke NC with regularity, thinking something I might say might smack him back into reality) (spoiler: it didn’t), I took a quote from chump lady’s book, wrote it out in multi colored sharpies and hung it on my fridge. The quote was “Nothing says “Fuck Off” to a narcissist louder than silence” (Or something along those lines) I spent many nights in tears, reading and rereading and rereading that piece of paper.
Another thing I did early on was send vicious, horrible, all-hours-of-the-night texts to a very good, platonic male friend of mine who had been chumped by his wife years earlier. I would write whatever I wanted to say to my ex and text it off to my friend. I would always get words of love and support back from him, and that was a whole lot better than any reply I may (or may not have) gotten from the person who those words were really meant for.
I hope maybe these techniques will be helpful for someone out there…..
I love this! I like the idea of sending the messages you really want to send to your ex to a good friend. I tend to write them out and keep them in my drafts folder on my phone, and i’m always terrified after a few too many glasses of wine I may accidentally press send. I’m going to start sending these to my sister- thank you!!
My phone contact just says father of my children with the poop emoji. When you ask siri to text him, she says “what do you want to say to father of my children smiling pile of poo! its so funny!
I❤️This use of Siri!
Omg – lol
Sooo funny! I want an iPhone now. lol 🙂
Haha…love this newme!
At my final DDay I discovered photos of SpinDoctor on vacation with one, then having sex with another one a week later. I suspected that vacation babe didn’t know about me or the other women I discovered. Using his phone, I send vacation babe a photo of him having sex with the other woman. Vacation babe called moments later and we had a revealing conversation.
By the time SpinDoctor woke up from his drunken stupor, I had downloaded contacts, including some photos, of the other women. When he wouldn’t get tested for STDs, I told him I’d be contacting them. I did and all but one made reality based decisions not to be with him.
I’m mighty and he should know that now. I doubt I’ll hear from him again, because he’s scared of me.
Awesome!
I got a call pretty close to the end (my time was before mobile phones) from a lady who was super worried about him because she hasn’t heard from him in weeks. She knew he wasn’t supposed to call during the day but thought it was just because he would be at work. She didn’t know he was married or that he had loads of APs.
When I answered the phone, she hesitated, then asked for him. I knew he had been in a certain town, so I said “no, he isn’t here. Are you in town A, by chance?” She said, “yes, how did you know?” I said “I’m Amiisfree, Cheater’s wife. I was pretty sure he was with someone while he was there. Sorry to be the one to tell you, but you aren’t even close to the only one, my friend.”
We talked for about an hour. I learned a lot about his M.O. and that enabled me to find loads more evidence with minimal effort. She thought he was serious about her and her three year old son. All he was serious about was her contribution to the smorgasbord of strange.
She said her son was asking about him and she didn’t know what to do. I told her I would suggest that she remove him from her life as though he had died because he would cause her nothing but heartache. I told her that I know he appears sincere, and I know he has a good answer for everything, but he’s not who he appears to be.
He came home that day and asked how my day was. I said, “I had a nice talk with Ladyname today.” He looked at me and froze. I said, “Could you at least pick people who don’t have children so you aren’t hurting kids with your bullshit too?” He didn’t answer. I don’t know how it ended with her.
For me, it ended in a divorce two months later. He is a monster.
The phone and Facebook cut-off was immediate. He tried to reach out twice, two months apart, by text. The number wasn’t listed in my contacts anymore, but by context I knew it was him. A dear friend of mine said I needed to put my foot down and helped me craft an email to tell him to fuck off. Part of that email was a promise that *HE* would never have to hear from *ME* again. That promise has kept me steady.
I have to communicate with my XW regarding my children. I always try my best never to send more than one email or text per day unless there is no way to avoid it. I never include any person attacks or respond to any personal attacks. Less is more when you are dealing with a Narc
I used this, also, when an IRS issue came up about a year ago (and dragged on and on and on…). Even two years after Dday, I could feel myself getting ramped up by his flippant blow-offs (“Yeah, don’t worry about that, I’ve got it covered.”) But instead of responding to anything more than I absolutely had to, I would just call the IRS agent directly and also paid my accountant to deal with him so I didn’t have to. — I did, ultimately, have to talk to him when his plan was to pay the IRS the penalty (due to his shady business accountant) in $50/month increments, and since my name was tucked into it, I thought, “Well, hell, no, we are not going to do it this way.” So I paid the penalty without telling him. He found out and actually sent me a check to pay me back. (shocking) It turns out he didn’t want to pay in full because he was buying OW a huge engagement ring. Ouch. — The point is, don’t engage with anything more that the minimum required to complete the business at hand.
I just pretended he was dead. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I also requested that he be seated in a separate conference room when he came to my attorney’s office. The attorneys shuttled between rooms while we negotiated.
Wow. Dr. ICBIaC. Look at you getting all creative with the keyboard – that’s perfect. And so is pretending he’s dead. I’ve said “you’re dead to me” in my mind a.lot.
And, I’m still grappling with whether I will sit with him in the mediation room this coming Monday! I can’t decide!!!!
Nikki Lynn, I did shuttle mediation with attorneys present. Never even saw stbx going in or out- totally NC. It was terrific to have privacy from him. I could get all the advice I needed and no judgement or shenanigans from him and no revealing my feelings or strategy to a person who would twist them (he tried the shenanigans with the mediator who shut it down). Also, in my state we were able to submit a pre mediation case letter. Mine was 30pages chock full of evidence about his cheating, lying, misuse of funds, and voluntary underemployment (I am the earner and am having to pay him to get out of the marriage). His doc was a few pages of “alternative facts”. I don’t think the mediator had much sympathy for him. I would say use the process to your advantage…my attorney routinely reminded me no need to respond to random shit he tossed out.
Funny thing is, mediator said stbx thinks my attorney is dastardly. I said “well he hates me too”. And the mediator said,” no just her. He likes you.” That made me laugh on sooo many levels. Good luck to you.
I recommend having another separate room available and seeing how you feel. Signal or write a note to your attorney when you need a break or want to be separated.
Don’t do anything that makes you more uncomfortable. Guard yourself.
Hugs!
There really is no finer satisfaction than seeing the soon-to-be-ex through the cracks in the blinds reach for the door handle to the conference room like he is going to strut in and your attorney blocking him. The best way you can tell someone to go to hell is with indifference.
My primary reason for keeping the rooms separate is because I considered our negotiations to be a business transaction. I needed to make clear decisions about my legal rights and assets without being distracted by an ass-clown.
I’m completely NC with my ex since our kids are adults. The divorce was final a couple of days before Thanksgiving last year so I wasn’t surprised when I still got Christmas cards addressed to Mr and Mrs. from his friends and family. I didn’t open them, just put them in an envelope and forwarded them to him. But this year? Cmon, it’s been over a year! So rather than breaking NC and forwarding them on like I did last year, I sent everyone from “his side” that I got a Mr. and Mrs. card from a copy of the letter that went in the cards I mailed out to people who didn’t know what had gone on. The letter included a little blurb about my daughter also changing her last name to my maiden name. I had fun wondering what his people would make of that. I also scratched out my contact info (I sold the marital home and bought my own place) and added his. I refrained from adding any commentary, I figured the news that we’d been divorced for over a year and one of his two children repudiated him to the point of legally changing her last name would be sufficient to get the message across. 🙂
1. Crickets ring tone for the XW’s phone number;
2. Whenever I think of her or her behavior, and I start to get angry and I want to lash out, I conjure up the image of a dog returning to his vomit and I stop; and
3. I keep in mind CL’s comment about how absurd cheaters are, and I just start laughing when the XW makes her absurd comments or takes an absurd point of view because it is absurd.
Hahaha! I use cricket ringtone for STBX to!
Changing their name to “assclown” or something similar on your phone always works. There’s nothing like seeing an incoming call or text labelled “Stupid Turd” to make me smile and press delete.
I haven’t had time to read all the responses, so apologize if I am repeating something already said. The first couple of years I was separated, I was so shattered that I lost all sense of my value as a person. But, I got help through several avenues and over time started to love myself again. Then for quite awhile I was very angry at how I had been treated. This contributed to my healing. I also realized when I became angry that my Ex was toxic and every time I saw him or heard from him, I fell back into a black hole. So, this was before I discovered CL, but I knew I had to go NC if I was to move forward. I stopped answering texts, emails, etc. He came to my door twice and I answered the first time, but did not invite him in and made it clear I did not wish to talk with him. The second time, I saw his car in my driveway and didn’t answer the door. He got the message. But, I don’t think I would have had this strength if I hadn’t started to see myself as a worthwhile person and that I had the right to say “no” to someone else. I ended two freindships with people who were critical of me through this process and with a couple of others, I told them we could only continue as friends if they did not bring my Ex up in conversation. I became very choosy about who I would share my feelings with. I think it is hard to go NC if you are still fully enmeshed and co-dependent with your Ex. But over time, you can get yourself back and then setting boundaries becomes possible. You may falter, but each tiny step backwards for me led to giant steps forward. Everyone on this site is a worthwhile human, with every right to choose a good fulfilling life free of anyone who does not truly respect them.
First time contributor, but have been following this blog since D day. My situation is a little more unique, but equally traumatizing. just over 6 months ago I found out, out of the blue, that my fiance of 4 years had been hiring hookers, direct messaging porn stars and messaging with a slew of married women. It cost a lot of money, but I called off my wedding, swallowed some non-refundable deposits, broke my lease and moved into a relative’s basement.
I finally achieved no contact back in September. I blocked him on social media, blocked his number etc.. I kept screen shots of the disgusting messages he exchanged with hookers, picked out a few that really sting, and every time I feel a little weak I pull up the messages again and go from feeling bad to wanting to punch him in the throat. I also have my go to girlfriend who if I text her anytime day or night, will remind me what a disgusting pig he is and how I could have contracted an STD and died.
I also told him if he tries to contact me ever again, i’ll call his mom and/or post on social media and shout from the rooftops what a pervy little creep he is. I’d never do that, but the threat is enough to terrify him. Egotistical little fu*k.
Logistically being able to cut ties was much easier without being married and/or having kids together. But it was still the hardest thing I hope to say I’ve ever done.
You are an inspiration CG52!
chumpgirl52, you are who I wish I was like in 1994 when I got married. After finding out my now ex went to Canada for “part 2” on his bachelors party. “Part 1” was a golf outing with family and friends. Looked so nice and Christian-like. “Part 2” was the real him. When I found out, he was laying in our future marital bed, hungover. I so wanted to walk away. I was so disgusted by him. But our wedding was a week away. Everything was pretty much paid for and my family had already invested money in dresses, etc. I so wish I trusted my gut. You are one mighty woman! You are my hero!
That sounds like an awful situation- I’m sorry you had to go through that. Looking back red flags were flying for years, but I ignored it until I found the sext messages.
It’s embarrassing for sure but i’m glad I called it off.
Your heart was still broken. Divorce is messy, but any break up with a cheater is a mess.
As to outing him, practice what you would say to his mom or what you would want to post. Just getting those words and feelings out without sharing or posting them can be so satisfying and therapeutic.
I love the idea of practicing what I would say to his mother! I’ve said it in my head 1000 times but I bet it would feel great to say it aloud.
My mom also practiced what she would say to his mom. ??
You dodged a bullet!
Yep, no matter how much money you “lost” cancelling the wedding, you’ll more than make up for it in savings on therapy bills, divorce lawyers and just general all-around heartache.
This may be a long explanation but I was inspired by Chump Lady’s encouragement to share to help the newbies who are dealing with this. Firstly if you are a newbie and hurting, I’m sorry but it really is for the best and here’s why, it protects YOU. In my case it’s easy to want to stay gray rock with my stbxh. He’s simply not the man I married. He changed so much when the ” midlife crisis ” hit that he could literally be a different person. I’m not the only person who knew him before who could see these changes also. Including his own Mom calling him Middle Aged Crazy. Now that I have been watching a lot of Sam Vaknin videos on YouTube I realize that this isn’t a midlife crisis. That narcissists are about as close as you can get to multiple personality disorder. They literally disassociate their true self from what the narc self does. In his case you can actually see the change in him, and hear it in his voice. It’s as Sam Vaknin says, ” eerie. ” Sure I’ve tried talking to him in the past thinking it would make a difference. But it won’t, and what I know now from those videos is that a narcissist NEVER gets out of their ” midlife crisis. ” They’re so disassociated from their true selves to ” protect ” them from what he, ( Sam Vaknin ) calls narcissistic injury. In other words he is in some ways a good man who wants to do good. But he’s also an addict who wanted exciting sex with prostitutes and other women and to drink a lot. The two don’t go together, so he split off into another persona that you can’t guilt into doing different as you can a moral man with a conscience. It’s how he dealt with his shame. Narcs have a lot of shame and they are fragile people and can’t deal with it in a healthy way.
You can say enough about the narc what about you? Well, when you realize all of that, it’s highly effective in keeping you gray rock as there is nothing more to be said or done. He’s crazy, he’s with someone else, there’s no reaching him or helping him to see health. There’s no reason to talk to him. In fact it just makes me angry to talk with him now. I try to be polite but dealing with someone that messed up that you used to love and admire for his good qualities ( he was a covert narc ). It just makes you angry about the situation. I can’t even really be angry at him because he’s mentally ill and was made that way by childhood trauma. If I have learned my lessons right then we chumps may have had childhood trauma too and it made us into co-dependents. Theirs made them into narcissists. Ours is actually the better situation, as ours is treatable, theirs isn’t, because they won’t even acknowledge something is wrong. Or if they do as he has, they shrug and won’t do anything to change, that’s the addiction. An addict will do anything to stay with their addiction, in his case another woman is filling that need and she’s just as messed up as he is and left her marriage too. They just blame you and leave, as he did. The beauty part is that they won’t be happy together as they are both crazy in the same way. Doesn’t work, you have to have a co-dependent and a narc not two narcs/borderlines together. So I don’t have revenge fantasies, since their being together is all the revenge I need. Just knowing how that relationship will be in time makes me laugh. lol
I am just angry that this whole thing happened and has left me alone at this time in my life and I am having to deal with that, I don’t want him back. It’s better that, than having to deal with an addict/narc for anymore of my life. So that’s how I stay no contact. Self education is the key to keeping you away from their sickness. Staying away is the best thing you can do for you. Because if they can suck you in they get a kick out of it. They aren’t happy people and they can’t stand it that you have the potential to be actually happy and loving and good and kind. Let go of them and embrace your new life and concentrate on growing that. Embrace your loving self. It’s hard because you feel devalued, but know that was their problem, not yours. You are more than just a reflection in some narcs eyes. You are yourself on your own now, it will eventually feel comfortable and even good with time. Educate yourself so it doesn’t happen again in your next relationship. Time really does heal all wounds, so be patient and loving with yourself. Best wishes and positive energy to all of you.
Thank you wish! I am inspired by your words. Keep moving forward and best of luck to you!
Great post – thank you for this! I have not heard of those videos on YouTube – will have to check them out.
WishTuesCameSooner , you said this all very well. I have a difficult time watching Sam Vatkin (not that he’s not excellent), but it’s more the accent which is hard for me to understand him. Anyway, I’ve been a student of YouTube videos since last summer I think. That and reading books like Psychopath Free, among others. Education is the way to figure out what happened to us and how to insure we never make this mistake again! Your post made me cry, because it’s so point on. I’m going to copy it and post it to where I keep things I want to read again. Your post will most certainly be helpful to some chumps out there in the future.
I never knew what I was dealing with my ex. He had me so convinced that there was something lacking in me. He never said that to my face at all. I just always sensed and knew he was always out there looking for other “friends.” I couldn’t figure out what was wrong with me that I was enough for him. This lead to over 20 years of trying harder, doing more, dancing for him to make him notice me or spend time with me.
I could never understand how one day he was acting in love with me and happy with me. And then it seemed like the next day he hated me and was done with me. Now knowing all I know about narcs — this has made sense of what my marriage was.
And like you, my ex had/has good qualities. Qualities that I admired and loved. But he also has an evil, twisted side. I now trust he sucks. He’s a narc and narcs suck. They suck all the life out of you. Make you feel like you are worthless and then they throw you away like garbage. Normal people don’t act like this. Thank you for your post.
I can’t quite go NC with X, as I entered a bankruptcy WITH him, about a year before the divorce. Dumb, dumb, dumb. I forgive myself, I was being mightily abused, but what a mess. Guess who paid the whole thing? Not him, delicate flower that he is, who can’t work much of the time because of anxiety. Now that I have paid it off, which took years, I still need his cooperation to sign papers, and mail them back, so I have found being nice, and brief, to be the only way I can keep him cooperating. Plus, we have adult sons together, so I just want to be able to see him and be reasonable at the occasional event! I’m very glad I live 900 miles away from him. I hope no other Chumps get tangled up in this financial mess, like I did. That was a constant theme through our marriage- he would mess up our finances, and I would try to fix them, it was exhausting.
I work for a tax accountant, and today a woman called looking for an accountant for her fiance, who apparently has tax problems going back seven years! All I could do was pass her call to my boss, but I so wanted to be a movie or tv receptionist talking to her so I could say something like “Girl, what are you doing?! Get away from this man-boy who can’t or won’t take care of his own shit. You are dipping your foot into a lake of fire and stench! Step back before you fall in!
But I couldn’t do that, and I feel that it wouldn’t have been appreciated if I had. I wish her luck, whoever she was.
Oh God, I hear you. Mine has us in debt to the IRS. Still trying to resolve that in the divorce. Every time that jackass was laid off or the kids needed something “extra”, it was on me to pony up more funds. Work the second job. Whatever necessary to pay the bills.
Btw, he is in my home as Miserable Vomitus Mass and his ring tone is So What (na na na). The picture next to his name is Stay Real, Stay Loyal or Stay the Fuck Away from Me.
Phone. Damn auto. Correct, lol!
Mine would call me everyday to find out the kids schedule. So, I made a shared iCalendar with alerts, events, etc. I send him info about any sport team group page…and remind him that I won’t be adding this separate calendar to our shared calendar. Then, whenever he would call to ask, I would simply say “it is on the calendar”. He eventually stopped asking.
I simply have him listed on my phone as “X”….I was more creative early on…I think my fav was “re-Dick-ulous”
Yes,the poor helpless one, er…..clueless one.
I spent the first year after divorce texting the phrase “as it states in the divorce decree…”
Eventually he went an entire month without seeing the son because he hadn’t read the decree, and texted me “how can I go an entire month without seeing my son?” I should have kept my mouth shut but instead I said “read the decree and find out.”
That’s when he read it and was angry that he could have seen the boy on quite a few of those days he missed but he’s stopped the nonsense and now doesn’t ask stupid questions.
Even though your fiance is a whoremongering pig,you are still grieving the loss of the man you thought he was.You wouldn’t be human if you didn’t.
Apart from that CG52, you handled it all brilliantly.Narcs fear exposure and are all about impression management so your threat will probably keep him away from you.
When the heartache goes,you’re going to look back and be grateful you weren’t married to and parenting with this turd.You will get past the horrible trauma.
Thank you! It was almost an out of body experience, I just went through the motions and listened to my family (who of course he insisted “didn’t know how strong our love was”)
You hit the nail on the head when you said I’m grieving the loss of the man I THOUGHT he was.
Thankfully, he doesn’t usually try to contact me. He still thinks that he is completely innocent. After all, he’s “only human” and “our marriage was in trouble”, even though I didn’t know it was in trouble. Neither did the kids. Or family. Or friends.
Anyway, I’ve cut him out of my social media. I’m still friends with his family on FB, but I’ve stopped following them so that they don’t come up in my feed. I’ve gotten rid of as much as I can in the house that reminds me of him. Whenever I find something new, it goes straight to the trash, Goodwill bin, etc.
I’ve also changed his pic on my phone to a hand making the “loser” sign. That helps… a LOT.
I try not to respond to emails or texts right away. I think through my response and ask myself 1) what outcome do I really want for me and the kids? and 2) is my response effective in moving me toward what I want?
And yes, we talk only about the kids. I find that I miss him sometimes when I’m up late working, but I tell myself it’s just because I’m tired and not thinking straight. Sure enough, by morning, I remember what an ass-clown he is and how much better my future will be without him. One day at a time.
You miss the person you thought he was. You miss having a partner.
I cannot go No Clmtsct with my STBX as we have mutual minor children and are in the third year of our divorce (awaiting trial). I think of dealing with my STBX the way I imagine I might deal with cleaning up the results of a nuclear accident–Try to clean up what I must wearing a Haat suit and stay far away from the site when I don’t need to do clean up duty.
I am working on minimizing the length of my interaction with STBX. Time is momey. I realize that the shorter my messages to my attorney, the lower my fee. The same is true, albeit it not as directly, regarding my STBX. The more time I spend interacting with him, the less time I have to develop professionally, prepare lunches for my kids, maintain my health (which results in fewer doctor visits), all of which lead to earning and saving money. (Life of minimal contact is way more pleasant, too.) Like the old game show Name that Tune, in which the winner is the contestant who can name the tune hearing the fewest notes, I win by minimizing the number of words I waste on STBX.